Mark Normand Might Just Be Norm Macdonald Light

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2:20Dana Carvey:I'm going to look that up. I get that all the time. People say, kill yourself. You're no norm. You're like norm light. You're norm, but bad and gay. Did you kill yourself or did you take any of that advice? Nah, not yet. Later. But they're just going around the moon. They're not letting them on the moon, which I thought was messed up, but it might hurt the property value. And then I said, of course, they make the black guy do a drive-by. And I say, let them on the moon. I want to see that guy jump. Can you imagine that moon jump? And then I call it moon team. so we had some good times dana mark norman who's a very funny comic uh not on every single person's radar yet but that's what we like to do get someone like we did with shane get him a little early and pre-stadium yeah pre-stadiums he's always consistently funny uh when i see him do quick sets or on instagram or uh just talking to the dude he's got a great sort of norm mcdonaldy vibe uh well they talk about his love of norm yeah his love of stand-up uh and also he does a podcast called we might be drunk with sam moral is another great comic so two of them are out there killing it and he was a lot of fun and just a lot of jokes a lot of laughing and we really kind of dug deep with him too yeah you talk about the uh because he really writes a lot of jokes per minute and a lot punch lines for a minute and the pressure to keep coming up with material yeah little shorties yeah we probably got three jokes every minute you're right and it's just hard to fill an hour on stand up and then i think we talked about doing a special and how how much of that can you still use and you know how do you rotate inside baseball or what it's like to be a touring stand-up comic um it was a pleasure to hang out with him ladies and gentlemen enjoy way mark norman mark norman mark norman is our guest we start right away mark all right let's do it we're halfway through all right so this isn't a we might be drunk marathon where you're there for an hour five great how long are your how long are your podcasts on we might be drunk well we drink a lot so they can go from an hour to two and a half it gets pretty sloppy do you really drink when i was there did you drink well that was an la version so we kept it a little queefy for you i know you're old and delicate thank you yeah queefy i'm gonna look that up wait i know i'm old and what delicate i didn't want to hurt you yeah yeah you don't want to hurt me mark norman i was telling you such a riveting story like if you do a podcast we might be drunk which i've done and i actually like i didn't know because i'm frail and brittle that you were delicately leading me through a 22-minute podcast for my own safety.

5:15But I don't drink in the day anyway. That's the problem. I barely drink at night.

5:18Dana Carvey:Why not? Because I'm a fucking puss, dude. I used to be able to, but God dang. It is bad. It leads to horrible things. You tend to have skipping the night and just drinking and going to bars. So day drinking is evil. Don't do it. Yeah. do you when you drink do you i don't mean to cut i won't cut you i'll cut you off 30 more times i know zoom is tough i appreciate that you had offered to come in when you were in town it was very nice and then i was trying to find you i was in new york the other night and i saw my stupid instagram it's like mark norman is doing his hijinks at gut busters i'm like why am i seeing this and then i go oh he's in new york and then it scrolls down he's also doing flim flams he's also doing beep bops and i go oh he's not gonna have time to do anything you're like the new york guy going boom boom boom right oh yeah well yeah i gotta i run around like a psycho because uh my jokes are short so i gotta i gotta write a lot just to fill an hour and it takes forever so i gotta keep uh keep getting up and tweaking i did notice that very good joke writer uh very funny uh I've always sort of watched from a distance.

6:32I finally got the nerve to approach you on Instagram. But, well, I always appreciate a good joke writer. So does Dana. So when you're cramming in short ones, it is harder. I like to tell stories in my act. I'm trying to get one story that's an hour long, ideally. Wow. I don't think I have one. I can make a story an hour and it's fucking boring, but to get some tentpole laughs in the middle is very hard. That's called the moth. That's a whole different thing. Oh, that's a moth story from Norm? No, no. I like how Norm takes an old joke and then he's like, this is my joke. I'm like, it's a joke. It's like, Johnny went to school.

7:12I'm like, are you sure this is your joke? Just elongate it with facts.

