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In short
Football Weekly episode centers on a controversial VAR decision in the Manchester derby (Man United 0-1 Man City). ProRef issued a statement: Haaland’s goal was checked and deemed onside; VAR also said Enzo Fernandes didn’t play the ball, making any offside “subjective,” and that VAR should have recommended an on-field review. Panelists argue referees/VAR are overwhelmed by data and lack “data wonk” expertise, while also debating whether Foden’s red card was correct and whether Bruno should have been booked too. Key examples: Haaland’s hour-mark goal; Foden’s sending off for kicking Bruno Fernandes; comparisons to other football mistakes.
Guests
Barry Glendening, Barney Ronay, Max (unnamed), and John Brewin (Guardian staff/panelists). They also discuss Arsenal’s 2-0 win at Sunderland (Bruno Guimarães late goal; David Raya penalty save), plus Chelsea 2-2 Hull, Ipswich’s win at Palace, Brighton 5-0 Coventry (Lewis Dunk goal of the season), Forest beating Villa, Bournemouth drawing Brentford, and Liverpool drawing Fulham.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOMatch Summaries and Highlights
0:30 to 1:42
Recap of significant football matches, including results and standout moments.
“How will AI revolutionize your business?”
Panel Introductions
1:42 to 2:17
Introducing the panel members discussing football topics, with a touch of humor.
“With all that, plus your questions, and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.”
Manchester Derby Overview
2:17 to 2:56
In-depth discussion about the Manchester derby, focusing on key events and decisions.
“Manchester United 0, Manchester City 1, Erling Haaland on the hour.”
VAR Controversy
2:56 to 3:40
Discussion about the VAR decision related to Haaland's goal and its implications.
“I mean, I have a clear position on this.”
Referee Performance and Challenges
3:40 to 4:36
Debate about the challenges referees face in modern football, especially with VAR.
“These are people who've just been superseded by how hard it is to be bombarded with all this information.”
Potential Solutions for Refereeing
4:36 to 6:32
Exploration of potential solutions or changes needed in the refereeing process.
“You know, who could presumably go and sit in an office and earn a truckload more without getting death threats every five minutes?”
Mistakes and Human Error in Football
6:32 to 7:56
Discussion on the inevitability of mistakes in football, both by players and referees.
“I thought the standard of refereeing at the World Cup was quite good, but there were some really, really high-profile boo-boos there as well.”
Impact of VAR on Decision Making
7:56 to 8:15
Analysis of how VAR has changed the refereeing landscape and decision-making processes.
“But there doesn't seem to be much forgiveness for the refereeing community out there, does there?”
In-Depth Analysis of The Red Cards
8:15 to 10:40
Examining the red card incidents from the match and discussing their fairness.
“has led to even more human error, like the one of these two blokes sat in a, or three blokes sat in a VAR room, coming up with that decision.”
Philosophical Debate on Referee Decisions
10:40 to 14:00
Engaging in a philosophical discussion about the nature of referee decisions and their consequences.
“And Enzo Maresca, he is a good manager, but he's particularly good at these specific tactical jobs.”
Show all 36 chapters
Retaliation in Football: A Discussion
14:00 to 14:15
Exploring how retaliation is perceived in football and its implications.
Historical Context of Retaliation
14:15 to 14:48
Referencing historical football incidents involving retaliation.
“obviously the example brought up is the david beckham diego simeone or do you remember when Dennis Wise pinched Nicky Butt at Stamford Bridge.”
Manchester United's Disappointing Performance
14:48 to 15:01
Analyzing Manchester United's performance in their recent match.
“We saw an awful lot of that type of thing in the World Cup, didn't we?”
Tactical Shortcomings in Midfield
15:01 to 15:56
Discussing the tactical issues faced by Manchester United's midfield.
“If you look at the XG between Foden sending off and later on in the game, it's negligible levels.”
City's Strong Performance and Substitutions
15:56 to 16:12
Evaluating Manchester City's performance and strategic substitutions.
“And the substitution of Cherki at half-time for Andai created that extra dimension to City, a bit more speed.”
Arsenal's Success at Sunderland
16:12 to 16:49
Commenting on Arsenal's recent victory and standout moments.
“But as Barney says, they've got the far better players.”
Gimeraj's Striking Performance
16:49 to 17:41
Highlighting Gimeraj's impressive goal and its significance.
“Yeah, and he really enjoyed that one, didn't he?”
Analyzing Gimeraj's Goal and Team Dynamics
17:41 to 18:39
Examining the setup and teamwork behind Gimeraj's goal.
“Yeah, you know, like he's sort of got the assist for Saka as well because that pass is perfectly timed, isn't it?”
Arsenal's Defensive Strategy
18:39 to 19:15
Discussing Arsenal's changes in defensive tactics this season.
“We mentioned the Donnarumma save as well.”
Controversial Penalty Decisions
19:15 to 20:06
Delving into the penalty decisions impacting Arsenal's game.
“So they've drawn praise for being more, I guess, creative on the ball is the easiest way of describing it, but just creating more from open play.”
Arteta's Reaction to VAR Decisions
20:06 to 20:53
Analyzing Arteta's response to recent VAR decisions affecting his team.
“you know his post-match recriminations of this decision are clearly a warning shot across the bow of the hated organisation pro-ref to sort that act out it was a poor decision it was a poor decision also backed by VAR.”
Psychology of Refereeing Decisions
20:53 to 21:45
Exploring the psychological aspects of refereeing and decision-making.
The Role of Grappling in Football
21:45 to 22:54
Discussing the concept of grappling in football and its implications.
Sunderland's Competitive Spirit
22:54 to 23:37
Highlighting Sunderland's competitiveness against Arsenal.
Reflections on Judo and Football Tactics
23:37 to 24:28
Drawing parallels between judo tactics and football strategies.
“competitive, Grant Jack was good, Mookie Eli was good Broby gave the Arsenal centre-halves plenty to think about.”
Chelsea vs Hull: A Season Overview
24:36 to 25:47
Analyzing the Chelsea vs Hull match and its implications for the season.
