.jpg&w=1920&q=75)
In short
Football Weekly discusses the weekend’s Premier League and wider football picture, but is dominated by two storylines: Arsenal’s title push and “Spygate 2.0,” plus VAR controversy in West Ham vs Arsenal. Arsenal beat West Ham 1-0; the panel fixates on a VAR-awarded foul on goalkeeper David Raya that led to a disallowed/allowed outcome, arguing it was “clear and obvious” yet exposing inconsistency and the stress of VAR’s “after review” theatre.
Key claims
the foul was egregious and consequential; other fouls in the box went unpunished; a possible rule change could delay attackers entering the six-yard box.
Notable examples
Raya’s crucial saves (including Mateus Fernandes) and Arsenal’s set-piece dominance. Guests/panel: Barry Glendening, Max (host), Robin Cowan, and Philippe Auclair. They also cover Liverpool’s poor urgency under Arne Slot amid boos, Chelsea’s disjointed performance, relegation implications for West Ham/Leeds/Nottingham Forest, and EFL/Women’s/Scotland plus Spygate’s alleged Southampton analyst spying on Middlesbrough.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOArsenal's Title Chase
0:45 to 1:30
A recap of Arsenal's recent games and their title ambitions.
“Let's hope Leeds went on an absolute tear-up before Spurs away tonight.”
West Ham vs Arsenal Match Analysis
1:30 to 3:40
An in-depth discussion on the West Ham vs Arsenal match and key moments.
“Mutt says, why did VAR get it right and why is everyone complaining?”
The VAR Controversy
3:40 to 6:20
Debate around the VAR decision during the match and its implications.
“Like, yes, maybe they've got away with some, but, you know, they got away with them.”
Fouls and Consistency in the Game
6:20 to 8:30
Discussion on fouls committed during the game and the consistency of officiating.
“He said when two incidents happen, it's the one that has the material impact that will be judged.”
Impacts on Teams and Future Changes
8:30 to 11:10
Exploration of how VAR decisions affect teams and potential changes to rules.
“Another occasion this season where you had that type of foul committed on the goalkeeper by Arsenal or by any other club.”
The Role of Goalkeepers
11:10 to 13:00
Discussion on the importance of goalkeepers in the match and their performances.
“Yeah, I mean Arsenal have scored 27 goals from set pieces I mean, I pity the person, probably at Athletic, who has to watch all of those and find all the fouls to do a big piece about that.”
Arsenal's Key Players This Season
14:01 to 16:46
Discussing the impact of David Raya and Callum Wilson on Arsenal's title run.
“And also, just a feel for Callum Wilson because he strikes that ball so brilliantly and he has scored a couple of really crucial goals for West Ham despite playing about...”
Arsenal's Title Hopes and Performance Insights
16:46 to 18:58
Analyzing Arsenal's performance and the potential challenges ahead.
“I don't think he's as good as Aaron Ramsdale about four years ago.”
The Bottom of the Table: West Ham and Relegation Battle
18:58 to 22:48
Examining the relegation battle, focusing on West Ham's struggles.
“They look like they're playing with a bit more clarity under Deserby.”
Liverpool vs Chelsea: A Tale of Discontent
23:34 to 28:00
Recapping the Liverpool vs Chelsea match and the implications for both teams.
“So the top of the table, below the top two, Man United 65 from 36.”
Show all 23 chapters
Liverpool's Season Woes
28:00 to 29:00
Discussion on Liverpool's struggles this season and potential reasons behind it.
“And I'm a little bit, I mean, it comes to slot at Liverpool.”
Bournemouth's Surprising Form
29:00 to 30:30
Analyzing Bournemouth's unexpected performance and potential for Champions League qualification.
“And because of his demeanor, I actually think that the man has behaved with great amount of dignity and frankness throughout the year.”
Fulham vs. Bournemouth Match Analysis
30:30 to 33:50
Recap of the Fulham vs. Bournemouth match, including key moments and red cards.
“They're still performing to a really great level.”
Villa's Upcoming Challenges
33:50 to 36:10
Discussion on Aston Villa's performance and their upcoming matches against top teams.
“and yeah it was one of those games where Forest just were powerless weren't they to prevent what was happening to them.”
Brighton's Resurgence
36:10 to 37:30
Exploring Brighton's turnaround this season and their current form.
“Part three, we'll rattle through the Premier League and then we'll do Fitbar Corner, EFL, Women's Air Cup, semifinals and more.”
Everton's Missed Opportunities
37:30 to 39:00
Reflecting on Everton's recent performances and chances for European competition.
“Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly.”
Bruno Fernandes Award Controversy
39:00 to 41:20
Debate about Bruno Fernandes winning Football Writers’ Player of the Year amid differing opinions.
“as the season has progressed but I'm still not sure David Moyes quite fancies either of them.”
Scottish Football Update
41:20 to 42:00
Recap of the latest developments in Scottish football, focusing on Hearts and Celtic.
“of this man Bruno Fernandes so it's not a scandal but I didn't vote for him that's fine also not a scandal.”
Scottish Football Update: Hearts and Celtic Battle
42:00 to 43:50
Learn about the intense competition between Hearts and Celtic as they head toward the season climax.
“It's almost like individual boards aren't really the point of football, isn't it?”
Spygate: Southampton's Controversial Tactics
43:50 to 48:20
Understand the implications of the Spygate scandal involving Southampton's alleged spying on Middlesbrough.
“You can imagine Nick Muhammad's character.”
The Consequences of Spying in Football
48:20 to 54:40
Explore the potential ramifications and historical context of spying in football.
“And I have to say that if it is proven, and if they've done it regularly as well throughout the season, I agree with Barry.”
The Ridiculous Mbappé Petition and Its Impact
54:40 to 56:01
Discuss the viral petition regarding Kylian Mbappé and why it reflects on media coverage standards.
“It's an absolute scandal what's going on here.”
The Impact of Media on Player Transfers
56:01 to 57:08
Explore how media narratives influence player transfer speculation.
“I mean, like who is, even if Marco or whoever are reporting on it.”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00Max Rushden:This is The Guardian.
0:30being a West Ham fan. Imagine being Darren England. Imagine being Chris Kavanagh. Perhaps it would be more galling for West Ham if Arsenal had been pushing and pulling at corners all season. And so, two wins at home to Burnley and a way to Palace and Arsenal are champions. Meanwhile, West Ham's defeat means Forrest and Leeds are safe. Let's hope Leeds went on an absolute tear-up before Spurs away tonight. Also today, more boos for Arna Slott. Bournemouth put a little pressure on the top five and advantage Celtic in Fitbar. Until injury time at the London Stadium, the biggest story of the weekend was in the bushes near Middlesbrough.
