She Spent $20k to Start An Underwear Brand. Now She's Sold $8 Million: Sandy Ronalds, Nat'V Basics

0:00Hey, business besties. Welcome back to the Female Founder World Podcast. I'm Jasmine. I'm the host of the show and the creator of the VMA Founder World universe. Today, I am in Sydney, Australia, and I'm talking to Sandy Ronald, the founder of NatV Basics. She started this business just a few years ago, and she has sold more than$8 million worth of product. She sold over 1.1 million pairs of underwear, which is pretty impressive stuff. And we're going to go through her story and how she's been doing that. You are now entering Female Founder World with your host, Jasmine Grinsworthy. Sandy welcome to Female Founder World.

0:34Thank you for having me. For people who don't know NatV Basics what are you guys creating over there? Currently or from the you know launch and start we really just wanted to create sustainable basics that were for the everyday lady that were comfortable better for people and the planet and we've sort of evolved from there. I love hearing people who are coming into categories that you would think are like pretty crowded same as beauty all these people launching beauty brands in the last three years and they're doing so well. Again, you launched into a category that you're not the first person doing this, but it's really worked.

1:08What do you think it is that people like buying into about the story or about the product? Yeah, I think we've got a really strong why and purpose behind the brand. When I first launched the product or even had the idea, I didn't really just want to launch another underwear brand because as you have just mentioned, there are just so many underwear brands on the market. They've all been very old legacy brands, very well established. but I feel they sort of get stuck in their old sort of ways of doing things and really had the market and didn't really need to diversify in any way or change what they were doing so it was quite easy for us to not easy very hard work but it was easy for us to find a niche within the market to come in and be a bit of a disruptor from the start.

1:51What were you doing when you came up with this idea and what was that process of like bringing it to market? Did you launch in 2019? Is that right? 2020 yeah I launched on 20 in 2019 on my daughter's birthday which is Halloween okay I sort of just wanted to relate it back to her just because I feel like I also created the brand to make her future better and all of our children's futures better in some sort of way hopefully love this um so yeah that's when we we launched okay amazing what was the process between coming up with the idea and getting this thing out into the world or the process it was a long process it wasn't an easy just you know click the fingers and it took a couple of years right it did so the first initial idea was back in 2017 and it just sort of popped into my head because I was scrolling myself and trying to find something that was that I was looking for and I just couldn't really find that so from there it sort of popped into my head I sat on it for about a year about a year because you always have that inner demon that sits on that shoulder and says no you can't do this totally and as you said there's so many brands on the market and sort of that does make you feel worried and puts doubt but then I sort of thought you know what I'd better I'd be proud of myself just to have a go and do it and fail rather than do nothing at all so from there I started planning about a year and a half out before launch a lot of research and development that went into the product but then once I was happy with the product then I really focused on all the marketing and pre-marketing hype and getting everything up and running before launch.

3:19Okay we're definitely going to talk about the launch marketing in a second but what you said about that like devil on the shoulder also often that's actually just a real person with a voice in the world that can be telling you that. I remember when I was probably 19 I was really young and I wanted to start an activewear brand and I remember telling a friend and she was like oh it would have to be really good for me not to buy I think it was like Lorna Jane that we're all buying in Australia at the time she'd have to be really good for me not to buy Lorna Jane and I was like yeah that's true there's already like someone there yeah and that was 10 years ago you are so right so even people within my family who are my biggest supporters no matter what they also said that they said underwear you can just go to Target or yes bras and things and you know I can rattle off a whole bunch of you know brands that are available in Australia and obviously that didn't help but I was very lucky to have a very supportive dad and my husband they'll just like just do it yeah you'll be great and like you know make sure you plan like obviously don't just go into it blindly have a plan have a strategy of how you're going to do it but don't not do it because of those reasons yeah yeah yeah you it's always good to have it just at least one of those people who can be in your corner and tell you that it's possible because it's totally possible I've spoken to hundreds of people from all different backgrounds who have done it so whoever's listening you can do it too absolutely I want to understand what your launch marketing plan was you had a pretty strong launch What were you doing to kind of get that momentum and get that buzz right at the beginning?

