Champions League Debrief: Arsenal win but disappointment for Chelsea and Man City

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1:09Make your travel dollars work harder. Follow Smart Travel on your favourite podcast app. On the Football Daily Podcast, Champions League Debrief with Kelly Cates. Mixed night in the Champions League for English teams. Possibly one that went the way we thought it would, getting the first leg scorelines. But Arsenal are through to the quarterfinals. They will play sporting after their 2-0 win over Bayer Leverkusen. That's a 3-1 win on aggregate. Misery, though, for Chelsea. They lost 3-0 on the night at home to PSG and lost 8-2 on aggregate. And not to be for Manchester City. They had a go against Real Madrid after their 3-0 first leg defeat, and that match was watched by Alistair Bruce Ball.

1:58Yeah, one of those, Kelly, a couple of sort of wistful ifs and maybes after this game, starting after the first leg 3-0 down. If Manchester City have managed to force one of the early chances past Thibaut Courtois, because City did start well. If the captain, Bernardo Silva, hadn't been sent off, that's a big if, obviously. Then maybe they might have been able to affect something like the miracle of Manchester and turn this one round. but I don't think Silva could have any real complaints about his red card for handball in the first half. He blocked a Vinicius shot on the line with his elbow. It was missed on the pitch at the time, dealt with by VAR.

2:32Vinicius took the penalty, stuck it away. So then Real Madrid led 4-0 on aggregate, having not been able to beat Donnarumma with his penalty in the first leg. To their credit, though, City kept going throughout. Haaland equalised on the night just before half-time. Pep Guardiola had to be a bit clever in the second half, making the changes, trying to keep players fresh for the League Cup final on Sunday. Would have been lovely for City, I think, to go into that big final with a win under their belt. Had their chances as well, didn't find a way through. And then Vinicius, of course, who else? Had the final say on the night in added time, just volleyed home from close range, got the second Real Madrid goal.

3:09So they won on the night, they won on aggregate by five goals to one, and they go through to the quarterfinals. Leon Osman was watching alongside Ali. Leon, it's a strange game to try and make sense of because although Manchester City did have a go, they had a couple of goals disallowed for offside, Haaland did eventually manage to end his goal drought, Real Madrid knew that they had that 3-0 cushion, so they didn't really go for it in the match. No, not really. I think Pep Guardiola will be pleased with his team after the game because they gave everything they had, they gave a lot of energy. it was going to be a really difficult task to beat Real Madrid 3-0 to take it into extra time by 4 to actually come away from here with winners and that was made near impossible when they went down to 10 men I mean they have to be absolutely exceptional create things left, right and centre, be really clinical and not give up any chances the moment Real Madrid scored again suddenly it was more than impossible it was undoable and you kind of saw that they kept going, they tried to create chances City, never quite looked like they were going to beat the goalkeeper regardless who it was, I mean Lunen come on at half time for a quarter and played just as well, made just as good saves because City did keep pressing but ultimately you just knew if City were going to get one more Real Madrid would just go get two more it just felt like that and Real Madrid as they kind of do, eased through that second half, kept City at arm's reach and progressed quite comfortably Did Manchester City play with wing-backs in this game and is that something that they could do more of going forward?

4:45I think they did in the second half, certainly for a spell before Semenyo came on for Mateus Nunes and I don't think it's something you'll really see off Manchester City that often but when you've got the likes of Ait Nuri and Mateus Nunes who are just as much wingers really the attacking prowess is more effective than defensively. I mean both are improving defensively but both effective going forward as well it just gave City the option to try and get people in off the line give Real Madrid something else to think about some players popping up in positions that maybe they hadn't really worked on through the week but yeah it worked somewhat but ultimately Pep brought Semenu I'm probably thinking as me and Ali were discussing about the weekend's game as much as anything this one felt like it was too far it worked a little bit but I wouldn't see them doing it much happen more as we progress forward.

5:37Yeah, we'll look ahead to that in just a second. But just on tonight's game, did you see, or maybe this does actually knock on to the League Cup final at the weekend against Arsenal. Did you see a bit more from Erling Haaland than we have in the recent previous appearances? In the second half, yes. In the first half. Was that to do with the wing-backs, Leon? Did that affect that? Possibly. Or was it just Haaland? Possibly. I just thought once that goal went in, I mean, even the manner, and we're all saying he's desperate for a goal. I can't believe that we were saying that about Erling Haaland but he just seemed a lot more easy to mark.