0:58We'll talk Spygate 2.0. There's the rest of the playoffs. You could do a whole pod on the Rochdale-Borham-Wood playoff final. There's the Women's FA Cup semis. Basically, too much football to fit in today. We'll take your questions. And that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.
1:16On the panel today, Barry Glendening. Hello. Hi, Max. Welcome, Robin Cowan. Hi, Max. Bonjour, ça va. Philippe Auclair.
1:23Philippe Auclair:Ça va beaucoup mieux, Max. Beaucoup mieux. Ah, exactement. more. Okay then, let's start the London Stadium. West Ham 0, Arsenal 1. Doesn't really tell the whole story. Mutt says, why did VAR get it right and why is everyone complaining? Maffa the Laffer says, the cynic in me says, Arsenal have scored that goal 10 times this season. What's changed? And Ian Wright said, Chris Kavanagh's after review with the sweetest word since Martin Luther King's I have a dream. As someone with a dog in the fight, Philippe, how was it for you oh it was unbearable it was absolutely unbearable you know you remember that program when they wired up i think it was sam allardyce for a game to check out what was happening to the manager's pulse when during a game i think if they had wired me up uh i would basically have had the same readings and i think if you had wired up all the arsenal fans who were watching that game you probably would have enough energy to uh to keep the country going for one year if you could somehow get the electrical impulses.
2:24Philippe Auclair:It was, you know, it was absolutely unbearable. And it was very fitting, I think, as well, because it's almost like the whole season went encapsulated in, you know, 101 minutes or whatever it was. But yeah, it was totally unbearable and a great case to be made for defibrillators being installed absolutely everywhere Arsenal plays, or in every home when Arsenal plays, if you're an Arsenal supporter, or a West Ham supporter, I should say. Yeah, I mean, Barney got it quite right, Robin, you know, when he said they had it's up for grabs now. They had Aguero, you know, drink it in. And now we've got half the review.
3:02He looked at the screen 17 times. The replay was played 17 times across two and a half minutes. And obviously there's so much riding on this decision. And I guess the official's job, Darren England, the VAR, Chris Cavanaugh, is to take out that all away and go, is this a foul? And did they get it right? Well, it was a foul, wasn't it? But there was also an awful lot going on around it. Oh God. I mean, I'm already quite tired, Max, but this is, I mean, this is so much. I've got to say, actually, I watched match today this morning and I thought Danny Murphy's comment about this isn't Arsenal's problem.
3:40Like, yes, maybe they've got away with some, but, you know, they got away with them. And it's, you know, who cares, really? I'm sure that Arsenal fans wouldn't. Ultimately, it's a subjective call, isn't it? And it's just another layer of subjectivity. Was it clear and obvious? That's debatable. Could there have been other decisions given? Debatable? You know, there were lots of other holding going on. I mean, yeah, ultimately the decision was correct. But yeah, I can understand why fans of other teams are kind of going down the whataboutery route as well. I'm also going to make a prediction that over the summer we will get an edict come down from PGMO saying this is going to stop.
4:25It's ridiculous. And we're going to clamp down on it next season and it will last about three weeks and then it will go back to how it is. I mean, Nuno said it's the lack of consistency. Everybody's lost a bit of what is a foul and what isn't a foul. I thought he was quite measured. Arteta said the referees had a lot of courage. I think no one would disagree. It's a foul because Raya almost has the ball in his hands. And he said, you know, to make a call and change the course of one of the two teams, what a responsibility. I suppose, Barry, it's a sign of how stressful that job is as an official.
4:57You know, because you don't have a lot of time, even if it took five minutes, and you know whatever you do, it's going to be, you know, fury somewhere.
5:06Max Rushden:Yeah, first of all, I have to applaud Arsenal's ability to just put their fans through the ringer and the meat grinder over and over again. If I was a gooner, my soul would have left my body when that Callum Wilson shot across the line. Arteta's comments after the game, I think he's only saying that because the decision ultimately went his way. and I think if it had gone against him, he wouldn't be quite so kind. Was it a foul on Rhea? Yes, no doubt about that. But I think the issue some people have is the number of other fouls that were also being committed in the penalty area by Arsenal players, also by West Ham players, went unpunished, but that one was punished.
5:59Max Rushden:And Shea Given quizzed Darren Cahn about this on Match of the Day last night. They brought the referee into the studio, Barry. Yes. The official, out of the cupboard. It was in emergency break glass. There's Darren Cahn. And Darren Cahn said when two incidents happen, now I would argue there was six or even seven incidents in this farce. He said when two incidents happen, it's the one that has the material impact that will be judged. Now that's fair enough, but I'd be fairly confident some other former official will come out and contradict Can before the day is out. So, yeah, look, there's no doubt it was a foul on Raya, but I'm not quite sure why that particular foul goes punished and the rest of them don't.
6:50Max Rushden:And as I said, there were West Ham players also committing fouls at that corner. like Thomas Suchek was grappling with Zubimendi. We all saw Declan Rice rugby tackle Mavropanas into the back of the net. Pablo on Rhea, obviously. Odegaard was wrestling with Tadibo while Tadibo was also fouling Rhea. So, you know, to go back to your original question, I do not envy any VAR or referee having to try to pick the bones out of that. It's like a sort of Caravaggio orgy. Darren Cairn did make a point, Philippe. He suggested on Match of the Day that a rule comes in where no attacking player is allowed in the six-yard box until the corner is taken.
7:36So that means the sort of grappling either happens outside of the six-yard box or it just means the keeper has a bit of space. And I don't, like, when anyone ever suggests a rule change, everyone just goes, no, you can't do it, it's terrible. I don't intrinsically hate that idea.
7:51Philippe Auclair:No. It would become, I mean, basically it would be the equivalent of the encroachment rule on penalty kicks. And there is nothing really wrong apart from the monitoring of the encroachment, which would be much more complicated in the case of a corner kick, for example, than it is in the case of a penalty. There is something to be said for that. I won't be the devil's advocate. I'm going to be the angel's advocate here. I do think they got it right. And I also think that the type of foul that led to the goal being disallowed is so egregious in a way. I mean, I'd like, actually, try to remember, if you can, because it's chaos, obviously, we're trying to make sense of here.
8:33Philippe Auclair:Another occasion this season where you had that type of foul committed on the goalkeeper by Arsenal or by any other club. And I've seen, yes, cases where goalkeepers have been impeded, as in they couldn't go towards the ball. This is different. He's really literally pushing his arm down as he's about to catch the ball or punch it. That is really clear and obvious. And the fact that the on-pitch referee is not saying immediately, no, no, no, come on, guys, there's a foul. First of all, good luck for anybody who would be, you know, the ref camp, that's about the only thing, that it's the only purpose it serves.
