A Voodoo Schizophrenic Molesting Himself | Papa Doc: Haitian Dictator (Part 2)

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1:41Welcome back to Fingers History. I'm still with Horatio Gould. And this is part two of our series on Papadoc. Yes. The Haitian dictator. Yes. Now, in our first part, we learned that Heishi is the shittest place in the world. That's not just me. I think that's the World Health Organization's official quote. Top of the league table, they eat mud cookies. They do eat mud cookies. They had a private Tun Tun security force. Yeah. They had a lesbian MP who was created the genital mutilation. Well, yeah, I think the lesbian thing, that's not... We're listing reasons why it's a failed state. I don't know if the lesbian thing was necessary.

2:15Don't deny her her sexuality. I think you're implying that that's something to do with the... I think there's bigger structural issues. I think lesbians are quite creative with genital mutilation. That's what I call lesbian sex. Yeah. um oh yeah i guess because she was um so this woman was doing cock and ball torture but because she's a lesbian i guess she took no sexual pleasure from her and it was purely uh some sort of uh castration against you know men i guess it's a homosexual who's gynecologist right it's taking yeah taking her frustrations out yeah right exactly uh voodoo doll yeah voodoo doll a man's cock yeah um but then it's attached to the man so it's not really yes i guess it's not really who's this affecting well it's me it's my cock yeah that's not a voodoo doll that's just my dick anyway so duvalier papadoc had had a heart attack big diabetic stroke in may 1959 and from being an incredibly normal guy he suddenly suddenly becomes slightly strange yeah uh it radicalized his paranoia yeah so clement barbo who had saved his life by giving him a lot of glucose yeah uh he was kind of the caretaker manager while duvalier recovered um interim for nine hours for about nine hours right but duvalier wakes up and goes well you're clearly trying to take my job he's when he's up he's cross-eyed he's got a tiny accent why the fuck are you taking my job for hey wag one man that's my job um and so duvalier has barbeau imprisoned uh and then ultimately murdered i mean he was back to the corner there yeah so after 1959 duvalier's uh already quite worrying behavior uh changes for the worse okay he intensifies his intensifies his purges he accelerates the tonton the tonton macut and he sort of withdraws further into the sense of ritual uh the voodoo nonsense one thing in in his favor though is because everyone talks about this as like a turning point that destroys haiti that this uh leader but everyone before lasted like 10 hours and was getting lynched and he lasts fucking 16 15 years so there's a level there's a level of stability that he brings well I guess not to be a papadoc truther but well I guess it's the same guy on the money isn't it for 15 years there's a level to it where it doesn't feel like there's much to compare it to does it matter if the money is sort of meaningless and people are getting killed but what was it before well I don't know I mean maybe there was a new guy on the money every six months but at least you weren't getting yeah fine weren't getting your balls cut off by lesbians a civil servant yeah so he starts to adopt the persona of baron samedy he is the voodoo spirit who governs the cemetery and so this is a lot of like uh new orleans tarot cards uh famous in the james live and let die james bond film with roger moore oh yeah yeah um baron samedy wears a big top hat and is often painted with a white face and yeah papadoc dresses permanently in black, wears a broad-brimmed hat, speaks in a flat nasal monotone, much like our fans.

5:18They love freaking themselves out. They love it. Yeah, they do. It's spooky stuff. The real Baron Sam would be spoken in a nasal voice because he had cotton wool shoved up his nose. Sorry, I say the real Baron Sam would be in the folklore. I guess so. That sounds like a real fact about you wouldn't put that into the folklore. Seems weird. Why have you got Mark Lawrenson up? Why have you got Mark Lawrenson up, Charlie? Quite monotonous. I was wondering if you could when Laurence Loro's Baron Samadou. Yeah. I mean, that's quite terrifying at the end of your bed. It's just like, you're dead now. I'm governing the cemetery, but the cemetery's not been protected.