Emi Martinez's Goalkeeping Challenges
25:47 to 28:01
Examining Emi Martinez's performance amid Chelsea's defensive struggles.
“It's too early to say, but on the face of it, Hull are going to make an awful lot of people, including me, look very stupid this season.”
Discussing Chelsea's Goalkeeping Situation
28:01 to 29:59
Exploration of Chelsea's goalkeeper choices and their fit within the team's structure.
“And I suppose he's probably had, well, he comes back from the World Cup.”
Ipswich's Promising Start
30:00 to 31:39
Analysis of Ipswich's performance and key player contributions in recent matches.
“I mean, okay, two goals, but actually the coil miss you mentioned, Barry, his skill to set that up was so good from Volumi.”
Coventry's Struggles Against Brighton
31:40 to 35:39
Review of Coventry's difficulties in their match against Brighton and the standout moments.
“And if they don't tighten that up, they're going to be in trouble.”
Villa's Disappointing Game and Management Woes
35:40 to 38:25
Discussion on Villa's lackluster performance and the implications of management changes.
“So that would be a huge source of concern.”
Liam De Lappe's Redemption at Southampton
38:26 to 42:00
Highlighting Liam De Lappe's promising performance after a difficult time at Chelsea.
“they've been totally destabilised by players leaving.”
Bournemouth vs. Brentford Match Discussion
42:00 to 45:03
The hosts analyze the Bournemouth and Brentford match, highlighting key moments and player performances.
“I think I've been to that fixture both in London and Bournemouth.”
Spurs Struggles and Transfer Window Review
45:12 to 47:07
The panel reflects on Tottenham's lack of scoring and the implications of their recent transfer window.
“Mark says, remember a couple of years ago when you wrote about someone, Luton, I think, going a whole season without scoring?”
Liverpool vs. Fulham Match Analysis
47:07 to 51:16
The hosts discuss Liverpool's performance against Fulham, including player evaluations and match highlights.
“uh I mean that transfer window that every that Spurs fans got excited about I saw described as the worst transfer window in history and so you know it's fans the fans are taking it well they're taking it well.”
Eddie Howe's Future and Referee Aspirations
51:16 to 55:19
Discussion about the potential coaching changes in Spurs and United, as well as a humorous story about a child's desire to become a referee.
“And they've got so many weak spots in the team and players who you just think, no, it's not going to work, it's not going to happen, particularly in the full-back positions.”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00John Brewin:This is The Guardian.
0:30John Brewin:to pick a side. You can have them all. How will AI revolutionize your business? AWS AI is how.
1:00and VAR should have disallowed it. All we want is consistency, Brian. City were better even with 10 men. Phil Foden sent off for kicking Bruno Fernandes slightly harder and slightly higher than Bruno Fernandes kicked him. At City's fourth win in a row to keep up with Arsenal then, who won at Sunderland, Bruno Gimaraes with a glorious goal after a David Reyes brilliant penalty save following Ezra Consa's horrific foul on Dan Ballard. Also today, Hull's brilliant start continues, a creditable point at score a lot, concede a lot Chelsea. A brilliant win for Ipswich away at Palace. Brighton hit five at Coventry.
1:28Lewis Dunk should be worth at least two. A huge win for Forrest at Villa and an exciting draw between Bournemouth and Brentford. Spurs, the gift that keeps on giving. Was it Eisenhower who was president the last time they scored a goal in the Premier League? While Anfield look equally blunt as Fulham get their first points of the season. With all that, plus your questions, and that's today's Guardian Football Weekly.
1:53On the panel today, Barry Glendening, welcome. Hello, Max. Hello, Barney Rone.
1:58Barney Ronay:Hi, Max. Hi, everyone. I haven't seen you since New York. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Thanks for coming. Still doing this podcast, you guys? Yeah, we still seem to be doing it. Still trotting it out. John Bruin, hello.
2:11John Brewin:Hi. Yeah, I'm still here, Barney. So, hi. Yeah. All still doing it. And all with that enthusiasm. Let's start with the Manchester derby then. Manchester United 0, Manchester City 1, Erling Haaland on the hour. And we'd like to begin, obviously, with a statement from ProRef. We can provide clarification regarding Erling Haaland's awarded goal. The on-field decision was offside. That was checked by VAR and Erling Haaland was found to be in an onside position. In the same attack, it was established that Enzo Fernandes did not play the ball and therefore that makes any offside offence subjective. However, on this occasion, the VAR did not recognise the likely impact of his position and should have recommended an on-field review.
2:52Contact has been made with Manchester United this evening to acknowledge that we deem is an error of judgment a review of the incident will take place i mean barney it is your dream to come on here and talk about var and i don't want to stand in the way of your dreams
3:05Barney Ronay:no sorry it was just the way you read the statement there he did not did not realize i didn't realize like it's just really comical because he attempted like a pile driving diving power header and like sort of nat lof house in 1953 and it was just a bad decision a bad mistake I mean, an inexplicable bad mistake because you're watching it thinking, how's that happened? Why are you doing another apology? I mean, I have a clear position on this. I just think that the referees are spooked. They're not up to it. It's really difficult. These are people who've just been superseded by how hard it is to be bombarded with all this information.
3:46Barney Ronay:if you think about what footballers are like they're it's almost impossible to imagine how good a premier league footballer is at what they do and the process of sifting through these people is so brutal they're so good at it they process so much information they literally run for 90 minutes so many people must fall so that this one guy who plays for Bournemouth can exist and when you're watching it you just know these are very very best at doing this they're sort of superhuman in a way to you and I who play football. And do you think that looking at the referees, do you think how could anyone have this level?
4:21Barney Ronay:You don't. Like the game has changed around them. You need people who are able to cope with that level of information. Like no offense to referees, but most of them don't have higher education. Like you want absolute super data wonks doing this. People who have experience of like... In the VAR level. they're doing the job generally they're just out of their depth and they can't process this stuff and they make mistakes and so people think they're biased and it's cut we're talking about them now it's a really really really difficult job and these blokes are doing their best they're just not very good at it and so we end up talking about really really basing mistakes like this and sorry i've gone on a bit there but it just is annoying and no one really seems to say like it's the game has changed for them and they just can't deal with it sure but then you know So how are we, Barry, how do we get data wonks?
