The End of Oak Street, plus Tony and Late Fame | #1077

18:15Josh Larsen:Okay. What's the thematic, emotional, psychological reason for using this. And I came up with some, some answers, you know, this, each of them has their own response and perspective on the experience. It's commonly used to amp up the tension because it is disorienting to ask you to focus on two things at once. Yeah. That all makes sense to me. I don't know why he didn't include overlapping dialogue then, which would enhance that. It's very much where we get a shot and one character says one clear point of view and then in the background another character offers something else i don't know to be honest with you even though i can see some of that rationale and maybe you have some some stronger ones uh it did take me out of the movie in a way that some of the more ostentatious techniques of a film like it follows did not and worked in concert with a theme i have i have a

19:12Adam Kempenaar:super, super profound rationale. Are you ready? Okay. It's really cool. I thought it was really cool in terms of my, my response to the movie and, and getting back to the question I posed to you. I can agree with you overall on your read, certainly of Spielberg, and even my feelings about Spielberg, but disagree with you on this movie. And it's, it's really great to put it in those terms. I didn't think about where I would put this movie in my Spielberg ranking, what would keep this from being top-tier Spielberg is that I don't think there is, no. Nor do I think Mitchell is seeking wonder. Maybe, yeah, it is unfair.

19:56Adam Kempenaar:Because it would be one thing, Josh, if there were moments I recall from this film where I thought Mitchell was seeking the transcendent and was coming up short. And I don't recall that ever. So that is the way I think he is specifically, despite all the similarities, all the parallels that we've already drawn, that is the way specifically I think he is diverging from Spielberg. So I don't think this movie is top tier Spielberg, and I don't think it's even as good a film as Super 8. I'm with you on that. But I will get blasphemous, I suppose, and say that somehow the best Spielberg movie of 2026 isn't directed by Steven Spielberg.

20:31Adam Kempenaar:That is how much fun I had with this movie. I, of course, was not as high on Disclosure Day as you. One of the things we can discuss, in spoiler talk anyway, we can get deeper into it, is whether this film is truly just pure summer entertainment with satisfying resolutions and no larger questions to ponder, and whether then my use of the word just is pejorative. Maybe you're a David Robert Mitchell stan and you love It Follows and you love Under the Silver Lake and you love how those movies are full of ambiguities and mysteries. The latter, I haven't seen it from what I understand, almost requiring you to decode it.

21:13Adam Kempenaar:And here, The End of Oak Street is ostensibly a textbook crowd pleaser. Maybe that bugs you. It is a crowd pleaser. I enjoyed it for all of the reasons I do love many of Spielberg's crowd pleasers. The combination of drama, of thrills, of heart, and of craft. I think the degree of difficulty here is quite high because you could fill your movie with a bunch of homages and it would feel very trite. To try to pull out the same combination of drama and thrills, heart and craft that no one other than maybe Spielberg has done before, at least so consistently. And to come up short, you'd have something that was not only trite, but very possibly quite dull.

22:01Adam Kempenaar:And this is probably not a stretch to say this, but I imagine this movie playing like gangbusters for plenty of audience members who have no relationship to Spielberg's work whatsoever. And I think where we probably disagree the most, because this speaks to my having a deeper investment in the heart and in the drama of the film than you, is I think Mitchell does it largely just based on fundamental storytelling. That it comes back to character. It comes back to dramatic irony. I don't think the family dynamic is as thin as you think it is. I think that there's enough weight here because I like the touch that everybody in this family has a secret.

22:42Adam Kempenaar:And these aren't, you know, suburbia, blue velvet ants crawling on a bloody cutoff ear in the green grass while, you know, below a white picket fence type secrets. There's nothing dark or sinister about them, but they're real. and they do subtly tear away at an individual's and a family's psyche the way the dad, Greg, is hiding that he lost his job and he's taking these pizza delivery shifts. Why is he doing it? Because he doesn't want the family to worry. But what's that doing? All that's doing is just leading to more anxiety in the family. He's got a little something stashed in the garage. He also knows what Denise is up to in the basement, but he's not letting on about that, right?

23:22Adam Kempenaar:She's hiding that she's writing this book in the basement. that she may also want to leave Greg and her kids. She may also want to leave them to be a writer, but you can go with the kids too, right? Like Brian is at that age where he's, he's testing the boundaries a little bit. He's smoking cigarettes. He's lying about that. He's in some trouble in the neighborhood that he's not facing. Audrey, I want to mention this scene. I mentioned Maisie Stella and she, I didn't immediately recognize her. I just immediately recognize, I feel like I've sort of seen her before and she's really good. We learn what she's hiding about her identity in a scene that as often is the case with these great music moments, it's a candidate for me, Josh, for music moment of the year and moving moment of the year.

24:05Adam Kempenaar:The scene where she goes to the garage and she puts in a cassette. And that's pretty much all I'll say, except to further explain that it's just such great economical storytelling. It's set up by one earlier quick scene, but that that's just laying the foundation for it. The reason why that's so great is because it functions. It's function for the audience is is to reveal something about the character we didn't know before. But Mitchell here is a smart enough writer and director that that's the subtext. But the text is within the context of the movie. Why is that scene occurring? And it it feels not just logical, but appropriate.

24:45Adam Kempenaar:It feels necessary that someone in Audrey's circumstances with all of this insanity swirling around her in a quiet moment would seek normalcy. Putting that cassette tape in the car, in the garage, sneaking away like that, that song playing transports her back to 1982. For those three to four minutes of Steve Wynwood magic, things are okay with the world. But it's also a tinge for this overwhelming sadness because you have to consider what she's thinking about, what we know she's thinking about, that's not spelled out, but we get it. And also that she has to be considering that she may never be leaving this place and what is she never going to get to experience.

25:27Adam Kempenaar:All of that's going on with nothing being said at all, just what she's doing in that scene and what the music's doing. And then finally, I'll say that none of them, none of them in the family are talking about what they all know to be true, which is that this family does seem to be falling apart. So for me, those those secrets, they provide something substantive for us to latch on to. And that that gave me investment enough in what's in what's going to happen to this family in that dynamic.

25:55Josh Larsen:Amazon Health AI presents Painful Thoughts. Why did I search the Internet for answers to my cold sore problem?

26:03Adam Kempenaar:Now I'm stuck down a rabbit hole filled with images of alarmingly graphic sores in various stages of ooze. I can clear my search history, but I can never unsee that. Don't go down the rabbit hole. Amazon Health AI gets you the right care fast. Healthcare just got less painful.

26:24Josh Larsen:How's the new place? Get your Wi-Fi figured out? I got T-Mobile 5G home internet and I'm loving it. It's the fastest 5G home internet. My old provider was so slow. Mine is slow. And only$35 a month. Do I need to try this? Try it for 15 days. Love it or get your money back. I love it already. There are over 250 reasons to join T-Mobile. Find yours and check availability at t-mobile.com slash home internet. This is according to Ooglu Speed Test Intelligence. Date a second half of 2025. All rights reserved. Redeemed money back guarantee within 30 days of cancellation. Next, that's K-N-I-X leak-proof underwear is made for real life.

26:59Josh Larsen:Because when your day is already full, your underwear shouldn't be something you have to think about. NYX gives you reliable leak-proof protection that fits seamlessly into your routine. For periods, for light bladder leaks, for workouts, for everyday freshness. NYX leak-proof underwear comes in a range of absorbencies, from light to ultra. So if you need a little backup or all-day protection, there's a pair for you. Unlike bulky protection, NYX feels barely there with soft fabrics, moisture-wicking layers, and anti-odor technology that keeps you feeling fresh and confident. Wear them to work, running errands, traveling, even overnight.

27:36Josh Larsen:Plus, they're machine washable, so you can wear them again and again. Find your perfect level of protection at knix.com and get 15 % off with code FLOW15. That's knix.com, code FLOW15. That's knix.com. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinheiro and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word Solita, trading the pity for possibility.

28:20Josh Larsen:Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people and they were like, you smiled at us. Not a lot of people smile around here. It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip. I hope you listen to Solita on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

28:55Josh Larsen:Did anybody else see that weird light last night?

28:58Adam Kempenaar:A weird light.

29:00Josh Larsen:The wind was blowing all crazy. Starbuck was freaked out and barking. Could have been lights from a helicopter. Or a UFO. Aliens. Shut up, Dad. I think it's the case for me with this movie is where I can intellectually understand all the choices that are made. And yet they none of them are resonating with me in. It's almost like I can see the structure rather than feel the structure. Now, the case of the scene with Audrey in the car is different. It stands out. It's a it's a great sequence for all the reasons you described. and almost makes me wish that this entire movie had been about her point of view and her story.

29:41Josh Larsen:She seems to be given the most interesting experience that is unique in its own way, even as it is embedded in the universal experiences of someone that age. The other family members' issues just felt so perfunctory in how they were presented. Audrey's scene is presented beautifully, as you described, you know, without any sort of dialogue or a back and forth between husband and wife. We've seen a variation on a million times. I wonder how much this is a matter of performance. These are two lead actors, Adam, that, you know, we both like quite a bit. We've praised Anne Hathaway, you know, for some of her other work this year.

30:24Josh Larsen:Ewan McGregor. We've gone back to with since Trainspotting. And in our recent revisit or a discussion of Trainspotting, talked about how good he was there as a breakout star. I don't know if it's the writing. I don't know if it's the suburban 80s dad that's just not a good fit for this Scott. I don't know what it is, but there is—I couldn't figure out why he was in this movie. and Anne Hathaway, somewhat similar, though she gets to bite into a little more stuff as the movie proceeds. She has a bit more interesting of a backstory, the fact that she's writing this novel in secret. There's more to dig into there.

31:05Josh Larsen:I don't know that the movie actually does beyond wanting to give her a secret, as you said. And maybe for some viewers, that's enough. I do wish it had been explored a little bit more. But this relates to something I wanted to ask you, the performances. And I do want to hear what you think of those performances, but it does make me wonder. It connects with the question you asked, which is really good, is what was he looking for as writer-director with this movie? If he's not seeking that transcendence, that Spielbergian transcendence, which I think is fair and he doesn't have to, what was he seeking?

31:39Josh Larsen:I wonder if this was really, if you asked him at heart or asked anyone involved in it, is this supposed to be a dark comedy, like a really dark action comedy? Because for me, when the end of Oak Street operated at that level, it was really clicking. And that doesn't necessarily need a rich family dynamic. That needs more types that we can place as the gears start churning in a more humorous vein. that needs leads who are more comfortable in that vein. And so even someone, I don't want to get into recasting, so I'm just going to throw out one thing, but because this was David Robert Mitchell, it made me think of Under the Silver Lake.

32:24Josh Larsen:And even someone like Andrew Garfield, who I don't think we think of first as a comic actor, he's incredibly funny in Under the Silver Lake in a fresh way. I hadn't seen him before. and even him in the role of the father here might have brought a little goofiness, a little unexpected, even zaniness that I do think the movie is going for. I mean, there's a great shot, speaking of the camera work here, there's a great shot early on after the chaos has broken out and Greg and Denise are running through the neighborhood trying to find their kids, but we see them in the foreground is another family who's come out of their house.

32:59Josh Larsen:They don't know this is going on yet. They're getting into the car. And the camera just slowly pans to reveal across the street behind them, Greg and Denise sprinting across all the neighbors' yards, fleeing these dinosaurs. That's funny. There is the moment of the two dinosaurs mating in the background. That's darkly funny. Well, I thought that was just light, actually. I mean, it's kind of light and it's lightening the scenario, I guess is what I would say. A dark scenario is bringing a light touch to it. And then when we get to our spoiler conversation, I think that's particularly where this movie wants to, or I feel like has the opportunity to become quite dark and humorous and where it ends to me only works.

33:48Josh Larsen:If you see this movie as a dark comedy, if you see it as anything other than that, I think the ending is, it's kind of a disaster. I went with it because I enjoyed The End of Oak Street, not as the year's best Spielberg movie, but as a quite funny, dark, insane comic fantasy. I think that's where this movie is clicking.

34:10Adam Kempenaar:I like how it ends, but I also like the possibilities that The End opens up, which we are going to talk about. And I understand why you potentially want to read it that way. I can only tell you that the experience I had in the theater was not one where I thought that David Robert Mitchell was going for a darkly comic experience. I think that there are moments of comedy and there are moments where I laughed. And certainly there are moments where maybe you don't expect that you would be laughing. And so I get that that's usually the term we would put on it. But I still can't help but think. And maybe this is just me going off my first reaction.