5:54No, it's not. The cemetery, you know, it's just not the same as it used to be. Loro providing all the structure of scrambled egg on a chair. Yeah. It's amazing how long he lasted in that job. Really is. I mean, you look at Alistair Campbell now and the rest of his politics kind of folding into the chair. Lawrenson, by four years into the match, he's just like, it's like someone's thrown some custard on a cushion now but duvalier so he starts dressing like baron samedi so all the haytians think he's an actual yeah witch doctor voodoo god uh he said he starts encouraging rumors that bullets can't harm him the illnesses can't kill him the death itself answers to him okay because he'd been close to death and then returned the population are like oh right yeah so he's actually a god i mean they're easy to spook yes they are easily spooked but then to be fair they've had 200 years of complete you know they're eating mud cookies so well you'd think that if you're eating dirt cookies and it's the shitiest place in the world you'd be quite sort of hardened to it or you'd get more and more superstitious right it all starts becoming quite surreal I imagine yeah or is it not surreal maybe it's incredibly real well I think mud cookies are quite real it's not like what am I like I'm eating shit for a cookie yeah it's more like oh it's this again yeah that's true so in 1961 Duvalier stages a one man election and that he's the only person you can vote for.

7:09So he's democratically elected. Yeah. And he is an incredible victory. Amazing. Over 1.3 million votes. It's more than Blair in 97. It is. It's the only thing you can compare it to is Blair in 97. The opposition are wiped out. Right. They get zero votes. You're wondering if they're happy with him or not. There's your proof. Yeah. I mean. Stunning victory. It's Haiti's Blair. It's completely validated his whole regime. Hope. Yeah. Yes. um uh so we should place this 1961 would you like to place this for 1961 so i think this is after elvis first ate a hamburger yes and before elvis ate sony hamburgers he shat on the toilet and died he died doing what he loved eating hamburgers on the toilet between elvis's first and last hamburger yes what a journey that was between the burgers my new biography of elvis between the burgers sounds like such a disgusting film between the burgers a book about papadocca nation the haitian leader yeah uh when was elvis presley's first burger do we have any record of that charlie what when was he born i mean he ate like a king yeah well yeah is that what kings yeah 35 so i would say his first burger could have been 90 as early as 1938 probably three right You're not giving three-year-olds.

8:31Well, maybe someone in this part of America cut up a little bit. Have you given any of your kids burgers? Have your kids never eaten a burger? No, they haven't. Not even a bit of it? No. When are you going to get in their first burger? I don't know. I mean, they like sausages. They have a lot of sausages. Right. But you haven't planned that yet. I guess you're scared that they might end up like Elvis. Yeah, I know what's coming. You have one bite and then just... I just want their last burger to be after I'm gone, frankly. earliest noted burger moment was in 1954 but i think he got 100 sliders after his first radio broadcast yeah so sliders were a thing in the 50s i think so do we charlie can we find what elvis's final his last meal was can we find the order he made six chocolate chip cookies and four scoops of dinner ice cream that was his last meal wow a far cry from the extravagant fried peanut butter sandwiches i mean it's not like jim morrison no it's not absence and heroin it's ice cream and burgers fuck me now whoa is that him no no that can't be him it was like Bernard Manning that's crazy see now that's what makes your girlfriend's comment even more frustrating about me that's fat Elvis yeah and she said that remind people uh my tour poster my upcoming tour is me modeling the Elvis suit from the 68 comeback you're a big Elvis fan big Elvis fan yeah I'm not a big elvis fan and you probably thought you in proportion you look quite good i felt good yeah i thought i've never worn this much leather i'm not like charlie i'm not a divin i'm not wearing leather normally no it felt good i mean i waddled but you know the baby came up to you and went oh this new poster is so great i went thank you she went yeah man the whole fat elvis attack so funny and i went right well it was just elvis actually it was not fat elvis you know anyway i mean the next the next tour could be you dying on the toilet yes like you you could be squeezing out the tour dates yeah just white jumpsuit squeezing out the tour anyway so that perfectly places papadoc it's between the burgers the life of elvis presley haitian food obviously we've got it's funny thinking that that those pictures of burgers though that was the lee harvey oswald of elvis like that's what that was that what killed him do you know what i mean i'm looking at that pilot the picture i was like that that's what assassinated uh elvis yeah that's the second the second plane

