The non-emergency pod: Tainted vs stained, Polish adverbs & Andy Townsend's pub toilet

19:37I've been asked that for about 10 people already. No, I just think a lot of people just call me, they'll always say Robbie Ewer they wouldn't just say Ewer so yeah that was a reason and then to be honest I think URE is so small I just don't really like it so I was like I'm going to put my first name in as well and yeah I've got it at club level as well and yeah I prefer it

19:59Charlie Eccleshare:Charlie I think this is the most if not the only act of active embracing of full naming a topic that we have skirted around for so long but there's never been any sort of tangible evidence of this but he's directly addressed this Yeah, that is really funny. It's also just like, just generally, I do like the idea of, you know how often like Spanish players or Brazilian players will use naming conventions that seem slightly strange to us and you're a bit like, is that a full name? Is that the surname? Is that the first name? Whatever. Like, yeah, if Scottish players or British players just started doing that because they were like, yeah, I just quite like it.

20:34Or just went with just their first name.

20:36Charlie Eccleshare:It's definitely informed. It's definitely sort of brought about by him playing in Spain, Dave, where I imagine it would be much more understandable for his full name to be on his shirt for any other reason. But the fact that he's directly addressed that people can't just stop saying his name in total, not just because of its length, as he suggests, but because of his sudden curiosity. He's essentially come out of nowhere, was a Scottish under-19 international and has ended up at Sevilla for a small fee, hasn't scored for them yet, but is in the Scottish national team. So there's a lot of curious eyeballs on him.

21:05Charlie Eccleshare:He's going to get full named. He has all the ingredients for being full named. Yeah, definitely. But I think he is right. he's hit on it there with the fact that you is short i mean he's talking about it in terms of it looks weird on the shirt if there's only three letters but even just to say it it's like quite it feels insubstantial yeah when you when you say it so kind of yeah you're just fleshing it out it just makes it feel a bit more just feels better doesn't it i wonder if this opens the door charlie for sully march one of if not harvey barnes yeah the the most full name players in premier league to have their full names on the back of their shirt.

21:40I love the idea of that, yeah, being so aware of it. I think that's just a tremendous development for the discourse, really. I really, really like this. Could we ever see a two-lined first name, then surname on the back of a shirt?

21:50Charlie Eccleshare:There have been instances, definitely in the EFL, of double-barrelled names being on two lines on the back of the shirt, certainly if it's a small player as well, with narrow shoulders. And there's been a few eyebrows raised at that. Is that a thing? Yeah, it's definitely happened. It's definitely happened. what small players being a thing and not having enough space on the back of their shirt definitely yeah it's definitely happened I can't remember who it was but it's definitely definitely happened my first kit or one of my first kits I got for my eighth birthday I really I wanted echo share on the back and my parents had to go up a few sizes so like we can't we just can't fit that in I was like all right I'll take a bigger shirt you had to have echo and then share yeah exactly I didn't want that I wanted it all in one line obviously when you're doing a powerpoint and the font's too big is that oh for fuck's sake yeah he's like oh god make it 48 fine this next one came from liam i really enjoyed this um the official polish national team twitter account um summed up their game against bosnia with this koniec metzu remisu yemi bezbrankovos bosnio and herzegovino that translates dave as end of the match we draw goallessly with bosnia and Herzog-Ovina.

22:55Charlie Eccleshare:I want this adverb into football now. I don't care if this is an accident of translation. I want we draw goallessly in football immediately. If you can have a goalless draw, you can draw goallessly. There's nothing stopping us. Nice. I wonder if Gary Taphouse was commentating on this game. Goallessly done. Oh, it's great. I mean, Charlie, this isn't going to require a great bit of admin from anybody to incorporate into our language. This will be great for Soccer Saturday. And yeah, they've drawn goallessly here at Loftus Road. And could you expect, you know, we just played really goallessly. You know, it was just, it was, you could tell from the start.

23:37Charlie Eccleshare:Yeah, sometimes you just unearth something in another language, something subtle that we could take on board. I've just had a look and sadly it was Paul Dempsey for the world feed on this game, not Taphouse. Okay. I'll tell you who was the real hero of the international break though. and this is pure international break. We would never feature this if it wasn't the international break. Here is Andy Townsend on the etiquette of using pub toilets. Beautiful day today. Take the old boy out for a walk. Right, so the other night in the pub, a walker comes in. He's got boots and got the shorts on. And he's coming and he's having a little look around.

