Arsenal take on Chelsea and deadline-day chaos: Football Weekly Extra

0:00Seb Hutchinson:This is The Guardian.

0:30who nicked Iliunem Dye as well. Not sure you can blame him for agreeing personal terms with Spurs, checking the table and saying, I might stay up north. City host Coventry. Everton haven't had a great window. Following Balogun changing his mind at the last minute. They've got Manchester United at home. Forrest got a point last week. They host 0-point Spurs. How will Mikhailo Mudric get on? Back under to Zerbi. Bradley Barkley's Liverpool go to Ipswich, while 100 % record Hull City play 0 % record Aston Villa. We'll look at the rest. Look air to the start of the WSL. Look back at a full EFL program.

0:57What a win for the Hughes at Bradford. We'll take your questions and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.

1:06On the panel today, Robin Cowan, welcome. Hi, Max. Hello, Seb Hutchinson. Hello. Fresh from a huge ovation as he walked on stage in Dublin, the homecoming gig for Barry Glendening. Welcome, Barry. Hi, Max. How are you? Yeah, I'm good, thanks. Does it make you feel 10 feet tall? The cheer for Glendening is twice what the rest of us normal folk get.

1:28Max Rushden:Yeah, I think it's getting quieter every time. Okay. Still, it's still good. Cling on while you can. Arsenal-Chelsea, 4.30 Sunday then. It's a massive game this, Seb. And it's not a title decider. But it'll be fascinating to see how it goes.

1:46Seb Hutchinson:Yes, I've covered Chelsea already this season. And their attack looks great. You know, their front three looks electric. And that's something that probably from an Arsenal point of view, that their supporters are... not feeling great about in terms of where they invested in the transfer market. But what we also saw from Arsenal last time out was their ability to see a result over the line. They probably look the most ready side in terms of big games and getting results in big games of all the contenders for the competition. But because Manchester City and Chelsea have spent so much, even though they've taken so much in, they are still unknown on whether they can click and go on a run.

2:26Seb Hutchinson:And this is, of course, the best... way to test that is that Chelsea going to Arsenal knowing that they have an attack that of course can score against Arsenal but Arsenal fantastic defensively yeah and actually Baz Chelsea look quite open don't know if Caicedo is fit they don't have uh Monaco's Lamin Kamara because Monaco pulled the plug at the last minute it'll be interesting to see if they can contain us

2:49Max Rushden:yeah they've um what shipped five goals in their two Premier League games so far scored seven but they do look a bit porous at the back. Their record in the Premier League against Arsenal is not good. I think they've lost seven and drawn three of the last nine but this is a pretty similar Arsenal to the one of last season or more or less identical Arsenal but a fairly different Chelsea with a new boss. So I'm looking forward to this one. And Arsenal will probably win. They weren't particularly impressive against Villa, but they got it over the line, as Seb said. And that's what it's all about, I suppose, these early stages of the season.

3:36Max Rushden:But yeah, it could be good. Yeah, I mean, I guess worst case, Robin, is Arsenal's excellent defence just snuffs out Chelsea and they win 1-0. And then we're just like, oh, really? We want Chelsea to win 5-4 or something like that. Well, another feature of this Chelsea team is that they don't have the ball much. do they? They have extremely low possession in both of their opening games. So, yeah, it could be quite boring, couldn't it? It could be Arsenal with the, as I know some fans have dubbed it, is it the shoehorn of death? You know, the passing around, you know, just the possession stats racking up, the pass completion.

4:11But then, yes, electric on the break, Chelsea. So would it not be more a horseshoe of death than a horseshoe? Yeah, it is a horseshoe. Sorry, I got that wrong. I was trying to work out how it was shoehorned. Sorry for shoehorning that in, but if you actually played football like a shoehorn, you'd be quite back and forth. It's not an important point. No, that's true. No, you're absolutely right to pull me up on it. Thank you. So, yeah, the horseshoe of death. And, yeah, as I say, I think it could potentially be quite boring, but Chelsea aren't very boring so far. So, yeah, I guess we'll see. Yeah, the Arsenal thing is interesting, isn't it?