9:12Philippe Auclair:When they use it, you realize this is chaos all around those guys. And also, there is this thing, if I get it wrong, it will be corrected, which has become the default behavior, I think, of quite a few referees in the Premier League. We saw that as well in the Fulham game where there were two red cards given, which were, I think, completely obvious, should have been given on the pitch. It just thought the referee thought, listen, I'm going to give a yellow card. They can always tell me if I didn't get it right. So it's a kind of insurance policy. I can understand if I were a West Ham supporter, because I think in many ways this decision is of more consequence on West Ham than it is on Arsenal.
9:52Philippe Auclair:Losing out on a title, which by the way, Arsenal wouldn't have lost out on the title. Manchester City still has to go to Bournemouth, which is bloody hell, very hard indeed. And anything could happen. But in the case of West Ham, I mean, that's a signal. That's an absolute signal. So I think you can feel sympathy for everybody involved. and I think perhaps we should move back a little bit and say the right decision was taken. It was a foul. It was the most consequential foul of them all in the box at the time. The right decision was given, but the consequences are absolutely huge. And this is the problem.
10:30Philippe Auclair:The problem becomes, it's not the game. It's not even the incident. The problem is about the consequences of using VAR in those particular situations, and which goes way beyond even the title or the relegation is the fact that obviously the system doesn't quite work as it should work. And that there is a real problem in particular with three-kicks-deadball situations, basically, which is why at least try... I think they have tried out actually the encroachment rule in a couple of tournaments and it worked out okay. Whether it would work okay in a game which has got so much, again, so many consequences hanging on to it, I don't know.
11:08Philippe Auclair:but probably worth a try because the fact that we're all talking about it and we cannot not talk about it is an indication that there's something here which is deeply wrong because we should be talking about there were plenty of other things to talk about in this game be it about West Ham being about Arsenal which are admirable things or not so admirable things but they go in the background and that in itself is bad. Yeah, I mean Arsenal have scored 27 goals from set pieces I mean, I pity the person, probably at Athletic, who has to watch all of those and find all the fouls to do a big piece about that.
11:44I mean, the drama is there. I mean, I suspect we all put Var in the bin, Robin, but it is still amazingly dramatic. The theatre of that is dramatic. I'm not saying I like it because I don't like VAR. I don't know what the question is, really, apart from I just found the whole thing sort of slightly overwhelming. And as a Tottenham fan, I was sort of slightly conflicted inflicted because I was like maybe a point maybe that's okay Tottenham could still survive and Arsenal you know mess it up and that's funny but I don't know it was just it was just as you said it was sort of exhausting but but absolutely thrilling and yeah you're right I think um it is quite just as someone who's got you know got no skin in this game at all it the sort of ceremony of the of the VAR has kind of added something you know usually to piss people off and especially those in the stadium it's not really worked in that sense and i don't write the after review it's i don't think that's necessary i think if they if they had the voice of the guy who does the movie voiceovers maybe um but it's always very they always sound so timid and like they don't want to be doing this and be to be heard in the stadium um i don't think that adds much to it but yeah it's you know it's here to stay it's not gonna it's not gonna go anywhere is it i just feel like I was very much for it when it came in I'm not sure it's worked but you've got to say as Philippe said it came to the right decision but it's just tedious and I feel like it's more the debate and the C word consistency keeps coming up it's like you just can't have that it's not possible you can't have that you want it within a game yes within 90 minutes you'd like consistency but you just can't have it in every single match in the Premier League Maybe it's a kind of cumulative thing where they have to stop the play and go, look, if West Ham are committing four fouls and Arsenal three, then West Ham get the benefit.
13:36So you're looking at all these different things and two hours later, you get the result.
13:40Max Rushden:I was wondering, like, just for the sake of argument, could he have done after review and chalked off the goal and then said, after further review and awarded West Ham a penalty, save for one of the blocking, shoving, dragging incidents? I don't know is the answer. I'm just putting it out there. It would have been amazing, dear. And also, just a feel for Callum Wilson because he strikes that ball so brilliantly and he has scored a couple of really crucial goals for West Ham despite playing about... Well, I mean, hats off to Gabriel as well because it was his block on another good Callum Wilson shot That led to the corner that has got everyone talking.
14:26Well, and David Raya as well. You know, David Raya, he's basically, I know it's been a team effort, but I don't think Arsenal win the title without him. Honestly, he's been absolutely sensational. He made that save for Mateus Fernandes, who was through. And that's one of several that he's made over the season. Like, really saves that you really possibly wouldn't expect keepers to make. He's been absolutely sensational. yeah and actually fernandez has so much goal over there philippe to put it in and it's such a crucial few minutes isn't it because he misses and then trossard scores but raya does so well there to kind of not i don't know because it's sort of like it's counterintuitive to not commit yourself because there's so much goal and like like you know but he does so well to to sort of
15:13Philippe Auclair:put doubt in fernandez's mind and the thing is that the fact that he's you can see it's quite extraordinary because he's rooted to the spot and usually when a keeper is rooted to the spot it means that he's thinking oh shit i don't stand a chance here and so and he tenses up he doesn't he's super relaxed he doesn't move and in fact you can almost feel matthews fernandez thinking well the keeper's going to do something the keeper's going to do something by the time he realizes shit i'd better i'd better shoot he's too close and he's got a i mean fantastic reaction I mean Robin I couldn't agree more with you I think he's been he's the player of the season for me for Arsenal ahead of Declan Rice or Gabriel he's the reason his golden gloves for the third season in a row which is insane he's only 6 '1 but he's superb in the air as well and on his line his distribution is the best that I've seen this season he's the best keeper in England he's the best keeper in Europe and for me there's absolutely no doubt about that whatsoever and the fact that he doesn't play for spain is one of the biggest mysteries in contemporary football i because okay he's got there's some other decent ones but he's he's absolutely extraordinary and his save was was absolutely phenomenal not just that save but as well on the other corner kicks the way he's able i mean despite being six foot one being able to punch the ball as it does every single time like 30 yards out i mean this guy is at the absolute top of his profession.
16:45I certainly wasn't one saying, I don't think he's as good as Aaron Ramsdale about four years ago. But, you know, we all make mistakes. OK, then, Barry, Arsenal have 79 points from 36. Man City have 74 from 35. But does that Arsenal performance, I mean, they could have scored a lot in the first 20 minutes, but then they did. I don't know if Arteta made a mistake taking Rice out of midfield and then corrected it, put him back in. And Odegaard made a big difference coming on. But did you see enough kind of there there to think actually it's not totally done. Like there'll be a little bit of them going, oh, Burnley played okay at the weekend.
17:20You know, Palace might be good. I don't know.
