244. JVN on The Financial Wake Up Call That Changed Everything

20:50Tiffany Aliche:Yeah. It's taken me almost this whole, like literally you guys in this time, I have gotten a new business managing team. I learned how to budget. I understand what a P and L is. I also, the first thing I did after I had you on, I understood what I spent a month, which when I figured that out, I was like, someone take like someone just, someone take my credit cards for me. No, just take me out. And also that was the other thing I learned about. Cause like I ended up, I bought, I bought like, I bought more than one property. And when I was buying properties, I was like, oh, well, it's like the down payment and it's like the mortgage.

21:22That's what I was thinking in my head. It wasn't until I did the budgeting where I was like, no, girl, it's like the maintenance. It's when someone breaks. It's when something breaks. And that's like all money that you can't invest, you can't save. So then my business manager was like, well, this is how much money it costs you to run that property for a year. And then I was like, oh my God. And in this economy with real estate, honey, like now I just had to like, I learned about it after I interviewed you. It took me like kind of four months to figure all that out. Four months to kind of start saving again.

21:50Four months to like stop the bleeding, like to get it kind of together, figure it out. then like now I got these fucking properties and I'm like, I don't want to do this anymore. This is really stressful, but it's not cute to sell a house right now. So now I've just had to like sit with my impulsivity and just like sit with these decisions and wait for the right time. And I can't do no fun impulse buying, can't buy no cute bags. Although I did relapse at Hermes a few weeks ago. I like, it's fine. Everyone like I was a tiny relapse. I haven't really relapsed since 2024, like on an Hermes moment.

22:22and I know that you don't really act like that and you don't really believe in that, but I'm stupid and I can't help it. And that French craftsmanship.

22:30Tiffany Aliche:That's beautiful. I get it. Well, congratulations. You will see me doing that. Thank you. But no, congratulations for all of it. And I think that one thing that anybody listening can take away is, you know, whether it's discovering my work or, you know, discovering somebody else who's starting to take money seriously, you then think, okay, I'm going to fix it all. And that's going to take two days. And I'm like, it's actually not like, like it's going to take a long time to understand your financial trauma, to understand your triggers, to get your financial house in order to start figuring out how to make proactive decisions.

23:03Tiffany Aliche:And so what I love of what you just said is it's like, it takes months, if not years, it takes a long time. And like, that's not something to beat yourself up over. That's just the natural part of this. and I got I became you know I was saying I became obsessed with solid core or did I tell you that I can't stop talking about it my intention for the last like two weeks in class I've been like when when the teacher's like okay like what's your intention like and then you like said it like quietly in my head I'm like when that voice is like buy it go on re-bag get something resale that's better because it's cheaper than retail and like that's how I can like but the voice tells me all sorts of different ways to like get around my rules to like impulse buy something like even when it's out of my budget or like I you know I wasn't I wasn't like and so like in my solid I'm like when that voice gets intense think of it like this in your solid core and you're not going to do it like we're going to bump up right against that intensity but we're not going to do it because of course it feels intense but we're not going to like do it but um yeah I you know I still do mess up sometimes but I would say I'm like a good 85 percent better yeah well and better Better doesn't mean perfect, right?

24:10Tiffany Aliche:Like better does not mean you've never spent money because that's a diet. We know diets don't work and it's the same thing with spending. Yeah. So it's like you have to have a little flexibility with yourself. Very triggered by the bags. I think it's like sex in the city and being a millennial or something. I don't know. I'm just, I'm very, it's very trigger city for me, a bag. Yeah. Well, you found the thing that you love. And I think we probably talked about this when I came on your show, but it's like value categories, right? You find the three things in your life that you love spending money on.

24:36Tiffany Aliche:And for me, like. Okay, because yours is travel. Right. Yes, you're right. Yeah. Good memory. Yeah. So like, what are you going to get? I tried the designer thing, Jonathan. Like I tried it because I saw all of these people being like, you know, once I started making a little bit of money, I was like, oh, is this what you're supposed to spend your money on when you have some money? And then I would go and I would see, you know, this Gucci bag that I thought was beautiful, but it'd be six thousand dollars. And I was like, nope, that's not for me. Like it doesn't it doesn't tickle anything. But you know what does?

25:06Tiffany Aliche:Yeah. A luxury hotel. Oh, I dream about it for weeks. I like look at all the amenities multiple times. Like I know what the amenities are, but I go to the website and I like look at all of them and I try to do it on like credit card points too. So at least like half the stay is covered. It's getting you so much endorphins. Like you're just getting like fucking endorphin hit after endorphin hit. Well, because I do so much - You're getting the pretty room. Literally. And I do so much taking care of people all of the time. Like I'm an Enneagram too. I take care of our team. I take care of my partner.

25:34Tiffany Aliche:And it's so nice where I'm just like, someone's going to come clean after me, clean up after me like twice a day. I don't have to worry about anything. I don't have to cook. And so that's the thing that I look forward to. But it's like to each their own. Can we take a... Okay, because I just have to tell you, I follow you very closely on the social, okay? That's very nice. I didn't know this. This is so nice. And I saw your thing about you're like, these are the things as a millionaire that may surprise you. And it was like, you're never going to see me like spending the money on the designer bag.

26:02Like I tried a couple of times that it's not for me. Like I literally, like I follow you. Like I'm like obsessed. So then I almost teoned you about it. But then I was like, don't be psychotic. But since you brought it up and let's like talk about it. So can we just take like a three minute bag detour into like bag land? Because I've made so many mistakes. I've learned the bags that don't last. I've learned the bags that do. I've learned how to score them for cheaper. I've learned about resale. I've learned that like how you can resale well if you want to. And I've learned the ones that do hold their value and the ones that do not hold their value.

26:29Part of this is because I also like secretly ghost follow Bethany Frankel. But I don't want her to know. So don't anybody tell her because I'm scared that she's going to review my hair products online. And she's going to be like, I don't like this shit. Even though I do think that she would like it if she did try it. But like, I don't know why I'm just like, I revere her, but I'm also like kind of scared of her. It's like this. Oh, she's terrifying. Yeah, it's like this like multi-pronged ball for me with Bethany Frankel. But I do really like look up to her and Her Bag University. It taught me a lot about my steez as I've been like, you know, understanding like my categories.

26:58And like, because remember how when you were on and I was like, oh my God, of all my impulse buys, there's only like 25 % of them that I love that I would like use again that like I like I love so then I started about like I was like let me get rid of that other 75 because it just brings up like guilt and shame that I like let my impulsivity like win and I don't need them collecting dust and so the ones that like made me sad to get rid of I didn't get rid of but the ones that I was like I literally don't give a shit if I ever wear that again and it's been on a shelf for like literally years those ones I sold so this is what I learned yes please tell us because

27:30Tiffany Aliche:I'm even curious what, because all of it feels to me because it's not something that I love spending my money on a slight waste of money. Now I'm not shaming you. I'm not shaming anybody listening. If you save, if that's the thing that's going to bring you a ton of joy, great. I'm just hard on my shit. Like I'm just, I wear the same bag. These are the bags that you can be hard on. These are the bags that you can be hard on and not, and it will not waste your money. The row, the row bags hold up so well. They have a small cross body. That's incredible that like, it's not for like computers and stuff.

