Tuchel’s giant England squad and an EFL roundup – Football Weekly

0:00This is The Guardian.

0:30George Elek:And realistically, what starting positions are still up for grabs? Then on to the EFL. Are Kov ready for the Premier League? Who of Middlesbrough, Ipswich, Millwall and even Hull would be the most interesting to join them? It's exhaustingly tight at the bottom of the championship. Oxford, Leicester, Pompey, West Brom and Blackburn all desperate to avoid joining Sheffield Wednesday. Lincoln could be promoted from League One at Easter with Cardiff sure to join them with perhaps nine teams still vying for the playoffs. In League Two, it's picked three from six for the automatics with Bromley almost certainly there plus a four-way scrap to stay in the league.

0:58George Elek:We'll do all that. answer your questions and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.

1:07George Elek:On the panel today, Sani Rudjavadjala, welcome. Hello, hello from Salford Uni. If I have to disappear at the end, I apologise in advance, but learning's got to be done as well. It absolutely has. What's the subject of today's lesson, Sani? Live blogging and thankfully I'm with my colleague as well, so she might start them off if I delay to talk Bromley, it'll be okay. It'll be all right. Okay, good stuff. Then it is a NotTheTop20 slash the England pod from NotTheTop20 takeover. Ali Maxwell, hello. Hello. Pleased to hear that Sani is developing the Barrys of the future. Yeah, absolutely right. And George Alec, hello.

1:46Hi, Max. If I have to leave early, it definitely won't be for learning. Okay.

1:50George Elek:Well, maybe our listeners will learn something from today, but history would suggest it's unlikely right let's talk about England to start with they know the 35 man squad 11 players arriving after the Uruguay game I mean you can George get caught up with who's going to be the 23rd player because ultimately it doesn't have a massive bearing on the matches but Ben White's inclusion is interesting after Kwanzaa was ruled out especially with Trent's continued exclusion yeah I think that's kind of the big the big story here he's someone who's been in the international Wilderness for three and a half years despite that time coinciding with the best period of his club career playing as a you know a really important player for Arsenal.

2:27Ironically I guess this call-up comes off the back of not a great performance in quite a big game on Sunday. I think it's divided opinion amongst England fans I think some feel like his decision to basically step away from the England national team fairly early on in his career at quite an important stage means that he shouldn't necessarily be welcomed back. There have been a lot of rumours and conjecture about what happened under the Southgate regime I think it's probably quite telling that towards the end of gareth southgate's tenure there was talk that white had effectively ruled himself out of returning back to the national fold and now under tuchel he's happy to come back in that suggests that something has changed he's someone that will hopefully or i mean depending which way you look at it but will likely come to the summer having one at least one pretty big trophy with his with his club team um and that's fairly significant

3:11George Elek:that's a big if there george that is that's a big yeah yeah you think at least one maybe but in In terms of profile of player, I think that's kind of the interesting thing here, where Trent Alexander-Arnold is clearly an immensely talented footballer. But again, going back to the Southgate era, if you think back to the last major tournament we had in the Euros in Germany, even by then, Southgate was still unsure how to use Trent. In that first game, he played as kind of a hybrid right wing back slash centre midfielder. He was then taken out of the team and used to substitute. I, like many others, thought that a change of manager might see Trent basically ushered in immediately and installed as our first choice right back.

3:43But I think it's gone the other way, where Tuchel looks at his skill set and while appreciating that he's an unbelievable footballer and a very unique talent I think what he wants from his right back and his fullback is basically a very good one-on-one defender who's going to be competent in possession and provide a really good platform for the attacking players to play and that and that isn't Trent so and if you look at Bakayo Saka who'll surely be you know occupying that right wing role he's played a lot of his best football in his career with Ben White at right back and at least with a pretty sturdy um you know capable steady right back rather than a trend behind him so it makes some sense I think as an England fan it's quite frustrating maybe that we don't get to at least see him have a look at Alexander-Arnold but maybe at this stage in March it's too late to do that anyway because I think he knows the roles that he wants from his team

4:24George Elek:yeah and actually Ali if you look at the England team and that obviously there's a lot of football to be played between now and June but it feels like the fullbacks are the most up for grabs positions like you sort of imagine it's it's obviously Pickford then it's probably Gaye in Concer is it? The three in midfield, Ryze Anderson and Rodgers and then Saka Kane, probably Gordon. But right and left back, there's a lot of questions. Yeah, on the England pod, pretty much every month we go through every position and we discuss what's sort of up for grabs. And I suppose Rodgers versus Bellingham in the number 10 role is still a big conversation.

