In short
ESPN FC - Gab & Juls Show: Are Spurs in a Relegation Fight?
Episode Summary In this episode of the Gab & Juls Show, host Julien Laurens is joined by Nedum Onuoha to analyze the recent sacking of Tottenham Hotspur manager Thomas Frank amid concerns about the team's proximity to the relegation zone. The discussion touches on Frank's tenure, the challenges faced by Spurs, and the implications for future management decisions.
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Key Discussions
- Sacking of Thomas Frank
- Context: Thomas Frank was dismissed after Spurs found themselves close to the relegation zone, mirroring their struggles from the previous season.
- Public Perception: Reactions vary; some see it as overdue, while others were surprised.
- Key Arguments:
- The team’s performance had been underwhelming, with only 7 points accrued in the last 10 games.
- Concerns about Frank's ability to manage a club of Spurs' stature and pressures were highlighted.
- The lack of authority and confidence in him among players and fans contributed to the decision.
- Challenges Faced by Thomas Frank
- Injuries: A significant number of first-team players were injured, impacting performance consistency and team selection.
- Fan Discontent: A toxic atmosphere at home games with booing and chants indicating displeasure.
- Comparison with Other Managers: Discussion of the leadership qualities necessary for managing a high-profile club compared to a smaller club like Brentford.
- Next Steps for Tottenham
- Interim Management: The need for a temporary coach before a permanent replacement, with names like Ryan Mason and Johnny Heitinga mentioned.
- Future Prospects: Speculation about potential candidates for the managerial position, including the possibility of a return for Mauricio Pochettino.
- Fan Sentiment: Pochettino's legacy at Spurs may influence fan opinions about his potential return.
- General Premier League Updates
- Performance Highlights: Manchester City's impressive performance against Fulham, Liverpool's bounce back, and Chelsea's unexpected draw with Leeds.
- Managerial Movements: Other managers sacked in the league, including Sean Dyche and Roberto De Zerbi, and their implications for their respective clubs.
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Key Takeaways
- Thomas Frank's managerial stint at Spurs underscored the challenges of transitioning from a smaller club to a larger, more competitive environment.
- The decision to sack Frank was indicative of a broader need for accountability and authority in leadership roles within football clubs.
- The upcoming transition period for Spurs will be critical, as they seek to improve on-field performance and fan relations amidst a turbulent season.
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Conclusion The episode offers insight into the high-stakes nature of football management, highlighting how performance, fan engagement, and internal club dynamics play crucial roles in a manager's tenure. As Spurs navigate the aftermath of Frank's departure, the search for a new manager and the upcoming fixtures will be pivotal in determining the club's future trajectory.
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Note: The Gab & Juls Show airs regularly and provides in-depth analysis of football-related topics, featuring expert opinions and discussions on the latest developments in the sport.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VODiscussion on Spurs' Management Changes
1:00 to 2:39
Analyzing the sacking of Thomas Frank and its implications for Spurs.
“But we have to start at Spurs because really this is the biggest story of the week.”
Evaluating Authority and Player Dynamics
2:39 to 5:06
Exploring the importance of manager authority and player expectations.
“looked like that step up from a small club to a bigger club in the Premier League is very difficult and not everybody can do it and for me that's In what sense though?”
Injuries Impacting Team Performance
5:06 to 7:18
Discussing how injuries are affecting Spurs' performance this season.
“Even when you own fans saying you're getting sacked in the morning, it can't be nice.”
Game Management and Consistency Issues
7:18 to 9:50
Examining Spurs' inconsistent performances and game management.
The Future of Spurs Under New Management
9:50 to 14:01
Speculating on the potential return of Pochettino and its implications.
“What's the best version of Spurs under Thomas Frank?”
Pochettino's Potential Return to Spurs
14:01 to 17:00
The hosts discuss the implications of bringing back Pochettino to Tottenham and whether it would be beneficial.
“And it's because they have that sort of romantic emotional connection to him because some of their best years in the Premier League came under him.”
Manchester City vs. Fulham Analysis
19:16 to 21:43
An analysis of Manchester City's recent performance against Fulham and their title aspirations.
“And the reason I say that is because we made a big deal of the Liverpool game on the weekend.”
Sacking of Roberto De Zerbi
21:43 to 24:42
Discussion on the recent sacking of Roberto De Zerbi by Marseille and its implications.
“Do you think he gets another big job after this?”
Chelsea's Draw Against Leeds
27:05 to 28:01
Reviewing Chelsea's unexpected draw with Leeds and its impact on their season.
“We're tuning up at home and cruising against Leeds before.”
Chelsea's Unbeaten Streak and Title Race Implications
28:01 to 28:44
Discussion on Chelsea's performance and the implications for the title race.
“I think in fairness that he'd won or they'd won the previous four league games.”
Show all 27 chapters
Bayern Munich's Return to the German Cup Semifinals
28:45 to 29:39
Insights on Bayern Munich's performance and their upcoming semifinal match.
“Bayern are back in the German Cup semi-finals.”
Liverpool's Dominance Over Sunderland
29:40 to 30:34
Analysis of Liverpool's win against Sunderland and their season form.
“And I'm glad we always championed him because that's not the case of everybody.”
Sunderland's Struggles Without Key Players
30:35 to 31:15
Discussion on Sunderland's issues with creativity and key player injuries.
Arsenal Women's Champions League Journey
31:16 to 32:06
Overview of Arsenal women's team performance in the Champions League.
“If you want to watch the highlights, it's really worth it.”
Burnley's Unexpected Comeback Against Crystal Palace
32:07 to 33:16
Analysis of Burnley's comeback win and the implications for both teams.
“A win that maybe we are not really seeing coming, Ned.”
Palace Update on Player Injuries
33:17 to 33:45
Discussion on Mateta's injury and its impact on Crystal Palace's season.
Aston Villa's Late Victory Over Brighton
33:46 to 34:39
Review of Aston Villa's recent win and their position in the league.
“So let's see, I really hope for him that he can come back to decent fitness before the end of the season and give himself a chance to maybe call up by Desmond.”
Impact of Early Substitution on Young Players
34:40 to 37:16
Discussion on the psychological effects of early substitutions on young players.
“Things you wouldn't necessarily expect to see from a side as I say that's doing as well as what they're doing but I suppose at some point towards the end of the season it's just about the results isn't it?”
Dale Upamecano's Contract Extension at Bayern
38:12 to 42:00
Discussion of Upamecano's contract extension and its implications for Bayern.
“Save money and get a better view of the road when you replace your worn-out wiper blades at O 'Reilly Auto Parts.”
Career Longevity in Football
42:00 to 43:17
Discussing the significance of career longevity and player commitment.
“No, I think as is the case with many things in life, as you look back now, certain things feel more obvious than they were in the moment.”
Comparing Icons: Milner and Barry
43:17 to 45:42
A comparison of James Milner and Gareth Barry's contributions to football.
“I said, how long are you going to be out for?”
Managerial Changes and Team Dynamics
45:42 to 47:20
Exploring the implications of managerial changes in football teams.
“That's way too many years, too much football.”
Team Bonding: Does It Work?
47:20 to 49:57
Evaluating the effectiveness of team bonding exercises in football.
“and I made them that good, I swear to you.”
Ronald Araujo's Mental Health Journey
49:57 to 52:46
A discussion on Araujo's mental health struggles and the support received.
“But the performances haven't been great since Abeloa took over.”
