Women's Euros: England v Sweden Preview

21:40Vicki Sparks:Well, let's talk about Ella Toon then. I wanted to go into that. She said they should be scared when they play us. Oh, right. Sorry, I was clarifying. I thought she was talking that they should be scared of... Scared of you? No, scared of Sweden. I thought that's a bit defeatist. Sorry, Sweden should be scared of England. Right. Yes. And I thought actually quite a good reminder because Serena Vigman, I think, finds herself reminding the press at times that England are a very good football team. And I don't know if maybe we forget that at times. But I think we all agreed here, just you can give me a sort of yay or nay into your microphones.

22:13Vicki Sparks:We think Serena Vigman is going to start the same XI tomorrow. I would be very, very surprised given how well they've played in the last two games if it changes. And I feel as though we've talked. I've just allowed Luke to speak for the table. Was that a yes or a no? I mean, yes, I agree. She'll start the same. And so I feel like we've been over how that tinkering with Elatoun coming in has changed things. So I just want to talk about what we make of her so far in terms of maybe that work off the ball and away from the limelight, stats, standout, headlines, i.e. scoring again, assisting again.

22:48Vicki Sparks:She made history against Wales, completing 100 % of her passes as well, which makes it a quote-unquote perfect game according to the stats. So what is she doing, Karen, away from that stuff as well that is just working so well? I think, you know, the work that she does off the ball as well is something that probably goes overlooked, you know, so in terms of the stuff like the runs in behind that obviously stretch the back line, that give the opposition centre-backs something to think about, you know, in terms of the threats. The fact that she's given that freedom to kind of go out wide and combine with either an overlap or an underlap to move or at least shift the full-back's attention like we saw against Wales.

23:32For me, I think she's positionally more disciplined, you know, than perhaps obviously LJ in the 10 and things like that. So in terms of shoring up the spine of England, And I think that's something that they really, really benefit from. But I think also, you know, I hope I'm not speaking out of turn here, but I think she's playing for something bigger than herself as well, you know, around her father and, you know, her family and things like that. And so that's something that's not really quantitative. You can't measure that. I think she's been a moments player, really, for me, Ella Toon. She's flown flashes and she's had magical moments, the European final three years ago, for example.

24:12but I don't think she's done it consistently. I think Alessia Russo, for example, has kicked on and has started to do it consistently in English. But Elatoun hadn't. But that's what's so impressive about the way she's been in these last two games. It's like something. She's found a little extra something. Something has clicked, whether it's mentally, physically, whether it's confidence. I don't know what it is. But she looks like the player over the last two games that we've always hoped she could be for England. I think, you know, a lot of people criticise that Jamaica game just before the tournament, didn't they, in terms of like, what's the point here?

24:41but this is exactly what the point of it is, is to let someone like Ella get back into the game, start banging in goals from midfield. And it's a confidence, you know, it's amazing what confidence can do. And she's obviously translated that into an opportunity. And maybe there were some questions around how she would handle the disappointment of perhaps not starting, but she's channeled it in the right ways. Well, we said that at the time, didn't we? That it was fascinating because Serena Vigman in the build-up to the Euros three years ago really used those friendlies, not really just to hone her starting line, but also to hone her substitution strategy.

25:12And we said, actually, Toon starting against Jamaica obviously gets two goals. Is this about who's going to be the first substitute? And then actually you make a tactical tweak after France, which really works. But I wanted to pick up on what you said as well, KB, because you're so right in terms of playing for something beyond yourself. And I know we spoke during the Wales game about Beth Mead. And obviously this is the first tournament for Beth Mead since she lost her mother. It's the first tournament for Ella Toon since she lost her father last September. And I think they both spoke so powerfully about that after the Wales game, you know, that they've been going through the same thing and supporting each other.

25:44And Ella saying, you know, it's nice that we are constantly talking about them. We know we are doing them proud. And even though they're not here to see it, that actually they're carrying that memory with them and still doing it for them. Absolutely. And I think that's so key, isn't it?