28:00It's just a small crossbody. You can write it so hard. It's like two grand. I've had one for like six years. And also if you fuck your stuff up from the row, you can send it back to them and they will like repair your bags. It's like lifetime bag repair. So they're really good. I'm like obsessed with the row. Now I know that this is a thing and I know that it's annoying. I know that it's annoying, but I did finally get an essay, like a sales associate at Hermes who I did like who I can get like a bag from Hermes now. and I did not have to spend that much money. You really don't have to like go like buy all these other things.

28:31Like that's all you really just have to find an essay that you like that you connect with that like likes you. And and you might have to go to multiple stores to find that person. So my I just bought fragrance. I brought fragrance. I found one and I was like, oh, like I didn't go in for the bag. I was like, I just really want fragrance. And then once you once they're like then and if they ask you what bags you would like, that's how you found your girl. If they don't ask you, you don't ask them and you got a new one.

28:56Tiffany Aliche:but i have to pause you i have to pause you tell me for the civilian what does this mean because a lot of people don't know you can't just walk into hermes and be like that one like what what is happening when you say i have a person now you have you have to get like a sales associate at hermes if you want to score a burkin or kelly there are some bags that you can be like i want that one but there are certain bags that you have to be like offered but there's this like whole like wives tale that you got to like spend a certain amount and that was not my experience Like you just have to find a sales associate that likes you.

29:27I got my bag off of like, I just bought a fragrance and that's how I got my first bag after that. The point of that is resale or mezzes are like really expensive because I like didn't want to wait. And then I was like, oh my God, this is expensive. If you can get it from the store, it's actually like, it's still expensive, but it's nothing like resale. And like, I don't resale my bags because like I'm obsessed with them. But if someone did do that, like you could actually really make money on that. But like, don't ever like tell them that. but I'm like not a resale girly for Hermes because like now that I finally got there, I'm like, I just want my like one seat your bag.

30:00And like, I love it, but they do resale really well. So if you ever did need to get rid of your bags, Hermes is the only bag that actually is an investment where you could buy something and then sell it for what you bought it for or more and actually use it. So I don't do that, but you could do that if you wanted to. And like, they actually like really do hold their value. It's like crazy Chanel. I don't know if they really care about reselling their bags the way that Hermes, because if Hermes finds out that you're reselling a bag, they don't like this. Chanel, I don't think it's really the same, but I did resell.

30:31My Chanel's were some of the ones where I was like, oh, I resold a lot of those suckers. And in my experience with the Chanel's, they keep like half their value. So you buy it, you literally never use it again. You keep it in the box. So that's really not a good investment. I always thought that those were like good investment pieces. They're not. The only one that actually is, in my experience, is Hermes, but they really hold up. You can really use them. The row I feel like holds up really, really good. Bottega holds up really, really good. And actually for the girl who does not want to spend a lot of money on a bag, but wants a designer bag, this is what I would say.

31:03Because this is what I learned. Bottega does not hold their value, but you can beat the shit out of them. So if I was trying to do, like trying to save a little money, but wanted something really gorgeous, and this is someone who's resold like a lot of their Bottegas, because I just like didn't use a lot of them. like there's, but there's bags that cost eight grand like retail that someone lightly uses. Like there's not even a stain. It's just like used and there's not a box, but like it looks very new. You can get it for$1 ,700,$1 ,500. So you can get like one that's got like a little bit of wear and tear for like 800, but it will last you for like 10 ,000 years.

31:38And it's kind of cool when it's like a little bit worn, you know? So the resale market really is like, you can get like bags that are like a quarter, a third, because most bags don't hold their value. So you really like that six grand Gucci bag. You could probably get for like 800 from like rebag.

31:54Tiffany Aliche:I didn't know any of this. Look at this. And the row is, isn't that Mary Kate and Ashley's brand? Yes. Who those fucking girls. Like if I wouldn't just like lay down on train tracks for them, which I would like, I don't know why they're like, actually, this is the row. Let me put you on the row sale. Can I put you on the row sale? You guys type in the row.com and just look in there like once a week. They'd never talk about it. It's very low key. It's very secret. You have to go on there online and then you click on the men and women. And then every once in a while, it'll just say sale. Like this sweater that I'm wearing, you guys, I literally got it for 75 % off.

32:27I think no one liked it because it's got these like insanely long sleeves, but I love like a crazy long sleeve and this like V-neck. So you go on their sale. They really do have steep cuts, but they never advertise because they're like chic ass luxury ladies. So they're not, they're not, they're not advertising their sales. You guys got to sneak in there like a thief in the night on their online. look for the sale and their sale like you can just pillage it i have gotten on their sale stuff it would have cost like twelve thousand dollars at the store for like three thousand for like a bunch of stuff shoes sweaters like like they have good ass sales and their stuff really is made so well it holds up like it really does like beat it up yeah yes well and let's talk about that for a

33:08Tiffany Aliche:second because i think anybody who's listening to this show knows that i will no matter what you want to spend your money on as long as you can afford it and it's a thoughtful purchase, I don't fucking give a shit. I don't care. You can buy your designer stuff. You can buy your Four Seasons Hotel. I do not care. We do not shame people by saying, oh, it costs us much. Like you spend your money on the things that you love. However, what I think you're talking about for somebody who might be going, oh, I can't$3 ,000. That's crazy. Can you maybe talk about spending money on things that hold up or last as opposed to the things that you might get like at H &M.

33:44Tiffany Aliche:Because I think that that was something I learned in my 20s even. Now, I'm still not a shopping designer, but it was like, okay, I'm willing to pay$120 for a pair of jeans that fit me really well, because I know I'm going to have them and wear them for a very long time. So can you talk to me more about that? Yes. So, I mean, I also just would say that like, Like, you know, H &M, like I have H &M pieces that I've had for like 15 years, like 10 years. Like I have some H &M stuff that like, I don't know if it's like from some factory because like some stuff holds up really good from there. And then some it's like, you know, you wear it for a year or two and it's like not happening anymore.

34:22So I don't know. Like you can get like really great stuff from like your H &Ms and from your, you know, like that level of retailer, like chef's kiss. I would also say another retailer that's really good that's like, it's giving like the row, but not those prices, but it's more expensive than H &M is Cause. I really like COS Cause. And also I really like Quince. Quince and Cause are two places where you can get like really good luxury.

34:50Tiffany Aliche:Quince is a sponsor of the show. I'm obsessed with them. Oh man, we love Quince. Even if they weren't sponsoring the show, they're so good. Girl, you know when I discovered them after I met you? Because I was like, I can't be going to the role like this anymore, but I still want some nice cashmere sweaters. Like I still want some like luxurious. And then after Kim K like did all her Kim K stuff, I was like, well, I can't be wearing Skims dresses like that everywhere. So I still wear the old ones because those bitches were expensive, but I don't buy new ones. And they have really cute, like, um, like spaghetti strap, like, you know, just like wear around the house dresses on points that I love.

35:21So I think I'll also turn you on to Spanx.