5:14You know, who could presumably go and sit in an office and earn a truckload more without getting death threats every five minutes?
5:20Max Rushden:Well, that's the question. Where do we find these people who will be good at it? Is it a case of training them, having academies?
5:28Barney Ronay:You know, when you watch an American TV show about like a president or something, and there are people in some kind of situation room, those people in those American films who are hyper-competent and know exactly what they're doing. Like in the Bourne Ultimatum, for example, in the situation, Treadstone. It's Treadstone. Treadstone people. We need those people, yes. Right. Back to you, Barry.
5:48Max Rushden:Well, we get them from the Bourne Ultimatum, clearly. Or, I don't know, NASA, when a meteorite is heading towards the Earth and they've sent a spaceship full of oil men up to drill into it, the guys who helped them out from the ground. I don't know, do you find data ones who really want to be referees at a young age and send them for the refereeing and VAR equivalent of an academy and keep the best ones, weed out the dross? I don't think referees are corrupt, I think they are doing their best, I agree with Barney on that, but they're not doing themselves any favours and a lot of people do think they're corrupt, like genuinely to be believed they're corrupt and this isn't helping it's just going to make more people think they're corrupt and make things worse but that was a really bad mistake uh on a weekend that had quite a few high profile mistakes uh as for what is to be done i don't know a lot of people say well we we should bring in foreign referees but you know foreign referees get things wrong as well as we've seen.
7:05Max Rushden:I thought the standard of refereeing at the World Cup was quite good, but there were some really, really high-profile boo-boos there as well. So it's not my job to find a solution, and I'm glad because one is needed. Can I have a counter-argument, just as sort of devil's advocate, which is, you know, these elite, incredible footballers that we watch, they all make mistakes. You know, there were big mistakes at the weekend. You know, there was a, you know, the Bournemouth keeper passing it to Kevin Sharder, you know, amongst other quite big mistakes. And these referees are probably the best we've got.
7:38And so they are the best we've got. And the reason you don't have academies is there aren't a million people trying to do it. You know, there aren't people with posters of referees. So, you know, we don't go, this is as good as it's going to be, hands up. But actually give them a bit of grace and say, look, people make mistakes. It's okay. The world keeps spinning.
7:56John Brewin:Yeah, yeah. But there doesn't seem to be much forgiveness for the refereeing community out there, does there? But I suppose there's a few factors here, is that their job has been made more difficult by VAR and taking the sense, the humanity out of decisions. But actually taking the humanity out of the decisions has led to even more human error, like the one of these two blokes sat in a, or three blokes sat in a VAR room, coming up with that decision. The type of decision that someone's dad running the line on your local park would have probably got that one right on instinct and yet they somewhere along that decision making process and maybe we'll get to hear the tapes somehow arrived at that uh conclusion which was a completely wrong one and Gary Neville was talking wasn't he about how they were going to get a call next week of apology well it came within hours actually you know Howard Webb I saw Howard Webb at one of the games yesterday that and he's one of those people that has an iPad but had a keyboard with his iPad.
9:01John Brewin:So, which always strikes me as a slightly technophobic way of using an iPad. So if Howard's doing that, what are they called? Pro-Ref now. Well, what are they called the P-G-M-O-L? Then last season they changed themselves to the P-G-M-O and now it's Pro-Ref. You know when companies go bad and they try and change their name to escape, you know, like Group 4 or something like that? that this appears to be the problem and there is there's probably no more pariah organization in the uk i'm joking of course but then than pro ref at this point they need another rebrand no or you're not saying a crypto billionaire wants to donate has donated 38 million pounds to pro you know what that's what we find that they're really i say what that could be a winning winning votes if you said we're going to spend this 36 million improving and i suppose the question is should ai not blow us all up uh those um tech workers left without a job maybe they could move into the refereeing sector or ai could do the refereeing i don't know hang
10:08Barney Ronay:on future solutions is a good new name for yeah yeah that's good we've nailed it we've nailed it
10:13John Brewin:Yeah. Barney, what is kind of lost then is, again, it's Erling Haaland with the key moment in this game. And, you know, City, even down to 10, with a better side.
10:23Barney Ronay:Yeah, that's correct. And it was one of those things that I was going to say it was like morally onside because it was a good goal. And I kind of felt, but then when you look back at it, actually the goalie does kind of stop as the diving header happens. And I think that did affect the goal. But City did deserve to win this game. And Enzo Maresca, he is a good manager, but he's particularly good at these specific tactical jobs. He's a really smart guy. The way that Chelsea took on Paris Saint-Germain in the World Club World Cup final, he loves this stuff. Like reorganising a team with 10 men to win a derby game away from home, that's really in his wheelhouse.
11:06Barney Ronay:And having said that, I think he's also, there's something about the city setup that's really good. I really like the way he's one of these control managers. He's really into like positionism and you've got to be here and you've got to do this job. But the way he looked after Cole Palmer at Chelsea, where Palmer was actually really good under him. He is also into his attacking elements and won't completely crush them. And in Turkey and Haaland, they have a really elite level creative department, so to speak. So watching that, I thought, my God, they're so much better than Man United. the players are better the manager's on a different level to Michael Carrick sorry Michael Carrick but he just is and I thought they looked really good and they're obviously going to push be the team that pushes Arsenal all the way can I just say on the red card on the red card as well I didn't quite understand that I kind of thought they both should have been sent off but what interested me was he missed the chance for we don't really see it anymore the double flourish yes bang bang that's sort of from the 90s isn't it's like a Paraguayan referee at the World Cup would do a double or even a rare triple.