25:59Vicki Sparks:Well, and she almost epitomises this England team in terms of that big performance mentality, Karen. because I'm trying to think back at major tournaments. She's been at three of them now. She hasn't really put in a bad game or a bad moment, as Luke said. She's a big moment player. No, she is. And I think also, you know, you think about what she's been through this season, just returning from injury and, you know, that crucial time away. I think she's found her passion for the game again. And, you know, I certainly can remember her return. I joked about this with her. I was kind of hoping that she wouldn't be fit for the Derby, but she was.

26:33And boy, did we pay for it. but no, you know, she presses really well, you know, like for me, it's her work rate and I think that that, like I said, isn't something particularly sexy when you talk about game stats and things like that but it is so, so crucial.

26:47Vicki Sparks:And she said, I like creating space for Lauren James and Kira Walsh, this kind of says everything, you know, the work she does defensively is incredible. She covers a lot of spaces we can't and I suppose that's the point we're making is that's what you maybe don't notice. Yeah, certainly to an untrained eye like me. Karen's all over it Karen's noted it all down I've got no idea what she's doing I'm glad you're here Great to be part of it No I'm joking She's a team player and I think she'll be one of those I would imagine that the players like having her there when she's in the team and I think you've made a really interesting point about Lauren James now Lauren James is going to be marked like never before now, Sweden will target her.

27:34So it might be that Ella Toon is the player who benefits from that, who pops up in those little pockets of space. And I think Alessia Russo really enjoys, we know they're friends, they do a podcast for the BBC, I believe, together.

27:43Vicki Sparks:You can download it on BBC Sounds. But I think she could benefit from that, because I think Sweden will try and shut Lauren James down, but the form that Ella Toon's in, that might end up benefiting the player in the number 10. I think the movement from Alessia Russo to drop in and get on the ball and link play like they did so much with with you know like she did with elatoon will be crucial because we saw you know that was something that germany was able to do to kind of get at them get at sweden for their first goal and i think to your point luke around lj um jonah anderson is someone i played with at lynchipping she was a really young defender but she was always really aggressive really physical wants to get up to the ball and someone like lauren will be able to roll her you know it will be a tough battle but like the thing about lj is she's so aware of what the defender is doing.

28:33She can read their body weight. She can shift the ball right, left. She's always in control and she's always looking at what they're doing. So she'll relish the opportunity to make someone look foolish. And we love that. And we do love that. And we went into this tournament. We've had a generation of stars. We know we had it before. You know, your generation, people start retiring. You need new stars to come through. Lauren James, I know she was already a household name in terms of women football. I'm talking about crossover, breakout star, the way she's playing. She is that player for England.

29:01I think that we need that. We need a new generation of young players coming through who are superstars. And she is that, I think.

29:07Vicki Sparks:And she's got a great relationship down that right hand side with Lucy Bronze, who we're going to hear from now. We caught up with her a little earlier. Does she think that anything has changed now that it is knockout football? They've been calling it knockout games, England, since the loss to France. But now we're actually in the quarterfinals. So how different is it? It's definitely business as usual. I think having to play those last two games as knockout football has brought out the best in us. It's brought out big performances from a lot of players. I guess it's pushed the team closer together in the way that we've had to play.

29:38And knowing that it is do or die, I think this team plays really well under that kind of pressure. So having already had that experience as a squad, then to go into the quarterfinal has almost turned out to be a good thing for us. It means that we already know what we're coming up against. We're coming up against a top opposition as well, similar to what we had to do against the Netherlands. So, yeah, I think we can draw from the experience of even just these past two weeks.

30:01Vicki Sparks:The Swedish captain, Kosovar Aslani, has been talking about the strength in their side being the collective of the team and also said they're a very physical side. I wonder, from your perspective, what you've identified as the main threat? Yeah, I mean, I guess that's quite similar to us in a way. The collective team is the best thing about our team. Obviously, we know that Sweden's physical, maybe in stature. I think we're quite physical in aggression and maybe the pace that we play. So I think it's two teams that are very respectful for each other but very front-footed. I don't think either team will be holding back, but I think we know the threat that they cause and they have caused in this tournament.

30:41I think we can find a way to nullify that and obviously show the best of ourselves.

