The Night Before the World Cup

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1:19Welcome in to the latest edition of ESPN FC and like the World Cup, it is quantity over quality today. Mark Ogden is here, as is now even now, and Craig Burley. We are 20, we are all dark today. 24 hours to go until the World Cup kicks off. It is the biggest World Cup ever. 104 matches, 48 teams. Mark, where's the excitement? I feel like in other tournaments there's kind of been a buzz, kind of this gravitas of a moment on the precipice of history. Are we feeling that here? In a word, no. But I think that's because it's three nations. So we don't know where the epicentre is. It doesn't feel like it's in the US right now.

1:57The first games in Mexico, which I imagine will be crazy for it. But obviously there's been so much controversy in the build-up to it that it's left a sour taste. Obviously the Champions League final is 10 days ago. So there's a very small gap between the end of the European season and this. but you've got the ticket prices, you've got the visa situations, I mean, the referee situation, the Somali referee. There's so many issues. There's so many issues, and I think that's the South East and the real cloud hanging over the start of the football. But with 48 teams, it was supposed to be bigger and better than ever, wasn't it?

2:26Yeah, and it still could be. We're talking about before the tournament, and yes, there might not be as much excitement as maybe we would have hoped, but the fact is, once the football starts, some of the conversations do change. I think the point that Mark's made about some of the issues before the World Cup, they are very, very true, they're very, very prevalent, But the moment the ball is kicked, people start to watch again. I think there are other nations as well who are looking forward to seeing their teams perform at the World Cup. And I think the point you made about there not being a true epicenter, I think that does matter in some ways.

2:52But from when the games roll, people will be watching games. Craig, you've obviously lambasted the fact that it's now extended over 48 teams coming in. But we're going to see more football, just not necessarily good football. Not necessarily better football, just more. and not necessarily, and the interesting thing is going to be, one of the issues is going to be with the ticket and prices and the big stadiums that the teams are going to play in and a lot of teams that are, you know, not at the elite level is how full the stadium's going to be. Because, you know, aesthetically for TV, it's not a good look when we've got stadiums that are half full.

3:31Now, I don't know if that's the case or not. It might not be. It might be bustling. We just don't know. That's not going to be a good look for FIFA if that happens. Look, at this moment in time, and this could change, as Nedham said, when the football starts. At this moment in time, the rest of the world are viewing this in nothing other than a negative light. Immigration issues, ticket and prices, cost of travel, spread of the World Cup, too many games. All of these things, at this moment in time, this World Cup is going to have to be brilliant on the field. to win people over there is so much negativity unfortunately about coming to the u.s for a lot of people uh and i don't think a lot of it is i think a lot of it is untrue but there has been some some issues i mean i can't speak about the immigration issues because that's an immigration uh problem for them to to resolve but it's certainly there's a lot of people worried about coming here and that that's not that's not really a good place to be so hopefully when the football starts, the stadiums are full, the football's good and the fans are treated, which I'm sure they will, in a very good way by the American public.

4:41I don't have a problem with that. But if it goes the other way, this competition could turn sour very, very quickly. That negativity you mentioned is kind of epitomised by the front page of L 'Equipe today, the prominent French sports newspaper, leading with welcome to the USA. Very much ironically, Donald Trump front and centre with Infantino as a puppet, Omar Artan, the referee who was denied a visa to enter the country, meaning that he can't participate within this tournament. Is that a fair summation of the feeling of people looking in? Absolutely. But I was going to make the point, I mean, that is exactly what people are feeling.

5:21But I was in Russia, I was in Qatar prior to those tournaments and South Africa 2010. Are the stadiums going to be ready? What's going to happen to this? What's going to happen to that? You're going to be welcoming Qatar, the migrant workers and all these are valid issues but as soon as the football starts it was forgotten about you look back on those world cups now you think about Mbappe in 2022 you think of sorry the great France team in 2018 you think of Messi last time you think of Spain when they woke up in 2010 you don't think back to those world cups and think about the pre-tournament issues but I think in this case because the issues are so much I want them they're not more important because they were very important issues prior to those world cup but they're so prevalent and deep that people are so angry about I think they will still linger when the football starts because, like Craig says, the stadiums are not going to be empty, but they're going to be empty seats because fans who have spent their lives wanting to go to the World Cup can't afford to go.