England's Future with Tuchel
52:46 to 55:55
Analyzing England's decision to extend Tuchel's contract before the World Cup.
“There's probably still some teammates thinking like, oh, come on, you know, don't be like this, be stronger than this.”
Japan's League Changes for 100th Anniversary
56:00 to 57:00
Learn about the Japanese league's unique decision to eliminate draws.
“So if you had to bet, would you say England are ahead of the curve or behind it by doing this?”
Reactions to the New Penalty System
57:00 to 57:54
Discover the hosts' thoughts on the implications of the new rules.
“There's only somebody who has a chance to gain.”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00Nedum Onuoha:When you want your spring break to feel like... And your kid's pool day to feel like... And your hotel bed to feel like... Ooh, and room service to feel like... Because at Hilton, hospitality feels like... Your cabana's ready. Would you like fresh towels? It matters where you stay. Book now at Hilton.com. Hilton. For this day.
0:35Julien Laurens:Hello, welcome to the Gab and Juul show. No Gab today, so look who's come down from Manchester. I'm back, Juul. So good to have you back, my brother. Nedo Manoa is with us for this packed show because we've had not just one, but two Premier League managers sacked in the last 48 hours. We'll talk about that, obviously. There's a big Premier League midweek round as well. We'll talk about City winning, Liverpool winning as well, and cups all around Europe. But we have to start at Spurs because really this is the biggest story of the week. Thomas Frank gone. Some would say finally or eventually, others say that maybe they didn't see it coming.
1:10Julien Laurens:Where do you stand in them deciding to let go?
1:14Nedum Onuoha:That's a good question. I think in some ways I'm a bit mixed with it just because, you know, with managers, people say give them time, give them time, give them time. I think it's fair to say the team wasn't doing as well as they would have hoped. For the fact that they're in the same position they were in a year ago when we were saying that was probably one of their worst ever Premier League seasons. You know, in some ways it's alarming but then it also runs parallel to them being in the knockout stages in Europe which is exactly the same as last year but it just never felt like the, well not never but in recent times it's not felt like the fans and others around it have been almost trusting of him to be able to do a good enough job for them to find better form.
1:48Nedum Onuoha:I agree. You know, I think in the last 10 games that they've played they've amassed seven points which is the same as Wolves who most people say are doomed and the only team with the worst record is Crystal Palace so I think having watched that last game that they played against Newcastle side who had no away record Newcastle come in and essentially dominate for long periods in that game it did raise the question well how long can this go on for and in some ways I guess they've seen that gap between this game and the next one against Arsenal and think well maybe it's time for a change
2:17Julien Laurens:I was a bit surprised because I thought they would give him until the end of the season not because they believed in him because he would have been sacked eventually in the summer anyway but just because now you need an interim coach for three months whether that's Ryan Mason or Johnny Heitinger or whoever you want and then you go through the process again in the summer it just for me looked like that step up from a small club to a bigger club in the Premier League is very difficult and not everybody can do it
2:45Nedum Onuoha:and for me that's In what sense though? How do you mean? Are you talking about footballing wise or just like status wise?
2:50Julien Laurens:A bit of both I think he kept the same methods and the same ideas from Brentford to Spurs thinking very naively no problem i'm gonna do the same thing as spurs and it will work the same way it doesn't i think spurs fans spurs players probably spurs direction as in like top of the people expect something different from you as a manager than doing what you did at brentford i also think that the players in the dressing room expect somebody different than the guy that was at brentford and for me the lack of authority that he had on this thing which is clearly clearly to see was also a problem. If you come to a bigger dressing room of a bigger club with bigger egos, bigger names, bigger players who've won more than you because you haven't won anything, by the way, you have to be strong.
3:35Julien Laurens:And if you're a bit too weak and open that weakness door, they go and smash it.
3:39Nedum Onuoha:When you say strong, what does that mean to you? I think in authority, I think. In terms of what, like, are you talking, for example, about, say, Christian Romero? Yeah. So what do you think, for example, in this last week when he received the red card and he said what he said what would you what do you think a stronger manager would have done in that instance
3:56Julien Laurens:I think they would have publicly called him out
3:58Nedum Onuoha:for the words or for the red card
4:00Julien Laurens:for both I think I think there probably would have been a sanction internally which there wasn't like the last red card too I think what Van Der Ven and Jets Penz did when he said to them boosted the fans nobody at City does that with Guardiola nobody at Arsenal does that with Arteta and yet they hardly looked at him even and not for the first time if you don't have authority on your dressing room
4:23Nedum Onuoha:can you succeed after the weekend? no you can't no and I think the authority side of things it needs to be stronger when things aren't going well when things are going well everything's great you see all the positives but when people are now looking to you to try and find a solution and you want to believe in their words but then the words that they're saying they seem almost like shallow and not necessarily worth it then I think that does become an issue and it is a shame in some ways for him because I think he's one of those managers who I believe lots of people wanted to do well you know they felt like he could have been it was a different feel to say some of Spurs' managers in the past you've got like Ange, you've got Conte, you've got Mourinho's it's a real spread of what the managers can be but I think we'll be doing it a disservice if we don't talk about the injuries because they've had a lot of injuries and the team that say he's putting out at certain points it probably wouldn't be the team they expected to be able to put out at this stage in the season and that will make a difference but I suppose it's the other side and I think the point made there about why didn't they give him until the end of the season I think the fact that they thought sacking would give a club give the club the boost says a lot about how bad things were
5:26Julien Laurens:you know
5:27Nedum Onuoha:because you don't there's no guarantee of who's next but people feel relieved that he's not there anymore and to believe that you're at that level of addition through subtraction for somebody who many perceive to be a positive person I think in some ways it kind of shows that the club are in need for something stronger but maybe not something as strong as like a Conte or Mourinho
5:45Julien Laurens:yeah maybe And also I think with the fans, it got to a point where there was just no way back. It was so toxic, the booze. Even when you own fans saying you're getting sacked in the morning, it can't be nice. And I think from a clear point of view, as much as you have your own direction and you don't always have to listen to the fans or follow your fans, there's a point where...