24:17Don't really know where he is anyway. He goes straight in the toilet. it. Bosch does what he does. Comes out and we've only got the one. We've got one gents loo and one ladies loo. Comes out, straight out the door, gone. And I'm like, really? Can't you just buy half a lager, a Coke, a bottle of water, something to acknowledge the fact that the pub has just saved your life. Surely you do that, don't you? I would Never go into a pub, walk out, do that, and not just buy a little drink or something. For the privilege and the fact that the pub saved his life, this bloke. He was having a bit of a sweat on, I could tell.

24:58If he had said on the door, two quid for a shit, would he have paid it? Yes, 100%. He'd have paid it. Do you know what? I'd have lent him two quid. He was looking that desperate. He can't just come in, do that, leave, and not buy a drink. Can you?

25:15Charlie Eccleshare:There are so many elements of this that I know of, Dave. We obviously are going to have to pick our favourite little bit of this monologue. It's the kind of Andy Townsend gear that he speaks in, which is basically just like match analysis, but with a bit of kind of physical aspect to it, but also protectiveness for his local pub as well. It's having to look around to see if anybody's listening before he tells this story, stopping dead at the real pivotal moment of the story where he can't walk any further because he has to. It's just, what was going on here, essentially? Just glorious Townsending.

25:48Charlie Eccleshare:And I understand this is the common theme for his Instagram. This is constant. I don't really look at it. I feel like I've missed out a lot. But this is him at his peak. Yeah, when he's walking his dog and he's always got a little observation on life. He's always presenting these sort of really mundane moral quandaries to his audience. which is it's a nice it's a really nice sort of aspect of of townsend and there's so much there's so much there but just him you know he does what he does yeah yeah the walker just the way he says that is so good if it was two pound for a shit yeah the way you had to suppress your life you had to suppress the shit just in case anybody might be within earshot which is class from him charlie because ostensibly and i'm being really superficial here everything about this video has the appearance of him basically embarking on an anti-woke rant about something.

26:41Charlie Eccleshare:Some sort of sub-clerks and rant. But it's not, because it's Andy Townsend and he has a heart. But yeah, him suppressing the word shit, I think, might be the best bit. Shit. It's so... He saved his life. I mean, that's slightly... He saved his life. I mean, I have... Coke or something. I have been in the position of this walker on a run once. I remember along Regis Canal, and I just suddenly... I was like, fuck, I'm going to shit myself if I don't stop and found a pub, did go in, did it. But I think. Did what you did. Just to be. Yeah, did what I did. And I love as well, he says, like, we've got the one gents, got the one lady, like that ownership of your local.

27:18Yes. We've got the one pub. Yeah. But I just, the thing is, you know, for the walker, he's going to be so embarrassed. Like he knows. I don't know. Like when I was in that position, I was sort of like, I also just, I just want to get out of here. Like, you know what I've done. I'm a shell of a man at this point. Can I just get out without going and buying a half pint of Coke? I just kind of want to leave. But I see what he said. He almost wants to just leave the cash and get out of there. But can you charge me on my card two quid? I don't want a drink just for compensation. Just get one of those little QR code things you can scan on the back of the toilet door.

27:59Charlie Eccleshare:Really good idea. Yeah, you might as well monetise this, because it's probably kind of station-side pubs that get the brunt of this issue, Dave. People who are going for the train will think, I desperately need a piss, and I know I won't be able to go anywhere else. And you've got a backpack on, so you're so obviously not going for a drink. And I don't know, I've done that sort of walk of semi-shame before, and sometimes the toilet's so far at the back, you think, oh God, they've obviously spotted me. I'm going in for a piss. But yeah, I don't know, you've just got to ride it out sometimes, but I would happily do the QR code thing.