4:59But it's certainly Rodgers' shirt to lose, it seems at this point, particularly with Bellingham recovering from injury. and yeah at left back it's been quite funny because every single time England's had an international camp we've commented on how pleased we've been with the new left back so it was Lewis Hall and then it was Miles Lewis Skelly and then it was Nico O 'Reilly and Jed Spencers popped up there as well and then we wondered if Luke Shaw might come back into the reckoning but no now we're pretty happy with Nico O 'Reilly except oh god he's playing really well as a number 8 for Man City is that a problem?

5:30Probably not the good news is Lewis Hall looks absolutely sensational at the moment and everyone's pretty happy that he's back in. And no doubt he'll start on Friday night against Uruguay, a game that I'm really excited about because although the first team, if you like, are going to be playing against Japan and they are the most important unit, if you like, you know, all the speculation around the World Cup squad is really, really exciting and fun to me. And I think essentially this Uruguay game is kind of like the Squid Games. There are players being pitted against each other for the honour of being probably England's first reserve in each position.

6:05And some of them, you can line them up against each other and it'll be quite exciting to track that game. So Foden against Parma. I honestly think only one of them will go to the World Cup. I think they'll both get some minutes against Uruguay. And therefore, every time they touch the ball, it's going to be quite important if they can make something happen as long as they do their work out of possession. You know, it's like a bad touch. You give it away. You get killed. You're out. You're not going to the US.

6:30George Elek:Which, Sani, is such a stupid way for anyone to play a football match, isn't it? I mean, I know that's what he has to judge it, but it's just ridiculous if, you know, Cole Palmer overhits a pass. That's it. No World Cup for him. Yeah, it's the finest of margins, isn't it? You could be talking 15 minutes on a pitch to decide your entire career. Better this than previous tournaments, right? Previous managers where they've just kind of arbitrarily cut to the number that you'll need for the tournament this early. I suppose why not keep it open and wide as possible? yeah a lot of discourse about the first game being like england b essentially and um was it chris sutton many years ago turned down england b yeah he refused to play yes yeah you know he does regret it does chris yeah well well yeah absolutely so i suppose yeah a good opportunity because because you do never know you know trevor sinclair all those years ago 2002 came out of what nowhere really he didn't really have that chance and did really well and he's kind of the exception of a He had a great World Cup, didn't he?

7:27He did. He did have a great World Cup. And that's the thing. And what was he? He came in for Danny Murphy, I think, was it? And Danny Murphy was himself a replacement, was it? Or something like that. Anyway, if you've got enough players who are familiar with the setup and know what Tuchel wants, it does save you a lot of that legwork, doesn't it? So, yeah, strange. Really strange. Very sad for Trent. But, yeah, I kind of like the idea of, I'm a people pleaser. You know, let's not upset anyone. Let's just keep them all happy for as long as possible. and then absolutely break their hearts so they can't get to the World Cup.

7:57George Elek:George, what do you make of James Garner coming in and the recalled players, Harry Maguire, Kobe Maynard and Fikari Tamori? I have to wonder, in these cases, if this is a direct knock-on effect of Tuchel having signed the new deal since the last squad. This is the first squad that Thomas Tuchel has named since he's confirmed that he'll be carrying on as England manager post the World Cup. I find it hard to really believe that Garner in particular is going to force his way into the reckoning. His club form is obviously brilliant and you know if you're going to take the view that players can deserve a call-up which is up for debate anyway but I think he is someone that probably does deserve to be looked at by the England manager if Tuchel was still intending on leaving his his job in the summer after the World Cup then I wonder if he'd be overly bothered about having a look at players it suggests to me that he's he wants to you know he when he first joined as as England manager there were reports that he made a huge list of all the players that were kind of in his pool of thoughts and now maybe he's taking a look at some more of those and then obviously he's going to be on for a longer period of time but Tamori you know he's someone who there's been kind of a small clamour for him consistently over the last few years given his form at AC Milan another player who I think given we don't have immense depth at centre-back it's important to look at he's playing consistently at a very high level and is an important player for his club and is in good form too so I don't know is there a world where James Garner puts in two incredible performances against Uruguay and Japan and forces his way into the World Cup squad?

