Arsenal back in Champions League final during a week to savour: Football Weekly

0:00This is The Guardian.

0:30wasn't as nerve-wracking as it should have been. The second great result for the Gunners after Manchester City dropped two points at Everton. It could have been worse for City. Jeremy Doku with a glorious curler to rescue a point and keep the title race alive. Just our City, the bottlers after all. Meanwhile, after we said Forest needed to play their strongest side against Chelsea, they made eight changes and won. Chelsea's sixth league defeat in a row. And then to the Jazz Bar. It's been far too long for a proper fit bar corner. Ewan Murray joins us as the title race goes from three to a two-horse race with Hearts leading the way.

0:58There's big news from the Lichtenstein Cup. Your questions. And that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.

1:07On the panel today, Barry Glenn Denning, welcome. Hi, Max. Hello, Nicky Bandini. Morning. Mention of the Lichtenstein Cup will mean some listeners will already know that from the sweeper pod, Paul Watson is on today. Hey, Paul. Hi, Max. And joining us for part one, producer Ty, anyone who listens to the end of these podcasts may occasionally hear today's football weekly was produced by tayo papula but he's also a co-host of the tuesday club the alan davis arsenal podcast if that's not fair on you tayo and you were there last night i was there last night yeah thank you for having me it's a pleasure it's been a very good two days to be an arsenal fan uh nikki is smiling from ear to ear tayo how was it at the emirates last night from start to finish it was brilliant from the atmosphere before the game outside the ground to the whole build-up it felt like a special night it felt like the biggest night at the stadium you have to worry about things like that because I think a few Arsenal fans especially around my way remember getting very excited in 2009 when Ronaldo Cristiano Ronaldo ended our semi-final hopes inside 11 minutes so when you have all of that kind of build-up before a game it can sometimes come back and bite you on the bum but it didn't this time the TIFO looked great the fireworks were great and we started off and managed the game fantastically well and you know the crowd have been criticized this season and rightly at times for transmitting those kind of nerves to the players well I think they did the opposite yesterday and they transmitted a real confidence and excitement and everyone was on board it's interesting where the mind goes doesn't it and I think Taiz did right thinking about that Ronaldo goal actually the atmosphere It was amazing before that goal.

2:48I remember that being at Arsenal. I'm thinking, God, you know what? Everyone's up for it tonight. Maybe we'll do something. And then how quickly it can be punctured. So I was thinking about the narratives we tell around games and how, yes, the atmosphere last night was spectacular and something that Arteta's been trying to build and Arsenal tried to build. But it's not the atmosphere that wins the game still. Even despite that, you have to have the performance to match it. I'd actually made a note of this, and I was almost afraid to say it in case I got absolutely hammered. But seeing as you mentioned it, Would it be fair to say that since getting criticised after the Bournemouth game for booing Arsenal off, despite them being nine points clear at the top of the table, the Arsenal fans seem to have tweaked that they can do more for their team than turn up five minutes before kick-off, sit in silence or moan for 90 minutes and then go home.

3:40Because last night seemed really special, the welcome for the team coach, the fireworks. I love a good T4. That one was great, especially when you compare it to the cannon on a bed sheet hung disconsolately behind one goal. Was it last season? And I think that makes a huge difference to the team. Yeah, I mean, look, being there as a fan, it goes both ways. It's been a very, very, very tense season. There has been this tension in the crowd because this one season feels like it's lasted for four years and there's a lot of tension around. That is on the crowd to kind of react positively. And I do, I take slight issue, of course, with the idea that we're kind of turning up disconsolate and booing.

4:27That did happen against Bournemouth. Bournemouth was a terrible performance. It doesn't help. But at the same time, the crowd are responding to the team. And after the optimism and enthusiasm of the Fulham game, I think, and of course, even though it's a different competition, the result a couple of nights ago with Man City and Everton, it turned the mood positive and that atmosphere came with it. And the players responded to that. And I think there was one way where the crowd did make a big difference. It's like when the board went up for five minutes, that normally is a point for, oh no, we've got another five minutes of hell ahead.