17:23Max Rushden:No, I thought it was done before this game and I certainly think it is now. I thought Arsenal would win a lot more comfortably than they did yesterday. But I can't see them messing it up. You feel the same, Philippe?
17:40Philippe Auclair:if i'm trying to be neutral if i try to bring my heartbeat down to a manageable level if i put on my fair objective observers suit on yes it's done i think so on paper it's done if i go back and my my soul goes back into my body as as barry said uh i'm still i think there's going to be more pain because you never know because you could for example a red card in the seventh minute a team that's already relegated and starts playing really well as we've seen Wolves for example do this year when honestly they didn't have a chance in hell and suddenly they take they get a few fantastic performances anything is possible I think Villa will completely fold up against Man City in the last game I don't think there's any chance they will do anything and for mean it will all depend on on that game at bournemouth for manchester city which is an incredibly difficult game against one of the informed teams of the season but on one hand yes i mean they're in the they really are in the driving seat and manchester city has receded from from the from the mirror but it ain't done before it is done you can still do a by oliver coosin it's never too late to do by oliver coosin yeah meanwhile at the bottom that result means Robin that Leeds and Forrest are definitely safe so it is a two-horse race West Ham have 36 points from 36 games Tottenham have 37 points from 35 games so as I've said hopefully Leeds went and got absolutely shit-faced last night you know who let it Calvin Lewin just said come on boys we're safe who cares about Tottenham away Opta only has has West Ham a 12 % chance of survival I obviously I don't think it's done but do you as a more objective viewer think okay it's done I wouldn't say it's done, but I think that's probably accurate just in terms of Spurs just look more confident.
19:40They look like they're playing with a bit more clarity under Deserby. Just the fact that they're not in the relegation zone now is a big thing. It would take like another collapse from Spurs, I think, which is I'm kind of a bit, you know, again, I have no allegiance to either of these sides. But I do think it's a bit sad. So I do think Nuno really did gave them a punch as chance, didn't he, West Ham United? And they've been slightly unlucky, but then they've turned in a couple of not great performances just for the international break. did their game against Aston Villa where they weren't very good and then just not clinical enough against Brentford, you know, big defeat there.
20:19So, yeah, it looks like it's going to be West Ham. But it's really fascinating tonight because, yes, Leeds might be hung over, but that is going to be a buoyant stadium, isn't it? And they can play with a bit of freedom. And whether that means that they're going to try some weird stuff and that will let Spurs in or they'll just be like free-flowing and absolutely batter Spurs. It's going to be interesting to see how they approach it. It's terrifying. But Van Cisie beat Brentford 3-0 on Saturday, moving them two points behind Arsenal until the West Ham game. They didn't score until the hour, Mark Barry.
20:54We don't need to do a whole lot on this, but I wonder what your take on it was.
20:59Max Rushden:God, it seems like so long ago now, doesn't it? Yeah. Again, like Arsenal against West Ham, I thought they made heavy-ish weather of it and they looked a bit nervy until Doku scored what is becoming his signature goal now again. And as soon as that pearled into the top corner, that was it. There was never any danger of them not winning and they went on to score two more. So it wasn't a brilliant City performance, but they did enough and that goal from Doku clearly settled their nerves and then they rolled their sleeves up. Yeah, Pep said, if you want to become a better player, you have to win games for yourself.
21:44It's not enough to make crosses for other ones. You have to win games and score goals. Everton, the goal for 3-3 was the right foot. The first goal was the left. He made an incredible step in that sense to say, I'm Jeremy Doku. I'm going to win games. Big players always have that mentality. Yeah. Oh, just on, there was a couple of issues that Arsenal fans, I think, would have, you know, Bernardo Silva, the sort of toddler sort of hitting the leg of Nathan Collins. Like when I told my son he can't have ice cream at nine in the morning, that was a bit like that, the sort of swipe at the leg. And I don't know.
22:15I mean, if he got sent off for that, I'd feel a bit, maybe just a timeout would have been sufficient. Yeah, the naughty step. And there was also a slight penalty, maybe, maybe not, you know. But yeah, it was a deserved win. But yeah, I think Barry's right. They weren't very convincing until that docket goal. Yeah, someone made a good point on social media that, you know, perhaps Bernardo Silva is just so much smaller than Nathan Collins that he has to really deliver like an almighty blow for it to count as some kind of punishment. Anyway, that'll do for part one. Part two, we'll begin at Anfields.
22:53Max Rushden:Business is booming, but you know what really helped? Zero, the accounting platform for small businesses. I used to think unpaid bills were just part of it. ugh but batch payments wow automated accounts payable even better all in one place that's a big one and i can keep track from my phone while i get the job done no bills in sight what a life do right by yourself and your business and search xero for your free trial conditions apply
23:33Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly. So the top of the table, below the top two, Man United 65 from 36. They're in the Champions League for sure. Liverpool have 59 from 36, as do Villa. Bournemouth 55, then Brighton 53, Brentford 51, Chelsea 49. Liverpool won, Chelsea won. And Barry booze for Arna Slott throughout this game. Not through the whole game, but at key moments.
23:56Max Rushden:Yeah, he was booed when he took off Rio and Gamora and said afterwards that he knew that was going to happen, but that Ngamua had indicated to him that he had cramp and wasn't able to continue. And then there were boos at the end, which I think were probably deserved. And boos at Anfield seem less pantomimish than, say, boos elsewhere. So it's worrying for Slott. And they weren't good. I mean, they started well and they scored, went ahead through that lovely Ryan Gravenberg strike. Then Enzo Fernandes slash Wesley Fofana equalized for Chelsea. And after that, it was all Chelsea. And this is not a good Chelsea team.
24:43Max Rushden:It's very disjointed. They came into the game on the back of six consecutive defeats. And they took over from there. And I think they were probably a little unlucky not to win the game. Each team had a goal correctly disallowed for offside in the second half. But it was an interesting game between two big teams whose supporters are both very dissatisfied with how things are going at their respective clubs. And Callum McFarlane will have emerged from the game with a lot more credit than Arna Slott. Chelsea were missing five wingers. So they played Cucurella in a more advanced role. as a kind of wing-back.
25:25Max Rushden:He was brilliant throughout. Because they didn't have much width, the midfield was quite congested, and Arnaud Slott admitted afterwards, oh, we just couldn't figure out how to play through them. And it's like, well, Arnaud, that's kind of your job to figure it out. God, Chelsea missing five wingers. I presume they'd have like 20 more. I saw they were rumoured to be in for Ethan Manieri, and you thought they can't be going for it. Just stop buying attacking wide players. Just please, young one, stop doing it. Now, Robin, I suggested to Barry yesterday that Arnaz Slott felt a bit like the air of Keir Starmer.
