Mike Birbiglia

0:00Great dude today, Dana. Mike Burbiglia. I'd like to buy a vowel. Burbigs. If you don't have time you say Burbigly and you lose the A. Save time. Yeah. Mikey B. By the end of the podcast we were very good friends. Mikey B. He has a new special on Netflix, The Good Life. He's one of the great storytellers we have out there. And he'll deep dive into his methodology about having a theme where he can go kind of serious and funny. It's very interesting. Yeah, explains a one-man show. What's the difference between a stand-up set? Went to Georgetown, did a comedy contest early on. I did at ASU also. So we had that.

0:49Oh, we talked about that. We kicked and scratched about that. He's a sleepwalker. We make fun of him for that. He does sleepwalk and there's some danger involved and it's a long story. And it's something that's been a big part of his zeitgeisty material. And if you don't know him, he's a well-respected comic out there in the New York circuit. Give it a listen and you'll know him more. We like to get people on here that you may not be a household name yet, but very close. and I'm sure he will be. He writes, he directs movies. He did a Sleepwalker movie and he's working on a new one. So he breaks down his methods for us.

1:31Yeah. And we have a bunch of laughs. So stay tuned.

1:39Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa. Wow. As I live and breathe. Yeah. As I live and breathe. Has anyone ever told you that you kind of, when you smile, Now, there is like your long lost cousin, Bob Odenkirk. Just in this. Oh, yeah. I just thought of that. I do get Odenkirk sometimes. He, we shot a pilot once for CBS like 15 years ago where he played my brother. Oh, okay. So. I buy it. Oh, is that the one that didn't go? That's the one that didn't go, yeah. We heard that saved your career getting away from Bob. Yeah, whatever happened to him. And Nick Kroll. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Exactly. He was in it too. executive that passed on it i mean if it's something like that you just say yes you fit even if the show sucks you go yes let's get all these guys under a deal and then you start changing it or whatever you want to do that's right sometimes i think that i go why are you passing on this package it's too good did you think it was bad because you know i know bob o'dakirk fairly well and he would be he's very comedy is really really important to bob to say the least thank you no no it's great no you guys are so funny you know he's awesome he said the single i word non-sequitur but since you're smiling and you know the single maybe funniest thing has ever been said on the podcast because we knew bob when he was like an underling he was like an on snl and stuff but i always loved him he's a writer but he's kind of struggling it's in his book he comes on our zoom and like we're you know better call saul was kind of like you know he knew comedians have like what what the fuck Bob O 'Kirk now he's like winning Emmys as an actor and then when he did Nobody or the Fighting One what was that called yeah Nobody yeah and he said to himself if this thing works man you guys are going to be going what the fuck he's an action star now it's just like because we know Bob from before so it's funny and there's a sequel, Dan.

3:41We're going to let you talk in a sec, but I just want to say that. No, no, no. We don't need to do that. No, I mean, Odenkirk, yeah, he came to the filming of The Good Life because he's in town doing Glengarry Glen Ross, and he's just like a deeply supportive person of, I think, comedians. He's just really good to fellow comedians. Yes. Good dude overall. If I'm not mistaken, he rode Living in a Van down by the river you are not mistaken yeah you are not gave one of the biggest gifts to snl by the way do you remember when we met this will be a really quick story you may not i opened for you in rhode island at a college is that what that's it but i was i was on some kind of doing a little mini tours i had a friend of mine mark that it was my opener and no one told me that they booked an opener so when we showed up they go this guy mike wants to go up and you know and you know You don't come off like a cocky guy.

4:40You're kind of unassuming. I go, oh no. What's this fucking guy? What's he going to do? We really need him. I didn't know you. Do we really need him? Oh yeah. So, you know, I'm thinking, this is going to be a clusterfuck. This guy, I'm not getting good vibes. So then I'm watching you. Not good vibes. What the fuck? Well, because Mike is unassuming and quiet. And then I'm watching the show. I'm like, he's building and building. I went, holy shit. This guy is great. Yeah. Oh, that's so nice. I thought it at the time, and I do not think I followed you correctly. I think you left awake because it was clever and stuff.

