Liverpool leave Paris empty-handed and Atlético stun Barça: Football Weekly Extra

24:40Simeone said that was just common sense and I think if you watch it back you can interpret it as he hasn't actually taken the goal kick he's given to his teammate to take it but it looks a bit like he's taken the goal kick and Flick certainly thought he couldn't understand why that wasn't given as a penalty and what would have been a red card because I think Mark Poubill already had a yellow at that point Yeah, I'm on the common sense part of that but Baz, you think that's a stonewall penalty?

25:04Max Rushden:I do, yeah We've seen them given before against Tyrone Mings and not given against Arsenal's Gabriel. I thought this was as egregious as any of them. I thought the keeper had played the ball to Pugil and he handled it deliberately. And, you know, he did look like a trump if it had been given against him. It's a big risk for him to take. He clearly thought the goal kick hadn't been taken, but I'm not so sure about that. Fair enough. I mean, the Alvarez free kicks hit. I mean, it's so good, isn't it? Right, it's brilliant. It's important for Julien Alvarez, who's had a really strange season. So Julien has been built up as the player that's likely to lead Atletico in the future, that's likely to be their kind of key player.

25:54But he had a very, very difficult... He scored on the opening day away at Espanyol and then didn't score away again, I think for something like three months. Went for a really poor spell in terms of his performance levels. He then did something I think very ill-advised, which is post-game when he had finally scored and he was asked about his future. He basically said, well, who knows where I'm going to be? And on a day in which, I can't remember which game it is now, but Atletico Madrid had won a game. He played really well. Everyone was happy. And he goes and sort of ruins the mood with this comment amidst lots of talk of Barcelona being interested in him.

26:29And I think what's important is he started to play really, really well recently after a really difficult period earlier in the season. and looking like that player that... I always feel with Julian, there's a slight doubt with Atletico Madrid about whether they want him to be the highest of the strikers or the second line of the strikers. Is he a number nine or is he a number 10? And so when they play with Solov, obviously he's the number 10. When they play with Griezmann, he's the number nine. He can do a bit of both. He covers a lot of the pitch. That run in the first few minutes yesterday was fantastic.

26:57His is the pass for the red card. He then, of course, scores the free kick as well. His ability to link everything up is brilliant. and I think he'll be really, really important for them if they are going to achieve anything in the Champions League but it hasn't been a great season. One other thing then, Max, to add, I just want to say this and there was a lovely moment before the game which also, with hindsight, you think, was it actually a very clever moment from Diego Simeone? He did the pre-match press conference with Anton Griezmann who, of course, has just announced that he's going to Orlando and before the press conference started, the two of them were sitting there together, Simeone and Griezmann and Simeone said, can I just say something?

27:31and he went on this discussion of how what a great person Griezmann is he's a he's a model for society we need more people like this I love you you're you've been amazing I consider you a friend as well as a player so but if you don't run tomorrow you're not playing but he he did this really kind of quite emotional thing and Griezmann was basically asked to reciprocate and Griezmann said well for me to really open my heart I think I need to be at home with my family and my kids and maybe Diego's family but perhaps not here but he did this this really kind of Simeone did this really sort of personal and emotional thing with Griezmann, who then played brilliantly.

28:03And I just sort of, you know, Griezmann is old now. And last year he had, I thought, a few difficulties kind of accepting this new role. And he's talked about admitting that he had this difficulty accepting his new role where he wasn't playing all the time. He's still their best footballer. And if you look at that second goal, and this doesn't often happen admittedly when you're doing a match report, because you normally, you know, it's all happening a bit too kind of frantically. I managed to actually properly watch that entire move without looking down at the keyboard, without writing or anything.

28:30It starts with Griezmann dribbling his way out of his own area, releasing the pressure from Barcelona, playing, I think, a one-two with one of the central defenders, playing it into the middle of midfield, then Atletico slow the ball down, recycle it, bring it round the other side. Griezmann, again, is the one that provides the penultimate pass to Ruggieri, who then provides the cross for the goal. And I just think he is a criminally underrated footballer

28:52Philippe Auclair:who Atletico are going to miss. And whom France are going to miss big time. I'm still, every time I see him play, I just wonder, why did you retire? Well, I know why he retired, because he wasn't given the captaincy. That's why he retired from international football. But he's the one type of player we don't have with France. And is he replaceable? And I think actually Didier Deschamps used that expression for him, is he replaceable? And there is, I mean, I cannot support you, in your opinion, enough, seat because I consider him to be one of the three greatest French footballers of all time. And he's going to be terribly missed.

