Brilliant Bonmatí sends Spain into Euro 2025 final, plus transfer talk – Football Weekly Extra

23:37I don't think Aja Mang's probably played those minutes at the end of the games because of the fact that they're sort of chasing the game. But instead, they've all led to this point to where those two are now significant options for the European Championship final. So with Esme, I'm firstly delighted for her. The fact that she could stay patient enough and be ready to come in and do that. I'm not really surprised because of how good she is. But yeah, she's going to be playing in the European Championship final. I know how much that means to her and all the rest of the women in that team. So it'd be amazing to get a little bit sentimental, by the way, or just to almost have a reverse reality check.

24:07My kids, so I've got two daughters and my son. My oldest daughter's 11. Next daughter's eight. My son's about to turn seven. And in their lifetimes, all they've seen is England be good, which I find hilarious. This is the third final in a row for England women, a World Cup and two European Championship final. and for even like the men side of things, they've played in your two Euros finals. Then let's go a bit younger. So like England in the 21s, they've won back-to-back European championships. I'm like, and these kids now, they're watching games at night time. So are they not going to win? Are they not going to win?

24:42I'm like, nah, they'll be all right. Just hang on a second. Something's going to happen. So shout out to all that and sort of the fact that it's inspiring so many. But yeah, I think the team will probably say the same because she trusts them. She knows that they can play. on the big occasion against people who some of these call their peers and against some who they call adversaries on an almost week-to-week basis. So I think she'll stick with that. And over this tournament, again, my biggest takeaway is that I really, really believe in Serena Vigman, by the way, because whatever the situation is, I feel like she's got an idea or a sub in play, which maybe some of us hadn't thought about, but instead she gets it done, and I'm a full believer in it.

25:20Because even going into the last game, in my mind, I thought, well, Russo's replacement is Agui Biva-Jones. so when Farrusso stays on then you bring on Ajimang to compliment her and then all of a sudden she's bringing on Agui Biva Jones and Ajimang at the same time for Farrusso and it's because she's seeing something she's seeing a different way that the game is going to compare to other people and her ability to as it stands pick the right person for those moments and not look too flustered on the side outside of that France game where I think everyone was flustered on the sidelines I've been a big fan so I think she's going to probably pick the same team but whatever she picks I've got no doubts whatsoever that it's going to be a good enough team to win the game Yeah, it's hard to argue with five straight major tournament finals that Serena Beegman has.

26:01And yet, as you alluded to in part one, Jonny, England haven't been great in this tournament, which I guess you can say, well, they've got to the final without being great. They might be great in the final and they probably have to be, right?

26:12Jonathan Liew:England are certainly capable of playing a level of football that is far superior to anything they've shown so far. And I think they are going to have to. the interesting thing about Spain this tournament is we've not seen how they do against a team that really pressures them proactively that puts pressure on Patrick Guijaro for example that pressures Paredes who is obviously so integral to their build up, whether England have the energy to do that after 220 minute games remains to be seen, but yeah the other thing is this could very well be a game that that gets decided by the benches you know spain able to to change things they're able to bring like parallelo off the bench they're able to bring athenia off the bench and and england too have managed to they've used their substitutes to well you know to stick it all the forwards on and get it in the mixer in the in the 93rd minute so these are these are teams that will will they will not finish the game probably anything anything like how they started it which which which is what makes it so fascinating, because there are going to be phases and subplots and chapters to this game that you probably can't predict.

27:28And Wiegmann is right that you can't foresee,

27:34Jonathan Liew:there's not some tactical master plan that is going to foresee how this game is going to pan out. You kind of have to react on the fly a little bit. You have to react to how it's going. I think if there's an early goal, it could well be like an absolutely pandemonium type game. But if it stays nil-nil for 45 minutes, we could end up going the distance. It's one of those. It's hard to know how good Aja Mang is, right? Because obviously she keeps making this incredible impact. And then you obviously, you can't ignore that. What she's done is brilliant. And actually she did play really well in that extra time.