34:48Adam Kempenaar:I just saw it two days ago. that that doesn't really mean anything it's not like it was just two hours ago but i am still processing my reaction i i still see this as david robert mitchell mostly trying to give us a very entertaining action-packed experience and succeeding now on the performances i am with you that i had a similar reaction unfortunately to mcgregor and some of that is i fear that the character as written is supposed to be a bit bland and a bit ineffectual you know there's a moment in the movie where hathaway her character says listen to your father and that's actually supposed to be a big moment for for both characters whether whether or not the camera draws any attention to it and the camera doesn't that's actually a big moment because she isn't she isn't someone as the mother who is usually telling the kids to obey what the father is saying.

35:48Adam Kempenaar:She wears the pants in the family. She's driving the car. She's got the shotgun. She's the one who is handling most things. And I do think that McGregor's performance then as a result, it's as if he taps into that a little bit and plays him a little boringly. hathaway though i think is pitched at exactly where this movie needs her to be and that includes needing her to be able to sell the terror that this family would feel including when we get one scene in particular that i think is one of the great set pieces in this film when, let's just say, a creature invades the home and none of them are aware of it.

36:40Adam Kempenaar:It's one of those scenes, Josh, where I noticed it wasn't just me. There were other people in the theater. We were all squirming in our seats. When a director can make you squirm in your seat because you're actually trying to maneuver as if your movements would help the character move. If you can do this, maybe the character will notice what's behind them. So that is something. And that is how I felt certainly watching this scene. There is a moment at the end of that scene where I'll put it this way. Hathaway's Denise goes to town and Hathaway plays that with the same conviction. she would play the odyssey or or any other movie any other character she's ever played you believe that every single protective instinct is coming out of her there but not only that every ounce of anger that has built up in her up to this point from the family dynamic but also through whatever they're experiencing every ounce of frustration it is all coming out of her in that moment, this release.

37:52Adam Kempenaar:And I actually do think there aren't that many actresses on Hathaway's level who can deliver that type of catharsis in that moment. And I really appreciated it in her performance there.

38:06Josh Larsen:Yeah, she's doing stuff we haven't seen her do before, especially in that scene. She's 100 % committed to it. I think she also works a little bit better because for me, she's tapped into the vein of humor too, whether it is finding a way to kind of not directly undercut her husband, but, you know, give us a variation on an eye roll over his ineffectiveness. And yeah, I think she does work quite a bit better than he does.

38:33Adam Kempenaar:Well, let's talk a little bit then before we get to spoilers. Can we talk? Well, I also have to tell you what I think is the great screenwriting misguided misstep of this film too. The misstep. Okay. Oh yeah. There, there, there is one. I, I almost thought I couldn't forgive Mitchell for, so I have to get to that. But since I brought it up in the setup and I know we're going to diverge on this, I'm going to go ahead and say it. What I, what I do think it has on, on disclosure day, as absurd as it might sound since that film takes place in a more recognizable real world and Oak street has a bunch of dinosaurs running around some of the choices of the characters and their actions with this one major exception i'll get to are more rational and believable here the other part is what i alluded to before this dialogue about faith elements in disclosure day there were elements i appreciated but spielberg also makes the conflict there quite literal right it's in the form of the sister mora character and eve hewson's jane and they are they are talking directly about their faith or lack thereof and what all of this means in oak street you have characters who represent different sides of that conflict in a way that seemed realistic to me especially since i know which one of the characters i am this family has been dealt a terrible hand the only real possibilities seem to be die pretty quickly and gruesomely survive for a bit but suffer okay both of those are bad or long shot, the longest shot, they'll be magically saved.

40:19Adam Kempenaar:Some members of the family express a faith in, effectively, a higher power, and they'll be magically saved. And why? Because they have no rational reason to believe that, but it comforts them. and it's how they want to live their lives because the alternative seems to only hold at best negativity and at worst sorrow what about the people out there getting eaten one of the characters says at one point that also i have to say is one of the great theological quandaries since the beginning of of thought and but and it's quite funny and it's quite funny the way they deliver it exactly lazy stella god's not gonna let us die here you only go to church at

41:03Josh Larsen:christmas and now you're telling the kids god's looking out for us what about the people who are out there getting eaten the other characters are pragmatists who see false hope as the great sin

41:17Adam Kempenaar:to be avoided i found that conversation and i do mean that that actual conversation but the larger conversation because it's something that the the movie is speaking to not just in that scene I found that conversation to be very compelling. I liked that it made me think about that. Now, I'm not suggesting, Josh, that David Robert Mitchell is giving us the end of Oak Street because he wants everyone to come away with this treatise on faith. But I like that it was I like that it was wrapped up in there.

41:46Josh Larsen:I yeah, I wish I could have seen the tentacles of that conversation in the rest of the film. to me there are basically two conversations like that that are dropped in kind of come out of nowhere i found it to be more employed to give extra shading to greg the father's inefficiency helplessness of course he would be the guy who says you know god will save us or whatever he says and then here's more dark humor this is where hathaway is like great line to church on christmas Christmas. And you're pulling this out. So I thought that was funny too. Yeah. I just didn't see it as, um, I didn't, it was a curiosity to me.

42:28Josh Larsen:Like where is this? And I know it's, there's a callback with the neighbor, the young woman who goes to private school. They're like, does she go to Catholic school? And then the neighbor asks, I think, uh, Audrey, do you believe in God? When she asked her to me, that was like, oh, well, this is random again. And I know you could extrapolate that to ask these larger questions that you proposed there. I don't know that the movie really, as you said, also, is that interested in doing that. Regarding Disclosure Day, you know, which it is curious that both of them at least touch on this issue, my preference is that Spielberg had let that play more in the background.

43:04Josh Larsen:I always would rather have it be something that's, you know, not that explicit. However, why I did like it in Disclosure Day, even though it worked in that way is it was much more directly woven into the characters backgrounds who they were as people i mean this isn't the first time jane brings up the eve hewson character faith it's not out of nowhere like greg here it's because we know she's already shared that she considered being a nun at one point and and you know these are these are much more richly developed characters in general, and specifically on the question of faith. She has a relationship with the other nun.

43:47Josh Larsen:And here's the other thing that Spielberg is, and again, this is coming out of just being deeply embroiled in his work, realizing that he has always been a believer in belief. And what I mean by that is he's less interested in the object of the belief. The belief could be a fairy. It could be a dinosaur. It could be an alien. But what he believes in is the human act of believing in something that's unbelievable. And he, his special gift, is getting you in the theater to feel like you could believe as well. And that is one of the main questions. I don't remember if we got into this that deeply in our initial conversation.

44:28Josh Larsen:That's one of the main questions that Disclosure Day is interested in, is the value of believing in something that's unbelievable. Right. Yeah. So, um, again, is it a little too literalized in disclosure day for me? Yes, I would agree with that. But I think it is much more thoughtfully and skillfully woven into that movie than it is here where it struck me as an oddball curiosity to have those two scenes kind of drop.

44:55Adam Kempenaar:See, that's the that's the exact opposite of what I'm describing, because for me, that's exactly the type of conversation I believe that family would have in that moment, precisely like they have it there in that scene. It did not feel to me at all like some contrived moment. The screenwriter felt like he needed to have in order to elevate his script.

45:18Josh Larsen:I guess just a couple of more suggestions about what their relationship to this was before, maybe even in production design or.

45:28Adam Kempenaar:Crises like this bring these out, bring these types of conversations.

45:32Josh Larsen:I'm talking about as a viewer, you know, so that you're kind of being, the landscape is being set. The seeds are being planted that this might be something that's going to come up in some way rather than it suddenly being dropped in, you know, 40 minutes or whatever into the movie, I guess.

45:50Adam Kempenaar:Let's get on to something that I struggled with. Oh, yes. My David Robert Mitchell It Follows embroidered nitpick hat is going to come out with the asterisk that like my It Follows thoughts, it's not a CinemaSins like nitpick. And I'm going to explain why. The key difference here is that while this choice sends the movie off track, fortunately, it turns out it wasn't a permanent detour. there is a point and obviously i i don't think this is a spoiler and i'm going to be i'm going to talk generally about it enough that if i thought it was a spoiler i would save it and i'll save part of it actually for a spoiler talk later there's there's a point roughly an hour in where mitchell clearly decided that either a it was going to get too stagnant if i didn't get this family out of the house for an extended period of time or B it was going to get too stagnant if I didn't gym up gin up some heavier emotional stakes or C both because is this is this Starbuck Starbuck and Greg he has one of the family members make a decision yeah that accomplishes both of those things that is nevertheless one of the dumber least believable things i have seen a character do ever on screen and yes it does involve the dog starbuck and you can say first you can tell me how much you all love dogs and so you bought it you can also understand how far you would go for your dog exactly you can also tell me how how mitchell sets it up in earlier scenes In retrospect, that just feels exactly like that's what it was, a writing ploy to try to justify this insanely stupid act.

47:39Adam Kempenaar:And as if that wasn't bad enough, what follows is then another character, a smarter, more mature character. That's the sin. Doing something equally stupid. But here's what I think is, here's the compound on compound. What I actually think is the greater sin, what frustrates me most, what elevates it from nitpick to the level of what I'm saying is, I think, misguided narrative judgment is the reason both of these characters, and this maybe gets back to where we diverge on this movie overall a little bit. the reason both of these characters make this decision or the reason that they're in a position to make it is why because their parents are having a screaming match in the other room setting aside the fact that they're fighting isn't enough for me to believe that either kid

48:34Josh Larsen:would do what they did especially the older more mature one we're yanked as viewers out of that

48:42Adam Kempenaar:fight so we can watch the kids do what the screenplay needs them to do. But the family dynamic and the tension, which starts with Greg and Denise, for me, isn't just window dressing. As I argued, it's the foundation of this movie. It's crucial to this movie working as well as it does. And this is a huge moment, the moment when the secrets are finally laid bare. Greg and Denise deserved to get those things off their chest. We deserved to hear them get those things off their chest. And somehow Mitchell literally and figuratively turns their voices into the adults from Charlie Brown. It becomes background noise that allows what the plot to move forward.

49:32Adam Kempenaar:It's contrived. It undercuts the emotional thrust of the movie. I wasn't sure I was going to be able to get over it. I was in part because of another decision Mitchell makes to salvage it, which I'll get into. But I was struggling with that for a while.

49:50Josh Larsen:Isn't this the movie showing its hand, laying its cars on the table? Potentially. I knew that's where you were going to go with it. But like I said, it pulls it out.

49:57Adam Kempenaar:It had enough of its hooks in me by that point. that I could overcome it.

50:02Josh Larsen:For me, it was like, this is the movie we're in. It didn't surprise me. I disagree with you that, or I mean, I agree with you on Audrey's choice to follow Brian. But hey, come on, Brian, risk reward. He's that age. He's still learning to calculate things, risk reward, and Starbuck needs help. What are you going to do if you're a, what is he, 13, 14-year-old boy and you're not? He's old enough. He's old enough. So let me, before we do spoilers, I wanted to, one thing I was asking myself and see if either of this resonates with you. You know, what else is this, what else might this movie be interested in?

50:38Josh Larsen:Because obviously at this point you found more in it than I was. And so I was looking for things and I thought, is there any sort of commentary going on here? Maybe there's the one shot of Brian after it all goes down. He grabs the encyclopedias from his bedroom and he's looking in one of them. And we see a page that says something about greenhouse climate. And so part of me is thinking, okay, is there some sort of environmental thing going on here? I didn't find any more threads to pull on. Maybe you did. I don't know. Here's another option of social commentary. I did think this beginning, this long opening setup of this neighborhood and the block party that was going on and on and on for me.

51:19I'm thinking this has got to be some sort of commentary on, you know, the United States basically being stuck in the past, the movie set in the past.

51:30Josh Larsen:So somewhat related to nostalgia, but possibly even more pointedly related to recent dialogue about America being better before. and it clicked for me when that overhead shot of the entire neighborhood, like a circle, isolated amidst the prehistoric landscape. And I'm thinking, okay, maybe we're getting something here about isolationist America. America doesn't want to just go back to the 1950s, let's say, but it wants to go back. We're so behind the times in the United States because we're looking backwards, we might as well be in the prehistoric era. Is there anything there? I don't know that I found many more threads, possibly.

52:13Josh Larsen:I think that's a little more interesting. But did anything like that register for you or either of those strike anything?

52:20Adam Kempenaar:No, Josh, I think it's entirely possible David Robert Mitchell just wanted to make a blockbuster that really entertained people. I do think in this case, that shot, though, that shot, that shot, though, is really interesting because it made me think even though ultimately aliens are not part of this movie there is something clearly cosmic going on and that shot overhead of the cul-de-sac it's a very odd oddly shaped circle it's a pretty good circle it looks it looks like a crop circle it yeah it makes it makes you think that the of course oak street in this circle this neighborhood was the one that was picked out it's a nice little bit of of design or or at least set choice there you're right though that what is interesting unless i'm overlooking something something that is interesting about i think it'd be very i think it'd be a bit of a stretch to suggest the movie is trying to make some climate change argument or really wants us to think about it but that that moment stood out to me as well where he gets out the encyclopedia and he's reading about dinosaurs Because the director shows us what he's reading.