Read the full transcript
26:00Like, you know, not a terrible bloke. Not all his fault, but it's just people just aren't having it. You know, they're not having him. And I feel that with Slott a bit. They're just not having him. Barry did point out that he thinks Slott's done a better job than Starmer. Someone texted to say, I think Klopp left Liverpool in a slightly better state than the Tories left the country in. But the point remains that I'm just not sure the Liverpool fans are really, they're just not feeling it at all, are they? Well, as a BBC employee, I, of course, can't comment on any of that sort of stuff. But that's a great, great little conversation that you guys had on TalkSport.
26:34Yeah, it's an interesting one in terms of what do they do? Because clearly, I think it sounds like the board wants to keep him for a number of reasons, you know, financial and just, you know, a bit of consistency and to give him a bit more of a chance. But yeah, the tide has turned, doesn't it? As Barry was alluding to, there were boos. You know, there's one thing kind of social media dissent, but it's when the fans inside the stadium are turning, that's kind of an indication. But how much should you listen to supporters, you know, to make a decision? Difficult, isn't it? And, you know, he did deliver them the title.
27:09We've gone through many of the issues that have arisen this season. and he possibly hasn't helped himself with comments like Barry alluded to there, you know, about, you know, we find this difficult. It's like, well, yeah, you need to find a solution. So I feel a bit sorry for the guy, but it feels like if he is there next season, he probably won't be there long because if they start badly, then, yeah, it's really, it'll just be toxic, won't it? So, yeah, it's just interesting what the decision might be.
27:40Philippe Auclair:there's one thing that surprised me that game which by the way was of very very poor quality I thought certainly not the kind of technical level we would expect from two sides like that it's the fact that Liverpool haven't qualified for the Champions League yet you look at what they've got to do and and did you see any of the urgency that you would expect from the players on the pitch, when you know that you've got a place in the top five for the Champions League, which is definitely not done, if you look at what they've got left, especially they're playing Villa, Villa and Bonamuth can overtake them.
28:23Philippe Auclair:And did you feel any urgency? None. Absolutely zero. And zero intensity. And I'm a little bit, I mean, it comes to slot at Liverpool. I remember what we were all talking about last year. We were saying he's done the impossible thing, which is to take over a team which is not really his and turn it into a champion by becoming more pragmatic, by showing a Liverpool that is versatile, that can attack, that can defend, that is balanced and so forth. And then it's totally unraveled this season, totally unraveled. It's gone down. And because of his demeanor, I actually think that the man has behaved with great amount of dignity and frankness throughout the year.
29:09Philippe Auclair:They've had a rotten time with so many things, particularly with injuries. And I think maybe we have got to take that into consideration. And maybe that's why the Liverpool board is thinking, well, hold on a minute. Not everything has got according to plan this season. And there have been loads of problems. There was a Salah problem. There's the Isak problem. There's the Eketike problem. There's loads and loads of problems. And also there was a Marguerite problem as well, which is the fact that they didn't land the player that they perhaps needed the most. So you put all that together and maybe you can be a little bit more philosophical about it.
29:45Philippe Auclair:But again, the lack of intensity really surprised me when I think that there is a lot. This is not a game that is of no importance. It's not an ever-to-season. Well, we've qualified for Europe already, so foot off the gas, blah, blah, blah. It was not one of those. and that is worrying, I think. Liverpool have got Villa then and Brentford left to play. Villa have Liverpool and City to play and Bournemouth have City and Forest to play. I mean, it would be quite extraordinary, Robin, if Bournemouth managed to get into the top five, given they're four points behind with two games to go. But I guess it's not inconceivable.
30:20Not at all, because they're on this incredible run, aren't they? You know, they can't be beaten at the moment. And it's just, again, it's, you know, The coach has said he's leaving, Andoniero Alona, and nothing's happened. They're still performing to a really great level. I think, again, it just shows it's just a really well-run club. I do wonder about his decision to leave, especially if they get into the Champions League and he's thinking, I'm not going to be taking them. I mean, if we're going to go on to Fulham against Bournemouth. Yeah, please do. It's almost like you've hosted this podcast before.
30:57It could have gone either way, couldn't it? It was a kind of narrow, it was a narrow win for them. Two red cards, as Philippe alluded to earlier, sort of both of them possibly should have been given in the first instance. I know some people saying Anderson might have been a bit unlucky, but I think when you see it back, he's going, no. What's he doing? 10 against 11, it's insane challenge, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, no madness, sort of off the floor. And that was after Ryan Christie. It was great. They had a little shot of Steve Clarke, who always looks pretty annoyed. He was just like, yeah, don't be doing that.
31:28Don't be doing that. at the summer for Leeds, Ryan. Ryan scored the goal for Bournemouth. It looked like Bernardo possibly should have saved it, but maybe took a nick on its way through. And yeah, it's just, yeah, again, Bournemouth just really well run. As I say, Iriola, they've already got a new guy in place. But I just wonder if they get into the Champions League, if he'll start to sort of look a bit regretful. I'm not sure. Yeah, can he say to Marco Rosa, actually, mate? I'm not, you know, like the house falls through. They've just fallen through. And he's like, what? I thought I was... No.
32:01I mean, look, Villa are in the Europa League final. Obviously, they hammered Forrest on Thursday night after we last recorded, which is a massive result for them. And they play Freiburg, and they'll be big favourites, Barry, for that. But they couldn't beat Burnley, who did play with a bit of freedom, I was thinking ahead to the Arsenal game. So it'll be really interesting to see what Villa do in these last two games, of course, because the Europa League final is sandwiched between Liverpool at home and then Man City away.
32:26Max Rushden:Yeah, I mean, there are two tough games. Unai Emery, I'd imagine he was upset with the result against Burnley, but he wasn't upset by the performance. Most of the players who played against Forrest on Thursday featured here as well, and they weren't terrible. And Burnley, I think, were much better than everyone expected. Burnley did miss a couple of good chances. Ian Fleming missed two. He probably should have scored before he did score. and not a catastrophic result for Villa but yeah, Liverpool home, City away, they're tricky enough. But I guess, what do they need from that? Two points, three, it's hard to know.
33:10If I could do the maths quickly, I mean, the most that Bournemouth can get is 58-61. So one win will do it for them, won't it? It just feels like they've chucked in the Premier League, Villa, a little bit. A little bit. But, you know, Emery knows what he's doing And actually that performance was brilliant against Forrest, wasn't it, Robin? You know, and John McGinn, who's so crucial to them. Like his two goals were both brilliant in this game, I thought. Oh, man. I mean, I think he might be, I mean, it's kind of recency bias. He might be one of the most important players Villa have had. He's just, you know, he signed from Hibs in 2018 when they were in the championship.