28:29turn it into a business this is dragon's den shit glad this has come up actually because yeah i've i've been in this situation plenty of times like you know walking around london or whatever and my sort of policy on it is that if it's a weatherspoons or one of the big cheney pubs i don't mind as much i just i don't care i'll use the toilets and fuck them whereas if it's a smaller pub like one that i like or like an independent one or just like if you know i just would feel bad about doing it or there is sometimes yeah also the thing of like if it's a weatherspoons it's going to be big enough for you to just get in and out and feel like no one you're not making as much of an impact if it's a tiny boozer and there's like one person in there and the barman clearly sees you back yeah you know it's that is a bit awkward but also i think if it's a pub that i think i've frequented a lot i feel like i've earned it a bit i've put in the money already and i will come back well like abios points yeah yeah yeah so yeah it's sort of unspoken you can come in and do the odd shit in here i mean you you do have that choice advantage you have that choice as well don't you like something it's like do you just front up and you could you know this is more in a restaurant but you know if you're like i'm just desperate and i'm going to a restaurant do you say something i'm really sorry like could i just use your toilet like that is that avenue is open to you and most places or a lot of places be like open up dialogue definitely yeah exactly or do you do and i have done this sort of enjoying the deceit of pretending i'm on my phone and looking as though i'm like looking around the place pretending as if i'm gonna be meeting someone and then you go down 100 and then walk out with a slight annoyance there yeah they're not here like oh have they gone to the wrong place oh that's annoying and then i guess i better leave you know having done my business i've done the thing as well sometimes when you're sort of running through the logic in your mind of like what would they say like if they did question me like if it's like a busy pub and it's it's london it's like a weeknight and you walk in and i sometimes think to myself well how would they be able to know that i hadn't come to the pub met someone just being outside the whole time and had been drinking i might not have come in and bought the drink but i might have been outside the park you could just tell from the manner it's the way you enter the pub you're not entering the

30:40Charlie Eccleshare:pub like that if you've been outside the whole time you're marching in there's yeah there's you don't have that comfort that familiarity with the place it is funny though isn't it you do come up with these whole backstories as if you're going to get like a proper interrogation about your intentions it's ibs all right just leave me alone they'll back off they'll back off sorry sorry sir yeah please anyway yeah i am broadly on on town's end side here for the scale of the pub that he is yeah country pubs as well yeah but just great delivery of the whole thing and that's the main thing. Anyway, this episode of Football Clichés is brought to an association with Saley, a new eSIM service app from the creators of NordVPN.

31:16Charlie Eccleshare:Listeners, I'll admit to a frisson of excitement when I land in a foreign country, my phone slowly finds a signal, and the unfamiliar name of the local network operator finally appears at the top of my screen. But after that excitement, usually comes fear about the charges I'll rack up if I use my data abroad. But these days, I don't have that fear because I can download Saley. Before I leave the UK, I open up my Saley app, buy some data for my destination, so when I land, I'm connected to a safe and secure internet connection that doesn't cost the earth. They offer different data packages depending on how long I'm going for, and they can be up to 10 times cheaper than roaming fees.

31:49Charlie Eccleshare:Saley offers data plans for over 200 destinations, along with 24-7 support, so they've got me covered. But it's not just saving me money. Saley enables me to switch my device's virtual location to access apps and content from back home. To try it out for yourself, you can download Saley, that's S-A-I-L-Y, in your app store and use our code cliches at checkout to get an exclusive 15 % off your first purchase. Full details are in our episode description or simply visit salee.com forward slash cliches. We'll be back very shortly.

32:26Charlie Eccleshare:If your business runs on five different apps, 12 browser tabs, and one spreadsheet that everyone's afraid to touch, it's probably time for Odoo. Odoo is an all-in-one business management software that connects every part of your business into one powerful, easy-to-use platform. So instead of wasting time switching between disconnected systems, Your entire business works together in real time. Your team moves faster, your data stays accurate, and you can actually focus on growing your business. Let one unified system run your entire business. From the first opportunity to the final payment, everything works together in one place.

33:08Charlie Eccleshare:Whether you're a small business or managing a large operation, Odoo gives you one flexible platform built to grow with you. Learn more at odoo.com. That's O-D-O-O dot com.

33:25Oh, look at that! That is wonderful!

33:32Charlie Eccleshare:Welcome back to Football Clichés. Dreamland episode 32 is going to be out very soon. It's the fifth edition of our Voices of Football. Peter Brackley, Gary Neville and Simon Jordan. What a trio, Charlie. Simon Jordan, someone we've been waiting a little while for, and I think we did both him justice and his detractors. Something there for everyone. Yeah, it was a great trio, actually. Quite an eclectic mix. But yeah, all interesting in their own way. Yeah, all semi-generations covered there, I think. You can sign up for Dreamland for just£5.99 a month. You'll get ad-free listening of all of our episodes, plus two episodes a month of Dreamland, our exclusive subscriber-only show, and access to the premium section of our quiz games as well.