35:24Tiffany Aliche:Spanx doesn't just make shapewear. So I fuck with all their stuff. I love me some Spanx. Sarah Blakely followed us about three months ago, and I literally cried because I love this woman so much. But I have probably six, five or six of their jumpsuits. They are the most comfortable things. Okay, not an ad, but they are so comfortable. And I literally worn them on like transatlantic 12-hour flights, and they still hold their shape, which I've never found before. If you're wearing something all day, like usually it gets a little stretchy. It stretches out. It did not stretch at all. And I wear these things like a second skin all the time.

36:03I love her. I think she's so brilliant. Now, I will tell you how I like about like the lasting thing for like, you know, spending something. So yeah. So I just cannot emphasize enough. The resale market really is so good. People are reselling stuff that is so not used and like barely used and it just does not hold its value. I'm talking like the web addresses, Bottega dresses. Like if you have not messed with the real, real get into it. Like, I'm sorry, but if that is one of your top three categories, but like you're like, that's too expensive. Get into that resale. I'm getting so many cute pieces like for fractions of the cost.

36:38That's that. Now, I don't know if you'll believe me when I say this, and this might be one of those things where I thought I was doing good, but maybe I wasn't. But this is how I justify my expensive pieces from like, you know, like those more expensive pieces. So I take the price, right? then I think to myself, I'm going to wear this for like 10 events or like eight events. Like I'm going to wear this like this many times this year or like this many times. Like I'm, I'm, I plan it out. Cause usually when I buy stuff like that, it is for work. It's either for like tour or for work. It's like, not for me to like wear out to brunch, but still it's like a cost is a cost.

37:09So I'm not like trying to spend money just, you know, to spend it. So I think about like price per wear. So if I'm like, if I can have this thing for like a couple of years and I can wear it for like three stage shows, a press tour and like another thing, then it's like not really 3000. It's like 400 or 300, like a time. So you could like apply that to whatever your like price range is. And then you just like, and I wear my pieces. I don't like wear it once and then like put it up. I don't like buy one thing and then put it in like some, you know, like fashion rotundo that I don't ever break out again.

37:41Cause ever since I met you, literally I resold all the stuff that I don't repeat that I consider like it was kind of impulsive or it was like trendy or was for like one thing. I literally don't do that anymore. I only buy stuff that I can re-wear for like a long time or that like I am obsessed with. I also buy a bunch of resale stuff now that I didn't used to. So I really have like fundamentally changed my approach to like how I like dress myself for work. I do think about like a price per wear thing. And I also think about like if there was something that I was rougher on, you know, a couple of H &M things in a row, like they're like, that's still like a couple hundred.

38:15And if you just like ruin it or like don't really take care of it, you end up, it kind of reminds me of like cheap shampoo and conditioner versus like better shampoo and conditioner. The better is like more concentrated. It actually lasts longer. And then you have to like buy more of the less good stuff, which is like a little harder on your hair. So it's like at the end of the year, you may be paid like pretty close to the same thing, but the quality of one was way better than the other, which I do feel like that's not blowing smoke. Like I feel like that's real. So that's what I, that's how I do it.

38:42Tiffany Aliche:We're talking about all this stuff of, you know, the lifestyle that both of us have now. But I think a lot about for me, it was, you know, I'm 30. For me, it was my early 20s of trying to navigate just spending money in these really micro moments on the things that I love. And can you take me back before Queer Eye? Because you had just turned 30 when you joined the cast. Like, what was your money or spending like when you were a small business owner just trying to get by? Sorry, I keep jumping right in here when we get to the really good questions. But hey, the sponsors keep this show 100 % free for you.

39:16Tiffany Aliche:So when we come back, we're talking about Jonathan's rise to fame through Queer Eye and everything they wish that they had done differently when they started making more money. This is such a great lesson if you're someone who has started making more money and wants to know what pitfalls to avoid. Plus, I get into a rapid fire breakdown of retirement accounts. We'll be back.

39:34Tiffany Aliche:Everybody needs a website in 2026. I think it's one of the most important tools in your arsenal, but you especially need one that is beautiful and functional and easy to find. Maybe you're a business owner, maybe you're a freelancer, and maybe you're someone who just needs a place where all of their work can live, especially when you're applying for jobs or getting new clients. We did our first ever website with Squarespace, and it is still the platform that we recommend. The best part about Squarespace is you can do a bunch of stuff inside of it. So yeah, it's a website tool, but you can also send emails, you can sell content, You have your analytic tools all in one.

40:07Tiffany Aliche:So you don't have to like pay for a million different platforms. And when my partner needed a website to launch his business, this is where we turned. I literally helped him set up his Squarespace and we had his beautiful website all done in a weekend. Head on over to squarespace.com for a free trial. And when you're ready to launch, use offer code FFpod to save 10 % off your first purchase of a website or domain. I shared this on social media, but my family and I have been going through a rough time. For the past nine months, it's been really, really difficult to just do life. And we got some news that was just really hard.

40:39Tiffany Aliche:I started sending factor meals to my parents. My mom manages her diabetes with diet and exercise, and they have incredible keto meals. And so for the past six months, I have been sending them factor. And they have truly loved it. They are ready in two minutes. There's no prep. There's no cleanup. They are actually fresh. They're not frozen. I look forward to my factor delivery every week because it just makes my life so much much easier. I am like feeling so good because my meals are portioned out. And they were also just so kind after I messaged them and told them, hey, you are helping us get through this hard time as a family.

41:15Tiffany Aliche:They sent me and my mom a year's supply of food. So we appreciate you supporting them because they have supported me and my family in a really sweet way. Let's eat real. Head to factormeals.com slash food50off and use code food50off to get 50 % off and one free breakfast item per box for one year while supplies last until October 31st, 2026. That's code food50off at factormeals.com. See website for more details.

41:47It was obviously really different because I was like, you know,$70 ,000 or like, I mean, I think when I, the first year I did hair like in LA, after I moved back to LA, it was like, it was like 40, 60, 80. And then it like, I think then I like booked queer eye and like the year that I booked queer eye was like the first year that like in the salon, I got to like right around a hundred K, um, like before taxes and like, you know, having to do like all of the things. Cause I was a small business owner, but one thing I've noticed about myself is is that whether I made like 40 ,000 a year or what I've made in these last few years the impulsivity and like the resistance to budgeting and like that was there then and it was there now like now it may have been like a robe bag but I remember so viscerally like going to all things and seeing this like suede boot and it was like 159 dollars and I was like 159 dollars for a fucking boot like god damn like they're trying to rob me blind but that suede is so gorgeous and I'm and I dreamt about it and I thought about it and I was like am I really someone who could just like buy like$160 boots?

42:53Like who do I think I am? And then this client like tipped me really good. And then I was like, I'm fucking buying the boots. I took myself to like third street promenade to that all saints. And I bought those boots and I literally still have them in my closet. Those have not befallen the resale. Cause they're like, so like sentimental to me, even though I don't wear them anymore. And I remember the first apartment that I bought, there was like a one bedroom instead of like a bachelorette. Like I was, I remember like asking all my clients and being like, do you think I can like, is that like, Do you think, and they were like, girl, yes, like you can do it, girl, like get the fucking apartment.