6:08And we all know that World Cups are not a typical football crowd anyway. You need to have a bit of money to go to the World Cup, but it doesn't feel like a football crowd. And I think that is the issue, that football fans across the world feel like they've been cheated out of a World Cup. We heard Gianno Infantino talking today. Once again, seems to be completely tone deaf, unable to read the room when asked about the situation. with Omar Artan. He said, well, look, everyone just needs to chill. Yeah, I think it's fair to say that yes, he doesn't read the room that we expect him to be in, but he reads the room that he puts himself into.

6:38I think appeasing anybody that is in power that's helped the World Cup arrive at this place, just make sure, no, you're doing a great job. Everything's fantastic. And I think we've heard this for many years beforehand. I think for him, even for discussing the ticket prices and so on, he justifies it by saying we need to bring as much money in as possible to fund all these other federations. And I'm sure people from those federations even like Shaka Hislop you know our colleague he's very happy that Trinidad gets money from this World Cup but for the everyday person and people who are going to try and experience this possibly once in a lifetime thing then it's not there and it is hugely disappointing because he's sort of in some ways the issues that not obviously not everybody you might not necessarily be the majority but the issues that those people feel they should matter and I think Infantino at times just brushes it to the side the fact that referees not going to be there he was voted the best referee on the continent of Africa and he's not here.

7:26And we'll just move on. We'll forget about that. We can talk, say, for example, about Iran's situation here. They cannot stay in the USA. They have to come in just on the day and leave on the day. If we're talking about fairness from a football and competition standpoint, Iran don't have that. But for Infantino, we're just happy there. We promised they were going to play and here they are, they're going to play. It's not right for me. Well, on the referee one, we can't really, I mean, he said he's paper. I don't want to get into it because, again, it's a customs and borders immigration issue. But people were saying, well, why can't he go and referee in Canada or Mexico?

8:03But I think part of the problem, if I'm reading this right, is that the referees are all based in Florida. Miami. And their training base and their relaxation and all that sort of stuff has been done in Florida. And then they sort of disperse to the game. So that scuppers getting around that way. look Gianni Infantino cares about one thing money that's why the club World Cup was extended to a ridiculous amount of teams money why the World Cup is extended to 48 teams money he has no interest as long as it's not a disaster and by the way he might have noticed it's not going well as long as it doesn't become a disaster then he'll walk away and he'll bat away these questions as Augie always says, he just bats them away.

8:54But FIFA have got one goal. And it isn't really growing the game. It's making more money. And just making more money for themselves and their members. At the behest of officials, of players and player welfare. And he's at the top of this. And by the way, numerous countries apparently are very keen to vote him back in. As sharp as they can. I think this could really damage him because he's going to stand unopposed, I'm told, next time it's, I think it's 2027. Unopposed right now. Is he the best candidate they have for this role? No, but what he's been very clever at, which Sepp Blatter did as well, was to kind of make sure you get the votes of the African constituency, the Asian constituency.

9:34And is that because he is getting them more money? Well, he's invested in their football, which, you know, that is the job of FIFA. But the point I'm trying to make is that, you know, we saw the Senegalese players, how they were treated when they got off the plane at the airport. Moroccan fans have had visas not bad the Somali referee if you're representing an African nation or an Asian Uzbekistan and the same, if you're representing these nations this guy's turned his back on you when you need it the most, the FIFA president has done nothing to help you guys get to the World Cup like I said, the Somali referee of the best in Africa has just said, chill out everybody so when it comes to a vote, if somebody's brave enough or bold enough outside of his power base to say, I'm going to stand against him because he let us down, this could finish him off when politicians ignore their constituents no matter what it is or where it is they get punished and maybe Gianni Infantino has made the biggest mistake of his career because it will damage him but this could have been an even bigger scandal say for example and I don't know the mechanics of how this may or may not have worked but referees are they're one of a kind aren't they in terms of the personality you need to be able to do that job very difficult job being a referee and the assistant and the fourth professional and all that what if the other FIFA officials would have come out and said do you know what if his papers are not right then fine then fine but if his papers are correct and he is not allowed in and you're doing nothing about it we're on strike how's this World Cup got now that would have put people on a pedestal to say we have to do something about this but they haven't done anything so Gianni Infantino is able to come out with these smarmy, half-cocked comments about everybody just chill the guy's only just been sent home and not allowed in to a World Cup.