28:06But then you sort of, because it's the story, so many people have sang so many, More people have probably spent more time talking about her abilities than she's actually had minutes playing for us to judge how good she is. 100%.

28:20Seb Hutchinson:I know we use the word genius all the time, but it always works in football, even when we don't really mean somebody's a genius. But Serena Vigman, I've covered or I've watched all of the games of her in charge of England, all of the games. and even when you think she has a consistency to a team selection she always is ahead of the game of people who cover all the time we think she's going to do this and then she does something slightly different she's going to do this and she does she goes against what everybody's calling out to do now michelle ajumet strangely enough she is an example of this connection that serena vignan has with the fa itself and this is another reason why she's so successful because she's so integrated in the FA and what they want to do as well while being her own person and putting her own stamp on the England side.

29:11Seb Hutchinson:The under-23 system in women's football is an important part of England now and the idea that players get an opportunity to showcase what they can do in an England shirt but not for the senior side right next to the manager the senior manager can see that St George's Park and see the games and Michelle's played for England at almost every age group and she's always looked to stand out at every age group and it was almost a feeling to the under-19s that she was going to make that jump straight into the seniors and I think Serena noticed that well before this tournament but thought it's going to be about timing nobody knows about her nobody knows what she can do at senior level so let's keep our powder dry i'm not suggesting she had that conversation with arsenal per se but even when she was on loan at brighton last year she wasn't a starter week in week out it's like substitute appearances she didn't dominate you know the games for brighton or anything like that so nobody really knew so even when she was drafted in the squad a few months ago there was still a sense of oh are you sure but she had an immediate impact on her debut 40 odd seconds scored I think the best Linus's goal I've ever seen and even though it was in a defeat her attitude to that game was pick the ball up let's get back let's win the game the calms about her play but then we didn't see her at all until the tournament started and there were several games after that and that's but I believed she was going to be in the squad because I could just see Serena Vimy even talking about her after the game this is my player who is going to possibly win the Euros for England because nobody will be able to deal with her when she comes on the ball is like a magnet to him she comes on the pitch and even from a commentator's point of view I'm just delighted to see her on the pitch because whenever that ball was in and around the penalty area I'm thinking where's Adjermang where's Adjermang And so it was no surprise that she's been the saviour of England on two occasions.

31:17Seb Hutchinson:And I've had lots of Ghanaian people texting me and messaging me saying her name means saviour of the nation, which I think is absolutely incredible. I've not been able to check that. And I don't know sometimes if people send you things and you think, are they just making this up? But that just feels so apt that that's the case. And I just think she's somebody who I don't even think. people said calling for her to start the final. No, she shouldn't start the final. Absolutely not. She stays out of the picture. England stay in the game and then she scores a hat-trick with two minutes to play. Another player that is talked about loads is Lauren James.

31:52She might be injured. She might be tired. That doesn't stop me starting for Melbourne Bohemians. I will point out. But if she is fit enough to start, do you think she should? Yes, I think so. I think so. I think she still has that quality, which was one of the big factors as in to why she made the squad and why she was selected for the first few games as well. So I'd definitely be on board with that. I think she did seem a bit quiet in that game just gone, and maybe that was because of the injury. But I think the style of play that she has, she's probably one of the players in this team that's perfectly suited to be playing against Spain.