43:25So a lot of anxiety, a lot of like not knowing it. And the reason that I had the anxiety is because like, I didn't want to budget. I didn't want to know how much I was spending. I didn't want to look at some of the behaviors. So I just like ostriched it. And it was literally not until, not to say 18 million times, you know, until like I met you that I stopped doing that. So whether I made a little bit or like a lot of it, a lot of the same behaviors, same approach, And like, so yeah, it just was like a smaller, different scale. I would say that one really intense thing for me at least, and this is why I'm so passionate about politics and I talk about it so much and living with HIV is like in my twenties, like the HIV social safety net, like saved my life.

44:05And so it was really important. Like at the time, you know, like I, you know, if you make over a certain amount, like you don't qualify, which I really didn't have to worry about because like, I wasn't really even close to that amount. But I remember like the first year, it was the year that I booked where I were like took myself off of it. And I remember like going to the office and being like, I'm going to make too much this year. Like I don't need this like assistance. And I was like so proud of myself, but like without that, like, and also like that was so stressful. Cause like, it wasn't like just provided like you, like you're qualifying for like the Medi-Cal and like them helping you with your medicine is like incumbent upon you filing your taxes.

44:42It also like had to, at least when I was doing it, it was like all about your birthday. So it like always renewed on your birthday. So like mine, my birthday is like right before like taxes are due. So like, and as an independent contractor, I was always like shitting my pants and like February and March, cause I would like do it by the month. But you know, it just was so stressful. Cause it's like when you turn everything in, if it doesn't go through or if it's not on time and it's like your medicine and when you achieve and maintain an undetectable viral load, like you're not contagious, but if you get cut off from your medicine, like that's not good.

45:12And so it's really stressful. And like, that wasn't like an easy thing to navigate. It was like the early days of the Affordable Care Act. So I was navigating like the ACA, Medi-Cal, Medicaid, like the subsidies, you know, learning that I had HIV, living with that. And my like, you know, it was like my mid to late 20s that I like, I found out when I was like 25. And then I booked Queer Eye when I was 29. So there was four years of like, just a lot of nail biting and worriedness around like, and then once I did make a little more money, then I was like, oh my God, what if I do make too much? And what if I'm not?

45:41And what if I get cut off? But then what if like I break my wrist or like what if something happens and then I don't make as much money. And so like the whole system is really fucked up because the last thing someone should be worrying about is like acquiring their pills. Like for public safety, once you know you have HIV, if you can like get on your meds and stay on them, you can't. You literally that's like where that whole saying like undetectable equals untransmittable comes from. It's like when you're undetectable, you literally can't pass the virus like sexually. Like for me to give someone HIV, like my liver would have to like lacerate down the middle and like fall in your liver because we like were in a such a like, you know what I mean?

46:18It would be like gruesome blood exchange. Like it'd be like, and we're probably not living through that anyway. But it's just incredible how far we've come and how like not that big of a deal living with HIV needs to be like because it really like, you know, I take a pill once a day, go to the doctor every three months. I feel great. I'm not contagious. like you know but your life expectancy from diagnosis now is 50 to 75 years which is incredible like my goal of living to be 107 is like still attainable because found out when i was 25 like i'm still totally in this um but yeah but it is it becomes a really big fucking deal when you can't get your medicine it goes from being this like treatable disease where it's not really an issue for public safety because like i said you're not you know passing it around but when it when you cut off your medication actually there's a supreme court case going on right now where this you know employer in texas it's called braidwood management versus like something but they're the employer and like they don't want to cover preventative care and i can already feel what you guys are thinking you're like well how does this affect me guess what also is preventative care birth control so these people are trying to say that because of their religious like their faith.

47:29They don't feel that they should have to cover birth control or prep for their employees. And this is going to like directly affect public health. And another thing that makes me so angry is when people would say like, well, you know, family planning and birth control, like isn't economics. Like that's not kitchen table issues. Like when they would say that about Kamala and it's like, what the fuck do you mean? That's not kitchen table issues. Do you know how expensive it is to raise a kid? Like that is the most, like not having reproductive autonomy and reproductive to freedom. Like I learned that from Melinda Gates, not to name drop Melinda French Gates, but her work and her and her research, like took her all over the world to like developing countries.

48:07And they found that when women didn't have access to family planning, that's what like causes the impact to like opportunity issue. Yeah, absolutely.

48:16Tiffany Aliche:Yep. I'm sure you guys already know that, but I learned about it and I was like, my little gay mind was just like, uh, no, but it's, it's what we talk about so much in my work where you and I can talk about budgeting and we can talk about finding bags for cheap and we can talk about all of this. And it's helpful, right? Talking about budgeting, talking about paying off debt, talking about investing, these are all important things. And they're some of the only things we unfortunately as individuals can control about our financial picture because there is so much that is policy-driven or lack of policy-driven that directly affects your money.

48:48Tiffany Aliche:And I think we grow up believing that if we're bowed with money or if we don't have enough money, that it's somehow our fault, that we're not good with it, or it's our identity of just, you know, I don't know math, so I'm not good with money. And it's like, no, there's definitely steps you can take, but it's probably because the minimum wage federally has not been raised in, you know, a couple decades. It's probably because abortion access is continually at threat. It's probably because medication is so fucking expensive. And it's like, these things have a lot more to do with whether you're able to financially survive and thrive, then do you know how to money?

49:27Um, I have a really intense pivot that my ADHD wants me to do, but if it doesn't work, you can just like be like, that doesn't work. You're insane. And then we can just go, but I have a question for you. Talk to me. For me. Okay. So ever since I met you now, like all my girls, cause I talk about it so much. One of my girlfriends like went through this thing where she found out that her mom had had like a life insurance policy that she didn't know about. And then her mom like passed away. And then she came into like almost a hundred grand. She literally hung up on the insurance company three times because she thought it was a joke.

49:57And then like the fourth time they were like, please don't hang up. This is like not a fucking joke. Like we're trying to figure out how to get you this, like very life-changing money. So like her and then my other girlfriend like got like 10 grand. And in both of their cases, their debt was like way less than what they got, whether it was 10 or the hundred. So they were like, well, what should I do? And I was really good with like, figure out your monthly budget first. That's the first thing that you have to do then you're going to pay off the credit cards but you don't want to do it all the way to the zero every month you got to have like a little bit to like figure that out based you know what you want to put on there figure out what your thing are is that not right i you stopped me

50:28Tiffany Aliche:because i opened my mouth really wide we actually want to pay off our credit cards completely that is one of the myths all the way every month all the way every month it's one of the myths that gets perpetuated and it's like oh we'll increase your credit score that way it's like no it just puts you in debt it's not a big deal they can pay it off really quick especially if they have that amount of money. I told her to keep like one 50. I told her to keep like 150 on there a month. Okay, so I have to call her back and tell her that. You can send her my way too. Oh God, Jesus Christ. Okay, so I'll tell her that.

50:55I also actually already did. I told her that she should have been like, I already told her that like 19 million times and she may have done that by now. She's really cute. So, but then this is the part that I get stuck on for independent contractors.