4:44Because they do look a bit light now. I don't think the Martinelli deal has gone through yet, but it looks like he's on his way. they've let Waniere Jesus go and Trossard obviously earlier in the window and you know this pursuit of Vinny Jr Julian Alvarez and Morgan Rogers didn't come to fruition I think title winning teams generally have the best defences but you do wonder you know if they might lack the goals which they obviously didn't last season but you know there have been concerns just slightly still people saying unconvinced by by Jokeres Kai Havertz though is fit you know he missed most of the last season so yeah I think I agree with Seb they're in good shape but if they do fall slightly short then this might be pointed out as the reason yeah possibly I'm it's amazing that Arteta and Alonso were I wrote a piece about having an existential crisis about going to watch Cambridge United you know with one of my oldest friends and back when we were nine we were talking about which division we'd play in and there's Arteta and Alonso as mates probably having the same conversation but they actually did it you know and now they are managing against each other um so what do you make of the enzo uh deal i'm glad the transfer window is over as a

5:54Seb Hutchinson:commentator we love it when that slams shut because it's just a pain and you post a like a emotional picture of you looking tired or like on a private yacht saying what a magical three months this has been the window closes yeah we can do nothing until january performative stuff no i don't no i didn't do that i should do that should i know yeah people would lap that did somebody else i mean i think i saw quite a few of those you know the season is over and you're like no it's it isn't i love the season is not over it's like that it's just started it's funny there's more from the point of view of when you're doing a game and you have to always you don't want to get involved in hearsay but you feel you have to because it becomes what everybody's talking about you know this person you know there's question marks about their future and just it's it's done now for a few months well i say you know people still keep that alive enzo fernandez fascinating actually because already he's riling up chelsea supporters because of his move to city because of the way his unveiling works but this is the whole world we live in with this building up of of a narrative when really it's just somebody who's just moved somewhere else for probably better pay i don't know it's hard to tell with chelsea but better pay probably felt he wants to work with the person he worked with before and he's going to get booed everywhere he goes anywhere so it doesn't really matter does it if he moves now and what I still not quite sure about is how it's going to work at Manchester City because heavy investments if you heavily invest in somebody like Boadi for example and you look in the shape of that midfield you've heavily invested in Anderson and Fernandes so the idea is is the idea eventually you play all three is there going to be a gentle rotation where Boadi comes in over a few months if you have that eventual midfield so where does Cherky play his part in that and then Phil Foden having done this their game against Palace it was interesting Foden finds it difficult in wide areas we know that from an England point of view but when he went central and Cherky went off he was great in that role that's probably where he wants to play but Cherky's been City's best player so far so how Enzo Fernandes fits into that will be interesting to see yeah that is interesting Robin isn't it because you know City played Coventry and Bawadi I guess is is the most Rodri light I mean I don't know a lot about Bawadi I can't claim to have watched years of him playing he's only 18 it would be I wasn't watching him when he was an under 11 player it would be weird yeah but Anderson isn't a Rodri replacement and Enzo isn't a Rodri replacement doesn't mean you shouldn't buy other good players no i mean is is enzo mareska a pep replacement i think you know is he going to try and do things slightly differently even though they do look very similar um you know the bald bloke with beard is kind of now very in vogue isn't it um as football manager yeah and it is very interesting i think it would be remiss of us not to not to talk about you know these charges that still they've spent so much money again although they've i think it was 458 million but they 300 million in sales you know it's still positive net so I mean it's yeah it's again sort of maddening we're still waiting and just on the Coventry game you know obviously they'll be heavy heavy favourites really tough start for Coventry but I see it's the first meeting since 2002 when they met in the second tier and it was Kevin Keegan in charge Manchester City yeah it has been Baz for Coventry to lose that game to Hull in between these two it's a brutal start for them

9:29Max Rushden:Oh, it is. We pointed this out in our season preview that they had a horror start and the whole game was really important for them and they didn't particularly turn up for it. I mean, Coventry have spent, I read somewhere, they've spent more in this window than they have in their entire history. Really? Yeah. I think 130 million in total. It's hard to know whether they've spent well or not. only time will tell, but it looks like they're going to struggle to get goals. They've brought in experience in the form of Taiyo Wanyi, but he's not a particularly prolific striker, hasn't been here. They've brought in experience in the shape of Ethan Pinnock in their defence.