34:15Charlie Eccleshare:Happy Hunting Grounds, Out of Control, which thousands of you have been enjoying. So all of that on offer at dreamland.footballcliches.com. This Thursday's episode, for the first time in 564 episodes, we're welcoming a referee onto the Football Cliches pod, Dave. Be on your best behaviour. It's ex-referee Graham Scott, now of The Athletic, is joining us. for essentially a pure cliches refereeing Q &A. We're going to fire the most clichesy referee questions we can possibly think of at him. But conversely, what are the things we're not going to be asking him? What's top of your not going to ask Graham Scott this list?

34:55VAR. I think we can talk about VAR, but pick out the funny little aspects of it that we're interested in. But we can't have the VAR debate with Graham Scott, can we?

35:05Charlie Eccleshare:Get Graham Scott to draw the most realistic TV screen he can under serious pressure. Charlie, I won't be asking him, like, who was the most annoying player to deal with on the pitch during a time in the Premier League? Who gave you the most earache? Graham, are refs under too much pressure? Do we scrutinise them almost too much? Well, yeah, no, I think that is an element of it. We won't be doing that. Yeah, so yeah, if you want to get involved in that, send in your most cliché question for Graham Scott, former Premier League referee. And that will be Thursday's episode. Thoroughly looking forward to that.

35:36Charlie Eccleshare:He knows the pod, crucially. I must make that clear. He is a pod knower. Didn't need any explanation whatsoever. He's in on the game. It's fine. Tremendous scenes on Sunday afternoon, Dave. The great Pat Noon of Cliché's quiz fame joined me for Happy Hunting Grounds Alive and was beaten 13 points to 11 and a half. Wow. Yeah. Adam Simpson was his opponent. Yeah, how did it go down? Pat Noon thought he'd turned it round. He thought he'd won it in round three by plucking Jordan Mutch 13-14 for Cardiff at Stamford Bridge. Wow. But no, that was a level seven, I believe. But no, Adam Simpson was not to be denied and prevailed in a 24 and a half point thriller.

36:18Charlie Eccleshare:So he is human after all, Pat Noon. What did Adam Simpson get to win it? Can you remember? Newcastle, somewhere. And quite charitably, I let him have a one from this season, I think. Or maybe it was from last season. It was Malik Chow scoring twice anyway, wherever that was. Oh, Everton, maybe? Yes, exactly. Hill Deco. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so it was last season. So he was all right. So yeah. Yeah, tremendous scenes. Great, great game of HHD Live on Sunday afternoon. On that theme, Charlie, here is a Happy Hunting Ground story from Matt Robinson. He says, this is from my wedding ceremony. During my mum's speech, she decided to tell all our wedding guests that I can name the goal scorers and results from pretty much any Arsenal match from 2001 onwards.

36:58Charlie Eccleshare:She then decided to test me and asked Villa versus Arsenal 0-1-0-2 who scored. I confidently answered Robert Perez, mentioning that he lobbed Peter Schmeichel. My mum immediately told the entire wedding party that I was wrong. The problem? She'd been given the question by my brother, who had accidentally given her Arsenal vs Villa at Highbury rather than Villa vs Arsenal. So having been publicly humbled at my own wedding, I spent a significant portion of the reception showing various guests, some who don't even speak English, the match report on my phone to prove that actually I was right. What an incredible thing to have to do at your own wedding.

37:32Very, very relatable. Yeah, I mean, I'm amazed in a way. I guess you don't want to look like you're being, I guess there's a difference between Matt and I, but like that you're looking too competitive. But I think I would nip in the bud quite quickly. Like, no, man, that very much is correct. You are confusing the home and away game. The home game, of course, was a 3-2 thriller that Arsenal won, having been 2-0 down. But I'm sure Matt Robinson's mum knew that.

37:56Charlie Eccleshare:Happy Hunter Grounds making it to wedding speeches from parents, Dave. Tremendous. Amazing. Amazing. I mean, I can't hear this story and not just picture it being Charlie. Yeah, I think at my wedding, this skill was mentioned in passing, and I think at my 21st. I think at my 21st, I was then asked to perform that skill, and I did get it right, thankfully. Really? Wow. Because that is a risk. Pronto Happy Hunting Grounds at your 21st birthday. Yeah, I remember I was asked about Blackburn VR 797-98, and I quipped Home or Away. What, in a speech or just by somebody at the party? No, in a speech. It was said, he's got this insane memory and he can name any Arsenal result from all these years.

