The Commentators' View: Prawn sandwiches & back to square one

27:49Are there teams that play in claret or is it a football? I can't think of. Are you suggesting claret should go into Division 1 of the great glossary of football commentary? Huddersfield Giants, they play in claret. Oh, there we go. That's good knowledge. There we go. That is good. Well done, Ian. Any other suggestions on the claret front to tcv at bbc.co.uk? If you recall, actually, I've got a jumper. I do recall. which is navy and it's got a claret and amber, two stripes going down either side. Yeah. Which you said that Gareth Southgate had questioned my attire. Yes, he did. What are you laughing at, Ali?

28:29No, I was just wondering why that had caused such mirth, but it's just been explained. So that's good. It looked like I was wearing braces. It did, yeah. And actually, on the subject of claret, that is a potential phrase, isn't it, for the football glossary because there was a time when blood on the shirt of a footballer would be described as the claret, wouldn't it? Yes, it is. WhatsApps and voice notes to 08000 289 369. They are always greatly appreciated. And our first voice note of 2026 comes from Kevin in Colchester. Hello, everyone, and a very happy new year to one and all. Myself and my dog Skip absolutely love the pod and spend every Saturday morning listening to the latest pod.

29:13and I can be seen smiling and chuckling away much to the amusement, I'm sure, of all my fellow dog walkers. Skip enjoys it as his normal walk is extended. My reason for calling is that I wondered how many other of your avid listeners while listening to the Bournemouth-Ve Arsenal Premier League game last weekend shouted out, Rice, Rice, baby! When Declan Rice put his second goal away in that game. And as I said, me and the dog look forward to Saturday like no other day of the week. Kevin in a very ice, ice-bound culture star. Very good, Kevin. Happy New Year to you. And just for Kevin, but also for everyone else, let's remind ourselves of Ian's commentary from the Champions League last season.

29:58Maybe a little pick-me-up for the Arsenal fans after the goal of straw with Liverpool on Thursday. Declan Rice runs now, hits it right, footed! Oh! Oh, rice, rice, baby! Oh, my word! Two absolute belters! There we are. Always great to hear that again. My favourite piece of Five Live commentary from 2025. And it is remarkable, isn't it? As we heard from Kevin there, how many people seem to listen to this podcast while they're walking their dog. I might mention that in a commentary over the course of the weekend. Don't forget to say Happy New Year to Skip. Yes, good point. I encourage more Kevin and Skips to listen to the commentators view on their dog walks.

30:43We're going to delve into the great glossary of football commentary in just a bit. But we've had a very popular suggestion as we start 2026. Paul in Gisborne in New Zealand says, following on from my admittance of it came down with snow in it to Division 2 a few weeks ago, I have had another thought. How about back to square one? Andy from Crosby says, will you allow the phrase back to square one in the glossary, given its football BBC radio history? Ross from Stafford says, do you know the origin of the phrase back to square one? I believe it relates to early football commentary and involves the radio times.

31:23So there we are, back to square one, which I think our favourite Premier League, what's his title? Match manager. Match manager. I think Martin suggested that back to square one should be in the glossary as well. One of our good photographer friends, Andrew, has mentioned it to me three or four times. How come that's never come up on the commentator's view? And I said, it will, it will. It definitely will because we're aware of it, but we've had so much correspondence on it. So I'm very glad it's featuring at the start of the year. Yeah, our chief football writer, Phil McNulty, used it in one of his recent articles about Manchester United.

31:58He said Sir Jim Ratcliffe, director of football, Jason Wilcox and chief executive Omar Barada now find themselves back at square one and other messages as well. Yeah, Tim in North Wales. I think the most important phrase to go into the glossary should be back to square one, which is a radio phrase that's passed over into the general lexicon. Tim says, I believe the original basis for the phrase was used in initial radio commentary of football when the pitch was split into numbered squares. So the commentator could explain where the ball was to the listener, i.e. the ball has gone back to square one.

32:32That is my understanding of it, because the radio time has been mentioned as well, that you would have a grid, wouldn't you, as a listener in front of you with these squares. And then the commentator would commentate corresponding to those squares so you could follow where the ball was on the pitch. Well, Janet in Morton actually says, in 1927, BBC Radio broadcast its first FA Cup final. And to help listeners follow it, the Radio Times produced a guide of the pitch divided into numbered squares. It is said that back to square one may have entered everyday language, but it might have been used for something else years before 1927.