29:31Philippe Auclair:It's shocking because seeing what he does with Atletico, he's got a place in the French national team. There's absolutely no doubt about that, even if he doesn't play every single game. But when you remember, he's been France's best player in 2016, 2018, 2022, each tournament. And we're not going to have him. And it's going to be a big miss. If I can ask you a question, Sid, by the way, which is not Griezmann related, it's still Atletico related. I have to say that the type of football that they played, and maybe I didn't watch enough of them this season, but the type of football they played and actually before the sending off, there were moments I thought this is actually bloody, bloody good football.

30:17Philippe Auclair:The combinations, they looked much sharper. They looked much more positive, not at all the Atletico we're supposed to hate which is all prickly and defensive and counter-attack. There was actually some really good stuff being played there. So have we missed or have I missed on something from Atletico this season?

30:35Max Rushden:Just before Sid answers that question, Philippe, that's a trap I've fallen into as well and it's a trap quite a few of the pundits and commentators on TNT Sports I think also fell into. And Terry Gibson, the former player and Spanish football expert raises it on social media. And yeah, I'd be interested to hear what Sid has to say. I'm laughing because I could kind of, I'm quite enjoying the chance to respond to this because I did notice on that minute by minute that I think it was Joe Cole on TNT had prefaced this game as beauty against the beast. And, you know, the Atletico will be all ugly and Barcelona will be all wonderful to watch and stuff.

31:17And it just isn't true. It just isn't the way that Atletico play. Atletico still have that in them. And actually, there was quite a lot of criticism last night. I didn't get a chance to hear very much of it. But post-game, listening to some of the radio responses to it, of what Atletico did in the second half, this idea that you're a man up and a goal up, go and kill them, go and score five, as if that was really, really easy. I actually thought Atletico managed that second half pretty well. And the second goal is, I think, a really good example of that, of slowing it down, bringing it back round and creating the chance.

31:44But you look at Atletico Madrid this season, they beat Barcelona 4-0 at home in the Copa del Rey. and then they went away and lost 3-0 and they were hanging on and people criticised them for it. Well, you know, they got through against Barcelona scoring four goals against them. Last year in the Copa del Rey against Barcelona, it was 4-4. They went to Betis and scored five. If you look at their goals this year, they are just not that team that wins 1-0 anymore. The surprise last night wasn't so much that Atletico scored two as that they didn't concede any. This just isn't true that Atletico are this team.

32:16and so yeah I saw Terry Gibson's tweet and thought yep that sounds about right now admittedly it's very easy to be a smart ass when you follow a league and everyone else doesn't you go well look at this but I do think that and this happens in Spain by the way this happens with people who do watch Athletica all the time that there is a kind of you like a comfort in saying oh there's Simeone and it just isn't true admittedly I do think that some of Simeone's instincts are to are to be protective and so on. There was an interesting comment that Simeone made in the pre-match press conference. And I can't remember the question, but I can remember the answers.

32:50I'm not 100 % sure of the context, but I think it was about Barcelona and defensiveness and being open and so on. And his answer was, teams who attack better tend to defend worse. In other words, you know, the old short blanket theory, you can cover your head or your toes, you can't cover both. Up to a point, it's a choice, but then within that choice, you then got to try and perfect the elements of that choice that you make. And he said, and that's the process that we're in. And it was his admittance that, yeah, we're not defending like we once did, but that's partly because we're now attacking differently to how we once did.

33:23Obviously, all of this is also a product of what you've got available to you. So if you've got a team that has Simeone Jr., that has Julien Alvarez, that has Alex Baena, that has Antoine Griezmann, that has Sorloff, that has Lukman who started on the left-hand side last night. It's natural that your evolution is going to be into something else. And at times there has been that question mark about whether there's a slight disconnect between what the manager wants them to be and what the players that they've got mean that they really should be. Although it would be complete insanity to cover your head with a duvet and have your toes exposed.

33:56I mean, I understand the point, but that would be a mad way to try to sleep.