38:42But yeah, I clarified, I guess, the home and away, which I did as a joke. I suppose so. Yeah, maybe Matt needed to do that. Only 10 years gone at that point? When were you 21? Yeah, so this was December 2007.

38:56Charlie Eccleshare:Good point. Yeah, it was only 10 years previous. On the back of your kind of DNA level hubris, then, Charlie. Let's tackle the ladder, shall we? Let's remember that the Premier League does exist and try and get through 10 rounds of happy hunting grounds. Level 1. Who has scored for Chelsea at the Emirates? Lukaku, I mean. Yeah, you could do Lukaku. 21-22. 21-22. Arsenal 0, Chelsea 2. Goal scorers Rhys James and Romelu Lukaku on his debut, I believe. Right, level 2. Who has scored for Arsenal at Portman Road? There you go a bit. Do you want to go older just for the hell of it? Yeah, you could go Bergkamp 2000-2001 Ipswich 1 Arsenal 1 Goal scorer 6 minutes from time The Flying Dutchman Dennis Bergkamp Right Oh the non-Flying Dutchman Non-Flying Dutchman What am I doing Didn't correct me That's fine I thought it was Almost knowing I was like Is that so Is he baiting me He never get that one wrong Right Level 3 Who was scored for Bournemouth at Goodison Park Feels very Josh King But then he Is that just because He played for them both Junius Stanislas Or just go Or more recent when they were good.

40:04Solanke. Yeah, like either Solanke or... Ever Nielsen, Clivett. Yeah, so in sort of Everton's last year at Goodison.

40:14Charlie Eccleshare:Yeah, I don't think Ever Nielsen. Don't mind Clivett, but I think Solanke... Solanke's safer, probably. He didn't get 20 before he moved to Spurs. I don't know if it was quite that many, but he did get a lot in that 23-24 season. Should we say Solanke 23-24? Yeah. Callum Wilson the thing with Callum Wilson is that it gives us more of a chance of a second chance do you know what I mean oh good season yeah yeah okay should we go for Callum Wilson but what season 16-17 something like that I was watching a Premier League years recently and he scored a goal and the crucially I can't remember which season it was but the commentator said it breaks his drought he basically didn't score for like a year nearly which was really surprising to me what episode was it?

41:07they came up 15-16 yeah right 17-18? yeah I think his drought might have gone from the back end of 15-16 into sort of back end of 16-17 okay

41:21Charlie Eccleshare:17-18 then? can I go the season after just to be safe? yeah alright then here we go Everton 2 Bournemouth 1 goal scorer four minutes after half time Josh bloody King oh but has he ever scored there is no but because Callum Wilson has never scored for Bournemouth at Goodison furious absolutely furious Dominic Solanke has done it Joshua King has done it three times four times Joshua King has scored wow a genuine happy hunting ground for Josh King scored there for Watford as well yeah that is pathetic from us but still that's the ladder sound logic I thought yeah good process boys well done Right, let's move on.

41:58Charlie Eccleshare:This came from listener Samuel, who sent in a clip from his over-45s debut, and a goal he had disallowed for offside as his strike partner performatively tried to not interfere with play, as discussed on the listener's MHD last week, Charlie. That's more of a visual appeal. From an audio perspective, I want you to listen very closely for the quintessential Sunday League shout in this situation as Samuel runs through.