33:42And he's now like, he's captain. He's been there for ages and he's so important. When he's not there, they just don't perform. They don't function as well. What a player. and yeah it was one of those games where Forest just were powerless weren't they to prevent what was happening to them. I just think and I know Ana Emery is you know a specialist in winning this tournament but it's a one-off game they will be favourites against Freiburg I just feel like they do need to secure that Champions League in the Premier League and they all look just like they drop their level a bit and they're sort of waiting for this final and yeah Liverpool at home and then it's the final and then it's away to Man City.
34:21So, yeah. And also a bit like Arsenal in the Champions League. If Villa go into that game with Champions League confirmed, it changes how they play it. Whereas if Arsenal have won the Premier League and they go in the Champions League final, it's a totally different vibe to, you know, to what happens if they don't win it from here. Brighton beat Wolves 3-0. Brighton are on a very good run. Oh, they're on a very good run. I don't know if you remember Herzl was under pressure at some point earlier in the season. They're in seventh, two points behind Bournemouth. Yes, Philippe?
34:46Philippe Auclair:Yeah, no, I wanted to make a point of that because I was remembering, oh, all this Fabian Oetzler is under pressure, is criticized. I was wondering, well, when was that? And that was in February. That was like yesterday when they had a series. They only won one game out of 13 between the 30th of November, 2025 and the 21st of February of 2026. and at the time people were saying that he was running out of time and was under pressure for his job. And I think many people are feeling a bit silly now, but one win out of 13 and to be in the position there now, obviously that's actually a great quality for a manager is to be able to actually right the ship as he did and did it with conviction and playing some lovely football.
35:39Max Rushden:He's just signed a new three-year deal as well. to keep him there until 2029. So by the end of that deal, he'll be 18 years old, which is good, isn't it? Sorry, Robin. Wolves had kickoff and they also had a throw in and they still conceded after 35 seconds, which is pretty impressive.
35:57Philippe Auclair:Edwards used the word to describe the beginning of the game, which I'd never heard a manager. He didn't say it was bad or terrible. He said it was despicable. Despicable, yeah. You don't hear that very often. A despicable start to the game. Right, that'll do for part two. Part three, we'll rattle through the Premier League and then we'll do Fitbar Corner, EFL, Women's Air Cup, semifinals and more.
36:21Max Rushden:I'm Kai Wright. I'm Kai Sherman. And we are here to tell you about our new show, which is rooted in this feeling that at least I have, I know you have, where, you know, it's kind of like when you wake up in the morning and you pick up your phone and you're just hit in the face with a fire hose of news, right? There's war. There's authoritarianism. Our planet is burning. I could go on and on and on. And on and on and on. But like we're trying to figure out how to manage it, right? Like how do you manage it? I manage it by leaning in and trying to learn more and trying to figure out, okay, how can I be smarter about this particular topic?
36:58Max Rushden:And who can I talk to that's going to make me feel better about it? And who can tell me who's responsible for the mess that I'm reading about? So that's our mission. That's the show. Welcome to Stateside with Kai and Carter. We're a new show from The Guardian. We're talking to big thinkers and the best journalists, just trying to understand the world through smart conversation and honest reporting. We don't have billionaires telling us what to say. Stateside with Kyan Carter will come out three times a week, Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, starting May 13th. Follow on Apple Podcasts or catch us wherever you watch or listen.
37:40Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly. So Palace 2, Everton 2 in a game that doesn't mean a whole lot. Everton without a win in five or so. So they've slipped out of the chance to get into the Champions League. Could still get Europe. It was a really good game, Barry, this, wasn't it? And on a different day, maybe we'd give it more than the 30 seconds I'm allotting to you.
37:58Max Rushden:Yes, it was a good game. James Tarkowski scored a goal that wasn't with his head, which is probably a quite rare occurrence. Thomas Tuchel was there to watch probably two of England's goalkeepers. I would say Jordan Pickford was the more impressive of the two. Yeah, if Illaman and Jai's international manager was present, he will be concerned by the number of chances Illaman is missing at the moment. He could have had three or four in Everton's last game, and he should have scored here as well, one or two, I think. Oh, Adam Wharton obviously will have caught Tuchel's eye. he sent a long range effort fizzing narrowly wide of the upright I would say a draw was probably a fair result Oh sorry and Mr.
38:48Max Rushden:Beto who I have criticised in the past he has hit a rich vein of form I still think Everton are going to need be in the market for the striker next season but Beto and Tiernan O 'Berry have both improved as the season has progressed but I'm still not sure David Moyes quite fancies either of them. Palace are into the Conference League final as we expected they beat Shakhtar Donetsk 2-1 on Thursday night so they play Vreo Vercano on the 27th of May and Sid saying them getting to a European final is the greatest thing of all time and he's on the pod tomorrow so we will talk to him about their journey.
39:25Forrest Drew with Newcastle it means they're safe Elliot Anderson scoring late on against his former club two lovely goals actually in this game Philippe I thought.
39:32Philippe Auclair:Yeah well particularly the Anderson goal was remarkable, especially considering the state he was in at the time, because I've never seen a player celebrating by cramping in both legs as he did. Yeah, I know. Obviously, it was the end of the end at the end of his tether. And no, an absolutely remarkable one. Another example of why he probably won't be with that club next season, because he's going to be snapped up, isn't he?
39:57Max Rushden:It's probably worth noting he buried his mum on, I think it was Thursday or Friday as well. or would it be Friday I think so yeah he's showed a tremendous amount of character in the last few weeks yeah you saw it with his celebration he was yeah you know we send our love to him of course Sunderland 0 Manchester United 0 Philippe you wanted a word on Bruno Fernandes winning the Football Writers Football of the Year did he get your vote?
40:25Philippe Auclair:no no because I hesitated between Declan Rice and David Raya I wouldn't say that it's not a scandal because he's been absolutely fantastic in a team that has been far from fantastic from the beginning of the season. It's an individual award, so you can understand that. But I think because there's been quite a lot of controversy about it, a bit silly controversy, I must say, one of the problems of those awards is the fact that it's the voting system. When you vote for one person and you've got a team like Arsenal in which you've got not one outstanding player, but you've got three or four who are going to divide the vote it's obviously going to favor the players who are quite simply heads and shoulders over everybody else so as Bruno Fernandes is with Manchester United who are back in the Champions League and if they are back in the Champions League it's not just because of Michael Carrick it's especially because of this man Bruno Fernandes so it's not a scandal but I didn't vote for him that's fine also not a scandal.