6:14He felt like he was not sure where to run in the first half and that's how I've seen him for a few weeks. Once that goal went in and it was kind of a mishit, mistime shot because of the reflection that came his way and he celebrated it like he was a bit embarrassed but from when he ran off and he got to the halfway line again from that moment till he'd come off he looked like the Erling Haaland we knew. He was sharp. He was making positive runs. He was really getting into positions that we expect him to be. A couple of efforts. Kiba made a great save at the start of the second half. But, yeah, I think he'll feel a lot better going into the weekend's fixture than he has done in previous games, maybe even going into this.

6:51I think that goal did him all sorts of good. Watching the game between Arsenal and Bayer Leverkusen was Matthew Upson. Watching Chelsea PSG was Pat Nevin. But before we get to their games, Pat, thoughts on Manchester City and what this means potentially for the rest of their season. Nine points behind Arsenal in the league, although they do have a game in hand and they do play Arsenal before the end of the season, as we know, in mid-April. But there won't be a Champions League. They've got a League Cup final to come at the weekend. Are they sort of limping towards the end of this season, do you think?

7:26Do you know, it's an odd thing, you know, it could be three points when they play a game hand, as you say, and they've got the game against Arsenal. And yes, they look very, very tired. So they've gone out. Yes, they've got the League Cup final. But in reality, they're probably going to have a lot less games than Arsenal between now and the end of the season. That's the only upside, and that's what they need to grab hold of right now. If a team is looking, you know, as if they are wearying a little bit, any sort of rest will help them. So the oddest thing is for Arsenal fans out there, they really probably wanted Manchester City to win this and go through.

8:01But they're out and their concentration will not totally, but almost totally move on to the league now. So, yeah, psychologically, no, it's not a good thing. Of course, it's not a good thing. Physically, yeah, it probably is. But, you know, they won't be thinking that right now. No, they certainly won't be feeling that way. But Matt, with Arsenal and in terms of the league, which is, while we've got the City focus, or we can really focus on it at the moment, there is that gap, there is the game to come against Arsenal, and we'll come on to the Arsenal performance, but almost more than that, there's a calmness about Arsenal, which has been a long time coming, but it feels like it's kicked in now.

8:41Do you think that Arsenal will be worried about the fact that the City could have, what, at least two fewer games than them between now and the end of the season? Yes, because it all plays a part, but ultimately why think or even focus on something that you just can't control? So at the moment Arsenal are doing what they need to do to hold their end up, to worry about themselves and to get themselves into a position where they're competitive and on the verge of winning nearly every game. And that's what they've done, to be honest, by different ways and in different manners. Tonight was slightly different, they were more at it tonight, a bit more kind of on the front foot.

9:18They really did suffocate by Leverkusen. So, you know, other games they haven't been, but they're getting it done. So worrying about whether Manchester City have had two less games because they're out of the Champions League, I just think they can't control it and all they'll be thinking about is themselves right now. Let's hear from the Arsenal manager, Mikel Arteta. Oh, everybody want to fire me, right? Oh, God, guys. One day I'll look up here and say bye-bye, guys.

9:49If you only had one Champions League, would that be disappointing to you? Would that be enough given how good... Yeah, you're right. You're right. I have to win six Champions League to be recognised in that. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Listen, I started my career really young. In the second team, Barcelona, we started in New York. We were promoted in the new league. And after Barcelona, when the travel is extensible. Since then, in order to win the trials at Super Bowl, my team is a failure. So I know that since they won. First season, you remember first season here? Why are you going to win the Champions League?

10:22We won 100 points. Why are you going to win the Champions League? Why are you going to win the Champions League? At the end, we won it. Why are you going to win the Champions League? So we tried. Yeah, we tried. We have been in other finals, a lot of semifinals. And unfortunately, in the last two editions of the Champions League, We have been out.