51:06Tiffany Aliche:So like, I do the credit card thing and then it's like the do the three months of your three to six months of your like emergency fund saved up. And then you got to like do your retirement stuff. And then for the independent contractors, I can't explain the difference. And when I read about it online, why is a Roth or not a Roth better? And like, who is that better for again? And like, what's the difference again? I just cannot fucking figure it out. And I want to understand it. No, I love this question. Okay. So let's just talk about Roth versus traditional before we add independent contractor in.

51:34Tiffany Aliche:So whether it's a traditional IRA, a traditional 401k, a Roth IRA, a Roth 401k, it's basically the differences in how they're taxed. So if you have a traditional 401k, that is a 401k offered through your employer. So if you are a 9-to-5 or a W-2 and you get a 401k, you cannot open a separate 401k. That's either a benefit that's offered to you or not. the traditional Roth or 401k means that you are paying the tax when you retire. So the money's getting taken out at that point. A Roth 401k or Roth IRA means that you are paying the tax now. And the IRA and the 401k, again, the 401k is offered through your employer.

52:20Tiffany Aliche:The IRA stands for individual retirement account. So pretty much anybody can open one of those, whether you're self-employed. Even if you have a 401k too, right? Yes, you can open both. Yep. So I think I need to do, I think like that's the next thing I should do. Sidebar. Like I need to get an IRA. I need you in stock market school really, which is my program that teaches you how to invest. Um, and we'll, I'll talk to you later about it. So the IRAs are again, individual retirement accounts. Roth means you pay the tax now. Now, uh, everybody's got to make their own decision. You got to choose the one that's right for you.

52:49Tiffany Aliche:For me, I like Roth options for the average person for two reasons. One, it's like giving 65-year-old me a little gift. It's like, hey, I paid the tax. 30-year-old me paid the tax. Go take your hot Pilates instructor named Luca out for lunch where you drink Sauvignon Blanc in Italy. That's my real-life retirement plan. The second thing is I have no idea what the fuck taxes are going to be. Now, they could be better. It'll probably be Hunger Games. So I would rather just pay the tax now than wait till later. but it gets interesting when you start making more and more money because you then need to go to an accountant and be like which one based on the amount of money I'm making slash the ability you know what money do I have to invest and where should it go so that's where it starts getting slightly more complicated but for the average person listening I don't care what account you contribute to I just care that you're contributing I think a lot of people get hung up on like making the perfect decision.

53:44Tiffany Aliche:And I'm like, honestly, I just need you to pick one and run with it. When you're an independent contractor, you could open up your own 401k. Your business could open up a 401k. It could also open what's called a SEP IRA. It's a self-employed IRA. But you cannot contribute to both of those in a calendar year. It's either 401k or either SEP IRA. But then either of those plus a Roth IRA, for example, you can contribute. So you could do a 401k and a Roth IRA. You could do a SEP IRA and a Roth IRA. In the same year. But again, talk to your accountant. You just can't do a SEP. You just can't do a SEP and a 401k in the same year.

54:22Correct. But you could do a Roth and a... Okay, all right, all right.

54:24Tiffany Aliche:Yeah. It's just the 401k and the SEP IRA have really high maximums that you can contribute. And so they're trying not to, you know, give you the ability to contribute. Give yourself too much of a gift when you're 65. Exactly, exactly, exactly. When's your university? I kind of want to sign up. And also, if you did sign up for that university, does that mean that you don't need an investment manager? Yes. Because you just do your own? Yes, yes. It was actually a question I had for you, and you offered me the perfect segue. But Stock Market School, to not shamelessly plug too hard, because I plugged it on the show before, we literally built not only the ability to teach people how to invest, but the actual technology.

55:01Tiffany Aliche:It's an app that we built. and as of literally like a couple days ago over a hundred million dollars has been invested by the women women plus in that community and 80 of the people who join have never invested before so like we're not just offering education we're like actually bridging wealth gaps and it's my fucking favorite thing but oh my god do you guys hear that on the audio it's it's the hot bitch alarm. It's going off so hard right now again. Girl, that is so cool. It's so it's like my favorite part about my work is like, OK, let's actually get people investing. But one of the things I wanted to talk to you about and again, to whatever like whatever level of vulnerability you want.

55:43Tiffany Aliche:I think that when you booked Queer Eye, when you started making more money, this happens to a lot of people, regardless of whether you were on a Netflix show and you're super famous or not, is if you start making some money, you then think, I don't know how to do this and I need to hand it to somebody else. Like, I don't know how to manage this money and I'm making more money than I've maybe ever made in my life. And I need to hand this to somebody who knows how to money. Unfortunately, well, sometimes it works out. I think unfortunately, sometimes it doesn't. Can you talk to me about your experience of, wow, I'm making really decent money and I don't know what I'm doing.

56:24Tiffany Aliche:So maybe I need to give it to somebody. Yeah. I mean, I had a business manager this whole time because I really didn't know like, I mean, I had an accountant before Queer Eye who I would go to every year for like the health insurance stuff and like, you know, filing my taxes. But then once I booked Queer Eye, I was like doing stand-up comedy in like 30 states and sometimes internationally. So there was like 30 state income tax returns. Like there was like employment stuff. There was like HR stuff. Oh, I'm big fans of accountants. I think accountants are well worth their money. I think. Totally.

56:53Tiffany Aliche:No. Yeah. But, but I'm just saying that like there was, there were things that my old accountant couldn't do once I started doing, you know, stand up in like all these different States and different countries. Like she was licensed in California. She like wasn't licensed. Like she didn't know how to do like some of those like other things. So then I went with like a business manager because I needed someone who could like learn or that could do all of the things and help me like with employment, you know, just anything like, So that's kind of the idea of a business manager is that they do not only your taxes, they should probably help you with your budget.

57:25They usually help you with finding an investment person, but they charge commissions. So they charge like 5 % of everything you make. So that's usually the setup of how that works. So I had like the same one for like years and years and years who I really, really loved. And he didn't like do anything wrong. It's just that like our response to like a budget shortfall or like me being like, wow, I feel like really overextended. And like, you know, I like, oh my God, I'm just like working like so, so, so much. Our answer is just like make more money. Like I needed to like find something else to book, like find something else to do.

58:00And so I just left. I just, and so that was working. and then I but I was just like literally so burnt out like so burnt out sad overwhelmed and then once we had our episode of my bot I was like oh my god like I just don't want to feel like this and I just like brought a lot into focus for me I was like I've never done these exercises I didn't even know anything about this stuff so then that's when I was like I think maybe I need to make a shift so but I didn't do anything reactive I was like let me just start to figure this stuff out then I kind of started to shop around then I found a business manager who took me for like less of a commission, but did more stuff.

58:36And also just like brought me into visibility on more things. Like I never did a profit and loss. I never did a budget. And so I do that, you know, really like in lockstep with this team that I ended up going to. And they've been incredible. You know, I've saved some money because like I said, they charge less. And, you know, could I do it on my own? Like, could me and my like insular team do it on our own? Maybe we could. I'm sure we could. I kind of feel even still like between learning how to write, because I mean, I've written like three books. I'm learning how to write scripted. I'm running a hair care company that's like in seven countries, expanding, trying to turn that bus around because our former parent company filed for bankruptcy in 2023.

59:14So that was a really stressful process and needed to find a new parent company, which we did successfully. And I really liked them. And we've been able to maintain control of our DNA. And oh my God, I have 10 % ownership of my company now, which I never had before. So I actually like have equity in it now, which I never had before, which is really cool. Can I pause you?