9:26Possibly but I think it's quite unlikely although important to note as well that he's played for the England Un21s in the past he's played at right back and for Everton too so having an option there who can play either as a centre midfielder or as a right back could be appealing for a World Cup

9:39George Elek:and actually Ali who is the what's the reserve midfield if you know something happens to Anderson and Rice or one or the other Yeah, so Anderson and Rice are obviously missing this first game and they'll start, you'd imagine, against Japan to kind of continue establishing their relationship. Feels like an Anderson-Rice starting duo at the base midfield is almost, you know, as locked in as anything could be at this point a couple of months before the World Cup. Which means, you know, depending on how serious Thomas Tuchel is about Jordan Henderson being an England player rather than sort of the England mentor of the dressing room, it's him and Garner and then Maynou and Wharton.

10:20And clearly, one of the main benefits of Elliot Anderson's emergence has been unleashing Declan Rice, if you like, something that's been talked about a lot at club and country level. How do we unleash Declan Rice? Because he's really good as the deepest midfielder, but he's world class as the number eight. And so I suppose you have to look at it in those terms as well. It's who would excel in Anderson's position were he to be missing. Wharton's progressive passing is world class. For Palace, he doesn't actually always pick it up off the centre backs. He quite often plays a little bit further forward, but I've no doubt he could play that role quite well.

10:54Garner, as George has discussed, I think Mayno you probably want as the Rice, really, because he's so good in the middle and final thirds and such a good ball carrier in particular and a good passer as well, but that's probably not his main strength. And then Henderson probably is that deep orchestrator who's just going to keep things simple and make sure tactically so, so good and will maintain position. So it's those four. It would take a lot, I think, for Ghana to make the World Cup squad ahead of Wharton and Henderson who've been in so many squads. And I think Mainu would probably be considered ahead of him as well at this point just um on reflection of uh this giant squad and the fact we're going to talk england i i rooted through some of my uh my old i'm going to call them family heirlooms right i want to take you back to the winter of 1996 the glow of euro 96 has happened it's been and gone um okay index remember index the rival to argos and in the bargain section of index were some of the corinthian bobbleheads from euro 96 which i was oh i can't afford them at the time yeah but this was like the extended squad um which i managed to get for about six quid so so i thought i'd bust them out so this is potentially the future here so i present we guess have you got have you got a david unsworth i do have a david unsworth there we go okay

12:15George Elek:that's a great i think i'm really five points for me i think can you guess the other two carinthian bobbleheads players that i have they are both one cap wonders this is the original um cryptocurrency wasn't it what are the other two then they're one cow is they in the squad steve howey's a great shout i i think i do have a steve howey but he's not one of the ones in my hand when you said i'll take you back to the winter of 1996 i saw max's eyes lighter than mine if i'm honest somewhat ladies though i was i was i was more preoccupied with starting school in the autumn of if we're being honest would i would i rather spend 45 minutes guessing these two bobbleheads or talk about what's happening mid-table in the championship.

12:58George Elek:I'm going to say one thing, but in the interest of everyone else. I'll speed you up then. I'll speed you up. So Corinthians went to the trouble of giving this man an unshaven look as a defender. And do you want to put extra plastic to give them long hair? Oh, Barry Venison? It is Barry Venison. Yes. Okay. Okay. Great stuff. And the final one is Neil Razor Ruddock. These players have the chance to be the equivalence of a bobblehead and they can live on forever and 30 years later a 40 year old man will be looking forward to pass this barry venison on to his seven-year-old son very confused but this is the future of these england players they could end up you know immortalized in some form sanny i'm absolutely delighted you brought that to the table feels the right time to end part one and we'll do the championship in part two

13:52George Elek:Welcome to part two of the Guardian Football Weekly. So the top of the championship looks like this. Coventry have 80 points, nine points ahead of Middlesbrough on 71. Ipswich have a game in hand on 69. Millwall 69. Hull 66. And then in the race for the playoff, Southampton in the final playoff place on 63. Wrexham have 63 and Derby have 60. So the question on Coventry, I guess, is look, they had that blip. Then they went on a brilliant run, won six games, lost to Southampton on great forms. but beat Swansea this weekend. How do you think they'll do in the Premier League? Always find this quite difficult because, you know, we're talking about the team that, you know, in terms of me and George's EFL podcast, the team that we talk about every week as being the best by miles.

