The "what's eating Erling Haaland?" threshold, FA Cup anthem fears & Gary Weaver's Circle of Goals

15:21Nick Miller:That'll be the inspiration. Golden boot winner.

15:24Charlie Eccleshare:Matty Gravish. Oh, he looks like a Matty. But, yeah, he can't be a Premier League goal machine with a Matty. No chance. But, yeah, doesn't bode well for the film, but we'll see how it goes. Danny Dyer, MHD, though. We were talking about this the other day. Like, would back him, actually? to come up with some interesting stuff. He's an interesting bloke. I mean, he does obviously lean in heavily into the parody of himself with films like this, but away from it, he's actually quite interesting. We could do another little press junket interview, though, couldn't we, just at the very least? Yeah, it'll be fine.

15:57Charlie Eccleshare:Right, I'm afraid to say that Gary Cotterill we must condemn. Here he is asking Paphos manager and mid-2000s Real Madrid midfielder Albert Saladez about the big news of last week. A bit of a cheeky question. You obviously played for some time with David Beckham at Real Madrid. Have you been following his saga? What are your thoughts on it? Who did so? No, don't answer. I think the question is not relevant to Pafos FC, I'm sorry. I don't understand the last word. We played together, yeah. Probably better not answering it. Probably wise. I have a good memory of him because we spent time together and he was an amazing professional and very good player of course thank you he needs to stop what's he doing?

16:48Nick Miller:is there a I mean yeah I just think like how many times out of a hundred that's gonna lead to something I mean I guess you do it because maybe there's a chance and if you did wouldn't you feel good you can show Albert Silades

17:03Charlie Eccleshare:breaks his silence on the point of Beckham saga. This was the post-match press conference, Nick. I mean, it was neither the time nor the place. I mean, I know this might be a slightly redundant point given the person we're dealing with here, but what did he expect he would possibly have got back from that that would balance out the kind of embarrassment of asking the question, if nothing else? I suppose the obvious answer is he blew past that, at the embarrassment slash shame threshold some time ago. But I think he did sound a bit embarrassed there. There was some nervous laughter there, and he was sort of saying, oh, probably, yeah, probably don't answer it.

17:43Like, I'd be fascinated to know, like, internally, whether is Cottsrell the one who leads this sort of stuff and is kind of, I'll send me anywhere, I'll ask any question you like, and they're happy to let him do it. Or is there pressure on him? Gary, we'd love you to go do this. Like, the Beckham story's big this week. who could we get oh this guy played with him david does feel like the first one i really does yeah i'll suspect so but what's one of the only times i've heard cost real sort of perhaps realize that

18:11Nick Miller:it's a step too far yeah because he could go back in for more there is a there is a pause after the press officer said like you know don't answer it he could because celadis is sort of smiling and looks kind of fine about it he could have another go i mean i get it's different as well isn't it because as much as a lot of people don't particularly like it but going and asking a manager who you know is about to move to another club questions that that is legitimate you know to go and because they might give you something this is a bit different from that but yeah i guess nick to your question like i guess the best case scenario and that would offset the weirdness of it is if he did happen to have really strong views and then i guess that would go viral because it would be kind of hilarious you know that albert celadis actually does feel really strongly about this situation like i'm glad you ask yeah exactly this is the world we live in and

19:01Charlie Eccleshare:he goes on sort of a monologue like that that would be great but um yeah nick you know what would have been the cherry on the awkward icing of this horrendous cake would have been the um the moment that celadez suggested that there was a bit of a language barrier and he didn't understand the last word of kotral's question which was saga saga in spanish is saga that was the least of his problems I don't know whether I'm giving him too much credit here but that feels like a very clever sort of deployment of the yeah sorry I don't really understand the question from Saladis it's a Scandinavian word it's not even an English word nice I don't know where he goes next Dave I mean surely people in press conferences are going to start tutting louder from now on because he can't go the whole hog and like find Brooklyn Beckham somewhere and just go straight to source can he That is outside of his remit.

19:51He has to stay within the bounds of football press conferences or training grounds.