34:00Lars Sivertsen:Switching the play like Pedri, I do think on the subject of the Terry Gibson tweet, he also mentioned Barcelona's high line, which in fairness, I do think there's a plot line here. Bearing in mind that after Barcelona lost very badly to Atleti earlier in the year, there was the story going around that the players had had a chat with Flick about this high line, about whether sometimes they need to ease off a little bit. And then this tie essentially turns on a ball in behind that leads to a red card. Like, is this being discussed at all? Because that's how they got done here. essentially. Yeah, it is how they got done.

34:39And, you know, it is a recurring theme. And it is a recurring theme, not just in terms of what's happening on the pitch, but in terms of the way that everyone analyses Barcelona and endlessly. And I can't remember which game it is. I think it's the Rayaway-Canon game where one of Rayaway's players said after the game, the manager told us about, and he actually called it the flick line. It sounded like a military defence. It's like the Maginot line. Exactly, like a military defence or something, the flick line. and everybody's aware of that and Flick has talked about there being a slight modification to that but what Flick always insists and obviously in fairness he's right to insist on this is that you know up to a point let's go back to the blanket shall we you take a choice over which bit you cover and if you play with a high line because you think the benefits outweigh the risks now Flick's argument is always and I think he's right and I think although admittedly there are times when you look at it and you think you know if we can all see this why can't you see it and of course the answer is he can see it but he thinks it's worth it.

35:33His answer is always it's actually not so much about where that line is but about how well you press and about not allowing the other team to have the time on the ball to be able to play that pass over the top because although that pass is quite simple in the sense that there's a lot of space to hit and it doesn't need to be perfectly accurate to go beyond the other team's defence you still need to be able to get that pass away and in fairness to Flick this team won every domestic competition last year got to the Champions League semi-final was the width of a post away from reaching a Champions League final this year looks like they're going to win the league again.

36:01They got knocked out of the Copa del Rey. And in that Copa del Rey game, by the way, the 4-0 against Atletico Madrid, Atletico just streamed through them. And it was that high line thing. But Flick's argument is, it's more about how well we press and how well we do the mechanics. And this is one of the reasons why, when you look at Rafinha, and everyone talks about the goals and assists, when Barcelona fans were watching us every week, and when Flick looks at Rafinha, what they see is the guy that leads the press and the guy that's contagious. And this is one of the reasons why, for all of his other qualities, season for all the fact that numerically Rashford's season has been brilliant you know you couldn't ask for more for Rashford numerically one of the doubts is yeah but does he do that stuff that makes the whole structure work and Rashford was well statistically I think their most dangerous player last night I think was six shots or seven shots or something and kept going at now El Molina but there is always that doubt about does the collective functioning work as well when Rafinha is not there because Rafinha is so important for that don't tell Wilson there's a former Man United player who doesn't press because he'll write 55 articles about it in the next year.

37:01Quickly, Sid, this tie is not over, though. We have talked about athletes being good, but Barca created a lot. And if their finishing had been better, they would have been ahead. And they still had chances when they were down to 10. Yeah, there was a suggestion made by both Flick and Simeone actually dealt with this yesterday, that moment when it's 1-0 and you're a man down on whether you stick to it or whether you try and draw it back. And there was, I think, I think there will be some people as they start to pick over it today, who will think perhaps Barcelona could have tried to hold on to the one rather than go and look for it because then you go away to Atletico Madrid and Barcelona winning 1-0 Atletico Madrid is perfectly plausible.

37:36Barcelona scoring two goals at Atletico Madrid is also perfectly plausible, though I suspect that Atletico will score. There we are destroying the cliche again. I suspect Atletico will score, but they may well concede. But yeah, I think you're right. I think it's not over. I think it's a big, big lead though for Atletico who have been really, really good at home this season. And shall we say it one more time? Been really good to watch at home this season as well. And finally, Sid, your reaction from you and from the rest of Spain on the Real Madrid-Bayon game yesterday? Well, I don't know about from the rest of Spain.