14:36And so, you know, to sort of pivot and go, well, actually, they'll probably be one of the worst next season. But history suggests that might be the case because the odds are so stacked against these teams. Essentially, as far as I can tell from this season, we've had a good season, right, in that Sunderland and Leeds have competed really well. And how did they do that? They spent tens, maybe upwards of 100 million pounds on massive, really fast guys who can run unbelievably quickly, sort of smash other players and, you know, score either on the counterattack or from set pieces, but not very much in terms of kind of open play threat.

15:15so that if that's the blueprint will be tricky for Coventry at the moment they play very stylish attacking kind of 4-2-3-1 4-4-2 type situation they play through the thirds in the main that one of the reasons they've got better again and so consistently over the last few seasons but one of their big upgrades this year was just you know playing for their physicality and attack they do have two or three really impressive physical strikers particularly Ellis Sims and Brandon Thomas Asante so they have played forward quicker and they have been better sort of in transition if you like a bit more a bit harder to set up against that was one criticism of Lampard last season was that actually if you just sat in for 90 minutes they might find it hard to break you down but they've they've got over that this year they've got Matt Grimes who plays 90 passes a game at the base of midfield he's like the kind of Javi of the championship and there'll certainly be some questions about whether he can be anything like a Xavi in the Premier League and if he can't then they will have to change the way that they play because he everything goes through him they haven't been that incredible defensively uh this season I'd say that they've had vulnerabilities on that front and their goalkeeper has been one of the players of the season in the championship Carl Rushworth but he's a lone e from Brighton so possibly won't be with them next season so there's certainly plenty of question marks heading up to the uh the Premier League they've got plenty of time to prepare for it, given that their promotion should be rubber stamped early to mid-April.

16:43And what I should say is their recruitment team has been absolutely sensational for a really long period of time. Coventry's success is, you know, a lot of it gets put down to the management of Mark Robbins and then subsequently passing the baton to Frank Lampard, who's taken them to another level. But deep down, it's been Coventry's success in the transfer market both in buying players to contribute for the first team most crucially selling them for lots of money and then buying more players who make the team even better has been remarkable so I would like to think that recruitment team will make a pretty good fist of it whether they'll be able to spend as much money as Sunderland or as Leeds I mean that that comes down to an appetite for risk really doesn't it.

17:25George Elek:How impressed have you been with with Lampard George and what's he done well this season? Yeah really impressed I was one of the many who couldn't really understand the decision to sack robbins and appoint lampard at a time where lampard's managerial stock was was pretty low you know there's a big difference between the the frank lampard we saw we saw at derby county and early on at chelsea where you know he was initially assisted by jody morris and now he's assisted by joe edwards and there is a very clear the style of play shift now that might be lampard's development as a as a coach or it might be because actually you know assistant coaches do a lot more than we as football fans normally give them credit for because they are you know often leading training and um and play a big part in how they set a team up um but Lampard's uh Coventry you know his Derby side were just relentless presses which often worked but often would get paid the the press would get played through quite easily now Coventry seem a much more well-rounded um side especially in possession who often find ways to um to break a team down who have no issue breaking down a low block I think individuals have flourished under him as well so he's done incredibly well like he's you know I think the decision to appoint him now looks like a masterstroke and a managerial career that looked like it was spiraling a little bit is now back you know he's gonna be a Premier League manager next season by merit not because he's Frank Lampard and not because some owner in the Premier League has decided they'd like to have Frank Lampard as their manager so the tough part starts now because there is a cycle that we see so consistently of teams like Coventry like Middlesbrough Ipswich were this team where they come up as a really good in possession side and they go to the premier league and they realize that style of play means they're probably going to get relegated and that either means that the manager who got them there in the first place is sacked or the manager has to change their approach which is what we've seen with leads this season where leads certainly out of possession are a completely different side under daniel farker than they were in the championship last season and that is a manager daniel farker who's paid the price for not changing the style of play twice with Norwich in the past.

19:24So it's going to be interesting. You know, Lampard's had a job at Everton. So he's already managed a team who don't necessarily, you know, dominate possession in the Premier League. And it went okay for a while and then didn't go great. So the transition of style of play is going to be important because as Ali says, it's hard to see them coming up and being able to rely on players, you know, like Grimes to have as much impact upper level when they're not going to be able to play a high line and they're not going to be able to dominate the ball.