19:56Charlie Eccleshare:Dreadful stuff. This won't improve your mood either. Nick, the news that the FA are planning to create an anthem for the FA Cup, similar to the theme music of the Champions League. The FA has commissioned a company, part of the Universal Music Group, to come up with a men's FA Cup anthem and a separate one for the women's competition. Initial thoughts. well these things other than the champions league and even even then the only thing that these sort of anthems serve is for people to boo them right like what club fans of clubs that think they are being done over by the premier league or whatever they will boo the premier league anthem when it is played before games so i can't think of any that other than champions league anthem that has any cut through at all that but people actually know you're not a fan of the nations league The Nations League Well, no, the playlist is for Dave Stagg now It's just the anthems Really gets in your ear, that one Oh, yeah, there is that one

20:57Nick Miller:Because that was a Ronis he played, wasn't it? At a Champions League game last season

21:00Charlie Eccleshare:Oh, yeah What if they play in the Carabao, by mistake? Charlie, obviously this is going to face some traditional resistance Because the FA Cup is just so embedded in its ways But this supposed FA Cup anthem will be played in stadiums during player handshakes from the early rounds through to the final at Wembley. It would not, however, replace Abide With Me, the traditional FA Cup hymn, nor any music played by clubs when their teams run out. If they scrapped Abide With Me, imagine, imagine the columns.

21:28Nick Miller:Genuinely an absolutely top class hymn. I would be gutted if that were.

21:32Charlie Eccleshare:But Nick, what the FA potentially taketh away from the magic of the FA Cup, they giveth back to the Telegraph columnists by making sure that their plans for the new anthem will include a British composer to be appointed to write it. Thank God we don't outsource this to the Europeans. What is going to satisfy the Telegraph columnist here is like reviving Elgar or something like that. Yeah, mad. It's known as sonic branding, Dave. Yeah, which is a thing. That's a thing. You know, like the Netflix and all that stuff. But that's a short... Sonic branding is like a short thing. It's not, you know, it's like the Intel noise.

22:11It's not a whole song.

22:12Charlie Eccleshare:Someone posed the question when discussing this, Charlie, about does the FA Cup have any sort of iconic sounds that you could incorporate into an anthem? The first one, the only one people could think of was the rustling of the balls, the clinking of the balls in the back. Can you make music out of that? It'd be a nice intro.

22:29Nick Miller:Yeah, that is a good one. No, I mean, I'm thinking just of famous FA Cup commentaries, but yeah, I can't think of any just noises. The bus is rolling in to Wembley. Studs going up the stairs at the end.

22:41Charlie Eccleshare:Wow.

22:42Nick Miller:Oh, OK. John Button. Ribbons fluttering in the breeze.

22:46Charlie Eccleshare:Yeah, wow. Yeah, tenuous stuff. Can't wait to find out what it sounds like. They've commissioned Universal Music Group, which it sounds like they're going to try and make it sort of – you'd assume that it's going to be more of a modern song. Whereas all the other – the Champions League and even the other attempts like the Nations League and Europa League, they are orchestral. So, I suppose the Premier League one is not that orchestral, is it? But it's fraught with peril, this. It just does not need to be done. We'll see. We'll see. Let's keep an open mind for now. We've kept an open mind with this chat for long enough as well.

23:27Charlie Eccleshare:Gary Weaver is officially now Sky Sports' Derby Day man. He was on double duty this weekend. On Saturday, it was Millwall versus Charlton. Here's Millwall taking the lead at the Den. Z's involved again. Langstaff with the flick. Oh, my God, again!

23:50Millwall's Lions roar in the South East London Coliseum. And Charlton Athletic run for cover.

23:59Charlie Eccleshare:Nick Charlton running for cover is suck that's an unnecessary layer isn't it also famously Colosseum there was no cover that's the whole point of the design if you're in there with the lions game over you can't run for cover you either fight or you're done Weaver's in the early stages of learning about Roman history to apply it to his commentary he's gone medieval he's moved on he's branching out here Charlie is Millwall's ceiling their emphatic 4-0 win it's a Macu it's another one there's no stopping them

24:42these are the new Lions Kings around here and these players could be giving these supporters these people just what they want

24:54Nick Miller:that's such a weird sort of letdown of a finish because you think he's setting himself up for something Lion King related. Yeah. He says like, these are Lion Kings and these players, you're sort of expecting. Can you feel the love this afternoon? Yeah, exactly. It's where you are.