32:27Because I think for the way that Spain want to defend, it's very much on the front foot. It's aggression in the turnovers. it's applying as much pressure to players as possible but who's who's the Lauren James stopper who's the one that's going to be able to match her physically match her speed understand her skill and when she gets past them who can catch it who can catch her up I don't think it'll be the I don't think it'll be the Spain um center halves I don't think it'll really be Spain fullbacks and I think for the way that she plays if she's at her best then you know there aren't many in world football like her so I think if she is fit I think you do have to start her because it would be one of those games as we've discussed where you know for long periods you probably will suffer you won't have tons of the ball but how are you going to be able to take the ball at the pitch sometimes and if it's a case of just just Russo running to channels you know she I think she can do that she's very good at that she's got good speeds got a good understanding of her movement the hold up players really really good but I think sometimes you also need somebody that can break past the defense with the ball at their feet and I think she's capable of doing that anywhere on the field so if Lauren James is fit I would 100 % start it yeah how do you see it panning out Johnny yeah I

33:26Jonathan Liew:I agree. I mean, actually, I was sort of on the fence, but Nadam has convinced me. He's just a very persuasive guy. She will get more space. It's a commanding voice, isn't it, that he has? I want Nadam to... She shall play. ...to break bad news to me. I want Nadam in a white coat in my doctor's surgery when, you know, just sitting me down and going, I'm sorry, Mr. Liu, it's worms.

33:57Jonathan Liew:She will get more space than she did against Sweden and Italy. And I do want to put to bed this kind of, there's this persistent slight on her that she doesn't defend or she can't defend. I've seen Lauren James in, I mean, take for example, the Champions League second leg for Chelsea against Manchester City. She was incredible off the ball and on the ball. She can clearly do it. And I think a lot of the time she gets, I think she gets scapegoated for issues that are collective, that when the team press isn't quite as focused or cohesive as it can be, because she's the eye-catching player, because I think there is a certain view of her as almost a slight luxury player, unfairly.

34:45Jonathan Liew:she I think gets she gets unfairly blamed for a lot of defensive issues so I think if she could play 60 minutes that would be great I think you'd rather have her in the first 60 minutes fresh and fit and attacking those spaces and I think giving Spain some problems going backwards. It is a great video Seb of you and Lucy Ward you know obviously the final is it's Seb and Lucy or Robin what do we do what do Football Weekly listeners do it's a very difficult choice but like when that moment and it's so it looks so great you know do you know the cameras are on you is one question and two do you know how quickly after like a moment because obviously a commentator you know you're doing a lot of chat but no one's really going to remember most of it and then you have these moments you've got to get them right how quickly do you know i think we've really done that well there you know that was pretty good yeah you the thing is about anything you know

35:37Seb Hutchinson:commentary is subjective so at the end of the day you think you nail something and someone thinks is the worst thing in the world but I've always had the belief that the thing that probably makes commentary work is the idea of the added emotion to capture what people are watching so if you're if you're watching a game you're often watching the game most people watching the game for entertainment or an emotional connection to the game the support a team the support a nation so if you are not excited when a goal goes in then what are you doing it for that's my that's the baseline and there's different ways people can convey that and I think it's because if Adjurman had scored that goal in the first five minutes to make it one nil I would not have said it in that manner because considering the opposition considering the state of the game but it was probably the last attack of the game realistically England have put in so many crosses into the match and there was one more cross going in the goalkeeper had caught everything up to then Giuliani and then she spills one for the first time the emotional tiredness Italy were crying on the bench before the final whistle had gone Sontrin I could feel like blood vessels popping out of his head just just give me a full-time whistle and I'm a made man um and because of that everyone's caught up in that so are you as a broadcaster so even before the game I know before the social media team they wanted to put you know a GoPro on us during the competition and at first you are thinking okay commentators we just try not to be in vision that's part of the you know the part of the um benefit and uh when they put it there but you do forget you do genuinely forget and it was only afterwards literally after the game that i saw um tilly who's this one of the social media people for itv i saw her and it reminded me oh yeah that camera's there but initially you're thinking oh no and that's it's thinking oh no and also because of the often fisheye lens look of a um gopro right that's your biggest worry how how round and stretched or my face look especially especially in profile your head looks really long and deep and so you're thinking so when it's flat on it's better and then but these are not things commentators have to worry about usually no i think it's so interesting thinking about when to pause you know yeah what what the co-coms is doing because you don't see it rather you sort of think oh there's a goal everyone's shouting but clearly like your you take the lead and lucy's taking notes and what's happened and then you have a pause and it's yeah it's fascinating it's very hard i was going to add it's the paper i'm not a musical person but in your head there is something ticking about pacing a football game and i always remember brian brian what i liked about brian moore back in the day was i called it being slightly one pace behind the action to give yourself more emotion and it feels more natural as if because when people are watching football they are one pace behind the action things are happening so quickly there's like oh oh that that feeling and so i purposely in commentary want to feel get that across almost as if I'm being reactive to what's going on, Ryan, rather than pre-empting or being too on top of it.