10:57a platter of burgers yeah there's no there's no real conspiracies he didn't leave the door open for any any doubt it's not it's not like an epstein thing is it like killed i don't think elvis killed himself i think he did assassinated by yeah a lifetime of eating burgers a platter of burgers on the toilet could you ever be yeah in a locked toilet door on the toilet trousers down burger in your mouth there's no hint of like wrongdoing what's gone on here yeah i uh i suspect some foul play the police are not treating this as suspicious have you seen those toilet steps i've got one but it's not what you think it's because my daughter needs a step to get up to the big toilet we don't we don't does it double as a shit wench yes yeah that's how you're meant to poo isn't it yeah i know someone who'd like he brought a girl back and he you know check this out but he just had that in his toilet it's like that's clearly not you can't go into someone's toilet they've got like a shit step i don't know what the branding is for a shit step either do you do it classy and discreet or do you go like i thought you meant do i i thought you meant do i have a branded toilet step for it.

12:06No, no, I mean, the toilet steps that I've seen advertised on TikTok. Just poo it. I don't know. What's the branding? Like, you probably want something sleek and maybe Norwegian just to make it feel like it's not bringing up. You don't want it to be like trashy and it's like a guy on the logo going, oh! Mine, the top of my daughter's poo step is ridged, ribbed, for my pleasure. But it means you've got more grip on your feet so that if you're having to work it out, your feet don't fly over the place. Yeah, the friction, I guess, is... No, it's important. It'd be good to have like replaceable ones so you can like mix up the terrain.

12:37Yes. Braille for your feet. Or you wear AstroTurf shoes. So they're just like... No, you know cyclists who they have those clip-on shoes? You clip in to the Pooh Step so that you don't... Pooh Step remix. What are those called? Those little... What are those clippy... What are those shit... Can you do shit stool? I just want to see what the brand... It's just called a Pooh Step. Yeah, okay, I guess they haven't... What else can you call it? I guess no one's... Ridley Scott hasn't directed an advert for them. He hasn't like... Should we just clarify what we're talking about? I feel like we've been talking about this for a while.

13:13Bum banister, maybe. A what? A bum banister. I don't think it's... Basically, I don't think... No, it's not a guardrail. I think it's pretty clear what we're talking about. It's a step that you put below the toilet so that you can have your feet raised and it gives you more of an angle. Because supposedly that is how you're meant to poo. You're meant to poo like a Cambodian man waiting for a bus. Right, yeah. Knees up. so it's an oriental thing it's like a weeb thing maybe i don't know but no my yes i what are the what are they called the when you clip in cycling shoes wearing full lycra so you're more aerodynamic helmet as well big helmet we got the velodrome just the air resistance of pooing really slows me down clipless poo shoes i guess Yeah, anyway.

14:00I guess. I guess. I'm not giving up. I am selling the building. The final season of FX is the Bear. The restaurant is flooded. Everything's either going to be okay. No. Or not. We are outgunned and we are outmanned. We have each other. FX is the Bear. The final season. All episodes now streaming on Disney+. I'm Glenn Washington, host of Snap Judgment, the award-winning storytelling podcast from KQED. Every week, Snap deals a new card. Like the girl whose sister was a monkey. Or the man who lived in the woods for 30 years. Or even the woman who snuck her lover out of prison in a dog crate. Pick a card.

