A Dirty Protest Without A Cause (with Vittorio Angelone!) | IRA Hunger Strikes (Part 2)

24:46so lashings and lashings of ginger beer so some prisoners that are already in prison they don't like having their uh being made to wear uniforms and they uh kill six prison staff over the course of 1976 so uh yeah it's not not funny no i mean how are they doing that is what i want to know Is it shanky? Is it sharpening toothbrushes? Shanky, shanky. Yeah. Well, yeah, they were still allowed their own clothes. And maybe he was like, no, this is my knife necklace. Yeah. Swally and Zeph in the toilet. So what they then do in 1976 as a response to their special, not being able to wear their special jumper, being taken away.

25:29Is this what the paramilitary Olympics? Yeah. The Paralympics is because they all have special status. Yes, I suppose so. Paramilitary. It's confusing it's called paramilitary, isn't it? And paratroopers. It makes you think they're all sort of disabled. Yes. Do you ever think the Invictus Games only exists for ex-veterans who weren't good enough to make the Paralympics? We've talked about this. Special Olympics, Charlie would qualify. Special Olympics is like Down syndrome and things like that? Of the mind. If Charlie lost a leg in a bus accident, it'd be Paralympics. if he lost a leg from an IUD in Afghanistan, it would be Invictus.

26:06But if you were better, you would go for the Paralympics. I think you can go for both. The times? You have to have served. I don't know if they're getting loads of calls. You have to have served to get into the Invictus Games. Does the leg blowing off have to have happened in active duty? I don't, maybe not. Can you just separately have like... Can you come back with all your legs and then walk from the bus, fall down the stairs. Fall down the stairs and get your leg amputated? It was a terrible fall. Charlie, what have you Googled? Tell the listeners. Does piles qualify for the Paralympics? I do not qualify as a Paralympic athlete.

26:38Apparently autism might. Because I was trying to figure out if I can get a blue badge. It's a fucking con. I can see you winning the Paralympics. That would be amazing. I was talking to somebody who their daughter is like entering like youth Paralympic stuff and it's because of the anxiety and also the stress. She's a swimmer and she would never do a false start. She's always like last to dive in because she would never want it. That would stress her out too much But I do like the idea that they all have that problem and they all just like the buzzer goes off and they all just Yes individuals with autism can qualify for the Special Olympics if they also have an a company just have to have something else Yeah, that's like saying people with brown hair can Does persistent genital arousal disorder qualify for this special?

27:23We've talked about came his dad's funeral the guy 70 times a day well that probably should in all seriousness I'd watch I'd watch the Special Olympics but that is a that's a if you're if you're trying to stay on track 100 metres the gun goes on it always comes first yeah they're all winners really come on take some notes Charlie in the Special Olympics they are all winners anyway so because they want to wear their special jumpers and and see their mates yeah and they don't want to work in the library and all this stuff right they start this blanket protest. So this is where... It's a blanket protest.

28:00It's not in that sense. No, no, no. It's an actual blanket. Actual blanket. They start wearing prison uniforms. It's not a protest of everything. It's just a blanket. No, no, it's not. They had a big duvet day. It's a blank... It is a big duvet day. It's a blanket blanket protest. Yeah, it's very cute, these guys, aren't they? They want to hang out with their friends. It's about to get less cute. It's the seep over, you know, let's take our blankets. It's about to get less cute. Okay. Let's smear our pool on the walls. It's so cute. Colour vibes. um so in 1976 the first prisoner who has been sentenced under the new regime without the special case status he arrives in may's prison a guy called kieran nugent who was an ira volunteer you know he does charity work convicted of hijacking a bus of his own accord he had a tabard on god bless him good samaritan kieran nugent refuses to wear the uniform that he's now told to saying he's a political prisoner uh and he then says you've got to be joking i'm not wearing a uniform.

28:56I lay on the floor all night without mattress blankets or anything else. And on his second day, he's given a blanket, which he then wears, what, with his pants? Is he wearing pants? Captain Underpants sort of thing. I think it's pants and like a cape. Like a toddler who's a superhero in the summer. He's wearing pants and a cape. I'm Superman! There he is. Making little flip cartoons. Yeah, I don't remember that one. Captain Underpants age block. Captain Underpants tried to hijack a bus. Captain Underpants did Bloody Sunday. Right. So he's wearing a blanket, which is why it's called a blanket protest.

29:33So he's wearing a blanket. And they were known as the Blanket Men, weren't they? The Blanket Men. So more people join the protest, they get called the Blanket Men. They're wearing it during exercise, but this is later prohibited. And then I think there were like marches in Belfast of people who would just like wear blankets to sort of support the Blanket Protest. Yeah. And so every two weeks, the governor of May's prison, where is maize prison is it in belfast uh i think just outside but i think i could be wrong about that so uh he's ordering compliance and uh the refusal of wearing clothes would lead to three days on the boards which means you have to just lie on the floor there's no furniture in the cells uh you have yet put on the number one diet number one diet it's just not a turkish um number one chicken my friend not a turkish weight loss clinic number one diet very very good very on, um, tea without milk, watery soup and dry bread.