59:32Tiffany Aliche:So it has your name, image, and likeness all over it. You didn't own any of it before? Zero percent for the first like three years. Because the company that went bankrupt, they basically were like, we're going to invest like$40 million in this company. You're not investing anything in it. So like you don't get to own any of it, but obviously like no control. You're investing your name and your fucking credibility. But they were like, it wasn't like that. So obviously their business model wasn't great because they went bankrupt. and that was really crazy stressful, you know, and the whole thing because we, my team and our company worked so hard to build ourselves a legacy, not saying that the other companies that were affected by this didn't, but a lot of them don't exist anymore.

1:00:12And a lot of them like didn't find the bandwidth to like, to kind of land on their feet. And that was transitioning from a parent company that goes bankrupt to finding a new parent company. And I'm like really strict about formulas. I'm really strict about packaging. And thank God we found a parent company that was willing to like come in, help resuscitate us, didn't make us change our packaging, didn't make us change our formulas. They've been so supportive. They've invested in us. They gave me 10 % ownership, which is incredible. And also like a vesting schedule to like get more ownership if we meet certain goals.

1:00:42So I'm just so proud of like what we were able to do there. But anyway, the long and short of it is this new business team, like they literally part of their thing was like, you have to have, oh, well, the moral of that other story was like, I just don't want to spend the time and the bandwidth on like learning how to do those things when I'm focusing on other things. But this new team really has been incredible. Like they require that we have a meeting once a week. Like I'm not allowed to skip it. Like, so I have to once a week, we look at income, we are like, we look at cash in, we look at cash out, we look at projections, we look at the whole year.

1:01:13Like I have like a one, three, five year plan. Like we have a savings plan for like what I need to save every month. Like we had to do a little bit of a reorg on like certain things, which kind of, you know, made me lose sleep and made me really sad. Cause like I, I didn't want to really have to do that, but I did have to have some tough conversations because at the bottom line, at the end of the day, I was spending more than I was making and I was not going to reach my goals. So we had to do some reorgs. I'm selling a house, but it hasn't happened yet because I just, you know, patience. So yeah, so that's kind of what it took.

1:01:44It has taken a lot. I'm still sitting with the consequences of some of those impulsive decisions before I knew how to do some of this stuff. But I do really, I, I, and I feel bad because my old business manager really was like so sweet, so nice, but like, that's how a lot of business managers are. They're like, and he wasn't bad. He just wasn't really hands-on. And I will say that these people are women in their like young thirties and they're much more just like, uh, like they don't just really let me coast. They don't do like a yes person thing. They're like, no, no, no. Like we got to talk about this.

1:02:13Cause like we aren't mind readers and like, they just don't let me get away with shit, which I love. And like, I have just learned so much. So maybe someday I could, but right now I really like the support of this team and they help me make sure that like no shit falls through the cracks. I really feel like they're earning their keep because I have so much more security and peace of mind like than I used to.

1:02:29Tiffany Aliche:Yeah. When we come back, we're finishing our conversation with Jonathan, including talking about how she feels on the other side of financial education and how she navigates being an activist and an advocate for queer joy.

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1:04:43Tiffany Aliche:you don't need me to tell you this but like i'm so fucking proud of you and i hope you're really proud of yourself um that's it's just like it's just so cool no i'm getting like i'm unludial i'm about to start my period i'm like teary on a good day but like trying to hold it together today no it's just it's just really great and it's like no girl the universe really is crazy because i interviewed you when that was going on like when the bankruptcy was go i'm no i'm sorry because i like i'm fucking over talking to your own podcast but i just i was so excited to come mom because like the universe literally introduced me to you.

1:05:12Like when that bankruptcy was happening, like it was in the thick of it. And like, I was realizing like my hair care company was like potentially crumbling. Like I didn't know if we were going to find a future or find a home. Like it went from like fastest growing hair care company in the country. I'm not even just saying that. Like we were the fastest growing hair care company in the country. And then the rug just got pulled out from under us to the point where like, I didn't even know. I mean, we were going to become one of those like horror stories. And to be clear, we still could. Like we're not all the way out of the woods, but we have turned such a corner.

1:05:44We have come such a far way. And I am just so proud of our community, of the people that have supported us through this and like our like mega super fans. Cause at the end of the day, I do feel like what did save JV in here is like the quality of our product and then our community. Cause like if our product wasn't good and it wasn't as effective as it is, it wouldn't have lasted this long anyway. but we also couldn't have done it without support and understanding because like our inventory got fucked up our like our like deliveries got messed up because the parent company went bankrupt so like we couldn't pay vendors we could it was like it was a mess and here's a moral story of that for any entrepreneur listening you cannot cherry pick what you want to learn about when you start a business like when i started jv in here i was like i was like oh i only care about formulas and like marketing and like

1:06:33Tiffany Aliche:formulas and like performance but i was like other people to talk about money and numbers yeah you yeah no you can't do that yep yep and not even like if you own it all of it it's just like you have to understand you have to like because it's like there are experiences that you've had and skin that you have in the game that other people by nature just won't and if you don't understand what decisions they're making like there are just like really preventable things that you that i just i i should have known what ebeta was and i didn't but now i do i didn't know about operations and I didn't care.

1:07:03But now I do, especially with tariffs and stuff. Now, Jesus Christ, like the president of the company and I are just like, just together. Like I just learned, she always jokes that JV and hair is like the business degree that I never asked for, but like I have one now, like it's like an unofficial BA. Um, but I am really proud of myself too. Cause so much of me wanted to just like sell everything and go buy like a small cabin on a lake and like grow like tomatoes with my husband and animals and like never come out of a cave. But I'm really proud that 2024 wasn't able to do that to me because it almost did, but it didn't.

1:07:35Tiffany Aliche:Yeah. Well, for anybody listening, I think one of the most impactful things about what we're discussing is I think it's very easy to watch people you admire, people on TV, people who you think are like, oh, they make so much more money than me. They have all of their shit figured out. And I appreciate your vulnerability. And I hope people understand who are listening, like, just because you make a bunch of money, or just because you have a TV show doesn't mean that your financial trauma goes away. It does not mean that like, you suddenly know everything about how to run all of this. And I've been increasingly in rooms with people who I'm like, Oh, actually, there's a lot either I can teach you, or there's a lot that you can learn about money because I want you to have something to show for it.

1:08:26Tiffany Aliche:Like, I want you to have something to show for this moment that's turned into a movement. I want you to have something to show for when you get a raise at work. Like, I want you to not just waste that opportunity because, you know, the financial education piece wasn't there. So I just really appreciate your vulnerability. And I think it's going to be comforting to people, weirdly, to know that like, oh, okay, just because you're, you know, quote unquote, rich and famous does not mean any of these problems go away, you know? They actually get bigger and worse and more severe, higher to fall. Yeah.

1:09:00Yeah.