10:18Max Rushden:Hadji Wright hasn't played for them yet this season because he's not fit. So we'll see how he gets on when he comes back from injury. And they've brought in a, I think it's a striker, Siddiqui Sharif from Fenerbahce. So he may be good, he may not be. But they already look like they're out of their depth. But it is obviously too early to write them off. I would be astonished if they get something for this game. Yeah, sometimes maybe good, sometimes maybe shit. It's the greatest ever quote from anyone in football. Thank you, Gennaro Gattuso. Everton Man United, Seb. I mean, somebody, Lee underscore EFC, who has sort of an Everton Twitter account, just posted Everton's window.

11:06They now have one left-back, Mikalenko. They loaned out their reserve left-back. They've got one right-back, Ainsley Maitland-Niles, who I had forgotten the existence of, my apologies, sold their reserve right-back, Patterson. They've got one striker, Barry. They sold Beto. Balligan left without signing his contract. Tammy Abraham rejected them. Zerksi wanted to join, but they left it too late. They sold and died to Man City, he says, for peanuts. It's a lot of peanuts. Attempted to sell Armstrong to Forrest. An injured Norgard passed his medical. David Moyes wanted a bigger squad. Now he's got a smaller squad.

11:38Only 18 senior players left. Seems, doesn't seem perfect as a window.

11:43Seb Hutchinson:No, but you mentioned the Manchester City charges. You have to remember that Everton was one of the teams to be deducted points not that long ago. And I still think as a club, they are still acting with that mindset of, we have to be careful with our finances because they'll come after us because they did before because a club that essentially found themselves in a difficult situation by overspending by going big in the transfer market and of course David Moyes would like more players in but there is almost something in the idea of just standing still for a second and seeing how you get on and I know it sounds crazy and they could find themselves in a difficult situation but if they do have a massive gamble and it doesn't pay off they could be in a far worse situation now that's because of david moy's dogs of war you know return to that dunkirk spirit everton could be good and even even greelish coming in even the fact he wants to go there feels that they he felt wanted there and maybe somebody like beto didn't and that's why he's gone and and i think this is part of it they have to have that sense that we'll be okay because so much is brought into the players that you bring in so much people add so much to that oh they've brought in all these players they've done good business how do we know we just don't know until those teams are out there now they will be worried of course they will but there is a i think a general thing in the premier league of of course the money that's been spent how are these clubs able to spend it is there a credit issue here and is it going to bite a lot of clubs on the proverbial bum because I think it is strange the amount of money you mentioned commentary there of course the Premier League has money but does it have that much money for a club to invest in that way and clubs who come up feel they have to do it so we'll see with Everton because I don't think anybody's backing them to go down I haven't heard anybody feeling that they're going to be in that bottom three if they are in that situation come around Christmas time then maybe they'll push for it but otherwise I still have hope for them that they'll do okay but it depends what they want

13:45Max Rushden:what do they actually want I didn't have everything to go down in my season preview I thought about it and then I thought they'd be okay I think they might go down now that this window is closed I think their fans are furious I say David Moyes is apoplectic with what happened on the deadline day because it looked like they were having a good window. They brought in Hayden Hackney, brought in Christian Neurgard, Brennan Johnson. It looked like fan power had struck a blow last weekend when they shelved their plan to sell Harrison Armstrong, their real bright new prospect. Angus Kinnear had been talking up Illumin and Jai, saying, well, we want to keep him.

14:29Max Rushden:We've no intention of selling him. And then on deadline day, they sell in Jai. They sell Beto. And they failed to bring in for Florent Balogun, who I think possibly wanted to orchestrate another Balogun affair that he hoped might overshadow the Balogun affair from the World Cup, which I suspect he really doesn't want his name associated with. Just keep a low profile following. Come on. So following Borla, he turned up, did his medical. There was an issue with it. Everton were going to back out of the deal. Then Monaco lowered the price, I think. And the deal was more or less done. And then Balogun apparently took exception to the way he was treated during his medical at Finch Farm and pulled out of the deal.