38:49Yeah, that's interesting.

38:50Seb Hutchinson:Yeah, it's because that's what I wish you to like about Bronwyn. You know, a goal would go in and go, and it's in there, and it's in there. And it's in there. And that aspect of it was what I loved. It wasn't what he was saying necessarily. It was just the, you know, David Coleman used to have it. And that sort of, that is something that you can't really measure. or explain clearly, as I've clearly explained. Yeah, you can't in an interview go, give us your ooh. Could you give us your Barry Davis? You know that, give us your... Oh, yes. Yeah. Oh, yes. So good. All right. Anyway, it was really good.

39:25Well done. That'll do for part two. Part three, we'll do some Premier League transfer stuff.

39:38Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly. Ryan says, should Chelsea actually strengthen a bit less in this transfer window. Yeah, in advance talks to sign Javi Simmons from RB Leipzig. And you still please Barry. He'll get to watch one of his favourite players every week if Javi Simmons gets in the 25. For the tape, Nadim, I have Javi Simmons, perhaps, you know, I sort of saw him as a wide man and a 10. And you have saved me a bit of grief by saying, no, this guy's a pure 10. But even still, I know Chelsea have a lot of wide players. They've got a lot of 10s. Like, do they need him?

40:08No, they absolutely do not need him. But, you know, might as well get him if you can. I don't really understand this strategy at the moment but one thing I would say is that for whatever they've done to this point they've now stumbled upon a team that's actually quite good. So this sort of like hoarding process of thinking well this works this doesn't really work this guy works well this guy's working now. Like just when they thought for example got Liam De Lapp I was like oh good they've got a nine to part to like rival Jackson oh no no now they've got Gio Pedro as well and now Gio Pedro makes perfect sense.

40:36So I think the methodology seems a bit intense and a bit heavy but as it stands as I say they're in good shape for it and I don't necessarily see how he fits in with the team because it feels quite clear in terms of how they want to play and who the player is going to be at this moment but Xavi Simmons is a top quality player so if they do manage to bring him in and there's a plan for him then I think there's a chance that he could be successful but again it doesn't feel like a necessity but which players felt like a necessity over the last I don't know two years? Yeah does it interest you Johnny that I suppose players always have self-belief right So they're not going to go, well, I'm not sure I'll go there because I might not get a lot of game time.

41:14But do you think eventually players will think, because they make a good point, they've won the Club World Cup, however good or not you think that is. They did beat PSG, like they have a good team. But you know, Javi Simmons thinking, I'll just walk into this team, because clearly that's where Cole Palmer is standing.