19:52George Elek:sanny you were and it's so tight below them middlesbrough in second at the moment bibs which have a game in hand on them in third and then millwall and i don't think you can discount hull um you guys may want to discount them but you sanny before this were listening to a middlesbrough fan podcast i did say it's possible to over prepare but what are they saying because middlesbrough two points from their last three games i mean this is this is the wrong time to drop off isn't it Yeah, once you've prepared for a pod by bringing a Barry Venison doll into the frame, you know, you can do whatever you like then.

20:24Yeah, the general feeling of fans is kind of similar to what I suppose we'd all kind of say, which is they've never really had an out-and-out striker and they're creating all these chances. And now they don't seem to have anyone to put in the back of the net. They're playing David Strelik up front, who the podcast mentioned that two Slovakian journalists had told them that he's not actually a striker. I think he's got five goals this season, so that's not working great. Tommy Conway as well isn't that sort of player, and I think he's playing a bit more wide. So they are a bit worried because, yes, it's absolutely the wrong time.

20:57The previous week, I was at Sheffield Wednesday Ipswich, and that was the week where everybody dropped points apart from Ipswich, who accidentally have now become almost in the driving seats, and it's just that time of the season. and Borough finally I think maybe the failings of a squad that aren't quite well they certainly aren't at the level of Ipswich for example obviously because Ipswich came down from the Premier League Helberg style of play of just you know flood players forward has worked pretty well until they haven't got anyone to finish it off and that's really kind of hurt them these last couple of games have they got enough to get over the line I don't know I've seen Ipswich now not play great and still get results and they've got players coming back so yeah whereas previously we were like yeah Burra the best of the rest I'm not so sure anymore and they play Millwall on Good

21:41George Elek:Friday Ali who drew with Ipswich this weekend I mean I keep expecting Millwall to drop off because Millwall don't play in the Premier League ever you know and and that is you know in the same way I don't expect Tottenham to get relegated even though they probably will do you think Millwall can keep this up it's sort of incredible achievement from Alex Neal yeah I think they can I wouldn't necessarily have said that two months ago but I honestly think when you get to this stage of the season the way that they're playing you know the second half against Ipswich on Saturday they're 1-0 down at Portman Road in a game where you know most people people uh minded like you would go okay Ipswich 1-0 up at home they'll probably win this that might be the end of Millwall in the in the um in the automatic promotion picture they were excellent in the second half they scored a really good equalizing goal and they hit the bar in injury time they could have easily won that game um against Middlesbrough I would be very confident that Alex Neal will have the perfect game plan because this is one of the most underrated managers in in championship history of like the guy is amazing and um tactically brilliant and this Millwall team are really really good and again it's it's that classic thing we always try and and make this point on the podcast is like if you can try and remove the actual name of the teams almost do like a blind taste test and you looked at these three you know yes Mill will score slightly fewer goals than the other two teams but they are all neck and neck over 39 games and that's because they're all broadly as good as each other and you can do the same with the playing squad yeah Ipswich have got players that they paid some of them they paid over 10 million quid for and Middlesbrough have got Hayden Hackney who's probably the best player in the league but Millwall's players they may not have come for as much money and they may not be as well recognised but they are playing as well as anyone that Middlesbrough and Ipswich have.

23:32Femi Aziz on the right wing they signed for one million quid from Reading he's probably now worth 15 and a lot of Premier League clubs reported to be looking at him he's been one of the most impactful players at the level. Tristan Kramer they signed from Brentford B and is one of the most dominant defenders can play centre-back and right-back and excels in both but there's loads of others as well Camille Negley's a 24 year old Dutchman you know they were the ones that brought Zean Fleming over to the UK and and he's now excelling as a Premier League player that they're really really good in terms of recruitment and it's not just you know six foot four Steve Morrison's like their their recruitment team have played an absolute blinder over the last few years as well they've used the overseas market as well as any championship club and all their players are playing just as well as all the other players so I feel you know it may be they go to borough and lose 4-0 but actually there'd still be six games to go and i believe in this millwall team's kind of both quality and their staying power yeah they're last in the top division in 89-90 when cambridge obviously knocked them out of the fourth round