30:25Interesting. It's interesting. It's like there's something that does connect. It's the love of tea. The Catholic Protestants where they all love tea with milk. So it's interesting that's like a war crime here. Tea without milk, flat bread. It's Turkish. It is Turkish. My friend, number one. Number one, my friend, um, black tea. No, no thanks. No thanks. I love it for an Irishman. That is please let me out let me out give me milk give me milk give me milk or give me death so prisoners are entitled to four visits per month uh and then so three are conditional on behavior and one is like your statutory right as a prisoner but if you're protesting if you're wearing a blanket you get even the statutory one you get scrapped yeah so they're not allowed visitors uh and then then for months the only outside contact is one censored letter in and out per month until some agree to wear uniforms during visits to maintain links with paramilitary people outside.

31:18So, and people with the past messages into them via smooching. Oh, really? Go on. We women like their wives would have like little messages stored up by like, you know, like one of those nicotine pouches people have. Yeah. Or Zinn or whatever. And they would sort of smooch them across. But you'd have to like tongue them in, wouldn't you? Yeah. It's pretty sexy. Yeah, you would. But a blokes doing that. no no no the wives sometimes you had to sometimes you had to ir gay yeah ir gay sometimes there'd be no message and you'd be looking for that message maybe it's in trousers maybe it's in shroud no i'm sure there's a message in here turn around

32:03um anyway i'm talking about a dirty protest come on this the relations between the staff often the prisoners are tense. Okay. Because there is an IRA assassination campaign against prison officers. Yeah, that would be tense. It wouldn't make things tense. Yeah, it's awkward. So the IRA shot prison officer Patrick Dillon in April 1976, and he was the first of 19 prison officers killed during the Blanket Men protests. So in March 78, some prisoners refused to leave cells to shower or use toilets after alleged assaults by officers. So Charlie, are you protesting at the moment? Or it seems to be very...

32:37I always use the toilet. Right. For everything. For everything. So let's just, can we just talk about what is in a cell? What's in a cell in May's block? It's a bed and there's like a basically a potty. Yeah. Right. Or a bucket or some kind of potty. And there's a wash basin. And then you have to go out to shower. Yeah. That's the deal. I've never been to prison. I don't tend to go. I think they vary. Like the Scandinavian ones are like lovely. Oh, yeah. Nicer than anyone. Classic online. PlayStation 5. Online quiz is like massage chair. UK uni accommodation or Scandinavian prison. Yeah. And you have to like pick between them and it's a tough quiz.

33:18Yeah. That's nice. Yeah. And Andres Breivik's looking like a king. Oh, yeah. He's in like a fucking Ibis basically. He's got a basketball hoop in his fucking, you know. So in 1978, prisoners start what's been come to be known as the Dirty Protest, which is also called the No Wash Protest. this goes on for five years so there's a fight in H block in April 78 and reports that a prisoner gets badly beaten in the solid future confinement which means prisoners smash up their furniture. I think this is part of like to note generally that the prison guards were being bad bastards as well as like we aren't allowed to hang out with our mates and whatever they were being kicked the foot out.

33:56Well that's not yeah I guess I didn't hear any of that in the podcast I listened to I just remember thinking that this is all a bit. Was that speaking to your dad or something. No, it was an Irish guy. On the phone to my dad. An Irish guy who does a podcast called The Troubles where he does like, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Which is very good. It's a big deep dive but he didn't, I mean, he didn't talk about, I'm sure you're right. I'm sure the guards are. I mean, if you're a prison guard, you've got to be a bit of a, you know. Bad bastard. Or nowadays they're just sucking and fucking. Yeah, there's so many.

34:25These sexy female prison guards. Yeah. Bonnie Blue is a prison guard I saw recently. Yeah. Something I saw. Where did you see that? on chat gpt when you typed it in yeah i searched for it found it took a while but i found it authorities remove all their furniture they leave just blankets and mattresses uh and when inmates refuse to leave their cells uh they they no longer empty their chamber pots chamber pot that's what it is not potty yeah um chamber potty chamber pot makes it feel like a like a too nice of a place chamber pot has real downton abbey vibes yes um a bucket it's a shit bucket a shit bucket yeah a shit and piss bucket a potty is a bucket essentially there's no like drainage on a potty is there no there's no drainage a potty is a bucket by another name the potty that we have by my daughter's bed right uh is it's basically it's it's it's two structurally it's two parts it's a sort of um a platform with a hole in it and then a removable potty part that you can take away the shit bit is there any like branding on it to make it fun as i've said before it's not a branded potty okay uh much as her poof step is not branded are you open to collaborations with always always looking for collab deals brand deals just poo it just poo it a nike potty um all day i dream about shitting what's that adidas adidas all day i dream about shit have you thought of that that's it's all i it's all day i do about sport oh is it that's the meaning yeah it's a it's not the meaning it's not it's adolf dazzler was the founder adidas rudolph dazzler set up puma okay the two nazi brothers who fell out over support for the regime I can't remember which one's which.

