The Commentators' View: Postman Pat, Shaggy & Chunky Porro

0:00This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. We focus on the part of the internet that most people don't know about. It's called the dark web. Undercover in the furthest corners of the dark web, US special agents are on a mission to locate and rescue children from abuse. Move in now. Police! From the BBC World Service, World of Secrets, the darkest web follows their shocking investigations. Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your BBC podcasts.

0:59Ali Bruce Paul. Hello! Hey Ian. You're still glowing as ever. Well I've had a few days off this week, this midweek so I'm actually glowing in every side. I'm glowing on the outside and on the inside. Well that's good to know. And you Ali? Yes, no good form thanks Ian. Obviously burning issue of the day. First question that's got to come your way how was the golf? Well I heard you say last week that will take 10 minutes of the pod for this week and I'm thinking No, it won't. It won't even do 10 seconds because Hare Chapman beat me. Oh. I've got to say, Andrew Murray is my new golfing guru. I was three up through six holes.

1:43Were you? And then Andrew had been walking me through the course. So, for instance, I think on the third, he said, trust me, get your nine-nine out. I hit it within a foot of the pin. I was actually giggling. And Chappas was chuntering. And in fact, tell a lie, that was the sixth because after that, Andrew said, I've got to go now. And then I shot 20 in the next two holes. And my game nosedived and Chappers won convincingly. And from chuntering, he was then quite chirpy. And so much so that on one occasion I said, I'm on the green in about four here. And he went, you're not even on the green. And he was just giving me those sort of like snide comments throughout.

2:21Do you know what? That's a very accurate match report that because the Chappers couldn't wait. So I sent him a little message at some point during the week. I didn't even ask about the golf. And he said something like, I bet this doesn't get a mention on the pod. So I thought, oh, I know what's happened here. But in terms of your match report, Ian, he said, yep, you were three up after six. Drew disappeared. Your head fell off. And he said then for the next two holes, 20 shots. So I think you were 13 over par for two holes. Yeah, I had a shock. My game disintegrated. But what was then quite amusing, I bet he didn't tell you that he had a bout of cramp on the night.

2:58Really? He did. He was in agony. Did you have to lie him on his back and stretch his leg out? I just couldn't stop laughing. I've actually got it on video. Oh, marvellous. If I'm actually feeling down this week, if I'm feeling down this week, I just look at the video and it just makes me laugh. But also, Andrew, who loves the pod as well. And we should explain, Ian, Andrew, long long long time member of the five live golf team and oh yeah you know a a very very good golfer in his own right good enough that he won the european open so european open champion and all-round good egg yes it was actually quite surreal for me because i've obviously listened to to andrew for a number of years on five live and to have him walking around the course going get your nine nine out keep it steady it was i was i just found myself giggling a lot of the time But it was a very good experience.

3:55But his partner, Natalie, bringing it back to the pod, because Andrew loves the podcast, she's got a suggestion for the footballing glossary. So when you have a big hoofed clearance, and, you know, Peter Kay, let him have it, that type of thing, give him his foot back. And I said to Drew, I said, right, I said, I'll mention that on the pod. So if it's a big route one clearance, give him his foot back. that was Natalie's suggestion I don't know what your thoughts are for that I think that might be a North West England one do you think? right because it's I'm funny enough Andrew's mentioned that to me and I thought I'm sure I've never heard that right Ali?

4:36I've not heard it I really like it I really like it but I've never used it I've not heard it but that's made me smile but I think that possibly suggests with me sitting down in the sunny south in Salisbury that maybe it's a football phrase that belongs further up the country Now listen, while I was having a little breather this midweek, you commentated on two quite convincing Champions League wins, didn't you? Yes, Arsenal against Atletico Madrid on the Tuesday. I've got to say, Arsenal, once they'd scored the first goal, Atletico just couldn't live with them. They think they scored four goals in a 13-minute spell.

5:16and their intensity. Strength and depth as well when you think about it. I mean, he only made the two changes from the Fulham game. But they are looking a really, really impressive unit. And also, this is a team that is still missing Odegaard. Maduweke, of course, is out injured. Got a number of injury problems still. Gabriel Jesus has not played. He was able to arrest Calafiore. And yet, they dismantled Atletico Madrid, who did pose a threat on a couple of occasions during the game. So Arsenal and another clean sheet. Yeah. Incredible. I did Arsenal last weekend in the Saturday tea time kickoff at Fulham.