5:18I made some faces, did some funny sounds, and after 10 minutes, they were done. It was like you absolutely crushed. I don't think I'd never seen you live, but I grew up on both of you guys on SNL, So I would do in seventh grade. I remember I was doing at school, church lady, Hans and Franz, George Bush senior. Sorry. And by the way, killing, literally doing your characters. No one really knew what they were from SNL. So I was just getting, I was like the seventh grade hack. So they didn't know it was from SNL. So you're doing your new character in junior high called the church lady like that. Yeah.

6:03and killing with it I was killing with SNL characters I would never it would be the most embarrassing that's an easy one to do but you know well everybody I mean that's one of the things about your impressions is that your impressions are so good thank you I mean your Biden is so crazy good that essentially it's that thing in culture where everyone retrofits their Biden everyone goes now wait a minute It's like walking. Now hold a second. Everyone turns into a walk-in at a certain point. You go, oh, now I can do it. It's like a home kit. And guess what? And by the way, it was the non sequitur.

6:43Guess what? And by the way, the fact of the matter is, I'm not getting around here. I'm being serious. I'll knock you out, Jack. Get your facts straight. Jack will beat the hell out of you. Take my wood shut. Yeah, he calls people Jack. How would I have known about the cancer? They couldn't have known. they don't do checks for that kind of thing there you go what if they knew about the cancer for four years it's like another thing they're like wait there's another thing we kind of spaced out no but okay so I used to do SNL impressions in seventh grade and then I remember one here's the mistake I made I did John Lovitz's annoying man and if people don't know the character he just shows up to Dennis Miller's update and he just goes annoying man he puts his fingers around his eyes and shit i did it to this guy in class named kenny who was tough and i go kenny annoying man fucking i don't know if i can say curse you can't socked me in the face oh socked me in the face bleeding in science class seventh grade and i never did annoying man again don't you love it the character the name of the character is who the character is.

7:59I just love that. We did too much of that back then. I think Santa was Crazy Spoon Man. And he had a Crazy Spoon. Opera Man. We had a lot of mans on the show. Metal on the Head Productions, man. I don't think they do it as much anymore like that. You know, just straight up, here's what it is. What do you think, Mike? Just building it out from who the people are. How comedy is started? Because we would have little jingles like, he's massive, massive head wound hairy, or Lyle, the effeminate, heterosexual. And when I was out there, I asked them, and they said, oh, we don't do that anymore. Well, I guess it's out of fashion, but to me it's so funny to lay it all out like that, present it.

8:40I think my favorite analysis of SNL through the years, because I've watched it since I was a kid, I still watch it, is when Seth Meyers said every single episode since the beginning of time, some of it is great, Some of it's terrible. Some of it's okay. And it's never changed. Very true. No, it's never changed. That's why we don't have a plethora of other live sketch shows in America. Except now they're going to do one in Great Britain, I guess, Saturday Night Live. And Charlie Ode London. So, but yeah, it's not easy. And you're humiliated half the time. You know, you kind of just, it didn't really happen.

9:20You know, it didn't happen. The audience knows it didn't happen. Lorne Michaels knows it didn't happen. and you kind of just blew it. I made a movie, I don't know if you guys know this, I made a movie called Don't Think Twice years ago about Keegan, Michael Key and Gillian Jacobs are part of like an improv group where everyone's best friends and then one of them gets cast on like a Saturday Night Live type of show called Weekend Live and then everyone else doesn't and it's about what happens in friendships when people realize they're not going to get the same thing. Did you guys have that when you guys got it?

9:53Yes. Sure, yeah. That's the whole, that's going back to the improv and seeing people you saw. And now you got a little heat on you. But I watch people do it before me and after. So it's always just an odd. Then you get on SNL and it's the same thing. People get in sketches and all their stuff gets on that week and yours does. And you go, hey, good job. Go get them. Yeah. It is a funny thing. It's so hard to cover. You're like. Because you're coming from your stand-up scene and your friends, you know, and then suddenly you're on television and they're not. And it's just kind of awkward You know, Bobby Slant was like I can't believe this song I can't believe it I can't believe this song You, of all people And Seinfeld was always Because Jerry had This spectacular confidence Even way before he made it You know, I met him in like 1980 He was in his suit And he had it all together Yeah, I've always heard that And then when I got on SNL And went to some award show for a comedian or something.