25:11Charlie Eccleshare:Yeah. Oh, that would be superb. The circle of goals. As innocuous as that finishing line might sound, bear it in mind in a moment because on Sunday on the South Coast, he wasn't there physically, but it was Portsmouth versus Southampton. And because he was doing it off-tube, there's always a bit of a worry with the balance between commentator noise and crowd noise. The audio balance here, very much set to end of season DVD. Here's Southampton taking the lead at Fratton Park. Azaz, nicely done as he brought the ball out of the sky and he's released Sienza. Sienza closing in. It's Sienza!

25:55Southampton give the city just what it wants the people what they want a goal against Portsmouth right in the heart of Portsmouth and it means everything he's used the line again Dan I watched that one live and I was watching with a Southampton fan and we knew it was going to be on Sky Sports Plus so we weren't even sure whether Weaver would be on it And there's no build-up either, so it's literally like a countdown to kick-off, and then as the teams are coming out, the commentators switch on. And when it was Weaver, we punched the air with the light that he had the game. But yeah, fatally undermined by being off-tube, it just robs him of everything that he needs for his moments to really land.

26:42Charlie Eccleshare:You can't hear the crowd. Yeah, it's weird. It feels like it's an easy thing that they could tweak. But who knows? So yeah, between his kind of misunderstanding of how the Coliseum works, and some off-tube uncertainty and some unusual lines. We needed Weaver to roar back into form. And here is Portsmouth pegging Southampton back. Segacic is dropped right on top of Peretz. Is it bundled in by Ibu Adams? Portsmouth celebrate. They were looking for a hero. And Ibu Adams runs to the frattered end to take the acclaim. They will not be pushed around in this derby on their own territory today. It really has an extra oomph when he's just saying it to a microphone in a room, doesn't it?

27:34Charlie Eccleshare:Incredible. Pushed around on our own territory. Lovely. That's what we want. That's classic Weaver, isn't it, Charlie? That's what we want. The bread and butter.

27:41Nick Miller:Yeah. I mean, it's funny, Dave, you mentioned there about your friend who supports a team. Like, if your team is involved, like, does he ever do Watford games? I just can't imagine what that experience would be like. It feels so inherently comical almost. I think he might have done a Watford-Luton. I can't remember. We've played him a couple of times in the last few years and we've crossed paths. Because I think if your team concedes and then you're getting all this stuff about your team running for cover and, you know, this sort of weird... He'd get discarned for Watford-Luton, wouldn't he? Could you not just be a bit like, fuck off.

28:13Nick Miller:I'm annoyed enough we've conceded a goal. I don't need this right now.

28:16Charlie Eccleshare:No, he's great. Leave him alone. I want to end part one with some more off-tube commentary now, as our friend Bill Leslie watches Barcelona equalise against Slavia Prague in the Champions League last week. Garcia, a little flick from Rafinha. There's de Jong. This is good from Barcelona. The product lacking, though, Fernand López.

28:42He's squeezed it in, in fact. He has squeezed it in.

28:50An acute clinical finish from Fermin Lopez. And Barcelona are level.

28:56Charlie Eccleshare:Oh, Dave. 12.1 seconds that was from net bulge to Bill Leslie being 100 % certain that Barcelona had actually scored. Yeah, I feel for him there. He just hasn't, for whatever reason, hasn't spotted it. Maybe he thought it was one of those which has sort of gone along the back of the net and sort of somehow hugged the back of the net. But I was thinking, is it worse that way round? Or is it worse to proclaim a goal that hasn't gone in? Almost certainly, because to a certain extent, Charlie, you could style that way round. You could style it out the other way round. That's it. You're done. You're cooked.

29:31Nick Miller:Yeah, that's a weird one, that one. It doesn't look... I mean, obviously, it's easy to say, I guess, because we know it's a goal, but it's not one that looks particularly confusing.

29:40Charlie Eccleshare:As with all these situations, Nick, it's the half-hearted wheeling away of the goal scorer that does for Bill Leslie. Firmin Lopez barely and then when they finally do the close up of him and he punches the air only then does Paul Leslie go actually

29:55Nick Miller:he's very happy for somebody who's just hit the side netting I think commentators can send around some kind of dick tap that players should celebrate with some enthusiasm just to really help us out with these things yeah

30:06Charlie Eccleshare:off-tube commentators being let down by the authorities we'll take a short break we'll be back very soon

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31:36Charlie Eccleshare:Welcome back to Football Clichés. A reminder that you can sign up for Dreamland at dreamland.footballcliches.com. For$5.99 a month, you'll get ad-free listening. of all of our episodes, plus two episodes a month of Dreamland, our exclusive show. Episode 16 is coming this week, How to Speak Like a Premier League Manager. Nick, you've written something about this, actually. You've talked about LinkedInization of manager speak in the Premier League. So, great timing. Yeah, obviously off the back of Liam Rossini's manage-manage thing. And yeah, continuing a fine tradition that, I don't know, I kind of, perhaps lazily, I identified Brendan Rodgers as ground zero.