5:03But there was a massive, massive cheer and there was that encouragement all the way through. So, yeah, I don't know if it's a case of the Arsenal fans finally working out that they've got to be part of it. I think a dam has slightly broken in the last couple of days in terms of atmosphere and optimism. And the end of the season feels like it's in sight. And I think that energy and enthusiasm is brought as much by the team as it was by the crowd. Yeah. And the end's in sight, Nicky, and you could win all of it. Yeah. Let's not make the whole Arsenal just being a Champions League final qualifying night about, well, were the crowd good enough recently?

5:38That's not actually what this is about, is it? I mean, it's amazing that it was such an amazing atmosphere last night. Listen, in the end, as much as I am a fan and the atmosphere matters to me and it matters to everyone, I think it is still not about just the fans. It's about the players on the pitch to win a game of football, which is a really hard game of football. I do think the atmosphere comes into it. I think it's important to mention. I just thought it was a bit of the same as maybe after the Bayern PSG first leg. I don't think everyone listening wants to go straight to the curmudgeonly and everything that's wrong with modern football.

6:09Maybe we can enjoy the fact that there's some happiness before we go straight to that. But listen, I think that it's worth saying that actually this is part of what Atletico Madrid do so effectively under Diego Simeone. They do make you feel unconfident. They do make you feel unsettled. They haven't always been this juggernaut. But what they are effective at doing, even when they haven't got the best players in an individual matchup, is making you doubt yourself. And I think what was really, you can put it on the crowd if you want to. but I think you've got to also acknowledge that this is what Michael Arteta has built as a manager.

6:42It's a team that actually has now been, despite all the bottling remarks, despite everything else, has been playing in really competitive games for a really long time. And on this occasion, did not show even an inch of nerves, really didn't actually, really delivered from the start of this game. And it's easy to go, oh, well, they aren't playing PSG, they aren't playing Bayern Munich. That's true. Arsenal have had the soft side of the draw. but they weren't playing nobody either. They were playing against a team that had Julian Alvarez, that had Antoine Griezmann, that had Adam O 'Lukman and none of those players looked at all threatening and I think you can get into the detail of that as well.

7:20We should probably question whether or not Simeone got his team selection right, whether or not switching the whole team out it felt like with 60 minutes gone was the right choice because it felt like that really threw them off their rhythm but I do think you know let's celebrate how flipping good that is because in the end two teams reached the final and Arsenal won them yeah and I wanted it to get edgy I was like waiting for it to get edgy I was like waiting for the panic and the panic was never there and I was like this is really annoying I want some panic because I wasn't necessarily supporting Arsenal in this game but they were good and actually Paul from the front I thought Jocheres who hasn't been brilliant I think at holding the ball up for a large part of the season but has been really good at that in the last sort of three weeks basically I thought he led the line absolutely brilliantly he was fantastic he's like a whole he looks like a whole different person and it's funny because I don't think he's necessarily doing a completely different job I think he's been making these runs he's been working very hard but it suddenly feels like something's clicked in him especially after Fulham after that game he just looked so much more pumped up and confident I do also feel like the fans response to him is a part of that I feel like the fans are now you know in the past was a bit of eye rolling at some of the some of the runs he was making and you know no one's ever doubted necessarily his his effort and his workload but he was starting to make runs that looked pretty futile whereas suddenly you know he made the goal that was that was very much he was doing he created the situation that led to to the goal and from nothing really not not from a particularly threatening position his run alone created that situation and it's really nice actually because there's always been this doubt about you know is he going to be a flop and I still don't think it's definitively you know he's been a success but I do think it's really nice to see a player settle into a club and actually finally show what he's capable of and last night felt for him like a real celebration of how far he's come he he did miss that great chance as well to be fair he missed a brilliant chance for a second one but again he got into that position and and you know if he'd scored that you'd have said what a game from jokers you know he's on fire but you know he did miss that chance i will i will concede that and i really thought that was going in all the way and you know looked perfect the ball was perfect um was it in cap here i think put it perfectly into him and he did he did blaze it but um i just think he's such a different player when he's confident and he looks confident and i'm i'm just really happy for him actually i'm no in no by no means an Arsenal fan but I'd love to see a player who perhaps looks like he's he's on on course to be seen as a bit of a flop finally sort of deliver.