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15:26$50 for 12-1 plan required. $15 per month equivalent. Taxes and fees extra. New customer offer for initial plan term only greater than 50 gigabytes may slow when network is busy. See terms. So, but we digress. Not for the first time. No. We're talking about Papadoc. In 1961, he won 1.3 million votes. Stunning. A stunning election victory. And this vote officially declared that he had been reelected for a new six-year term. And this is basically the most blatant voting corruption of all time. like no one's ever been this blatant with it there was a new york times article about how this is even by latin american standards this is the most ridiculous sham elections ever been yeah because there's often like kangaroo court sort of stuff where it's it's it's all faked yeah but you'll at least have other candidates yeah this is kind of just absurd what's like one and a half i've never heard of it just being one person on the ballot yeah because is it i mean it's a farce that everyone's just like well we're gonna go well i guess i'm hoping for that then and a lot of people will be like well if you don't like it you shouldn't have voted for it I'm going to spoil my ballot what does that even look like now this precipitates along with some other along with the US just deciding that they didn't like him anymore this precipitates the termination of US aid in sort of 1962 in 1964 Duvalier declares himself president for life wait hold up but 99.9 % approval yeah it's pretty good so he has lost he has lost 0.1 % I don't know what that 0.1 % is.

16:55Well, two years into his term, you know, government's always losing a lot of access. Sure, you do lose a bit. You lose a bit of support. Now, the national budget, half of the national budget went to repressing people. What's the important part of the GDP? The Tunst and McCoot. You know how, like, Trump's trying to force NATO to do 3 % of GDP for defence? Yes. It should be like, well, 50 % needs to go to repression. Obviously, that's a big part of the GDP. Half it, repression. He freely embezzles millions of dollars a year from public funds. He had built a fund or he started a fund for like renovation and he taxes everyone.

17:29The National Fund for Renovation. Nothing was ever renovated using the Fund for National Renovation. They started a city You can't blame him for that. No. It's infrastructure projects. He started a city called Duvalierville and it's still I think you can still see it if you Google it Charlie. It's like an abandoned city. So a vanity city. Now if you were going to create a vanity city what would it be called? taylorville taylor town taylor town yeah taylor taylor town sounds too silly yeah it does i guess mine would be like goldstone goldstone or like goldville i don't like either goldstone in kent just sounds like a sort of i think i'd probably go like saint gouldberg or like i want to give it something a bit more all right horatio lopalopolis

18:16horatilopolis is good you know it's aspirational Taylor Town just sounds like an absolute dump. Taylor Town does. Yeah, no, it does. It sounds like a speed like this. Yeah. I'm from Taylor Town. Now, a guy called Luckner Cambrone, he was leading the Tauntaun Makut through the 1960s and he had this nickname, the Vampire of the Caribbean. Right, sounds like a good guy. Yeah, what he would do is everyone he killed, he would steal their blood plasma and then sell it to the US through the company he founded called Hemo Caribbean. Founded a company, that's nice. Yeah, it is. But now Hemo Caribbean, that's not my business, which is Hebe Caribbean.

19:03Which is the... It's an appreciation society for 15-year-old Caribbean girls. Right, so was Epstein involved in this? Yes, I'm building, I'm standing on the shoulders of giants. I'm building on the work that Jeffrey Epstein does. I found a guy on Instagram who's called Jeffrey Epstein, who just now his whole content is i'm not that one he's got like 20 000 he's like quite high up in disney i think i'm just saying i think it'd be quite good if someone gets arrested with that name everyone with that name needs to get arrested as well just to make sure just just let's just flush out yeah that's him yeah all jeff epstein yeah poor old jeffrey epstein yeah pin tweet i guess i should have i guess i should read all the rips but i'm not dead and i'm still not that Jeffrey Epstein.

19:43Hemo Caribbean was a company that meant he would take all the blood of his victims and supposedly he would say that Haitians have got loads of diseases so it's got the blood's full of antibodies so it's quite good blood. The Americans would buy it but there is lots of reports how this basically contributes to the spread of AIDS. Really? I don't know I don't know why or how. Yes, Charlie? Is it called AIDS as a kind of ironic thing? I don't think they're being ironic with it. Yeah, I don't think they named diseases ironically. It should be called unhelpfuls or not horrible. He also sold cadavers to medical schools and bought them from Haitian hospitals for$3 a corpse.

