Perez to Win Presidency

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0:34Welcome to today's edition of ESPN FC. I'm Dan Thomas, joined by Stuart Robson is here in the studio for the next four months. Stevie Nicholl joins us as well as we continue our countdown to the start of the World Cup. Later on in the show, Gustavo Hoffman will be joining us to discuss Brazil and Argentina. But away from the tournament that kicks off on Thursday, the presidential elections in Madrid took place today. and as we go to air, Sid Lowe joins us. We don't know the winner, but it looks like the winner is going to be Fiorentino Perez. So I don't want to go into the complications of the recount because that's going to take forever, Sid.

1:07Let's just assume that Fiorentino Perez has won it. What does that mean?

1:15Right, well, it means a number of things. The first thing I think is that the exit polls suggest that he's won it with around about 65 % of the vote, maybe a fraction higher, maybe a fraction lower. We're still waiting on that. I think that would suggest that he has a pretty strong mandate to continue and to go ahead with his plans to sell off 5 % of the club and from that to see if he can begin this process towards changing the model of the club. So it wouldn't be a model of membership-owned club as such. It would be done in a different way. I think actually 65 % it sounds a very big win and I suppose on the face of it is a very big win but I think it's a surprisingly significant result for Enrique Raquelme a guy that basically no one had heard of three weeks ago.

1:56For him to get around about 35 % and let's see what the final figures are, I think it's quite significant. I think it does suggest a growing, I wouldn't call it an opposition to Florentino Perez, but at least an alternative to Florentino Perez. But the bottom line is it gives him the mandate to continue. It keeps him in power. He's already been in power, of course, for 23 years with a gap in the middle between 2006 and 2009. It means that he can go ahead with this plan to change the structure and the model of the club. It also means in the immediate short term, Dan, that we will see Conate and Dumfries come into the club.

2:31It means we will almost certainly see Jose Mourinho announced probably tomorrow, on Monday. And, of course, what Florentino also said was that he's going to make a bid of at least€150 million for a Galactico on Tuesday. Which is going to be a lease exit, yes? Well, this is what we believe. But, of course, Florentino, apparently, the curious thing about this was that this was on a TV show. with a presenter called Ike Jimenez. And when Jimenez suggested Olise, Florentino denied it. But the very strong evidence points at it being Olise. I don't know if Florentino denied it because he was kind of caught on the hop and kind of didn't know what to say or if he just doesn't want to point it out yet.

3:13But the other thing is we should remember here that, of course, this is Florentino Perez saying that he's going to make a bid, not him promising that he will get the player, but promising that he will make the bid. Who's going to leave, Sid?

3:27this is a very good question who's going to leave because of course if you look at the structure at Real Madrid if you I mean bringing in an Elise isn't necessarily a problem because of course he plays on the right hand side and on the face of it you could say Elise, Vinicius, Mbappé that is a hell of a forward line isn't it and anyone would want that but I think there are some doubts about a lot of players you know obviously we know that Carvajal is going we know that Dani Thabias is going those two maybe don't matter enormously, although Carvajal is the club captain. I think there is a doubt about what happens up front.

3:57And Florentino, during this presidential campaign, which by the way, I think has been really good for Real Madrid in a way. And it's certainly been good for the fans and for journalists and everyone around because we're hearing from Florentino Perez. We've not really heard from him for around about decades. We're hearing from him in a different context and he's having to answer certain questions. Now, that's not to say you always get clear answers. And that's natural, I think, when you're the president of a club. But one of the things he's been asked about was about Vinicius. He's talked about wanting to keep him.

4:23He's talked about saying that he doesn't think that there's any hurry, but Vinicius is going into the final year of his contract. So if right now, if your question, Dan, is essentially asking me which of the big two is leaving, and I suspect it kind of was, then right now, of course, logic suggests we're talking more about Vinicius than about Mbappe. So, Sid, on the face of it, this is exactly what the fans wanted. Fresh faces coming in, a mix-up, but the problem is, the core problems are still there if you believe what we've seen over the last few months with those big players? Right, OK, so the core problems are still there.

5:01Well, at the moment they are. But of course, let's present the kind of the optimistic Real Madrid fans view at the moment. The optimistic Real Madrid fans view is, OK, the core problems maybe are there. For example, some of the gaps in the squad, that there isn't a ball playing number five, there isn't someone to build the play, that the problems with Mbappé and Vinicius occupying similar space, the problems with dressing room divisions, some of those issues there about how there hasn't been a solidarity amongst the squad, how there's been very, very significant divides, and all of those things are there right now.