32:17But now I'm thinking, I don't know, does it go back further than that? I mean, maybe we'll find out in this episode.

32:22Charlie Eccleshare:You may well do. You may well do. You set that up incredibly well. Yeah, cheers, Nick. You can read Nick's, you can subscribe to The Athletic for that much, or you can subscribe to Dreamland for this much. It's entirely up to you. Also, this Thursday's episode will be January's edition of the listeners' Meza Harlan Dicks. If you want to get involved, send a 30-second voice note detailing your very specific, very niche, possibly even pathological footballing fascination or irritation, and we'll pick the best six. Get in touch by sliding into my DMs on Twitter or Instagram or email your voice note to footballcliches at gmail.com.

32:58Charlie Eccleshare:Right, I want to start part two with a, well, a rare fusion of recurring football cliche segments. It's For My Sins and Bit of Both Corner. And we'll do it three-way, will we? Yeah, I think we will. Right, all three of you are going to play. This came from Soup Type 52. It's from Vernon Kay's Radio 2 show. And between the three of you, I want you to guess when this man says the immortal words of For My Sins. And then I want you to tell me if and when a bit of both is about to happen. This is the first ever bit of both corner then. Yeah. And it's three way as well. Yeah. Yeah, it's huge. Never been a contested situation.

33:37Charlie Eccleshare:So if you lose out, first of all, don't worry. There's a second bite at the cherry. Right, here we go. So for my sins and bits of both corner, here we go. 3BC Radio 2, 10 to the top. This is Dan Tonesend. Welcome, Dan. Morning, Vernon. You're in Mocop. Where's that? Mocop is a little hillside village in between Staffordshire and Cheshire. Oh, very nice. So it's very high up and you look down on both counties, really. It sounds very green. It's very green, very rocky. It's a nice place to live anyway.

34:09Nick Miller:Yeah, it is. It's beautiful. Really good up there. You play the guitar in your free time? I do a little bit, yeah. I've done that for a long time, but only in the house, really. Right, OK. And when you picked up the guitar for the first time, is it easy to get all the chord structures down and that kind of stuff? I was 11 at the time. It was nearly 40 years ago. And I had lessons for probably about 10 or 12 years, and I kind of went on my own after that. There's only so much you can learn that somebody else can teach you, and the rest you kind of find out by yourself. I think a lot of guitarists do that, don't they?

34:41They read Burt Whedon's Plain a Day and then they're off. That's it, Burt Whedon, yeah. Yeah, fab. Are you a gardener? I am. For me sins. Well, wintertime, is it downtime or is it preparing for spring? At this moment in time, I'm recovering from a few surgeries, so I'm just relaxing at home at the moment, trying to recover.

35:00Charlie Eccleshare:An absolute mess, as expected. Charlie and Dave bowed out early, but Nick Miller stayed the distance. Well done. Well done to you, Nick. Yeah, well done. Pleased with that, held my nerve. Howie didn't go for the bit of both there at the end, and then it turns out he was having surgery, so that's probably allowable. What I didn't include in this clip, because it would have muddied the waters even further, Charlie, is that Vernon Kay then went on to ask this guy, are you going to pull through? Wow. Wow. It's a bit like the Jason Tindall thing. Yeah, you can't ask him that. He sort of went, oh, I'm going to need more surgery, actually.

35:35Charlie Eccleshare:He's just got a disc problem in his back. Well, it's a bit of both, actually. yeah oh dear anyway um will we ever do a three-way again not sure well done to you nick miller right next up uh tis the season for january transfers that just sounds so right here's one for you ryan fraser from southampton to western sydney wanderers on a free transfer yeah that's nice he's i mean he's got a very australian name as well ryan fraser fraser phrase fraser

36:05Nick Miller:Frazo Frazo's a great guy I think they go Rhino there because it's he got the yeah wow the former Australian fast bowler Ryan Harris was Rhino

36:16Charlie Eccleshare:but you know footballistically Nick the right move at the right time 31 for you know stocky winger Ryan Fraser just to go and sprinkle some stardust on the A-League is he 31 yeah yeah yeah that's perfect yeah

36:31Nick Miller:would his nickname actually be something like Titch or something like that because I'm really sure I feel like that's just sort of like, just let's belittle him a little bit with his nickname. Ask around, just wander around Melbourne. Hi, excuse me, excuse me, sir. What nickname would you give this man?