9:59I've been very critical of Giocares this season certainly I think he's not he's not showed the kind of technical ability he's looked awkward but he was brilliant last night and as you say not so much with the goal scoring stuff but the running of the channels the incredible hold-up play he gave Lenormand and Panko a really really tough time all night did brilliantly bringing other players into it as well but he also really benefited from having players on either side of him fit and available who kind of compliment him because he had a fit sacker and I'm sure we'll come to him Trossard also two players who like when he plays alongside say Martinelli or Maduaki he's got you've got a side of three runners who are perhaps all trying to go for the same balls through midfield that he is as well but he his strengths were played to by having Saka mixing things up with having Trossard going short for him as well and so he's not having to battle you know James Tarkovsky or other Premier League defenders who he has struggled with because the Premier League is really really hard so he's very recently we've had we've been playing him more into kind of channels where he has been able to kind of bully his way use his speed use his upper body strength in that situation much more effectively And I also think just one thing to say about him, as I say, I've been quite critical of him.

11:20He's been available this season when others haven't. And, you know, he's done the minutes that Havertz, Marino, Jesus, if they've been fit. So he's kind of battled through, he's found his place in the Premier League. He's found the Champions League a little bit more easy physically, of course, in comparison. but he's really put the he's kind of put the work in and how he's got to 20 goals if you ask me to go through them all I'm not sure I can do that for you but he's shown up and he's found a groove and now with better players on the pitch with him with with Calafiore um looking to forward motion at all times with Eza looking for him as he did for for Saka's goal the other day he's got players around him um and look guess what Arsenal look better with their better players on the pitch and he's definitely benefited from that.

12:10And one of those players, Baz, was Lewis Skelly. And I was surprised that he was... I wasn't sure if Zubin Mendy wasn't 100 % fit, but I just thought he did incredibly well in what must be like... It's an incredible moment to be put into centre mid. I don't know how many times he's played centre mid, but it feels like a centre mid the second time he's been put there. And he hasn't played so much this season. Unless I'm mistaken, I think he is a centre mid by trade as a kid. so it's not a position that's alien to him but I thought it was a brave selection by Arteta and it paid off again I don't know what Christian Neurgaard has done since leaving Brentford what has happened to him the guy cannot get a minute on the pitch it seems and I wonder what he makes has been overlooked for Miles Lewis Skelly this child playing out of position in terms of his senior appearances but Lewis Skelly didn't put a foot wrong and there are other selections Arteta you could argue were a bit of a gamble picked Ben White who was again fine I can't think of a single Arsenal player who didn't have a good game last night David Rea was good again he didn't have to do much but what he was called upon to do he did were fine.

13:34And again, I just add my praise to Jokeres. I think I remember saying a couple of months ago that it's just not working for him. And it wasn't at the time, but the transformation in him over the last six to eight weeks has been jaw-dropping, I think. Worth a mention for Saka, Nicky, isn't it? I mean, like, you know... Tiny mention maybe for the player who scored the goal. Yeah, absolutely. But him coming back is... Because there were times when Maduweke, I think, started really brilliant for Arsenal. You were like, oh, this is, you know, it sort of doesn't matter which one you pick at one point.

14:08But then you do see the... And Saka, I think Barney was saying on Monday, you know, had looked a bit tired at times of season. But, you know, like it wasn't the most brilliant goal he's ever scored. But like, he's such a special player. No, but I think there is. I mean, there's a real... Obviously, there's a qualitative difference between Maduweke and Saka. And that's not chucking Maduweke under some sort of bus. you can be a very good player and not be as good as Bukayo Saka. I think he's, I've always felt like he's the special player in this team. I was, well, maybe that's doing other people a disservice, but he's the one I'm most excited to watch.