6:07Nedum Onuoha:Yeah, like I've said this point, some people might have heard me say this before, and I'm not going to die in a cell or such, but I'm going to be walking my way up there. home form matters a lot in terms of general vibes and energy around a football club because it's assumed in the back of many people's minds that points away from home are good three points away from home should be the standard yeah it can really affect how you perceive a season because for example spurs's home record is the third worst in a division only worse is burnley and wolves spurs have got 10 points from 13 games so you've got 50 or 60 000 people every other week turning up to see their team do absolutely nothing like do nothing yeah in those 13 games they scored 16 goals they're doing nothing whatsoever and so when you gather you're around your people and you're talking about it more instead of like the the diehards for example who are going to the away games you know they see a slightly different version of football yeah you have to entertain the people when they all come together and he certainly wasn't doing that just on the injuries
7:08Julien Laurens:that you mentioned earlier they've lost other bear again on tuesday night and i was told this morning he would have a knee surgery which i think will keep him out all the way until the end of the season and then a bit of that the issue i have with injuries as an no as an excuse kind of not an excuse but maybe a reason or justification whatever is that it was the same last year
7:30Nedum Onuoha:so there's clearly a problem within this football club where how can you have two seasons in a row
7:36Julien Laurens:12, 13 first team players out for a long time at the same time year after year is it your medical staff by the way that they changed twice already last season is it the way you train is it something with this dressing room that is maybe not doing everything they should outside of the games to not be to not get injured in terms of what they eat what they sleep recoveries I don't know whatever is the rehab the problem so when they come back they then have a setback again what's happening with Kulizewski man this is the longest mystery injury in the history of mystery injuries so I'm just like okay I understand that it was difficult for him at times do those injuries explain why he kept changing the team all the time formation was different your midfield was different your back four was different your from three was different all the time and there was no consistency in there and by the way Nets there was not much consistency in game after game they could have 20 good minutes of 30 good minutes in the second half
8:39Nedum Onuoha:but the first half was dire yeah that's i think that's fair in regards to the injuries it's tricky because some of the injuries and stuff are not like re-injuring the same thing i think there's been a few knee injuries as well which which haven't helped you know because these are long term ones and maybe you could argue those guys are now chasing like a strong level of fitness after that but it is very very strange and it's a lot of players like i'm just looking now and this is missing players you had benton kohlberg val danzo davies kudus kulisewski madison poro charlison romero and udoggi yeah and now you've got odderbear out as well that's i don't know how many players are named there but that's that's a lot that's almost a starting 11 pretty much that's that's the awkward point where like as a football club you don't have that many treatment beds at the training ground you know you're having to book in slots now says how unfortunately this guy's on at this time but it's it's it's way too much and you do have to have an internal view of like why this is happening yeah because it's not necessarily like people have injuries around the league sure but not many teams have that many you know there needs to be something really significant to look into that so it you know it doesn't happen again in the future which is obviously what you thought they tried to do last year but two years in a row of it is outrageous um but the sort of game management stuff.
9:56Nedum Onuoha:What's the best version of Spurs under Thomas Frank? I don't remember them controlling games of football. Never.
10:02Julien Laurens:That's not why he did that Brentford either.
10:04Nedum Onuoha:Yeah, which is fine. But then I suppose for me, a lot of the teams up near the top, there's some point where they do do that. They'll score more than the opposition and almost break the opposition spirit at key times by, say, putting the foot on the ball, keeping possession and so on. And I know that generally the public doesn't like that. But having played against teams like that sometimes being 1-0 down feels like it could be 10-0 down because you've not seen the ball for so long yeah but yeah they end up being the side where teams always feel encouraged because they'll always have a spell and spurs will have a spell as well but what does that spell look like is it sustained pressure for long periods of time i'm not sure and you know the prime example is that game against man city they go from being in a very awkward position that first half of being really really poor yeah to find the momentum in the second and that's good for them as such but you'd expect a really good side to not be so Jekyll and Hyde.
10:55Nedum Onuoha:You know you just like you're craving consistency from everything.
10:57Julien Laurens:Could that be on him as well? Because there's something that we said earlier in the season about him and I think he admitted himself privately certainly that he could not transmit the energy that he needs and wants or had at Brentford to go back to the point where he he wanted to be the same as Spurs and he was at Brentford which I think was never going to work but could not get the energy from the fans, could not get the energy from the players. So is that on him?
11:22Nedum Onuoha:I think in some ways it probably is, yeah. Because you're talking about 11 individuals out there on the pitch trying to represent a team, but they won't all think the same thing. So sometimes the manager has to come and tell them what they have to think, how they have to play in a game. Strategies to put the opposition under pressure straight away. Think of, for example, I don't know if they still do it this year, but PSG last year when they kick it into the corner from the kick-off. That immediately puts the opposition under pressure. you know that is the definition of starting in a manner which puts you on the front foot yeah you know instead of saying moving things just side to side just getting a touch and just like blending yourself in so i think a lot some of that would come down to him because if it's one week fine if it's two weeks okay that's strange but if it's week in week out it's more and having worked on say like loves working on the efc so much like you listen and you learn from different perspectives and one that i loved one time was steven nickel talking about if you start fast you can slow down but if you start slow you might never find the pace of the game itself and say an example was yesterday so City won 3-0 against Fulham and Fulham came off the pitch at the end of the game thinking
12:23Julien Laurens:that they did well in the second half I imagine they did yeah but the only reason they did is
12:26Nedum Onuoha:because City had won the game in the first half it was 3-0 and they became very very comfortable and just worked on other things yeah but for Spurs if you start slowly consistently especially at home fans aren't going to be having that yeah the players themselves probably are going to be disappointed as well and it offers encouragement to the opposition and given how fine the margins are in the Premier League or just any league really where everyone's matched up equally. Yeah. You can't afford to be on the back foot for long periods of time but that's kind of how they are and I think some of that will come down to Frank and one of the reasons why he's not in charge.
12:55Julien Laurens:Yeah, I agree with you. I think that was a massive problem for them. So, okay, he's gone now. We said he would probably be an interim coach now between now and the end of the season. We also said they've got 12 days to prepare for this, the North London derby and the Arsenal game at home, by the way. So, in terms of new manager bounce, I know, It's either that or you lose and you get smashed and then it's even worse. But it looks like Marcel Pochettino, who will be out of contract with the US men's national team after the World Cup, he's the preferred option from the board to bring him back to the club.
13:30Julien Laurens:He seems quite happy to come back to the club as well. He wants to go back to club management and to England. Anyway, do you like those kind of comebacks after a first stint somewhere? we saw obviously Mourinho doing it at Chelsea and a few others. I don't think it's a good idea, but that's just me.
13:50Nedum Onuoha:So personally, overall with the comebacks, I don't think they're a good idea. I think Spurs fans that I've heard of do think it's a good idea. And it's because they have that sort of romantic emotional connection to him because some of their best years in the Premier League came under him. Not just that year when Leicester won the title. there was another year where I think they were in the late 80s point mark and they finished second as well. Yeah. It's the Chelsea, so. He's got a legacy at Spurs, which goes beyond however we feel about him and managers returning. Is that reason good enough to bring him back?
14:25Nedum Onuoha:I don't think it'd be a good appointment, personally. I don't think it would be. Because I think for where Spurs are now, compared to when he was last in charge, it's two completely different things. I think even the make-up of the squad, the nature of the Premier League now, I don't know if him coming back for as much as it might evoke feelings of success in times gone by, relatively speaking, I think the quest to find that success now with him in charge of this group of players in his current Premier League environment, I don't think they get there. I think it's like a longer-term thing. And if it's a longer-term thing, is Pochettino the right guy to bring in?
14:58Julien Laurens:I know. And I think he would only come back with the right conditions, which probably means, even outside of financially, a lot of power that he didn't have, if you remember, when he was there the first time with Daniel Levy. Do you remember there was that spell of two years or 18 months where they didn't sign anybody for him? I don't think he would go back to those kind of conditions. So if they're ready to basically give him the keys and say, here you go, do whatever you want. We'll back you up all the way.
15:25Nedum Onuoha:Do you think the nation's performance at the World Cup will matter to how he's perceived if he wants to go to Spurs next season? No, I don't think so. Why not?
