The Commentators' View: Ali hit by golf ball & John’s fashion show

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1:17Hello, welcome to the Football Daily. I'm John Murray and this is the Commentator's View where we five live commentators talk about football, the language of football commentary and the journeys football takes us on. Speaking of which, today we are not on a footballing trip. We're on a golf journey as we come to you with a slightly different sound. You might have picked that up already because we are at Bethpage State Park, Long Island, New York for a bit of a Ryder Cup special. So joining us on the podcast today, Alistair Bruce Ball, as usual. Hello, John. But no Ian Dennis, who is not here. and Ian Dennis has been replaced by our golf correspondent Ian Carter.

2:02Hello, John. Hi, Ali. Are you ready, Ian? Are you ready for it? We've already done an open championship special. So the commentator's view has had a golf flavour before already this year, but this is quite different, isn't it? Yeah, and your question, are you ready? Yes, yes, we are. And it's unique to the Ryder Cup because the Ryder Cup is played on a Friday, Saturday and Sunday. I've been here since Sunday lunchtime in New York.

2:30Ali Bruce-Ball:I was going to say, because obviously we, you know, as you say, John, we did a golf special during the Open Championship and actually the media centre we sat in at the Open Championship physically was a bigger structure than the one we're in here in New York. But it's fair to say, isn't it, Ian, in terms of the size of an event and the excitement and the anticipation, nothing beats this in golf, not the Masters, not the open. This is the biggest and the best, isn't it? I think this is the moment that golf transcends and becomes not just something that the casual sports fan engages with, but properly engages with, properly gets passionate about it.

3:11They, in the same way as people follow football, you go with that sort of tribal recognition, that parochialism and the combat that ensues. It's so much easier to understand. And I think that much of the individual game is for the golf enthusiast is celebrating the immense skill of the players. Whereas this is just all about winning and losing.

3:37Ali Bruce-Ball:You and I, John, cover football all the time. This is the closest to a football atmosphere you'll ever get on a golf course, isn't it? Yeah. And also, it's the greatest contrast. this because you go from absolute silence hopefully to well you will do there you know there will be moments where it is absolutely silent and then you go to the top of the range and and it that is unique that is unique and you know this is the commentator's view ian and the commentator's view at this event is also unique it is uh and we're very fortunate we're We're all sitting here with our blue lanyards on our accreditation, and they say inside the ropes.

4:23They also say one arm's length, which for me and Ali is a bit of a problem because we're not blessed with the wingspan that you have, John. So you'll be able to get a little further in from the ropes than we can. But seriously, that means that we're allowed to be inside the ropes, but we have to be close to those ropes. We can only go an arm's length inside. hopefully they won't be too strict on that because then it's all about trying to get vantage points where we can see we're not heard by the players and we're not obscuring the view of the the spectators as well and as we all know that's a bit of a challenge yeah it is that is a challenge

4:59Ali Bruce-Ball:yeah what isn't unique and i know ian dennis is not here but we'll will i think i think you'll feel your pain john but he will enjoy this story at the same time is that getting out here and your travel woes have reared their ugly head once again your start to Ryder Cup week was not ideal was it no it wasn't and listen everyone has travel problems you know what in whatever walk of life you're in you know and we've all had our fair share but I thought that this football season Paul Robinson had actually taken my title of the travel Jonah of Five Live from me but I think I might have won it back over the course of 24 hours awake on Monday.

5:43From the moment that I got out of bed on Monday morning to the point where I got into bed in New York, I had been up for over 24 hours. Just delayed flight, bag didn't turn up because there was a very very tight connection so I made the plane but the bag didn't make it also driving the hire car on my own from JFK Airport in the very early hours through New York was an interesting experience into Chinatown into Chinatown I also took a couple of wrong turns went over two bridges I think I went over the George Washington Bridge which is a big bridge and I'm thinking where I need to be is behind me and that bridge is going a long way in the other direction.

6:30Anyway, finally got there. When I got there, stepped out of the car, and I looked down at the tyres, and the back left tyre was flat. So that was all quite challenging, and it took me all of Tuesday to get all of that sorted out. And as we speak, my bag is still waiting to be located.