33:11and actually I know from having one of the various anniversaries that we've had of the first football commentary I think I'm right in saying that it is not necessarily the case that the phrase came from the Radio Times and the football commentary I think it was a phrase that existed before that time but obviously the use in the Radio Times and in Radio Football commentary did add to its use. Did you not do a game once with, was it David Gray? David Gray and Bob Wilson and James Alexander Gordon was with us as the caller of the numbers. That coincided, I think, possibly with the 50th anniversary of the first football commentary.

33:53Janet says 1927. I was just looking that up. That's Cardiff beating Arsenal in the FA Cup final in 1927. You're nodding. So you knew that already. And I also know that that was the first FA Cup final in which a horse scored a goal? In which the cup final hymn, Abide With Me was sung. Oh, really? Yes. So there we are. And actually Chelsea fan Simon says, which of the phrases, terms, originated in football are now in common use in language and or other sports and commentary? So that's very much one for the listeners, tcb at bbc.co.uk. What do we think? Is that going into Division One? I think the public have spoken.

34:37I think they have. Overwhelming, is it not? I think it should go into, I think it's our responsibility to put that into Division 1, don't you think? Yes, no, I agree. I think given this is the commentator's view and we're talking about the origins of radio football commentary, it almost deserves a place on its own. It's almost... Yeah, I agree with that. ...Champions League or inaugural winner. And what we've said in the past, that Division 1 is for football-exclusive terms, clearly back to square one is not football excused. But damn it, we're putting it in. Well, as Gareth says, the iconic radio football glossary term back to square one must surely go into Division One.

35:14Yeah, there we go. We all agree. And if you disagree, you're wrong. My name's Steve Bradnell, assistant manager at Royal Oak FC. You may have seen me online going viral. Viral sensation. And now the BBC have given me the chance to set the footballing world banter rights. This could be a great opportunity for us, lads, a podcast for the BBC. Can I just say, what's a podcast? Brilliant. Great start. Well done, Bob. Brilliant. We can completely show utter transparency to Royal Oak fans. I'll use my charm. Gift it, Gab. Game's gone. The Steve Bracknell podcast. Watch on YouTube. Listen on BBC Sounds.

35:58The commentator's view on the Football Daily. With Alistair Bruce Ball, John Murray and Ian Dennis. Right, now it may be a new year, but we're strapping in for plenty more unintended pub name fun. So this is unintended pub names from sports commentary or indeed unintended film names which have crept into it. Jodie in Huntingdon writes in, During the Chelsea-Aston Villa match over Christmas, I heard Connor McNamara say, call Palmer in space a riveting sci-fi spectacle if ever there would be well read John very good that was pigs in space pigs in space right onto the meat and drink as you might say of our unintended pub name so this is Rowan in Colchester gets in touch greetings TCV team loving your entry into the football daily universe that's where you can find us under the football daily feed on the BBC Sounds app TCV is a must-listen every week.

37:01While listening to Test Match Special, Dan Norcross gave us a corker of an unintentional pub name. And then England lost the second week at the luckless Pope. Yes, he stabbed a bit of the ball from Cummins that he might have left alone. He might have done, but he pushed just in front of his leg, but then a stunning one-handed catch from Arnas Labashain at second slip. He had to take it, diving to his left. Robert and Yeovil also sent that one in the luckless Pope. He says it would be a Canterbury city centre hostelry reflecting the decision by Henry VIII to remove the Pope from the head of the church in 1532.

37:38Pope is such a good surname for this kind of thing, isn't it? The whatever Pope, fill in the blank. Ollie and Nick have provided us with some great content. And on a similar theme, this voice note from Ollie in West Sussex. Hi there and Happy New Year to everyone. Back before the Christmas break, I was listening to TMS give their review of day two of the Adelaide test, back in the delightful days when England could actually still win the Ashes. The lovely, gravelly voice Dan Norcross said, You think what LBW, and he seems to do this thing, David, where he fixates over the dismissal that he's had and then sort of tries to play the, if you like, the battle before, thinking too much about how he got out before.