41:28Max Rushden:I do wonder why most of the outrage over the Football Writers Association award seems to be generated by people who have little or no time for any football writers. So I'm not sure why they're that bothered by what the football writers are saying. I'm not a member of the Football Writers Association, so I didn't vote for anyone, but I could kind of see, I think Philippe but it's explained adequately why it wasn't ridiculous that Bruno Fernandes got it. It's almost like individual boards aren't really the point of football, isn't it? Yeah. Anyway, to Scotland then. So on Saturday, Hearts went to Motherwell, which is not an easy game.
42:10They were 1-0 down. They drew one apiece, but they couldn't get a winner. And then Celtic played Rangers on Sunday afternoon. Rangers took the lead, and then Celtic eventually won it 3-1, including Barry an absolutely amazing overhead kick from Days of Maeda and so with two games to go Hearts have 77 and Celtic have 76 and they have to play each other on the final day of the season
42:33Max Rushden:yeah it's great isn't it I think everyone with a few notable exceptions wants Hearts to win it everyone wants a final day showdown I believe Celtic are now favourites to win the title I hope they don't. I've no beef with Celtic at all. I just love to see hearts. I want to see Ewan Murray happy. I don't think I've ever seen that before. He was like a different person on the pod the last week, wasn't he? I want to see what it's like. Happy Ewan Murray. We'll go into detail on that, but we must talk about Spygate. So, look, Borough and Southampton drew 0-0. Before that, Hull drew 0-0 with Millwall.
43:14So the second legs tonight and tomorrow are all to play for. But the EFL has charged Southampton with spying on Middlesbrough. A Southampton performance analyst is alleged to have recorded Middlesbrough training and taken pictures of tactics on Thursday morning. He was caught in the bushes or he was chanced upon by one of the Middlesbrough coaching staff. He ran away, ran into a little house and changed into a separate outfit he had. The EFL released a statement saying that Southampton has been charged with a breach of EFL regulations. then other clubs since that have shared with the guardian their surprise at the ease with which southampton adapted to supposedly unexpected team shapes and appeared to second guess set peace routines during an unbeaten run of 19 games towards the end of the season so yes tonda you saw this idea of and there's so many parts to this robin which are you know it is cheating but it's also incredibly funny of you know southampton players like constantly playing matches going how did he know that like how did he possibly know Birmingham were going to do this how do you know that Rex how did he know that Sheffield United were going to do this and then you've obviously got just a man in the bushes like and then Southampton saying of which I don't know if they're sticking to this for now is he was a lone wolf like which what Southampton training someone went anyway anyone know where Alan is where's Alan gone and they're like he's just thinking I'm doing this oh they'll be super proud of me anyway it's it is hilarious it's very it's
44:40Max Rushden:It's very Ted Lasso. You can imagine Nick Muhammad's character. Yeah, totally. He could be hiding in a bush with surveillance equipment. Essentially, football is a soap opera, right? This is why we all love football. And this is a repeat storyline, isn't it? This is bringing Dirty Den back, right? So they've run out of ideas, football. The only thing, the only big twist left is that it's actually Marcelo Bielsa. For some reason, he's doing it. Don't know why, just in his spare time. They're bringing back Harold Bishop. It's just, you're right, Max, it's cheating. It's also so funny and just feed it to my veins.
45:22I just love all this stuff. And yes, maybe they've got an advantage, but Borough had 21 shots in this game and this has been the story of their season that they're just a bit wasteful. And I'm not sure how much spying would have prevented that. Maybe they know exactly where they're going to shoot and they need to be in the right position. But yeah, it's obviously, you know, Middlesbrough is going to take this very seriously. But yeah, it's great stuff, isn't it? It's great stuff for us neutrals.
45:55Philippe Auclair:What is the punishment for spying in football? Is he going to be expelled? when Bielsa did it the Leeds derby playoff there was no precedent and there was nothing in the rules I think because they just never thought anyone would be bothered to go to someone's training ground with some binoculars and then obviously Bielsa just said yeah of course you know why wouldn't I do it which is different to how Southampton have reacted and he got a£200 ,000 fine or Leeds did and he paid it himself but since then the punishment has been brought in and the interesting thing is like you know Borough boss Kim Helberg argues that a fine would be insufficient you know Because you get to the Premier League, it's, what,£200 million now.
46:34And so what do they do? It's egregious enough, Barry, that if they're found guilty, I don't think that they could have complaints for being thrown out. However funny it is, it's also cheating. They could find that out. Someone suggested to us yesterday that Middles should have a penalty for the first kick of the second leg, which I think would be amazing.
46:54Max Rushden:I don't think they could have any complaints about being slung out. they obviously would complain but I think those complaints would be spurious but then there's also the case that Chelsea have been caught cheating on a mass scale they got a fine Manchester City are accused of cheating on a industrial level across over several years we don't know yet what's going to happen to them is what is a man standing in a bush with a pair of binoculars more or less serious than the other kind of financial chicanery and do-hickory, probably not. But I totally get Kim Helberg's anger, and I thought Tom Deckard, his manner of dealing with it in his post-match press conference, which was basically to refuse to answer questions, was poor.
47:49Max Rushden:He was probably acting on instructions from his overlords. But I definitely think there's a case for them to be slung out of the playoffs and just for Middlesbrough to get the spot in the final. And if it turns out that this isn't a one-off event, then absolutely throw the book at them.
48:10Philippe Auclair:Wasn't that the case that something similar happened in Formula 1? And with spying as well, and that was taken very seriously. And in fact, yes, I mean, my memory tells me, my very bad memory tells me that the team that was responsible for that actually was deducted points. And I have to say that if it is proven, and if they've done it regularly as well throughout the season, I agree with Barry. It's really funny, and it's not funny at all at the same time when you know what depends, you know what hangs on that particular game. so uh yeah with formula one what does i'm just reporting back and it's it's true mclaren cars go really fast is that what is that what the spine was i've come back and the brabhams are
48:57Max Rushden:going really quickly guys we've got to watch it no it would all be car design and no i know i know i was being facetious i was being facetious about it was a joke it didn't land sorry you can't win them all you can't win them all that's okay yeah no and i also i suppose reputationally for tondra record if it turns out that he's basically just a spy he's not actually a football manager at all he's done a really good job of disguising himself as a football manager he's jackson lamb just one dirty trick after another just sitting there farting away you know in his office stuck in southampton yeah i mean it's an extraordinary story and we did suggest maybe you know the when it broke on saturday and we're on the radio we're like maybe they should all like he should dress as Columbo or Miss Marple or Magnum or you know who not a detective actually needs to be a spy of course we were trying to think of someone who wasn't James Bond but I suppose another interesting point that we donate is how high up does it go is it a lone wolf seems unlikely is it from the manager like does it how many people up the chain know because Kim Helberg actually spoke really well Barry I thought when he he said look it's not the players and it's certainly not the fans it's a bit like you don't control who owns your club you certainly don't control who goes spying on behalf of your club, do you?