10:53He just walked up and goes, congratulations, you made it. And just walked away. It wasn't no MV, nothing. But yeah, show business is like, have you had that experience? Because what I was going to ask you is this, and it goes to an overarching theme of how you do your performance. When you were coming up through in the clubs, because a lot of times the blender's going, you got to follow a dick joke guy. And so how did you survive those days before you became well it was funny it's like i remember because i was a writer you know when i was in high school i saw steven wright live at the cape got melody tent and i was just like this is the greatest thing i've ever seen in my life you know before that i'd watched snl i'd watched early letterman but then when i saw a comedian live i was like this is crazy and he was an a different comedian like just a perfect linesmith yeah it's like yeah perfect perfect Yeah.

11:49And I was just like, I want to, you know, I want to do this. And then I just started writing jokes and I had, you know, notebooks of jokes. And then by the time I, when I was in college, I was working the door at the Washington DC improv and great. And yeah, great club. Who came through when you were a doorman? It would be like Mitch Hedberg, Dave Mattel, you know, and Margaret Cho and all these people who are great, you know, Dave, Dave Chappelle and Brian Regan. And it was great. And then when I would work the road after, when I, after I was 22, after college, I was working like hard gigs. And I remember like I would open for these guys and they, I remember one guy, he just said to me, he goes, you're going to make it.

12:32Like I would do like not great. And he goes like, you're going to make it. And I was like, I literally go, why, why do you think? That's a great question. And he goes, instead of thanks right he goes you're right you write your jokes i was like what the fuck are you talking about why don't we all write our information there's a lot of there was a lot of road warriors that did a lot of dick jokes one guy i can't remember but he got this guy was so hung they call him the human tripod you know you know in loud bars and so to survive in that environment you start to get louder and faster and bluer but yeah you actually craft maybe he's yeah you're a crafty writer you're writing good material it will surface because you're you're you know if you get a crowd that listens i think that's what you need and some people can do it with this sound off so the way you write it's sort of like nate does right now he gets a quiet crowd that listens and waits for him and so yeah i think you over time like i've never heard one negative thing about your act or anything.

13:38And, you know, usually, usually it's me kind of starting. No, I don't want to fan out over you. I was watching you. They're bad. You know what I mean? Just to get the thing rolling. It's like, Hey, you know, it's kind of shitty, but I like some of it, but it's just, you know, so I do that. But, um, I think you've got a good rep out there and I think that just grinds through and keeps your career going and keep getting better and better and better. That's a good thing to have because it's hard to stick around in the biz, as we all know.

14:35With Visu Steuer. Now, let's try it.

15:05The host was Victoria Jackson. Oh, really? That's a better story than I thought. Love it, love it. You're so funny, Mike. You're cute. You're cute and funny up there. That's who she is. I mean, she's so likable. I swear to God, I came off stage. We love her. I came off stage and I, you know, it was like me doing a big character. There was a musical number. It was bananas. Of course. Oh, you did a whole big giant thing. Oh, back then? Yeah, good job. And I walked off stage in Victoria Jackson, who, you know, I idolized watching SNL. Yes, she's great. And she goes, you're gonna be a comedian. Oh, that's, I love it.

15:48She's literally the first person in my life to tell me I'm gonna be a comedian. I was like, I can't believe it. What's coming from someone famous, that means a lot. It was great. It was a crazy experience. Because she, on SNL, she would obliterate. Oh, yeah. She would kill in sketches. Kill. So hard. And super cute. So unique. I've said this before, but when I was in the 17th floor, and I think I had just gotten the show, and Victoria was there, and Lorne Michaels came up to me, because he just had talked to her. He said, Dana, will you talk to Victoria and try to figure out what that's all about?

16:25Because you're one. What does that mean? There's something funny there. Is she playing a character? You know, but she wasn't. you know and that purity bounced off the screen and snl uh this innocence that's true innocence about her but um so what i was going to observe about because i like we have stand-ups on this show and as a stand-up you're i'm pretty much good with a great stand-up for about 15 minutes you know yeah as spade said at the fifth day they get the general gist you know we know how the but with you and there's others, but you're, it's personal. And so there's a through line in a story.