35:58Rudolph set up Puma, Adolf set up. Adidas. Adidas. Puma. Puma. Puma. Yeah, yeah. It's good. I'm loving shit. Exactly. Cooking. Starting or growing your own business can be intimidating and lonely at times. Your to-do list may feel endless with new tasks and lists can easily begin to overrun your life. So finding the right tool that not only helps you out, but simplifies everything as a built-in business partner can be a game changer. For millions of businesses, that tool is Shopify. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world and 10 % of all e-commerce in the U.S., from household names like Gymshark, Rare Beauty, and Heinz, to brands just getting started.

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38:30Tell your doctor your medical history, muscle or nerve conditions, including ALS Lou Gehrig's disease, myasthenia gravis or Lambert-Eaton syndrome, and medications, including botulinum toxins, as these may increase the risk of serious side effects. Why wait? Ask your doctor. Visit BotoxChronicMigraine.com or call 1-800-44-BOTOX to learn more. Anyway, now my daughter has a, you take, the thing is, when she poos in the potty, you really do. There's something about a toilet, a bathroom, where the smell is mitigated by the environment. Hard surfaces. Hard surfaces. Soft furnishings make shit smell worse.

39:08My God, in a bedroom that's carpeted and full of pillows, just pooing in a bucket in the middle of the room will make the room stink. There will be a science. And you don't realise that. You don't want to carpet the shit room. Don't carpet your shit room. Don't carpet your toilet. If you poo in the shower as well, that's really bad for smell. Because it kind of... Well, yeah, no, farting in the shower is awful. But pooing is even worse than that. Have you pooed in the shower? Yes, I did for a while, but I'm not allowed. For a while? For a while? I'm not allowed anymore. I'd wind my bum in the shower but I'd end up just like shitting all over the shower what and there was a time there was a time you've got to make a political statement with some of this stuff you're just wasting it you're wasting shit you're wasting it I don't stand for anything you've got to demand something you've got to you can't just let this go to waste basically I used to clean it was to be more clean but it ended up being not clean and wait how deep were you cleaning your bum I would like put my pretty much put my the whole hand in there to clean it out.

40:08Right. And then my girlfriend My girlfriend at the time was banging on the door trying to brush her teeth. And I was like my shins were just covered in shit and I was like if she comes in now she will leave me. And she did in the end but not because of that.

40:22Right. So sorry so you were originally pooing in the toilet and then not wiping or washing. There was times where I would get a poo out of my bum and throw it into the toilet and it's the most counter-intuitive thing. and I swear to you that's true but in the end I was like what am I doing it's the way he said get a poo out of his bum as if he doesn't like push with his body at all he just grabs it with his hand wait explain explain why you chuck it in the loo you're in the shower you're in the shower you need a poo I'll use the loo and then I'll go into the shower to clean myself and then I'm like oh I've still got some I'm not done yet and then I'd be like well I can't just like go get all you don't want to get the floor wet do you God forbid how weird you look walking to the toilet shitting your own head like a chimp I'd throw I'd underarm serve my poo into the loo yeah you're not fast bowling I know steaming in you're spraying it everywhere it's a bouncer oh no it's just on the floor I don't do that anymore and I'm not allowed I've been told I'm not allowed how long do you do it for in what age 22 to 25 three years how old are you now 29 you was doing that post COVID yeah during COVID as well I think I started around 20 21 22 till 25 and did did someone tell you off for it yeah because I told someone about it and they were like you can't fucking do it I live here did you have flatmates yeah I told my mate he was like what the fuck I use that shower every day I think you know I don't want to talk about this anymore to be honest saying it like we forced out of you yeah yeah no nobody waterboarded you although god knows how you'd respond to that you fucking love it you know there's just something about hiring someone and you just take it for granted that they haven't put into their hand for at least 10 years you don't want to put it on the job requirements yeah you'd think that like he's only four years away i mean less when we started this podcast when we started this podcast a year ago it's It's only three years since you've been shitting into your hand and throwing it into the toilet.