30:46Vicki Sparks:She also said it's going to be a fun game, which I wonder will suit you. You like a fun game. But I wonder what she meant by that. Do you still get nervous? Do you look forward to these sorts of games? Yeah, I mean, I feel like I could say the same thing. And I think what she probably meant by it is what I've just said. Both teams just going toe-to-toe. I think that's the great rivalry that the Swedish and the English team have. It's two teams that really just go at it. They don't really hold back. We don't sit back and defend. We can play in different ways in terms of playing short with the ball, maybe just kicking it long, using physicality, using technical ability.

31:18so I think in that respect it makes for a fun game because there's so many unknowns but at the same time two very talented teams

31:24Vicki Sparks:Talking of that rivalry, a high point was obviously Euro 2022 you won 4-0 in the semi-finals a lot of people remember it for the Alessio Russo backheel you scored that day as well I know, no one remembers that But you must have great memories of that game and I wonder is that the Sweden that you feel you're facing this time around versus maybe the two sides or the singular side that you've drawn to in the last year? I don't think either. I think perhaps a completely different team. I don't think we're drawing too much on the previous Euros. I think both teams have changed a lot since then in terms of momentum and well as personnel and players, strengths weaknesses have changed.

32:03I think Sweden seemed to be in an even better position now than what they were back then. Obviously it was a fantastic memory for us. It's something that can give us, you know, I guess positives to look back on but I don't think we draw too much going into tomorrow's game just to look at that game.

32:19Vicki Sparks:So that was Lucy Bronze speaking a little bit earlier. Did she score against Sweden? Did she? I've got no memory of that. What goal was that? It was a header. Of course it was a header. Of course it was. And it was a good one as well. She'll be hugely offended. Sorry Lucy if you're listening. Sorry Lucy. I mean she literally said no one remembers. I literally have no memory of it whatsoever. I remember Franz as well. That was a very good goal. From long range. That's right, yeah. I remember that one. Someone was watching. But yeah, it is all about that backfield though. I mean, I remember watching it in person and it was incredible, wasn't it?

32:53Vicki Sparks:And actually talking about Lucy Bronze's goal contributions, which, you know, we get so used to. She hasn't scored here, which seems remiss considering almost every other player scored on the England side. Yeah, that was such a positive, wasn't it? Against Wales, six different goal scorers, four players getting their first goal of the tournament. I mean, she will continue to make those runs. I thought that the way she spoke in the press conference as well about you know being willing to give everything and anything for England they were asking her about you know what what's your why and in terms of the wider inspiration and you know she spoke about that but for her her why has always been she loves football she loves working hard and she adores playing for England and I think that's it you know we've spoken Karen haven't we about you know in game she can be such a positive with that emotion and that passion that drives her forward but also at times it's about managing it and staying disciplined and that's that's always the the balance that you get with Lucy isn't it yeah I think so she's she she wants to do whatever is best for the team ultimately and I think obviously it's a team game isn't it so you know what we saw against France was possession breaking down when she was already in advanced positions and the willingness and the desire to get back and you know like sometimes you just want it so bad that maybe it doesn't always come off but you know like what she's been doing in terms of moving infield securing sort of um you know she'll she'll kill any sort of counter attacks with her positioning so she gives lauren james that freedom now it'll be interesting to see like if she is tasked with getting a bit more forward against the likes of sweden and what that looks like but um yeah she's an incredible player an incredible leader 10 years 10 years since her breakout tournament back in 2015 she has been at the very top of European and world football for all that time showing no signs of slowing down how has she changed I've got to ask because she was 2015 she was quite shy wasn't she but then you see her speak today and she's a you know really confident really comfortable her own skin yeah I remember her first tournament with us in 2013 and obviously that was a bit of a shambles for everyone but in 2015 she kind of grew into it and And I remember she came up with that massive goal against Norway, didn't she?

35:02That really kind of got us through. And I think she's grown on the pitch in terms of what she's been able to achieve, obviously, with the likes of Barcelona, et cetera. She's won everything there is under the sun. But I think it's the way she's grown off the pitch as well, in terms of being able to mentor and lead younger players. And yeah, I think she's an incredible player. and I know she gets a lot of sticks sometimes about maybe, you know, being in her twilight of her career. But no, I think she's a crucial cog.