11:17Ridiculous. The competition, despite all of this, will, of course, kick off tomorrow. Mexico in action against South Africa. The defending champions will have to wait a few days, but they were playing yesterday. Argentina against Iceland. Lionel Messi on the bench. He'd come on and score in the second half. Nathan, where do we stand on the defending champions and their chances in this tournament? It seems like they're not heavily fancied, to be honest. And in some ways, I suppose you can see that. I think the nature of this tournament itself with the sort of the rise of say a lot of people are expecting France for example to get to those final stages and I think a few people now are seeing some of the more negative sides of this Argentina team you know they're an imperfect side but you can make the case that lots of teams are but they still have arguably the best play in the history of the game that's going to be existing on that pitch obviously someone else can make the case for say Ronaldo and so on but I think they've got a good chance but they don't feel as strong and almost like a team of destiny as they did in Qatar in 2014.

12:14Four years on for Messi, isn't it? Yes, and for a lot of these players as well. You know, you look at, for example, McAllister, who played last night. You know, he was flying at the time. He's not had a good season. There's, you know, Romero at Tottenham. The list sort of goes on. And Messi's four years on from actually still performing, obviously, at the last World Cup, which he did, but he had a very good support base around him. As you said, they're all a bit older, and the main man's a bit older. so I think it's very unlikely, but you wouldn't rule them out after what they did four years ago, but I just don't see them being as strong as they were, and again, four years on for Lionel Messi, it's difficult.

12:59Messi, I remember watching the Champions League with PSG two, three years ago, and he looked well past his best at that level. At the elite level, he didn't make an impact. Now he's come to MLS and he's had an impact, but how good is he really? How impactful can he be against a serious opponent? And how often is he playing against a serious opponent? How often do Argentina play against a serious opponent? So I think when it comes to the tougher games and the knockout stages, I think we'll find out then. I think something about this tournament itself, which reminds me in some ways of the Club World Cup last year, is that there were certain stadiums which weren't for, but others that were.

13:29And I think a stadium with Lionel Messi in it will always be fought. Oh, 100%. So the support that, say, he will have and Argentina will have in those arenas will make them tough to play against. I think even though it is a foreign tournament or an away tournament for them, they will have a sense of familiarity and popularity wherever they go. There will be many teams that will have greater support than he will. So in some ways, maybe that is the type of thing that will benefit them. But four years on, they've also lost the likes of an Angel Di Maria, somebody hugely influential for them across the last 10, 15 years.

13:56But I understand why people don't really have them down as being the favorites anymore, but that's more so to do with the quality that exists in the rest of the world. I think they're going to flop. Round of 16, out they go. Who losing to who? I can't remember. I did it in my bracket. I'll show Craig it later. I'll be fascinated, I'm sure. I will never talk about a bracket when it's on the screen. Look, the economy is a lot right now. And if you're a small business owner, you probably feel it. You can't control interest rates or tariffs, but you can control how efficiently your business operates.

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16:06Portugal in action on Wednesday. They beat Nigeria by two goals to one. Pedro Neto on the score sheet. Conceição as well in the second half. We'd see Portugal prepare for the World Cup with a win. It's the same conversation with Portugal and it's going to be until he retires Cristiano Ronaldo. A help or a hindrance, Nélinn? Yeah, I think that is true, but it's very tough to say something. Which one is it? Yeah, that's where you give me an answer and then all the Ronaldo fans... It wasn't like a middle-of-the-road question. If the backup striker was someone of a higher status than Gonzalo Ramos, then I think he would have been brought out of the team sooner.

16:41but I think there is such a significant difference between the two. I think Gonzalo Ramos on his best day, in my opinion, doesn't necessarily go ahead of Ronaldo on an average day. Even now? Even now, I would say. What about Rafael Leal, who's not really a striker? Is he not suspended? He's suspended, isn't he? Anyway. Yeah. Ramos will work more than Ronaldo and that's what the team is. The question is, to your question, right, a helper or a hindrance? Recent major tournaments, the last two or three, both Euros and World Cup, the answer is hindrance. Fernando Santos dropped him, eventually. He didn't score, I believe, in the last major turn-ups.