15:36Julien Laurens:one because it's the world cup and it's the u.s if it was if he was the england manager they'd probably be under more scrutiny than than the u.s manager so let's say he reaches the last 16 um if you're a spurs fan whether he reaches the last 16 of the quarterfinals does that make a difference to you i think i think what's more interesting to go back to your point is what he did at chelsea and that season that was really up and down more down than up where he did it in Paris for 18 months but again that was probably more down than up and that's the last two club experiences that we had from him and I'm not sure that was convincing to the point that Spurs fans would get super excited oh he's back he took us to the Champions League final five years ago
16:23Nedum Onuoha:wherever it was or seven years ago yeah I'm not sure I think what I would say as well to link two things you were talking about thomas frank being harder on uh christian romero yeah it'd be interesting to see what someone like pochettino would say yeah especially when someone's talking about something that's not just football given how he thinks timothy weir is one of the worst people on planet earth for trying to speak out for the everyday and that's i wonder if that's a bit of a red flag you know for me that's a red flag flying quite high i agree but for others you know
16:53Julien Laurens:i guess they just want their old manager back maybe i mean for sure the next few weeks and few month, we'll talk a lot about the search for a new manager at Tottenham for now. Let's see what happens between that and the Arsenal game.
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19:11Julien Laurens:They're the ones with the bear on the box. Right, enough. Tottenham Hotspur and Thomas Frank. What about some quickies, Nets? Hey, let's go, Jules. Let's go. Manchester City closed the gap with Arsenal to three points at the top of the table with
19:22Nedum Onuoha:a big three near win against full of my home yeah it was uh watching this game it was a really really strong start from city um getting the goals and manner that they did but they were really they were the pressing was really really good yeah and they kind of stopped for them from getting a feel for the game itself and so many turnovers led to so many issues for them as well and there's a strong performance from city i think in the second half fulham basically came out and they had nothing to lose you know so at that point yeah you're more threatening you play better i think they'll be but it was a much needed win for City again.
19:55Nedum Onuoha:And the reason I say that is because we made a big deal of the Liverpool game on the weekend. But if you want to win the elite out from this point, every game is a must win. Yeah, definitely. It doesn't matter whether it's Fulham at home or say Liverpool at handfield.
20:05Julien Laurens:Nico O 'Reilly has played left back for most of the season, right? I know he was a very kind of midfieldish left back, but now he's got a position in midfield.
20:13Nedum Onuoha:He's good as well.
20:14Julien Laurens:That brings a lot more balance, right?
20:16Nedum Onuoha:Yeah, 100%. He's a really good technical player and he's very coachable. has something about him something a bit special and he's massive Jules this fella's like 6 foot 4 6 foot 5 and runs and it was a great goal for him in transition yesterday as well so it's going to be interesting to see how he finishes off the season for City and I don't know if he's going to be playing in midfield for England but maybe he can go from left back into midfield in terms of the build out
20:42Julien Laurens:I think he will make the World Cup squad I think
20:45Nedum Onuoha:yeah hopefully and he'll be deserving of it if he does so anyway Jules Roberto De Zerbe he's been sacked by Marseille you seem very happy
20:51Julien Laurens:about that no no no no no i never like people losing their jobs you know even at marseille um it's a very interesting one so okay they lost at phd on sunday got smashed 5-0 and they might not be in a way back for him for that but it's not so much i think the the problem here he was very frustrated and struggled to understand why his team could be very good one day like against lance who were terrible at the time and very bad another day like against PSG, like against Bruges in the Champions League in other games but if your manager can't really understand why his own team, so the players that he picks, the system that he picks can't get that consistency, surely it's to be on him, right?
21:31Julien Laurens:I mean the fans have had enough a lot of the players thought he was far too intense and going from one emotion to another very quickly which is very much him but in a way I'm not surprised. Do you think he gets another big job after this? I think there's still clubs, including Spurs, who still like the good things that they see about Roberto de Zerbi that they saw at Marseille, that they saw at Brighton. I think there's a lot of, it comes with a lot of baggage, you know, the intensity being one of the weaknesses that he has, because the problem with that kind of intensity and emotional side of you as a manager, is that you go up and down so quickly that I think, in a way, the players could lose you, the fans lose you, the club loses you too, at the wrong time.
22:15Nedum Onuoha:Yeah, I think that's fair. And I think with some managers that are like that, as a player, sometimes you want to match somebody's energy. At times, seeing somebody calm on the sideline goes a long, long way, especially in times of crisis.
22:25Julien Laurens:Yeah, I agree. West Ham stopped Manchester United and Michael Carrick's winning run stopped at four. There will be no five, so that kid conquered his hair still. Is that a setback, Ned, or you take a point away like that?
22:37Nedum Onuoha:I think because it was against a more resurgent West Ham, I think we can look at it in a different light. but then also for Carrick coming in and picking up 13 or 15 points through those first five games having played against City, Arsenal, Spurs, Fulham and West Ham. I think overall they deserve credit, the game itself wasn't a great game by them. I think West Ham would be disappointed to not take the three points but then it's the value of a late goal. Late goals always change how you feel about games. Exactly, exactly, they were like a bit upset beforehand but now it's like oh let's go over to the fans let's do a big clap because we've just thrown 1-1 so for me it's a minor setback it's a minor setback being able to still accrue points is massive and as it stands now I think it's them Chelsea and Liverpool fighting for that for that top five so fourth and fifth yeah listen they've got something to play for and that point could go a long way yeah so Jules it's not just Frank then we've had another manager sacked in the Premier League
23:30Julien Laurens:yeah because I woke up to your message this morning because you took the train very early from Manchester saying die she's gone which I have to say I was asleep at half midnight when Forrest put that statement out. They love putting those statements out. I think they did the same when the side post-tikoglu was right in the middle of the night or something. I'm not a Daesh fan. I never really liked him as a coach. I don't know him as a person. But 114 days in, in his last six Premier League games, there's two wins, three draws and only one loss. It felt brutal to me. But then again, they drew nil-nil at home to Wolves on Wednesday night although the expected goals is super high and they had enough chances to win and that's not
24:09Nedum Onuoha:on him yeah i thought it was a bit brutal yeah i think that i think that is fair and i think some of the anxiety comes because west ham feel resurgent behind them yeah i think points wise for the last like 10 games or so they're basically the same yeah i think they were 13th or 14th yeah but it feels more imminent at this moment in time and i think the fact that like some of the they're not really scoring enough goals and that game against wolves yesterday as a prime example you had 35 shots on goal and the game finishes no no see the more a team has had shot without scoring for the last 20 years or something yeah and in some ways maybe that's the story of sean dyes especially at this moment um in the in the premier league yeah if you've shopped online chances are you've bought from a business powered by shopify you know that purple shop pay button you see at checkout the one that makes buying so incredibly easy that's shopify and there's a reason so many businesses sell with it because shopify makes it incredibly easy to start and run your business shopify is the commerce platform behind 10 of all e-commerce in the u.s from household names like mattel and gymshark to brands just getting started shopify gives you a leg up with hundreds of beautiful ready-to-go templates to express your brand style and forget about the code tackle all those important tasks in one place from inventory to payments to analytics and more Spread your brand's word with built-in marketing and email tools to find and keep new customers.
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27:05Julien Laurens:Let's go with Chelsea. We're tuning up at home and cruising against Leeds before. What happened? I don't know.