36:48Charlie Eccleshare:His name? This is his name and this is his height. Yeah, yeah, he's pure A-League. I love this. Right, next up, the Andy Burnham football analogies are running wild as the Labour leadership voted overwhelmingly to reject his request to seek selection for the upcoming Gorton and Denton by-election. So this is how it was first framed. Labour's deputy leader, Lucy Powell, says blocking him would be a mistake. At least we think that's what she's saying, using the analogy of her beloved Manchester City. I want to make sure that we're putting out the best team on the pitch week after week so that we can win those important matches.

37:23I don't want to see Haaland on the bench because there's been some falling out. But I'm also going to get behind Pep Guardiola as our manager and make sure that we win matches. we win those crucial matches and that we go on to win the league and I think we can do that better as one Labour team Are Labour going to go on a run? Doesn't feel like it It also doesn't it doesn't quite work as well because it's not the same like Erling Haaland isn't like trying to get the manager's job Yeah, true

37:51Nick Miller:That's what's eating Erling Haaland His bid for the manager's job

37:55Charlie Eccleshare:This didn't stop though Charlie another Labour MP said I see Lucy Powell and others talking about Burnham like Haaland or a super sub He's more like Paul Pogba. Talent is there, but massive ego and goes missing when it matters most. Pogba's got real staying power in these analogies, hasn't he?

38:09Nick Miller:Do you think he is the sort of definitive, that sort of description? Like, oh, so much talent, but, you know, the kind of wasted talent. No, because, I mean, he's achieved something of note here. He's been Manchester Mayor for quite a few years and to widespread acclaim, at least. So it doesn't feel like quite a perfect analogy. He's not Pogba. He doesn't even have a brother. No, no, no, I don't think it works. To a safe seat somewhere. No, I don't. Matthias Burnham. This is like, but this is a sort of turbo version of a, not quite our work, but another manager showing up in the director's box of an under pressure manager, isn't it?

38:50Charlie Eccleshare:Yeah. And then finally, Carl Turner, MP. Nick says, we needed our best player in the pitch when we're not doing well in the league tables. It seems we've decided to bench our political equivalent of Messi. I'm saddened that that will reflect badly on our leadership and the PLP will probably react adversely. He's Messi now. Burnham's Messi. Extraordinary. I think the only possible footballing scenario, I mean, this isn't plausible at all, but it would be more like, say, so Liam Rossini is Chelsea manager. Now let's for a second pretend that Frank Lampard has never managed Chelsea yet. If Frank Lampard resigned as Coventry manager and started turning up in the director's box at Chelsea every week and kind of let it be known that he was interested in the job to undermine Rosinia from the back benches.

39:36That's the sort of scenario we're talking about here.

39:39Nick Miller:Yeah, I feel like there have been cases where managers have made it known that they are sort of interested in another job when someone's there. I'm trying to think of an example.

39:47Charlie Eccleshare:I need to come over here and issue us with a correct analogy with some carefully chosen players. Anyway, on that note, wow, this came from Andy. It's from some random highlights from the Kenyan 5th Division. Apparently, Pac-University versus Kahawa Pride. An altercation there. Tony Blair seems not to be pleased with something. And his teammates are telling him, please, let's get back to your position. Just off screen during this part of the stream, apparently number 14, Tony Blair, threw a handful of dirt onto his own keeper after a disagreement erupted between the two. We aren't exactly sure what caused the argument, but the ref saw it, stopped play, and brought Tony to midfield where he was given a straight red.

40:35Tony Blair.

40:39Has been red carded. Presumably the goalkeeper was called Gordon Brown. Tony Blair. Sensational sort of portentous music under that as well.

40:48Charlie Eccleshare:Yeah, God knows. I really should have done more research into what this YouTube channel is all about but it does appear to be tracking the fortunes of a fifth tier Kenyan football team called Kahawa Pride.