50:14Max Rushden:The lone wolf is clearly imparting his information to somebody else. It's not for his own records, is it? Who is getting the information and what are they doing with it? Tonda Rekker going, don't tell me, don't tell me, don't tell me this. Anyway. Well, and also they have the perception, if they go up, if they go up and they've just been fined, people are going to, the perception is going to be like, well, you didn't deserve promotion. that's true but then i suppose if they do go up then what happens you just then you have to like not only do you hire like you know performance analysts you don't have to hire like your own spies right you know like every premier league club needs to have like yeah like like former mi5 agents who are just checking that some student at cambridge would get a tap on the shoulder from Matt Letizia or Jason Dodd.
51:09Philippe Auclair:And Rupert Lowe when we're at it. Yeah. Oh, God. Anyway, that was the championship. We will see what happens with that, of course. They need to expedite the process because it's normally a 14-day process, but obviously that feels a bit too long to work out what to do with this. In League One, Stevenage nil Stockport one, injury time winner for Ben Osborne. and it's a very funny goal if you haven't seen it. It's not funny for Stevenage but their centre-back trips on the ball twice at different parts of the game. A Stockport player falls over so all the Stevenage fans cheer and then the Stevenage defender trips over and then Ben Osborne just puts it in.
51:45Bolton beat Bradford 1-0. Could have been two at least but they have an advantage. In League 2, Solford won 2-1 at Grimsby and Chesterfield missed a penalty and lost 1-0 at home to Notts County. To the play-off final at Wembley for the National League, Rochdale, if you remember, were second on 160 points. That would be sad. He gained second on that. 106 points. And then they had that ridiculous final day against York. They had a playoff final against Boreham Wood. They were 2-0 down, equalised in the 97th minute. I think it was the same guy who scored the header against York, who scored in the 97th minute.
52:21Rochdale didn't invade the pitch, which is probably lucky. And then they won on penalties. But I don't know if you've seen the highlights, anyone. It was amazing, Barry.
52:30Max Rushden:Yeah, well, it's like you say, a 97th minute equaliser. Dizzy Rue nodded home across, sparked jubilation, obviously, among the Rochdale fans. They had a chance to win it an extra time, didn't take it, and then won it pretty comfortably on penalties. I think Boreham Wood missed three. There was a player for Boreham Wood, Abdou Malik. I think he was outstanding, sort of budget Jeremy Doku, I would say. That's probably been unkind to him. But he was the standout player on the pitch and didn't deserve to be on the losing team. But, you know, life isn't fair, is it? No, it isn't. Women's FA Cup semi-finals were also both incredibly exciting.
53:15Robin, you were at Chelsea Man City. Chelsea two up with four minutes to go. Yeah, and then they ended up losing. Before that, Liverpool with 2-0 up and Brighton won 3-2 right in the last minute. So, yeah, really dramatic day. And the big thing is that Bunny Shaw, who Manchester City look like they're going to lose. She's their record scorer. She's an incredible striker. And just, I mean, don't know the ins and outs, but basically mismanagement from Man City. They've let her contract run down. I believe she wanted to stay. But Chelsea look like they're in pole position to sign her because they're offering her a longer term deal as well as more money.
53:53and she was the one who put Chelsea out. So she scored the equalised to send it to extra time and then she scored the winner. So yeah, again, just these storylines just make it even more compelling. But yeah, two really great semifinals. Chelsea having a long contract is a surprise. Yeah, and she took both her goals really well there. Yes, Philippe?
54:10Philippe Auclair:Yeah, and that's not that we haven't mentioned it. She's been voted the Women's Footballer of the Year and there was no controversy. I think that was a plebiscite, basically, that she's just been absolutely amazing. Obviously, Guardian Women's Football Weekly out tomorrow. So listen to that. Subscribe to it. It's great. Philippe Sid's on tomorrow to talk about Barcelona beating Real Madrid, Rashford scoring, then winning La Liga. You wanted to talk about that and the Kylian Mbappe petition for him to go because he went on a mini break to Sardinia and I suppose some other things. Yeah, I mean, the thing, yeah, it's just absolutely ridiculous.
54:43Philippe Auclair:The fact is what really concerns me about this petition, which has now got something like 73 million signatures, is that it's been given an awful lot of acreage and space in the media and in people who should know better about what's going on. It's an absolute scandal what's going on here. There aren't 72 million people who have signed this petition. It's all done with bots and AI. And the fact that it's taken seriously is indicative of a serious problem in the way we cover news. It's absolute bollocks. The whole petition thing is bollocks. The people who have signed are not verified. The whole operation probably just cost a few hundred euros to set up everything.
55:27Philippe Auclair:Because believe me, no petition has ever required, for anything has ever required that type of number of signatures in such a short space of time. And the problem is that we can dismiss it because it's ludicrous. It's utterly ludicrous. But the problem is that it's not being dismissed. And if you do a search, if you look at the websites, websites, if you look at the papers, it's everywhere and taken seriously. It shouldn't be. It's utter bollocks. So I was going to say, does anyone take it? Is anyone really taking it seriously? I understand, but does anyone really take petitions seriously? There are so many petitions for everything and you think, wow, this is all bullshit.
56:04I mean, like who is, even if Marco or whoever are reporting on it. This is Real Madrid.
56:10Philippe Auclair:So it has consequences as well on the player. And I'm not saying that because I'm a huge fan of Kylian Mbappé, about whom I've written a terrific book, which is just out, and which you can find in old, decent bookshops. But it is being taken seriously because the headlines are 70, at the beginning, like 2 million people, Timon Mbappé being sold, which becomes 70 to 75. And it's taken, yeah, it's taken seriously. It's a degradation in the way that we cover news, basically, which I find very concerning. I'm sure it's water for Duxback when it comes to Kiliad himself. He doesn't care about that. And the Real Madrid people, that's not exactly what they're going to base any decision on.
56:54Philippe Auclair:But the fact is somebody is able to create all these bots, use fake email addresses, and find whatever they're doing, this campaign, becoming a top item, a top news item absolutely everywhere, and being taken seriously by an awful lot of people who don't understand how this can be put together. and I think that is really concerning yeah well we'll do more with Sid on that tomorrow but that will do for today managed to get through a lot well done everybody thank you Barry thank you cheers Robin thanks Max merci monsieur Eau Claire bonne chance pour Arsenal etc de rien de rien monsieur Rochden thank you very much it's nice that you were the one who forgot to speak French rather than me in that moment I enjoyed that tremendously maybe he's not French at all he's the spy Football Weekly is produced by Silas Gray.
57:44Our executive producer is Joel Grove and we'll be back tomorrow.
57:59This is The Guardian.