5:58Great atmosphere inside Craven Cottage. Fulham had a right good go at Arsenal. You never, ever felt Fulham were going to score. It was just whether Arsenal were going to get through Fulham, which they did with a set piece. Gabriel Flick on Trossard from close range. Arsenal couldn't get the second. But despite everything Fulham did, I just never felt, you know, Fulham. Arsenal look so strong. They do. In October. Well, no, you're right. Because Lady Kelly posed a question to Glenn Murray, who was the summariser, about, you know, what about Arsenal and the Champions League success? And I actually said, well, hold on.

6:34I said, this time a year ago, I was watching Arsenal beat a very tame looking Paris Saint-Germain 2-0. And you wouldn't have even said that Paris Saint-Germain on the evidence of that night were going to qualify. And yet look what happened in the second half of the season. By the way, talking about Kelly Cates presenting that night. John, did you hear the start? There was a lovely, I think you know what's coming here. And there was a lovely little moment just ahead of Arsenal Atletico kicking off. I don't know I think an indication of how big a game this is for Arsenal either that or they found out it's your birthday tomorrow because there's a light show on at the MRO there is a light show yes they've all been encouraged to log into some sort of QR code log into a QR code?

7:16you know what it is what's the terminology for it? I don't know just tell us about the light show there's lots of lights mobile phones lights it's a light show Kelly that's all I can say across the technology there she also said you wouldn't you wouldn't have got that with ai would you no you wouldn't yeah an ai commentary would never have come up with that genius no kelly also said do you know who you share your birthday with the 22nd of october and i said arsene wenger i thought it was she was being topical with it being arsenal and she said no shaggy is that right to which i replied i'd have got away with it if it wasn't for those pesky kids because not that one.

7:59A friend sent me a text going, I can't believe that you thought of Shaggy Scooby-Doo rather than... Anyway, Kelly then came up with a really good payoff. She said, it wasn't me. Yeah, yeah. I knew that was coming. The Chelsea game the following night, John. So another convincing win for an English team. Enzo Mareska made 10 changes. Yeah, yeah. Which I think is very interesting, you know, looking at the teams that were picked in the Champions League this week. But yeah, carry on. No, go on. So why do you think? Well, it goes back to, you know, I was saying at the start of the season when we're talking about the Champions League, I think the managers are now looking at it slightly differently and thinking that, you know, we will progress in the Champions League and actually this is the chance to make one or two changes.

8:47And I think we're seeing that across the English clubs in the Premier League. that they're not necessarily playing their strongest teams in the Champions League, whereas in previous times in the groups of four, that generally would be the case. You know, play the strongest teams and get qualification done. We referenced it in the commentary. It's a little bit like Chelsea in the Europa Conference League last season when Enzo Maresco was very comfortably able to make loads of changes, win games, keep sort of non-regular playing members of the squad happy. Obviously, I don't think you can play quite as fast and loose with the Champions League, but I just wonder whether he'd sized up the opposition a little bit here.

9:27Ajax are not in a good moment, as we discussed on the last podcast. They're not helped by the sending off 17 minutes in. But it was a madcap first half. It was a fairly humdrum second half. But the first half is one of the sort of most amusing first halves of football I've commentated on. Five goals, the red card, three penalties. the third penalty after the ref gave the third penalty and a couple of the the Ajax players complained he just shrugged at them and said what do you want me to do if you foul someone inside the penalty he just kept pointing to the spot and then and and just sort of the Weghorst cameo so Weghorst sort of decided to take it upon himself to try and rescue Ajax who were down to 10 men scored his own penalty but the challenge honestly that you've probably seen it the challenge he puts in on Enzo Fernandez to concede the first penalty against Ajax is one of the most ludicrous sender forward clumsy challenges you will ever see in your life it was just and I was fooled by John in the commentary I thought he must have won the ball there you don't go in like if you're not going to win the ball he just took everything apart from the ball it was hilarious but but I think you I think you probably can play fast on loose with the Champions League and I think probably coaches are influenced by the fact that Paris Saint-Germain finished what was it I think was 15th 15th or 16th in the in the league phase last season and then got stronger and stronger and went on to win it.

10:45The only thing about that, and I mentioned this on Tuesday, is that when we did Bayern Munich-Chelsea on match day one, Harry Kane was talking about how Bayern really rude not getting into the top eight of the Champions League last season, because those two additional games in February, I think they felt really hurt them when they played Celtic in the playoff round. I think that's a fair point, but I think as long as you finish in the top eight... Yeah, I agree with Ali. I think it's dependent on the opposition. You think that Mikel Arteta made six changes against Olympiacos. He only made two against Atletico Madrid.