12:11Barney Ronay:But you're off. But I don't know if you can still do it. I don't know if one red card has the power. Because don't you have to take out another one and then write the name on that? Can you do a double flourish? Double brandish. I think brandishing is less common than back in the day. I think it is a brandish, yeah. I mean, I know what you mean. It felt, Barry, like an injustice, but maybe the right... You know, sort of how hard do you have to kick someone to get a red? like like bruno can't be is not innocent here you know well as soon as i saw what foden had done in
12:42Max Rushden:real time i thought he's in trouble and the red card was julie brandish slash flourished and i don't think he can have any complaints and when you're lying on the ground as he was and you kick out at someone that seems to be worse than just what say what bruno did kicking someone from a standing position kicking a man when he's down is not as bad as kicking a man when you're down well there's a whole philosophical philosophical debate to be had on that i don't think we've time but um my read on the situation is that bruno probably deserved a yellow card the ref didn't give him one and then var can't interfere if it's a yellow card offense but i don't think Foden could have any complaints.
13:32Maresco didn't complain about it afterwards.
13:34Max Rushden:He said it was fair enough. But that Bruno probably should have gone too. I think a yellow card would have been all right for both of them. But by the letter of the law, Foden has to go, I think. I mean, I guess you could letter of the law. Bruno gets a yellow for his little kick and then a yellow for simulation because he, you know, afterwards. That would be quite, I could have sort of yellow, red, yellow. yellow red yellow red would be perfect double brandish yeah yeah we sort of quadruple in the
14:05John Brewin:end i guess i was going to say retaliation appears always to be seen as the worst worst defense doesn't it in one of those situations you're reacting to it so obviously the example brought up is the david beckham diego simeone or do you remember when Dennis Wise pinched Nicky Butt at Stamford Bridge. Nicky Butt just reacted as a guy from Manchester would if someone pinched their thigh and just stuck the nut on him. That's considered worse. Foden himself would have known that as soon as he'd lost control, that was that. It should have been a yellow card for Bruno. It doesn't look great when you react like that.
14:48John Brewin:but in a sense it's all in the game. We saw an awful lot of that type of thing in the World Cup, didn't we? If you're asking what I thought from the Manchester United point of view, it was a desperately disappointing performance and one of the reasons that Manchester United struggled is that they, Michael Carrick and Boney talked about his shortcomings as a manager, perhaps tactically, is he's not been able to shift the team from being good at counter-attacking to dominating an opponent from midfield with passing, finding your way through an opponent through the key pass. If you look at the XG between Foden sending off and later on in the game, it's negligible levels.
15:36John Brewin:They didn't really create anything. And in the last few minutes, when they're really chasing it, There was a litany of horrible crosses from Dorgou and Dallot. And Bruno himself had a poor game. The guy that's expected to lift the team couldn't find those moments of inspiration because City's defence and midfield had them locked down. And the substitution of Cherki at half-time for Andai created that extra dimension to City, a bit more speed. and City were the far better team. But as Barney says, they've got the far better players. They've had a far better transfer window. You know, I did hit the post twice and Donnarumma does make a great set.
16:21You think Mbouma, like a really elite striker, just passes that into the corner, don't they? But it's a brilliant save, I think. Yeah. Anyway, Arsenal also had four wins from four. They won 2-0 at Sunderland. Barry, it might upset people, but should we start with an actual bit of football from this game? because I think the Gimeraj goal, I mean, it's hard to get in the Arsenal midfield. So to come off the bench and get in there and then do that at Sunderland when you're a former Newcastle player is, you know, it was such a great strike.
16:51Max Rushden:Yeah, and he really enjoyed that one, didn't he? Scoring against Sunderland at the Stadium Light and then telling the fans how insignificant and small their club is.
17:04Max Rushden:It was a wonderful strike. good work down by the byline from Havertz and Gabrielle and Declan Rice were both involved. Rice just slipped the ball into Bruno's path and he just bent it into the top corner. It was, I would have said at the time, and this was Saturday evening, we're probably not going to get a better strike into the top corner this weekend because there's only three games left, but that would have been a mistake. But nevertheless, despite having his thunder stolen by Louis Dunk on Sunday, it was a very, very good strike. Couldn't happen to a nicer fella. Yeah, you know, like he's sort of got the assist for Saka as well because that pass is perfectly timed, isn't it?
17:50And then you have Barney David-Raya. And, you know, that penalty save, that is a good penalty, I think. Like, it's a brilliant save.
17:59Barney Ronay:Yeah, it is. Yeah, those two moments were really... But talking about how good footballers are, the Goomarash goal, he's seen it before it's happened. You can see, well, they did a bit of this on Match of the Day. He's saying, I'm in space to Declan Rice. Like, just give it to me here. And he's seen where he wants to put it. He knows that's going to happen. He's not just picked up and whacked it. He's conceived and felt the goal in his foot before Rice has taken the final touch to even pass it to him. And he's only just come on the pitchers. They're brilliant at this. Same with the save. I agree.
18:29Barney Ronay:It was a brilliant save. If he's really had to spring to get there, the hands had to be good. And I guess you could say it's sort of, it's a bit unfair. We always say it's a bit lucky. We mentioned the Donnarumma save as well. But the goalie is also, you know, he's an 11th of your team. And you signed him for that reason and play him and train him, get him in the right frame of mind. And that's just part of why they're such a good team and have such a good defence. The one thing I think about Arsenal is this year they've defended slightly differently in that you've noticed how good their defenders are one-on-one at defending.
19:02Barney Ronay:There's been a lot of deep defence and not so much team defence. There's been a lot of blocks and tackles and what a good game this guy had. And that's slightly different to last time. They are trying to shift how this team plays very slightly. So they've drawn praise for being more, I guess, creative on the ball is the easiest way of describing it, but just creating more from open play. and there is a slight payoff in that they don't look invincible in that way we will just take the ball away from you, slow the game down, do all that stuff. And I wonder if at some point that will be tested or there'll be mistakes and they might concede goals.