35:34Vicki Sparks:But if we go back to the France game, she was caught out of position a little bit. And if we look at the threats Sweden have, we've already talked about their wide players, their speed, those balls in behind as well, Luke. The speed worries me because Lucy has lost, unfortunately, as I discovered, that once you get into your 30s, you do start to slow down. Particularly at your elite level. Yeah, particularly when you're an amateur level, like I was. But you do, and you can see that has happened. She has lost a little bit of speed. And against France, I have to admit, I thought, oh dear, is this the tournament where cynical people like me, nasty people in the media say it's a tournament too far for her?

36:14But against the Netherlands and Wales, she was incredible. And back to her very best. And I think she is one of those players, and we're talking about relishing this, a European Championship quarterfinal knockout football, I have every faith in her that she will deliver her best. I think there's a lot of context to that because like I said, you know, England were losing possession in the build-up phases quite early on and that was obviously, if that didn't happen and she was in that advantageous position and they were managing to, you know, play the ball through midfield with secure possession, I don't think that would have been a problem.

36:46But it's about kind of making sure that everyone's on the same page essentially. I was worried she was getting beaten one-on-one by a fast winger. That was my only concern. I was worried that she just lost that little bit of pace. And against speed, that was kind of a kryptonite. But I'm confident she'll be okay. But please give me some... No, I mean, yeah, okay. There were some issues in terms of just one-for-one decision-making as well. But I do think it's something that they've managed to kind of discuss and put right. And we've seen that in their following performances against the Netherlands, against Wales, etc.

37:20But yeah, I do think, you know, the wingers will pose a massive threat. Yeah, I would agree with that. I mean, it is a strength of Sweden. We've discussed it already. I think the main thing for me is as a player, as a commentator, I absolutely love watching her. You could tell from the press conference today, she cares so much. She, like she said, will do anything and everything in an England shirt. But it's just those moments. Say, for example, England are 1-0 down with 10 minutes to go. do you see perhaps a Lucy who is just so desperate to do everything she can to keep England in the tournament that actually game plan slightly gets left behind in terms of just being desperate to get that equalizer and I do think that is where I really because she is experienced enough where you have to be thinking with your head as well as your heart she's absolutely capable of doing that but I think that that could and not just for the quarterfinal if they go forward there are going to be those moments where it is going to be so key and and that is something that I'm sure Serena Wigman will be having those discussions and again as a manager you want players to feel the game you don't want her not to go for those runs but as you said Karen it's about everybody being in the same page because they can lead to real danger moments there was a shade of that in the World Cup final as well against space yes well remembered yes it was Lucy for a forward lost the ball on the halfway line which is where the Spanish goal came from But the teammates have got to help her out there.

38:42Like, when you get to her age, sometimes you're up against electric pace. You might need your winger or a midfielder to come over and say, don't leave me on my own. You know, you can double up. And that might be what England need to do, not leave her exposed one-on-one. But also, if she makes those runs, because we all know she's going to make them from time to time, somebody drop in. I think that's the difference in terms of what we saw in that Netherlands game, you know, as well as, you know, if your fullback's gone round, you know, obviously everyone needs to squeeze around as well. but then the likes of, I don't know, your wingers or your Georgia Stanways coming and securing next to say Keira Walsh or Keira Walsh dropping into the back line to allow the opposite centre-back to get across and go in support.

39:19I think we're seeing those conversations happening on the pitch. It's certainly much more visible than it was against France, which you didn't really see the sort of gesticulation that we see now.

39:28Vicki Sparks:One final thing I just wanted to touch on before we go, and it's not about the football, it's off-field stuff. A few of us have been doing media duties. Luke, you've been there as well at the Dolde Grand, which is where England are staying. A bit above my pay grade, I noticed. Have they not offered you a room? They didn't offer me a room and I looked at the prices and I don't think I'll be staying there anytime soon. Stop that now. I don't know if you've seen where Sweden are staying. I've heard about this. So there's a brilliant piece, if you want to read more about it, on The Athletic from Michael Cox.