53:27Adam Kempenaar:And he reads something about the climate and how it's going to get very hot. Yeah, greenhouse climate. The greenhouse climate. But then, to my recollection, the movie doesn't do anything with that. I thought that that then was going to lead to some kind of revelation later in the movie where the way they get rid of the dinosaurs is by doing something with the climate. it it doesn't factor in so as far as i recall so why does that why is that shot in the movie

53:54Josh Larsen:yeah it is a it is a good question maybe maybe we missed something listeners can tell us if there's an environmental reading or or yeah america stuck in the past reading yes but i will

54:04Adam Kempenaar:say this as we transition to spoilers for the people who are are not ready to listen to that yet what what we are going to talk about in spoilers i want to talk about as you've hinted already the ramifications of the ending i also want to talk about denise as writer slash god okay that's where that's where we're gonna go let's go ahead and close out the review proper of the end of oak street if you've seen the movie and you would like to agree or disagree with with one of us because we see this movie differently you can write in feedback at filmspotting.net

54:41Josh Larsen:Amazon Health AI presents Painful Thoughts I, um, I can't stop scratching my downtown

54:50Adam Kempenaar:Yeah, but I'm not itching to go downtown and tell a receptionist I'm here to talk about my downtown Some things you'd rather type than say out loud

55:00Josh Larsen:There's no question too embarrassing for Amazon Health AI Chat your symptoms and get virtual care 24-7 Healthcare just got less painful How's the new place? Get your Wi-Fi figured out? I got T-Mobile 5G home internet and I'm loving it. It's the fastest 5G home internet. My old provider was so slow. Mine is slow. And only 35 bucks a month. Do I need to try this? Try it for 15 days. Love it or get your money back. I love it already. There are over 250 reasons to join T-Mobile. Find yours and check availability at T-Mobile.com slash home internet. This is according to Ooglu Speed Test Intelligence.

55:38Josh Larsen:Just date a second half of 2025. All rates reserved. Redeemed money-back guarantee within 30 days of cancellation. NYX, that's K-N-I-X, leak-proof underwear, is made for real life. Because when your day is already full, your underwear shouldn't be something you have to think about. NYX gives you reliable leak-proof protection that fits seamlessly into your routine. For periods, for light bladder leaks, for workouts, for everyday freshness. NYX leak-proof underwear comes in a range of absorbencies, from light to ultra. So if you need a little backup or all-day protection, there's a pair for you.

56:10Josh Larsen:Unlike bulky protection, NYX feels barely there with soft fabrics, moisture-wicking layers, and anti-odor technology that keeps you feeling fresh and confident. Wear them to work, running errands, traveling, even overnight. Plus, they're machine washable, so you can wear them again and again. Find your perfect level of protection at knix.com and get 15 % off with code FLOW15. That's knix.com, code FLOW15. That's knix.com. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus, or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle.

56:50Josh Larsen:I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinheiro, and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word solita, trading the pity for possibility. Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people and they were like, you smiled at us. Not a lot of people smile around here. It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip, I hope you listen to Solita on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

57:49Adam Kempenaar:Josh, spoilers on the end of Oak Street. Where would you like to begin?

57:57Josh Larsen:So as boring as he was, I was sad to see Greg get it. Yeah. I think that is, you know, I also feel like I should say I haven't had time to sit down and write, which is where I finally know what I really feel about a movie. I'm leaning positive on this movie. I did enjoy it. Really? Yeah. As an experience. I mean, you're trying to claim it's Spielberg. Well, how am I going to get on board with that? That's nuts. But. Yeah. Not top tier Spielberg, Josh. Just better than Disclosure Day. I did have fun with this movie. And I think one of the best sequences is Craig's death because it is exciting. It is, again, darkly funny.

58:38Josh Larsen:What does he have? A sledgehammer, I think. Yes. Just the ludicrousness that a sledgehammer to the nose of this. What was that? An Allosaurus he's going after? Allosaurus. Okay.

58:46Adam Kempenaar:So nerdy Josh didn't know that. Okay.

58:48Josh Larsen:I didn't get into dinosaurs as a kid. I don't know. I think we were too old for that. That didn't really start in earnest until Jurassic Park. Well, I know.

58:57Adam Kempenaar:So I was into dinosaurs way before Jurassic Park. I was into dinosaurs right about the time this movie is set, 1982. But I definitely wasn't familiar with Allosaurus's at that point.

59:07Josh Larsen:Anyway, so he takes the sledgehammer and knocks the thing down, which got a laugh out of me. And then all of a sudden, this was my thought process, Adam. The Allosaurus chomps his foot. And I'm thinking, how are they going to work?

59:22Adam Kempenaar:It's like below the knee, Josh.

59:24Josh Larsen:Yeah, yeah, you're right. I mean, it's severe. And my first thought is, again, like a screenwriting thought is like, how are they going to write around this now for the rest of the movie? He can't hop around the rest of the film. He can't. And then, nope. Nope, he won't. Who's the guy? The lawyer in Jurassic Park. He just gets swallowed there. Yes. And I think I laughed at that as well. I did feel bad. Sure. And I do, that's where my interest started to peak in terms of the dark humor and the implications for the family dynamic, I will say, got a little more interesting after that point. Which I'm guessing is where probably you'll go.

1:00:01Adam Kempenaar:Look, see, so that's so fascinating because I can tell you that my experience in the theater is that when you watch a gigantic dinosaur on screen bite somebody's leg off and blood starts spurting out and they're screaming, there's a part of you that can't help but laugh a little bit, even if it's internal, just kind of chuckle. but the moment when that dinosaur ate greg all i'm thinking this is this is at least how in tune with the movie i was josh and the family when that when that dinosaur ate greg all i was thinking about was i was feeling it like denise and the kids were feeling it okay i was crushed i was crushed on the kids behalf i was in shock sure like they were i mean i'm not a monster no i had some i understand i'm just saying that i didn't have the darkly comic take on the film i think

1:00:51Josh Larsen:Think about how many of the other kills in this movie are punchlines, though, Adam, like with the neighbors and stuff. And so this is operating. I know it's the character we know even better, but it's operating in that vein.

1:01:05Adam Kempenaar:But you say that, and I think it's such a fine line. And I think even Mitchell was probably trying to figure out where that line was because we hate that neighbor. And I want to talk about this in a second where I want to go with the ending. That neighbor is a loser jerk. and if you asked us early in the film do we want to see him get eaten by a dinosaur we would say yes and there's a part of us even as he's shooting at him i was thinking oh i kind of can't wait for them all to swirl around him but then when it happens he shows it happening from the perspective of denise and greg and denise and greg are nothing except purely horrified sure and so then i'm purely horrified i'm not laughing at him getting eaten yeah by the dinosaurs right yeah that one

1:01:53Josh Larsen:yeah because they're involved which goes back to the spielberg human experience thing i was talking about actually because they're involved involved it's seen through a different lens and certainly greg's death is too of course because the kids are right there and she's right there and as you say that's what i'm thinking is about is they're watching this but it but it's it's also curious because I was noticing how is that scene going to play too? Because to me, it did have that dark comic element, but she does cover their eyes and drag them away and start talking to them about other things. So it's definitely meant to play that way.

1:02:28Adam Kempenaar:Yes. Yes. Before maybe we get into the heavy stuff, because I don't know where exactly you want to go, whether or not it coincides with where I want to go. I do just want to go back to, I said Mitchell salvaged the misguided narrative choice. Oh, right. And that is simply that just about, I swear, just about the time I was thinking, if the rest of this movie is me having to follow the kids and the parents not being able to reunite because of that fight and Brian jumping out the window to chase Starbuck and Audrey chasing after Brian without telling the parents that she's going after him. It becomes the fruit of the poisonous tree.

1:03:10Adam Kempenaar:It's just going to sink the entire rest of this movie and maybe retroactively everything that came before it. And right at that point, I was thinking it. It's like Mitchell was reading my reading my mind and and they see they see the parents outside the window and they open up the doors, mom, dad, and they see each other and they get back together. It's like if I had to go any longer with them not finding each other, Josh, the movie was probably sunk.

1:03:35Josh Larsen:I'm glad for your sake that you didn't have to experience that. Yeah, I think the reuniting of the family at the end via this very elaborate glowing blob, which, you know, I guess we just accept that's all we're going to learn about that. Yeah. You know, one of my quibbles about the movie, too, is or hesitances, I should say, is that it's kind of like half a high concept that he's come up with here. And he didn't kind of finish it because this portal is just glowing there. And I bought Audrey's explanation.

1:04:12Adam Kempenaar:She reads Carl Sagan. Carl Sagan's a wise man, Josh.

1:04:14Josh Larsen:What's the deal? Yeah, exactly. But yeah, it's there to reunite the family. But here's my question for you. um so they steal this other dimensions greg that's it right the father so and again i was kind of chuckling at the implications of this just because how i had keyed into the movie you're a sick man they steal what what about the other dimensions audrey this is the question Denise and Brian, right? Apparently this just means that Greg never comes home. Dad never comes home from surreptitiously delivering pizzas. The dinosaurs invade and whatever happens to the three of them happens to the three of them alone.

1:05:01Josh Larsen:So they've stolen this dimensions, Greg. I also like, I mean, here's where it's got to be meant to be sort of funny. the fact that Jeanette, the neighbor girl who ends up with them for a long time, she runs away to steal her entire family, including her other self. Well, she got back earlier, Josh. So in the happy ending, no, I get how it happens. But in the happy ending, I saw that as a punchline that there were two Jeanettes. Just like this is our new family life. Right. Is we get a bonus Jeanette now.

1:05:36Adam Kempenaar:Yes.

1:05:37Josh Larsen:Yes. Again, all of this, you know, I think for me only works if it's a little bit of a joke asking you to say, yeah, you know what? Here's how I felt, how I experienced it. And I enjoyed this experience. Yeah. We put a portal in our movie. Yeah. That means the family gets together. Yeah. It means this Greg was stolen. Sure. You know, we're at the end of the movie. This is what we want. And it was what I wanted. As boring as Greg was. He's back. Good. They're in better terms. Absolutely. I'm fine with it. I had a good time coming out of the theater, but yeah, only because I was locked in in that vein.

1:06:15Adam Kempenaar:Joke's the right word in that context. I mean, the movie is playing in that register, certainly by the end of the film. I think, I mean, it is a dinosaur movie and it's about wormholes. Like it's, yeah, we know what we're dealing with here. And just to be totally clear, even though people are listening to this, they they have seen the entire movie and they've probably thought about all of this. What you are saying is exactly where I want to go. This isn't really a time travel movie. This isn't back to the future or the Terminator where you go into the past and your actions can change the future.

1:06:53Josh Larsen:This is a we might be in a multiverse.

1:06:55Adam Kempenaar:This is a multiverse.

1:06:56Josh Larsen:I hate to say it. It is.

1:06:57Adam Kempenaar:So at the end, even though I just said it's not back to the future, it's kind of like they returned to Hill Valley because I love how they see the time on the clock and they realize that they have time.

1:07:07Josh Larsen:The biggest clock I've ever seen. That's right. Yes.

1:07:10Adam Kempenaar:They have time to change what will happen, but not entirely. But they have some time and things are going to change or they can change things. But the event, the wormhole is going to happen. So I I'm I'm not patting myself on the back here. I assume most viewers put it together. The, the crumbs were the breadcrumbs were laid from the very beginning of the movie, the references to the pizza delivery, the, the, the phone number on the top of the car, we can put two and two together that she's going to go to the phone booth and she's going to call the number. She's going to have the pizza delivered.

1:07:45Adam Kempenaar:And theoretically he's going to arrive. Daddy is of course alive, reuniting tears, rejoicing. Wow. It's like he's, it's like Lazarus. Lazarus risen from the dead, right? But in so doing, they have, they have changed the events in this, in this multiverse that's been created because returning Denise, returning Denise, Audrey and Brian. So let's call them Denise, Audrey and Brian two. They're with Greg one and Denise, Audrey and Brian one. They all went to the wormhole without Greg one. They're all without their dad. So they've got this other guy. No, they don't have a guy. They don't have a guy.

1:08:31Josh Larsen:Oh, no. Yeah. You're, you're, you don't have a guy as I'm reading it. Right. Yeah. So in our, they stole exactly.