38:05I'll try and give you the rest of Spain's view. I see you as speaking for the whole of Spain. We've got all the rest of Spain in Sid's hotel room right now. It's really crowded here. I am the voice of the nation. It's an annoying voice, isn't it? I think the feeling was that for 60 minutes, we saw a reflection of how Real Madrid have been this year. And we saw a really, really good buy. There's a real sense of, wow, they're good, aren't they? Particularly Olisse. I think everyone's watched Olisse. I go, what Olisse did to Carreras. And it makes me laugh a little bit. Should we go back onto destroying cliches or obvious tropes?

38:41The obvious trope that Trent can't defend. Well, the two fullbacks, the one that was struggling to defend wasn't Trent. It was Carreras who was getting taken to bits by Olisse. But then we also saw that Real Madrid reaction. and that I think makes everyone think that maybe there is a chance because Real Madrid it's a god I'm using this word a lot today it's a bit of a cliche but you sort of think if there's someone who can turn this around if there's someone who can be a bit illogical because Real Madrid haven't been good all year but they have their little moments and they have lots of very good players and most of the time it's not functioning well but you just sort of think you know if they get it right if Bayern Munich allow them to to to counter them and to run at them, then maybe there's half a chance.

39:22But yeah, I think the overall feeling was one of Real Madrid's qualities and weaknesses both got shown in this game. And actually, the structural weaknesses are probably too great to really expect them to win anything. But hey, it's Real Madrid. And that's always the answer. There was a front page headline in Marduk. I might even have it here for you. Here we go. There's Marcus. I'm doing it. There's Marcus front page. Sorry, you can say James Richardson. It's allowed, Sid. Don't worry. Can I? I'm doing the James Richardson here. anyway the front page just says for as long as there is life you know and so they're clinging to that good stuff Sid thanks for coming on pal very much a pleasure cheerio Sid Lowe there out in Spain and that'll do for part 2 part 3 we'll preview the Premier League action this weekend

40:14welcome to part 3 of the Guardian Football Weekly So the Premier League returns after quite a while away, what with an international break and FA Cup as well. And it begins, Barry, on Friday night, West Ham Wolves. And this is so huge for West Ham, isn't it? Because a win takes them out of the relegation zone, puts Spurs in it. But if they don't win against quite a good Wolves team, psychologically, you feel that could, you might not recover.

40:38Max Rushden:Yeah, I think you've nailed it there. Wolves, quite a good Wolves team. I think it's a bit of a stretch. They're considerably better than the shockingly bad Wolves team that started the season and continued for five or six games into the Rob Edwards reign, but they are significantly better. It wouldn't surprise me if they beat West Ham. They've had over two weeks off. West Ham had that quite grueling FA Cup match against Leeds last weekend. And it's a game West Ham simply have to win, you'd think. And if they don't, they will only have themselves to blame for anything that happens to them from here on in.

41:21Max Rushden:They should have enough about them to beat Wolves at home, but will they? It's impossible to guess, really. I mean, I hope they don't. Yes, Lars?

41:32Lars Sivertsen:So since the 1st of January, Wolves have taken 14 points in 12 when West Ham have taken 15 and 12. So they're both kind of recovered into something resembling passable lower mid-table form. But of course, because of sins earlier in the season, they're both like right down in it. I think it could be a terrible game, like entertainment to quality. Like this could be absolutely dreadful because they're both teams that excel at like counter-punching, but none of them really want to control the game, I don't think. And given the nerves involved, I mean, this could be horrendous, but it could be one of those, like, you have to watch it still.

42:11Lars Sivertsen:You have to bring up the popcorn. Rubbernecking. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're probably right. And then the next game is the early kickoff on Saturday, Pilipe. Arsenal against Bournemouth. I mean, that was a crucial win yesterday against Sporting. Has that suddenly changed your whole feelings or not? Because Bournemouth have a decent record against Arsenal, I think.

42:32Philippe Auclair:Yes, they do. And it's often been Arsenal's problem to actually fail when you don't really expect them to. But yes, it felt absolutely huge. And thank you again, David Raya, whom I don't see his name mentioned among the candidates for Footballer of the Year. But he's been Arsenal's best player this season. And I think he again showed it at Sporting. And when he's not around, we see the difference in a big, big way. Anyway, but what I'm expecting on Saturday is pain, then more pain. I don't expect it to be a glorious cavalcade of young Arsenal attackers rampaging through the cherry orchard at all.