5:31Now, the optimistic view, though, says, ah, but those things change when the manager is no longer Ardaboloa or Xavi Alonso. Those things change when maybe two or three key players depart and maybe some other players come in who perhaps have leadership qualities. those things change in theory when you bring in Jose Mourinho and I think one of the big things about Mourinho's arrival and I do genuinely think that Mourinho's arrival can partly be described defined or explained by nostalgia by the idea that he made Madrid tough and aggressive and they went and took Barcelona on and I think that's what people want and I think the belief is that he partly did that because he also took on some of the egos in the dressing room because he was a leader now this is not to say that Mourinho is the same guy he was in 2013 when he left you know it's 13 years have passed and I think actually in some ways he's he's a mellower figure than he was then but I think that if you like that nostalgic view is we need someone that really imposes in the dressing room and whether or not this is still true the image of Mourinho is of precisely that kind of personality why would these players listen to Jose Mourinho uh well players haven't listened to Jose Mourinho over the last few years, I wouldn't say.

6:40And the style of football that we saw when he was Roma manager, they were real disciplined. The players were real disciplined. He spent most of his time arguing with fourth officials, most of his time arguing with press, most of his time arguing with referees in car parks. That's the Jose Mourinho that we've seen over the last 13 years, or maybe the last 10 years. He went from Roma, he's been to Turkey, hasn't done particularly well. He did OK at Manchester United. But he isn't the same manager. He isn't the same character he was when he went to Chelsea, when he was at Inter Milan, where he was dominant.

7:09And when he made substitutions and when he said things, everybody listened to him. Now, when he says things, people don't listen to him quite so much. When you think of the best man management of this generation, Carlo Ancelotti has to be number one. He couldn't get these players in the end to listen to him. Correct. So why would Jose Mourinho? What a good question. If only you'd asked it. There really isn't a positive answer to that. Because I, including everybody on our show, I haven't heard anybody turn around and say, this is it. This guy's going to sort it out. We know what he's like. We know what he can do.

7:46You know, Sid's been talking about if you're an ultra positive Madrid fan, he just listed about four ifs. And one of the biggest ifs is, will they listen to Mourinho? So you'd have to say probably not. Why? No question, this guy's mellowed. The guy who came in the last time maybe could have sorted it out. But he isn't the same guy. And so it's another if. Can he do it? Every time we sit here and we're talking about Areola, for example, going into Liverpool, we know what he's going to try and do. We know what he's all about. We've got a really good idea of what he's going to try and do. We've got no clue what Mourinho's going to try.

8:28When he went into Real Madrid the first time, he'd had success in Sporting Lisbon, Porto, sorry. And then he'd had success with Chelsea. Everywhere he went, he won things. So when he went to Real Madrid, everybody believed everything he said, you know, and the football was much better. He was dominant with the press. Everybody loved what he was saying. You know, he believed him. That's not the case. He's going into a club now, having not done too well over the last few years. Sid, you can write the headlines, can't you, almost already. First couple of months, Stern Mourinho is getting a song out of this side.

9:02and it's when it all starts to fall apart that it's going to be fascinating to see how it all plays out. Yeah, and it's going to be very interesting to see how this plays out. And I think just to try and answer it in part, at least one of Stevie's questions there, which is why would they listen to Mourinho? And I think when we look at the experience of Xabi Alonso, look at the experience of Alvaro Abelho and look at the experience of Ancelotti in the final season, because of course the season before Ancelotti won the Champions League. So I think it would be fair to say he certainly did get a tune out of them then.

9:31I think maybe the really big difference with Mourinho is not just about Mourinho. It's about what Mourinho symbolises and what he's got around him. About the fact that this is a manager that, in theory at least, will be given the authority. In theory at least, will be back. This is one of the very few managers that Florentino Perez, the present, has truly believed in. Has truly felt a sense of connection with. That he likes that aggressive Mourinho. That he likes the idea of going and taking people on and being tough with it. And I think that one of the differences between Mourinho and Abelar and Alonso and Ancelotti, the last three, is that I think that when Mourinho, for example, let's go to the Classico from earlier this season.

10:09Xavi Alonso takes off Vinicius, Vinicius saws off the pitch and down the tunnel and basically says, well, I won't come back again. Now, Vinicius does eventually apologise, but the dividing lines are opened up then. At that point, there's a real problem. One of the reasons there was a problem is because Alonso wasn't backed, wasn't given the authority by the club to act. And I think right now, and maybe it will only happen in the short term, because we know the nature of Real Madrid, we know the nature of the environment, but in the short term at least, if that happened in a Clasico this time around with Mourinho, and Mourinho decides, right, Vinicius sits on the bench for the next four games, I think he would be backed in it, and in a way that Alonso wasn't.