38:17I mean, how did you read it? It was a skittish, back to the skittish Pope rather than the calm Pope. Regarding unintended pub names, this gave me a picture of the town centre old man's favourite pub, the Calm Pope, being rebranded to the Skittish Pope to keep up with other trendy establishments in the area, such as the Easy Tappin. The old jukebox had gone and been replaced by augmented reality darts and a shuffleboard table to try and draw in a younger audience, much to the detriment of locals and regulars at the pub. The landlord, Mr B Stokes, was asked to comment and said that the calm Pope had run its course and would need to be replaced after underperforming for years.

38:55Sure enough, the high street building situated at number three opened its doors to new customers on Boxing Day. Some travellers even arrived from Bethel-Lehjem. Following the success of the rebrand, Mr Stokes now has another decision to make over the pub chain's faltering Crawley branch. Thanks to Ollie for that. Happy New Year, Ollie. as well. I do love it when they suggest what the pub would be like as well. Our BBC colleague James Porter, who quite often gets in touch, so regularly listens to TCV and sends us some great missives. He's got this one from Jonathan Agnew. Great catch from Brooke.

39:34Green is out for seven, but the dangerous head remains. The dangerous head. James says, Lord knows what the sign would look like. Feels like a pub near a football ground that only home fans can drink in. And let's round up with this one before clash of the commentators. David in Hampshire says, I really enjoy your podcast and have been listening carefully for unintended pub names throughout your commentaries. I was explaining the concept to my wife recently and I imagine my pride when she immediately replied, oh, you mean like the goalkeeper's arms? Also, have you had a suggestion of the in behind, both an unintended pub name and as an entry to the great football glossary?

40:16They've got in behind. Yeah, I think I used that last night, talking about Frimpon getting in behind Lewis Skelly. In behind, yeah, it's good. I wonder if they're going back to pulp. I wonder actually if there is a pub. I'm not, is there a pub name that has pulp in the title in the UK? Must be. Must be. There's a challenge for our listeners. And if you spot an unintended pub or film name, Cole Palmer in Space, in any sports commentary, do let us know. KCV at bbc.co.uk and WhatsApp's to 08000 289 369. So the great glossary of football commentary coming up. But first of all, before that, he said, with a heavy heart, It is time for Clash of the Commentators.

41:07This is how it works. Two of us take turns to answer a question and give as many correct answers as we can in 30 seconds. Last time out, we played this. Ian killed it by beating me on teams that were top or bottom at Christmas. So as we enter 2026, Ian has eight from 10. the reigning champion, the defending champion the Crystal Palace of Clash of the Commentators Ali has 4 from 10 and I have 3 from 10 but Ian, you effectively I mean, no one's interested in this anymore now what you did last time but there is a twist for the first one of 2026 as we're back around to the start of the fixture list so it's Ali against John and all will be revealed, but who wants to go first?

42:03I mean, this is a six-pointer, John, given where we are in the table, isn't it? Shall I go second this time? Okay. I feel like I've gone first a lot. Yeah, sure. Okay, I'll set the tone. Okay, so here's Unplugged, Ali. Yeah. And the twist is, is that you have got your specific questions. Oh, really? Yeah. So, Ali, this time last year, you were commentating in the FA Cup third round on Everton 2, Peterborough 0 and Bristol City 1, Wolves 2 I want you to name any player to feature in those matches Everton, Peterborough, Bristol City Wolves your time starts now Blimey Rodrigo Gomez scored for Wolves I think Agbadoo made his debut who would have been in goal there?

42:50Sar, Jose Sar, Sam Johnston let's say Everton must have had let's go Pickford, Keane, Tarkovsky Maybe Seamus Coleman. Who else would have been playing in that game? Maybe Dominic Calvert-Lewin. Beto. Who haven't we done? Peterborough. I can't remember any of the Peterborough players. That's bad. Bristol City. Now I'm wasting time. I'll leave it at that. I don't think that's very good. Well, I'll be honest with you. I can't tell you how well you've done. We'll have to wait for Nathan to... Should have got more Wolves players there. We'll give the thumbs up and the wave to John to get him back. So, John, the twist is that you each have your own individual question.