4:45Well, obviously, quite a while before we even launched, I had done a little bit of a business plan and then that leaks over into a marketing plan and strategy around that. So I really had a strong purpose and why of why we were doing that. I love a planner. Lots of people just go into this without a plan, myself included, but we love to hear that some people have strategy. well and sometimes like strategy can come naturally and it I think people get a little bit overwhelmed when you say plan like I'm not writing a 20 page document with a lot of words it really is just boom boom boom what are the points what are the benefits I don't need to write an essay like I'm delivering it to some professor at uni it's like really what are the key points for me and my little business right now so I was really strong on really making sure So our purpose and our why, once again, was strong and made sense for what we were doing.

5:37And from there, I created a promo plan and advertising around that. So about two months out, we had the website up and running. We were obviously collecting as many emails as we possibly could for launch and obviously doing a little deal around that because I think growing your database as quickly as you can is a huge asset. It's pretty much one of the best things to own in a company. Yeah. essentially and so by the time we hit launch we already had thousands of people on our actual database and we were very lucky to also have an influencer strategy a little one not a big one in place where I think the day after we launched we had a well-known influencer from Byron Bay which sort of fit our market right then and there because you know we're a little bit more sustainable we're much more sustainable than the average product and that demographic and people that were following that influence at that time sort of really matched well and sort of got it out from there and so the influencer piece actually is like working quite well for you because I do hear a lot of people's like quite hit and miss depending on who you work with yeah it can be and I think um we still have hit and misses as well you've really got to find the right influences that align with your brand and really track um whatever it is that you want out of the relationship um I have sort of mentioned you know to friends and other people that are in business that I love working with micro influencers I think they're great they're up and coming but we will happily work with them and it's more to generate content because they can be great content generators but if we are working with the more expensive influencers we definitely want to see a return on investment brand awareness and conversions so how do you like manage those influencer campaigns like is it is it a matter of someone on the team is sending a dm to somebody and then you have like an excel spreadsheet where you track it like i'm just really curious about like the specifics of how someone does that so um what we all usually we have a lot of people reach out to us which is fantastic it means that they've found us and they find that we align with what they're doing which we love but if we're also looking in the market and we're on Instagram ourselves we will actively first of all we don't really like it does matter about the following but it really doesn't it's more about the engagement and how much influence that influencer actually has on their audience because you might find someone that has 500 ,000 followers they will be more expensive but when you actually use them they'll convert far less because their audience just isn't engaged so So when looking at those influences, don't worry about the followers.

8:13Really drill down, look at a post, look at the likes, and then also check the comments. Make sure there's not a lot of spammy ones because they could have bought the followers and the comments, which you can do and you can easily tell. And then also just be wary. So if you've got a young lady that is gorgeous but, you know, you might have more of a male following. So if we get her to post and she's got a predominantly male audience, yeah it's just not going to work it's not going to convert yeah interesting yeah that is such a um for especially for you in the category that you're in i'm sure that's something that you actually really have to think about a lot we do yeah and going back to how you asked how we track it at the moment we're so simple we just have it in an excel spreadsheet we have each month we will have our budget that comes across from our cash flow projections we'll pop that in we'll then start putting in our influencers they're usually pre-planned out you know at least a quarter in an event okay and so we'll have the name of the influence and handle we'll put how much they're actually what their fees yeah and then after the campaign we'll go in and we'll drill down on the analytics and we'll see what the return on investment is and put them there and work on work out what that is and you give them like a discount code or something so that you can track who's shopping through them absolutely yeah yeah it's the quickest and easiest way to you know track what they're doing and you sort of really want to know what they're bringing in you can also these days really request their sticker taps and their analytics give me a screenshot yeah um we spoke live a couple of nights ago um you know i'm coming towards the end of our australia tour at the moment where we're celebrating australian businesses and you were an amazing guest thank you speaking to the um the business besties in brizzy and one of the questions that we had from the audience was around when you knew to make that move from, you know, you're building the business like in your parents' spare room and then going into your own kind of facility and what that process was like.

10:10I'd love to know what triggered that and how people can know when they're ready to make that very scary decision. It is a pretty scary decision. There was no real analytical sort of equation that I can share right now on that manner. It was simply, I could not stay in my mum and dad's two bedrooms anymore. We were getting too big and we really just had to, like they had to kick us out because there was no space. You were evicted. Yeah. Yeah. Mom and dad had to kick me out because I was taking over their whole entire house and it was like a three-story home. So it was a lot. So that was like the main move but at the moment our factory that we currently operate out of is actually too small and has been for a few years and I do have like the next goal where we have to be doing at least over probably like 5.5 mil revenue in one year yeah to make that switch that's sort of like the trigger down yeah so okay yeah good to know something else that I'm really curious about with you um you are not like taking a big salary from the business you're not driving towards profitability your goal is growth but you're still bootstrapped right you own 100 of the company I do so I own 100 and we have no external investors all of the investment from the company has been from myself okay learnings why are you doing this like what's the benefit I'm sure it's also very challenging um to be honest this is an area that I don't have very much expert like I don't have any expertise in it I've never dealt with investors or venture capitalists in my life and that's probably why we have never gone down that road yet.