7:17Dana Carvey:Yeah. I used to drive a tractor, you know, one of those tractor things, you know, driving that tractor. That's good. You have a little Norm. Do you hear that or not? I get that all the time People say kill yourself, you're no norm You're like norm light, you're norm But bad Did you kill yourself or did you take any of that advice? Nah, not yet, later I'll go with me, not for them If there's a million comics, you're gonna look like someone You're gonna act like someone That's just the way it is I get Dana at the fucking Car wash the other day The guy goes, isn't that special? And then he goes, I'm sorry I love Opportunity Knox I love all your movies and I go thank you I think Dana does the same thing I've aged out of our we used to really compare it a lot Joe Dirt anyway we've interviewed people on this we interviewed Shane when he was still in the clubs and he maybe had just put out the YouTube special and I was following your trajectory so based on the experience of this podcast you'll be headlining Madison Square Garden in 11 months Hey, all right.

8:28I'll take it. I just got to say some Asian slurs and I'm in. That's the trick. That's a shortcut.

8:35Dana Carvey:That's the thing is you go anywhere you want and it's never comes off. I mean, I don't know. It doesn't come off dark or weird or creepy. It's just sort of, you just flow by, but you go wherever you want, right? As far as just topics and stuff. Yeah, thanks. You know, you always hear these people like, what can you joke about? Where's the line? i think if it's got a punch line and a twist you can joke about anything and uh so i i go all in and yeah i've been told i'm non-threatening i'm

9:10queefy yeah you're asexual that's great this is a great quality to have in a comic you're on you're unoffensive even though you're offensive there you go so i think people told me early like you're no one cares about you you're kind of under the radar so i said all right well that's that's a detriment but maybe i can use it to say horrible things no you throw it away and you make it a

9:33Dana Carvey:little innocent you do that arm move something about you're almost sort of commenting on how dark it was well you know but it's all cheery it's all cheery delivery yeah yeah that's where comedy comes from because i had to remind audiences hey comedy we're doing i don't actually yeah oh by golly well i think you stumbled upon a really smart point um is if dana or i go to one of these gigs and say something too much we we can step in quicker but if you or shane on the way up for theo you're just saying crazy things quietly in the clubs and then you build up an audience and they're all used to it so it's all baked in by the time other people hear about it it's too late because you've already said all the stuff everyone's accepted it and you're not like a corporate working for these different big places so no one's telling you no and now that's just you and that's a great way to do it because if i if i'm only on sitcoms and pg 13 movies and then out of the blue and i also do corporate gigs and i do commercials so if someone i say something it jumps out more if that's if i'm making any sense sure people go whoa what are you doing but you guys i kind of get jealous of just like people go hey we're already fans we like this guy don't try to cancel this guy oh hey thanks yeah and i think you get known for it i mean like louis might be a bad example because he did get canceled but louis not not for his stand-up yeah now and now he's back he's got a netflix special he's back circle yeah but i think if you come off like a robert schimmel who's like, I'm the bum.

11:13I'm the loser. I'm the underdog. What a great reference. You set that table. This is who I am. I am the creep. Yeah.

11:22Dana Carvey:That's a great title for his next special. No, I'll tell you, this is a reverse compliment. Did you think a special called Out to Lunch would get any views, let alone 15 million? He got 15 million. What a funny title. Out to Lunch. That's nuts. Thanks. Well, it was the pandemic. I put it out right as the pandemic hit. It was a complete failure because Comedy Central said no. Netflix said no. Amazon said no. So I said, screw it. Put it on YouTube. And it hit because people needed content. And it was free and all that. So I guess the timing worked out. But at the time I put it out, I wanted to kill myself.