43:32What did you say? Did you call me Sir John? No, I'd never call you Sir John. New Year's Honours list. It's only a matter of time before you are Sir John, but for the time being, you know we're near a knighthood. Not for Clash of the Commentators, I'm not. No. So you've got your own individual question. Oh, right. Okay. And so, John, this time last year, you were commentating in the FA Cup third round on Leeds United 1, Harrogate Town 0. and Tamworth Neil Tottenham Hotspur 3. I want you to name any player to feature in those matches. Leeds Harrogate, Tamworth Tottenham. Your time starts now. Oh, my goodness.

44:06Joe Rodon, Ampadu, Gruev, Ellis Taylor, James Belshaw. For Tottenham, Son, Son Heung-min, Benton Kua, Romero. Spence will have played in that. Oh, gosh, who else? Kulosevsky. Kamos is so dumb. Well, we'll have to wait to see whether that was in time. You would have got a bonus point had you come out with Tommy Tonks. Oh, Tommy Tonks. Do you know what? I was trying to remember his name. That was when Poster Coglis Tottenham needed extra time to win 3-0. Yeah, that was a good tie, that. Yeah. My first visit to the Lamb. Did Mikey Moore play in that game? Probably. I think John's won that. What were your matches?

44:59I had Everton-Peterborough, John. That was after Sean Dyche. Remember Sean Dyche left on the day of that game? And Bristol City Wolves that I did with Dave Edwards, who I saw at Wolves the other day. Seamus Coleman was actually on the touchline that day. Oh, he was. Of course he was, yeah. Because of what I just said, yeah. But he didn't actually play, but he was in charge of Everton. And the results are in.

45:27Ali, five, John, Sir John, eight. Me! Well done. Hooray. Very good. Hooray. Hooray for me. We're level. Ian remains top of the table with eight from ten. The defending champion has just lost his first match of 2026. could that be an omen for Crystal Palace Ali has four from eleven and now I've got four from eleven so we're joint second again Ali thrilling a happy new year for you John what a treat that was for the listeners to hear a rare victory for me in Clash of the Commentators so now it is time for the great glossary of football commentary where we add listener suggestions of commentary terms and phrases to our collection.

46:25Remember, you can find our entire glossary in the episode description. There's that episode description again. Over Christmas, we have had enough submissions for a glossary Bible of football commentary. And this is how it works. Division one for football exclusive terms, apart from back to square one. Division two for terms used in football commentary, but also used in other sports. And last time out, we added blaze over the bar into Division 1, as we felt that's not a phrase used in other sports. But Kane in Belgium disagrees. Sorry, boys, blaze over the bar can only be Division 2 because of high jump and pole vaulting.

47:07Are we having that? No. No, we're not. Kane, no. Sorry, Kane. You don't blaze over the bar, do you, as a pole vaulter? I mean, there is a bar involved and you go over it, but I don't think you ever hear a comment that says they've blazed themselves over the bar. over the bar. Yeah. While we're here, how about this from Chesterfan Graham? Hi all. Happy Christmas and New Year to the team and fingers crossed for another successful year ahead for the TCV. I've tried and failed to get prawn sandwich for grade through to the Great Glossary before but after hearing Kate Curd use it on the Wayne Rooney podcast I thought I'd redouble my efforts.

47:44I certainly had never heard that phrase before Roy Keane famously used it whilst at Manchester United. People come to Old Trafford and I don't know you can spell football, never mind you understand it. So at the end of the day, they need to get behind the team. And as I said, away from home, our fans are fantastic. I'd call the hardcore fans, but at home, you know, they'll have their few drinks and probably their prawn sandwiches and they don't realise what's going on out in the pitch. We may be in Fergie time, but on lunch, and one last up and under to get it included in the glossary. Or even we have a prawn sandwich brigade down at the Deba Stadium.

48:12Well, thank you very much, Graeme, and a happy New Year to you too. What do we think? Great to hear that very young voice of Roy Keane, wasn't it? And he obviously didn't use the term brigade, did he? That has been added too. So he said enjoying their prawn sandwiches. They've become the prawn sandwich brigade. Where do you think that sits in terms of the glossary? I could see it mentioned. Not Division I, though, is it? Probably not Division I. You know, you'd probably refer to that. You know, at Wembley, when the middle tier, they never come back, do they, after half-time, saw many of them. Do they have a prawn sandwich brigade in Rugby Union, Ali?