11:47I don't even know what to say to them or even how to get in contact. And from what I hear, it can be a tough market for us women in the venture capital space. So it's something that I just thought, you know what, I'm just going to do all the hard work and do it myself. And I've got a bit of a five-year strategy to get everything, all my ducks in line for any opportunity that comes around in about five years, whether it be a great investor to come on and help me take it from, you know, the five mil mark a year right up to maybe 20 mil a year would be amazing goals. Or for someone to come in and buy it if it aligns with what they want to do.

12:25How about building a team who's working on this with you now? So currently I do have a team of about six people. They really aren't working on this high-level sort of strategy though because it is. So I do have external sources to help. I'm currently trying to find and source an accountant that will check my company structure because obviously that's really, really important when you go to sell and it will play a lot into how much tax you do or do not pay. So that's obviously first and foremost. I'm creating an IP register at the moment. So what people wouldn't realise, which I didn't even until recently, is yes, I did have my trademark for NatV and I do own it in Australia, New Zealand and America.

13:10but if you get a logo done and it's done by a graphic designer outside of your company they own that right until they sign it over to you so you have to make sure that you so what I've done is create an excel spreadsheet and I'm starting to get together all the things that when I go to sell what makes a company actually worth something and so that does include logos, URLs, Instagram handles, your database obviously all your trademarks all the design specs, patterns, you know, the list goes on and on and on. So IP just isn't that trademark. It's like pretty much everything that you were going to sell at some point that you actually own.

13:49And you have to make sure that you actually do own it when it comes time to sell. That's so interesting and so important to mention because it's not just about how much money you make. No, no. I mean, obviously that plays a key role, but you actually have to own your brand in every way, including creating logos and all the graphics and yeah. Is there anything else on that list? I feel like we should actually have this list published somewhere for people and like speak to it. It's actually a huge area in itself. I'm part of a board group and we had a special speaker come in just last Friday and he did an hour talk on it.

14:23And it is just insane how much there is to do and to build and to make sure that you've got everything lined up perfectly. And again, I'm no expert, so I'm learning as I go. But these are the two things that I'm starting with because I feel like they're the most important. But yeah, it's actually someone that you can hire to help with this sort of thing if you get to that sort of stage. What about retail and wholesale? Is that a big piece of the business or are you guys focused on e-com? Retail. We have never looked at bricks and mortar as of yet. And our range is just simply too small. Like to hire a whole shop, like you'd be half empty.

14:59So it just wouldn't make sense. Wholesale, we have stocked on the Iconic before, but that just wasn't working for us at that time. Which is a big online – it's like the biggest online fashion retailer in Australia, I would say. It is, absolutely. And it is a great platform, but it just wasn't working for us at that time. I would love to more so get like a distributor maybe overseas because one of the biggest problems living in Australia, as everyone's aware, we're an island in the middle of nowhere essentially. Australia is far it is far I just did the flight I can tell you it's far to ship anything it's just more expensive the customer has to wait longer times especially when we ship to the US and when we do quite a bit because we do have some influences like Chloe Fisher who you know obviously has a bit of a following over there and a few others so we do ship over there but you know it just isn't as good as what it could be so I'm not sure if it's the right way to go but on one of my opportunities in my SWOT analysis is definitely like outside like international distributors that can take care of the brand in that area how do you think about like up leveling and growing yourself as the person who's driving this business forward like what are some things that have been helping you or just how have you done that over the last few years as the business has grown like quite quickly um as in professional development yeah like professional development as you know you're showing up like leading a team now and this you're I think as the business grows like this what's required of you grow grows as well it does um it can be tough and you know I'm not going to sit around and pretend like everything is like it might look very polished from the outside but I feel like I'm in the trenches of war every day so it might look beautiful but you know if you come into the office every day, it's just hard, hard work.