10:44But this club, we arrived to make the bar a little bit high in terms of Champions League, and we didn't achieve that. Always, this is not a good thing, but it's fine. That is good. I would love that club have the feeling that Madrid has. Still don't have for the history. Madrid has. If you don't win the Champions League, it's a failure. That is pressure. We, yeah. Pep is a failure, it's no way in the Champions League, it's fine. But Man City is not expectation, that is the pressure. With the time, maybe we'll get that. Maybe we'll get that. But I think I don't have anything. Just today I'm going to sleep and tomorrow, tomorrow is like, let me challenge, Madrid come and let me challenge you.

11:30You know, in 180 minutes with 11 against 11. I will have that night, that feeling, that's all. Maybe play against 11 and you lose 0-4. Who's a guarantee you play against 11? But the feeling I had in the last times we played here, even last season 1-1, it's just no stats. You just see the feeling. The 4-3, before the 4-0 here, the 4-3 was the most unfurled result I ever experienced in my career. These kind of things that make always we are good. Here against Real Madrid, always we are really, really good. But 10 against 11, 75 minutes, listen, 10 against 11, 75 minutes, you are in aggregate, one up or two up, one one, okay, let's go to defend, what happened?

12:16But with 4-0 down, it's a little bit more complicated because in the first leg, we make 20 minutes good, 20 good minutes in the second half. But yeah, the result dictates 3-0, it's tough, really, really tough. So, Leon, there's the possibility of challenging further into the season for the league title for Manchester City. There is the possibility of silverware in the League Cup final on Sunday. Commentary on 5 Live from 4.30. There is also, longer term, the question mark about whether Pep Guardiola stays as Manchester City manager. People with knowledge of inside the club seem to suggest that Guardiola himself hasn't even made a decision yet.

12:58And that's why there is this question. as to what happens next. But having seen what happened with Sir Alex Ferguson at Manchester United, where he wanted to end on a high, does this feel like it might influence Guardiola's decision? I don't think... I think it's hard to sort of determine which high you go out on and how you feel when you're leaving somewhere that it's job done. You just feel with what Guardiola has done at Manchester City and how he's propelled them to be champions so many times, I think six times under his tenure. They've won other things as well. You just feel like it wouldn't quite sit right if he left at the end of this season with them not actually winning anything and maybe them not being in a good position.

13:45So I do think Silverware is important into the thoughts behind his decision. Maybe Carabao Cup will be enough. Maybe at the end of the season he'll sit back and think, well, you know, that's a nice little way to finish. I brought one more trophy in. But just know he's a hugely competitive person. You can see that by the way he manages. You can see that by his desire to be at the top teams, Barcelona, Bayern Munich, Manchester City, and be successful in each one. So my gut, and to be fair, I'm not sure my gut's a big influence on what he's going to do at Manchester City, but my gut will be there.

14:23He might just stay another year. Pat, it's another point that isn't measurable. But there is a question about how much this uncertainty, how much these conversations about Pep Guardiola's future have affected Manchester City this season, have translated themselves onto the pitch. There's that and there's the sense that this is a team that's in the middle of a period of change as well. You just look at clubs that are in transition periods, and we know they are just now. They've had enough money to spend. Some good players are brought in, but it's even happened to Liverpool this season as well. You know, the season before, you thought that would be a transition season.

15:02It turns out this is the one, and that has an effect. I'm not sure. I have to say, I think footballers are selfish. Do they really care? You know, they look at the manager. Yeah, he's gone. We'll get another one in. We'll just do our job, and we'll do the best of their ability where we're doing it. because you have to be focused when you're a football player at that level. There's a game every week. You're not thinking that far ahead. You have to think quite simply what you do in that game. So I don't think you can use that as an excuse or a reason for Manchester City. What they've not been able to do is be as good as Arsenal and they've not got a big enough squad that's been able to cope with the stresses and strains of it and that's been clear.

15:38But underline, I'm not writing them out of the league title. I really wouldn't do that. I think it's a very brave person that will do that just now. Because if they can just concentrate on one thing between now and the end of the season, look at the quality players they've got. All it needs is Arsenal to slip up in one game and Manchester City to say, OK, it's in our hands now. So, you know, don't write it off yet. They're not favourites. Arsenal are favourites to win the league. And they are by a little distance. But is it finished? No, I don't think it is. I just wonder what, Leon, you've seen in Manchester City this season.