11:20I bet you he'll go near a six for when they play Slavia Prague in their next match in the Champions League. But we also had a little look at the Chelsea squad, which is vast, but actually then looked at the team and thought the only ones, I'm trying to remember, who was sitting on that bench who you would have thought, well, maybe, you know, they should be starting. Neto was on the bench and didn't get a game and got a rest. Gusto was in there. Kukurea was on the bench. There was also Rhys James, Garnaccio. They were a new substitutes as well. And talking of Chelsea, that's where we're going to be based for our five live commentary this weekend.

11:51And Ali's in the hot seat with Steve Sidwell for the three o 'clock goal service and commentary. And on Sports Extra, we'll provide you that alternative listen of Newcastle United against Fulham. And John, you're at Old Trafford for 5.30. Manchester United against Brighton and Hove Albion with Paul Robinson. and then on Sunday it's Arsenal-Crystal Palace at 2. Aston Villa-Manchester City also at 2 is on Sports Extra. Bournemouth against Sean Dyches-Nottingham Forest on the BBC Sport website and app. Wolves against Burnley, another 2 o 'clock kick-off also on the Sport website and app. And then John, you're with Sue Smith at Everton against Tottenham.

12:31For what will be your first visit to their new stadium? Two firsts. Two firsts for me on Sunday. First visit to the Hill Dickinson Stadium and also first time working with Sue as my summariser. So I'm very much looking forward to that. You know, a bit of variety doesn't do any harm, does it? So you're not in operation this weekend? No. Well, I think the birthday celebrations continue. Do they? Yes, they do. I've forgotten what age I am, but yes. Yes. Well, fancy that. I didn't realise that. So you're having a breather as well. It must be that time of the year. I've had a breather ever since I did the Arsenal game in midweek.

13:12Have you? Yes. Much deserved, if I may say so. Why, thank you. You look out for those donuts at the Hill Dickinson Stadium. I'm not really a donut man. You know, I'm not really a biscuits, donuts kind of guy. No. Did you see that Manchester City's Josko Gvardiol revealed this week that he nearly quit football for basketball when he was struggling to break through at Dinamo Zagreb as a teenager. So here's a question. What would we have done if we hadn't gone into football commentary? Well, I would probably... There's a chance that I would have been involved in something agricultural. You know, probably something like that.

13:56If I had not moved away from Northumberland, probably something like that. My mother always wanted me to be an auctioneer, you know, like a farming auctioneer. Yeah, I knew exactly what you meant as soon as you said it. Yeah, but not like someone who's selling furniture. It would be like an agricultural auctioneer. How would you have done that, John? Can you give us a little? I would have done it. Well, I don't know. I've never done it. So I would have to do it to know how to do it. Okay. So I think as has been revealed before on this podcast, my degree at university was Italian and drama. So I've always enjoyed languages.

14:37So I wondered about the possibility of translation a long, long time ago. Don't think I was ever going to make it on stage and screen, although I did enjoy. Hugh Grant, as we always say. But the other one, the other field that really interested me back in the day was advertising. Quite like the idea of sort of trying to come up with campaigns and slogans and that sort of thing. Which, of course, was Murray Walker was famous for working in advertising. He worked in advertising. And I think, did he come up with the phrase, a Mars a day helps you work, rest and rest? Really? I think I'm right in saying.

15:18Yeah. So that was his main career. before he became a motivation. I didn't know that. And then obviously I watched the series Mad Men and thought, oh yeah, I should have worked in advertising. That was just such a good, I mean, that's obviously a different era and fictional as well, clearly, but it really made you want to sort of be around and working in that industry at that time. What about you, Denner? I think I would have looked to the police.

15:49Which side of that? what do you mean? Which side? The right side or the wrong side of the law? The law. The law. Chief Inspector. I also, I also have always had a hankering to be a postman. A postman? I've always fancied that. I've always fancied being a postman. I know nothing about that, John, but what attracts you, the thing I would think about that is early start, hopefully, get the work out of the way and then have the rest of the day to yourself. Good exercise. Good exercise. Lots of fresh air. Yeah. I always see, you know, walking around with the shorts on, you know, doing that. Talking to people.

16:27Talking to people. Yeah. And, yeah, I mean, I wouldn't be doing it somewhere in the inner cities. I'd be wanting that. I'd be wanting around in the Lake District or something. I mean, I know he... Like Postman Pat. Well, yeah, possibly. I know he claims he doesn't listen, but I can already hear Herr Chapman's intros to the next commentaries featuring the pair of you as a policeman and a postman. That is absolutely nailed on. Guaranteed. Listen, he can call me what he wants at the minute whilst I've got that video of him with cramp. I keep going back. That is the gift that keeps on giving, I can tell you.