1:09:00Tiffany Aliche:I've always said like, if you can manage like$300, you can manage 30 ,303 million. Like it's, it's not really that much difference. Now you start getting to have, you know, maybe nicer things. You start getting to hopefully save and invest more money. There are certain strategies to do, you know, to, again, protect your money. But the basics are the same. Understanding budgeting, understanding your impulsivity, understanding your financial trauma, like whether, again, you're making$3 or$30 million, it's actually very similar. Yes. I mean, a part of me does just still fantasize about how irresponsible and impulsive I used to be, but I just did it without like$30 million.

1:09:42But sometimes I just get this fantasy of like if I had$30 million, like, and like, just like an Hermes didn't work how it works. And you could just like, uh, I found this lady on Tik TOK. You guys, I don't know what her, but what she does, what her man does, what her family does. But this Hermes collection on this lady is like, take you out at the knees, weak at the knees. Like I would, the woman who's like,

1:10:05Tiffany Aliche:I'm a trust fund baby with a hundred thousand dollar a week salary. Is that this person? No, this queen is like, she's like in her sixties. She's British. She's so cute. I think she has a house in London and New York and Tokyo. Because she's like, this is my London collection. This is my non-traveling New York collection. This is my non-traveling Tokyo collection. She's got exotics. She's got cuts of Hermes bags I've never even heard of. She taught me about this one called the Lindy, the 21 by 21, the Plume, all these other bags that these undercover non-Birken & Kelly Hermes bags. I'm losing minutes and minutes of my life watching her bag tours.

1:10:42But I'm guessing conservatively that over the years, I would guess that her bag collection costs her, I'm going to guess half a million, 500 ,000. And I would guess that if she were to resale it tomorrow, like on, I bet you it would be worth like 2.5.

1:11:02Tiffany Aliche:Especially if she has like a following too. And they are like rare. Her bags are rare and vintage and cool as fuck, but she doesn't even resell them because she's too classy to and she didn't make stupid mistakes like buying bags she didn't like like whereas like I bought bags I didn't care about thank god I didn't do that with like I really do like my Hermes bags like I joke that I'll just like live in them if I go like broke bankrupt and like end up like houseless like I will literally live in them I'll sew them together and like find like a secluded place in the woods where I don't get like like robbed for my Birkins but yeah um I don't know where that came from I freaked out no it's just I we were talking about the vulnerability of you being open about your money.

1:11:43Tiffany Aliche:And I just really appreciate it. And it's also, again, like, I love that. And again, you don't need my permission, but like, you're allowed to spend money on the things that you love as long as it's an informed choice. Right. Because the last thing I want for you is to spend money on something that you really, really are excited about, but then with a side of guilt, like that's why I say it has to be an informed choice because I joke, like nothing tastes worse than a pina colada on the beach with a side of guilt because Because that's what's happening when you just spend money without knowing if you can afford it.

1:12:14Tiffany Aliche:Is that the very things that you were actually looking forward to or the very things that you were prioritizing then have this massive asterisk on them. And so, yeah, it's like, great. I did that with this house. I did it with this house. Because now it's just this behemoth of this thing. And I was like, oh, that was a mistake. But I still love her. It's just too much. pressure. Well, and you learn, you guys, we're going to land on our feet. We did. Yeah. You learn and you figure it out. Okay. My last question for you, when we're talking about being a member of a minority group, whether that's a woman, a queer person, a person of color, a disabled person, I think you immediately become, or are almost forced to become an activist for that group of people, even if you didn't ask for that, and you've become and are such a huge advocate for the LGBTQ plus community.

1:13:16Tiffany Aliche:How has that evolved for you when you also are trying to prioritize your own safety, your own joy, your own happiness with also knowing, okay, there's something that concrete that I can do to make a change here. Does that question make sense? Yeah. I mean, I think it's kind of like reconciling my public, like my responsibility with like my personal life. And I think at least the way I like approach my platform and like my work life balance is like, I'm just doing the best I can. And I always am kind of doing the best I can. I think if anything, there have been some eras in my career where I could have done more.

1:14:02I feel like I didn't do enough. There's been other times where I feel like I did too much. But what the commonality was is that I've always just been trying to do the best that I can. And I read this really interesting book about yoga and vegetarianism after I read that book, Skinny Bitch, when I was 22. And it turned me into a militant vegan for four years until I walked by a seafood restaurant that had steamed clams. and that I jumped off the vegan wagon and never got back on accidentally, but I still really value their work and the lessons that I learned from them. But this woman who wrote this book called Yoga and Vegetarianism, she was saying people are doing the best they can with what they know.

1:14:37And that always stuck with me. And I think another thing that really helped me is this girl who I've known since I was like 19, I worked at my first salon with her out of hair school. Now she works with us on JVN Hair and I just love her. She told me this quote that like, I don't know if her husband invented it, but it's certainly the first time I've ever heard it. But he said, like, don't attribute to malice what could be attributed to ignorance or fear. And so that made me like way less vitriolic against Republicans because it is like it isn't malice. I do think it's misinformation and fear and like propaganda that they've been exposed to.

1:15:15And so that has helped me feel like a little bit more hopeful and like less angry and like more willing to engage. age so yeah that's kind of where i am i love that you have been first of all so complimentary to me

1:15:27Tiffany Aliche:thank you i promise i love you keep going you know say any of this you guys we didn't pre-pro any of this i just i really love you so much i'm so grateful for your work i just i i'm cheering you on so hard and i just i just love you and just keep it up and just maybe turn off your dms do not let these fucking incel ass shine but you know what's interesting tori i really that's like i I mean, just from like, you can keep this or like kind of not, or it's like whatever you want. But one thing I feel like I really have learned from the last like seven years of being such a public person is like, and I've heard like other like celebrities or like famous public figures, politicians, just people talk about this, that it's like the more public you get, the less of yourself you share because the criticism is so intense.

1:16:11Like just the unsolicited critiques for people are so intense. But I realized what that's done to me is that like I curated and have I have censored myself. Yeah, like for the negative voices, instead of all the positive voices that were supporting me, cheering me on wanting me to be more of me. I've gotten rid of more of my authentic self to to avoid potential criticism from people that were that were never going to like me anyway. They were never going to give me kudos anyway. They were going to shit on me for whatever reason, no matter what. And what that has cost me is growth. Because I see other people that started at a similar time as me that have like continued to go higher.

1:16:51Whereas I kind of have been around the same place and I'm still picking up the pieces of like, betraying my sense of self for negative feedback from people that never gave a fuck in the first place, which how you show up for your causes or your platform or whatever, that's all going to be impacted by how you feel about yourself from this unsolicited feedback so not engaging in that unsolicited feedback and or engaging more in the positive than like the people who are fucking assholes not that you should be above criticism but like because obviously but it's like you're not an idiot and either am I and we are self-aware and when we fuck up we we know that we did and we can explore that without like a fucking internet pylon by people who like do not give a shit about you

1:17:32Tiffany Aliche:and never did yeah you know I think I think for me with the incel and we're talking about a video that I posted last week where, yeah, it was just the cadence because it happens all of the time for me. And I know it happens all the time for you. And I truly am okay. Like, I'm not just saying that, like, does it hurt sometimes? Absolutely. But it hurts more when it's from people who, like, I think I'm largely aligned with. That's the stuff that hurts more when it's from women. The men I don't care about. It was more just the, it was every five seconds. So it felt like I was watching waves come in.