19:38Barney Ronay:I wonder about that. Maybe not. They still look pretty good at the back. But yeah, they're clearly going all the way to the line again. On the penalty itself, John, Dan Ballard, it's obvious that he is the aggressor in this. And Arteta said he was very worried and very sad this could never be a penalty ever I mean there's this new clump down on holdings so perhaps Arsenal were always going to be the first side punished in some way for this
20:01John Brewin:Arteta's clearly and Barney's written a very good piece about this you know his post-match recriminations of this decision are clearly a warning shot across the bow of the hated organisation pro-ref to sort that act out it was a poor decision it was a poor decision also backed by VAR. But I suppose the root of it is that last season there was an awful lot of grappling in the box so there's some sort of clampdown but unfortunately those making the decisions are not very good at them and so it's given Mikel Arteta a chance to argue his case and lay a marker and operate on that old principle principle of eventually things will even out and they will get away with one further up the way and this is how the psychology of it operates um it was you mean you don't think you don't believe he's truly worried and sad not necessarily sincere yes yeah i mean in my saying my auto i think that it was a perfect moment for him because he's going to be right here because they've made a bad
21:14Barney Ronay:decision it's a perfect opening to make this point because there's now huge pressure on people to to be a bit wary of this issue they would have obviously schematized this in advance alteta plans everything he would have thought what am i going to say when this happens because it will happen we're all warned this would happen and it's a perfect moment to put the sad face on to say i'm sad i'm scared i'm i'm just so worried hold me please hold me tv interviewer because something bad is happening here and i also don't mind that at all i think it's okay like it's a tactic that us have been really good at you play on the edge of the physical constraints we have this kind of micro surveillance football world now we live in a world of of micro surveillance and they've been really really good at getting ahead of that like it's all football's always finding an advantage and they've done that it's not cheating or whatever i actually think the word grappling um we need to reclaim the word grappling it's always said like in this really pejorative way as though it's a bad thing um i mean grappling it's not the end of the world there is grappling you know that that happened i don't mind i like grappling you know it's all right to grapple otherwise what are we what is a man when you take away his ability to grapple but that is part of the game like it used to be you couldn't grapple with steve foster for example or terry fennec because they're too strong and powerful yeah but defenders are now they would you you'd die trying to grapple some of those people but defenders are now selected for their skill on the ball and you can grapple them and grappling is a legitimate human aim i think people should be encouraged to grab look at an ultimate aim is like reclaiming notions of old-fashioned manhood old male virtues where you could grapple bring it back toxic grappling you know but as you you thought it was going to be competitive and that suddenly midfield would go totes over the arsenal you know probably would be a handful of stuff and and they they were actually you know they had a couple of chances like Arsenal were better but Sunderland really gave a good account of themselves I thought.
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23:18Max Rushden:Yeah, Arsenal are better than Sunderland, there's no two ways about it but I thought Sunderland played really well like everyone else I didn't think the penalty should have been awarded but I was happy to take it and maybe I should have taken it but no, they were very competitive, Grant Jack was good, Mookie Eli was good Broby gave the Arsenal centre-halves plenty to think about. Him and Gabriel had quite the battle. And just, yeah, Arsenal's quality shone through in the end. One thing about the penalty, I wonder if maybe Dan Ballard had watched Borussia Dortmund play Villarreal during the week because Gürassi won an almost identical penalty.
24:04Max Rushden:I think it was when Dortmund were 2-1 up and they went 3-1 up on the back of an almost identical incident. A judo role. Did anyone else do judo? I mean, I didn't enjoy my, my judo career was short lived, but I did a discipline called Mugen Du, which was kind of similar. Right. What did that entail? It was a bit like judo. It was a martial art. Okay. I got to a blue belt in judo. What could we, I mean, if we were to, if we were to pair off, what, what level did you reach? You want to grapple? Good. I like this. yeah i'm here i'm here to grapple i'm sure it would do good numbers but i would hate it to be a mismatch if you know if you're a black belt then i'm not a black belt but if you're a yellow belt then i could easily upon you and it would be a a very quick fight okay well this will now obviously
24:54Barney Ronay:have to happen people always say that judo is actually the best martial art that a judo you know but it's just not true is it you've seen some of those other martial arts like kicking people in the head and punching them to death the judo is kind of like i will use your power against you and make you fall over oh no you've punched me in the head really hard yeah well judo is very much there was always one kid whose trousers the drawstring of someone's trousers weren't good enough and his they'd be grappling and then his trousers would just slowly sidle down and his wife wants to be there and that was not the man you wanted to be anyway that'll do for part one part two we'll begin at stanford bridge
25:37welcome to part two of the guardian football weekly chelsea 2 hull 2 barry what a brilliant start to the season for hull like uh you know a deserved point of chelsea could have been more i mean they they may have lost it they may have won it but they were really good again yeah they were
25:54Max Rushden:scored another two goals could have had more Louis Coyle missed a really really good chance when it was 1-1 Emi Martinez had to make a really good save from Cho right at the end after he got the end of a cross Hull are really good they're really well organised they're pretty solid defensively Chelsea their front six is really good but their defence is a little short of a shambles I mean the first goal they conceded on Saturday was just a litany of errors caused by a long ball from the holekeeper, Salakis. Fofano and Gusto both misjudged the bounce of the ball and that allowed Giles to send in a cross and the bounce of that was completely misjudged by Jarrell Hato and Mohamed Baloumi just was lurking behind him and smashed the ball past Martinez.
26:48Max Rushden:It's too early to say, but on the face of it, Hull are going to make an awful lot of people, including me, look very stupid this season. In much the same way Sunderland made a lot of people look very stupid last season. But I did see someone point out that I think it was in 2008 Hull were third in the table in October and only stayed up by the skin of their teeth on the last day of the season. So it is too early to be making predictions, but I've been hugely impressed by them so far. The big thing in the buildup to this game, I think, I don't know if anyone saw that Sorbet Thomas rolled his car on the way to training on Friday and he appeared to do it in a quiet residential street.
27:37Max Rushden:I am baffled as to how he managed that. I really want to know, but luckily he was unhurt and was able to start this game on the bench and come on and play and play quite well he did play well yes i'm starting to feel smug that i had them at 19th makes me look you know um uh it's stringly emmy martinez john a sort of if robert sanchez had these sort of games it would be a big headline type thing you know like he he did say well from mcburnie but he's built one before he just doesn't quite look ready yet the thing is martinez is that
28:12John Brewin:He does have these moments, doesn't he? But he is a big moment goalkeeper. And I suppose he's probably had, well, he comes back from the World Cup. He's had a summer of flux. But I think, as Robert Sanchez also showed, it's not easy to play behind this Chelsea defence. I mean, you are left exposed and you're likely to make more mistakes the more exposed you have. yeah I did see you know some social media rage over Martinez you know how did we end up with this clown when you know we had a previous clown in Sanchez and it's like well this guy is a you know pretty world-renowned goalkeeper but you know maybe Martinez isn't the perfect fit for the way Chelsea wants to play and I suppose that's the the big question is that Xabi Alonso is having to find some semblance of sense from a squad that we know has been constructed chaotically.