14:40That's certainly true. He's always our star boy. And I think that it's easy to go, oh, scoring the goal, the flashy thing, the thing that you remember, of course, and having that moment of running to the crowd. But actually, I think there's something almost more to it than that, which is for a 24-year-old, he's really actually quite patient. I think that's part of, again, what I was talking about before with Arsenal not panicking in this situation and being up against a team that just wants to have you under pressure the whole time. That whole goal was quite patient. It was a lovely ball from Saliba, I think it was originally, to get Kjokos free.

15:14He takes the time he needs to get the ball right across goal. Trossard really takes his time, doesn't panic, takes that beat to look for the ball. And I think all of those things are what makes it. And I think that Saka is absolutely a player who does that, who transmits that, and who when he's on the ball or not actually on that flank, you can see that he really is taking decisions. Whereas Madueke, he's so good at going past this man, but I'm not always sure he is making those decisions with as much thought as Saka is. So I think that there is a different intelligence to the team when Saka's in it personally.

15:47And I think that's part of why they won last night. I will say this does go back to the fan thing. and I want to be clear I was never trying to get away from the fan thing I just felt like it was a bit negative that initial talk but I do think like as someone who grew up in London there's something extra magic about when you hear Saka talk at the end of the game and like yeah you know like that's what it sounds like in London that's how being an Arsenal game has always been those are the people you know you've grown up with and enjoyed football with your whole life and it just it does feel like as a fan he's one of us and that feels a little bit extra special Athletics weren't great in this Paul I mean obviously part of that is Arsenal stopping them be great but were you expecting more yes I think I probably was but I think I was also expecting exactly what we got to some degree so coming into this I think to some degree what was interesting was that the first leg because of the disappointment with the overturned penalty it felt like Arsenal were a bit disappointed to have only got that one all draw but actually that was a huge result you know that that was really for me the danger leg because you're going to a stadium where I think they've never, Atleti had never lost to an English side in a Champions League knockout at home.

16:54So this is a really daunting tie. And I think really the credit to Arsenal for the way they weathered that, that they came away disappointed to only have got the draw. I think it then put this huge pressure on Atleti because they were only really going to be able to play the way they played. And it relies on those little moments, those little sparks from Griezmann or Alvarez or someone to do something magical and and it didn't really happen for them that said there were some there were some moments like I think you know we talked about this game being perhaps not the edge of the seat kind of game and it wasn't it didn't have that feel of like your stomach plummeting as an Arsenal fan I'm not an Arsenal fan but you know I didn't feel like Arsenal fans were sitting there with their stomach plummeting every minute or something there weren't an abundance of chances but there were those moments and you know there's there's um when Simeone got through and was sort of bundled down, Griezmann's penalty shout, you know, all of these things could have been the moment.

17:53So I don't look at it and say, well, I think Atleti played particularly badly or managed the game particularly badly. The only point, this decision to change things up so massively, just at the point that they seem like they were catching a kind of flow, Atleti, to suddenly make those changes and sort of change the whole, the way they were playing, seemed slightly counterintuitive to me. Yeah, I know there was the saw-off air shot, which, you know, given how hard he kicks the ball, must have hurt the air, I thought. Just, you know, the poor bit of air that he kicked would have been tough. It was funny, Ty, you were saying before the pod, you weren't sure if it was a good game on.