6:52Ali Bruce-Ball:Yeah, and personal shopping assistant involved in this story as well. Yeah, yeah. So where we are, there were a couple of us. So I went to reception with very, very helpful with all my problems the other day. And all of them. Yep, all of them. Absolutely all of them. And Lisa on reception said, you're going to need to buy some more clothes, aren't you? And I said, yeah, where do you recommend? And she recommended one place. But then she said, actually, if you are likely to get compensation for this, then why not go to Macy's? so I went to Macy's and they have a very interesting fashion collection and and the slightly older lady sort of took me under her wing and decided she was going to dress me for the Ryder Cup and some of her suggestions were not really the kind of things that you two have seen me wear such as well there was one that was sort of very very radical Hawaiian with big feathers on it yeah I can see that.

7:52Bright, electric blue with lots of feathers on it. Another one, she picked them, and she was holding them up against me and saying, oh, yeah, yeah, that is you. And I'm saying, I'm not sure it is me. And then she pulled this. Did you say I tend to go for a check? I didn't say that. I was sort of gazing longingly at the checks on another rack. And she also leaned into this, and she pulled out this scarlet shirt, and she said, look at this. I held this up against me. And I said, I'm not, again, I'm not sure I go that bright. So in the end, I managed to sort of get into, in fact, I'm wearing it now, which is a checked shirt, which is sort of, yeah, kind of checked.

8:37Yeah, but anyway, so there we are. You're here. I'm here, and I've just come back in off the course. So I've walked part of the course for the first time. That is going to be a challenge. and I think commentating on the first, commentating on the tee shots Ian, that is going to be, you know, I know that we've spoken already about how we're going to do it so you can elaborate. Yes, I mean it's, we're going to do it differently this time because the tee, the first tee is elevated and ordinarily what we do is we're down by the side of the tee and you can see the players, You want to see into the whites of their eyes because it is the most nerve-wracking tee shot that is ever played in the game of golf.

9:21And so ordinarily we try to get pretty close to the tee and you get that view of the player and then you usually get a view of where they're hitting two and you're able to describe that opening tee shot. But this time, because the tee is elevated, to be anywhere near that tee, you're just not going to see them because you're down too low. but at the back of the tee we have this huge grandstand with 8 ,000 seats in it that goes all the way around and the other issue is that the the first tee is very adjacent to the 18th green so you can't really have the usual horseshoe grandstand around the first tee that's always so intimidating instead this is a much wider structure that takes in the 18th green as well as the first tee but there is an area there for the media to be able to go so I think what we're going to do is one of us will be at the back with a great great view down as the players come on to the tee we should be able to see in the whites of their eyes we'll be able to describe the ball being teed up and the shot being hit but the problem is it's a dog leg and these players hit the ball so far they're hitting the ball straight over the trees so from there you can't see the ball land so whoever's with that group that's teeing off at that time will be further down the fairway the description will come from the tee and then it's heading your way and i always love that that bit anyway we do it at the masters all the time especially down the 11th hole and then you know the next commentator will pick it up it's landed in the fairway blah blah blah some of our favorite moments being and the ball is on its way ian yes my when you said that what immediately came to mind there was actually the open championship not the right of come when tom watson looked as though he was going to win on the final hole at turn three 2009 i was with bernard gallagher standing right behind tom watson you were up in the commentary box on the grandstand and he'd you know he negotiated the tee shot he was in the middle of the fairway and you know bernard and i had spoken all the way down saying we're actually going to see tom Watson at the age of 59 wasn't it yes win the open we're gonna he's gonna do it and Bernard would say well he's just got one more shot really to hit so I'm describing it he hits it and it's bang on line and and I've kind of said well there it is Tom Watson's approach shot to the 18th it's bang on line he's on course for victory and where's it landed Ian and you said and I said it's landed in the middle of the green.

11:55Where's it going Ian? And you said, well, it has skipped on

11:59Ali Bruce-Ball:through the back. Just to tell people a little bit of what we're going to be doing this week and we did do a bit of this this summer. So we will be out on the golf course inside the ropes as Ian has explained with arm's length with us as commentators. We will have former professional golfers as our summarizers to provide the sort of the expert analysis as we go. And then the current professional golfers. Well, exactly. That's a very good point. Yeah, that's a very good point. We're also going to get Kat Downs on the podcast this week, one of our other commentators at the Ryder Cup this year and has done it previously as well.