43:21Philippe Auclair:I'm expecting something yes really painful slow everybody looking at each other with their head in their hands and it's going to be like this until the end of the season

43:33Lars Sivertsen:I'm afraid it is so fascinating because if you look around Europe like the top teams we've talked about it on this like most of the ones have this in common is that they can be absolutely devastating going forward but you don't really trust them down the other end if you talk about Bayern if you talk about Barcelona if you talk about Real Madrid same with PSG really yep and then there's arsenal who are like the again the best defense in europe but like a lot of the times it's not a ton of fun really they're the big outlier here yeah it's just it's just the point that basically you know i'm trying to write a column about this you you know you love football and you want your team to win but you don't actually want your team to be in with a chance of winning because it's just so agonizing that they might not win and then they might be at the bottom and then that's agonising as well.

44:21The Spurs fans speak it. Exactly, you just want to be mid-table. Chelsea play Man City at 4.30 on Sunday. Obviously, a lot depends on the Arsenal results from Saturday, but you feel like City probably need to win all their games pretty much to win the title.

44:39Max Rushden:You'd think so, yes, but obviously that depends on how Arsenal get on. Chelsea's record against Man City in the Premier League recent record is dismal. They haven't won in nine. City have won four of their last five at Stamford Bridge in the league. I would expect City to win this. Chelsea are not in a good Premier League place at the moment. They've won one in six. If they hit their straps, they could cause City no end of problems. But I would expect City to win this. They have to win it, basically. Yeah, they do. And then Nas, 2pm. the Stadium of Light Roberto De Zerbi's first game as the Tottenham manager I can't

45:23Lars Sivertsen:It feels like a big occasion Max

45:30Lars Sivertsen:Well given that he's not exactly the unity candidate I feel like a good start is important but the Stadium of Light is not the easiest not the easiest place to go It is at the moment Lars

45:42Max Rushden:it's no longer the fortress it was

45:44Lars Sivertsen:But have you watched Tottenham play football recently, Barry Glendale? I have, yes. Are you familiar with the work of the Tottenham? I was looking at one of these websites that do previews for this game, and in the comments section, one of the readers has predicted that this will be a 37-0 home win. And interestingly, the username of the reader has THFC in it, So this is the level of self-loathing from the Spurs fans at this point is pretty historic. But I think Roberto de Zerbi is a smart guy. I think he's a very dangerous candidate for this moment. And I'll be watching this from behind the sofa.

46:26Philippe Auclair:When it comes to de Zerbi, the fact is I was rereading this interview that Louis Dunk gave. I don't know if you remember it. Yes. In which he talked of the first two weeks were carnage.

46:39Max Rushden:Yeah.

46:40Philippe Auclair:I love that word carnage to describe what De Zerbi brings. And the other thing is that, of course, you arrive and it's been an international break. But the thing that everybody would know that De Zerbi's temple is basically the training ground. But Tottenham, wherever they are in the league, they still had 13 players on international duty who only came back quite late and not necessarily in the best of conditions, by the way. so he's had barely any time to actually work with those players before the trip to Sunderland and the problem is that you feel that this weekend is the pivotal moment West Ham beats Wolves goes out if Tottenham do not go out of relegation zone do not win they have to win not a draw is not enough if they do not win at Sunderland then the only way is down

47:31Lars Sivertsen:I'm afraid. Maybe this is the way. Thomas Frank tried to motivate them. Igor Tudor seemed to try to demoralise them. None of those things worked. Maybe confusing the players is the way to go. You've just got to push a different button, befuddle them in the manner of the Zerbi. Maybe this is the way. Their last win in the Premier League was against Brentford on the 6th of December. That is more than four months. Four months ago. Colin Miller tweeting, since January 1st, 2025, a period of 15 months. PSG have won more home matches against Premier League teams than Tottenham have. And... Suboptimal.