16:14Because as everybody said, this potentially could be a season of transition for Manchester City. But they finished off the pace last season in the league title as well. And how long this process of rebuilding this Manchester City side might take. If you think that your gut tells you that Pep Guardiola is going to stay on and potentially do one more year at Manchester City, how far into that process of change he is? Well, I think I was looking at the start of the season and thinking with the changeover of players and where I thought they might be, the signings that they made, albeit good, whether they were at the leadership stage, maybe I was thinking of the characters with regards to their influence on the football team.

17:03I thought it would be a year where they got stronger towards the end and maybe they'd fall too far behind at the beginning and it was going to be by the start of next season after another transfer window that Pep would have them exactly where he wants them to be. But they were ahead of schedule. They really were. I thought the fact that we're talking about them as, you know, even eight games to go, the closest rivals to Arsenal. They've given them more of a go than I thought. He shows me that they are ahead. Yes, they've fallen away for all the reasons I thought they wouldn't be in the title race at the start of the season, but they've had a right good fist at it.

17:38And maybe that is going to put them in good stead for a runner out next year. Again, Pep's enthusiasm will determine everything. It always does. His influence on the team, his ability to build a new team and keep them going. But as I said, I mean, if they were to win the Cannavale Cup, if they were to get over the line and be in one more, then who knows? But I just think they all, I think they progressed better than I expected them to. So I think he'll be looking at that in a positive way with regards to being in charge next season. If they are going to stay in the league title race, they are going to have to expect Arsenal to slip up in that.

18:16But given tonight's performance in the Champions League, They just, Matthew Upson, seem to have an air of calm and control about them in terms of just getting the job done. Yeah, they were back to that kind of arsenal that you see at home when the match starts and they're just on the opposition. They're just all over him. They're pressing in. They're not allowing him to play out. Leverkusen couldn't really get a foothold in the game. they weren't creating like masses of chances at Arsenal at that point and then all of a sudden the corners started flowing and then the opportunities came and then the opposition got stretched, got a bit ragged the back three of Leverkusen had to defend the box the goalkeeper made one or two saves and they're under siege at that point they could have scored at that moment and then it took a bit of brilliance by Eze to produce a brilliant goal on the turn and then from then on it just, I don't know you just never felt like Arsenal weren't going to go through and came out in the second half, Leverkusen were better, first 10 minutes, had another bit of a go, but didn't quite have the cutting edge.

19:24And I think that's the difference. They're playing against the PSG Arsenal or Real Madrid, then obviously that level is going to go up a notch or two. So that's going to be the real test to see where this Arsenal team is at this season. But in this fixture, they were comfortable. They were very business-like. It was calm. The stadium felt good. It was in a positive mood before the game. And I think that just flowed into it and it was relatively comfortable in the end. That goal by Eze was something really special, wasn't it? Yeah, it was. I actually prefer Declan Rice's, weirdly. Like, I know it had the wow factor, Eze, because it was a swivel.

20:01It sat up on the volley, smashed it in. But the way Rice has pulled the ball out of the sky, he's running onto it. He's got there first in a challenge anyway. He's controlled it with like the sole of his foot on the half volley. He had another touch. And then to just curve it into the bottom corner. I mean, it's a top piece of skill from Declan Rice. And he has these moments in the Champions League, doesn't he? And it was down that end that he scored those amazing free kicks against Real Madrid. So, you know, it was another great night for Declan Rice, who's just been the consistency of his performances.

20:35I mean, he rarely drops below an eight out of ten for Arsenal at the moment. is going to be key moving towards the end of the season. Let's hear from the Arsenal manager, Mikel Arteta. I think we started the game so well. I think we were a threat from every angle. Their keep it, as you said, maintained them in the game, I think. And we needed a magical moment from Epps to score a wonderful goal to give us the lead. And in the second half, we had periods of domination, periods where they dominated us because they are a really good side and they are really good what they do. And again, the Aklan's actions opened the opportunity to win the game and the tie.

21:12And unfortunately, as well, we had four or five situations where we should have probably scored the third one and put the game to bet. But overall, I think we fully deserve to be in the quarterfinals. It's been a really brilliant few days for Arsenal. Leon, they get the win over Everton at the weekend, which comes along with Manchester City dropping points as well. Thank you for that, Kelly. Well, the reason I went to you on that one is because you will have, but it was you or Pat, so I can't really duck it with an ex-Everton player. But the reason is because you will both have watched that game and you will have paid attention to that game and you will have seen that Arsenal performance.