18:28Like, being a fan, you just weren't sure. You know, it was interesting when Paul said it wasn't edge-of-the-seat stuff. I think it was sort of back-of-the-seat stuff for neutrals. But you just have no idea? Yeah, I was reliably told that it was an absolute turkey. of the game so uh thanks for clarification look you don't yeah you don't you don't know in there there was a moment like around 70 minutes where and I didn't say it out loud because of jinxing of course but it was the first time I felt comfortable and to your point uh Paul and Nicky about the substitutions about the disrupting of the flow when you take off Alvarez and Griezmann and go for that kind of Hail Mary switch up that was a vote of confidence for what Arteta had been able to do in terms of suffocating the team so if you're watching as a neutral without that tension then I can perhaps concede that it might have brought you to tears but there was no way that there were battles all over the pitch for the one-eyed Arsenal fan you know and we found those and Mikel Arteta seemed to come up with the solution for all of the small amount that Atleti offered and they didn't really offer much up front there was that kind of scare with I think I think if Simeone had gone down at the first opportunity then we might have had a case um for for a penalty but he tried to stay on his feet thank you very much and and take the shot so apart from that there wasn't really too much to worry about so yeah as a as a fan watching it I was absorbed from start to finish I was um especially absorbed because where I sit is right in front of Diego, Simeone and Arteta.

20:11And the two of them as Jack in the Boxes, it was incredible to watch as a side show. I mean, there was a point where Simeone ends up in Arteta's technical area at some point. So that in itself was sensational. But yeah, couldn't take my eyes off it. I will watch it all again. And I'll concede that it might not be as much fun the second time around without that tension taken away, which is everything. I just wanted, on those substitutions and that impact, it's another of those fan things that maybe isn't real, but Antoine Griezmann scored that goal against us in the Europa League and then did the fortnight celebration however many years ago that is now.

20:54And I think there's like that institutional fear of players you get because you remember them ruining your big night. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so at least as a fan, like the second he goes off, you're like, oh, thank God. Because like you're waiting for him to do it again, to go and score that goal and do the dance he hasn't done in years and years, but he used to do. And yeah, I do think that substitution, psychologically as a fan at least, was like, oh, thank God he's out of the way. And Baz, it'll be, I mean, it'd be good to get a pound for everyone who says styles make fights in the lead up to whoever Arsenal play in the final.

21:20But that will be, regardless of who it is, it will be a fascinating game. Yeah, Arsenal will almost certainly go into it as underdogs, whoever they're playing. but it's a final, it's a one-off game. They have every chance of winning it. We've seen it happen before, Wigan beating Man City in the cup final, any number of FA Cup shocks. We see massive upsets in other sports. I don't think Garrison beating Bayern or PSG would be a massive upset but I think they will need whoever they're playing to have a bad day. They'll need big performances all over the pitch but I'd definitely give them a chance.

22:05Of course they have a chance. They're in the final. I was about to say something uncomplimentary about Mike Larteta, but it's not allowed, is it? Barry should. Barry should say something uncomplimentary about Mike Larteta. I forgot I'm on the arse cast today. Hey, Barry, you can say what you like. I would like to hear Baz's uncomplimentary thing about Mike Larteta. I also just think, and I completely agree with everyone who's going to say it, Arsenal will be the underdogs in this final. But it is weird. It is nevertheless weird that we're talking about a team like there's some crazy underdog while they are top of the Premier League and have not lost in the Champions League this season.

22:40They have zero loss in the Champions League. Yeah. Barry, now time to take this away from, you know, there are lots of listeners to this podcast who don't want everything to be positive about Arsenal. Yes. No, just, we mentioned the touchline antics of Simeone and Arteta. And while mildly amusing, it's getting out of hand. Arteta's behaviour on the touchline is disgraceful and the sooner the better some fullback or winger absolutely cleans him out accidentally in inverted commas while going for a ball that's rolled down the touchline, the better. I cannot wait to see it. Up in the air. What is it you don't like, Barry?

23:26He's interfering with the game. He's practically standing on the pitch. and he's got this rectangle he's supposed to stand in and he doesn't stand in it. And so with Simeone. Last night, Simeone was so far down the line at one point I thought he was going to take a throw in. I said at the start, I mentioned both of them, but it's just, it shouldn't be allowed. You know, you have a technical area, stand in it, it's not hard. Are you sad, Austin, in the final, Barry? I couldn't give a shit. who would you prefer Tyo out of PSG and Bayern there is a revenge factor to play PSG again I wouldn't dare to suggest that one side is going to be better suited to Arsenal the other but I think the overriding thing is living in a world where Harry Kane has scored a winner against your team in the Champions League final I'd like to take that out of the equation so if my choice is based entirely on that.