12:02Dana Carvey:But you shot it yourself with your own money and then tried to sell it to other people? Yeah. Did you shoot yourself with your own gun? now you know um what about i think it's also you're kind of underplaying it because even though it was during covid they have to find it i see things on youtube that are great and they have 20 000 views and you go fuck how does it get to the point where it gets passed around enough or in the algo enough where people start going now it's at a million like that's a big deal you can't you can't time to get 15 maybe one you can't not 15 yeah that's good so something's working and then you play bigger places obviously over time you do clubs then you start doing some theaters and that's a little more pressure do you feel like it's harder or is it the exact same uh well i think well just to go back to the special i do think it got oversaturated that when i got it in there was still new and if you watch all these specials over time have gotten less and less views just because it's it's not what it used to be um so if i put one out now i I don't think it would hit as big.

13:07So timing is a factor. But, yeah, it sold a ton of tickets for me. Started doing clubs, adding shows, and we moved to theaters. But then here's the crazy part. You get the Netflix hour finally, and it comes out. That was in 2023. And everybody goes, hey, let's go see this guy in a theater. And now you have no material. And now you're kind of eating shit in a theater where people go, hey, this guy got a special. He sucks. And I go, I know, but I'm out of material. Yeah, this is the age old. We always talk about this, me and Dan. I'm from the school of don't throw it all away right away. I mean, you need some tentpole laughs.

13:43They're paying a lot of money. And as with a band, they only want old material. Yes. And they don't want new songs. And we always talk about this. Then your stand-up, you're going, I want to see people do jokes I like. I want to go to my friends, listen to this one. And I think specials get watered down over time. I may be myself included. I won't take myself out just because to work and buff out an hour, as you know, as Dana knows is so hard to get it working. Yeah. And to just go, let me start from scratch. It's fucking so hard to get things at work and you got to massage them and try them out.

14:19And, and then every time you're on stage, it's an audition. Dana knows that you're going, you don't want to bomb. He's, you know, Shane's in the back or one of your friends walks in. You're like, I don't want to do my new shit. They're like, he has nothing.

14:30Dana Carvey:Chappelle thought you were good, man. He was here? Oh, he watched you bomb miserably. But David Tell on this podcast, we watched his special, and people who write, you're a writer, and you're landing like four or five laughs a minute, probably at least. Deesh, deesh, deesh, deesh. And I'll just go gag, gag, gag, gag for like five minutes. So I'm in awe of that. And Dave Vatel, he did his special, it was like 35 a stand-up, and then he did some food thing at the end because he said, my God, because it is like this bam, bam, bam. And I don't know how you guys do it, but it seems like really difficult to turn it.

15:10It's a nightmare. It's a young man's game. It's so much tinkering, getting every, oh, that word's not hitting. Let me shorten it off a few syllables. Let me change that term. But I think Dave Vatel and I, he's the goat in my opinion. but I think that we're scared of doing stories. We have such low self-esteem that I don't feel like anyone will want to hang on to me with a story for a three minute story. Even three minutes are like, everyone's like, what the fuck is going on? I panic. So I want to get that laugh and move on. Yeah. I agree with you. That's very hard. And I like people that have patience up there and I see people that just, you know, even Nate goes slow.

15:47I like that. He did. I don't know when that started. Maybe it's always been that way, but they wait and his crowd is taught to wait. I know. I'm so jealous. Yeah, yeah, me too. He's molasses, but it works. He just has that southern drawl where you just get lulled to sleep like a big lazy boy.

16:05Dana Carvey:That's the name of his next special, Big Lazy Boy. My act is a big lazy boy. Brought to you by Apple Card. Apple Card users get 2 % daily cash back on purchases made in-store and online, whether it's for big-ticket items or everyday purchases, when they use their Apple Card with Apple Pay. Now that's a benefit that's just too good to pass up. You could be earning 2 % daily cash back when you use your Apple Card with Apple Pay to buy turmeric for your signature curry, 2 % back on flights to visit the family in Tucson, and even 2 % back on your kid's new tuba.