17:02And we'll talk more about these games in the commentator's view extra out on Saturday morning on your Football Daily feed. Which is something new, isn't it, this week? It's a bit of a trial situation. Well, they say it comes in threes. John, you're in New Stadium. You're working with Sue. and you're also featuring in the commentator's view extra. Commentator's view extra, yes. So the commentator's view grows legs. Yeah. Not that we're getting anything extra for it.

17:34Well, I mean, it could all, I mean, it all builds the case, doesn't it, for the tour, which we haven't mentioned for a while, have we? No, we haven't, no. No, so it's, yeah, it's almost growing out of control, isn't it? Yeah, that's going to be sort of pre-match live shows ahead of commentaries. Yeah. I mean, it's just, yeah. Although I think the tour could be on the back burner after I'm more interested now in the unintended pub names pub crawl. I think that could... Yeah, I like that. Yeah. We actually had some great unintended pub names from football commentary last week. The Hairy Cucurea, the Falling Canate, the Watching Madonna, the Cramping Ogbonna, to name a few, and In Off The Crossbar.

18:17and this week Robert writes in from Yeovil. I think the pub names will run and run. After the watching Madonna, we had Mick Jagger watching Fulham against Arsenal but I couldn't find a suitable reference in the commentary. But on match of the day, we had commentary on Sunderland versus Wolves and Guy Mowbray gave us a suitable pub name for Wearside. That's a difficult one to defend but Wolves have managed it. Ballard couldn't get the touch at the end. Look at those bounces. A bit of spin on it. That's what takes it away from the flying Ballard. He didn't duck that one, did he? Oh, Ballard, sorry.

18:59That's a good one. Mike in Hales Owen also sent us that suggestion, as did Dan in Bristol and Terry in Bromley. So thank you very much. Kidder Minster fan, Sean. And I heard this one live, Sean. Hi all, an entry for the unintended pubs names. It comes from five lives, Jonathan Pearce, in the Spurs Villa match on Sunday in second half stoppage time. They want to play on. The referee says, yes, go on. Go on. You've got possession. And Bergfell now for Spurs with the striking blonde hair out to Chunky Porro. Porro down the line here is a run from Kudus. Do you know, I was listening to that as we were sitting at Anfield with Stephen Warnock.

19:37And when Jonathan said that about Porro, Stephen Warnock sort of nudged me and looked at me. porro chunky but but but also jonathan there's just called him chunky porro the the is not is not there so chunky porro could also maybe be like a dish on the menu in the pub maybe it's a type of sort of a condiment i don't know um and this is a one that that i heard actually because i was listening back to um the the excellent crystal palace bournemouth match from last Saturday afternoon when Chris Wise was commentating alongside the former Nottingham Forest defender Luke Chambers. He takes the extra touch which allows Munoz to make up that ground and cut it out for the easy tapping.

20:21The majestic Munoz so good at going in in both directions it's like one of those hairs on a greyhound track that just keeps on moving Bournemouth corner 2-2 the scoreline The Majestic Munoz. That's definitely got a ring of a pub, hasn't it? It has, yeah. Doth the way the poor for war in the Majestic Munoz. It's a little bit of tapas doing the rounds on the tables. And we've also had another one from Will. Hi, commentators. Listening to Manchester City versus Everton last Saturday, I noticed what I thought was a good pub name. Comes to the head of Tarkovsky and he powers the header forward and Beto will climb in the air.

21:00And Dewsbury Hall just tries to wriggle away from Matthias Nunes. But there was the right back just to stop his run. And he's helped out by Savino. In fact, Dewsbury Hall, Pat, has stayed down. They seem to get his foot stuck in the ground there. We're treating ourselves to Sunday lunch this week at Dewsbury Hall. I imagine it as a rather smart country inn rather than a backstreet boozer. And that would not have a the on the front, would it? No. I bet there is a Dewsbury Hall somewhere, as in an establishment called Dewsbury Hall. We need to find that. at Dewsbury. Yeah, exactly, John. Exactly.

21:37But the double-barreleds, I mean, they work well with the dirt in front. I was just thinking the Oxlade Chamberlain. I could see myself having a pint in the Oxlade Chamberlain. Welcome to the team behind the team. A new podcast series in partnership with the Open University where we'll be showcasing the people, the tools and the techniques that help athletes and teams reach elite level. Like all elite sports, it's a pyramid and everybody's trying We're going to get to the top. It's not just my vision. It's a shared vision amongst the team. What is this? This is not the way I see the game. The team behind the team with Katie Smith.