20:24I like the use of the word cadaver. It's a meal deal. Cadaver implies... Meal deal. Meal deal per body. Yeah, it's true. I guess it is. It's less than a meal deal. $3 these days. So one of the key moments in the Papadoc story is in April 1963, unknown assailants try and assassinate his kids. So his kids are getting out of a car and then in Port-au-Prince and the snipers start firing and they kill the chauffeur, but the children are luckily unharmed. But Duvalier then... He was livid. Yeah, to put it mildly. He's annoyed. He goes home. He throws his poo step across the floor. now he concludes that the only person that could have done this is like a top sniper marksman and so he then thinks of the first person he knows that is that which it wasn't by the way but it's a guy called francois benoit who uh it is a stupid name if it rhymes so he's a detective and so he was an elite sniper who was known critic of the regime but he was innocent but what duvalier does is that they he sends men to benoit's home uh and benoit had already sought asylum inside the Dominican embassy because he's getting molested why is he doing that what it's just because he's scared that it's going to happen he's getting molested you know I don't mean molested sexually molested as in harassed right he's getting harassed Makut forces storm the embassy searching every room which is not cricket they're not allowed to do that yeah Benoit slips away his family don't and then it's funny when you don't obey international law a lot of stuff's just easier yeah this is international waters well no I'll just shoot you from there it's also it's really shown up as a sham when you open the door of an embassy you can't do that and you go fuck off fuck off bang oh shit I guess you can actually because it is just a house yeah who's going to stop you like the whole thing's a construct isn't it yeah like the oh the I'm hiding in a house Julian Assange no why don't you just go and fuck off fuck off you're Ecuador I don't fucking care yeah when it who's ever who is Ecuador what's it ever been this is a house in fucking West London oh it's Antonio Valencia's house in West London who gives a fuck the guy's the guy's got one move he's gonna go he's got one foot he's gonna go outside yeah who cares well as right back when he was he was asked to though to be fair to him when he was called back into right yeah but i could play well as a right back if i'm asked to do you know what i mean i don't know what you mean it's he was a winger he was so shit they went well fucking we can't buy another one to just play right back and this is julian assange's fault yes julian assange was hiding antonio valencia's house in london and for some reason we just didn't storm storm the embassy.

23:03Yeah, I mean, and then also there was the whole Gaddafi thing when they were just leaning out the window just fucking spraying people. And they were like, we can't... But that's the great thing. If you don't care about international law, then stuff's very easy for you. Very easy. So Benoit, basically, he slips away, he hides, but his parents, his wife, his infant child and other just visitors to the embassy are just massacred. So witnesses describe the guards kicking down the doors, spraying bullets into the family's home, then burning the house to the ground. So rumours spread that Benoit's infant son had survived and been taken alive to Duvalier.

23:39But what happens next is kind of unknown. Some people think - The boy was interrogated, but he's like two years old. Yeah, other people think he was ritually sacrificed, which is, I would just say I do not condone that. No, I think that's - Or condemn it. I don't, you know, I'm a centrist when it comes to these sorts of things. If you're going to sacrifice a kid, it's better if it's ritual than if it's not. please at least make a ritual yeah if you're gonna kill a kid you might as well make it yeah catholic stuff yeah yeah duvalier unleashes nationwide reprisals uh hundreds of people are murdered across haitie corpses are left rotting in the streets for days uh and so this basically the local council sort of collapsed at this point yeah there's no corpse pickup up no like that it's all just yeah yeah i mean you know bin strikes aren't going yeah i don't know what bin you put your corpse in to be honest food bin is it yeah do they have different bins in haiti i think the country's a bin you've actually used that too much for that to mean anything you're right hyperinflation we've come to haiti and now you call it a bin is the boy who cried wolf yeah you've called everything south of england a bin so now it doesn't really mean anything yeah you're right what is it then it's landfill yeah yeah it's landfill yeah the food bin is smaller than the other bins though yeah which what is infuriating yeah my mom has that like a nasty little food bin up on the counter i just did oh people and it's like a little sliver and i just like a little ceramic vase and put a bit it's like fuck it it's a bin yeah dressing up It feels like it's as thin as a credit card wallet.