40:58Nick Miller:I was going to say, I wondered before he breaks it down to Tony, because you know there's this thing in Kosovo where there's the name like Tony Blair, like as one name. I wondered if it was like that sort of situation. But it sounds like he was actually a first name Tony, second name Blair situation.

41:15Charlie Eccleshare:Hope so. Yeah, Tony Blair. Very 80s footballer name, but not sure it works now.

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43:06Charlie Eccleshare:next up a mad fact that was tweeted to me at the weekend Matt said there are 53 palindrome times on the clock during a 90 minute football match what are we going to do with this information I can't wait to count them all up the weirdest thing about it though Dave is he also tagged in Jamie Oliver and MMA content producer Nina Drama so I'm sure they're talking about it on their podcasts aren't they as well I mean what are they so there's what there's I suppose the 0000 counts yeah 10 minutes and 1 second

43:39Nick Miller:4114

43:40Charlie Eccleshare:hold up there's 0110 this is good this is going to be the rest of the episode next episode of Dreamland us naming palindrome times what's the latest palindromic time on the clock in a 90 minute game 88 88 18 yeah it is surely assuming no injury time yeah exactly hasn't allowed for injury time or extra time

44:01Nick Miller:yeah that's a good point yeah away does say during a 90 minute football match

44:04Charlie Eccleshare:yeah that's true yeah yeah ball in play must be great anyway whichgoose7049 writes in next Nick this is from Bromley's website and their report about their win over Swindon and it says despite eight additional minutes of injury time the hosts held out for a huge three points seeing them rooted at the top of the Sky Bet League 2 table can you be rooted downwards roots are especially your upper your upper teeth have roots unless you're considering that the rest of the teams in the division are the soil and then you are that you your roots are then sort of going through really no I've lost confidence in that You've just described the normal routes.

44:46Charlie Eccleshare:Yes, exactly. Yeah, feels wrong, looks wrong, is wrong, isn't it, Dave? Yeah. What are they, though? So they are... I know, that's it. ensconced. ensconced. Don't mind it. They are six points clear at the top of League Two. Salford have a game in the hand. Yeah, promotion elect. Yeah. Nice. Right, there you go. Finally, this came from Sachin Mystery. Little conundrum for us. Charlie what would it take for a single goal in an otherwise average game to make the game the first game in the running order on match of the day i.e. if a goalkeeper came out juggled the ball on his head passed the whole team and then scorpion kicked it top bins surely that would be enough to make it the first game so let's figure out what game we're talking about here something like I don't know Palace Bournemouth what would make Palace Bournemouth in a single goal situation the first game on match of the day it would be something sort of Cantonaresque wouldn't it be sort of Kung Fu kick or something

45:41Nick Miller:Yeah, I mean, funny enough, that has been like the game of the season so far, Palace Bournemouth. But yes, assuming it was a crappy 1-0. Yeah, I mean, I'm trying to think, do they ever choose games just on that basis? Because would they not sort of just trail it and be like, and stay tuned? Because there is a, you know, kind of, you know, I'm thinking like if a goalkeeper scored or something, that would be like a crazy novelty. But would you want to sit through the whole first game? the highlights of a not very interesting game between two not particularly newsy teams just for a bad goal. So it would have to be something utterly insane.

46:15Charlie Eccleshare:Yeah, so a goalkeeper scoring in a classically goalkeeper way, like a 50-yard punt or a last-minute header or something, Nick, that would be not enough, clearly, to move the dial, even in the 90s or match of the day. But it would have to be something insane. So what could move that dial?

46:34Nick Miller:Well, what if just on the goalkeeper theme, if they did do a sort of allison at West Brom, you know, like an actual, you go up and score like a proper, like an actually really good header to win a game in the last minute. Would that, would that meet the threshold? Perhaps if there was some kind of like backstory, emotional backstory to a player, like one of the players has been ill for a long time and had come back or something like that. Would that, do you think, would that do it? It does need some narrative weight because that's what they're thinking of when they're putting the programme together.