17:05I know. And I want to ask you about standup versus one man show and the, you know, the blurring of that. But I found myself really compelled of this idea. When you tell maybe a story to your daughter, you make up a story. Then she pauses and says, and then what happens? And so you, you subtly ride this narrative. And so, And then you go for this moment where you just land a somber moment about your dad. You just say he felt sad, and it just sits there. And I'm like, and you're also balls out funny all the time. So it's very interesting. I found myself like I'm literally going to finish it. I only got halfway through today because I want to know what happens.

17:50So anyway, that's all I had to observe. I'll let you guys talk now. Well, that's definitely the goal. What happened was, when I was in school, I was studying film and plays, like how to write screenwriting and playwriting. And I thought for sure when I got out of school, being a delusional 20-year-old, I was like, I'm going to be a screenwriter. Of course, everyone wants me to write films. All of Hollywood's waiting. Yeah, yeah, they're all waiting. Everyone's just looking for scripts. Hurry, get out of school. cool yeah and so i and so and so the closer i got to graduation the more i i would talk to people in the business or adjacent to the business and they're like yeah no one wants movie scripts at all especially not from you who has no credits or credibility and someone said to me and i i and i thought it was good advice they were like you should just keep doing stand-up because you know you're working the door and you're you're pretty good at it and then eventually you'll be able to make movies and so along the way i started kind of merging playwriting and stand-up into a thing and so when i think of the shows i think of them kind of like what you're describing like movies like in a movie you have to have the scene uh lead to the next scene so then the next scene And so then the next scene, and if it doesn't have that propulsion, you just shut it off.

19:17Right, people fade out. You're surviving laugh to laugh then, the ultimate opposite of this. Yeah. You know. Yeah, but then I go, you know, like I think where I met Spade was over at the Comedy Cellar one night, like maybe a year or two ago. And that's where I work out the joke part of it. Because that's important too. Like you have to have the jokes work in isolation with audience members that aren't there to see you. That's the goal. That's true. And then because it's different than standup because standup is literally like if you go 30 seconds without some sort of laugh, you're like, what's going on?

19:56But if you have a one man show and you're doing it like a story, you can have ups and downs and parts that are sort of dramatic. Is that what you're saying? Yeah. Yeah. And like, you know, I was lucky about, I don't know, 15 years ago, 17 years ago, I met up with Ira Glass, who's the host of This American Life on public radio. And he kind of taught me how to shape individual like eight to 10 minute stories. And I was doing this moth storytelling series in New York. And so over the years, I just got, I got kind of hooked on this idea of like oh if you can have the jokes work and the story work and then and the larger show work then like it's kind of a magical thing who else is doing what you're doing of your generation i mean i know you you knew john mulaney or you know john mulaney and nick roll and stuff yeah is anyone else because it seems like you kind of stick out in this way uh right now if you consider yourself as a stand-up but but you're also a one-man show guy so well i produced uh alex Edelman's show, which is called Just for Us.

21:02And it's kind of, it's definitely kind of in that vein. I mean, like, Jacqueline Novak's, I produced Jacqueline Novak's show, Get on Your Knees, which is a little bit in that vein. It was at Largo a lot, like in the last few years. And really funny. Titles a bit, you know, leading. Billy Crystal had, I think it was called A Thousand Sundays. That's right. That's right. Billy Crystal does it really well. He had a narrative. Yeah. Yeah, he's fantastic. John Leguizamo does it, who's really good. He's another one. But the format is actually really big in England. Like Edinburgh, I went to Edinburgh Fringe Festival a few years ago.

21:42For the first time, I had never gone. And I was like, oh, like a hundred people are doing shows like this simultaneously. But it's just never really caught on here. Yeah, because with stand-up specials, I don't know now, but a few years back, It could be like you'd have your maybe a current event chunk or you'd have relationship chunk. And then you might have driving in cars and now dogs are different from cats. And it would be sort of an archetypal kind of. And then when it's one through narrative with all its different tributaries. I don't know. It sounds fun. If I wasn't lazy and went to College of San Mateo, I would do what you do.