42:32Charlie Eccleshare:He ain't. It's such a good shout for when you're trying to pre-empt a bad offside decision. He ain't. He ain't. He ain't. He ain't. Yeah, that is spot on. Because it basically, it's essentially gamesmanship to a certain extent. It's trying to steer things in your direction, Charlie, but it's also accounting for the fact that you know that the linesman will be shit and won't know what's going on. So you're basically trying to preload the decision. So it's good behaviour, I think. it's quite constructive but but it's it's just the delivery of it is so familiar to me yeah and sometimes one might you might do even about yourself like i'm not i'm not like you know that they're it's like so frustrating like i i know what you're looking at the wrong thing it's quite rare to address it to yourself but i wouldn't i wouldn't rule it out absolutely i'm not i'm not because i mean to deliver it while you're playing the game is is quite a skill yeah more after you've like put it in right turn around and say it i was i was running a line on Sunday just gone and I was actually really fucking annoyed with the uh with the ref actually who twice overruled offsides that I gave and I know and they were the only two that I did a half of on the line on the line and I only did only flag twice in the half it wasn't like I was every single ball I wasn't taking the piss I was I genuinely I was like he ref he was offside he was offside I'm not cheating here it's so hard to persuade the situation that you're not biased though i didn't think so i was like mate i'm why well you're you're why am i here you're behind the play you're behind him and i'm square on did he not issue a directive before the game though saying i'll do offsides you just do throw-ins uh okay no he said he just gave me the flag yeah it's really annoying and like i think you know with all this stuff these days about like who's active and and who's not and there was one where one of the two that i flagged like the ball had been played from like i think it was like a fullback sort of into the middle of the pitch towards where center forward was who was offside by about three or four yards and the ball went right to him but like our defender cleared it just before the striker had the chance to get it so i before our defender had like cleared the ball i was sort of was ready to raise the flag and the and the defense the striker saw me was like mate i didn't even touch it i was like well it's like you were about to like the ball was played to you and you would have been offside but anyway the ref's not fucking giving any anyway just shut up what a mess it's just a thankless task all round horrible job would never want to do it again in my entire life I'll tell you what I do want to do though footballers names in things here's a trio for you increasingly ridiculous as we go the first one came from Ryan Gray and it's from Wilderness with Simon Reeve

45:21so my final destination is a place called gordo banks where the sea of cortez meets the pacific ocean there used to be reports almost legends of shoals of more than 1 000 hammerhead sharks

45:36Charlie Eccleshare:around gordo banks one letter away it feels like a million miles away annoyingly charlie but what What a wave. Gordo Banks. What a shark. Gordo Banks. Do you think Banks was ever called Gordo? This is what I would hope to be the case. I think that would legitimise the shout. I think Gordo's very possible. Banks is probably number one in terms of the nicknames. But I can imagine. Gordo feels a bit more Aussie, like Gordai. I knew Gordo, but his surname was Gordon rather than his first name. That is an important difference. Yeah. Is Gordon in Colin from Accounts called Gordo at any point? I think he might be.

46:21Possibly.

46:22Charlie Eccleshare:Gordo? Yeah, I mean, that's so Australian, isn't it? Ah, Gordo! What are you doing, Gordo? Yeah, definitely. There's Gordie as well, I think, as you sometimes get. But yeah, Gordo's great. Okay, well, that's just the first one. First of three. Next one comes from Tom Lawrence. He says, it may be just me, but does anyone else hear a Ballon d 'Or winner named in the England pod's description of the three Lions versus Spain from none other than David Walker. But they created so many other good quality chances with good football. I mean, there was one moment in the second half, George, where there was this ridiculous passing move where they brought Pedri on and they...

46:57Charlie Eccleshare:I like that one. OK, nice. Yeah. I didn't feel myself doing it at the time. I was going to say it didn't occur to you, but thank God. Thank God we've got the tentacles out there to get it on our pod. Thank you, Tom Lawrence, who's a footballer's name in things in his own right. Third one comes from Kyle Gladwin. He says, I'm currently on paternity leave, so my girlfriend and I are watching an incredible amount of daytime TV. Yesterday, while half watching one of our daily staples, Holmes Under the Hammer, my ears pricked up at the naming of an England manager mentioned by presenter Martel Maxwell.

47:32Back to Suffolk and the village of Oxford, where earlier Tommy took a look around this two-bed mid-terrace.

47:44Charlie Eccleshare:subtle this time but really good tommy too cool tommy too cool i'm all right with him dave you're a tommy too cool man aren't you no i'm very much a thomas but ali on the england pod at times has taken to calling him tommy tactics and i have which i've rebuked him on every time he's done it but i don't like it but you so you'd never call him tommy at oppressor then i think surely no one's calling him that to his face I think we're a way off that never know, one day maybe but that's such a good one because the accent really makes it perfect there that wouldn't, like just written down that wouldn't sound anything like as good

48:31Charlie Eccleshare:Next up, this is from The Telegraph who took advantage of the quiet international window by wheeling out Des Lynham to write a column about Match of the Day and where it currently is. Headline reads, Match of the Day needs one presenter, and it should be Kelly Cates. Which is not a bombastic headline, Charlie. It's an argument that could be made and could have been foreseen when they unveiled that they were going to have three presenters. So at the moment, it doesn't feel like a hot take, right? That's probably not worth a column, but a reasonable thing to say, right? It is, yeah. I do still think it's funny because his argument is partly like, you know, it's sort of confusing.