42:32Did you show it like Kobe when you did it? Sometimes, yeah. For a treat. Genuinely, Charlie, what is your facial expression while you're doing it? Is it a mixture of shame or has it become so routine that it's the same? You look up on your face and you're brushing your teeth. Sorry, I've just had a merch idea. You know those Nike Air Jordans where it's Jordan like that? It's him just leaning out of the shower. It's Charlie leaning out of the shower just completely but it's like your face like when you brush your teeth and it's just this is just routine let's not ask him how he brushed his teeth let's not ask him how he brushed his teeth just kind of bored and a bit annoyed yeah just fucking no it is boring wiping your ass is boring it's really boring I reckon that's what the IRA were thinking as well it's just boring wiping your ass oh I reckon there's a quick way to do this oh wow let's talk about this again yeah yeah sorry thanks Charlie for keeping us on topic no thanks well much as much as this makes It makes the same time.

43:26Doesn't it? These cons are about to rub their shit all over the walls and it's going to be like, oh, it's not that bad. It turns out they were actually, they could have protested harder. No wonder it didn't work. Nothing worse than a dirty protest without a cause. That's Charlie. Charlie's book, yeah. Yeah, that's, yeah. Charlie's autobiography. A dirty protest without a cause. A dirty soldier without an army. anyway so the blanket protest escalates into a dirty protest uh and this means that they're um so they're pooing in their little potty in the corner which is still more civilized than how charlie's shirt and then they're they're smearing excrement on the cell walls now what what i heard they do is they'd rip a bit of their foam mattress out and then they'd use that to scoop the door a and to paint much as we painted this wall actually Charlie actually painted this it was weird how you were only painting between half 10 and 11 every morning that was weird anyway instead of Scandinavian prisons versus UK uni accommodation that should be like civil rights protest or Charlie's day-to-day life yeah yeah so they take a bit of their foam mattress out and they'd like the sort of paint paint on the wall and they wouldn't be making art out of it.

44:48Or would they be writing like, well, maybe it's just sort of circles. Generally the pictures are mad. If you want to get the pictures up, it's like potato shapes, potato, you know, potato prints. It's like, yeah. No pollocks more like splatters. I guess it depends where they were on the Bristol stool chart. They probably rejected the Bristol stool chart as an, as a tool of the British imperial. Is there like a dairy, dairy poo chart, stool chart. Oh my days. That's so much poo. And look at him. He's loving it. Look at him down there. He's loving it. So we're looking at a photo now of the Dirty Protests.

45:23This is from Charlie's personal collection. But your wife's getting into interior design, isn't she? My wife is getting into interior design. She's doing interior design. What do you think about this? It's real 70s vibes. Yeah, it's that kind of brown of the 70s. Yeah, I mean, it's not disillusioned. I said this last time I was in and everybody was like, oh, ha ha, a bit funny. It's just nailed on. That's what it looks like. Because they are making, to look at the photo of it, they are making circles. The brushstrokes are interesting. So they're smearing, I mean, yeah, that's a lot of poo, isn't it?

45:54Authorities attempt to clean the cells, but prisoners just resume straight away afterwards. There's also like, there's food that they're not eating as well in the corner. So maggots are getting everywhere. And there's piss as well, sort of being like the floor is all piss. There's just everywhere. New game. The floor is piss.

46:14so uh but there was a point where they they had run out of bed to sleep on yes because they had used it as their poo paintbrush yes for the walls i've run out of bed well yeah well yeah you have and all all this is for them to wear their own clothes i mean that's where i hang out with their pals and hang out with their and i get that it's part of a broader thing it's in it yeah it's all like but when it's when it's a protest about a specific thing and internment i think internment's the big thing yeah you know what i mean yeah but i well what i listened to in that troubles podcast was all about this particular special case status but what that means is what that represents that's what i mean it's representative of something so by mid 78 uh there are about 300 prisoners involved uh the smell is unthinkable at this point oh my god five years five years of poo on the walls You must get used to it, though.

47:09Two World Cups. That's like our patrons changing rooms. Carol Smiley's in there. Oh, my words. The protest continues. The British government are not compromising. By late 79, nine out of ten newly arriving prisoners are doing this. But again, this is... It's a culture. It's the culture. What about the other guy? Is this like the 10th dentist that doesn't recommend Trident? But this is just after Mountbatten's been blown up. So this is why there's no compromise from the British, because they've just, you know, to take out a much beloved pedophile. You know, pedophile, as we always say, by this point in the 70s, that's all this country has.

47:49That's our greatest export. We're not manufacturing anything. We've outsourced everything. The only thing, the only product we export is world-class, well-dressed pedophiles. So taking out Manbatten is just unthinkable. so they also must have killed some pedos in the pub bombs yeah when mount baton blew up it was like we lost steel you know steel production wells yeah overnight overnight well who are we anymore so in january 1980 the prisoners issued these five demands i don't want to wear a uniform i don't want to work in the library i want to see my mates i want to get remission rights back that's where you can be let out early for good behaviour.