41:30Jonathan Liew:Yeah, I've always wondered how they sell the project to players and how players kind of rationalise it. how, say, a Kiernan and Dewsbury Hall, do you think you're going to play central midfield? What is your realistic expectation? I think for a lot of players who are joining Chelsea at the moment, you're thinking, if you go to a lot of clubs, especially if you're in the prime of your career, if you're 22, 23, and you're at the top of the market, you're at the top of your value, if you basically miss 18 if you waste 18 months of your career it can almost be sort of fatal for your development because especially uh in the sort of positions where where a player like like javi simmons is going to operate the competition in the market for that sort of player is is so fierce that you know you see what happened to dewsbury hall for example or you know even a joel felix who you know three or four years ago we're talking about as a potential Ballon d 'Or player and is now I couldn't I couldn't tell you if he's still at Chelsea or not or if he's on loan or is he gone is he like is he still there is he still on the books somewhere I don't know where Jao Felix is where the hell is Jao Felix but I players do I think they are slightly inured to this because the the attitude that thinks what if this goes wrong is utterly antithetical the attitude that got them to the top in the first place you have to believe in yourself and and i think simmons is like easily easily a good enough player to to establish himself i'd like i don't know where he fits in i think i think he like simmons running into space as we saw at leipzig absolutely deadly player how that translates to i don't know a champions league game against a team that has got 11 men behind the ball uh i'm not sure but he will you know he is easily good enough to establish himself but the thing is we have said this about a lot of players who have gone to chelsea that well obviously they got to find a place for him somewhere and they don't always have to yeah nadam would you say players what's going through their mind when they sign or they just as johnny says you've just got that self-belief to have made it this far that you think well that's fine it's just another challenge it's a good question and i think some of it depends on where the player's coming from and I think one thing I'd mention as well from Chelsea's perspective is that they buy a lot of young players so as a consequence the way that they perceive football is going to be very different somebody who's maybe four five six years older in terms of their decision making and as a youngster like you could go to Chelsea who are playing in the Premier League it's a good location to live they're in the Champions League they're a team who are probably saying to the player now we're going to try and win the league this next season and you don't see people in the team and think oh my gosh there's no way I can play ahead of this person or that person.

44:20Maybe someone like Javi Simons is thinking, well, maybe I could play alongside a Cole Palmer, somebody who I really respect and so on. So I think it's just the way that it pans out. And it'd be a tough decision to, and as Jonathan said, if you see that somebody's interested in you and you're like, well, maybe this isn't for me because I don't know if I'll be good enough to play or I don't know if I'll get any real game time. But why are they asking for you to join them? Because you feel that you are the exception. You've actively been headhunted and now you're thinking, well, maybe I won't play.

44:50I think that's a mentality which just doesn't exist. You could call it naive and so on, but if we were all in the same position, we'd be doing the same things. So again, the fact that these are young players, the ones who can think in that manner, the ones who can sign a five, six, seven-year deal, so it guarantees a level of job security within that as well. Not necessarily even the financial side, but actually, on reflection, do you remember when those deals were first happening? We thought, how could you sign a 25-year deal, basically? well now that they talk about the levels of money involved with those deals how it's lower than say you would expect for a club in that manner all of a sudden you don't have these situations where they're going to be struggling to remove to let players go so maybe that's the security that comes with some players when they join the club they know that if it doesn't work out first it'll still be on good money but secondly there'll be a way out for them should the worst case scenario happen and they're not going to be playing at the club so I think Chelsea might be Chelsea might be cooking it you know and it's a really weird thing to think I just think of the 10, 11 elite podcast hosts on the Guardians books that just don't get a look in and you know if they'd had their time again 2018, they just wouldn't have signed those long term deals.

45:56Bayern Munich are pursuing Luis Diaz from Liverpool who are reportedly looking at Rodrigo to replace him. He would cost him about 70 million. I mean 70 % a lot of money Liverpool haven't they? Already close to 300 million after Eketike arrives. I would be excited if I was a Liverpool fan. We know that not all transfers work out but like it's a they seem to be in a good place well yeah look we know transfers get