1:08:38Adam Kempenaar:So in our world, in our, our world, what we're called Denise, Audrey and Brian two and Greg one are living happily ever after with two Jeanettes and, and aren't they all really, they, they are, this is the question. they're just denise audrey brian and greg they're not two and one as far as they know they're all just the family but this is the kind of question that sci-fi movies have been posing forever sure different versions of multiverse versions are they really the same but to them to to the three members of the family it's just like they're reuniting with the only dad they've ever known so that's interesting to ponder but in the other world denise audrey and brian for however long they survived.

1:09:22Adam Kempenaar:That's what I said. I know I'm just spelling it out. I said that, Josh. I'm just making sure people understand because I think it's really fascinating. For however long they survived, they did so without their dad. Now, maybe he never came home. Now, now think about that. Think about that from their perspective. Maybe they ultimately, once they put things together, they decided, hey, dad never came home. that means he probably never got sucked into this wormhole and maybe at least he's safe back on oak street and so maybe they think about that and and it it makes them feel good or maybe it just fills them with overwhelming sadness that they they don't have their dad with them so effectively they lost their dad they lost their dad husband just like the others lost their dad slash husband

1:10:11Josh Larsen:and you're right they just stole him the other ones just stole that denise prob denise probably wasn't too worried. I mean, at that point in the narrative, she had blatantly said, I can handle a lot more than you think or something like that, probably more than you, more than you think. So she might not have been too worried. I don't think they'd started to reconcile yet. So yeah, it's again, obviously we're seeing it through, you've seen it through a more emotional moving lens and I'm seeing it through a more comic lens, which I think is to the movie's credit. I think that's when it's working best.

1:10:41Josh Larsen:And I see this ending as kind of kind of like a final punchline, even as it does raise some of these interesting questions.

1:10:50Adam Kempenaar:And the question that I still haven't fully been able to reconcile is, to what extent, because if you think about this, it's pretty heavy. And it certainly casts a shadow over the happy reading of the end of the film, which I don't see how you read as anything but happy. It's like the Back to the Future ending, where everything has now been not only set right with the world, everything's better than it previously was. She's the writer she wants to be. Everybody's happy. The daughter got into Cornell. They all have boyfriends and girlfriends. Everything is perfect with the world. But if you now start thinking about this stuff, it's not all perfect with the world.

1:11:37Adam Kempenaar:So does David Robert Mitchell want us thinking about that stuff? Or does he want us thinking about how happy everybody is. And then the other part of this is what I'm, what I'm just also intrigued by is, is that the fact that the movie takes time to show us not only is Denise a writer, but the name of her book, right? Is called, isn't it the, the true story, the, the true story of the end of Oak street.

1:12:05Josh Larsen:Yeah. But it has a, it has a two word title. Shoot. I didn't write it down. And then that's, I think that's the subtitle.

1:12:11Adam Kempenaar:is the true story of the end of oak street yeah yeah and and so she also says at one point to to greg when he says i i found your book when they're when they're fighting and she tries to say oh no it's not it's not true it's not real i it's a story like she's just an inventor of stories Yeah. Well, there are different versions then of the end of Oak Street, including now this different version of how things would play out with just the three of them in this multiverse without Greg. big and it's so i i have two things i want to mention one is i had a thought which is if mitchell had been really ingenious and i would be first in line obviously to to see this he would have simultaneously shot the other end of oak street the secret he would have simultaneously shot the move the move the second movie version the alternate multiverse version with just the three of them without Greg in the end of Oak Street.

1:13:19Adam Kempenaar:Yeah, yeah. And that movie would come out a year from now, and I would go see it.

1:13:23Josh Larsen:Yeah. Yeah, I think that partially speaks to why this does feel like half a high concept to me, is there's still that potential there by this ending. Here's a question, or here's a development that would have been interesting. What if the Denise, Brian, and Audrey, whose Greg had been stolen, what if they jumped through the portal, ended up in the same dimension as stolen Greg? Who's Greg going to choose? Which family? I mean, Greg's got some heavy thinking to do. And I don't know that he's up to it, quite frankly. No, no.

1:14:02Adam Kempenaar:He probably is not up to it. So then here's the last part. I said something about Denise as God. Any writer is a creator of a universe and is creating life, is creating characters and can dictate who lives and who dies and how life plays out. Isn't Denise doing just that as we described? She's deciding the fate of Greg. She's deciding the fate of Greg one. And she's deciding to some extent the fate of the alternate Denise, Audrey, and Brian as well. But more than that, the whole thing on the television, when we get the stories of the two-year anniversary, she not only chooses to save Greg one, but she has time to save three other people.

1:14:57Adam Kempenaar:Who does she save? She calls the librarian. She calls Mrs. Huddleston. And she calls the neighbor. So it's very interesting that those are the three people. The annoying neighbor. And she calls those three. She calls those three who she then saves by telling them to come to the hill, just like she does with Greg. So one of those three is obviously someone she's very close with. Mrs. Huddleston. One of those people we know, one of those people we know she is at least collegial with and she would consider a friend and also gave that woman gave up her life for them. Yes. So clearly she feels like she owes her a debt.

1:15:41Adam Kempenaar:The librarian. A very positive librarian portrait. Let me. I mean, come on. No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

1:15:49Josh Larsen:Only good information. And yes. Only good information.

1:15:53Adam Kempenaar:She gets eaten by an alligator, a gigantic prehistoric alligator for, for the kids. Josh would would Debbie do that um no I didn't think so I don't think she'd go that far but then she also saves the neighbor yeah so so how do you how do you explain that choice you want the

1:16:15Josh Larsen:cynical answer to save Mel the cynical answer and you've given this a lot more thoughts you probably have a better one um he's the only other neighbor we've met in the movie that I did think about that i mean of course it's kind of funny that it's him because it's ironic it's you know not what you would expect it's the last person you'd expect so it landed for me as a bit of a

1:16:35Adam Kempenaar:joke yeah i think i think that that's that's there i think the other way i suppose you could look at this cynically but i don't know if cynical is the right way or just to call it human nature they are the three people she knows that she sees die the other people in the neighborhood that she sees die we don't know for sure that she has any personal personal connection to and so if you were in her shoes you might also be inclined to save the three people you see die that you make sense and i think that that's i think that's part of it but also just something about her actually being neighborly even though she doesn't like him she does the neighborly thing and saves him I like to read it that way.

1:17:22Adam Kempenaar:Sure.

1:17:22Josh Larsen:Even though he doesn't deserve it. Yeah. It's yeah. I mean, I'm thinking about her having this sort of power and this being her story. Did she, did she kill Greg off? Like at some, at some level, is she, is she making the decision? No, that's David Robert Mitchell. I'm, I'm getting,

1:17:40Adam Kempenaar:I'm getting all confused. But think about this. This is still, this is still just Greg. This is Greg one. Greg hasn't gone through any of this stuff. He's still the lame Greg. From the first half of the movie.

1:17:51Josh Larsen:They haven't had their confrontation, their concussions.

1:17:54Adam Kempenaar:He hasn't gone through any of this adversity that's made him a better man. He's got some work to do still. She's got her work cut out for him. That's our spoiler talk on the end of Oak Street. And as I said in the FilmSpottingFamily discord earlier today, I thought that somehow without knowing, without having an inkling of what your thoughts were about this film, I thought that it was possible that somehow this movie might end up being, with spoiler talk, one of our longest reviews ever. And here we are over an hour on the end of Oak Street. Did that beat, what was it, The Tree of Life?

1:18:31Josh Larsen:No, it was Odyssey, right? The Odyssey and The Tree of Life.

1:18:35Adam Kempenaar:Yeah, somehow. David Robert Mitchell.

1:18:38Josh Larsen:Who knew? This is not the best Spielberg movie of the year, but it is the longest Odyssean conversation of the year, I guess.

1:18:48Adam Kempenaar:We'll have to pick a Spielberg movie to try to outdo this one at some point. I'll give you that. I'll promise you that at some point, Josh. Thank you. We do encourage you to share your feedback, especially after all that spoiler talk. Tell us how we should be reading The End of Oak Street. Feedback at filmspotting.net.

1:19:05Josh Larsen:I've got to tell you a quick story about my showing of the end of Oak street. Caught it middle of a day. I think it was Thursday and you can tell who the real movie diehards are, you know, weekday middle of day screenings. You usually have other people are there by themselves. Um, and the lights come up or the credits are rolling. And this guy, a couple of seats down for me, just kind of leans over. Maybe you've had this too. Although I don't think you take quite as many notes as I do, but I had my notebook out. He's like, Hey, I noticed, notice you're writing some notes. Are you like a movie critic or something?

1:19:38Josh Larsen:Does it, you get this every once in a while, sometimes when you're in a theater and he's, so I said, yeah, I'm actually, you know, do this podcast. Really nice guy. He's said he's part of a film group that they get together regularly and talk about the movies that they've seen. And yeah, I'm actually going to shout out his name. He's on Instagram. We traded, Traded Profiles, abc.nephew. So follow him if you're intrigued and keep up with his movie talk. But it's always nice to meet one of those hardcore film fans in the middle of the day, in the middle of the week. If you're one of those folks and you see movies that frequently, that devotedly, then you should become a Regal Unlimited subscriber because that way, going to these films, you could see one of them for free.

1:20:28Josh Larsen:Regal Unlimited is the all you can watch. movie subscription pass that pays for itself in just two visits. And right now, Regal is offering film spotting listeners endless movies for less. I forgot to tell ABC.Nephew this. I'm going to have to DM him on Instagram. If you sign up for Regal Unlimited using the code filmspot26, you're going to get 15 % off. Regal Unlimited is the only truly limitless movie subscription pass. You can see any standard 2D movie anytime. There are no blackout dates or restrictions. You're also going to save on snacks because members get 10 % off all non-alcoholic concessions.

1:21:08Josh Larsen:So sign up now on the Regal app or at the link in our description and use code FILMSPOT26 to receive your discount. Adam, it's been nice to see so many people joining the Film Spotting family. Recently, I'm guessing maybe the sale we have going on to become a family member is part of that. We are offering 20 % off membership through August 31st. You just need to use the promo code SUMMER, and you can do all of that at filmspottingfamily.com. So, yeah, some new folks coming in, but let's take a few minutes to thank people who have been members for a while now. Membership, of course, is the single largest source of support for film spotting.

1:21:50Josh Larsen:It's the main reason we get to keep doing this. So thank you very much to family members, Ernie Dawson in Tampa, Florida, and Alex in Valparaiso, Indiana.

1:22:01Adam Kempenaar:Ernie says, I've been listening for many years. A review you got wrong? Your top five concert movie list was extremely flawed. No Woodstock or Monterey pop? How dare you? A movie I credit with becoming a cinephile? 2001, A Space Odyssey. My mom let me stay up late to watch it on television at about 10 years old. I didn't understand any of it, but I was hooked.

1:22:21Josh Larsen:I have no excuse. Ernie. I did homework for that top five and Woodstock didn't make the cut, so still needs to be seen by me. As for Alex, Batman vs. Superman with Michael Phillips is the first episode I recall listening to. A favorite show reviewer top five? Tough to choose, but I think I learned of Koganata's Columbus through the show, and that is now an all-time favorite, so I'll go with that. A movie I credit with becoming a cinephile, Knowing, with Nicolas Cage from 2009, directed by Alex Proyas. Watching with the director's commentary track on a portable DVD player during a family road trip is what first opened my eyes to the art of filmmaking.

1:23:02Josh Larsen:Okay. A random film or filmmaker that I love, The Turin Horse, Where is the Bela Tarr? Marathon. Oh man, Alex, I've given up on that ever happening. I know the length of these films. It's going to take a lot to convince Adam. So I've managed to see.

1:23:21Adam Kempenaar:To convince me, don't sit here and act like you've been pushing for a Bella Tar marathon behind the scenes.

1:23:25Josh Larsen:I brought it up here and there. And I've done, I've seen the Turnhorse. I've seen Workmeister Harmonies. I've seen the man from London. I've got two. I don't think either of us have had the. No, no. The fortitude to take on yet. Look at it this way. I'll do it. Let's do it.

1:23:43Adam Kempenaar:Look at it this way. No, no, I don't want to do it. Look at it this way. The positive is we already have the name of the marathon awards, the potato peels. This is true. And yes. And the thing about the Bella tar marathon is that it starts, but it never ends. It will just take up the entire rest of the shows, the entire future of the show, Josh. It never, it's just ongoing. So I think that would be a problem. And we can't actually do that, Alex. I'm sorry. I just want to make sure I was clear on something. Did you say, Josh, that you, you watched Woodstock didn't make the cut Monterey pop. Is that one you still need to see?

1:24:18Adam Kempenaar:I haven't seen either of them. Oh, you haven't seen either. Okay. You did your homework, but you didn't get to either of those.