12:35Ali Bruce-Ball:In fact, I think Kat commentated on the winning moment in Rome a couple of years ago when Tommy Fleetwood was given the putt by Ricky Fowler, just to get her thoughts as well on what covering Ryder Cups. Do you remember what I was doing at the time? You were off air. Your pack had gone down. if times you do not want your pack to blow up yeah a on the singles day at the ryder cup in the last hour or so yeah so i was sitting with andrew mcgee behind i think it was the 15th unable to broadcast just watching the action i've got a good story on that actually how have you so celtic manor 2010 yeah i remember i mean they were brutal days with the rain and everything and that do you remember that day where they rejigged it all and and there was so it went it went on forever and and the final match on the course was the molinari brothers and andrew cotter was was covering that match and i'd gone up to our commentary box and was almost comatose i mean i was so exhausted and i sat down next to the presenter john inverdale took my headphones off and andrew was commentating it was the last match on the course and one thing i should say before that is that this commentary box wasn't ideally located.

13:47I remember this. Because there was a giant oak tree between the commentary box at the back of the grandstand and the green. Yeah, couldn't see it. You couldn't see the green. Couldn't see the green. So anyway, I'm half asleep, just thinking, oh, just got to, you know, get some rest here. And Andrew's pack went down as he was commentating on that final green. And so silence descends on the output. and then I hear in the background from my headphones, which are on the desk, Ian Carter pick up and commentate. My eyes are half shut. So I leant forward, stuck the headphones on, picked up the microphone, looked up to see who was putting.

14:32And of course, all I could see was a note tree. And then I looked at the monitor and was able to see it was Francesco Molinari and he held the putt and fortunately we got away with it. And I'll never forget Andrew trudging all the way up to the commentary box at the end of it all, coming in and looking and he said, was I on? And I said, no, you dropped out. And he went, oh, and I nailed it. So funny. But that's what happens. You know, it's great. What is also slightly different for us covering a Ryder Cup in the United States is, and it is the case this year as well, we are providing the commentary that is piped onto the course.

15:19So people listening on the course, on their radios, will be listening to the BBC radio commentary. And clearly that also means that you have to be very conscious. I know we always talk about impartiality, but we do have to be very, very conscious, don't we? That particularly here, when there's been such a talk about what the atmosphere is going to be like and how it is possibly going to be feverish, that many of the people on the course will be listening to us. Yes, and that is something that we have to definitely keep in mind. We can't let it affect our editorial judgment. And I do fear that there could well be moments over the three days of competition where we're going to have to say some tough stuff and describe incidents that, frankly, no one really wants to see at a sporting event.

16:09Let's hope I'm wrong, but we might have to. And when we do, we're going to have to choose our language very, very carefully, I think. because, you know, this is, I don't know whether you've sensed it, Ali and John, since we've been here, but we know that we're at a point in history in America where things are very polarised. And the fierce nationalism that is around this country at the moment, I think, could easily manifest itself in this Ryder Cup. And that's why I think people are predicting such a hostile atmosphere for Europe. And we've got to ride that and report it and not upset the people who are listening.

16:50And, of course, you've got the Trump factor. Go on, Jim. Two of my favorite stories of interaction that we get in the States when we are in that position where people are listening to us behind the ropes. One I remember, I can't remember which one it was, but I remember walking down within an arm's length of the ropes and this kid in stars and stripes leans out into the course with his hand outstretched. and as I'm walking I'm thinking he's going to approach me here and as I'm walking closer to him he's got this hand out stretch I'm thinking what's he going to do and he says hey you BBC hello and he said pointed at me he said you rock out baby and he put his hand up and he wanted a high five which I kind of reluctantly gave him another one was did he say nice checked shirt probably Probably.

17:43Another one was, I remember being, after a day of the Ryder Cup, in fact, it might have all come to a conclusion. I'm in the merchandise tent, and I'm just sort of thinking, what am I going to get to take home from the Ryder Cup? I turn around, and there are these two twin girls, you know, in their teams, probably, who are standing there in front of me.