22:22Dummy, dummy alert. You should, though. I mean, but you have a really, you have a lot of great raw materials for it because you had that whole health scare a few years ago. The things that you could talk about are endless. That's true. All right. Thank you. That is true. I've distilled it now to just kind of going back to sounds and trying to get people involved with abstraction. So it's a wholly different course, but I want them like in junior college with my friends who were stoned. I would do a Star Trek bit and it would go on for 10 minutes and stuff like that. You know, I've just gone full circle.

23:00You can do your thing about the hospital and play all your organs. Just give them all like a little personality. Hey man, it was a Bob bypass two words that don't belong together, but he got one out of the two arteries. Right. So he's 50, 50. You can't judge it. Listen. So, you know, that, that'll keep you in the NBA. I mean, in a way, shandling did it to a degree right like he's very personal he didn't it didn't have an arc necessarily but like it was just very personal that's a that that's it is something when it's personal that's also another thing that attaches if it's just abstract jokes but when it's personal um you know i don't know who do you like out there right now and i was gonna ask you about this phenomenon of people in the last six eight years playing stadiums or arenas like it was not so common 20 years ago so what is that about and would you like to play Madison Square Garden I feel like like you know there's a handful like uh I'm trying to think like Atsuko Akatsuka who has an HBO special I think is really really funny I think there's this guy Chris Fleming out in LA who's from Massachusetts really really funny I mean I I think like I love Tig Notaro I mean she's in my sort of class uh sort of personal and doing shows yeah very personal but um yeah it's weird the stadium thing feels like it's gotta end right I feel bad when I go I'm going to Tempe next month and I people like oh Sun Devil Stadium I go no I'm playing a theater They're like, oh, I guess a lot of people are playing Sun Devil Stadium.

24:46Like, a lot of people are one. One guy is playing. I won't say who he is. He's playing Nebraska. They're setting up a stage in the north border of Nebraska. They have speakers all throughout the state. That's good. So he's booked Nebraska. That's a pretty big state. I hope. Wow. I would play the four corners. I've never. I've never. I saw, I think. one or two shows at madison square garden of comedy and i was just kind of like yeah i don't know it doesn't it doesn't allure me but you know i like like i filmed my special at the beak at the beacon theater to me that's like the perfect big yeah it's three twenty seven hundred would you act to work in a big ten thousand seater was it the same thing or is it too small to listen to I think with screens, I mean, because Nate is similar in some ways, but I think the screens must do it, I suppose.

25:43Otherwise, how? Yeah, because I opened for Jon Stewart years ago at Meriwether Post Pavilion. That was like 9 ,000 people. And it was good. It's just like you're playing for television. Yeah. Right? It's like the screens. It's like you're just projected onto a 40-foot screen. Yeah. I think it's great for your pocketbook, but it's not, I mean, if money wasn't any concern or anything, what is your favorite size room just for you having fun? I mean, what's funny is in LA, I don't know if you guys go over there much, but like, I think Largo is the best comedy room. 300. Yeah. Unbelievable. And then in New York, the comedy cellar is unbelievable.

26:30It's 140 seats in a basement. Yeah. I really like just the compression of the energy, and it feeds around. And so for me especially, because I'll just get into some rhythm, and if I'm getting that energy, I'm just going to keep riding it with some character. And I do 100-seater, 80-seater, low ceilings for fun. That's fun. Yeah, probably my favorite thing I've ever done in comedy is being at the cellar, and Chris Rock pops in and you're seeing him in front of 140 people like work out new ideas. You're just like, this is the craziest thing. It's like a fantasy sequence as a comedy fan. That's the fun of the cellar, I think is wide.