47:05It's, you know, what's the story today, which is the best story for us to put first. And the original question from Sachin was, you know, this game is otherwise average. There's nothing else of note happening in this game. So you'd also need the other games to be drab. I don't know whether this sort of disqualifies it, but if it was a match of the day too and there are only two games. that gives you a chance but I think you'd need the keeper to score a hat trick or something or maybe the keeper would have to dribble from one end of the pitch to the other

47:40Charlie Eccleshare:maybe you could save a penalty and then score immediately after saving the penalty which is not implausible saves it, boots it up, field scores I think that would make it that might work but what about if it was some really really scandalous goal that everyone after the game agrees should have been disallowed.

48:00Nick Miller:Yeah, I think if it was like, if it was really, if it had become like a massive story, I think then it could be a, well, there's only one place we can start today. Like that would, that would take it into being genuinely newsworthy, where it's just like a madly good goal. But does that nullify the otherwise average game part of this? Does the aftermath of a controversial incident make it more than an average game? Yeah, I think it can. It could be a really crap nil-nil and then late on, there's like a ludicrous VAR gaffe or something that's like...

48:30Charlie Eccleshare:Offside goalkeeper, who scores?

48:32Nick Miller:Everyone, yeah. Everyone's like up in arms about it. Like AFCON final, if that was a league game and there was a penalty in the last minute, it was 0-0 and it was a league game, penalty in the last minute and the one team walked off.

48:43Charlie Eccleshare:That's overspill though. That's other stuff as well. Yeah, it's got to be the goal itself. Let's stick with the rules here. But I think it is tricky because you're right, Dave,

48:51Nick Miller:they do look for what's the story, but they are also like overwhelmingly guided by goals. I was slightly surprised the other weekend, the most recent weekend before this one, Arsenal Forest, which was, you know, sort of one of the biggest stories of the day in the sense that Arsenal blew the chance to go, whatever it was, nine points clear or something. But it was nil-nil, so it was the last game. In a way, it was like, fair play, that's quite an equitable way of doing it. But I'd say that was much more sort of narrative-rich than, I can't remember the specifics, but there was probably like a mid-tably game that was higher scoring but of less consequence.

49:27We know that there are people who work for Match of the Day that listen to this podcast.

49:31Nick Miller:Yeah. That's been proven beyond any doubt. Get in touch. So, yeah, come on. What's the real answer here? Yeah, I want to know what the threshold is.

49:38Charlie Eccleshare:Anyway, speaking of unremarkable people somehow making themselves the biggest story of all. It's time for Keys and Grey Corner.

49:58Ford Super Sunday.

50:03Charlie Eccleshare:Just one item for you in Keys and Grey Corner today. They were mysteriously off duty on the B-In on Sunday. Left it to the B-Team. But one tweet from Keezy. It's really odd tonight, not absorbing what the super sky blues Coventry City have done today. I'd normally be drinking in Super Frank's press conference by now. I hate it. Damned television. The way you pronounce that, you made it sound like Keezy would be in the press conference having a drink at the back. Got the emphasis wrong there, didn't I? Sipping away. So what's happened here? So Coventry were bumped to the Monday night TV slot, and he was bemoaning the fact that they weren't on a Saturday when he could be sort of soaking in their latest win on a Sunday night mecca.

50:45Nick Miller:That is quite funny for him of all people to be moaning about that and I'm sure he wouldn't spot the irony.

50:50Charlie Eccleshare:Yeah, this is where the conversation was always going to go, Dave. Richard Key's bemoaning the impact of TV on football scheduling. Damned television. Damned television. Ian have got 84 football channels. How dare he? I mean, is this the kind of situation where we have to think that you know he's in on this this is a kind of well gonna get them with this one kind of approach from Casey he could do a Rio here

51:20Nick Miller:and bait everyone and then realise once he's gaffed do the fishing emoji thing the sort of like refuge of I've been I've been caught

51:28Charlie Eccleshare:out here stunned he's never tweeted the fishing emoji actually no it's way it's way

51:34Nick Miller:too kind of millennial or younger for him isn't it no I think it's

51:39Charlie Eccleshare:in his locker the official emoji you reckon yeah I do I do is he an emoji man oh yeah well he put one on here he put a really angry red face oh I see television so yeah you know he's got an emoji in his locker most people do these days but yeah damn television I hope his blog's out or enjoy that after we record anyway we finish now thanks to you Nick Miller thank you thanks to you Charlie Eccleshare thank you thanks to you David Walker thank you and thanks to everyone for listening we'll be back on Thursday with the listeners Meza Harlan Dix See you then

52:26on ESPN and on the ESPN app

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