21:54I mean, it's not just the Arsenal win, it's because it's coupled with the fact that City dropped points. It's because it's coupled with the fact that, you know, they've got the League Cup final against Manchester City. They've got an FA Cup quarterfinal coming up against Southampton. I mean, the quadruple is on, isn't it? It is. I know it's a big ask and I know it's incredibly difficult still to do, sorry, to do still at this stage. But it is. They're into the final of a competition. It's one game. Yes, it's against, you know, one of the best teams in the country at the moment in Manchester City.

22:32but you know Arsenal certainly won't mind that situation because Arsenal feel they're the best at the moment they're nine points clear in the title race yes City have got a game in hand but it's an opportunity and a gap that they would have loved at the start of the season you look at the FA Cup and no disrespect to Southampton but Manchester City drew Liverpool you know they could have got one of the hardest draws in that situation they've got a relatively easy one you'd say by that standard haven't got a relatively straightforward one in Mansfield in the last round. That went kind of their way.

23:04And even the Champions League, yes, you know, Matt's watched them perform and get brilliantly tonight and get through. But they're not in the same side of the draw as Paris Saint-Germain or Liverpool or Galatasaray, Real Madrid and City. They're Bayern Munich and Atlanta who are in one side of the draw. Yes, Barcelona are no push-overs. But I'd say the better teams that we would say traditionally, the ones with all the experience of winning it year in, year out, the ones that probably are in the top of their leagues, in all the countries are all down to one side of the draw. So they've also got a pretty favorable draw in this competition as well.

23:38No game is straightforward. It's the final ends of the Champions League. They'll have to be at their very, very best, but it's certainly possible. And they've got themselves into a great position to do it in games. But also, as we discussed before, with the quality of the squad and they're all ready to play and they're all actually fit and raring to go. And that's that's huge at this stage of the season. Yeah, Arsenal will play sporting in the quarterfinals of the Champions League. They beat Bodo Gleit by five goals to nil, so they go through 5-3 on aggregate.

24:33On 5 Live Sports. On the Football Daily Podcast. Champions League Debrief with Kelly Cates. So Arsenal progress to the quarterfinals where they will face Sporting after that incredible comeback against Bodo Glimt. It's a really good opportunity for them to reach at least the semifinals of this competition, if not to progress further. They're still very much in pole position in the Premier League. there's a League Cup final to come against Manchester City and they face Southampton in the FA Cup in the quarterfinals in the first weekend in April. For Chelsea this evening, they came into their game against PSG, Pat.

25:125-2 down. It was always going to be a battle for them against one of the strongest side, one of the favourites in this competition. They needed a strong start, but it all went wrong from the beginning. Look, they took a massive, massive risk at the start of the game. They went for a back three, man-to-man, with two 20-year-olds, wide players, playing as centre-backs, I'd dragged out to full-backs. Mahmoudou Saar against Kvaretskiela, Hato against Bercolo, and it just wasn't fair in those young kids. It was bold. The kindest thing I could say was bold, it was also just wrong. It just didn't work at all.

25:48PSG scored right from the start, from that position. It was obvious that's where the danger was going to be, and they scored. Kvaretskiela put it away. after that I have to say I don't think PSG got over 50 % I think we're just cruising and that was enough they picked Chelsea off when they wanted Chelsea got into some good positions but the final third quality that PSG have got in comparison to Chelsea is just incomparable 8-2 over this two-legged tie is not flattering, it's not a fluke Chelsea are that far off this standard of side now a lot of people talking before Chelsea are world champions to be PSG and the World Club Championship.

26:27I wasn't buying that. I was never buying that at the time. It's kind of partially made-up tournament, and this is much more realistic of where real teams are going to. So Chelsea fans had left here by 70 minutes. They're doggone. So there's a realism here that is problematic. Now, they're going to try and talk it up. Chelsea are closer in points to relegation than they are to Arsenal. Now, this is a team that's spent£1.5 billion. pounds. This is four years into the project. You've got to say, I've got some questions. So in the end of this, Chalaba got injured at the end of that finishing up with 10 men.