27:14It's about three feet deep. And like if you go to the restroom in there, I think Colin was on last time I was there and I had to go pee and I'm like, no, because he'll see me for sure. It's just distracting. Like you have to walk right in front of him and everyone. And it's so small that it's too obvious I have a question about that table The comics sit at That's always curious to me Who's allowed at that table? That's a really good question I think even barely the comics Are allowed at the comics table Yeah yeah How is it some of the comics are allowed at the comics table? Is it one table? It's Yeah here's what I'll say It's one table There's an auxiliary table there's an auxiliary table yeah there's a spillover I think that well when I was in my 20s and I was playing there I would get you know it's the early 2000s I would get murdered by you know Petrice O 'Neill and Bill Burr and all those Colin Quinn like it was all the tough crowd guys Greg Giraldo and they would just rip me to shreds I mean it was just a different era if you sat there or they would just give you shit that's who was sort of yeah if I sat there I love it even like Jimmy Norton was like that he was in that group and I love these guys but like back then because I was like this wide eyed kid it's funny I remember one time Todd Glass who I know you guys know Todd he's a brilliant comic he came he was visiting me in town and he came and he saw those guys just rip me apart at the table.

28:56And he couldn't believe it. I don't think he'd ever seen anything like it. And he was like, why do they talk to you like that? And I go, I don't know, man. I'm new. I'm young, whatever. And then he brought up you, Spade. He goes, the only other person I saw this happen to was David Spade. Because when he came to LA, he was immediately really good and young. And he got a lot of stuff fast. And so people came at him really fast. Is that true? That's sort of the way of the world. But yeah, that was at the improv. And the worst part was I was like, they're like, you're doing a movie already? I go, I guess.

29:33Aren't you supposed to? Is that? I mean, I've done five sets. I've paid my dues. But the improv was a place where like it goes back to you saying you want to write movies, but to do stand up was good advice because you have to somehow be in front of people doing something because people won't see you when they go. People in my acting class are like, oh, I don't do commercials. I don't do soap operas. I don't do this. Or TV shows. You go, if you're good, they will find you. But you have to be in front of someone. You could find someone good even in a commercial. You go, or they just catch your eye.

30:10You have to be out there. And to stand up, you get to be at the improv if you get on or the store now. And the seller obviously is very famous. But there's always someone, even if it's other comedians, like they might be writing something. You know who would be good? This guy. Because you're in front of them. And so I got stuff because casting people would just drift into the improv and go, oh, I wasn't even here to see this guy. But they'll just grab somebody and go, oh, they'd fit. You know, we should. And that really helped me. You did not look like a regular stand-up, David. You know, you had the long surfer, blonde hair.

30:43You looked maybe 16 when you were 22. I watched Spade. When I was in college, I watched your half hour. Oh, I love it. Thank you. It was like a perfect half hour. You were like, you're probably young with that half hour. That was so great because I didn't realize that was one of the reasons I got spots at the improv because the chalkboard lineup, they wrote on the chalkboard in the old days. And it was Kevin Nealon and Leno and Seinfeld and Richard Belzer and just guys that did not look like me. And I was just from Arizona. I was 20 and I had long blonde hair. So I think Bud Friedman was like, oh, we need one of you.

31:20Just you just look different. Just get up there and mumble around. I don't care. Oh, sure.

31:28I do think there's no greater calling card than stand up If they know you wrote it They can see you can land a joke And in your case they can see you're an actor You could definitely, you know And you've done movies and stuff Sleepwalk with me Do you bring that cork board into your meetings To show how hard you work? Is that full of Saturday Night Live sketches? The yellow ones are the funniest The pink ones are under construction No, it's literally just, yeah. Are those your ideas, random ideas? Yeah, that goes back to when I was 18 years old and I started writing jokes and just putting them on note cards in my wall.

32:04I still do it. Well, they want me to have a background here, so I'm going to do that. I think it looks really good. Just a photo of that. Yeah, yeah. It looks very professional. I'm so fucking busy. If you could take a picture of that, send it to me. I'll blow it up. You know what's funny about that is that it shows people that it's hard enough to do your act when you see it polished. this is the shit that you're doing all day to get something that works for 30 seconds like to get anything that works is so hard no it's i always say that to people who are starting out in comedy it's like i write four hours of comedy yeah an hour of comedy and even now when you have a good feel for it and before you'd write something to be like a random thing would work but now you go I think in my head this will work I did that last week so I have to work on new stuff and I'm like these three will work and two didn't and I'm like why at this point do I still not know for sure what will work it's so confounding sometimes Mike have you ever written a bit uh or a piece of your special or whatever where you kind of thought well I don't know if I'm ever gonna write something that lands this beautifully, like full circle, you know?