48:55Well, Chris Sutton likes to put me in that bracket. I was just trying to think other sports or is it a football exclusive thing? Do we have the prawn sandwich brigade in other sports, in tennis, in rugby, in golf? Yeah, Wimbledon. Surely you would say Wimbledon. You know, when they don't come back, there's been a blockbuster match, then it's some less appealing match. shall we say? The strawberry brigade. But no, but I think, John, yeah, I think though, John, isn't it because you're trying to distinguish between sort of like Roy Keane is there, the sort of the hardcore football fans and the prawn sandwich brigade, but wouldn't, oh, there will, yeah, you're right.

49:35There will be hardcore Wimbledon fans who wouldn't miss a point, but I would have thought there's such a definition between the two in football. I think that's less clear in the other sports, the definition. Div two, div two. Okay. Aston Villa fan, And Alan says, great pod keeps me entertained during my Saturday morning walk with Hugo, my pet cockapoo. There you are. And Alan has a glossary suggestion from ABB's commentary on Aston Villa against Manchester United. Cunha takes it past Tielemans, tries to drag him back and foul him. Cunha won't be shrugged off that easily, still holds him off. Tielemans goes again, Cunha gets there to the edge of the box, wants the free kick, laid off here.

50:17To Lacey, hits the shot straight at Martinez. straight into the breadbasket and you almost heard the thud of ball into chest there as he claimed it and fell on the floor. Straight into the breadbasket. Alan says, not seen it in the glossary and not sure, if admitted, which league it would sit in. Division two. Yeah, yeah, that's definitely not football exclusive, is it? This is from Barbara. For your glossary of terms, how about one for your more mature listeners that may not be used so much these days. It used to be common to say a player turned on a sixpence, and I can't think of another sport that would use that expression.

50:57I do appreciate that's a bit dated now, and many of your listeners may not know what a sixpence is, but I think it's worth considering. Regrettably, there isn't anything to put in Christmas puddings or for the tooth fairy to put under your pillow anymore either. Turned on a sixpence. Well, thank you, Barbara, and Happy New Year to you as well. I think that that is a little bit like Johnny on the spot, isn't it? The sixpence is that it's a phrase that was used in days of yore, but still gets used now. But I think probably division two. Yeah, I would still use it, aware that it's a dated reference.

51:36And a lot of our listeners would think, what is a sixpence? But I just think that's such a common phrase. Problem is as well, that phrase, he's turned on a, has never been replaced by anything else. You don't turn on a 50 pence piece. No. Or a 2 pence piece or a 10 pence piece. Do you, in American sport, do you turn on a dime? Ooh, that's a good question. I made that up. I made that up. We've got many listeners in America. They'll tell us. Yeah, they'll tell us. In mainland Europe, do you turn on a euro? I'm looking forward to hearing that. in one of your Champions League commentaries, maybe a way to...

52:14Turned on a cent? Exactly, yeah. Turned on a kroner. That's a good point, Ali. We should actually drop that in now, in a couple of weeks' time. Wherever you are. I will be going to Bordeaux Glimt. Yes. What a revelation that is for the first commentator's view of 2026. Very exciting. Next round of Champions League matches, Bordeaux Glimt against Manchester City in the Arctic Circle, and I have been assiduously following the weather forecast for Bodo over the course of the last month or so. And generally over the last month or so, it's actually been milder in Bodo than it has here. John, when you get there, I mean, you might have loads of bags and whatever.

52:56You can actually walk from the airport into Bodo. It's that close. You literally get off the plane, walk through the terminal and just walk down the high street. It's brilliant. Unfortunately, I would love to do that, but I will have our producer Gary Flintoff with me, and Gary will not be up for that. Next, Caleb is confident about his suggestion. He says, my entry for the Great Glossary is a nailed on Division One shout, a cultured left foot. He says, I'm surprised this hasn't been suggested already. Keep up the fantastic work. Well, Caleb, cultured left foot is already in our glossary, but it is in our unsorted section as cultured stroke educated left foot and still needs to be put in either Division 1 or Division 2.