10:49So if we're looking for that, again, to use the optimistic view of this, if we're looking for that optimistic view of it from a rounded fans point of view, I think the optimistic view would be the differences Mourinho comes with authority. Good man, Sid. Thank you very much. When are you coming to the States?

11:06Next week on Thursday. Lovely. Good man. Safe trip. Just a reminder, we have you covered and then some when it comes to the World Cup. tomorrow morning. Our brand new show starts and of course we're with you every single day, bringing you everything you need to know what's going to happen over the next seven weeks. Dell PCs with Intel inside are built for the moments that matter, the moments you plan and the ones you don't. Built for the busy days that turn into all night study sessions, the moment you're working from a cafe and realize every outlet's taken, the times you're deep in your flow and the absolute last thing you need is an auto update throwing off your momentum.

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12:40The game between Denmark and Ukraine was abandoned today after Christian Eriksson collapsed. Obviously, considering his history, huge concern for the fans in the stadium and those around the world. Now, this was a statement that was released by the Denmark team doctor. Christian is doing well and walked off the pitch by himself. As I see it, the pacemaker responded as it should. He was briefly unconscious but regained consciousness very quickly and we were quickly in contact with him. He will now undergo further examinations at the hospital to determine what caused the incident. We are in ongoing contact with him and the doctors at the hospital, but Christian is doing well and he asked me to send his regards to all the players and tell them that he was OK.

13:29Argentina and Brazil both in action this weekend. Argentina with a win over Honduras. Brazil beating Egypt. Both are joint fifth favourites to win the World Cup. Let's welcome in. For more on the South American's chances, Gustavo Hoffman is with us. Gustavo, let me ask you the simplest of questions. And don't give me your Brazilian bias. Who is the better team going into the World Cup, Brazil or Argentina? Argentina Argentina but we have we have to remember that Argentina didn't face any strong team over the last four years including Brazil when they faced Brazil in the qualifiers it was still not the Brazil of Carlo Ancelotti it was another Brazil a very bad very poor Brazil so but anyway they are the champions so I have to respect them but I think that Brazil is Carlo Ancelotti is trying to to construct a better team a stronger team than what we used to see over the last month.

14:28But anyway, you saw the news. Wesley out. Wesley was already the backup for the right back. Edre Militão would be the starter. Now Brazil will have to use the third option at the right back. And our fullbacks were already our main problem, in my opinion. So the bookies can't separate them. Who do you have? I'm going to go with Brazil. I think Angelotti will do a fairly decent job. I like Rafinha a lot. You know, if he can combine with Vinicius Jr. Casimiro came back into form, whether he gets a starting berth or not, at Manchester United for the last few months. Bruno Guimaraes, who has just scored a goal, is a decent midfield player.

15:06Hendrik will be probably a substitute and come off the bench. I think overall, they've got a decent side and they will be managed properly in Ancelotti. They'll keep them calm, they'll be well organised and I think they'll play within a 4-4-2 almost. So you get the deciding vote, Stevie? I'm going to stick to Argentina. Are you? Yeah, I just think all round they're more solid, dependable. They certainly don't have the flair that Brazil have. But I think it's a bit of a stretch, just because Angelotti's in charge, that all of a sudden they've jumped over the top of Argentina. So, yeah, no, I'm sticking with Argentina.

15:41Until Brazil show me otherwise. Argentina have got a lot of players that, over the course of the last couple of seasons, haven't been in the first team of clubs. Someone like Molina at right back. But there's something to be said. And are you going to rely on Messi to produce one moment of magic? There's a lot to be said for being there, done it, seen it, know what it's all about. And then when it really kicks in, when it really starts. Martínez is going to be better than he was four years ago. He's loving it. I think he likes Brazil. Gustavo, let's take a look at Robbo's tip then to win the World Cup.

16:10And they're starting 11. As you mentioned, Wesley will be out now picking up that injury. Is this the team that will start, do you think, that opening game against Morocco? Well, Wesley out, probably Danilo will be the starter, a former Juventus player, Gerard Madrid, Manchester City player playing for Flamengo this season. We have a doubt in the left. We're not sure if it's going to be Douglas Santos or Alexandro. And then Paquetá will probably be a midfielder ahead, Casemiro and Bruno Guimarães. Then Rafinha and Vinicius on the flanks. and I don't think that Igor Thiago will start for Brazil.