16:49You might even be able to get 2 % back on a tuba tutor. Not an Apple Card customer. You can apply in the Wallet app on iPhone. Subject to credit approval, Apple Card is issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City branch. Terms and more at apple.co slash benefits. K-Pop Demon Hunter's Saja Boys Breakfast Meal and Huntrix Meal have just dropped at McDonald's. They're calling this a battle for the fans. What do you say to that, Rumi? It's not a battle. So glad the Saja Boys could take breakfast and give our meal the rest of the day.

17:24Dana Carvey:It is an honor to share. No, it's our honor. It is our larger honor. No, really. Stop. You can really feel the respect in this battle. Pick a meal to pick a side. And participate in McDonald's while supplies last.

18:06Dana Carvey:And a lot of it, you'd mention your wife and things like that, but there's a vibe you're pushing out. So it's kind of interesting to watch why someone blows up and another guy seems to have just as good or woman jokes, but is not quite, you know, it's a fascinating sort of art form. I'm going to call it that. Well, hey, I think you just got to use what you got. I don't know what the hell to do. I'm just trying to get laughs. And I don't want to have a message. Everybody's got a message or an agenda. and I think it's refreshing when, I don't know if you saw this Chris Fleming guy. He just put out a special.

18:41Dana Carvey:Yeah. It's hilarious. The tide's jumping around. Yeah, there's no point or agenda. It's just like, hey, I'm going to lay on the ground for four minutes and kick my legs up, and it's silly and fun, and I think we need that. I mean, who knows what Iran's doing right now? So let's have a chuckle. I couldn't agree more. I never wanted to find, be in that situation where you have a choir that has a certain point of view and then you're teaching. And you're getting roars of laughter because you're reinforcing political points of view. I like being just funny. Yeah. More than anything else. There's room for everybody.

19:20Dana Carvey:I don't know. Sure. I think, Mark, also, is there that kind of Chris Fleming, when he comes around, if the timing's right, everyone's ready for it. Like they just went through the kind of serious comic and then the guy that has no audience. And then there's all these tricks because as you know, specials are put out almost every weekend. I mean, a big one like Amazon, Hulu, Netflix. So to stand out and YouTube, I mean, it's such a blur. Right. I'm not saying it's pointless anymore. It's just hard because they, if my, my, my managers, I was like, got a special ready? I go, I just released it. He goes, I'll make a deal right now.

20:00you what do you hate money state doesn't like money everybody tells the office i go no i'm just saying i like the money i don't want to do the work just give me the money geez dave you can just say jew

20:15but yeah i know what you mean they just want you to put stuff out and you go hey i'm an artist you you douche leave me alone don't rush picasso right so i'm picasso in that scenario and uh So I'm like, I have to work on my booger jokes. Come on. You can't rush these things. I know. I know. Leave me be. But they want that money. I'm so jealous of these. Like, I don't know if you know Ari Shafir. He's like, I'm going to go to Machu Picchu for nine months and do ayahuasca and blow a pygmy. And then his agent's like, all right, we'll see you. And it works out. I don't have the balls. I'm such a wutz that my agent's like, we got you$18 to play for Raytheon.

20:55You want to do it? I'm like, I'm in. You have to perform in front of the bombs before they get dropped. And you're like, sure, whatever. I'm willing to look the other way. I'm scared of adults. I'm 42 years old, but I'm still like, oh, this man is calling me with a tie on. I fucking agree. My managers are more like, we want you to make money because it's so hard to keep the balls in the air because Dana and I are both over 40. and after 40 in anything in showbiz, they're like, What are you getting? Dana looks like a little worn. Dana looks like a fresh daisy.

21:30Dana Carvey:I'm inside a ring light. You can't see the ring light. He lives in a ring light. I'm literally in a bubble of light. If you sat in my light, Mark, 19. You'd look 19. You'd look 19, 20, yeah. Oh, look all up, Steve. It's hard. You just want to keep working. And you look at people that blow up quickly and you go, it's probably harder. I sort of got known over time gradually, and it was weird enough. But these people, like the Jim Carrey thing where they get so famous, like overnight, so fucking huge. Well, 15 years overnight. I mean, yeah, Jim, he did have living color. But to have Dumb and Dumber, The Mask, and Ace Ventura in a row, you go, how do you?