15:17Max Rushden:Now, there's nothing Everton can do about that, but then they scrambled to try and get Joshua Zerksi, who Manchester United wouldn't sell, and Tammy Abraham, who didn't want to go. That's another one. That's a bit odd because Unai Emery clearly doesn't want him at Villa, but he's decided to stay there anyway. He would have got game time at Everton, so I don't know what that says about his ambition. So I think what was shaping up to be an OK transfer window for Everton turned into an absolute shambles at the end of it. Moyes is left with one striker, Thierry N 'Barry, who's very raw, very hit and miss, very patchy.

15:53Max Rushden:And Moyes, I think, has made it pretty clear he doesn't rate him particularly. Now, he got off to a good start this season, but we saw he was back to his usual last time out. So I think this has been a dreadful window for Everton. And deadline day was a shambles, and the fans are fed up. The freaking group who owned them and their CEO, Kinnear, they'll be getting... I cannot wait for David Moyes' press conference tomorrow, and that is a sentence I don't think I've ever said before. Get the popcorn out. And we'll possibly never see again.

16:33Seb Hutchinson:Can I just get one thing right, though, by the way? Please. I don't think Everton had a good winter. Of course not. But I do think that doesn't mean there's going to be problems for them necessarily. Yeah. I mean, I suppose we just, and we've said it before, I think we say it quite a lot. But, you know, these players that you don't really think about because they're not going anywhere or they're not unsettled. You know, like Dewsbury Hall has started the season brilliantly. You know, they have some good players. But I agree. They look light. A couple of injuries. That's a big problem. They might be able to persuade Seamus Coleman to come out of retirement.

17:04Get him and Tony Hibbert. Man United's first transfer deadline day where they haven't brought a single player. They tried to get Ryan Aitnori from Man City. They were put off by City's ask of an obligation to buy. Yeah, it doesn't show you really want someone, does it? You know, that's not like... It's a bit sad for Ryan when they're like, yeah we want you but we don't we don't want to be obliged to not forever and they had a weird look they've had a slightly odd start haven't they because they they they were terrible at hole they were pretty bad for an hour against it and then they turned it on after getting some a real load of luck to to turn that game around so this will be quite an interesting test for them yeah it will be because it's kind of first sort of i guess established premier league opposition isn't it?

17:52I think that the main thing for them is that they have one left back, Luke Shaw, who I read yesterday actually had started every single Premier League game last year, which is pretty remarkable given his injury record. They have Mazraoui who can play there and Dalo who seems to, you know, you can play on both. But yeah, they seem a bit light as well. It's just all about Bruno Fernandes, isn't it? And whether he can continue doing absolutely everything in the team because he's just he's one of the best players in the Premier League so I think yeah if David Moyes can manage to galvanize and make his team angry I suppose that maybe they have a chance but yeah it depends it could boil over.

18:37Seb Hutchinson:Did you see the funny clip of Kobi Meynu talking to Bruno Fernandes during the game and he essentially was if you were mouth reading or lip reading is what it's usually called. If you're lip reading, he was basically saying to Bruno Fernandes, can we just keep the ball for a bit? Which suggests to me, he's a player who gets on it. I want to play it quickly. Stop shooting. And get another assist. Yeah, stop assisting. Stop shooting. Stop training. No, he's like glory pass, isn't he? We don't need to, not every pass needs to be 60 yards. All right, that'll do for part one, part two. We'll carry on our Premier League preview.

19:21Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly. So, Forrest Spurs, one of your three o 'clock games, Seb. Just get a win quietly, hope no one notices. It doesn't feel like that happens with Tottenham very much. They've signed Toysin Adarabio and Mikhailo Mudrik from Chelsea. I can't remember if we talked about Mudrik on the last pod, Barry, but I just think it's such a fascinating situation to see how he does and how much game time he gets initially. Oh, yes, Wilson was saying he was training in Battersea Park. He moved training there just to make sure he settled in. Yeah, possibly. I still think it's really interesting, Baz.