40:00Vicki Sparks:but it goes into this list of approved accommodations that UEFA offered up to the 16 teams when they were all qualified for the tournament. And Sweden went off list, unlike England and some of the others, and they are staying in a place just north of Zurich in a fitness centre. And the idea being that they describe it a little bit like a youth hostel, so they want you to stay out of your rooms, they want you to spend time together rather than being like, you can walk to your training facilities. They have amazing sporting facilities. There was a similar story around them in New Zealand at the World Cup where they were staying in something fairly modest compared to the USA, which were essentially in the kind of five star mega castle, weren't they?

40:41Vicki Sparks:I just wonder, Karen, your thoughts on that. Karen would have hated it. I like camping. What are you talking about? You would have hated it. You became a prima donna and you got it later in your career. Yeah, my head's massive. Yeah, no, I think it's really interesting. It reminds me of Finland in 2009 when we didn't have massive facilities. You just think about how much time you spend with each other, whether it's in the room, outside the room, when you haven't really got a whole lot to do. But from what I know about these girls, the England camp, they absolutely love spending time together. So whether it's getting together in a communal area, watching Love Island or playing card games or what have you, they absolutely don't isolate themselves in their rooms.

41:23Vicki Sparks:does it does it matter your environment though of course it does yeah because i mean you can design it to feel a certain way like clearly the the swedes have taken that on and said you know we want to make sure that y 'all are getting together and it's basic so england have we've been there it's luxury it is a luxury hotel sweden have deliberately gone the other way and turned it very very basic and very you know taking it almost stripping it all back and just making it a very sort of brutal almost team environment it looks great if you do well it doesn't look so great if you lose to England tomorrow night.

41:55And I think the key thing surely is, you know, are the players on board with it? Were the players consulted? And, you know, you think that they must have been. So actually, if you all buy into it, that's the biggest thing, isn't it? I think they're all on board depending on what happens tomorrow night. But that's the thing, isn't it? You might start moaning about it if they go out tomorrow saying it was absolutely terrible. But then if they get to the semi-finals, they're saying it's brilliant. Yeah, but they might go out because Lauren James has a blinded, not because they were staying in a youth hostel equivalent in the north of Shurin.

42:21Well, I mean, I don't know. seriousness to the conversation in terms of the facilities that are available. Yeah, we don't know the entirety of what Sweden has on offer, but we know, you know, the way that England prepare, the way they recover from games, you know, like they'll have their ice baths, they'll have their massages, they'll have their physios, they'll have all of that at their, you know, that they can use when they see fit. So essentially it's kind of like a no stone unturned situation where we don't know what Sweden have, what they don't have. But ultimately, you want to prepare your players to recover and perform in the best way possible.

42:58So if Sweden think that that's what it is, England looks like that's what that is, then it just depends at the end of the day what happens on the pitch, doesn't it?

43:05Vicki Sparks:So England against Sweden in the quarterfinals. Anita Asante on the BBC Sport website says, this is the game, this is the test. I feel that if England beats Sweden on Thursday, they will reach the final of the Euros. Karen, final thoughts? I don't know, Luke's doing something. What are you doing? I did some hand gestures because that's what I said at the start. People are like, oh, if we beat Sweden, we'll get to the final. They're going two games ahead. Well, I think this is it, isn't it? People talk about the semifinal. We've not even got there yet. So I think we just need to focus on this game, which is what the players will be doing.

43:36I know it's going to be tough. I think it's going to be a fun game for everyone, not only involved as players, but for us in the media to kind of see how this unfolds. But I certainly have full belief in the performances that I've seen in England, and I think they're more than capable.

43:50Vicki Sparks:Well, many thanks to Karen, to Luke, to Vicky. That is it from us here on the Football Daily, but do not miss it. England against Sweden, the Euros quarterfinals. Build up from the stadion Letzigrund in Zurich from 7 o 'clock tomorrow night on 5 Live. And BBC Sounds kickoff is at 8.

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