29:17John Brewin:And it's going to take a while. And there's a lot of promise in defence. There's a lot of quality in midfield. They are lacking an Enzo Fernandes now. And Casado's not been playing too much. So, yeah, it's going to take a while. I think a lot of people were talking about Chelsea being possible title contenders. Are we going to rule that out now? And just Barry's mention of Hull back in 2008-9 just brings me happy Phil Brown vibes. And are we going to see their manager singing on the pitch at the end of the season? I hope so, as they stay up. That would be magnificent. Yeah. I thought Balumi was.
30:03I mean, okay, two goals, but actually the coil miss you mentioned, Barry, his skill to set that up was so good from Volumi. Yeah, it really was. Should we go to Palace-Ipswich, Barney? Absolutely, this is such a huge win for Ipswich, who have also started the season pretty well.
30:21Barney Ronay:Yeah, they have, and they look good in the right way. They've got some really good footballers there. And you kind of think, actually, that maybe this is fine. Ipswich always just feel like, you know, complete yo-yo kind of club. It always feels like, wow, they'll be fine. They'll be fine going down. They're probably quite sensibly around. Zion Fleming is a really good signing. I'm always surprised more people don't. He's got that kind of Ivan Toney, Chris Wood, will score goals kind of vibe about him. He was a mill for a bit and was really good. So, yeah, I think that seems like quite a happy situation and they'll probably be okay.
31:02Yeah.
31:03Max Rushden:I think with Ipswich, we saw on Saturday, Leif Davis had a part to play in. He scored one, set one up, well, set two up. And I think that's the Leif Davis we were kind of promised two years ago when they came up, where he'd had some record 150 assists or something in the championship. But that Ipswich team was just so hopelessly out of their depth that he didn't get to show what he could do because he was largely on the back foot instead of the front foot. But I was very impressed with him on Saturday. And Crystal Palace, for the second weekend in a row, their defence is a shambles. And if they don't tighten that up, they're going to be in trouble.
31:50Max Rushden:Maybe in the position, taking one of the positions we all thought Hull would occupy at the end of the season. Yeah, no complaints over the disaster red card. that was uh he knew straight away didn't he i mean he didn't i don't think he meant to do anything bad but you know it was a bad challenge wasn't it um to coventry then coventry nilv brighton five john says brighton already have eight different goal scorers from the first four games how many will they have before spurs have one you know we've had lots of questions about that spurs not scoring a goal but uh we should start with the brighton they scored 13 in four games and john John, we have, as we all expected, a goal of the season competition between Ainsley Maitland-Niles and Lewis Dunk.
32:31John Brewin:Yeah, well, Ainsley Maitland-Niles reappeared from some time in the mid-2010s to score that goal. And Lewis Dunk, not a guy known for his sharp shooting, but yeah, if that isn't goal of the season, well, we've had what a season we have had. Just the whole trajectory of the ball, the way that it dips, the way it drops in in the end. It needed a Barry Davis and a grainy footage to add it to 101 great goals of that sort of. It was absolutely fantastic. It has to be said, he was allowed a bit of space to take aim by Coventry. I think you're allowed to give Lewis Dunk that space. Yes, well, that is very true.
33:20That's probably not the bit of Coventry defending I would focus on if I was Frank Lampard.
33:24Max Rushden:If you looked just at the result of that game in the paper and you saw dunk 66, whenever it was, you just presume, oh, it's a header from a corner, you know, and then you go and watch the highlights and you see that. It's like, wow. Yeah, I like the, he got a sort of standing ovation. He got a standing O from the bench, didn't he? It wasn't like they all cheered. They all sort of stood and applauded.
33:48John Brewin:Supposedly he has it in his locker. Fabian Herzl said afterwards that, you know, on the training ground. He does that in training all the time. If it falls to Lewis Dunk, you know, Jason Steele or whoever, the reserve goalie, is worried, you know, this is going to fly in. So, you know, maybe this thing.
34:06Barney Ronay:Do you think shooting is back? Maybe. Is shooting back? Is it the new set piece? It's the thing from the deep pass that teams aren't ready for. I thought of that when they were applauding him. It's like, we've talked about this. we realised that shooting might be good. You might score goals. And maybe these brilliant data-based tactical managers have shooting is in.
34:27John Brewin:I was going to say, you know how they say the Premier League echoes Serie A's golden era? Well, there was that point where the goals in Serie A were always so spectacular because the defences were so good, so that the attackers would basically spend all week just smashing shots to try and be good at them. Maybe this is the new way. You know, Fabian Herzer is our new wave of manager, and that's it. It's shooting practice now. I think that's all for the better, don't you? Dunk is the Van Basten of our generation. Look, Coventry, only the second team in Premier League history to lose their first four games of the season without scoring.
35:04Palace, 2017-18 with the other one. Frank de Boer was sacked after that. I suppose, Barry, look, Brighton could have been two up, but then Coventry had a spell where Rodoni had two good chances Verbruggen made a brilliant save. Another good save from Onyeka. Then there's the red card, which is a daft, nasty elbow from a 1-1. But I don't know if Frank Lampard said, look, 5-0 is not quite a story of this game. But I don't know if you agree with Frank Lampard.
35:32Max Rushden:We're still in the game when they were 2-0 down and had 11 men on the pitch. They had the better of the opening exchanges. as you point out Bartford Bruggan had to make several excellent saves so they are creating chances because they played very well against City I thought and should have scored but didn't should have scored here but didn't 5-0 is very demoralising and while I can understand Lampard wants to focus on the positives and the worse than positives they're far too easy to play through and their defence looked very porous and brittle.