27:13Nedum Onuoha:How can you explain this? Well, the only way to explain it is like the longer you live on this earth and the more you take an interest in football, you find these like stupid games every so often. This is what this was. because Chelsea were very much in control had the majority of the chances I think Leeds had four shots they had two shots on target and they come away with a 2-2 draw and made worse by the miss that Cole Palmer had at the back post like you almost got to like double check did that just happen you're trying to say oh did it bobble did it this so what happened
27:40Julien Laurens:because he put his foot
27:41Nedum Onuoha:I think he hit his heel and just ballooned over players of that quality they made that mistake probably one in a hundred times and just for Chelsea it's a shame that that was the moment when it happened but there was a there was a ridiculous goal the one where I think they wanted a handball against yeah Borgon against Borgon and all that stuff so it's just it's crazy but Chelsea should have won that game and probably nine times out of ten they do so if you overreact to it then yeah you'd say it's disappointing they've not been able to do it but the fact is Rossini is still unbeaten in his time as a league manager
28:12Julien Laurens:when you said earlier when we talked earlier about United that race for fourth and fifth
28:17Nedum Onuoha:yeah
28:18Julien Laurens:and what you said a bit for City which is the same for Arsenal you have to win every game now for that title. Same for those fourth and fifth places. Yeah. Dropping two points like that. It could be big, yeah. Could be massive.
28:29Nedum Onuoha:It could be massive. I think in fairness that he'd won or they'd won the previous four league games. Yeah. So they're definitely like in really good form as such. But if you've got a 2-0 lead at home against a side that's down in the bottom half of the table you'd expect to be able to close that out. So there will be a few issues but here's what it is. Anyway, Bayern are back in the German Cup semi-finals. It was a shock horror. I know but it's for the first time since 2020. Really?
28:51Julien Laurens:Yeah, so it just didn't happen for them before in past season, even last season when Kompany was already there. It was a quarterfinal against Leipzig that I think everybody was quite excited to watch. There was not much excitement in the first half, trust me. The second half was a little bit better because Leipzig made massive mistakes, especially their goalkeeper. In the end, he used a 2-0 win. It's good. They would play Freiburg in the semifinal, who beat Elta Berlin on penalties on Tuesday night. The other semifinal is Leverkusen-Stuttgart. So regardless of who wins who, but you could think Bayern and Leverkusen are the favourite in those two games, then you could have a Bayern final of the Pokal, which would be quite, I think, interesting.
29:31Julien Laurens:And for Vini, it would be a domestic double, maybe even a treble with the Champions League. So it's good. So he's not doing too bad then, yeah? He's not doing too bad. And I'm glad we always championed him because that's not the case of everybody.
29:46Nedum Onuoha:Yeah, roll the tape.
29:47Julien Laurens:Yeah, exactly. There's no name names here. Liverpool bounce back after the defeat against City at the weekend by inflating Sunderland, their first home loss of the season. Your former team, Sunderland.
29:57Nedum Onuoha:Yeah, that's right. It is strange to think that that is Sunderland's first home loss of the season as a newly promoted side and they were the last team in the league to suffer that defeat as such. It's not a big surprise. Liverpool are a very, very good side. I think Sunderland's issues in recent weeks have been about creativity. So from the moment Liverpool took the lead in that game, for whatever their defensive like for Elsie's have been and it's been added to now by Endo being injured it looks like it could be something quite serious Liverpool were very much deserving winners I think Sunderland they battled they battled but they didn't create as much as say they would have hoped to and you know you could argue it would have been a great opportunity to do it against Liverpool but it just wasn't to be
30:33Julien Laurens:Grant Chaka just to finish on Sunderland Chaka was again in the stands still injured and you see not just because Lefeuille has to play deeper and he's the most creative player in this team so if you play him deeper he's not right there closer to the box is a problem but without Xhaka he feels something there's something not yeah with
30:51Nedum Onuoha:with the experience that he has but then also you can see when he plays he's like the coach on the field you know the coach has told him what he needs of him in that moment and he can manage certain moments better than any other player not just in Sunderland but probably in and around the league to be honest so Arsenal women made a big step towards the Champions League quarterfinals
31:07Julien Laurens:yeah because they missed out on direct qualification for the quarterfinals so they have to go through the the player for the last 16 rounds if you want it's just like that they were away in belgium to leuven and they won four nil pretty easy they'd beaten leuven as well in their league phase too it's not a surprise what's really interesting is that if they qualify they will qualify they will play chelsea in the quarter finals so home and away ties between them and chelsea will be pretty special i think in this champions league the other last 16 time that we had last night was Paris FC against Real Madrid, which was very, very good.
31:42Julien Laurens:If you want to watch the highlights, it's really worth it. Real Madrid won 3-2. Linda Caicedo was amazing. But I'm glad that little Paris FC still have a chance. I know they need an incredible performance away in Madrid next week to qualify. But still, they're still in the shine. That's what they wanted. They just didn't want to be batted 3 or 4-0 and have no chance. At least it's only a 3-2 defeat, even if it's at home. And they will have a chance maybe to do something in Madrid next week. A win that maybe we are not really seeing coming, Ned.
32:12Nedum Onuoha:It's the one for Burnley away at Crystal Palace on Wednesday night after being 2-0 down. Yeah, of course. And we all saw it real time, didn't we? You know, Crystal Palace scored a first goal, scored a second goal. They're at home. They're playing against Burnley, a side who are basically counting down to the end of the season because they can be in the championship and then bang, bang, bang. Three in seven minutes. And even when it was 3-2 at halftime, you still think, well, Palace will probably score a second half. But I think some of this shows the position that Palace are in. You know, their form sneakily within the league is as bad as anyone else's.
32:39Nedum Onuoha:but I think in some ways just from the human side of things the fact that Burnley went 16 games without a win that can be really really tough like negative momentum is definitely something that they felt but now they're in that awkward position to where there's just like a little bit of hope and sometimes it's the hope that kills you
32:55Julien Laurens:it's almost because you've been in the position where you were in a team that was struggling and is this almost you don't even as a Burnley player or even you know Scott Parker himself just didn't see coming even or like you don't us to win the game yeah to score like that and then yeah i think certain things will surprise
33:14Nedum Onuoha:you when you've been on a run that long and you've not been winning games of football it can be very very tough because you kind of wonder well how's it going to work because through all the time that they've been playing and losing games the managers likely change training times change what they did in training change what they've eaten change the type of hotels they stay at change their tactics done different video reviews they've done everything they could to try and break that cycle but the fact is they still go out on the pitch and not be able to score enough goals to win a game of football so for them to score three away from home most teams do not do that but fair play to them yeah so Palace have also given an update on Mateta's injury duels yes do you remember he had
33:48Julien Laurens:this move to AC Milan cancelled because of that knee injury it was either surgery and he would miss the World Cup for sure or do some sort of rehab and he would have a shot maybe if Deschamps picks him to be fit for the World Cup he decided not to take the surgery I think the club because they've got Svan Larsson as well, kind of let him choose. So let's see, I really hope for him that he can come back to decent fitness before the end of the season and give himself a chance to maybe call up by Desmond. Would you like to see him there? I think it gives you a different profile to Dembele and Mbappe and, you know, even Akiti K and those kind of guys.
34:24Julien Laurens:I mean, there's so much talent for France. I think he will miss out. Ned, Aston Villa needed a late, late Inshilwood on goal to beat Brighton on Wednesday night.
34:34Nedum Onuoha:they're a funny team Villa they are a funny team because they obviously still very much you could argue technically still in the title race you could argue that point but they don't look like one at the moment like the result they got yesterday does have an element of good fortune I think the nature of the ongoing it's against the Brighton side who realistically have been struggling for a little bit now and who were probably better in that second half and also like this is the same Villa team who struggled so much against Bournemouth on the weekend can. Things you wouldn't necessarily expect to see from a side as I say that's doing as well as what they're doing but I suppose at some point towards the end of the season it's just about the results isn't it?