46:20Seb Hutchinson:supporters excited they create an expectation if you don't sign a player it's all over you know liverpool barely did anything last summer and then they won the league and this is an interesting concept of all of this is the idea of stability versus dreams versus excitement in football we're talking about chelsea here who if chelsea don't win the league next season nobody's going to be saying to them well you know the project's done the project's finished it's over or it should come to an end or they should even change the manager necessarily as long as they're if they're constantly buying players freshening their team up then it's a new start of a new cycle um where you look at team like Arsenal people are saying right let's put the cherry on top if Arteta doesn't win next season Arsenal Football Club is at an end it's all over they cannot ever be involved in title races again and so it's interesting now because Liverpool have made these signings the expectation shifts and people are going to be thinking well verts is now going to he has to dominate the league and if they don't slot's going to be under pressure after five six games because they haven't won them all and they haven't battered everybody or i always can't wait for the season to start one because the biggest issue i have with the transfer wind well there's lots of issues is the way people are looking at the money side of it so they'll say a club spent oh this club spent 300 million we've got no idea what's come out of the club's coffers a particular moment in time what their balance sheet is showing really there are some people who are very good at looking into this stuff but most people don't they'll say well if we sell Luis Diaz for 70 million then that will give us 80 million to spend on Rodrigo and it's there's so much more money coming in and out there's agents fees there's the wages themselves that people forget the impact they have on the team and so I think from Liverpool's point of view I think the excitement for them is the idea of when they always say you know improve from a position of strength and have Liverpool done that it's interesting they have in some ways but they've also lost an important player they've they've they're going through it might be a change of style they're going to have to do with the players they bought so who knows um that's probably where the excitement comes in but the transfer window honestly I mean it just it really does I'm just screaming bring on that first game when everybody's dreams come crushing down.

48:42Seb Hutchinson:Crashing down. Johnny, Arsenal Views has a question. Says now that Ange has gone how long until Johnny Liu hates on Thomas Frank quite a lot of Australians were annoyed with you for your piece on Ange. They all told me about it as the Ange envoy so do you want to apologise to me Johnny?

48:58Jonathan Liew:No, this is your fault we've established we've established that you've set the trap i'll walk straight out i'll walk straight into it yeah the content was fantastic i believe the click-throughs were off the scale and uh and my reputation in that great footballing hotbed of australia is now mud sorry i can't even now i can't help it i don't i don't know i keep i just keep walking do you think it was because interesting like because because you went quite hard on him and like about sort of him bullshitting and all managers bullshit all the time but was it because and had sort of said i'm not you know i'm not going to change this is you know like it was sort of so evident with him more than other managers who all are constantly lying to us the whole time you see you're doing it again you're you're setting up the trap he's gone he's gone he's going to saudi he's going to central coast mariners or or you know i don't know like no i've is it true that all managers bullshit i guess so it is i think it is i think it is it is an industry based on and especially in terms of coaching where your your brand is so it's so valuable it's it's it's such a an important tool in your armory you know not just when you're looking for jobs but when when you're trying to keep them as well and yeah i mean the fact that he came he basically came from what we have to say is obscurity you know 50 20 years ago nobody knows who he is.

50:21Jonathan Liew:Ten years ago, I think, he's the manager of the Socceroos who are losing every single game in the World Cup. So that branding has been incredibly important to him. And I don't think he gets where he is unless he can tell a story. And he tells a great story about himself. He is able to sell himself in a way that, for example, Graham Potter isn't. And that's a real failing of Graham Potter that he can't tell a story to fans and and I think the media that that almost makes you want to root for him I think it's it's incredible how many neutrals uh were just really invested in the idea of Ange Postokoglu as a concept wanted him to do well you know yeah he got no no strong feelings about Spurs but you like this guy and you want to do well that is a skill and I think a lot of a lot of what I wrote in that that column was this is a this is a talent just as much as being able to lay out training cones or come up with a tactical plan is a talent and this is this is his super talent there are so many great great tactical coaches out there but i don't think there's anyone who can who can tell a story like him how do you feel about the thomas frank era i like him i i think he's uh i think thomas frank again is a very decent bloke um i think there was a question mark over how he's again it's a big step into the unknown for him how he deals with not just a bigger squad but bigger expectations and and And a team that's basically expected to compete for, what is it, five trophies this season.