48:30And I also want recreational facilities and I want a weekly visit and letters and a parcel. In February 1980, and get ready for this, listeners, it's about to get even worse, 30 prisoners in Armagh Women's Prison joined the dirty protest. And if the poo wasn't enough, they're also smearing menstrual blood on the walls. This is Edinburgh Fringe Show, right? I saw this. Yeah, I definitely saw this. We should say congratulations to the Armagh Women's Prison, the sketch troupe that won the edinburgh comedy award in 1980 with the groundbreaking message women do have periods which was amazing women have periods and they poo and look at that aren't we clever um yeah what are you trying to say there yeah well brilliant you really opened my eyes yeah close my nose um so in june 1980 the european commission of human rights rejects the complaint by four of the prisoners they say the conditions are not inhumane but they're self-inflicted and designed to enlist sympathy for political aims.

49:28I mean, that's kind of fair. Which is fair. When they're like, this is inhumane, there's shit on my walls. It's like, will you stop smearing your own shit on the walls? Yeah.

49:38We're all trying to find the guy who did this.

49:44It's the hot dog costume. It's the IRA in the hot dog costume. It's covered in shit. It's the poo emoji. Who did this? Why is there poo everywhere? So Christ, we don't have long. we have to get we haven't even got to the first hunger strike so the first time so the poo is not working it is not we've tried the boo what's next the first board of call is poo on the poo and menstrual blood is not working they chuck the kitchen sink at it well that's covered in poo as well you know look smearing your poo on the walls is not the way to go to a british man's heart no you know we have a slightly more refined attitude to interior design than this by 1980 the blanket and dirty process will be going on for four years with no political resolution and the British government maintains its policy that they're criminals and we're not giving you political status and this is because Thatcher's in power Thatcher's in power and it's not just Mountbatten has Erin Eve been assassinated yet oh she loved that boy yeah Erin Eve was her close friend he's assassinated by the wasn't Mountbatten like her no it was the Queen's cousin Queen's cousin yeah yeah yeah and and uh is this around the time of thatcher being like when's erin is crime yeah 79 crime crime is crime there's no question erin he's been assassinated in 79 as well and that was thatcher's great political great friend that was the one where they sent him to the moon they blew up his car i think and it was like fuck me there is like in an account of it he like it mentions that he went fucking fast yeah Ronaldo celebration the commentator's like that one's gonna have snow in it when it comes down so by 1980 the poo protests aren't working and so they decide that they have to escalate in order to force negotiations so that where's it going from there?

51:36you don't eat yeah fair enough which will stop the pooing I guess yeah so yeah yeah we're all just input machines yeah what goes in must come out yeah so 27th of October 1980 87 republican prisoners begin a hunger strike in the maize prison now um this is to secure the five demands the original seven they pick one from every county because they want to try and maximize uh support from outside must be an extra one in there if there's six counties seven lads well no because i think brendan hughes isn't on the protest i think he's orchestrating it i think he technically did start because this one's quite short live brendan hughes for people as the lead character of Say Nothing.

52:15Oh, really? That's like the darky hues, they called them, which isn't great. So, because of what he... He was like a bit tanned. Yeah. That's like your dad had that, right? Yeah, he got called something slightly worse than that. Your dad says the M word. Sometimes. He's got the past, though. I mean... Because it's been used as a... Yeah. Some people say if it's been used against you, then you can use it. But then I'm allowed to call people horrible words for gay people.

52:43yeah that shouldn't really be the rule so also we could just call each other words just to give ourselves a free pass yeah you have to use it once just go lock ourselves charge each other up they want to create a short intense crisis they don't stagger their hunger strike protests they all go on hunger strike at the same time now hunger strike Like supposedly you can live the average time between 60 and 70 days before you die. It's super grim. So it's not intermittent fasting. It's mitten fasting. Mitten fasting. Right, right. Yeah. It's a long-range Ramadan. Yeah, okay. But no eating when the sun goes down.