35:12Nedum Onuoha:Yeah yeah true and they've been very good at that. Yeah they're grinding out these results and some people might say they're lucky or whatever but if it keeps happening maybe there's a skill to it.
35:21Julien Laurens:I know maybe there's a skill to it maybe. We saw something that we don't usually see or certainly not very often. Carlos Baleba was subbed up very early not because he was injured but because he got an early yellow card he's a young player you've been in that position before as a young player could this be damaging for him you think in terms of confidence because we saw him on the bench after he had his head in the shirt he had like he looked distraught yeah
35:49Nedum Onuoha:i think an early substitution is very very tough to receive as a player like thankfully i was never part of that like i was taken off half time a couple of times but never like in the first half because in the first half it's all eyes on you. Yeah, yeah. For a half-time one, yeah. For a half-time nobody's really seen you or whatever. But to be like that in the first half is concerning. It's a game where he will believe that he could have made a difference. And I think human nature, if you start off slowly in a game, you believe you can improve. You always do it as an individual. So when the manager says, no, I don't trust you to be able to get better.
36:20Nedum Onuoha:I think what it causes, I wouldn't necessarily say if it's an internal confidence in yourself. I think it's more so a belief in a relationship between yourself and the person that thinks that you're not good enough now because the manager could pull you to the side and say, oh, you know, I was doing it to protect you. Which ones protect me? Allow me to do what I want to do which is play the game. So I think if I was belay about I'd be very, very, very disappointed. I think for, it brings out some of the darker sides of me and I would be quite toxic and hold a grudge with a manager against the manager.
36:45Nedum Onuoha:I know you would. You know what I mean? I do have that within me.
36:47Julien Laurens:Because many, many players and young or not so young receive early yellow cards, right? It happens in any game. It's football, isn't it? Yeah, and I know he made another foul after and they thought, OK, but surely you can trust your own player. Or is the way Hansel sees Baliba and thinks, hmm, he's a bit of a loose cannon too much sometimes.
37:06Nedum Onuoha:I think it'd be very hard to be Baliba and to think that the manager trusts you. Because if he trusted you, he'd keep you on. Because otherwise everyone else that got a yellow card in the game or made a foul, he'd take them off. I think he's seen that. And maybe to be charitable, maybe he's thought Villa are going to try and play into him on this yellow card. Yes. You know sometimes in games where the noise goes up every time. Yeah, the players are targeting you, the fans are targeting you, and I think the moment's a bit too much. But Balibas, it's not like he's 16 years old. I know, I agree. You know what I mean?
37:35Nedum Onuoha:So I think he'd be disappointed, but I'm sure we'll talk about the person that came on anyway further down the road. Yes. As you know, managing maintenance, repair, and operations is never easy. But for the ones who always rise to the challenge, Grainger has your back. From professional-grade products you can count on to fast, dependable delivery, They're there to help you keep things running smoothly. Plus, their technical product specialists are here to help answer your toughest questions. And because Grainger knows safety is always a priority, they're committed to being your partner in protecting both your people and your facilities.
38:08Nedum Onuoha:Call 1-800-GRAINGER, click grainger.com, or just stop by. Save money and get a better view of the road when you replace your worn-out wiper blades at O 'Reilly Auto Parts. Right now, save$10 on a pair of Rain-X Latitude wiper blades. They feature beam blade technology to improve windshield contact for maximum visibility. The professional parts people will even install your new wiper blades for free. Choose Rain-X Latitude wiper blades at your local O 'Reilly Auto Parts store or online at OReillyAuto.com. Dale Upamakano then, Jules. He's going to extend his contract with Bayern.
38:43Julien Laurens:Yeah, he was one of the big names that was out of contract in the summer. Conati is another one, for example, and there are many others. but there was a lot of chat around what he would do would he stay at bayern who wanted to keep him would he go somewhere else there were clubs like usually english clubs mentioned real madrid mentioned psg mentioned all of that uh he decided to stay at barman which i think is a very good thing for them and for him because he must be happy there right on a huge huge contract by the way in terms of signing on fee and in terms of wages which i think a few people are taking a little bit in Germany because that's not really what it's not so much that's not what Bayern do it's more that he'd been a bit critical of the club um recently and I and I and I think some of the fans say like well you know he kind of wanted to leave he ran down his contract when I mean critical to the club in that sense um and now you you basically gave in everything that he wanted which I can kind of understand but I think he's a very good defender one of the best centre-back in Europe right now
39:50Nedum Onuoha:yeah I think the points you've made they're not ones which I'd heard before but now you've said them I think it puts him in a situation to where he's going to be held to the highest standard going forward like the Bayern Munich fans even in this sort of great season have protested at times against certain things that even Vincent Kompany has been doing certain members of Bayern players from the past who've been accused of certain things you know being part of the not training group but speaking with the manager and so on yeah yeah the thing is like
40:20Julien Laurens:the way he played this kind of like ransom yeah exactly to the point that they say okay pretty much anything you want we will give the signing off fee the wages etc etc and from a from a fan's point of view i guess you can be a bit like well lame go then fans in germany will
40:38Nedum Onuoha:be outspoken. They're not going to let things just slide and if a big enough group of them think that this is the wrong decision or they're going about the wrong way at some point they will let him know.
40:47Julien Laurens:That's very true too. Naidem, your former teammate James Milner came on for Carlos Baleba, to go back to that point that we made earlier, and made history on Wednesday night.
40:59Nedum Onuoha:Yeah, it's the 653rd Premier League game which is crazy to say. That's tied with Gareth Barry.
41:06Julien Laurens:yes so he hasn't broken the record hasn't broken it yet
41:09Nedum Onuoha:no and it's crazy that his first game he played in the Premier League was in 2002 for Leeds United and I picture him now with that Leeds white strong bow top with the collar baggy shirt rolling his sleeves up and I played against him in reserves I think that year or the year after but to think that like he started then and he's still around now he's still like having an impact in obviously see different ways because say physically now for as good as he is he's not as good as he was within the previous 24 years but his ways of experience and his like drive to win his understanding of what coaches want and how to manage things within games yeah like Hurtzler's bringing him on in the 20th minute yesterday yeah as a 40 year old like coming on in the first half as a sub is as hard as it comes it's like physically so tough but Hurtzler knew that he needed him to replace Carlos but like we were talking about before so credit to him for still being trusting to play that many games like it's not 653 games in a career is amazing 653 games and what we call the best league in the world yeah or what some call the best league in the world is hugely significant because as well as availability there needs to be trust in there from a lot of different managers so i'm i'm privileged to have played with him did you when you you played with him at city i played with them for the 21s england and for a little bit of city yeah so for example in the 21s could you see
42:32Julien Laurens:there was going to be longevity because of the way he was off the field or he was too hard to tell you?