18:03Ali Bruce-Ball:Not more personal shoppers, Vijay. And I turned around, and they both pointed at me together, and it was like something out of a horror film. and they said almost together they said here you are and I said um and they said we've been watching you and I said have you and they said yes we've been following you all week on the course and they said yes every time we see you we say to each other there he is i i i couldn't get away quick enough but you know that that that's definitely the positive side of it as well because you know you are right this is going to be an interesting one over the next few days and i think there are going to be you know some some tricky waters to navigate at times but actually the the majority of the reception i have found when we've done these in the usa has been really positive and i think i think the american fans enjoy the way we do golf with that sort of test match special feel to it.

19:04Ali Bruce-Ball:So the sport obviously gets covered, but it's interlaced with plenty of humour and colour and the odd football result pops in as well. And I think it's just something they're not used to hearing. They're not because the American sports broadcasting is very, very statistic and driven and number driven. And I remember when Rory McIlroy won the Scottish Open and they played it on the Sunday morning and I was actually, I'd left to get to the open, so I was driving down, I think, to Hoylake and I managed to get PGA Tour radio on my phone so I could listen to what was going on while I was driving down.

19:42And it suddenly struck me that all I was listening to was a succession of numbers. And this is just, you know, it was good, but it was, he's got a 52-degree wedge from 89 yards, three under par and the pin is 12 paces and it was just number after number after number. By the end my head was starting to explode because every mode of description was using a numerical reference and we I think try to use words and describe and you know I'm always very conscious and have become even more conscious after that to say if it's a long putt he's a cricket pitch away or something like that So just try and give people an idea, a reference point, rather than just have someone thinking, 66 feet, what's that?

20:31So I think it does go down well with the American fans because it is different. And we've been very fortunate as well to work with Johnny Inverdill, covering it for such a long time, who's so good at just giving it light and shade. And now Herr Chapman, of course, who has never presented a Ryder Cup in the United States before. but also you know is is very worthy success of it John in terms of how he keeps things

20:58Ali Bruce-Ball:bubbling under shall we shall we switch golf commentate now Ian listen yes can't disappear totally because you've got to come back for a guest appearance on clash of the commentators in a bit with trepidation yeah me too me too so Ian is disappearing for a second and he is going to be replaced by Catherine Downs who is sitting down alongside us here in our broadcast booth in the media centre at Bethpage State Park. Kat sitting downs. Very good. And I will put your microphone on. Kat, are you ready for it? I did laugh at your joke just for the listeners there. Which joke? The joke. Oh, yeah, that joke.

21:34I laughed, but you hadn't turned my microphone on. Well, I'm sure listeners will be splitting their sides when they hear that.

21:42Ali Bruce-Ball:You commentate, Kat, on a whole variety of sports for the BBC and for other broadcasters as well. How would you compare on-course Ryder Cup commentary to the other stuff that you do? I think physically very tiring compared to the other stuff you do. You get up out of bed. I was going to say at the crack of dawn, it was before dawn. So you're up at half past three heading into the course. That in itself is tiring. and then you're walking 36 holes of what is always a very challenging golf course. So Marco Simone a couple of years ago in 37 degree heat or whatever it was and we're all slogging up that hill from the bottom down at the 8th all the way up to kind of the 11th, 12th, 13th at the very top of the hill.

22:33And, you know, it's the length of days and the lack of golf. You know, you have to be able to talk an awful lot because it's not like a major championship where there's loads and loads of golf going on, loads of different players to get your head across. There's only 24 of them. And we have to fill all of this airtime talking about just 24 players. So there's so much talking, so much walking, so much waking. It's a physical challenge, I'd say, rather than a lot of my other sports, which, you know, in fact, I've been a sucker for punishment and I pick sports that take a long time to commentate.