49:03People don't know where they are. I wonder how many viewers are well I mean there probably are some Telegraph readers who do find it frustrating but yes it's sort of fine up until that point

49:13Charlie Eccleshare:So I wondered how much mileage there would be in this argument Dave when I reached this paragraph Some time ago I wondered and granted this will sound unusual whether the BBC should consider a figure such as Piers Morgan or Jeremy Clarkson someone to present, foster the camaraderie and allow the footballers to talk given that no suitable ex-pros were showing interest in hosting as Gary did Jeremy Clarkson doing Match of the Day. I mean, Des, read your own words, mate. Piers Morgan or Jeremy Clarkson allowing the others to talk. I mean, they're not just going to sit there, are they? I mean, it would be ridiculous.

49:47I mean, the whole thing is just, I mean, this is the Telegraph, isn't it, right? They just cannot get enough of this stuff. And I think I saw one this weekend about Strictly, basically the same thing, because Strictly now have three hosts, Josh Whittacombe and Emma Willis and the other bloke, I can't remember his name, but same article basically saying that there should be just one of them or one of them should be designated the main host, the other two should do the other bits or whatever it is, I don't know. But there is part of me that does think if you just remove it from the sort of BBC bashing element and they're sort of in my day, get rid of all that stuff, you could actually look at Matchday and say, you know what, maybe it would benefit from just having some consistency, especially even on the pundit side.

50:27Like if you think about Monday Night Football, I know watching Monday Night Football that Carrigg is going to be on it and he's going to say something interesting. So that's a reason for me to watch. And that's the same is true of podcasts and whatever. Like consistency is important. Whereas they could, so the Match of the Day's profile could potentially be raised if it was Wayne Rooney and Joe Hart with a presenter every week. And we knew that that was every week. And then you can build clips around it and you can kind of build momentum. Whereas it's the scattergun approach sort of plays into the hands of the idea that people are only there to watch the football.

51:02Charlie Eccleshare:I just, TV reviewing, Charlie, is such a venerable sort of thread of media coverage, but there does seem to be a sort of sudden explosion in sort of picking apart sort of presenting lineups and things like that, much like Dave sort of citing the Strictly discourse this week. It's like, it's just, there's been a can of worms open with the over-analysis of TV programmes, and I just think, I mean, we're all for it. I'm all for it on this podcast. Yeah. Yeah, it feels like we take this sort of stuff very seriously these days, but Clark's on NMOTD is a fantasy step too far, I think. It's a lot. It's a lot to imagine.

51:35Yeah, I mean, I think there probably always has been that interest to an extent, but maybe there's like a degree of ownership that people have. And obviously, like the post-Lineca world is always going to be like incredibly fertile grounds for discussion. I do know what Dave means, though, and I guess like the CBS Galazzo thing is a good example of, you know, the Richards, Kate Abdo, Thierry Henry Carragher thing is such a huge kind of brand that they lean into and that is the show it's got such a strong identity and yeah maybe you do lose that a little bit if you are rotating but the thing is these telegraph articles right so often the very thing that they're complaining about if that was to happen they would also write an article having a pop at it the same way like if Piers Morgan or Jeremy Clarkson or anyone like them got the presenting job or match today they'd be able to write a piece saying, you know, they're not sports presenters, they're not football people.

52:26Like, what is this?

52:27Charlie Eccleshare:They fucking love Clarkson doing Match of the Day. They find a way to fucking love it. All the things you've said are absolutely valid and the sort of things they would care about, but they would cast them aside if Clarkson did fucking... Can you imagine Clarkson's appetite for the fifth game on Match of the Day when it's a nil-nil? Yeah. If he had power, if he was presenting it, but also, like, basically in charge, like he was with Top Gear, he'd probably fuck the last game off. Punching one of the stats guys. Yeah. And make some sort of gag about it or something, wouldn't he? Yeah, yeah. Well, we're not going to bother with that one.