19:55Max Rushden:Yeah, he was a thorough choice winger. He has had a previous relationship with Deserby, Shakhtar, Donetsk. I have no idea what his fitness situation is. He may take a while to be brought up to speed. he was a very very exciting player at Shakhtar Wilson was making the point during the live show well I can't remember whether it was the live show or the pod or both if it's the location of Oliver Cromwell's head that was the live show so he loves to run into space hopefully for Tottenham's sake Deserby can get the best out of him has it been a good window for Spurs or a bad window for Spurs I have no idea I don't know either on the face of it it looks really good but yeah who knows where are you at Robin with finding it funny that Tottenham can spend this much money and still not not achieve anything absolutely loving it and I'm very sad that it's a 3 o 'clock kick off so we don't get to because they're appointment viewing aren't they Spurs but I'm with Barry because on the face of it this is like your typical winning the transfer window they've signed a load of players that we kind of all know and you think oh they're pretty good yeah they're good they should be you know they're gonna you know massively race up the table but obviously it's not as simple as that as i can't remember who wrote the piece about it but it was it might have been jacob steinberg just saying you can't buy mentality and it just seems like deserve he said yeah that's it surely you can't like surely like player profile you know natural leader you can buy mentality that's maybe but spurs the spurs is too strong.

21:39The force of Spurs is actually, it can, yeah. As I said, it's like going into FIFA. It repels mentality.

21:46Seb Hutchinson:It repels it actively. If Bruno Gimorais had gone there, he'd have been finished, wouldn't he? Yeah, you just become so weak. You're just so, suddenly, all your self-belief just goes. It evaporates away. The thing is, Seb, though, like, you know, De Zerbi likes his team to have the ball, a bit like Iriola does. And Forrest are a really good counter-attacking team. And I don't think they mind not having the ball at home and glasner doesn't mind and so it feels like they're walking into a trap seb that's what i'm saying and they're a good set piece team forest as well yeah and they're a side that i think when they faced leads on the opening well they said they faced leads twice in a row actually because they effectively played them in the cup as well they came up against a side who were almost their antithesis who were also good in set pieces also good in the challenge good mentality a team with lots of mentality and now they face a spurs side which you think actually this will suit forest a lot so also the the crowd there will feel well spurs on their day maybe could turn it on against us but we can beat this team and we've done it before so you know the last time they met was the big win at spurs's ground but i do get the feeling that maybe tottenham away from home will be better than they are again again because when they fall behind at home you feel like their whole world caves in away from home i think even at the back end of last season they did pick up some some battling wins and they were forced to go there so it's a really tough one to call this one and that's why it feels a bit of a shame that it is a three o 'clock for people in the uk for example because it's unless you're in the ground obviously this feels like a prime game you want to watch live i think and so it's a it's a touch it's a bit disappointing and but i think for it from a forest point of view i think they did did well in the end in the transfer market still that midfield area is a bit of a concern for them mackatee was playing in there at the start of the season and it's a place we're not usually used to seeing him in so we'll see how they work out but having getting an experience right back in and i think putting themselves in a position now where i think they can feel a bit more confident because there have been worries that they might get involved in a relegation battle again yeah i'm such Liverpool i mean Barca, I'd be interested to see how much he plays or not.

24:02Liverpool have signed a goalkeeper as well. Luka Brugmans from Genk. When Wilson was telling us either on a pod or the live show or backstage that he thinks Alisson can't run anymore. Is that a problem? Well, I think he can't move. Like he was saying, he can't move anymore. We had Donnarumma can't dive one way.

24:19Max Rushden:Customer goal last weekend. Good point, isn't it? But Barry, Liverpool have not started brilliantly. They haven't won yet. And Ipswich were really good in that. have been really good for a game and a bit so far this season. Yeah, and Julian Cecil's been brilliant for them. Liverpool have brought in some good players, Bercola, Jacquet, Victor Munoz, Ronald Arahu, but they look like they need a right winger, they need a defensive midfielder, they need a right back. They're all important positions, obviously, and they are light in them. So, I can't see them contending for the title at all. I don't know what constitutes a good season for Liverpool.