53:48So what are we thinking? I didn't realise we had an unsorted section. Very sloppy. Did Johnny Wilkinson have a cultured left foot? I mean, he had a deadly accurate left foot, didn't he? would you have a cultured left foot in other sports might need to leave it in the unsorted section yeah I'd be tempted to put into division one until people say it otherwise yeah I agree John that's good and also Irish Adam in Perth West Australia there's a lot going on there has flagged up a Roy of the Rovers stuff from Shea Given on Match of the Day I did hear that actually I was watching match of the day that day, when Shea was describing Harrison Reid's goal for Fulham.

54:33This is just a phenomenal strike. It's quite funny Harrison said after that, I've practiced this in training. But again, just Roy of the Rovers stuff, it really is. To get that much dip in movement and Swaz, Alisson's got absolutely no chance at all. That's also in our unsorted section, Roy of the Rovers stuff. So, are we going Division 1 or Division 2 for Roy of the Rovers stuff? Adam says, surely this is a football exclusive term. And it was a thunder and strike right where the spiders sleep, he says, of Harrison Reid's goal. Absolutely unquestionably, Division 1. Yes. Roy of the Rovers. That's a classic.

55:09Do you know what? I wish we could do a clash of the commentators on Roy Race's teammates. Melchester Rovers. Players who played for Melchester Rovers. I tell you, I'd be... I'd definitely get more than I got today. Vic Guthrie was one, wasn't it? Yes, Vic Guthrie. Rob Richards was the youngster coming through in Roy's shadow. Charlie Carter was the goalkeeper. Duncan Mackay, the bearded centre-back. Martin Kemp played for Melchizedek Rovers in later editions. Jeffrey Boycott was the chairman. That's right. That's right. Came in on a helicopter. Did he? Yeah. Also, we've got park the bus, which is yet to be sorted.

55:48Is that Division 1 or Division 2? Does park the bus pop up in other sports now? Can he park the bus? Should put that in Division 1. Yeah, put it in a different one and then see what people say. Okay. Right. Feeling generous at the start of the new year, aren't we? Yeah, aren't we? Yeah, there's nothing wrong with that. So the summary from this week on the great glossary of football commentary. Get in behind. I think, have we put that into Division 1? Or have we not decided? Should we put it in Division 1 as well? Let's do that. Yeah, okay. Into Division 2, go prawn sandwich brigade straight into the bread basket and turned on a sixpence and...

56:26Yep. Into Division One. We're going back to square one, whether you like it or not. We're going cultured left foot, Roy of the Rover stuff and park the bus.

56:43Hooray! So keep the glossary suggestions coming in. And remember, if you hear an unintended pub name in any commentary, Send it to tcv at bbc.co.uk and voice notes on WhatsApp to 08000 289 369. And also, do yourself a favour and listen to our FA Cup third round commentaries this weekend on Five Live and the various platforms on Sports Extra via your BBC Sounds app. But that is it for this episode of the Football Daily. remember you can find each and every episode of the commentator's view by scrolling down your football daily feed do you do you guys watch would i lie to you yeah sometimes yeah yeah you know how chapman's gonna be on it soon i think i think his episode's coming out coming out soon but appearing on every bbc tv show yeah i know i know the first episode of the new series uh has them falling about laughing like i've not seen for a long time and it's based around the phrase get in.

57:49You know when people, so when a goal goes in, but you say after it's gone in, you say get in. David Mitchell gets very confused about why you would say get in when it's already got in. And then the hilarity that ensues off the back of that. It's a good point though. You know, someone scores a goal and you say, yes, get in. But it's already got in. So it should really be. Anyway, it's a good glossary one actually, but it's worth a watch. It's very funny. Live sport. WSL. Our referee for this afternoon. Close her whistle. We are underway. That's the opening goal. And she is able to just kick her spot.

58:27This way past the best goalkeeper in the division. BBC Women's Football Weekly. The latest news, insights and analysis from across the women's game. Lucy Bruns, welcome back. What one lioness do you think would make the best rugby player? Me. Listen. With the BBC Sounds app.