42:36Nedum Onuoha:No, I think as is the case with many things in life, as you look back now, certain things feel more obvious than they were in the moment. Because he was always very serious. Yeah, but he wasn't, it's not like serious. He was just like committed. He was committed to the sport and being the best that he could be. And as we say that today, that's actually quite cool. When you say it 20 years ago, people called you busy and say like it was like a negative. You know what I mean? Like, why is this guy like doing stuff before training? like you hear the stories of people doing shooting after practice and stuff but this guy's doing stuff before training yeah he's making sure that availability is one of his best abilities as well as everything else that he had and today that has become more of a norm and the standard but from when he first started it wasn't but now that i look back and like he made his debut two years before i did and he's still playing six years after i finished and there are lots of people just like that who feel the same thing he was clearly onto something yeah definitely you know
43:29Julien Laurens:mean and he's because you also play with gareth barry who you know well yeah um also legend did so there's something really interesting we're not interesting we're not here to compare them it's a great record for you know both of them for now gareth played far more minutes by the way because a lot of james milliner's appearances have come off the bench especially in recent times yeah so i think there's there's yeah there's a lot more minutes from um from gareth barry on the page so we take nothing away obviously from james smilner but he's slightly a different career
43:57Nedum Onuoha:right uh in a way in some ways in some ways the thing about gareth is like he's incredibly robust yeah yeah so when he was at city i think he came over and he's like i had late 20s early 30s and we were training then he got injured and he said he'd hurt his hamstring and it was the first time he'd ever hurt his hamstring this was like might have been 30 31 yeah first time he's ever hurt his hamstring which is incredible yeah and he was like he's like he's a bit anxious as i've not I'm a bit concerned, this, that and the other. I said, how long are you going to be out for? He said a week. He said that's the longest injury he's ever had.
44:35Nedum Onuoha:It's one body that the science should look into. Yeah, it's freaky. It didn't have a lot of speed in it, but it had a lot of quality. But what I would say about him and James is people could make a case that they're the best player at certain points, but nobody wants to listen to it. But if you make a case that they're one of the most important players, you won't find many people that could argue against it. for all the places that they've been to, like if you play small-sided games, if you play bigger things, like those people are like the glue that holds a lot of stuff together.
45:05Julien Laurens:Yeah, I agree, yeah.
45:05Nedum Onuoha:And some of the jobs that they do are the ones which aren't really obvious, but the ones that they understand, which elevates the defending, elevates the attacking. And yeah, as I say, they're available. Gareth Barry was a freak and James Bond was exactly the same, to be honest.
45:17Julien Laurens:And just before people start screaming at their screen or their phone or wherever they're listening, life in football existed before. allegedly the primary league allegedly so gareth barry and james milner are eighth in the overall most most top flight appearances in history of english football just for the purist here yeah we are purists producer graham as well but peter shilton is the top of that list with 848 which is
45:45Nedum Onuoha:insane by 848 i know he's a goalkeeper makes no difference man makes no difference uh all-time
45:51Julien Laurens:appearances in english top flight football then you've got john hollins with 714 which is also crazy and then i think ray clements i think might be third or something like that so yeah so in premier league history that milner and barry are the best in all-time top flight english football peter shilton is still looking and that record is never going to be beaten never ever
46:14Nedum Onuoha:that's for sure that just sounds exhausting just looking at the number to be honest how many years That's too much football. Too many years. That's way too many years, too much football. So there's been another manager getting the second league on Jules. This time it's Habib Bay.
46:26Julien Laurens:Yeah, remember Habib Bay?
46:27Nedum Onuoha:Habib Bay, yeah, sorry.
46:28Julien Laurens:Yeah, no, no, Newcastle player amongst other teams. He was a Rennes. He, I always have a bit of an issue when you sack a manager who is sixth in the table. And I guess Amorim was fifth with United and they sacked him because they didn't think he was the right guy. Same for Rennes, they didn't think he was the right guy. they had a terrible run of form the last few games and not just the form because you could lose a game and being a very good team or the best team on the pitch the last game where they were terrible and there was a lot of tension between him and the dressing room which is never good between him and the people above him he made a few crazy demands as a coach like for example, Rennes just sold two of the most coveted young players Jacquet at Liverpool Mehite in Saudi Arabia and Habib Bey was like, hang on, I think I deserved some sort of percentage on their self because before they arrived, they were not that good and I made them that good, I swear to you.
47:24Julien Laurens:And I was like, Habib, I love you. We've known each other for a very long time, but this is not on.
47:31Nedum Onuoha:That's not the way this works.
47:33Julien Laurens:It doesn't work like this. So I feel for him a little bit because he's a really nice guy. But you know what? We talk about Deserby being psyched. He's the leading candidate now to take over at Marseille. so you know silver linings he played for marseille captain marseille yeah when they played newcastle in the ufacup final and things like that uh semi-final so let's see uh franc ace by the way if you like your french football he's the leading contender to to to go to rennes
47:58Nedum Onuoha:and become the permanent manager there so let's see okay next real madrid players when i on a
48:04Julien Laurens:meal all together without any staff any coach this week i guess as a kind of team bonding exercise you have played the game you probably have been in those dinners or lunches or breakfast or barbecues whatever does this kind of things really work at that level ah you're gonna get
48:20Nedum Onuoha:the grumpy side out me now oh god i love your grumpy sides so it just depends it depends why you're doing it okay because some elements of like team bonding are forced and some elements are more natural if the culture is to go out as a team yeah like quite regularly then it's great if it's a case of like okay we need to do something to bring everybody together you know this is different let's do this that and the other like for football men's women's or whatever it's a bunch of adults that have their own lives yeah so sometimes going to do these things takes you away from the life that you're leading away from football and does everybody get along maybe not can you all be together enjoying themselves perhaps not who's picking the cuisine i don't really like this you know what time is it ah this is what it is some people want to go and be away like think of 20 or 25 people go to a restaurant here's the table who sits where yeah you might see the big dogs at one side you see other people down the other like you're not going to be seeing like the um is it gonzalo is he sitting next to killian on the head of the table i know probably not i always wonder that yeah so that these like socially awkward positions where if you don't have all the status and leverage at a club, firstly, you've probably not been involved in organising it.
49:37Nedum Onuoha:And secondly, if you turned up or you didn't, nobody would care. So is it really team bonding or is it more a case of we're doing this? Because, you know, on the surface, it could be quite beneficial. I don't think it makes things worse. No, no, sure. Yeah, it can only be... But I don't think it necessarily makes things better. It depends on the club itself.
49:55Julien Laurens:Because obviously the form has been good in the league. They're still one point behind Barca. But the performances haven't been great since Abeloa took over. Yeah, like, sometimes there's chemistry, sometimes there's not.
50:06Nedum Onuoha:If a club and a group of players or even people within a workplace don't have chemistry, you can't force it, even if you tell them to go and do something that's designed to build the team. You know what I mean? So, I don't know, man. I don't know. Let's see.
50:18Julien Laurens:Let's see what happens at the weekend, I guess.
50:20Nedum Onuoha:Yeah. Anyway, Ronald Arrujo has talked for the first time about his recent depression, Jules.
50:24Julien Laurens:Yeah, he gave a big interview in the Spanish newspaper, I think, Mundo Deportivo, this week to talk about it. remember after the Chelsea defeat I think he was in the Champions League where he was sent off and Barca lost heavily he decided to take some time away from the game for mental health issues and he explained very well I thought in the interview he spoke really well about he always had anxiety that turned into depression after that game especially and after all the backlash that he got on social media especially he said like you know people saying they wanted to kill my daughters and and that I could not cope with and I don't think anybody would cope well with that anyway.
50:59Julien Laurens:So he said for 18 months already before all of this happened, he was a bit struggling. And while I was really glad, and I don't know if every club would do the same, but that Barcelona were very supportive, the players were very supportive, the coaching staff very supportive, his family as well to say, take as much time you want or you need to come back in a healthier way, in a way. And he did so and I think he's done well since coming back. He's scored a few goals too. He defended well. I don't know if this kind of issue can come back regularly in a career and in a life because he seems very fragile too.