25:07Max Rushden:A cup final or a cup and qualifying for Europe, I guess, would be acceptable for Anthony Iarola in his first season. And then Ipswich, they've hosed money around during this window. They broke Sunderland's record for spending by a newly promoted side. Brought in Zian Fleming from Burnley. He was pretty decent last season in a bad team. Issa Jop, Abdul-Fatawu, Ezekiel Palacios, Dias Ameda, Sasa Lukic. So, you know, they all seem like decent signings. and looking at the business the promoted sides have done, it looks like Hull and Ipswich have both done more than Coventry or done better than Coventry.

25:59Max Rushden:But this is all just on paper. We shall see. We shall see, yeah. I reckon Ipswich should give Liverpool a game, yeah? Sure. Hull, Villa, Newcastle, Bournemouth, Brentford, Sunderland, Brighton, Leeds and Fulham Palace. Any of those pique your interest, Seb?

26:16Seb Hutchinson:I'm covering Hull against Aston Villa, so I need to be interested in that one, I think. Yeah, you do. It could be three in a row. I mean, you could really see them winning their three in a row. It'd be an unbelievable start. Speaking of signings again, I think from Villa point of view, waiting for them to settle with their new boys who've come in to see how well they're going to do, because I did think they looked at, obviously, against Arsenal, so many were missing, but they did feel a shadow of the side, understandably, considering who they've lost. Hull City, on the other hand, Having your owner essentially being on social media and telling the supporters what's going to happen on deadline day is absolutely fantastic from a point of view.

26:53Seb Hutchinson:Because there's no, it is what it is. You know, the person who is ultimately in control of these things and knows everything is coming out to tell everybody. And I do wonder if that becomes a thing in the future that an official from each club will just come onto social media and just say, this is what's happening. And it just kills everything dead. and then the whole industry of transfer remover. And then David Ornstein can shower, finally. Yeah, exactly. He can wash. Long beard. Exactly. Not to kill people's careers or anything. But yeah, just one thing about Hull City. I do wonder though also, they're going to be a side who will want teams to come onto them and then they can surprise them on the count.

27:31Seb Hutchinson:So they did a number on Coventry. They did a number on Manchester United. And it'll be interesting again to see against an Aston Villa side, how they approach that because Villa are going to be a team that might not be settled yet either so we'll see how that one works out but good on Hull really and it'll be my first time going there actually. May you make him welcome people of Hull. They've made six signings on deadline day they've signed 18 players this summer that's a lot of players. So they've got rid of Liam Miller who scored the winner against Coventry he's now on loan at Birmingham. Has he?

28:04Yeah so I just it's a I found that a bit confusing, but I messaged a Hull fan and she just said, we're on board. We're just loving this. Whatever happens. Yeah. We need to talk about Malik Fafana, don't we? Please, let's talk about it. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He chose Sunderland, Barry. I mean. Did they have a better private jet, do you think?

28:25Max Rushden:I think they just offered his agent more money. It sort of sums up the grotesqueness and obscenity of transfer business, really, doesn't it? This player is brought to Lyon, an airstrip in Lyon, and has the choice of two private jets aboard, one going to London, sent by Crystal Palace, one going to Wearside, but sent by... Do you think there's ever been two private jets and your choice was Croydon or Sunderland? It's normally like Saint-Tropez or, I don't know, the Maldives or wherever private jets go. And then a third one turned up with the Sunderland. With the Sunderland chairman on board with a big bag of money.

29:11Max Rushden:I mean, it doesn't smack of a young footballer who's being particularly well advised, does it? You have one career. You think you would put a bit more thought into, you know, I'm leaving France where is my next destination well it looks like it was more or less a coin toss yeah it's like do you remember growing up you had those roll your own adventures I had a really good asterisk one and you know at the end of page 6 it would be like roll the dice and see where you go this is just like a real live version of that where he has a dice and it's like which private jet do you get on Newcastle have signed Matias Fernandez Pardo and when it was I first heard somebody talking about this guy as a rumour on TalkSport.

29:55I really thought they'd said Matias Fernandes, pardon. And it just really made me laugh. But he's a totally different human from Lille for around 55 million. Yeah, any of the other fixtures we haven't seen? He was one of,