16:53I think that's going to be Mateus Cunha and maybe Hendrik because Hendrik has played a very good match against Egypt. He's a very good one. Angelotti likes him. But I think that's most likely that's going to be Mateus Cunha. It's interesting that you mentioned Paquetá. People who haven't followed his progress over the last six months think, what, he left a side that got relegated. How can he be starting for Brazil? Well, he's a very good player. He was playing now this season for Flamengo, a giant from Brazil. He was playing a very, he was having some good match in Brazil. Ancelotti was watching him very closely.

17:31I think that Ancelotti knows his quality. That's why he's going to, he's probably going to be the starter. Because Brazil, we all thought that Brazil would play in the 4-2-4 formation with only two midfielders, four forwards. But then Brazil lost. Rodrigo, Estevão, Luiz Henrique from Zenit was the option for Rodrigo and Estevão. But I think that he didn't take a good opportunity with the injuries of the other players. So I think that Paquetá will be the starter because Antelot understood over the last two matches that he needs one more midfielder. including because of that, he called Ederson. He didn't call a right back for Wesley, the replacement of Wesley.

18:20He called one more midfielder because now with Ederson, he has six options for the midfielder. He had only five, including Fabinho and Danilo Santos, midfielder from Botafogo. So I think that what he has done with the option over Wesley, it shows me that he's going to use a formation with one more midfielder. How many minutes his name are going to play in this tournament, Gustavo? Well, tomorrow he's going to have an MRI scan. To understand his progress over the last week, he's still injured. He won't play in the first match of Brazil. So right now, right now, I cannot say that he's going to be in the World Cup.

19:06I prefer to wait. Carlo Ancelotti said that he's going to be in the squad. But anyway, I think that the scan tomorrow is going to be very important to understand if he's really going to have the condition to play. And even if he gains the condition to play, at least fitness to play, he won't be at his best. He wasn't already at his best. And now he hasn't played over the last three weeks. So right now, I wouldn't tell you that Neymar will be in the World Cup. Let's look at Argentina and the possible starting XI there, Gustavo. Robbo picked up a point that many are making. A lot of these players, inevitably, I believe, that's what happens in life, are a lot older than when they won the World Cup.

19:48How much are we at a stage where they're too old? Well, I think that the main problem for Argentina, besides the age of some players like Rodrigo de Poe, including Messi also, Emiliano Martinez, I think that the main problem for Argentina is that, like I said, they didn't face any strong team over the last four years. They didn't play against any European side and when they played when they faced Brazil, it was a very poor Brazil So I think that we're gonna have to to see how these How the world champions are right now against some strong teams during the World Cup We thought Arsenal gonna be hard to watch.

20:27Yeah Argentina are gonna be that sort of psyche as well. Now you've seen Romero at the center-half and somebody else You're still going for Argentina. Hold on, think about it though. You're probably right. But guess what? They get it done. Right. They find a way of getting it done. And you look at that. And absolutely, correctly, you can turn around and see, well, he's getting on, he's getting on, he's getting on. I mean, he's getting on. Yes. But you know what? See that little thing in your brain called the brain? Which the Scottish players haven't. The Scottish players don't have. You talk about football brain.

20:59I mean, that team just smacks over. it. That's what I'm going with. I'm going with the experience and the being there and the done it. Yes, if it comes down to physicality and legs, then obviously that may be a problem for them. But if you use their brains, then it won't be a problem to them. And we can talk about the heat actually a little bit later on. How does that factor in to legs and energy and this team and experience? Well, it does. There's no question. Unless, Well, number one, they're obviously going to be looked after incredibly well in terms of, you know, finishing training with ice baths.

21:39I mean, the whole works. Right. Now, if they skip on anything, then we'll see it on the field. At the same time, the manager is going to have to use his brains and take people off when he sees any sort of drop. So, again, the question will not just be about the starting XI. The squad's going to come into it. And so that's the manager's job. The manager, in my opinion, is about picking the 11 and throwing them out. Because this team knows how to play football. It's going to be the small details. When to pull Messi off. When not to play him. And that goes for probably four or five of those players.

22:15That's the key for Argentina. When it comes to supporters' expectations, Gustavo, both Brazil and Argentina fans believe that their team are going to win the World Cup? Yes, definitely. That always happens with Brazil and Argentina. The Brazilian fans really believe in the national team. And the main reason is an Italian, Carlo Ancelotti. Carlo Ancelotti gave back to the people in Brazil the hope to win the World Cup. Because before him, you all remember what was happening to Brazil. We know that Gustavo, in England, there's a saying, it's the hope that kills you. Gustavo, much appreciated. Just a reminder, Argentina continued their preparations for the World Cup live tomorrow on ESPN Deportes and ESPN Unlimited as they take on Iceland.

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