1:18:08Tiffany Aliche:Normally it's just waves. That was a tsunami. That felt like all of a pylon. It was a pylon continues to be. And so for me, what I've realized, so I turned 30 last July and I got a bunch of my friends together and I, I went to dinner and it was so nice. And I was like, this is my gift to you is this really, really nice, like six course dinner and it was so lovely. And one of my friends who had flown out, again, so kind, literally looked at me and she's like, hey, so what is your goal for your 30s? Like, what is your biggest thing? And I was like, my goal for my 30s is being okay being misunderstood.

1:18:45Tiffany Aliche:Like, that's my goal for my 30s is being okay being misunderstood because I know that I'm a good person. I know that I'm a good daughter and a good partner and a good friend and a good leader. And am I going to fuck up? Absolutely, because I am human. But I also don't have to prove myself to you. I don't have to prove myself to someone who I have not built a mutual sense of trust and vulnerability with. But I think with especially a lot of the men you were just saying, like, I was never going to win them over. And I'm like, I'm never going to win them over. And I'm also not going to win over somebody who, quote unquote, used to follow me, but she's changed or like whatever feedback they give me in that way.

1:19:29Tiffany Aliche:I'm like, you don't really know me. I don't really know you. I am okay being misunderstood. And that is my goal is I, I think I've gotten there way more than I was even a couple of years ago, but for throughout the rest of this decade, that is my goal. Three things really fast that just that resonated so hard. I interviewed this incredible queer historian on the pod last summer when I was like really going through it. And he said this thing to me that like really fucking changed my life. And it's kind of what you just said, but he said to me, find the courage to be disliked. And I just started like bawling, like bawling.

1:20:04Cause I was like, Oh my God, like that's really the people pleaser in me.

1:20:07Tiffany Aliche:Like just does not, does not cope with that. And I also, when you were saying it's like the women that like, it hurts worse, the criticism from like the queer community or like the left for me is way more painful than the right. So that also really resonates, but it's actually that was precisely the point that I was trying to get through to you, is do not dim your shine or quiet yourself down or not share about what you were. Don't stop being who you are to curtail yourselves from those ones specifically. Fuck the incels. But it's like I really found myself censoring myself, especially around the election because of criticism from the left about how I had phrased something or how I had spoken to a political issue on TikTok.

1:20:46So I just shut the fuck up. and I was so quiet in 2024 compared to like 2022, 2020, like every midterm, every like presidential election. And I really allowed myself from the criticism to just diminish and become so small. And it really impacted my growth, my business. And I think some of me needed that. Like I needed that experience universally or whatever to like learn the lessons I was supposed to learn. But I don't want you to fall into that trap because like as you, like I have learned so much from you and so many other people have too. and just like, let's not, it's our survival instinct that makes us notice the negative comments because that's the snake and the Serengeti that's going to kill you.

1:21:26The fuzzy positive feedback is the rabbit and like that rabbit's not going to kill you. So our brains haven't evolved to like be threatened by positive feedback. So like, that's why negative feedback, it's more attention, but just do not fall into that because you are literally changing lives. You've changed my life. You're changing other people's lives. So keep being you. I also need take that advice myself, but like, please girl, like you, you turn my fucking Titanic around, girl. You like put in the goddamn, I was like, I was like eight decisions away from being like episode one of Schitt's Creek, but not tax evasion, just impulse spending.

1:21:56So literally like you really did help me. Like you changed my life. So you are that bitch. You will always be that bitch. And will you do everything right? No, but don't let those negative ass fucking Nancy's who are having a bad day that try to shit on you on Instagram. They're probably like anti-vaxxing trad wives. Fuck them.

1:22:14Tiffany Aliche:Yeah. Thank you. And that's how I feel about your work. Every time I listen to your show, I am so inspired by the conversations you have. I am so looking forward to getting to know you better, too, in real life. And I just admire you and your work deeply and your courage because, y 'all, it is not easy to keep showing up when people are mad at you. It is not easy to keep showing up when you feel or are literally being threatened. It is not an easy thing. And one thing that somebody who's not on the internet or is not a public person will never understand is the feeling in your nervous system between somebody standing outside your door with a pitchfork and a torch and somebody screaming at you on the internet, your body does not know the difference.

1:22:59Tiffany Aliche:It is the same feeling. And so I just admire you so deeply. I admire your vulnerability. I admire you showing up and standing up for what you believe. Plug away, my friend. Tell us about where we can find more about you. I just love you so much. Thank you so much for having me on. If you like this, we do Getting Better every Wednesday. That's my pod. You can like watch it on YouTube or listen to it. Wherever you get your podcast, we do our Monday edit, which is like on Mondays, obvs. It's like the behind the scenes. It's me and our senior producer, Chris. And that's giving like a little news coverage, a little BTS, a little like listener questions.

1:23:31It's like a little snack. It's like a little fun snack to like look forward to because everything's so sad. So it's just like queer, like fun-ness on Mondays. So it's kind of the biggest thing that I'm, I'm also on tour at the moment on my, this is my fourth standup tour. It's like, I'm working on a new hour material, which has been really fun. It's kind of about like dealing with like the fallout from the election and like how we're going to get through the next four years. But it's about like safe spaces, queer joy, dealing with men hilariously. Queer Eye is, I think we're coming back for season 10, which I'll be filming again soon, which I'm really excited for.

1:24:02Yeah, season 10. It's like crazy. I've been doing this for a little bit. But I love it so much. That's what's on my agenda.

1:24:10Tiffany Aliche:I love it. Thank you. Thank you for being here. I love you. Thanks for having me. Thank you so much to Jonathan for joining us and for their incredible transparency. I hope this inspires you to talk more about money. We need people talking about money. You need to be talking about money with your friends, with your partner, with your co-workers. and this conversation was one, such a testament to how important our work is. I was so humbled to hear about how much my work and Financial Feminist has impacted Jonathan's journey, but also a commitment or a recommitment for us to take our financial education seriously and to take talking about money seriously too.

1:24:46Tiffany Aliche:You can check out Jonathan's podcast, Getting Better. There's an episode with me on there as well. And you can watch Queer Eye on Netflix. You know where to go. You know where to find the most heartwarming show that's ever been created. and thank you again to Jonathan for joining us. If you love the show, you can subscribe, you can share it with your friends and if you're watching us on YouTube, welcome. I hope you stick around. Thanks for being here. We appreciate you supporting feminist media. Thank you for being here and we'll talk to you soon. Okay, bye. Thank you for listening to Financial Feminist, a Her First 100K podcast.

1:25:17Tiffany Aliche:For more information about Financial Feminist, Her First 100K, our guests and episode show notes, visit financialfeministpodcast.com. If you're confused about your personal finances and you're wondering where to start, go to herfirst100k.com slash quiz for a free personalized money plan. Financial Feminist is hosted by me, Tori Dunlap. Produced by Kristen Fields and Tamisha Grant. Research by Sarah Shortino. Audio and video engineering by Alyssa Midcalf. Marketing and operations by Karina Patel and Amanda LeFew. Special thanks to our team at Her First 100k.

1:26:04Tiffany Aliche:A huge thanks to the entire Her First 100K community for supporting our show.

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