16:47So yeah, I, my team are amazing. Obviously they're a small team, so they're great at what they do. We're very nimble and can change, you know, whatever we have to do at any time. We don't have like a big level of, you know, red tape going on and levels of management. But I also, you know, use a lot of the tools that we have. So if you use Shopify, there's lots of learnings on there. All the apps that plug into those these days. They've got all their own learnings that you can go and read up on, part of groups like yourself and a few others. And also I'm part of a professional board now where we meet once a month.

17:24And that's probably been the biggest help at the moment of where I'm at. It's not something that I could have afforded when I first started, but I'm sort of getting to that stage now where you sort of need high level thinkers giving you what they think. And you can take and leave what you want, but it's always good to open your mind to every idea because no idea is a stupid idea and you you take what you want and leave what you don't think will work how does that work when you join something like that so is it is it you like pay to join and yes so there's a huge one in the world I think it's called YPO so my chairman Philip de Bella he is actually part of that but he chairs ours and he was like the coffee king of Brisbane.

18:06So he's very high level thinker, good at strategy and he runs our board. So it's good having him on the team, but then we have a whole bunch of different business owners that are on the actual board and we all share ideas where we're at. We tell, you know, we're not shamed at all. So we say how it is, no sugar coating anything. And it's great because you get real time feedback, real life feedback. You're not reading a textbook. Do you You know what I mean? So it's good to have that. And then you are kept accountable because you're meeting every month. So they know what you said last time. And then, which is great.

18:41That's a big part of it. Yeah. Because we love to procrastinate, right? If something gets too difficult, it's like, I'll do that later. But then, you know, you'll get six months down the line and you still haven't done that thing. That's super important because you're just like too hard basket, too hard basket. Yeah. Relatable. I get it. Yeah. The last thing I want to ask you is for a resource recommendation. something that you think other people who want to build something like what you're building do what you're doing that can go and check out right now oh this one is a hard one I do struggle with this because I use so many different resources so it's really hard for me just to give one sort of thing give us a few feel free to shop like Shopify apps um habits that you have anything that's really been helping you okay um Shopify apps triple l I think I mentioned the other night when we met and we spoke is great for analytical data and breaking it up so you can actually see where the sale's coming from on your, you know, e-com site.

19:42As mentioned that night, Google always take, say that they got it and then Facebook will say they got the same sale and then Instagram. Everyone claims it. Everyone claims it. It's really hard to tell. Yeah. So that also makes it hard to sort of budget your money and know where to spend it. So that one's a good one to have um it is a little bit expensive um but you know can you put a price on real life dot like you know yeah it's important um we use Yoppo at the moment and have just transferred over to them for everything what I love about them is they're an up-and-coming and they're huge now like they're not even up and coming they're everywhere but they've just put on emails so I've moved from Clavio over to them they're much cheaper yeah much cheaper and you get a full-time like account manager so I can if I've got a problem with one of the things so they at the moment I'm using SMS I use the EDM platform we've got subscriptions with them they do user generated client content and they also do reviews yes because they used to just be reviews so now they do it all and it's much cheaper and it's also if you've got any issues you can literally talk to someone in real time so I think the guy that I call Thomas he lives in Sydney I'll just pick him up on the phone and be, hey, I've got this problem and they'll fix it.

20:56I find sometimes when you're dealing a lot with the apps, really hard to get support sometimes. You can speak to the chat, but then it'll take 24 hours to get back. And sometimes you need it fixed now. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like this is impacting sales today. Can someone please get onto this? My customers are unhappy now and so am I. I need it fixed like now. Yes, 100%. So that one's a good one. When I travel, I love the app TripIt. I like to do a lot of travel in my spare time. you just literally email your plans um to it and it puts it in an app in order so you just email the itinerary from say your flights you'll stick it in the app and it will tell you in order what you're meant to do on your trip oh amazing you don't have to pay for it yeah it's even got the flight numbers what time like the everything okay i need that like for my travel home yeah so i love that.

21:48But yeah, I don't, there's so many. Okay. Amazing. Thank you so much, Sandy. It's been awesome to hear about what you guys are building in that V Basics and so impressed. So, so impressed. Thank you. Thanks for having me. Of course. Thank you. Quick shout out to all of our business bestie subscribers. If you are loving the show and you are building a consumer CPG or e-commerce business, or you're about to build one, This membership will give you access to the people, experiences, and the tools that you really need to build your dream business. Head to femalefounderworld.com forward slash subscriber for more.