36:16Max Rushden:So that would be a huge source of concern. But their fans seem to be enjoying themselves. They were still cheering away and chanting in support of their team after the final whistle, even though they've been subjected to a hiding. So, and look, two of their defeats have come against Arsenal and City. So, you know, they're going to beat most teams they play. So I wouldn't read too much into that. Brighton looked like they found another one in Malik Yalkue. He looks like a really good player, doesn't he? Villa won Forest 2. Massive win for Forest. And Gibbs White, Barney, they did well, or they kept him in however they kept him last year.
36:57But that little back heel to set up Jesus, he's so central to them.
37:02Barney Ronay:Yeah, he's just a really, really good footballer. It's really good that there should be that depth. I mean, there was a lot of upset around the World Cup that he probably should have been in England squad. I'm not sure what kind of difference he would have made. Or maybe some, because he's very good with the ball, very good at directing play and being calm and very intelligent footballer. And that was something that was probably missing a little bit. But they look good. They've got a really good manager. They'll be absolutely fine. I'm more worried about Villa, really, who just look not ready.
37:35Barney Ronay:They look rushed out of bed. I mean, I don't know if they look a bit like sort of me this morning. It's like you're suddenly doing something you weren't quite ready for. I mean, they're kind of a victim of, I think, bad macro management. There was a huge transfer flow in, which meant that that had to then be, this is Villa, that then had to be balanced. Losing that many players and trying to throw half a, you know, your best players after you've won a cup final. And they look really flustered and not quite ready. and sort of they've gone outside in their dressing gown and it's all getting away from them a bit, which I'm sure we've all done here as well.
38:16Barney Ronay:Probably it'll be fine and settled, but it's just a real shame that teams struggle to build on success like that. And I'm not sure it's totally the manager's fault. It's more something that's gone on with the way they've been totally destabilised by players leaving.
38:30Max Rushden:I felt a little bit sorry for Villa because when Forrest scored their winner, they were reduced to 10 men because Ian Mattson had to go off injured on the back of a fairly wild challenge from James McAtee, which possibly could have been a red card. And Villa reduced all their subs, so they had to play the last eight or nine minutes with 10 men, and that's when Forrest scored. So, yeah, I'd be feeling a bit aggrieved about that if I was Una Emery. Yeah, I was having a chat with my friends on my lad's weekend away, Barry. And I was positing the idea that, you know, if you've made all your subs and someone is deliberately, is injured by a deliberate foul, should you be allowed to bring someone on?
39:19And then we realised there'd be a lot of grey areas there. But the injustice was real.
39:27Barney Ronay:I'm just picturing this situation because at that point everyone else was saying, no Max we're with a monkey on drugs in Thailand dangling out of a high window in a building we don't want to talk about this. Well Jeff and Ian were really making good headway on a 500 piece jigsaw puzzle of a library and I think I'd had maybe one two cans of doom bar by then but anyway it was.
39:50Max Rushden:Max sent me a photo of his wild lads weekend at about two o 'clock on Saturday and it It was three blokes doing a jack, yes, afternoon, doing a jigsaw. And I zoomed in to look at, I could see the box of the jigsaw. Even the subject of the jigsaw was boring. I think we found it in, I don't think, in our defense, I don't think anyone brought the puzzle. No one said, who's got the puzzle, lads? I think the puzzle, we just found the puzzle in the big house.
40:21John Brewin:Railway bridges of Humberside or something like that. it was a it was a uh it was a library so there was a lot of small books and you had to find out what the book yeah it was you know i gave it a bit of a go but i wasn't even having my finding
40:33Barney Ronay:finding the puzzle in a cupboard does make it more exciting more of a sort of discovery thing it's like that yeah that was your tiger in the bathroom yes it was very much you never guess what we found i mean really we play cornhole which is this game with beanbags that you throw and they go down it's a really great game i recommend it fun for all the family and we We should mention Liam De Lappe, who scored the Open. I'm really pleased, John, that, you know, hopefully this leads to him scoring. I loved him at Ipswich and it just didn't work out at Chelsea, but that shouldn't define him as a footballer.
41:05John Brewin:No, and his celebration was one of vindication. And I agree with you. I did really enjoy watching him at Ipswich. And it was a rather sad sight at Chelsea last season. But we've seen several players swallowed up by the Chelsea experiment. We've seen several, as it turns out, investors swallowed up by the Chelsea experiment. So, yeah, good to see him. They need a centre-forward, don't they, with the fading out of Chris Wood. And he's with the right manager in Oliver Glasner, who is very good at getting the best from players. So, yeah, I'm on Liam Dillap's side. And I don't think he was worthy of all the criticism he got last season.
41:53John Brewin:It happens sometimes. And unfortunately, Chelsea, you don't get time. Bournemouth 2, Brentford 2, John. You, of course, were there. I can't think of a game that is more John Bruins at this football, mate. I think I've been to that fixture both in London and Bournemouth. I think that's about the fourth or fifth time I've been to that game. So, you know, it felt like home. And it was very much a Bournemouth and Brentford game in the fact that Bournemouth played very well, played the lovelier football. Brentford under Keith Andrews, they're now even more muscular and strong than they were. They're veering into Stoke West Brom territory at this point.
42:30John Brewin:OK, this is fun. Which I enjoy, of course. And I wouldn't criticise them for that. But yeah, it's a scruffy-ish first half. Some terrible misses. I mean we may not get to it but there was a Ryan miss it was absolutely horrible which reflected the one we just watched from the championship and yeah it's Bournemouth are playing well but not winning I think they should start winning soon but they're all very excited about playing in Europa League so it continues to be a happy story down there Lovely finish from Shard after that Petrovic mistake and actually the Tavernier goal was brilliantly set up actually.
43:14John Brewin:Three Brazilians playing in that game, Ryan and Igor Siaga who went to the World Cup and Evan Nielsen was by far the best Brazilian. Why Carlo Ancelotti was not there scouting her, I really don't know. Before we end part two, some sad news that I've just seen actually. The former West Ham QPR and Czech Republic goalkeeper Ludic McCloschkos died at the age of 64. He made almost 400 appearances for West Ham from 1990 to 98. He returned as goalkeeping coach. He withdrew from cancer treatment in December 2024, three years after his diagnosis. West Ham's statement says, it's with deep and profound sadness that West Ham announces the passing of legendary former goalkeeper and coach Ludek McCloschko.