24:28I can live with it being Dembele. It's too long a summer if it's Harry Kane. What if he's got a Spurs shirt underneath his Bayern shirt, just there. He's just got it on. What a moment that would be. Alright, thank you, Tayo. Thanks for your job. Go back to producing this podcast now. How we survived without a producer for part one. No one will know. I will be back in a second. All my bits for part one are going to be taken out. Now that our producer has officially come out and nailed his colours to the mast. You provided necessary balance for this very objective podcast, Barry. Thank you. And we'll be back to discuss.

25:04The thing I'm saying, I don't think anything I've said is even remotely controversial. That's the problem. You just seem in a bit of a mood, that's all. I'm not in a mood. Okay. Nothing's worse when you're not in a mood than someone saying, are you in a mood? Because then that gets you in a mood, doesn't it? I didn't mean it. We'll be back in a second.

25:30Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly. So then another good night for Arsenal the night before, Everton 3, Manchester City 3, which means Arsenal have 76 points from 35 games and Manchester City are five points behind with a game in hand. What a game, Paul. And weird, at the end of it, all the players look devastated. Yeah, like, I don't know if you saw, this is a bit of a tangent, but did you see there was a non-league game and someone took a photo that was on Twitter where both teams had been relegated and there was this shot that was just magic because every single player on the field was on their knees in that kind of we've been relegated pose.

26:09Platoon wave, brilliant. There was a bit of that here, wasn't there? Because also, what was so weird about this game is that Man City end up grabbing what should theoretically be a kind of, there should be some sort of relief and joy in scoring a last second equaliser and I'm sure there is. But they must be gutted because, you know, this is enormously costly result. It may be basically the death knell for their title ambitions. And Everton must be gutted too because they looked, I mean, there's no way they should have won this game, Everton, really, by rights. I mean, for the first, like, I don't know how many minutes they barely got out of their own box.

26:46It just looked like it was going to be a really typical sort of Man City win. So nothing in this game made any sense, really. even beyond the fact that actually um ilman and jai basically had three or four other chances that didn't go in it could it was just a game that made zero sense but yeah left both sides absolutely gutted my overwhelming sadness is for david moyce who's never beaten pep and you're like this is your chance this is your chance poor bloke um i mean the reality is barry that that docket strike it does basically keep the title race alive i think i think without that it is completely done.

27:21I mean, it's sort of done, but it's not done done. I think it is done. And I thought it was hilarious that when he scored that equaliser, he wheeled away with his finger to his lips and kept tapping his finger against his lips. And I'm going, who are you trying to shush here? You've dropped two points. You've given the title to Arsenal. I'll be astonished if Arsenal don't win the title at this stage. could scarcely have handpicked three easier fixtures for the remaining games everyone is saying that West Ham have something to fight for are fighting for their lives and that's all well and good but I could be fighting for my life but if I'm fighting against someone who's a much better fighter than me I'm still going to lose and be dead and so it's like a motivational speech that Barry you should put that on mugs and t-shirts you should do a reel you should do a reel you know I might get lucky with a punch but I'm almost I'm gonna lose uh if I'm fighting against someone who's better at fighting than me which is pretty much every human being who's ever lived so I'd be astonished if Arsenal don't win the league and I still think City won't win all the remaining games.