1:24:23Josh Larsen:Yes. Woodstock was on my homework list. Ah, I did watch other movies for the first time for that one, but didn't get to Woodstock.

1:24:30Adam Kempenaar:Okay. Well, we do have, I'll say, I think maybe I've plugged this already, but we do have a great movie death match for fans of concert movies. A great movie death match coming up. That's right. Monday of September. Stop making sense versus the last Waltz. So look forward, look forward to that one.

1:24:48Josh Larsen:Thanks again to Ernie and Alex for their support, for listening. If you want to follow them on Letterboxd, Ernie is at Hardtail67. Alex is AlexTheGreat18.

1:25:00Adam Kempenaar:You can learn more about joining the FilmSpotting family at FilmSpottingFamily.com. Early and ad-free listening wherever you listen to podcasts, whatever platform you're on. You do get our weekly newsletter. You get access to the complete film spotting archive. You get access to that exclusive film spotting family discord. Hey, it's just like a message board. Don't be scared of it. If you've never been on discord and it's a great group of people, definitely nothing to be scared of. You also get exclusive opportunities like being part of film spotting family madness, naming the best films of the 1920s and 1930s.

1:25:40Adam Kempenaar:Josh, we are down to the championship match. Yeah, saw this. And it did come down to The Wizard of Oz versus Sherlock Jr., two films that are in the film Spawning Pantheon, which seems only appropriate.

1:25:54Josh Larsen:Seems appropriate. I like the matchup. You know, Keaton obviously chosen by listeners over Chaplin to represent the great genre of silent comedy from that era. I don't know. I can't wait to see how Keaton fares against the Wizard of Oz, though. It just seems too big of a task, even for him, to knock Oz out. But you've been paying closer attention to how these matchups have gone so far. Am I underselling Sherlock Jr.?

1:26:26Adam Kempenaar:It's going to be very tough for Sherlock Jr. to overtake the Wizard at all his might. I will say that. But you still have time to vote as you are listening to this. We encourage you to do so. And if you were an early film spotting family voter, you may not have had a chance to vote in the third place matchup. I forgot that we do normally put up a third place poll. So you do have a chance still to determine the third place winner. Is it M or is it City Light? So please do go back and vote in that contest if you haven't already. August, Josh, the monthly bonus show you're going to get is a blind spotting review.

1:27:04Adam Kempenaar:The polls are still open there too, but it does look like it's going to be Kiyoshi Kurosawa's cure. I think 1997. I'll finally get to say I've seen a Kiyoshi Kurosawa film. You'll get to say you've seen two if we do that film.

1:27:20Josh Larsen:Yeah, I'm excited about that. I was happy with any of these picks, but this would be a good one with the samurai and the Prisoner still in theaters too, and Curacao on People's Mind. I like that.

1:27:31Adam Kempenaar:If you want to hear that conversation, which includes producer Sam and all those other benefits, just join the FilmSpotting family at FilmSpottingFamily.com. Don't forget to take that 20 % discount that's running for a couple of more weeks here. Use the promo code SUMMER.

1:27:47Josh Larsen:You work in the kitchen before? Sorry.

1:27:51Adam Kempenaar:Yeah. We open Wednesday to Sunday. Start at 11 a.m. What time is it? That means that you're here at 1045. Eleven is late. Anyone late is fire. You know I can cook too. The kids need to cook. Tony is the new biopic about the early restaurant career of the late chef, writer, and TV personality Anthony Bourdain. The movie is directed by Matt Johnson and stars Dominic Sessa as Bourdain, best known for his role in Alexander Payne's The Holdovers. Annoyingly, Josh, Tony has not yet expanded to my region of the world, which means I have not yet had a chance to see it. But you have seen it. Johnson, it's worth noting, did also make my favorite film of the year so far, Nirvana, the band, the show, the movie.

1:28:37Adam Kempenaar:I'm curious whether he brings any of the inspired madness of that film to this biopic. but also as someone who is enough of a Bourdain fan that I once ordered the crab back at Swan Oyster Depot in San Francisco solely because on parts unknown, he called it's buttery innards unicorn juice and a touchstone in my worldwide wanderings. Is there any chance that two Matt Johnson movies are going to make my top 10 of the year? Uh, buttery innards. Yeah. Buttery innards. Yeah. Okay. Well, yeah, that's what they are. Unicorn juice.

1:29:16Josh Larsen:Doesn't that sound delicious? Yeah, okay. I'm going to have to return to that. I think you're going to love this movie, Adam. And it's good. I enjoyed it. But yeah, given your background with Bourdain and enjoying Johnson's film, which I also enjoyed previous to this, though very different energy going on here. There is some anarchy here. This depiction of Bourdain at this age is one of a person trying to find themselves and doing that all externally. Not sitting in a room writing in a journal, but living loudly with other people in their lives and making mistakes and messing up their lives. And it is in that sense, something of an anti-hero drama.

1:30:05Josh Larsen:I think you can sense a little bit in the filmmaking style, actually the film grain and the timeframe. This has a 1970s feel to it. I forget the exact year this is supposed to take place, but the most consistent through line in terms of it being an anti-hero drama is Sessa's performance. I think we were both just incredibly excited to encounter him as a screen presence in the holdovers. Couldn't wait to see what he did next. And this is a great part for him to just double down on the lanky uncomfortability that he brought to the holdovers. And here as Bourdain, you just get the sense that he does not care what anyone thinks of him as a character or as an actor.

1:30:57Josh Larsen:He's not pulling any punches here. And his physicality is so much a part of this. One of Bourdain's instincts, this Bourdain's instincts at this age is just to instinctively lie all the time. And I love in the physicality, it's almost like Sessa has this very prominent Adam's apple. And I'm just imagining like the truth getting caught in that Adam's apple. And it just, the truth can't come out. This kid just lies about his past, about who he is, who he wants to be. and Sessa is mesmerizing to watch as that sort of character. The movie overall, you can feel it sanding off some of the more unlikable qualities that might come with that.

1:31:41Josh Larsen:The line a little bit, the drug abuse, alcohol abuse, you know, there are bursts of violence here that Sessa commits to, But that instinct in this character fades away as the movie gradually wants this to be a learning experience, Summer, that gave us, got us closer to the Bourdain, you know, that we all treasured, those who really followed his work. And so there's just something that moves further away from a 1970s antihero drama like The Last Detail or Scarecrow or some of these really bold. The movie doesn't care what the audience thinks of the movie, let alone the actor playing the antihero.

1:32:28Josh Larsen:Tony does care a little bit more. Sessa doesn't. Tony does. Maybe that's maybe that's fine for most people. I thought it was maybe held it back a little bit for me, but still good film, great performance. Worth checking out, even if you don't know anything about Bourdain, really. I think it still would work for someone.

1:32:49Adam Kempenaar:I have been heartened to see that it's gotten mostly positive reviews in addition to your positive reviews. So I think this weekend is when I finally do get a chance to see Tony as it is expanding wide. If you have thoughts on Josh's take, email us feedback at filmspotting.net.

1:33:07Josh Larsen:You're Ed Sachsberger. The Ed Sachsberger, right? The poet? That was a long time ago. You were brilliant. You wrote a masterpiece. It's as if the poems were written yesterday. They're moving. They're scathing. They're timeless. We all think so. My whole group. Your group? Adam, we both caught up with Late Fame. This is the latest from critic-turned-director Kent Jones, previously made the documentary Hitchcock Truffaut, and then more recently, Diane. Late Fame is currently playing in limited release. It stars Willem Dafoe as a New York poet whose mostly forgotten work has been taken up by a group of young artists.

1:33:46Josh Larsen:Now, Diane was something of a showcase for Mary Kay Place. She played the title character. I was very much about that character's experience in the world and psychology. how did you think late fame worked along those lines when it comes to defoe i think a universally beloved actor with an enormous body of work early in his career maybe a few chances to be center of a movie but you know not so much more lately i think we think of him as a welcome supporting presence in movies here he is center stage um how did it work as a showcase for him i haven't seen

1:34:24Adam Kempenaar:Diane, though I have seen other Kent Jones films. In fact, he was interviewed here on the show for Hitchcock Truffaut, that documentary, which I believe was his first film. But hearing that about Mary Kay Place and it being a showcase, your reaction to it, that doesn't surprise me after watching Late Fame. I almost never recommend a movie for this primary reason. And there are there are other rewards here but willem defoe's layered laconic layered performance makes late fame worth seeking out that's that's what i think the the attraction really is here and it's not so much that i didn't go back and look at his filmography and and break it down it's not so much that we've never seen defoe play someone so normal i suppose but it still feels

1:35:16Josh Larsen:a little bit novel and maybe the florida project yeah exactly yeah a key yeah yeah in that vein

1:35:23Adam Kempenaar:that's that's a standout too there's no like that character there's no real melancholy to to this man this this poet who's now a postal worker named ed saxberger but he just plays him with such acceptance. He plays him with a certain resignation. There's a, there's a certain man that he used to be, and there's the man he is now, but it's not as if you just understand with Defoe immediately the history that he brings to this man, the arc, there wasn't some transformation, just the, just the arc of time and the idea or the sense that you become who you are. And this, this encounter with this very idiosyncratic eccentric group of aspiring artists, I guess some of them are, are artists in their own, in their own way that, that say they have discovered this book of poems he wrote and, and admire him like he's, genius, this, this jolts some recognition back into him of this, this previous, this previous soul that he was a man who, who like artists are, or, or who like we presume artists are someone who, who couldn't help, but react to the sounds and the sites and, and the people that he encountered the experiences around him.

1:36:59Adam Kempenaar:And he funneled all of that into his work. And that's, that's just not the person that, that he is now. And the way Dafoe brings all of that to this character for me was, was, was something that I just found really enjoyable watching late fame. Yeah.

1:37:17Josh Larsen:It's interesting. You, you say he doesn't have a sense of melancholy. I think you're absolutely right. I think, you know, this, this character, it's not even that he's accepted where his life has led. And as you describe it, the passage of time is so good because it's just where he is. But he goes about, he's a postal worker now. He works at a post office and we see him going through his routine. And you're right. He's not trudging. He's not sighing. This is just who he is. He's not bitter. He's not bitter. Exactly right. But I will say what I liked about late fame, in addition to Defoe's performance, was that I did find it has an undercurrent of melancholy.

1:37:56Josh Larsen:And so what you don't get here is this group rediscovering him, as they say, and bringing him back into a limelight. And suddenly the fame that was short lived and went away has returned. And he, you know, and not to give away exactly where this ends, but it is not that inspirational type story that it could have been. And I think the melancholy that the movie does hold is more about the dissatisfaction that an artistic life will give if the satisfaction you seek is always recognition. And while I think that's healthy, there's something inevitably sad about that. And I think the movie is true about that.

1:38:45Josh Larsen:And so I appreciated it. I did find I struggled a little bit with, this is a movie, Adam, that I don't know if it needed another pass on the screenplay, and I'll mention the people behind it in a second, or if it just needed more screen time for some of these characters. I did find this world outside of Defoe and his New York not as well lived in as I had hoped or as, and believable isn't the right word, but I did find both the young men who are part of this group and they call themselves the Enthusiasm Society. and obviously they're supposed you're supposed to laugh at them a little bit at the beginning i didn't feel like the movie's portrait of them progressed much past that as a matter of fact it leaves the main leader of the group played by edmund donovan i think really kind of does him dirty where the how that character ends in terms of seeing them as kind of naive jokes now on the other end of that ed the defoe character hangs out now with his fellow workers at the post office at a billiards hall, a pool hall.

1:39:57Josh Larsen:And I also felt the depictions of them were a little less lived in as well. And some sequences of confrontation with them felt a little staged. And I just don't know if the movie needed more time to percolate, what it might be. The background here, now Kent Jones wrote the script for Diane. That's not the case here. He's working with a very talented screenwriter, Sammy Birch, who did May, December here adapting an Arthur Schnitzler novella. So clearly talented people at work. It's just, it felt like it needed to marinate a little more until, until I, I experienced something that felt, again, I just keep going back to, to the idea of lived in maybe even, I guess I was thinking, Adam, you know, this group of young artists, they're, they're on the verge of being Wes Anderson caricatures.