25:20I'm fucking trying to squeeze all the... It's all going in the main bin. Yeah, come on. Fuck off. Fuck off. Outside bin. Skip. I drive to landfill and then I fucking drop kick it in there. I throw it in. Yeah. By the early 1960s, Duvalier's Haiti is an absolute nightmare. It hadn't really been a picnic before that. But is the 60s, has that hit Haiti? Are they getting like the... Is there like a swell of music and culture? Is it the swinging 60s? or stinking 60s? No, I think it's the stinking 60s. Now, the fact that people think he's a voodoo sort of witch doctor... Complicates things. Complicates things when, on the 22nd of November 1963 in Dallas, John F.

26:03Kennedy is shot. Allegedly. Allegedly. But, you know, if we're going by the mainstream narrative, he was not killed by burgers. He could have done the same thing as Elvis. Well, if we slow the footage down, we see

26:20that's one conspiracy we never covered actually is that the bullets miss but because JFK is just scoffing burgers in the backseat anyway hamburger Oswald killed him and Elvis so because JFK had cut Duvalier's foreign aid when Kenley is shot Duvalier opens champagne bottles and champagne is served and he announces to members of his inner circle, quote, I have succeeded. And everyone's going, what are you on about? And Duvalier immediately starts telling everyone that he had placed a voodoo curse on the American president because, as we said in the last episode, he had been elected on September the 22nd.

27:06He was inaugurated on October the 22nd and Kendi had been killed on November the 22nd because his lucky number was 22. I mean, it does sort of add up. There you go. it does kind of work so so are you saying that he had like a voodoo car with a voodoo Jackie Kennedy and a voodoo that just voodoo Dealey Plaza and he voodoo shot his head he stabbed a voodoo 22 ,222 times right exhausting in JFK in the head is it now whether Duvalier actually believed this or not is kind of besides the point Haitians start to believe it and the idea is that if Papadoc could kill the leader of the free world then no one was safe it's a good bit of you know pr and at some point he goes to a cave doesn't he go to a cave a sacred cave in heishi and he i don't know he finds something uh and he brings back some like right oh demons he brings back demons he's just freaking everyone out he says that i've got some demons i'm gonna unleash on on the on the island right if you don't if yeah if you don't behave or whatever we've all got demons though yeah they're not they're not mental health demons it's not like alcoholism I've gone to a cave and I've found my demons he's got actual demons he's being interviewed by Stephen Bartlett and he's talking about his demons and Stephen thinks it's alcoholism and he's like no it's like a big red scary guy with horns yeah it's a dragon that's going to rape you in the mouth if you don't obey me and is that a metaphor?

28:31does that represent your struggle with addiction? no it represents your struggle with this demon's dick in your mouth one of the most disturbing practices is that he would cut off heads of his enemies and then have a bath with them yeah because he thought he would get their intelligence yeah I'd like to see him try with Charlie see what happens does it spread but it's like a I guess it's like a sort of lush bath bomb in Haiti does it fit? well it must do I'm just thinking if if you know if Millie's Cookies in Haiti is dirt then a sort of then a lush bath bomb Muddy's cookies. A lush bath bomb is a guy's head.

29:10Yeah. Isn't it? Yeah. So, but I mean, I guess you have a lot of baths, Charlie. Yeah, I love it in there. You love bath. I don't really ever put anything in the bath other than my body. Water? Yeah, yeah. Good, good. Naked in a dry bath. He's dry docking. Face down, presenting you somewhere else. I've got that picture. It's like a ship before you launch it. Let's put that picture up. get the picture up that's good stuff just put it in the edit but it should be said that it should be said that Papadoc is bathing still wearing his hat which is what I like to think are patrons there it is they wear their fedora in do you think he's is this how Papadoc is having a bath yeah that's how Charlie if you've ever wondered where are you thinking you are at this point where have you teleported to here but are you treating it like you know in Harry Potter where they dunk their head in the...