23:08I mean, you're lucky. you do 90 minutes and then you go home. Let's face it. Well, we don't go straight on, can. But I do tennis, which lasts all day. And golf and figure skating. You know, the figure skating goes on forever. Diving's quite quick. You know, that only takes 1.47. I'm not sure there is. Is there a faster sport than diving? No, I don't think there is. Here he comes. He's up, he's in. Yeah, that's exactly it. I don't even do it on the radio, so I don't have to describe it. You should make a bid to do it on the radio and then you'll be able to get home earlier. To return to a more conventional part of the Commentator's View podcast, we have obviously always been very pleased with the emails that we received from listeners, so tcv at bbc.co.uk, or indeed the voicemails that we love to get.

24:04and last week if you remember we were talking about how our engineer Chris Banner managed to catch the ball when he was sitting next to me at Newcastle Barcelona there was also Ali you were

24:16Ali Bruce-Ball:pointing out when Eddie Bevan at the cricket yeah that's a famous one isn't it you know I didn't think of it when we were talking about this last week but you know sort of when well in fact we've told the story about me treading on the golf ball at the Ryder Cup in 2006 when commentators sort of inadvertently get involved in the sporting action but the eddie bevan one is is famous where he's commentating on a cricket match at taunton have you heard this bit of audio cap where the ball is hit for six and he's commentating away and it's sort of coming straight towards him and then you hear this amazing smash tinkle crash of glass don't you it's very very like was he hurt i'm not sure i don't think so no i think he lifted it well he did lift it but it made me think of that but it also then got me onto golf because obviously we are occasionally in peril on the golf course because we stand in the landing zone don't we we stand looking for golf balls where they're going to land and i do remember at muirfield in 2013 uh sitting on a on a little hill uh beside one of the par three greens and brant snedeker's t-shot was on its way and i was sort of looking looking and like um just just completely lost it and then suddenly and luckily it hit the um the crossbar of my headphones there was this massive like and it just pinged off my head and flew off into the rough away to my right hand side and i think they found the talk back so it wasn't on air it didn't happen on air but they've got me and i buzzed to the studio because that's the way it works you know when we're off there we're able to say to the production team you know come to me in two minutes i've got a part and there's me going uh graham graham a b b at the 13th um i've just been hit on the head by snedeker's t shot are you all right yeah i'm fine i'm fine Still speaking.

25:51Ali Bruce-Ball:Yeah, exactly. And then later that evening, having told that story and finished the day's work, walked off into North Berwick to go and get dinner and got pooed on from a great height by a seagull, a massive splat of... All in the same day. What are the chances? I know. Have you been hit, Kat? No, not hit. I nearly ended up in the lake at Marco Simone on the Sunday. Did you? Which is the closest I've come to... Oh, yes, on the final green. Yeah, actual... That was quite hairy. It was super hairy, wasn't it? It was super hairy. Well, I remember having to... Tommy Fleetwood had already sunk the winning putt.

26:28Yeah. And then we were kind of making our way. By that point, we'd fallen off air quite dramatically, hadn't we? Oh, yeah, we all fell off air, didn't we? Yeah, there was a big power outage. And we'd all been told to make our way down the 18th and back to the cabins. But the stewards had lost control of the crowds because European fans were celebrating this victory and galloping all over the fairways. And there was no way that a string of marshals holding hands across that 18th fairway was going to stop them getting down to the green. And I think it was, was it Shane Lowry on the last? Yes, Shane Lowry.

27:03He still had a pot to go. Oh, against Spieth.

27:06Ali Bruce-Ball:Against Spieth. And the crowd were kind of, the little pool of green grass that was left for Shane Lowry to make his pot was only about 12 feet wide. and they were completely encircled and the crowd surging down the hill was pushing all of us who were already at the bottom of the hill back and there was a pond at the bottom quite a steep slope and I could feel myself beginning to topple and then this arm reaches out and gets hold of me and it's Tyrrell Hatton and I was clinging on to Tyrrell Hatton's arm and he's snarling at all the crowd around us like get back, get back and everyone's trying to protect Shane Lowry for this last bout.

27:48I think that's the closest I've come to being harmed, or at least getting wet. It did cross the line in the latter stages at Marco Simone. Anyway, on the subject of people getting hit by the ball, this week Ian from Ellesmere Port writes in, Dear TCV, following your discussion of commentators getting hit by the ball, I wanted to draw your attention to the following clip featuring the venerable New York Yankees baseball commentator John Sterling.