1:40:47Josh Larsen:but I think what you always feel when you get those sorts of figures in an Anderson film is the silliness but also a deep warmth for them and for their dreams. And I could see the movie kind of wanted that to be a quality here in late fame, but it didn't quite come through for me. Probably worth mentioning in terms of performance though, Greta Lee as well, who's an actress, an aspiring actress kind of on the fringes of this group. um like defoe who gets a great showcase sequence reading one of his character's original poems at a um a recital that this group sets up she has um a monologue there that's kind of a kind of a showstopper and she gets an earlier piece of performance yeah that's you know musical performance that's pretty incredible too outside of those her character also feels a little you know could have used more deepening but in those sequences of performance man does she pop and as

1:41:47Adam Kempenaar:you said defoe so good throughout it's an honor to meet you mr saxberg thank you of course this is exactly how you would look so here is where he writes not yet but you will again you might think the boys are silly but they have connections i take your point about lee and those two stand out performances are standouts but i didn't know that lee just full disclosure i didn't know that she had that theatricality in her i haven't seen that in her previous work and to see it come out here was was startling in a good way and i think the fact that she is playing such a literally theatrical character, someone who is, who is almost acting like Norma Desmond in every scene in terms of her, her bigness to then have that offset by at least one scene where we, we understand that this is someone who is actually quite wounded and quite vulnerable.

1:42:53Adam Kempenaar:I thought that, that at least added some more depth to that character that, that made me appreciate both That was a good performance and the character more. I do agree with your overall thoughts on, on the broadness of, of the two, the two groups here, the two worlds that he is trying to navigate. Maybe what you said about Myers, the leader and Edmund Donovan, he was someone I felt like I'm not familiar with. Maybe I've seen him in other performances was, was very interested in him as a character. And you can see how that character, and the enthusiasm that he brings for Saksberger's work, how intoxicating that could be.

1:43:37Adam Kempenaar:You said that it kind of does him dirty. Maybe you can clarify that. I don't know what doing him dirty would be because I really appreciated the slipperiness of that character and that ultimately I don't know who he is. And I don't think that's the fault of the screenplay. I don't think that character knows exactly who or what he is. I think he is he is so struggling to figure out what he is, what kind of an artist he is, what success is to him. There is a part of him that is the the real deal in so many ways and an absolute fraud in so many ways. And I think the movie understands that about him.

1:44:20Josh Larsen:Yeah, I guess I didn't find that complicated. I found it simple where he registered as a phony pretty much from the beginning. And there are glimpses here there of where he wants to be something more authentic, but only knows how to fake it. And his final scene is kind of tripling down on his phoniness. And then he just disappears. Yeah. It goes back to the Wes Andersonian warmth. You know, even that character, he's not a villain. But if there was a villain in this movie, in this story, it would probably be him. But even that character, you know, to the points you're making that you picked up on more, these other sides to him, I would like to have seen a warmth towards those desires of his rather than repeated examples of his phoniness.

1:45:12Josh Larsen:Even though there's a great, there's a really funny bit involving a command to Alexa and his character that I thought worked quite well. I got past the phoniness and started to believe him the same way that Ed does.

1:45:30Adam Kempenaar:And I think that's to both Edmund Donovan's credit, but also to Defoe's credit, right? That I started to, and I don't even think it's a matter of succumbing or wanting to believe it too much, though there's that element there without a doubt. There is that part of it because you're seeing it through that that character's eyes through sacksberger's eyes but it's it's also that it's in the performance and it's in the writing to an extent i saw enough conviction in him and i think there is enough conviction inside him there's so much truth in what he's saying but the the fraudulent part of him is there there's a huckster in him and you're right that at the end the the way that the way that character presents himself ultimately i thought push that character too far and you see something similar happen with the enthusiasm society even in its presentation of you know the scene where they're they're telling ed kind of who they all are and the lay of the land and they say over there those are the influencers and yeah that that seemed to me like such a naive way little for lack of a better word of presenting what in I can't imagine that even in New York City, there's actually a group of people who sit around and call themselves or or think of themselves as influencers who sit around at the top of a of a bar with their phones.

1:46:56Adam Kempenaar:And they don't sit around in a group like that.

1:46:59Josh Larsen:Yeah. And what it did exactly what it did is it reflected back on the caricature nature of the enthusiasm society is like. So, yeah, it meant to distinguish them, but it really only mirrored it. um so so yeah that wasn't one of the strong points either i think but again i think we'd both yeah i think we'd both still recommend late fame yeah i'm the strength of the i'll just add that what

1:47:23Adam Kempenaar:you said about melancholy i think is ultimately right where i was thinking more is that there isn't that bitterness in him there isn't that regret in him now but which is interesting yes Yes, but the more he interacts, the more he does think about who he used to be, the more he does think about the life of an artist. I think some of that melancholy, that there is more melancholy in him than he may have thought, that there is more wanting in him. There's more desire. There's more desires in him than he may have previously considered. And so I think that is what makes that character interesting.

1:48:01Adam Kempenaar:And I'm sure when you're talking about his friends and maybe a bit of caricature and how they're portrayed in some of the writing, this is what I would say about Defoe's performance. There's a scene where he interacts with them on the occasion of a birthday for one of those characters. And it gets a little bit overwrought. And I don't think that the line delivery, I don't think that the line that Defoe's character has to say is particularly believable. I think he says something like, you have no idea who you're talking to, which the implication is this is a point where Ed is finally maybe for the first time since he was a young poet in 40, 50 years is feeling himself a little bit.

1:48:56Adam Kempenaar:Right. And his feelings of frustration are believable. It's the way he expresses it via that line are not really believable. And that's all true. but still josh watching it i'm giving defoe enough credit that he says it with enough melancholy he says it with enough layers attached to it it's it's subtle conviction it's not it's not so much force that i almost heard it more like a question than than a pure admonishment it was almost like he was at while he was saying it it was like he was trying to get a grasp on himself it was almost like it was revealing of himself. I have no idea who you're talking to at this point, more than he was really trying to put them in their place.

1:49:44Adam Kempenaar:So that, that, that told me just how in tune I was with Defoe. Yeah.

1:49:49Josh Larsen:That, that's, it was a key scene for me in this notion of the movie needed to simmer some more because so much happened in that scene, whereas I loved what it wanted to do, but I needed Ed to more slowly realize the things that the screenplay was asking him to realize and portray in those three minutes. Now, to your point, Defoe kind of saves the scene, right? But he's coming to realization here, maybe I don't fit in with these guys who've been my friends for the past 20 years and my coworkers as well as I thought. And that's one of the things the screenplay wants him to realize during this one confrontation at the birthday party, when in reality, like it would have been a long time, many more scenes of this to be a developing awareness.

1:50:44Josh Larsen:You know, it's a movie. We only have what? 90 to two hours, 90 minutes to two hours, but in a movie as thoughtful and as quiet and as patient as this, it's a bit jarring when those sorts of realizations are expected to happen quickly in one scene.

1:50:59Adam Kempenaar:Yeah, I think I think that's exactly right. And I will just give it credit, though, for me, the milieu, New York in the fall artists, all that intellectual discussion, the conflict of it being all of the quiet variety that it is. There's no major drama here. Yeah, it it was for me, at least for the first 45 minutes, it was all just catnip. This This was such a movie I felt like I hadn't seen in a long time, and I was really enjoying it.

1:51:28Josh Larsen:I love that it's either, I mean, I would guess it feels from the way people are moving through the city like February. You know, they've got their coats on and they've been on for months. And the hat is just what Defoe, you know, that sailor cap is what you do now. And I love that sort of it's somehow romantic without being movie New York romantic. That's it. Yeah.

1:51:54Adam Kempenaar:I would fall, but it's not fall like leaves are falling. It's not that romantic New York portrayal. It's colder. Late Fame is out now in limited release. We'd love to hear your thoughts about it. If you've seen it, feedback at filmspotting.net.

1:52:10Josh Larsen:Amazon Health AI presents Painful Thoughts. I, um, I can't stop scratching my downtown.

1:52:18Adam Kempenaar:Yeah, but I'm not itching to go downtown and tell a receptionist I'm here to talk about my downtown. Some things you'd rather type than say out loud.

1:52:29Josh Larsen:There's no question too embarrassing for Amazon Health AI. Chat your symptoms and get virtual care 24-7. Healthcare just got less painful. How's the new plays? Get your Wi-Fi figured out? I got T-Mobile 5G home internet and I'm loving it. It's the fastest 5G home internet. My old provider was so slow. Mine is slow. And only 35 bucks a month. Do I need to try this? Try it for 15 days. Love it or get your money back. I love it already. There are over 250 reasons to join T-Mobile. Find yours and check availability at t-mobile.com slash home internet. This is according to Oculus Speed Test Intelligence.

1:53:06Josh Larsen:Date a second half of 2025. All rates reserved for T-Mobile. That's a good one back guarantee within 30 days of cancellation. NYX, that's K-N-I-X, leak-proof underwear is made for real life because when your day is already full, your underwear shouldn't be something you have to think about. NYX gives you reliable leak-proof protection that fits seamlessly into your routine for periods, for light bladder leaks, for workouts, for everyday freshness. NYX leak-proof underwear comes in a range of absorbencies from light to ultra. So if you need a little backup or all-day protection, there's a pair for you.

1:53:38Josh Larsen:Unlike bulky protection, NYX feels barely there with soft fabrics, moisture-wicking layers, and anti-odor technology that keeps you feeling fresh and confident. Wear them to work, running errands, traveling, even overnight. Plus, they're machine washable, so you can wear them again and again. Find your perfect level of protection at knix.com and get 15 % off with code FLOW15. That's knix.com, code FLOW15. That's knix.com. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle.

1:54:19Josh Larsen:I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinheiro and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word Solita, trading the pity for possibility. Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people and they were like, you smiled at us. Not a lot of people smile around here. It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip, I hope you listen to Solita on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

1:55:08Adam Kempenaar:I wanted to take a moment, Josh, to talk about an opportunity that Sam and I had just this past week where we got an email fairly out of the blue from a Netflix rep, someone who we've known for a while who does PR for Netflix. Actually, someone, David Guozo, who has been a longtime listener of this show, who knows that I'm located in Iowa and said, you know, the Twins and Phillies are playing. MLB has done a couple of games here at the Field of Dreams, which is in Dyersville, maybe an hour and a half from where I'm located. And they said, Twins and Phillies are playing in about a week. Would you be interested in coming to the game?

1:55:55Adam Kempenaar:And I said, well, yeah, of course I'm interested in coming to the game. I, I like baseball. I grew up on baseball. I love the movie field of dreams. I have only been to the field of dreams once, but it was a pretty great experience when Sarah took me for a milestone birthday fairly recently. I said, the only thing is I got to, I got to bring my producer. Can Sam come? And they said, they said no problem. so sam and i are pretty excited but josh we don't realize until the night before when we get our tickets that we're sitting right behind home plate we're sitting in the second row right behind home plate big way so we we had the opportunity to to not only go and spend a few hours at the field of dreams where it's one of those movie sets where you get to get to actually just walk around the field is the movie set and you get to sit on the benches just like they do in the movie scenes you get to walk up to the house you get to go to the pitcher's mound and the batter's box and do the whole thing you get to walk into the corn and all that stuff but then you get to walk through the corn and walk over this new field that they've constructed just for this game okay and sit down in this small little stadium that only holds 8 000 people and we get to sit there i've never had seats that good for a major league baseball game or any baseball game other than maybe little league and we got to sit there and it was fascinating because we even had one listener josh who didn't know about us going to this game but just happened to be watching the game on netflix and sent me a note on facebook and was like i see you on netflix right now didn't recognize sam because he had his glasses on and a hat on but did recognize me sitting there in the second row So it really was a great time, just being able to hang out with Sam for a couple hours, sit at the ballpark, watch a great game.

1:57:50Adam Kempenaar:The Phillies kind of crushed the Twins 7-1. Schwarber hit at least two home runs. Did he hit three? I need to look back at the box score. He hit at least two home runs, including a leadoff home run right into the corn.

1:58:04Josh Larsen:Schwarber with a shout-out to the corn in right. Keisha back, and it's gone! What a way to open the ballgame!

1:58:12Adam Kempenaar:we had a great time. So I have to thank, I have to thank David Ross lip Schultz at, at Netflix, Corey Rosen. They, they all made this happen for us and it's, it's an experience we'll never forget.

1:58:24Josh Larsen:I'm glad you guys got it in because I know whether, you know, as it was across the Midwest last week, um, whether it was dicey and there was a question you might not be able to make it. So yeah, how about that?

1:58:35Adam Kempenaar:We woke up that morning, as you, you know, we had a film spotting production meeting that morning and the forecast was so bad sam and i were talking about how this is going to get called off right like maybe we shouldn't even drive there because it was it was rain all day and it looked like into the night too and we got nothing it stopped it it stopped at like noon and never started again and the game happened and it was beautiful so thanks again to everyone who made that happen. And if you do want to stare at Sam and I, as we watch a baseball game and occasionally eat concession food, you can do that.

1:59:11Adam Kempenaar:The games, the games available to stream on Netflix. It's very weird having to be self-conscious when you watch a baseball game, knowing that your friends and family are watching the game and watching you and everything.