30:07Yeah, and they come out. Are you trying to look at your old memories by dunking your head? No, it's like the beginning of Terminator 2 when Schwarzenegger just arrives, but Charlie's just arrived in a bath and then drowned. I don't know. I think sometimes I pretend I'm in like a river, but mainly it's the sea. Anyway, so Papadoc has a bath with his enemy's heads and he's still got his top hat on, But he thinks that he can gain his enemies' ideas. Right. From sharing a bath with them. Right. So instead of reading books. Yes. You just chop their head off and bathe with it. Yeah. So he claims the dead could speak and they reveal their plots.

30:47So he's talking to it as well, probably. Oh, yeah. He's talking to them. A kid having a tea party with his toys. Except just his enemies' heads and a bath. Yeah. Is he making them, like, kiss?

31:02yeah i guess probably yeah now it's all with a chinese accent as well you gotta remember yeah it's pretty fucking it's a lot it's a lot at once it's a lot going on so what do you think yeah he was a lot to be honest he was he was a bit much the chinese accent and the dead heads yeah just it was a lot kind of overstimulating to be around now foreign journalists obviously they love all this yeah we showed a bit of wicker's world and he absolutely loves it he tells a story alan wicker in that in that um episode where uh papadoc had rung up uh haitian airlines whatever to book a flight and then um the boy had been very helpful this young boy had been helpful at the other end of the phone and he said oh what's your name he went oh to ponce i mean he went oh do i know that name he went yeah you um uh that guy was in the army and and you you arrested him 11 years ago he went oh right okay never mind you've been very helpful anyway put the phone down then the next day the boy's dad came home oh so he just he just obviously just released him because he'd like good customer service basically yeah interesting so he does have a there's there is a level of mercy there there was social mobility there you know you can't accuse him of not lifting people out of poverty wouldn't you say there's a state of customer service in this country i think it could do with a lot more kidnappings yeah kidnap they've would you like the power of being like when you're being put on hold or being sent to the manager after the manager would it be great if you'd kidnap their dad well how about i've got your dad and if you want to see him again yeah sort it out sort it out virgin media i've got your kids there's a lot to be said for that yeah i mean what's the most you've ever lost it at a cold caller do you ever actually lose it yeah yeah really that's my therapy do you feel bad No, no.

32:47I mean, I do think they're kind of audio punch bags. Charlie was shocked there. I just think, you know. It's stressful for you. They're not real people. But it's like a punch bag in the garage. I know they're real people, but... I tell them I can't hear. I pretend I got bad decisions. But you can't hear. So that's not... The point is... Is it like chopping wood for you? Yeah, it is. Just the therapeutic sort of... The thing is, if they're not going to speak to me like they're a real person, then I'm not going to treat them as if they're a real person. Right? if they're not going to just help and lose the fucking corporate bullshit, even though they're not a corporate person because they're fucking earning whatever.

33:23Yeah. You know, then I'm not, I'm just going to use you as a stress punch bag. Well, it's not their fault. No, I know it's not their fault. But they put them as the men over the trench of people who's actually fought it. And you're still going to gun them down. It's war. Thank you. Yeah. Am I going to not gun them down? Yeah. I mean, yeah, this is a 19 year old lad, you know, from Sheffield, who has nothing to do with the powers that be. but he's still in the way of my machine gun and he's going to die. Yeah, because that's my job. No, I just, I can't be, yeah, I just can't be doing with it. Is there anything that would like, if they were like nice jumper, would you, would it affect?

33:58Charlie, what's the question? What would it take for you to like be scared and not like stick it on them and actually respect them? Oh yeah, probably that actually, Charlie. You answer your question immediately. Nice jumper. Whoa, this is terrifying. I'm not giving up. I am selling the building. The final season of FX is the bear. The restaurant is flooded. Everything's either going to be okay. No, stop. Or not. We are outgunned and we are outmanned. We have each other. FX is the bear, the final season. All episodes now streaming on Disney+. I'm Glenn Washington, host of Snap Judgment from KQED.

34:45Every week, Snap drops you inside someone's biggest decision. The kind of decision you can only make once. With everything on the line, what do you believe? What do you want? And what would you risk to get it? Find out. Tap to listen now to Snap Judgment from KQED on Spotify.