22:13In partnership with The Open University. Listen on BBC Sound. We focus on the part of the internet that most people don't know about. It's called the dark web. Undercover in the furthest corners of the dark web. US special agents are on a mission to locate and rescue children from abuse. Move in now. From the BBC World Service, World of Secrets, the darkest web follows their shocking investigations. Listen on bbc.com or wherever you get your BBC podcasts.

22:51The Commentator's View on the Football Daily with Alistair Bruce Ball, John Murray and Ian Dennis. If you spot an unintended pub name in a commentary, do let us know. TCV at BBC.co.uk. And the WhatsApp thingy is 08000289369. Is that a bit like the QR code? It is. Now it's time to log in. Can you log into the WhatsApp? Well, you two need to log in for Clash of the Commentators. Oh, dear. Yes, and today it is the astonishing, really, Five out of five league leader Ian Dennis this season played five, won five against the four defeats in a row, Alistair Bruce Ball. So it's top against bottom. It's an interesting question this week.

23:44Oh, interesting. Yeah, it's it's well, I won't say too much until we get onto it. So who is going to go first? Top or bottom? All I would say to Ali is that I've taken my eye off the ball this week. I've kicked back. I'm not working. Today might be the day that it ends. If that's the case, without giving too much away, that could favour Ali. Right, okay. But this week, Ian, with you off duty, I actually sent you what I thought was quite a, well, I would say interesting, a brilliant quiz question from a... We'll be the judge of that. Well, no, you saw it, John. I put it on the group. So Bill Edgar, who we've mentioned on this podcast before, a few years back, brought out a brilliant book.

24:29It's got some amazing questions in. And I saw one. I thought, well, this will test them. And Denno had it in about a couple of minutes. Straight back with the right answer. And I thought, oh, crikey. So let's see. Let's see. So who is going to disconnect? I'll give you the choice. Do you want to go first or second? No, go on. Your birthday boy. Do you know what? Actually, no, forget that. I'll go first, please. Okay. Okay. let's let Ian get disconnected which he is now right so we are ready to go so Ali you two have both commentated on high scoring matches in the Champions League this week so Ian was at Arsenal and Ali was at Chelsea in all the English sides scored 19 goals in the Champions League this midweek and that is the most by a nation's clubs in one round of fixtures There are six English clubs in the Champions League this season.

25:27However, there were 17 different scorers, and I want you to name as many of them as you can. So, goal scorers for English teams in the Champions League from this midweek. And your time starts now. OK, I was at Chelsea, so that was Guillaume, Enzo Fernandes, Caicedo, Esteval and Tyric George. I can't remember the answer. Joukere's got a couple, didn't he? Harlem for Manchester City. Gordon and Barnes for Newcastle. Tottenham didn't score. Who am I missing now? Chelsea, Arsenal. Who have I forgotten? Oh, Liverpool. Eka TK. Gakpo scored. Van Dijk got the header. Did Canate score? I think I've got quite a lot there.

26:10You could have kept going. I could have had a chance for a couple more there. that's the that's the that's the running the 100 meters getting within 10 yards of the line well i hope you don't live to regret that but i think i think you will win this because i think he will have taken his eye off the ball that's what it was exactly my thought when i saw this question i thought that massively favors yeah and it does help as well john so when you're doing the commentary and then you're going to the other games you did the second match yeah exactly yeah And he did Tuesday night and you did Wednesday night.

26:44Come on. It's got to be a win. I think you win this. You win this. Okay, let's call him back in. What about that? I was gesticulating at him. What about that was it that he didn't understand? Hello. I was beckoning you back, and you seemed to be looking at me as though what does that mean? No, I just saw the two of you laughing, and I just assumed that you were still having it, so I waited for a clearer sign. Okay. I thought it was quite clear. No, it wasn't, no. It just looked like you were moving your hands. Okay. Are you ready? As ready as I'll ever be. Okay. So, you and Ali have both commentated on high-scoring matches in the Champions League this week.

27:21Yeah. You were at Arsenal, as you know. Yeah. And Ali was at Chelsea. In all, the English side scored 19 goals in the Champions League this midweek, which is the most by a nation's clubs in one round of fixtures. Yeah. As I said to Ali, of course, there are six English clubs in the Champions League this season. However, there were 17 different scorers, and I want you to name as many of them as you can. So goal scorers for English clubs in the Champions League from this midweek. And your time starts now. Eketike, Gakpo, Suboslay, Van Dijk, Gordon, Barnes, Arsenal did the bloody game. kind of did the game Jokeres