22:11It's another level.

22:12Dana Carvey:Well, yeah, that's a whole explosion. But just because of, for history's sake, when he showed up in LA, I was around, and he was at the improv and Jim was just doing pure impressions like Rich Little. And he would act out on Golden Palm with Henry Fonda and Catherine Hepburn with perfect voices. James Dean, look. And then we know his whole evil... I remember that. Well, it's Bruce Dern. I mean, his talent level, just pure raw talent is insane. He was on like an old comedy story, Young Comedians or something, maybe by Dangerfield and I was like this fucking guy, every time he turns around he looks exactly like he was so rubber faced, Jim Carrey very memorable and then you're right Dana, he did that which I was already floored by that, then in Living Color but I think you're famous and when you do 300 million movies in a row, especially back then that's about as high as you can get as far as how do you stay what I was saying is how do you stay around for 20, 30 years and that's you want to keep making money you want to say somewhat relevant it's just a weird biz so my guys are like hopefully you can do this hopefully you want to do this but i'm in your same spot do i want to take six months off i don't even know if i know what to do i know you feel worthless comedy is really my only like self-worth i have a child and a wife but i'm like ah that's second and third yeah yeah but do you guys worry about uh that's the thing about fame or making it once you make it you're like hey i made it this is great now how the hell do i hold on to this like i used to open for jerry and uh he would say like thank god for comedians and cars or i'd be irrelevant i'm like dude your show's on 11 times a day what are you talking about 44 channels i know jerry jerry look at letterman he went back out so yes exactly he's doing interviews lorne michaels one of his quotes was the minute you're hot, you can feel yourself getting less hot.

24:16Dana Carvey:And a career is like a pendulum. You're hot and it swings and then you're in the dark side of the moon and then you come back. It just comes with a turf. I'm just curious about, do you think, well, two things I want to know about your process. Are you like Jim Gaffigan or like Jerry Seinfeld has a panic attack, if that's possible, because he needs to get to his room and work on his stuff an hour each day, every day yeah Jim Gaffigan brilliant he he records everything at the and then he goes in and he listens to it the kids are sleeping and fixes how meticulous are you or is it just from reps on stage or oh I'm a psycho I mean I got four sets tonight in the city jumping around from club to club and uh yeah same set with new stuff filling in and then I go this line isn't working So I'll kind of just dissect one line and go, all right, the next set, just focus on that line.

25:10And I just do that for months and months. And hopefully it's gradual.