17:21He may have scored a penalty, but certainly not from open play. He struggled. This brilliant player, absolutely. As Neydom said, you can debate it. Messi or Ronaldo, all you want. There's no right, there's no wrong. Absolutely unbelievable individual of a player. Still doing it in his 40s. He's got a couple of hundred caps of what it is. It's amazing. but it still doesn't take away from the fact you could be a potential hindrance to your team at that age. And the question is, when they get to the knockout, and they will, particularly with this three teams, you know, a bunch of the three teams go through, I mean, you've got to be a right dauber to get knocked out in this World Cup.

17:59Eight out of 12 in advance. You've got to be really bad. That's another scenario, another debate. But when they get to the knockouts, and I'm not sure which way this crazily big bracket goes, but when they start meeting better teams, if he is struggling, there's got to be a lot of expectation on Roberto Martinez in terms of his job, in terms of what Portugal will do at this World Cup. He might have to make that big decision and the question is, does he have it in him to make that decision on his oldest player? If he's struggling, and listen, if he's not struggling, he's scoring goals, I'll applaud him because if he's doing it in his 40s at the World Cup, that's amazing but looking historically in the last five or six years the answer has been he has struggled in these competitions when you're talking about struggling these competitions you talking about missing chances or his general game involvement both because the missing chances thing that could just that could just change and I think for Gonzalo Ramos there's no guarantee that he would have scored all those goals either I think if we're talking about him being a direct replacement as such so see why you would persist with a play like that because for example let's say is he undroppable?

19:07The answer is both. Let me just before, when Nadim thinks about this, the answer where Ronaldo is, and here's part of the problem, he goes into the qualifiers and the Nations League and they play weaker teams a lot of times and they beat some of these teams by four, five, six, sometimes seven goals and he's bagging goals. And he's undroppable. And then it gets to the latter stages of a major tournament and you're playing much better sides. That's when I think the light has been sort of shone on him. In recent years anyway, not in previous years, he's been brilliant. But in recent years, his age has caught up with him.

19:43And it now means we have to really talk about this because are Portugal, if he's struggling, going to be better without him? Or is Roberto Martinez going to sit in his hands and say, well, if I take him off, the whole of Portugal are going to come for me? I think he, at this stage, I actually believe he's undroppable. if Portugal made it to a semi-final a man in his 40s undroppable at a World Cup Messi's nearly 40 would he drop him? he won the last World Cup is he not a better impact? he's four years on as you said a quarter-final semi-final put him on for the last half an hour last 20 minutes when the opponents are tiring when his lack of physicality now would work better take Ramos off because Ramos will work the defenders more than Ronaldo would and then bring him on for the last 20 minutes but that's going to batter his ego isn't it and that's where you're looking at your manager absolutely but his ego might get more embellished or massaged if he scores the winning goal on the 80th minute then he's a hero are you concerned more about his like general fitness and tiredness or what you're thinking he doesn't contribute you know the first line of defensive attack you know pressing from the front he doesn't do any of that neither does Harry Kane yeah but I mean we're talking different no put Watkins on instead get him to work and just go and press people yeah then you're also talking about late stages of competition Harry Kane hasn't necessarily done that no but Harry Kane's dropping it Harry Kane's dropping it you're talking about one of the best strikers in the world at the moment but Ronaldo isn't that player anymore and Kane's still doing it for Bayern Munich Kane's dropping it In midfield, pinging balls around and scoring 50 goals a year.

21:07And I don't feel like we're... We're not bashing Ronaldo for Ronaldo. We're having a discussion because of his age and because of his impact and the last Euros, the last World Cup and before that. He's playing in Saudi and he has been the talking point in previous major tournaments. What are we going to do with him? Should he start? Can I take him off? because he hasn't contributed like he once was able to do. And that's a fact. OK. Portugal overall, they're a real contender, aren't they? Absolutely. I mean, are they an outsider? I think they're more than an outsider. I think they're a real challenger.