53:28Right, yeah. It's Ramadan in the Arctic Circle, as you were saying. Yeah, it's Arctic Circle Ramadan. Yeah. So by December 1980, he was slipping in and out of consciousness. And supposedly the way it goes is you, around 50 days, you start getting into a coma. and then your organs basically just sort of shut down slowly uh they were told to keep drinking water stay hydrated much as you have to tell women with their stupid big sippy cups so yeah sandy cups yeah do you think they had those like encouragement water bottles keep going halfway through but it was with poo yeah they were doing this over christmas because they thought they're not going to let people go hungry over christmas but this is thatcher this is tough love yeah it doesn't matter if you're not eating don't give a fuck don't give a fuck yeah i love the idea of thatcher responding to like the new man's land football match being like what what are you doing it's a war yeah it's christmas dinner if you don't want it it's your own fault it's tasting the strike is called off uh because the british government had sent a document outlining proposed reforms uh and but they thought are great they're going to concede but the document basically was very ambiguous and it pretty much said i mean you have to wear uniform you have to do work maybe you can see your mates if you're good i can't remember what it said right but it was deliberately ambiguous so but it felt like like negotiations were maybe about to start and then it was just like yeah they sort of called it off maybe a bit early i think is the the perspective of the people involved okay but then the second one is this is what happened at the end of the first one then so what they called it off because they thought they were getting it and then negotiations collapsed right so yeah negotiations started and a couple of them were near very close to death so they stopped it to proceed with negotiations but then the British never actually gave an inch really so then they realised we're going to have to go again and this is where Bobby Sands come in who you know with 50 minutes in death I haven't even fucking told people who he is he was he'd been in jail for was it possession of a firearm I think been in jail for a while he's 27 at this point 27 club and he basically, he then becomes the operational commander of the second hunger strike in 1981 and he knows he's going to die or at least he might.

55:38When he starts, he's like, I'm going to die. He's like, the only way we're going to get these concessions. It's sort of like, it's like a real heavy quote at the start of it. He says, I stand at the precipice of something, something, something. Have you seen Hunger? Have you seen that film by Stephen Green? I haven't actually. With Michael Fassman. It is amazing. Film people like it. It's Fassman than Bobby Sands? Yes. Right. but yeah he's the kind of symbolic martyr of the whole cause probably what they do with this one is they stagger it so that they think that every two weeks there could be a death which will just keep it in the news rather than it's like one big news story one week they're like yeah yeah so 1st of March 81 the second hunger strike begins they stagger it the first guy to stop eating is Bobby Sands now 10 of these men will eventually die so Thatcher says crime is crime is crime it's not political uh and there's no formal concession uh so while they're striking uh there's a uh the mp for fair manor and south dyes dies frank mcguire dies of a heart attack and then such a bad heart attack that his car blew up um and so he had been an independent nationalist mp who was uh abstentionist as uh all the shin fangs doesn't show up to don't jump to westminster so that triggers a by-election and then they all the nationalists agree that they should maximize impact by electing bobby sands uh because he's a month into his hunger strike because well you of course he's a political prisoner he's an elected mp but it's a very tight um council borough whatever split isn't it it's right on the line between catholics and protestants so uh yeah the majority is 1 ,446 in the end which and then the podcast i listened to there were lots of um protestants living in that constituency that was really shocked at this they were like oh the idea that my neighbor wants uh my neighbor might be a catholic my neighbor wants a catholic um like a jailed ira member as my mp rams home for them that like i thought we could just get on as mates so he's now elected member of parliament and he's in prison cell covering his own poo not eating which is not very parliamentary no it's not the right honorable bobby sands the right honorable mr speaker yeah mr speaker he is mr speaker is he the right is he the right honorable bobby sands yeah i guess so if you're an mp are you right on the right pooey bobby sands the right doesn't work he's covered in shade honorable he's covered in poo isn't he this is autism talking to intellectual disability this is the problem to low IQ low IQ versus high right pooey versus shite honorable in the 50s we would have been in the same class in school for some reason yeah the shite honorable probably sounds like you're on the bus you're looking at the timetable he's right pooey look at him he's covered in poo no we get it we get it but shite visual it's a visual image shite honorable works It works, does it?

58:45And right pooey doesn't really... They're both perfect. They're both perfect. The right pooey Bobby Sand. I mean, he is right pooey. Right pooey, lad. Whoa. Right pooey, lad. Yeah, I mean, thank God he never went to Parliament because you play for the Ulster Union. It's sat next to him and we're going, bloody hell, mate, come on. So Sand's election makes it impossible to frame him as an ordinary criminal because he is now an MP. And so, hang on, This is less than a month after he's elected, right? The election's on the 9th of April. And on the 5th of May... It's kind of mad they let him stand, though.

59:20Right? What, the Brits? Yeah, I mean, they changed the rule afterwards, but... You can't stand when you're in prison? Surely. On what grounds have they changed the rule? They changed the rule that you can't be serving a prison sentence and stand to be an MP. Right. Which I think is quite grim. What? They're still citizens of the country. Like, you don't lose your citizenship because you're in prison. You have it put on time out. You sort of do. Your citizenship is put on ice. It's the sin bin. Yeah. It is. You're cooling off, yeah. It is sort of, yeah. But then how do you enact prison reform? Like, that's a piece of policy that's affecting the MMO.