28:42They've got some tough games coming. Yeah, I mean I suppose with my Spurs hat on I can just see Arsenal not helping Tottenham by accident and dropping points to West Ham but yeah, if they beat West Ham you sort of think Burnley at home Palace away three days before Palace probably have a European final. I thought City were slightly unlucky hearing that I think Michael Keane should absolutely have been sent off for that challenge on Jeremy Doku in the first half and he got away with the yellow card. I think he was very lucky boy there i mean there's been so much talk nikki of of arsenal bottling things and i'm just trying to imagine the reaction if gabrielle or saliva had made the mistake that mark gay made and look gay has been so brilliant for city and all moments in a season are defining but this that is a defining moment because everton okay they had some chances but like until he does that they're not getting back into this game yeah yeah in terms of the game it's completely transformative i think as paul said it's just a really odd game because everton looked completely not part of it until suddenly they were the better team for 20 minutes and could have scored six it felt like it just felt like every time they were going forward they could have scored again and even at three two um you've got donnarumma comes up for a corner and if they could just hoof it long they might score that way and then they don't end up winning so it was it was a very strange game but it does start to get weird with that game mistake so it it absolutely is one of the pivotal moments of the race i i think almost because of that i can't agree with that and certainly i'm aware i'm I'm viewing things through my own lens as someone who's got a horse in the race.

30:14But I don't think either of these teams has been without mistakes and without nerves. And as quickly as we've gone from Arsenal not being in control of it to being back in control of it, it's worth remembering it's five seconds ago that they were looking very nervy against Newcastle. So it just takes a weird thing to happen in a football game for things to change. And I do think one of the things that is being slightly under-acknowledged in all of this title race, in which we've often said it's over when it wasn't, or at least people have, I haven't, but people have, is that the Premier League's very competitive.

30:54The gap between the good teams and the bad teams is not as wide as it is in other leagues. And therefore, some of these teams, if they show up in the way that they're capable of, can cause surprises. and there's so many examples that through the season. Arsenal drew against Wolves who are the worst team in the division according to the table. So it isn't, I don't think it's over but it's certainly Arsenal have the, you know, have the command of it and will be the ones who've thrown it away if they don't win it. Yeah, I mean, I agree with you and yet, you know, if you beat West Ham, Burnley at home, Palace away is just, Palace is, because Palace would rest if they're in the conference league final, they'd probably rest everyone but then I guess forest rested everyone and they hammered chelsea's a lot who who knows i i want a bit i loved in this game and i like in football matches paul is when a goal happens before the directors and the commentators are ready and that very much happened with that harland got all of us yeah how's he there how does that happen the harland goal to me felt like it felt like if you're playing you know sometimes you have to play like someone's kid on a computer game like you're playing fifa and it's oh you're playing against like a your nephew or something and suddenly your nephew's actually really quite good and they get three one up and you're like all right i'm gonna have to just put you in your place a little bit here like you just run them up and score a goal it's like harlem was like come on no no yeah and the funniest thing was the fans leaving do you see the fans were leaving and then coming back in like 80 seconds later and you think so it's kind of hard as a man city fan to become disconsolate isn't it because they immediately give you hope and you have to come back in i felt like the celebrations at the end were almost like a bit of that it was It wasn't even so much that we've got results, we ruined your night.

32:33And sometimes in football, that's quite satisfying. Yeah, I don't disagree. I just wanted to check with you, Barry, because the guy who set up the second goal for Everton, I had never heard of. And I was like, should I have heard of all the players by now? Had you heard of Merlin and Rol? I had. And one of my takeouts from this game, actually, and from the last time I saw him was, who's calling their son Merlin? but I've never heard of I've heard of the magician and him and that's and a cat I know a friend of mine used to have a cat called Merlin I think Merlin is a safer name than if I was thinking at the playground and they said this is young Merlin I'd go okay fair enough if they said this is young Gandalf then I'd be like okay that is a step you can't give that that is not fair Mancia Brentford at home Palace at home Bournemouth away Villa home as we said Arsenal, please beat West Ham and then Burnley.

33:28I would like Arsenal to beat West Ham and then lose to Burnley, please. That would be, that's my dream. And then Palace away. Let's go to Stafford Bridge. Then Chelsea won Forest 3. And as I've mentioned, Baz, we made such a big thing of Villa kind of letting Spurs win to keep Forest in trouble, keep them scared. They had to play this game a day after Villa before this Europa League semi-final second leg. And he made eight changes and they won anyway. Yeah, and I'm assuming the minute by minute for this game. And when I saw the Forest team, I, you know, serious eyebrow raised. I thought he's taking a big risk here.