21:45I think they've got a real chance. Are they Belgium, though, from a few years ago that everybody thought, well, they're going to win at this? The same coach. Yeah, maybe. You know, I think they've got a real chance. I think they could be the team that comes from nowhere. It's hard to pick a team that wins the World Cup that hasn't won it before, if you know what I mean. It's always the heavyweights. But what, they're four favourites. Yeah, exactly. Because they've got a real supporting cast behind Ronaldo now who are definitely worth backing. Like I said, Bruno Fernandes has the best season of his career.

22:12Even people like João Felix have still got something in them. Then you've got Jean Neves, fantastic playing midfield. I think they've got Pitinha. He's got a real chance. Yeah? Yeah. Especially Ronaldo up front. How far? I'll go semi-finals. Semi-finals? Yes. Okay. Well, it's the road see yeah sure the road if you did my bracket you would have seen well I didn't see your bracket when did you do your bracket Sports Centre Billy Big Time again but they're definitely you know yeah I mean is it fair to say anything but a semi-final is a failure depends on the bracket right good thank you very much it does really doesn't it yes yeah it's a bit like Arsenal's trip to the Champions League easy path soft path yeah Arsenal favourite final I like things my way My coffee, my schedule, and my treatment.

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24:09Meanwhile, England are taking on Costa Rica as we speak in Orlando. The game was delayed by an hour because of a thunderstorm. This is an England side who come into this in their best run of major tournaments of the modern era. Of course, you see runner-up in the Euros, lost to France in the quarter-finals, runner-up in the Euros as well, where they lost against Italy in the penalty shootout. What's the expectation? You've just flown in from England, Mark. What's everybody saying? The expectation is not as high and as over-optimistic as usual. I think that's because there's a sense that this England team is going to struggle in the heat.

24:40I think people realise that this tournament is not built for England, but they've got a great set of players. You dare get it! Spare me already! Anybody got a violin in here? I know it's going to happen. The first time they're playing, it's a decent team who can pass the ball. They'll lose. Right. It's as simple as that. That's always happened. So Croatia? Well, possibly in the first game. Yeah. But it's not going to be hot in Dallas. It's a covered stadium. So they might get away with it. So we're saying a European team is not going to win over here because of the heat. Well, Spain keep the ball.

25:07Yeah, but Spain keep the ball. They pass the ball. What's Thomas Tuchel been brought in for? The Messiah. I know, but the thing what he's done is... I don't know why you keep calling him the Messiah. No one's called Thomas Tuchel the Messiah. He's filled the squad. He's filled the squad with athletes in a tournament where you need to pass the ball. He's left his technical players like Fordham and Palmer out of the team. So I don't understand why he's got so many runners. The FA have gone for another foreign coach of great experience because they think they have the guy that's going to get to the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

25:39Have they got the guy then? I don't like his squad. His squad was strange. I mean, you know, talk about heat. what if he has to go unlikely what if he has to call on Jordan Henderson absolutely Dan Byrne well he struggles in the heat but he's good around the dressing room he might have to play but come on the heat the heat can't be an excuse well it is the way that England play it's too much high energy high tempo they don't pass the ball England never passed the ball when they against good teams I mean I can't remember the last time they did I mean you guys might be able to help me out here but they play they play against inferior teams they win that's what England always do but I can't remember a major tournament where they've actually beaten a France and Italy, a Germany, a Spain, a Brazil, Argentina in the knockout stage.

26:22I mean, I really can't. You're probably going back to 1966 when they last won it. They don't beat heavyweight nations because when it comes to the crunch, they can't keep the ball. They can't show the patience that is required to break an opponent down. It happens every time. They're third favourites. Yeah, what you were saying there, I feel like it's wrong. I feel like it's wrong. And obviously someone will fact-check. I'm sure they beat Germany at some stage. Yeah, they beat Germany in the year 21. when he won. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that was a thing. I'm talking World Cup. Oh, shit. World Cup's on the Euros.

26:53No one in the gam I'll call you superior. We just talk about World Cups, don't we, Augie? We don't bother about Euros and stuff like that. Would this be a success or a failure? So, the squad itself, I think there are probably like four or five players that will get no football whatsoever. So, John Stolans and Konza are centre-halves? Is that what you're thinking? Yeah, that's what played against Costa Rica today. Mark Gray he'll play. Who will play? Mark Gray. Yeah, Gay here, yeah. Gay with Stones. Gay in Stones, I think. And listen, I have been a... I think John Stones is a terrific footballer.