59:51When you get out, you can do it. Yeah, I mean, you know, if you want bigger toilets, then ask for them. On the 5th of May, so... The day after Star Wars Day. The day after Star Wars Day, which we haven't placed any of this. They'll be livid. Did they celebrate Star Wars Day? We should place this. We should place this. Do you want to play it? 1981, the day of Bobby Sands' death. What's this before? What's this after? this is before Italian 90 yes lovely okay yeah but after the sort of breaking up of Pangea right yeah so it's way after the continent stop being one landmass but it's before Gaza's tears in Turin the listeners know exactly where they are before Pavarotti did Nessendorme Italian 90 wouldn't have made sense during Pangea this is all post Pangea it's all post Pangea but it is all pre-Italian 90 sorry Sorry, you've nailed that.

1:00:43Thank you. Cushioned it. Beautifully. Cushioned it perfectly. So Thatcher, and again, you know, Thatcher, her skill that is undeniable is how articulate she is and how brute, like there is no room for manoeuvre in the political soundbite she gives. Mr. Sands was a convicted criminal. He chose to take his own life. It was a choice his organisation did not offer its victims. Yeah. Which is like... It's a good one. Maggie, it's interesting that he's like the Tory politicians and the pro-union politicians at this time. And it was the thing for Wilson as well, because he actually was probably supportive of United Ireland.

1:01:21Thatcher maybe wasn't. He's a soft touch. This is such a hassle for them. Like none of them got into politics because they wanted to deal with Northern Ireland for fucking 10 years. They're all just sat there being like, fuck, I have to give like a hard line. But this is also, this is during the worst Britain. 74 to 84, economically, the worst Britain's been post-war. post-war you know three day week at 74 and there are bombs going off in guildford and uh birmingham and then by the time thatcher's in 81 it's kind of like a could you not please yeah could you not can you just wait you just want your own run off my feet here yeah can you just use a toilet for fucking five minutes and give me a fucking break it's like having kids it's genuinely like having kids you're trying to do it one and the other Eat, eat, eat, just eat.

1:02:04It is that, yeah, it is that. And I have no sympathy. I have no sympathy. This is your thatcher. Eat. You know, have the prison guards tried the aeroplane? Have they tried celebrating outside every time? The prison guards going to IRA prison. I can't resist. Fuck, fuck. Fuck not again, they will get us again. They will get us again. I just love aeroplanes. um you know sometimes when my kids aren't eating i have to go outside to the garden and through the french doors i have to celebrate every time they put in a mouthful and i take my t-shirt off and they love that yeah right did they try that they haven't tried everything you have to do like aguero match premier league winning goal given the prisoners like an ipad to watch youtube videos but also we haven't talked about force feeding which is which is what now the brits stop the practice of force feeding in the early mid 70s when the uh un say or whoever say that it's um bad form basically force feeding that's when you shove a pipe down someone's mouth and quite often results in death because uh if the person's resisting all the food or the porridge whatever goes into the lungs and you get a special on your mouth was that um innovated during the suffragettes i feel like that's the most famous use of it again it's pre-sippy cup suffragettes before the standard issue sippy cup the first sippy cup was the force feeding the suffragettes um there's a big tank with you're doing really well halfway through yeah yeah anyway

1:03:41yeah anyway so the law is changed brits changed the law saying that no one a little bit of carrot and a few crisps. I lost Mary. So the law has changed that bans serving prisoners for standing from election. And then at the end of... So 10 Republican prisoners die over the course of the hunger strikes. Now by August... Is Bobby first to go? Yeah, he is. And then... Well, he's certainly the first to start striking. So I imagine he's the first to die. And then there's a point where a guy is about to die and then the British come to... there's back channel, um, with the Brits and they basically conceding on most things.

1:04:24They're going to get reinstate special status. I think the one thing they say, no one is free association, but pretty much everything else is fine. And then, um, by October 81, the families are intervening medically. Bobby Sands is mom, or maybe one of the other ones, his mom had been told by him, don't keep me alive. Let me, if he goes all the way, let me. Interviews with her are sort of very grim. She's like, I support him. I'm very proud of him. Horrible thing. But it's, you know, if this was like an Italian mother. Well, interesting is Luis Ribalez, the head of the Spanish FA, you know, when he got fired for getting with the...

1:05:02Kissing the World Cup winners. Yeah. Maybe it was passing her a message, but we don't know. Maybe the lowest stakes hunger strike of all time. Yeah. Mediterranean mum. His mum went on hunger strike. Oh. protest him losing his job. She only lasted about six hours, but it's probably as low as stakes a hunger strike has ever been. My son has lost his job. I will not eat. Okay, I'll have a little bit. And a little bit of this and a little bit of that and a little bit of this. So there was one reason a guy called Jamie Bryson, who's this sort of like Protestant unionist, like annoying guy who just like pipes up on everything.