1:59:24Josh Larsen:Sam, Sam played it right though. I like that he has a disguise for, he's so famous now as film spotting producer he goes out he has to do the baseball cap and sunglasses there you go some

1:59:35Adam Kempenaar:other business we wanted to take care of recently in the film spotting feed we have really enjoyed showcasing some other shows that are part of our inflection network and we have recently partnered with a show called table read that is a great show and you'll understand why as you hear a little bit about the show and as you hear some of those shows josh the show is such a good fit with film spotting that we're actually going to be showcasing them over the next four weeks so film spotting listeners every saturday or sunday are going to get a table read show in the film spotting feed so we thought why not have the guys from table read and the show title tells you a little bit gives you an idea what the show is like and what the content is about we thought why not give our listeners a little bit of a sense of what the show is, who the people are behind it, why we're featuring it in the film spotting feed.

2:00:36Adam Kempenaar:And that's what we're going to do now. I taped a little conversation with the three executive producers of Table Read, and we would like to bring that to you now. All right. I'm very pleased to be joined now by the executive producers of Table Read, Sean Sharma, Mark Nell, Jack Levy. Table Read, a podcast that we're excited to be partnering with. Film Spotting listeners are going to be getting Table Read in their feed here over the next few weeks. The podcast is Webby nominated, Shorty nominated, an iHeart Podcast Awards nominee, just tons of accolades that I'm sure we will touch on here as we talk to Mark, Jack, and Sean.

2:01:20Adam Kempenaar:And I actually want to start with you, Sean, because I'd love to share with our audience the origin story. How did Table Read come about? Yeah, thank you. And we're Webby winners, not just nominees. Webby winners.

2:01:33Josh Larsen:We won the Best Fiction last year, which was just amazing. My apologies. No, no. It's an honor to be nominated and having won. But the story just comes to the fact that I got involved in SAG-AFTRA leadership and volunteerism back around 2015. And in 2016, I was sitting around with some of my co-leaders there saying, how do we work more with our

2:01:55Adam Kempenaar:partners in filmmaking, especially the writers at the Writers Guild? Because there's so many great scripts that have not been brought to life. It's easy for us to bring actors together to read those scripts. And then we get to enjoy that experience with each other. So we started doing table reads. It started doing them in person, especially at the American Film Institute in North Hollywood here. And we started working with The Blacklist, with eventually Coverfly, with the Writers Guild members, the Writers Guild Foundation. And Jack would start coming to attend some of those table reads. He was just so interested and loved what we were doing and

2:02:32Josh Larsen:our brains were starting to turn on about how we can do something together with this.

2:02:36Adam Kempenaar:And we started pitching like a TV show idea we were excited about that was kind of like the Hollywood Reporter roundtable with all the actors sitting around in a circle and having a conversation. And then the pandemic struck and that kind of put a pin in that conversation.

2:02:52Josh Larsen:And then Jack was getting all kinds of offers to help like Universal and other studios kind of build their podcast departments. And he's like, why don't we do it as a podcast? So that's when he reached out to Mark and we started taking

2:03:04Adam Kempenaar:some of our favorite scripts and bringing them into a studio with the actors sitting in a circle all mic'd up. And we would have an incredible read. We would deck out the space like we did with the in-person reads. And then, you know, Jack would go to town with his team to produce all the audio after the recording with sound effects and music and all this stuff.

2:03:24Josh Larsen:So it sounds like you're listening to a movie. But as Jack says so brilliantly, it combines the best aspects of live performance, like seeing theater or something with the polish of a major Hollywood studio with

2:03:35Adam Kempenaar:somebody who's won an Emmy for his work. So that's kind of where it came from, just a passion for stories. And, you know, the one thing I like to point out is that the table read is the one time that the writer's writing is done kind of purely without being changed, because as soon as they sell it to a studio, they're out of the mix. As soon as you get it produced and edited, it's going to be changed during production and editing. So table reads are such a gift because it's the purest expression of what that writer wrote. And we wouldn't have any of the movies or TV shows

2:04:08Josh Larsen:we love without the writers. So it started as a love letter to them, and it's just become such a gift.

2:04:15Adam Kempenaar:Quick follow-up, Sean. How are the writers then typically involved in the table read taping? Well, when we started doing them, we just said, you know, hey, just, you know, we would love to do a table read of your script, or the Writers Guild would just bring us a script or, you know, the blacklist would just bring us a script. And then we would just go to town. We would, you know, highlight the scripts for all the actors, cast the actors. We would have table tents and food inspired by the script. So if there's lasagna in the script, we'd have lasagna at the reading. We'd deck out the room. We'd have trailers on the TV.

2:04:45Adam Kempenaar:We'd have, we just

2:04:46Josh Larsen:went, we even had a deal with the prop house in LA to have professional movie props on the table for people to get inspired by. So it became kind of like a planet Hollywood or like a rainforest cafe of the writer's vision. And they would walk in just given a time and a date and they'd be like, who are you people? How are you doing all of this for me, for a stranger, for free? And so we never asked them to do anything

2:05:11Adam Kempenaar:other than come and just be celebrated. Jack, this show, as we heard, Webby winning number one on Apple Podcasts, US Fiction Chart. So clearly you've had a lot of success. What would you say is the secret sauce? What, what is contributed to the success of this show?

2:05:32Josh Larsen:It's the same thing that contributes to the success of your show. We, we start with great stories, right? Great storytelling. And that's, and that's unobstructed. It's like the most altruistic musician is all about the music. They're not about the marketing. They're not about how much they sell each record for. Right. So, you know, we are all inside the Hollywood garden and we all see amazing scripts every day. We've all been sent scripts by the studios that for some reason don't get made. And you think, what happened to that brilliant piece of IP I read? So it starts with the story, but the real secret sauce is the community.

2:06:04Josh Larsen:You know, people who come to Los Angeles to be in film, to be in music, they love making independent films. They love going into the studio and recording records. And that's not about the business of Hollywood. That's about the creative of Hollywood. And literally, we have the finest of every trade, writers, actors, musicians, post-production people, right? And we deliver the secret sauces. We deliver award-winning trades. I mean, literally, we've had Tony winners, Grammy winners, Emmy winners. We've had everyone on our show, multiple Oscar nominees. The only thing we don't have is the studio.

2:06:43Josh Larsen:So it's the very best part of Hollywood. And listen, the worst part of the movie business is the business part. People love making films. So it's the community. And who shows up? And by the way, it's not just the celebrity element. You know, working professionals, writers with scores of scripts, people who've been in the writer's room but never been featured. You know, the most award-winning scripts that have never been made. We do those. But at the same time, you know, we've worked with Anonymous Content and Scooter Braun and Tom Holland. And I'll tell you something that Sean doesn't know. Just yesterday, I got a script from Paul Schrader.

2:07:18Josh Larsen:Wow. Wow. An unproduced script written in 1978 from the guy who wrote a taxi driver, American gigolo. I mean, I mean, come on, raging bull. And, you know, he wrote such a gracious letter about the show. So, you know, that's fantastic.

2:07:34Adam Kempenaar:A one time, a one time guest here on Film Spotting. That was at first a very intimidating interview, and then he was kind of a teddy bear to talk to. So it was lovely.

2:07:43Josh Larsen:As I said, it's about community. You know, it's no different than Slash having a jam session at his house. Everyone who shows up shows up without the pretense because they love the art. Every time we do a table read, everyone Sean fills that room with. It does not matter if they're just getting started or they have a shelf full of statues. There is zero ego. When you show up on a set, Adam, there is always ego because there's agents and who's getting paid more and why didn't my lines come in right? None of that happens. And I think that translates to the content. People have a great time and it translates to the energy of the read we do, which translates to the 30 awards we've won.

2:08:20Josh Larsen:Absolutely. Quick little thing. Like we all geeked out. I've been on a show for the last eight years called The Chosen. And when Paul wrote a post about how much he loved our show, we all were just like wowed because we have so much reverence for him. So that's super cool, Jack, to get that. Oh, I'm going to pay him on that today. I'm going to send him a note. He's going to love that tie in. And I'm telling you, I mean, as you know, he's a community guy. I think most of the top people are coming. They put up with the business because they have to. It's nothing that they like. Yeah.

2:08:51Adam Kempenaar:So, Mark, we have a lot of aspiring writers and current writers in our audience. So I think they're really going to enjoy if they're not already familiar with your show, getting familiar with your show. And I'd love to give them some starting points. So can you share with them a favorite episode of yours and also also give them some context on the first episode that we're going to drop into our feed for them? I believe it's called Suburbanite Act One. Yeah. Well, I'll give you two of my favorites. And, you know, it's hard. It's you know, I have four children and eight grandchildren. And if I had to pick a favorite, I probably could.

2:09:30Adam Kempenaar:But I couldn't say it out loud.

2:09:32Josh Larsen:but Dream World is one of my favorites written by Sonny Postiglione the lead in that in that one is one of the faces that you see right here on the screen and it's just it's such a wonderful script with characters that we all love that we all grew up with

2:09:50Adam Kempenaar:you know little Bo Peep and Jack and the Beanstalk but they're all twisted in a really really wonderful way and it's a really it's an adventure And it's so cool. The other one that I really love came to us through Ty Burrell's production company. It's called Peavy and Franny, written by Tommy Wallach.

2:10:10Josh Larsen:And actually, Ty handles the narration of that script. Fred Armisen was attached to it. So Fred came in and read with us. And the amazing Kensington Tallman, who is just such an amazing actor. She and Liam Richardson read lead for that script. Both just did such a great job. So Dream World and PB and Franny really hold a special place in my heart.

2:10:38Adam Kempenaar:Suburbanite is super fun. Jim O 'Hare, Jade Taylor, Darren Tunder, Rob Fitzgerald, who just did such a great job. And then two of our really our biggest supporters, Ashley Platts and Zeke Alton, helped fill out that. And the short is that there's a sex demon that moves into a quiet neighborhood. And Jim O 'Hare plays Walter Knope, kind of a bankrupt antique salesman. And he's forced to enlist the help of Rob's character, who is a B-movie horror host, to kind of save things.

2:11:17Josh Larsen:So that's written by Nick Bannister. It is so freaking funny. It's just terrific. I think this is, what, the third script that Jim did with us and probably the fourth or fifth that Darren Tunder has done with us. And that's what makes this so special is we've kind of created this community of actors who really not just enjoy doing what they do, but enjoy kind of what has been created. And, you know, I will say that we created it in a sense, but they all created it, right? Their willingness to come into this room and just enjoy themselves. One of the things that we say is that we kind of lean on the imperfection of what a table read is.

2:12:04Josh Larsen:So when people listen, they'll hear a fourth wall break that will sometimes leave in. I think I've only taken a couple of them out. One was during a very, very emotional scene. Sean got the giggles. And I took the one out because I'm like, oh, my gosh, we can't leave that in there. You will not let me live that down. He will not. But it really is. It's, you know, what has been created, you know, yes, the three of us started it.

2:12:36Adam Kempenaar:But but what has been created is this just this movement of really wonderful, talented people who want to come in and really do have such a good time in the room. And that's what kind of I think makes it a bit different than some of the other things. Well, we are thrilled to hopefully not just be part of a network together with you, but be part of a community with you now. And I thank you so much for jumping on and sharing your story with us. Thank you.

2:13:07Josh Larsen:Thank you, Adam. Well, thanks to Mark, Jack and Sean for giving some time there to talk about Table Read. As Adam said, you will be getting some episodes the next few weeks in your film spotting feed. If you'd like to go ahead and subscribe to Table Read, just go ahead and do that wherever you listen to podcasts. Amazon Health AI presents Painful Thoughts. I, um, I can't stop scratching my downtown.

2:13:35Adam Kempenaar:Yeah, but I'm not itching to go downtown and tell a receptionist I'm here to talk about my downtown. Some things you'd rather type than say out loud.

2:13:46Josh Larsen:There's no question too embarrassing for Amazon Health AI. Chat your symptoms and get virtual care 24-7. Healthcare just got less painful. How's the new place? Get your Wi-Fi figured out? I got T-Mobile 5G home internet and I'm loving it. It's the fastest 5G home internet. My old provider was so slow. Mine is slow. And only 35 bucks a month. Do I need to try this? Try it for 15 days. Love it or get your money back. I love it already. There are over 250 reasons to join T-Mobile. Find yours and check availability at t-mobile.com slash home internet. This is according to Oculus B test intelligence data.