51:39Julien Laurens:So now things are better. But what happens maybe if he gets another red card one day and things like that. So I really wish him the best because I thought that the interview was really felt from the heart and really honest in what he had to say yeah i'm glad
51:53Nedum Onuoha:that he's done the interview and it's another case in my opinion of like you don't realize somebody's perspective until they share it and when they share it you realize how tough certain things are because for some people you know we live and die by players and their performances and we critique them based on that yeah but a performance is one part of like a greater thing itself like somebody that has had mental struggles for a year year and a half if you were the everyday person on the street that's tough if you're somebody that is doing it in the presence of like tens of thousands of people every single week and you're being judged purely on your output from the profession that you have not the person that you are that can be very very tough and I'm glad in some ways that say Barcelona supported him because they made a point of that so now that's the standard exactly that is the standard the standard isn't say oh just get over it just crack on and do whatever you know we need you back figure it out it's more so to see the human side of things and that will be seen by not just Ronald but like all the other players as well that's the culture that they want to set there that's the culture that can be seen around the league and hopefully as well you know some of the abuse and stuff that he gets and other people get before people go and release that think about the human side you know because nobody wants to receive the type of stuff that he's received regardless of whether they've like to put into perspective is this game of football that he's had meaning that he's worth every single bit of abuse that we receive or is it just a moment where they've not performed to their best within a situation yeah you know what i mean yeah yeah this is a blip in a long history of a human being yeah yeah not the most important moment in the history of the world and that's why it's a really good
53:28Julien Laurens:example to say and i know you obviously went through a very difficult time but the more we talk about this the more people yeah of high profile like him also talk about the experience the more people that might struggle but don't want to say it because they're not sure if the club was their club would support them, what the fans reaction would be, or even sometimes maybe their teammates. There's probably still some teammates thinking like, oh, come on, you know, don't be like this, be stronger than this. I don't really want to understand or even support the player. But the more we can talk about it, and I think the better it would be for everybody in the game.
54:00Nedum Onuoha:Yeah, I totally agree. I think you need to ask yourself as a person, not just in football, but like, are you being honest with yourself when you say you're all right? Are you actually okay? And if you're in an environment where you can't express that you're not okay, then there's something wrong with the environment and not you. And I think that should go a long, long way.
54:14Julien Laurens:Definitely. England have just announced that they've given Thomas Tuchel an extension to his contract, Nathan, that was supposed to finish after the World Cup. It's an extra two years. As an England fan, not really, but are you happy?
54:27Nedum Onuoha:Do you know what? It's funny. When we think about fandom, like, is it just like your nationality? Is it still fandom if it's just like that country or whatever? But obviously what this means, Jules, and it's unlucky for you, it means England have won the World Cup.
54:37Julien Laurens:Okay, they've won the World Cup. Yeah, because you would not give them an extension if you were doing badly at the World Cup, right?
54:41Nedum Onuoha:They said the reason he's been brought in is to win the World Cup and we'll see what happens after that. So, listen, England have won the World Cup and they'll be winning the Euros in two years after. Yeah, congratulations to England. It's interesting that they've done that, especially given the fact that so many clubs have apparently been interested in his services. I agree. So, if it was club football, I'd say maybe it's to protect their asset and the value of it. Or maybe they just think he's done a really good job as it stands.
55:04Julien Laurens:But would you take this decision before the World Cup? So, okay, let's say the worst, I know it's the worst scenario and it won't happen, but what if England don't even make it past the group stages of the World Cup?
55:15Nedum Onuoha:It feels to me like they've put all their trust into him and if that works out, it won't be his fault. That's the way. I think that's what they're trying to spin because this contract, how long has it been negotiated for? True. You know, without doubt, they started last week, so I'm not sure about it. but I suppose continuity in theory will help them this summer knowing that when it's all said and done they'll be ready to go again yeah yeah I guess
55:39Julien Laurens:I like Thomas Tuchel a lot and I think he's going to do a good job but this still feels a little bit unusual by the way just to finish on that a lot of other big national team FAs and things like that wait until the tournament is over to talk about what the future holds you know it's usually a cycle of two years or four years I get that but they never they rarely take this kind of decision before a tournament like this.
56:01Nedum Onuoha:So if you had to bet, would you say England are ahead of the curve or behind it by doing this? Time will tell, eh? Time will tell.
56:06Julien Laurens:Yeah, definitely.
56:07Nedum Onuoha:So Jules, the Japanese league has made a controversial decision.
56:10Julien Laurens:I know, and I love this. And as a former player, I'm curious to see what you said. Basically, it's the 100th anniversary of the creation of the Japanese league. And for that, this season, the league have decided to not have any draws anymore. So if the game finishes 1-1, 0-0, 2-2, whatever, it goes to a penalty shootout to declare a winner. The winner will get two points, the loser will still get one point like if it was a draw and people seem to be very excited about it the fans for the penalty shootout the clubs have voted for it and we're happy to change this for now it's only for this season and then next season just for the anniversary and next season they go back to the normal um you know two points for a win and one point for a draw because that's what it is over there it's not three points what significance of the anniversary for this is
56:52Nedum Onuoha:this the way it used to be or something hundred years no it's just they wanted to try something
56:55Julien Laurens:different I think in part of celebrations and they thought okay let's do this then a bit like what MLS used to do a long long time let's not get into that let's not get into that
57:05Nedum Onuoha:yeah there's some dark times there it was not penalty shootout
57:08Julien Laurens:wasn't it it was like one on one with the keeper yeah
57:10Nedum Onuoha:that's because that's when MLS was trying to turn football into other sports yes and it didn't really age well but do you know I'll be honest I don't mind this and the reason I don't mind it is because it gives fans an extra reason to stay in the stadium after a game is done but also So nobody loses out. There's only somebody who has a chance to gain. Yeah. So I'm at peace with it actually. I don't think it would be received too well over in 99 % of the world otherwise. Yeah, that's fair. That's fair as well. But I like it. I think it could be quite entertaining. Would you have taken the pens or would you have been seven feet?
57:40Nedum Onuoha:Listen, the only time I've been involved in a pen as a shooter, I was the last man to be taking a pen. And unfortunately, it didn't get to me. So yeah, if I'm on the pitch, then great. But there might be a tactical sub just before the end of the game saying, yeah, let's get him off. He's of no use anymore.
57:54Julien Laurens:Fair enough. That's fair enough. All right, Nels, so much, thank you so much for coming down. It was awesome to have you with me on this edition of the Gab and Jules show. We'll be back on Monday. There's a big weekend of football coming up, the magic of the FA Cup, obviously, that you can follow on ESPN if you live in the US. Safe journey back north to Manchester. Have a great weekend as well. All of you have a good weekend and like Gab always says, love yourself, love your neighbour, love your game or something like that.
58:27Nedum Onuoha:Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. The message for everyone paying big wireless way too much. Please, for the love of everything good in this world, stop. With Mint, you can get premium wireless for just$15 a month. Of course, if you enjoy overpaying, no judgments, but that's weird. Okay, one judgment. Anyway, give it a try at mintmobile.com slash switch. Upfront payment of$45 for three-month plan, equivalent to$15 per month required. Intro rate first three months only. Then full price plan options available. Taxes and fees extra. See full terms at mintmobile.com.
From the publisher
Julien Laurens is joined by Nedum Onuoha to discuss Tottenham Hotspur's decision to sack Thomas Frank with the side close to the relegation zone.
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