48:10De Zerbe did, you know, on the subject of, you know, the comments he made about Mason Greenwood, he did apologise and it was good that he apologised and he apologised for making a stance and you've always got to be aware that it's not his first language, but it was, there was a bit of the, I'm sorry if you were offended about the apology. So I think we have to look at his actions after that but it was good that he said something rather than nothing forrest also in trouble they play villa same time as uh spurs go to sunderland villa beat them 3-1 in january if that makes any difference but they are last still fighting for stuff villa so this is a really hard one to call

48:47Lars Sivertsen:i think yeah so villa seemed like they were okay i'm one of those sort of um uh stats nerds and who have kept going on about Villa's XG all year. And then recently, the results have turned. The much-expected Villaing has happened, whether that's to do with their regressing to the mean or whether it's just Kamara being injured and they're missing their holding midfielder, it's hard to say. But then that win against West Ham, the in-form West Ham, they suddenly beat 2-0 last weekend. So I guess the very short answer is who knows with Villa at the moment, who knows the other side of danger leads go to Old Trafford on Monday so we'll cover that next week Palace Newcastle Brentford Everton is you know both of those huge both of these guys are in with a shout of the Champions League I mean it's unlikely but it's possible

49:40Max Rushden:no it's this is a Champions League six pointer basically the ball's on 46 points Brentford are above Everton just by two goals the corresponding fixture at Hill Dickinson was a good game Brentford won that 4-2. And in the second half of this season, Everton, who I famously tip for relegation, the only teams who've picked up more points than them are Arsenal and Manchester United. Now, I noticed Thiago have a striker who's on 19 goals in the league this season. Where the hell would Everton be in the table if they had a striker who was on 19 goals this season? I think they'd be top. It's a very good point.

50:23Lars Sivertsen:Yeah, I do think for Chelsea, for all the money they've spent in the last few years, to be two points ahead of a team that has Beto up front, everyone should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves. Yeah, Burnley Bryant, Liverpool Fulham as well. Moving on, Adam Crafton tweeting, FIFA made a 30-minute documentary about Infantino's 10 years in power. In addition to making an Infantin brand and throwing parties in Miami and Switzerland, bombarded the world of football, asking for messages of congratulations. Would love to know how much was spent on it. oh man i mean he did tweet a link to the documentary i haven't brought myself yet to watch it i don't know if i can but maybe it's maybe for you know professional reasons it has to be done philip you wanted to talk about a jossimar piece that you're doing on uh fifa's partner adi predict street yeah the world famous adi predict street i mean i don't know if people

51:16Philippe Auclair:are really aware what prediction markets are but they're basically huge in america everybody will have heard of Polymarket and maybe Carl Shea as well. They're basically betting operators who offer odds. You play against other people on absolutely everything. And it can be the World Cup, the identity of the winner of the World Cup, but it also can be really controversial. That's a very polite way of saying it. Things such as, when will Israel bomb Beirut again? You can bet on this country. It's absolutely disgraceful. Absolutely disgusting. Oh my God. And prediction markets are actually prohibited in most of Europe.

51:56Philippe Auclair:They are not just illegal, they're prohibited. FIFA has decided, having seen the amount of money that had been put on Polymarket on the World Cup, if you can believe it, I checked this morning, we're close to half a billion dollars being bet just on the identity who is going to win the World Cup in 2026 on Polymarket. It's absolutely crazy. So they obviously thought we must make some money. So they went for a company that honestly didn't really exist. So everything's great. Everything's great. And by the way, we've got a little development in that story, which we're publishing later on this afternoon.

52:35Philippe Auclair:So go to usimarfootball.com for another very piquant detail about the identity of the new CEO of that company. but anyway FIFA has signed the deal and that's it it's more money in FIFA's coffers you know you name it it's the usual stuff and what is crazy max in the long run it will make absolutely no difference well do any of us exist would be perhaps their defense we don't know maybe we're all just ephemeral in this thing but you know good on you for doing some good work just my football.com because they are doing good things. And that'll do for today. Thanks, everybody. Thank you, Lars. Thank you, Max.

53:17Thanks, Barry. Thank you. Good luck on your run, Barry. Blimey. Oh, thank you. Yeah, I'll need it. When is this? Is it the weekend? Sunday. It's Sunday. Sunday. Yeah. Okay. Last few days to get your money to Barry, justgiving.com. Search justgiving Barry Glendening. Give him all your money. Thank you, Philippe. Merci, monsieur. De rien. Merci à toi. Merci à toi. Football Weekly is produced by Thayup Apula and Jesse Howard. Our executive producer is Joel Grove we will be back on Monday Barry may be alive we will find out then

53:58Philippe Auclair:this is the Guardian