51:50Jonathan Liew:Like the early messages have been good. But I think as he himself has acknowledged, this is the honeymoon period. Whatever you say is gospel. Everyone will laugh and smile. But it's when things get tough. I think that's where we're going to see the making of him. Luke says, following the in-depth analysis of the predictions in the last pod, Do you think that on the Guardian Football Weekly Weekly, they're doing their own prediction league on which Guardian Football Weekly pundits position where? How many would have had Barry top? Is that like when Leicester won the league? Yeah, I got a message from Barry saying I'm very excited to know 13 % more about football than Jonathan Wilson.

52:26And he will never live that down. James says, can man of the people Max recover from today's admission that he does his big shop in Waitrose? Give me a break, James. I'm only back for two months. They've widened the aisles at Barbican Waitrose. It was really and moved the tills. I presume all for me. it was very exciting um we'll finish with this from luke uh who says long time listener first and hopefully one time emailing uh not planning on a vasectomy uh my son was born yesterday tuesday july the 22nd at 5 12 p.m this is after 30 hours of my wife being in labor lost track of contractions and a few room changes due to overcrowding unfortunately and thankfully she got a c-section and both mom and baby are fine i'm emailing because during her c-section she had to be put under anesthetic and i had to leave and i had to spend 20 minutes just on my own in a hallway fearing the worst and feeling alone i had my phone on me the notification was delayed that you had a new episode out from monday i got to the lucy ward scale of how tall a goalkeeper should be before the doctor came out and said everything was okay i haven't had it before and hopefully never again where i needed and understood all the emails you get and the support that you give just by talking about football and nonsense i'll never be able to thank you enough but just keeping doing what you're doing lads and lasses because you don't know the next time someone's going to need to hear jonathan wilson talk about tournament personalities uh thank you from a first time dad luke uh love to you luke and to mrs luke and your son as well uh speaking of kids seb your your daughter reviewed uh you you know we were talking about nadam talking about his kids as well and uh your daughter who's not a massive football fan has become has got excited and you wanted to play a bit of her actually watching you do your job is she complimenting you or england that's the question oh good question i never really thought about her complimenting me because

54:04Seb Hutchinson:she really does she's a bit of a i say she's a bit of a fair weather football fan she she actually She started playing football for a girls team nearby, but she only started playing it because her friend was playing it. And she made me buy all the bits and pieces. And then she was there for a couple of weeks and then her friend left and she didn't bother and she sometimes didn't really watch games or she pretends she watches games. And then I questioned her and I quizzed her intently on every aspect and she just got it. She can't explain why. She can't remember where Sergio Ramos is. Yeah, exactly.

54:37Seb Hutchinson:Kirk is, you know, flying wing-back is going to fit into the Liverpool system. But it really did make me, reminded me, and I think we do need reminding of this impact of big tournament moments, what they have on people. And, you know, Ajermang Soarin, when she did, it seemed to inspire my daughter in so many ways. She was so excited after that game that she wanted the final to be tomorrow. And she wanted that first for football. And you see that in an eight-year-old. You just think, this is the bug that gets people. there's always a moment that gets people and they're hooked into anything and i think even in sport my moment was frank brudo against tyson and in the late 80s just that the emotion of that particular fight and i was getting right behind frank in that and i'm so gutted afterwards it's a straw that he'd lost you know and boxing so big in that manner you know you know literally on the ground, the fighter.

55:33Seb Hutchinson:And I thought, was that her moment? Did Ajumang create that moment in my daughter? And I wonder if that's the case for lots of young children, you know, children across the country, particularly with this tournament, girls. Yeah. Well, let's play her eight-second voice note. It seems self-indulgent, but I'm sure I'd do the same. Here, this is a nice way to end the podcast. Here is Hutchinson Jr. on that game.

55:58Jonathan Liew:that was the best game ever really good thank you for your input both Hutchinsons thank you Seb thanks for coming on no worries thank you thanks Nadam pleasure as always thanks Johnny thanks for having me Football Weekly is produced by Joel Grove our executive producer is Danielle Stephens we'll be back on Monday

56:20this is The Guardian

56:28Thank you.