1:05:39He did a hunger strike recent, like a few years ago that lasted less than 12 hours. That's good. that's just intermittent fasting that's healthy well there is one and i'm like very supportive of like the cause and everything but the the palestine action hunger strike at the minute one of them has type 1 diabetes so is eating every other day and i just think you're maybe not involved well what they do is they'd say it's better for digestion probably you got screened for having health conditions for the these are the strikes and there are people that couldn't do it because they had like one of the someone dies after like 30 days because they had a stomach infection that didn't no one knew about one of them can do it because he was hungry so oh yeah i wouldn't be a star athletes for sorry i'm starving the amount i would eat before going on hunger strike yeah i would eat so much i would be like a first death is finn taylor just before the hunger strike has started he's eaten himself to death the hunger strikes end in october 81 and no formal public concession has been announced by the british government but within months uh the british pretty much given on most counts, I think.

1:06:42Especially clothing. I think they didn't want them to organize IRA stuff, basically. Don't go and plot behind our backs. And maybe remission is still gone, but I think pretty much everything else eventually gets... So it is successful. They get to wear their cool clothes again. And Sands is like a martyr. Big time still is. Still a huge deal. You know, has his poetry books. it's got the mural there's a mural the Bobby Sands mural yeah there's a few my my controversial opinion is Bobby Sands like amazing guy amazing character from history yeah his poems aren't that good really interesting right but I mean so bad poet bad MP good political activist were they all about food?

1:07:21fucking stop Tommy from I would murder a burger I could murder a Big Mac right now fuck me it's not really Keat is it? fuck me i'm hungry but that's my poetry can we see any good poems oh the rhythm of time you can't be good at the dark of this prison cell it thunders forth its might it's the undauntable thought my friend that thought that says i'm right the problem the problem with poetry is right is that if it rhymes it feels inherently childish or something yeah and i think the best poems charlie's just grabbed the mic like you're gonna come i'm dying to meet you do you want to like a scratchy Charlie's our resident poet before before you do your poem I want you to improvise a poem about you now reflecting on on how you used to deal with your feces right so you've so that's this was four years ago you need a title for this poem as well I feel like to end the episode we should Charlie should read us out I'm going to run you to the stage and you're going to have to say this is a poem entitled this so in the way that Bobby Sands had poetry and this is just an open mic night poetry after his Dirty Press and Hunger Strike.

1:08:35Charlie's going to read us out with his poem that deals with your, I mean, non-political protests against your own toilet. Should we give him like a poetry slam? I think it's more dramatic if we hear the silence in the room. You'll have to click if you agree. I was just saying click him to the stage. So just before we get Charlie on, Bobby Sands' most quoted line is, our revenge will be the laughter of our children. but like bars yeah yeah i mean great line that's a good line that's a good line yeah but the hunger strikes succeed and uh we will end um we'll end this section of the troubles tapas menu here uh we'll you know you were on a patreon episode talking about um the brighton bombing that's on the patreon uh mike was on as well talking about byron that's for a patron exclusive yeah uh if you want access to that and the next uh early access to the next series join the patreon three a month for tour you're on tour i'm on tour all around the uk and ireland and america and then australia and all that where can people get tickets vittorioansanary.com i'd imagine that will be in the description of the thing god yeah i've got specials on youtube if you want to watch something before you buy a ticket i think that's a good two specials two specials very very good very good price very good price charlie to read us out here is this podcast very own bobby sands in more ways than one our resident poet talking about how he used to poo producer Charlie life is a toilet you don't need it there's power in the shower you just got to feel it well split the difference you can use a potty look after yourself and look after your body Thank you.

1:10:22Wow. No, no, no, no, no, sorry. No, I'm sorry. You're meant to be processing the fact that you dug shit out of your own ass. He's double dying. And threw it into the toilet. Yeah, you're justified. It's a mental health poem. I'm looking after my body and my body. I don't know if you are. You're throwing shit into the toilet from the shower. Okay. He's got another one. I want there to be some form of like, your poo is your future. don't throw it away thank you you must buzz off those hotel showers with the toilet and the shower like a wet room yeah also how far away was the toilet from the probably me to you you're joking I missed I have missed well yeah that's like four feet I don't want to talk about this again you brought it up your poor future don't throw it away right well that's been that's been the hunger strikes I guess that's been Bobby Sands I'm sorry to anybody from where I'm from.

1:11:22I'm sorry. Yeah, and I'm on tour in Belfast. Hopefully enough times pass between this episode and that tour. Exeter and Plymouth sales are shit, so that would be helpful. I've got so many tickets to selling cork still. This will not have helped. Anyway. Bye for now. Bye for now. Thanks for listening. We'll see you on the Patreon. And if not, we'll see you next week. Bye.

1:12:04We'll see you next time.

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