35:16Bye.

35:37offer for initial plan term only greater than 50 gigabytes may slow when network is busy see terms so obviously the foreign journalists that are writing about haiti they kind of bleed into the myth that he's creating because they love the idea it's a good story of like exotic voodoo nonsense um goat entrails didn't there was a thing where i don't think we mentioned it last time he thought he could predict the future by like reading goat entrails so they love it and so they love it they love it you salt you fucking love it but the westerners all love it and that's what makes it worse and then speech writers rewrite the lord's prayer to address papadoc directly our doc our doc who art in the national palace um and they change the flag colours to um associate it with they make it red and black now by the early 1960s duvalier's terror had driven thousands of Haitians into exile yeah students intellectuals young professionals people in new york there's a little haiti in new york i think or is it in miami anyway um people have lost family over there so from this community emerges the jeune haiti young haiti and uh it's a group of about 13 young men mostly students who are deeply influenced by recent history and castro's guerrilla victory in cuba yeah so they then basically be like right if we go over there and light a spark the rest of haiti will rise up yeah they forget that it's basically a bin okay and if you put if you set if you put a match in a bin the bin's just gonna be a big old bin fire bin fire the whole assassination of jfk hardens their resolve because kendy had been actually serious serious about trying to curb duvalier yeah um cutting aid and stuff so um in 1964 the 13 people so they have you know bear in mind last episode we talked about a coup of eight people yeah it's not there's not a lot of people who have a lot of get up and go no it's like three or four i feel like it's gonna take more than sort of double figures to take you don't even know how it feels like you could you can just if you walk in there we're still not if you manage to shoot him in the head then you can become president immediately yeah but we're still not uh like a they're not even they've not even filled a mega bus so 13 people go to haiti and they establish or they try to establish a gorilla presence in the mountains but haiti's mountains are not cubas so cuba's had like a lot of um like jungle and cover and haiti's mountains are just kind of completely exposed there's no cover and peasants aren't going to help because they're terrified of the big bad juju man in the in the palace wherever so the rebels get discovered and get betrayed uh others are tracked by the tun tun boys and they get killed executed and so but duvalier ensures that their deaths are displayed and then this is mad the corpse of a captured jean haiti fighter is placed in an armchair outside the arrivals hall at porto prince airport so that tourists when they land they get their bags and they go out to get a cab and they see a fucking dead guy in an armchair so i guess vibe kill the success of a lot of caribbean nations to sort of stabilize yes has been tourism right barbados even just across the Dominican Republic, right?

38:49I feel that's one of the steps as to why Haiti hasn't taken off as a big tourist destination. It's a big blind spot of Papadocs, I think. It's just the optics. Don't hang your political enemies outside the arrival pool. Doing departures. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? So that you're leaving and you go, we had a lovely holiday. What's that? That was weird. That's weird. Yeah, it sets you up for a bad, you know, the idea of welcome drinks is like the opposite of that. You know, when I went to Fiji, when we got off the main like little ferry onto a little boat to go to our island they had leleys on there was a ukulele they gave us like a they gave us like an alcoholic smoothie thing with an umbrella in it I was like this is fucking brilliant it makes you feel welcome it's a dead guy rotting in an armchair you'd be like I feel like I'm not welcome here maybe they'll do that to us you know well I don't think we're going to Haiti no I mean in this country because we're ending up like Haiti oh of course and podcasters are the last front of free speech we've been talking about Haiti what I mean Haiti is an area of London.

39:44Yeah. Now, basically. We're the last truth tellers left. Sadiq's Tuntun Makuts. And we're probably going to get, I like the arrogance of people who think they're going to get killed, but they got off and it's like, no one cares what you have to say. No, they're going to try and kill me. They won't. No. You're going to die of type 2 diabetes, brother. Dapper laughs, knows too much. He's going to get taken out by Sadiq's London. But it'd be great if we were putting the departures, arrivals, Heathrow, on this sofa. Just dead like that. With the mic. This is what happens to podcasts. Just so people know.