24:38George Elek:of the fa cup we all remember that uh should we ignore hull george from this automatic permit picture no i don't think we can at this stage um hull are in this a strange position where they're in fifth they're on 66 points from 39 games my reckoning is that their fans and their players are looking upwards and thinking you know borough play milwell someone's going to drop points there we're only five points off there's no reason why with a good run we can't force away into the top two i also think that wrexham and derby who sit seventh and eighth who are three points and six points behind hull they're probably looking at sampton's form who sit in between them and their relentless winning run and thinking it's probably hull that we can aim out here in hull that we try and get past so they're the team who i mean all season they've defied logic they've defied they've defied the data you know their underlying numbers the xg and all that stuff has them as a bottom half team but consistently they've proven that wrong i would definitely say that there has been an uptick in their performance level over the last 10 games or so where they're now putting in way more displays where they win games and deserve to win them and put like a clear gap in quality over the 90 minutes between them and their opposition they had a game against Millwall I think it was last week where they were probably the better side and came away having lost the game which hasn't happened too many times in the season so it would basically be a fool to predict what's going to happen to Hull between now and the end of the campaign it feels like you can't really rule them out finishing the top two finishing in the playoff places or even falling out of it all together and Southampton's form Sonny is really impressive Rich saying how good is Tonda Eckert can they win promotion through the playoffs yes it kind of comes down to them and and wrecks them really it's the margins are so tight I'm surprised you haven't started this question by mentioning Shea Charles goal against Oxford which was was absolutely incredible just that absolutely if you haven't seen it and I don't think he was really involved was he was like it was a set piece that was kind of recycled and it dropped to him or kind of rolled to him and he side foot it went across the ball top corner there was a man who oh stop it I've just seen it that is some hit yeah oh it's incredible that was uh that was some live blogging for you yeah well when you when you get a chance to watch the replay a few times There's a man who looks a little bit like John Bruin in a flat cap, just behind the goal as well, in like a blue and yellow striped shirt.

26:49And he's really excited. I really wish it was John Bruin.

26:53George Elek:Never knowingly excited, I would say, John Bruin. And I know the boys have been waxing lyrical on Shea Charles for quite some time, and he's not always been in the first team. But when you've got someone like that able to throw in, it's just exactly what you need. and I mentioned Wrexham I've seen a lot recently and two of the last three home games three games actually including at the weekend at Sheffield United and to come from behind there they are missing Kiefer Moore because of what he does and I think this season Kiefer Moore's kind of really emphasised how much of a more rounded player he is than maybe we gave him credit for he's not just like a big target man like you go back to his Cardiff days you just stand it up and boom it in but some of the goals he scored this season some of his link plays been great and missing him has meant Wrexham have been a bit more one-dimensional kind of hit Sam Smith and he's so strong he's got so much pace he's like he's built like a barrel but a really fast one and that's caused quite a few issues and Issa Kaborre who they've got on loan from Man City is a fantastic player who whipped in the ball for the winner for Smith and it's kind of between those two I mean Southampton have got a better goal difference and I am also looking at Hull who are incredibly efficient but then you think, well, at some point they're going to come unstuck and yet they haven't.

28:10And I've kind of grown a bit fond of this Wrexham side now, maybe because they keep being nice to me, maybe because I was nice to them on the pod last time. But it's quite difficult for them to catch Southampton it because there's so little margin for error.

28:22George Elek:Do you think a professional footballer would take it as a compliment to be described as a fast barrel? I mean, maybe they would. He's a very good player, Sam Smith. I obviously watched a lot of him when he was at Cambridge. Now, Sandy, you were at the live from Wrexham with Rob and Ryan. Swansea's chief executive, Tom Gorin, just said the club will raise concerns over television coverage of their game against Wrexham, with the EFL saying Wrexham were given priority at every opportunity. Rob McElhinney called being able to commentate on the game. He wasn't the commentator on the main coverage, it's worth saying.

28:52George Elek:It was the most rewarding professional experience of his entire life, which will be a blow to the directors of It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia. What do you make of it, Sunny? Do you think Swansea have a point? I think you've got to remember that And anytime you've got the home team doing something special, they're always going to be the story because they're the home team, right? It's all set up for them. But in this situation, I suppose, look, you know, put my hands up. You know, I was there reporting on the game for Sky Sports and these guys were commentating. I think it was their production arm and it's part of the documentary.

29:25And it was kind of a synergy with Sky and David Protton, who, by the way, I met for the first time, is the nicest man in sports broadcasting. What a lovely guy he is.