2:14:23Josh Larsen:Second half of 2025. All rates reserved for T-Mobile. Back guarantee within 30 days of cancellation. NYX, that's K-N-I-X, leak-proof underwear is made for real life because when your day is already full, your underwear shouldn't be something you have to think about. NYX gives you reliable leak-proof protection that fits seamlessly into your routine. For periods, for light bladder leaks, for workouts, for everyday freshness. NYX leak-proof underwear comes in a range of absorbencies, from light to ultra. So if you need a little backup or all-day protection, there's a pair for you. Unlike bulky protection, NYX feels barely there with soft fabrics, moisture-wicking layers, and anti-odor technology that keeps you feeling fresh and confident.

2:15:05Josh Larsen:Wear them to work, running errands, traveling, even overnight. Plus, they're machine washable, so you can wear them again and again. Find your perfect level of protection at knix.com and get 15 % off with code FLOW15. That's knix.com, code FLOW15. That's knix.com. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinheiro and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word Solita, trading the pity for possibility.

2:15:52Josh Larsen:Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people and they were like, you smiled at us. Not a lot of people smile around here. It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip. I hope you listen to Solita on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Time now for Massacre Theater, where Adam and I perform a scene and you get a chance to win a film spotting prize.

2:16:32Josh Larsen:Last time we massacred this scene. What's the torch for? 2 ,000 degrees, Mick. Enough to turn steel into butter.

2:16:47Josh Larsen:won't hurt at first. It's too hot, you see. The flame sears the nerve in it shut, killing them. You go into shock and all your feels cold. That was Thomas Jane with Eddie Jemison in 2004's The Punisher, written by Jonathan Hensley and Michael France, directed by Hensley. that massacre was part of our Spider-Man brand new day show. So why that scene from the Punisher?

2:17:19Adam Kempenaar:Here is Pavla Masik in Toronto. This one was instantly recognizable for me, even though I have not seen this movie in nearly 20 years. And yes, I did return to it to watch the director's cut, not only because of the amazing rendition of Tom Jane's Punisher by Adam, but also because it is one of the three good scenes in the movie. The others being Harry Hex song and the fight with the Russian Who could forget? Howard Hawks would not have liked this one. It has at least three good scenes, I remember, but at least a few bad ones. But my bar for a good movie is lower than great filmmakers. Adam, you should squeeze it in.

2:17:54Adam Kempenaar:Roy Scheider is in it. I don't know if that's enough. Totally forgot that. The obvious connection is that John Bernthal's rendition of the Punisher character appears in Spider-Man Brand New Day. But where is the fun in sticking to the obvious connection? The Punisher connection itself goes a little deeper. The Punisher 2004 was directed by Jonathan Hensley, who also directed the late and talented Ray Stevenson as the Punisher in Lexi Alexander's Punisher Warzone, which also had three good scenes, but more than a few bad ones. Adam, maybe a double bill? Sure. That sounds torturous.

2:18:26Josh Larsen:But wait, Pavla has more. The Punisher also connects to everybody to Kenmure Street. The Punisher 2004 features John Travolta as its main villain, who starred in primary colors alongside Emma Thompson, who, of course, appears in Kenmere Street. I scratched my head to connect The Punisher to The Samurai and The Prisoner, but here goes. Kiyoshi Kurosawa directed Daguerreotype, which I was lucky enough to catch at TIFF, starring Tahar Rahim, who did appear in Madame Web, perhaps the worst Spider-Man or at least Spider-Man adjacent film to date. to Harahim also starred as a titular character in the Mauritianian.

2:19:07Josh Larsen:Mauritanian. Yes. Pavla's really putting me through it here. Mauritanian co-starring Benedict Cumberbatch, a.k.a. Doctor Strange, who has shared the screen with Tom Holland's web slinger. Got through all of those. Thank you, Pavla, for all that.

2:19:23Adam Kempenaar:Jackson Goldberg was able to do what Pavla wasn't. In the interest of variety, I guess you could say this scene finds Punisher extracting information from a shackled hostage via unexpected means, like how Murashiga does in The Samurai and the Prisoner, kinda. Also, Punisher's last name is Castle, a thing Japan had in abundance back then. I know I'm reaching here. Alas, I don't think they had popsicles in feudal Japan.

2:19:50Josh Larsen:We also heard from Eric Jensen in New Jersey, winning life as a viewer of Thomas Jane's The Punisher. Obviously related, Spider-Man Brand New Day, as both feature actors named Tom playing the titular superhero suffering from the loss of those closest to them. There's also the clear tie-in of Punisher's roommates being played by actors Rebecca Roman, Mystique, and Ben Foster, Angel, who may or may not play a role in characters introduced in future MCU movies. If it's not one of those two reasons, I'm not sure why you'd choose the Punisher unless you wanted more people to be aware of John Travolta's historic early 2000s run that included Battlefield Earth, sword swordfish yikes and film spotting's first ever review be cool lastly adam you nailed the coolness nailed it thomas jane oozed in the 90s 2000s yeah wow oozed it sounds like an infection

2:20:43Adam Kempenaar:jeremiah conway says i would like to note that the reason i am not a winner is not because i've seen the film i haven't but because i recognize the scene from its comic book inspiration Punisher Warzone number one. God help me, I'm a 48-year-old man with a teenage son and who teaches high school and am therefore trusted with the safety and well-being of about 100 kids a day. And yet I remembered that scene instantly. The joke is that he's holding a popsicle to the guy's back and blowtorching a hunk of meat or something. This is why I'm not a winner.

2:21:14Josh Larsen:Don't be so hard on yourself, Jeremiah. A final comment from Josh Stolberg. Adam and Josh's performances hurt my ears more than being tortured by Frank Castle in The Punisher, which is where the scene comes from. And while most will claim the connection is Frank Castle appearing in Brand New Day, I'm certain they picked The Punisher because Brand New Day was shot almost entirely in Glasgow. And everybody to Kenmure Street focuses on Glasgow's Pollock Shields protest. Deep pull there, Josh. How about that? I had no idea.

2:21:45Adam Kempenaar:There's no way.

2:21:45Josh Larsen:It was all the rage when we first arrived in Scotland because I think they wrapped up possibly last summer. Yeah, Glasgow doubling for New York City. All right. Thank you.

2:21:57Adam Kempenaar:Thank you, everybody, for all the deep cuts there. All the great feedback on Massacre Theater, even though there seems to be some disagreement about the spectacularness of my performance. Josh, reach into the film spotting hat and pick out this week's winner.

2:22:11Josh Larsen:our winner is a familiar name family member julio olivera from austin texas i don't think julio has

2:22:17Adam Kempenaar:won before which seems crazy congratulations julio i know you don't need the trial membership to the film spotting family maybe you need a new film spotting t-shirt or a tote bag email feedback at film spotting.net and we will hook you up with the detours so simple

2:22:35Josh Larsen:would the detours so simple would the detours so simple would the detours so simple my dear boy

2:22:41Adam Kempenaar:why do you say that why do you say twer well you say it like i said we move on now to this terrible accent edition of massacre theater we have definitely done this film before i can't believe we have never done this scene before i am positive i'm i'm almost positive we've played this scene as part of a top five. And I think a lot of people are going to get it whether they've seen this movie or not. So I'm happy with this choice.

2:23:07Josh Larsen:Do you remember, did this movie take a lot of heat for the accents in it? I don't remember. When it came out, I remember it being widely beloved. Yeah. I don't know if enough people saw it to get mad about it. Yeah. I guess it wasn't initially a hit, but I feel like it grew and people do love this movie. We're both fans, But I got to say, in my deep research, which involved watching the scene just now, I don't know how they weren't made fun of for these accents. Well, I mean, I don't think you and I have to do a lot of hamming it up here. We just just got to play what we saw.

2:23:42Adam Kempenaar:There's some heritage there, at least with one of the actors, for sure. So they can get away with it, can't they? It doesn't get away with it. It doesn't always mean it's good. That is true. So we'll see what we can get away with or if we'll set back diplomatic relations a hundred years. I started off. You're going to give me the action. How do I get into character here? I don't know. I'm playing the serious scold. I don't know how I'll ever do it. Yep. I think you'll be all right. Okay, here we go. And action. Please just come on. I want to know for who. Just make the side order of spaghetti, please.

2:24:22Adam Kempenaar:I want to know for who is it for? For the lady with the risotto. What? Why? She likes starch. I don't know. Come on! I'll make it myself. Da! Who are these people in America? I need to talk to her. Oh, please. What are you going to do? Tell the customer what she can eat, huh? That's what she wants. This is what the customer asked for. Make it. Make the pasta. Make it. make it make of the pasta come on let's go and and a scene i'll tell you what did set back

2:25:00Josh Larsen:diplomatic relations the hand gestures we both chose to use you have to unplanned you have to and probably deeply inappropriate you you can't do the scene without him wow okay you know what

2:25:13Adam Kempenaar:film we just massacred email the movie's title your name and your location send them to feedback at filmspotting.net. The deadline is Monday, August 31st. We will select the winner randomly from all the correct entries and announce it in a couple of weeks. I feel like I might order risotto and spaghetti.

2:25:32Josh Larsen:Sure. I might. Always a good choice. That's the show, Josh. Yeah, I think we need to get out of here. Find Adam and the show on Instagram, Facebook, and Letterboxd, YouTube Blue Sky as well at filmspotting. I'm at those places, Larson on Film. We are independently produced and listener supported. You can support the show by joining the Film Spotting family at filmspottingfamily.com. You can listen early and ad-free. You'll get monthly bonus episodes, a weekly newsletter, and access to the entire show archive. For show t-shirts and other merch, go to filmspotting.net slash shop.

2:26:06Adam Kempenaar:Next week in the Film Spotting feed, the Movie Racket with Michael Phillips will be examining this question about scoring music. music michael's beloved topic yeah how much is how much is too much it's going to be a fun show tuesday film spotting svu they're looking at the high school theater dramedy don't say good luck it's got sunny sandler melanie linsky steve buscemi julia hart who made fast color and i'm your woman directs sam van holgren has seen it he says good movie exclamation point put it on the poster he says especially for musical theater families and he would know i was just going to

2:26:45Josh Larsen:ask surely i mean they should have given sam early access to this one it's so up his alley thursday the next picture show has a new pairing clearly similar mindset to me with the end of oak

2:26:57Adam Kempenaar:street and so many others david robert mitchell's the end of oak street and steven spielberg's the

2:27:02Josh Larsen:war of the worlds back to spielberg for them and war of the worlds i'm gonna say i've got as you know, second tier Spielberg, maybe third. Yeah, it's a good one. It's a really good one for me. And it's definitely it's better than the end of Oak Street. I'll say that. Okay, we disagree, but we'll save that for another time.

2:27:24Adam Kempenaar:Friday on film spotting. I'm putting an asterisk here because as of this taping, we don't have it scheduled, but it is penciled in. We are hoping to do our top five needle drops with Rico Galliano from the movie podcast. They just concluded taping and have put out their series about the best needle drops in movie history. So we thought we'd have him on and explore that topic with him. All right.

2:27:51Josh Larsen:Hope that works out. Film spotting is produced by Golden Joe Dessau and Sam Van Hagen. Without Sam and Golden Joe, this show wouldn't go. Our production assistant is Sophie Kempinar. Special thanks to everyone at WBEZ Chicago. More information is available at WBEZ.org. For Film Spotting, I'm Josh Larson. And I'm Adam Kempinar. Thanks for listening.

2:28:11Adam Kempenaar:This conversation can serve no purpose anymore. Goodbye.

2:28:43Adam Kempenaar:We'll see you next time. in control, giving direction and choosing the final output. Put ChatGPT to work on your most ambitious ideas and projects. Get started at ChatGPT.com by selecting work mode. Available on Plus and Pro plans.

2:28:58Josh Larsen:We learned how to love dogs from the dogs that loved us and waited for us to get home from school. They were the dogs that raised us. We returned the love with Pedigree dog food. It was good then and it's better now. Every bowl has 100 % complete nutrition, supporting six health essentials. And now it includes vitamin good bites, a nutrient boost your dog will love. Pedigree. Good then. Better now. Whether it's help with hormone therapy, weight management, or sexual health, every woman should have access to affordable prescription medication and personalized care that understands the whole woman.

2:29:38Josh Larsen:Join me, Dr. Doug Lucas, clinical lead of hormone optimization and longevity at LifeMD, along with other leading experts on the podcast, Here's Something Good on Women's Health and Longevity. To learn more, go to LifeMD.com slash iHeart. Skincare means Sephora. Makeup, same. They've got the products, expertise, and the brands that fit your lifestyle. But when I talk about hair care, do you make the same connection? Well, you should. Sephora is just as trusted for hair whether you're looking to repair, strengthen, hydrate, or add shine. You'll find brands like Kerastase, K18, and Gisu. Plus, the guidance that helped you choose what's right for your hair.

2:30:20Josh Larsen:And with free shipping and same-day delivery, great hair care is easier than ever. Shop hair at Sephora today.