25:15Dana Carvey:Bill Burr told me that he doesn't write it down. I know. What is that? He does it so much. Yeah. But I guess that that's, you know. You know, I saw him the other night, Dana. He went after me. I introduced him. Of course, I blew it because sometimes, Mark, you ever notice there's an emcee and sometimes there's not. So I'm at the store and I go, good night. and no one comes out and i go what am i doing they go bring up the next guy i go who's the next guy is it bill and then i go i did an encore because no one was back there and so i and then i go oh am i supposed to so i bring anyway bill comes up and i'm in the back so i watch a little bit and then i like type i text like just lines i liked and then he hit me on the way home he's like oh you like that yeah i was just working on that and now that you tell me he doesn't write it down i was like writing the wording when i text it going this is great knowing if i did it i would be like i have to remember how i said that right that was what made it work the only reason it works because you've done the bit the next night and you go i know what that is and you go i've done it with heather here and i'm like can you transcribe this because i hit it one night and now it is just not working what did i say that said that's another jerry ism you know something stops working you know check the setup okay is it clear i mean he is a scientist i'm just curious because people were mentioning that you had norm vibes or was he kind of one of your inspirations in a sense or or who so yeah because there's some ribnick stuff there's something in there it's a great thing to be influenced by so anyone else besides david or is norm your true north true north star uh well norm to me is the just the funniest guy like his stand-up is great but he was funny everywhere he's funny on the couch he was funny on a podcast he was funny in movies which i liked bill burr has that too some guys are just funny on stage but then you put them on a podcast and they're kind of boring you've you've done you've seen these normette a unique and you think when he was on conan and stuff it's like he's he's always smile was always smiling in such an intense way yes like his eyes are really happy and he had these big cheekbones and so it's very potent it's like he's laughing the whole time but not out loud because he knows where he's going with it but yeah it's his stuff you see the youtube clips of him on conan and it's like uh we haven't seen anything quite like yeah yeah he's lucky as conan because conan or letterman those guys invite a guy like norm because they want him to be weird and a lot of people won't put up with this don't get it so when you go on the view and he's weird he's talking and they're like oh the best i'm like why are they letting this guy in the fucking view do they know anything and then he does his thing and they're like huh yeah that bill clinton guy you know he the only problem was he killed a guy right didn't he rape that one girl everyone's like hey whoa whoa whoa whoa barbara walter's like oh i thought it was a matter of public record i i once had a two-hour phone conversation with norm driving around i was driving and uh he you know put down his comedy kind of vibe you know and he had a lot of frustrations with his career you know really a lot of a lot of pilots didn't work out and this guy and that and so forth and so on you know so he's a little frustrated you know because like he's so charismatic and he's like norm mcdonald you know probably wanted a few more norm movies or norm tv shows you know dana was there was there a pilot with lovitz and norm for happy madison because i don't know but i will ask him because i think it was about a mayor i do remember hearing this and somebody pulled the plug on it but i think they wanted to do it something weird but that that's the hard thing is like norm is tough he was tough to book because he wouldn't sometimes he wouldn't come or he would walk people and you know as a manager we have to say manager gervitz of course he's norm's too he's like norm i don't know you never know because one time he was i told this story but we were on the road with sandler and you know mark i think sam did it more oh yeah with us you know he rotates some people in just to make it more fun so in the old days norman on and then and we were in seattle or something and he and he just walks everybody and then well the ones that don't want to wait for sandler like i can't take this it's excruciating and then when he gets off schneider's mc goes there's norm mcdonald you never know which norm you're gonna get and tonight you got that one and then norm is on the group chat going hey what the fuck did schneider just say just so people it's so true though just so people understand we're listening if you say the cumul how did the comedian do uh he walked the audience that they well what do you mean well they left they got up and left the room oh yeah and and uh they stopped laughing for a while the comedian does not change gears at all he keeps going and they finally go i can't take it i'm forfeiting this and leaving voluntarily well if i see one person go to the bathroom you see someone go to the bathroom don't you go oh fuck they're leaving of course i want to kill myself it's the worst exactly i don't have the he was so strong he was such a tough guy he doesn't get his due i mean the whole cancer thing he hid that for years i mean most people to use that they would have been like here i'm the victim let me uh spin this into a ted talk you know end of life tour yes exactly he just kept it quiet like the integrity that takes Just being very, very personal, at least online, I just noticed how it's so monetizing if you really share every disease or every negative weird thing in your life.

31:29Dana Carvey:Oh, you got molested. Oh, aren't you special? Yeah, yeah, move on. Could you say that but say, well, isn't that special? You got molested. Norm was just fucking funny. He had a good joke about cancer. Remember that one he says? Oh, yeah. What was it? Everyone always says, this guy lost the battle with cancer. He goes, I think it was a tie. I think cancer died with the guy. Yeah. Cancer's not standing there going. Right. Something like that. And I was like, God, that's a smart way to look at it. Yeah. His dad died. He's saying the joke while he has it, by the way. He's like, my dad, your dad's in a better place.

32:10He's like, he's on the floor. Great norm joke. He was funny everywhere. And he's what a comedian is to me. So when the view is like, hey, Norm, what are you doing? I'm like, he's being Norm. He's the guy you booked. Yeah, that's the hard part.