52:59Charlie Eccleshare:It's a waste of time. The thing is though as well is in the same breath, as sort of obviously ludicrous as it is, I do find myself, because I listen to the Today programme most mornings, pretty much every morning. And when the Telegraph do their version of this with like, oh, this presenter doesn't like this presenter and they're going to be, this presenter's leaving and stuff, I do find myself clicking on it. So I'm like, for my sins, this is quite interesting and I guess a lot of people share that for Match of the Day or Strictly or whatever it is. Yeah, I guess you can't be wrong when you make an observation like that.

53:28Charlie Eccleshare:There's nothing really at stake when you say, well, this isn't quite working, Presenter X and Guest Y. Exactly. I'm going to end this episode with this tweet from Glenn Hoddle who just decided this was the moment to make this hot take apparent. Guys, if you had dinner party and you had six people to ask for the evening, who would you choose? Mine would be Muhammad Ali, Nelson Mandela, Pele, Michael Jackson, Princess Diana and JFK. Some night that would be. What part of that is completely knackered? And they've just conversed. Lovely. It's so weird. When I saw this, I was like, genuinely, did he schedule this tweet like eight years ago and by some bug it only sent now?

54:16like he put the wrong year in or it's been sat in drafts and he suddenly found reception seven years later and it went live like who is doing this in 2020 there's something very wholesome like this would have been twitter 10 15 years ago people were saying stuff like this yeah

54:32Charlie Eccleshare:this would be his second tweet his first tweet he'd be here to see what all the fuss is about and then second one's guys if you had a dinner party but the way it's phrased as well it's like it's like he's asking you you know if he asked you this in person but straight away before you even had the chance to answer he's told you his because mine would be and I mean what a list it's very it's gone for six people I think that's a bit much isn't it normally it's like three right isn't it like normally it's like if you could choose three yeah there's a chance you don't talk to one of them very much if there's six never got a chance to chat to it was good yeah I didn't really get to speak to Michael but Pele was chewing his ear off all night I mean this is a very dog-eared concept anyway, Dave.

55:17Charlie Eccleshare:But he's picked just all the classics here. All the sort of people you normally... Mandela. I mean, how many fucking dinner parties does Mandela get invited to? You must be like, I can't make it. Sorry, I've got to go to another 5 ,000 tonight. Yeah, yeah. I can't. I can't do it, Glenn. I did Jeremy Clarkson's last week, actually. And not to overanalyse this too much, Charlie, but JFK, I mean, maybe Glenn Hoddle is sort of, you know, interested in the sort of the early knockings of the Cold War and the Bay of Pigs and that sort of stuff. But I reckon if JFK comes to your fantasy dinner party, you're going to ask him about getting shot, aren't you?

55:54And like, can you ask him about how you died?

55:57Charlie Eccleshare:Can you ask him posthumous questions? Or do you have to attend that he's still alive? Exactly. Is it the reanimated corpse of JFK? I just think it's not that deep, is it? But that's his big thing. He didn't ask me. I can't believe it. And as he leaves, thanks, Glenn, for not asking about the assassination. I do really appreciate that. I should actually get peppered with questions about that. Glenn asking about Marilyn Monroe. I bet he would. I bet that's what he'd be part of. You come back at the point of death, right? You come back at the point just before you died. So he doesn't, you tell him, this is how you died?

56:30Charlie Eccleshare:Yeah, did you not know? Yeah, he goes back in like 20th of November, 1963. So yeah, he's blissfully unaware. He doesn't know any of it. I mean, he doesn't know about Glenn's career. Oswald just shot it lovely. he shot that lovely for the book depository but I mean yeah we have to return to our original point here Dave which is why has Glenn Hoddle tweeted it and why now

56:55Charlie Eccleshare:what's the point why does he need engagement he's Glenn Hoddle it genuinely is or do you think yeah was it meant to be like a sponsored thing and he's just forgotten to add like you know at whoever it is it's just it's just It's pure boomerism. He's just, you know, he's just, maybe he's seen someone else do it or he's just, you know, just had an idle moment. It's 10 to 8 at night he's posted this. Maybe he's had a glass of wine. Maybe he's been at a shit dinner party and thought, it's better if I was with these guys. Well, we'd have freshened this up. Rather than catching up with Laura down the road, it would be Princess Di.

57:36Charlie Eccleshare:It's such an innocuous tweet, but we got so much mileage out of it and I'm delighted with it. Thanks to you, Charlie Eccleshire. thank you thanks to you david walker thank you thanks to you jfk thanks everyone for listening we'll be back on thursday with our referees q a get your questions in see you then