43:54Rest in peace, Ludek, our beloved, inspirational goalkeeper and gentle giant of a man. Yeah, may he rest in peace.
44:00Max Rushden:Do you remember his performance against Manchester United the day Blackburn won the title? It was extraordinary.
44:10John Brewin:Unbelievable. Oh, God. Oh, that was... I mean, I think that's probably my darkest day as a Manchester United fan, just that whole day. And I watched it. Michael Hughes put them ahead, didn't he? And yeah, McCloscoe was so good.
44:27Max Rushden:It was just one of the great goalkeeper performances. Nothing getting past him that day.
44:33John Brewin:I loved it. He'd been a very good goalkeeper for West Ham for a while by then, but I suppose that's his defining performance, aren't we, if we're talking Premier League years. But I'm sure West Ham fans will have many further memories of, you know. And of course, you know, a Czech goalkeeper coming up over to England in the late 80s, early 90s, it was a very different thing, wasn't it? You know, one of the first foreign players to make a mark. Yeah, we send our love to his friends and family and we'll be back in a second.
45:11Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly. Mark says, remember a couple of years ago when you wrote about someone, Luton, I think, going a whole season without scoring? Yes, thank you, Mark. I think it was out getting a point, but, you know, the point stands. Warren says, what month do you think Spurs will score? You know, Domino's Pizza, we've delivered 489 ,297 ,478 pizzas since Spurs last scored a Premier League goal. John, you in the WhatsApp group said West Ham have been relegated and played seven championship games, but still scored a Premier League goal more recently than Tottenham Hotspur.
45:40The same applies to Burnley as well. I mean, they just... I mean, they were good, Barney, I thought, for about 25 minutes. They were sort of upbeat and positive, and then they hadn't scored, and then they all went, oh, maybe we'll never, ever score, and it all got very, very turgid.
45:57Barney Ronay:Yeah, I mean, there is a positive. I think people may be looking at this wrong. I see the clean sheets. Sure, of course, yeah. I actually have done that. I actually have gone, well, you know, you build on that defence. 36-0-0 draws, you stay up probably on goal difference. What a season! That's the season done. We did it. We killed football. I mean, it is not easy to keep a clean sheet, so he will be pleased about that. I think one of the problems is they have new attacking players who haven't really settled and also are just so Spurs-y. I mean, they're just such Spurs players like Savio and Marmouche.
46:33Barney Ronay:like they have found their place it's those i wrote in the paper the sort of players they will be fine because players like this are good for four games a season and suddenly score a hat trick against coventry then disappear get a tattoo come back four months later that's what happens with spurs players and so it's fine and they they'll have enough uh incentive to do that briefly and get enough points to stay up but um yeah keep keep racking up the points lads I mean Spurs just
47:04John Brewin:continued to fascinate me with just how it goes wrong like this and they found a new way to to uh I mean that transfer window that every that Spurs fans got excited about I saw described as the worst transfer window in history and so you know it's fans the fans are taking it well they're taking it well. I mean, it is an interesting, I mean, Barney mentions Marmouche and I was thinking maybe they should have bought a striker amongst that and actually they did buy Marmouche and Barney's right, he is a classic Spurs player in the fact that he could be good and there will be moments when he is really, really good but those moments might not come around as often as as they'd like.
47:47John Brewin:And I suppose it's Deserby that is left to supply the Spurs values of entertainment and anger and rage by just being so... The amount of buses he's thrown his players under, you know, the 149 that goes past the White Hart lane constantly has Spurs players underneath it. Does there come a point where he accepts any responsibility for this? possibly not. That's not how he operates. But I do... The myth of De Zerbe is a great coach, but are we beginning to wonder how great a coach he is? Or is Spurs just a riddle that we cannot beat?
48:32Max Rushden:Didn't Oliver Glasner say the other couple of weeks ago that? The suggestion was he's a bit of a one-trick pony, like a three - or four-trick pony. We all know what his tricks are, and we all know how to avoid them. But it was interesting that he did one of those performative Pep-style tellings off after the game on the pitch with Matthias Tell and Tell didn't seem to take it very well. So he may be cast out into the wilderness. I saw Everton were probably the better team in this game and they certainly had the better chances. I'm not sure Desorby will see out the season at Spurs. I mean, I suppose if you have so many players who could be good, eventually some of them will be good as we say for a bit but if they could all if either is it better that they all are good at the same time or just each one of them says i'll do four games you know i'll do marmouche will do october and then savio can do november like what's the what's the right way around to to to for this to to be as good as it can be i don't know it's you know
49:35Barney Ronay:it's i think the problem is once you've done your four games that's it you're done you can't go over the limit there you've only got four it's in the contract yeah i will be good for four games and you don't want to do them too early or at this all at the same time that's part of the job of managing spurs i mean yeah i think you're right definitely a new manager is going to solve all that just get yeah i think so one in yeah yeah someone like someone like someone with you know because if deserve is a one-trick pony go back to ang you had so many different ways of doing the same setting this all up yeah uh liverpool nil fulham nil i mean i barney was surprised I did think Liverpool would win this football match and they didn't no they they didn't and everyone's a bit angsty around Liverpool um Florian Wurtz didn't have a good game which is a real shame I'm kind of a Wurtz truther I just think that he's a brilliant footballer and is the best footballer at the club but I'm starting to wonder if maybe I'm just being taken in by how nice he looks he just looks so good yeah he's got grace and balance he's got all the things I like about Yeah, he may be performatively good.
50:38Barney Ronay:Maybe I'm misunderstanding it, but I don't think so. I think you can make him work. But I do think there's been so much flux there. Like the slot season hasn't really helped Iriola in that nothing really got built in that season, but they were champions. And since Klopp left, they haven't really found a new way to go. It's hard to understand exactly what that team is. And he is a really good manager. and they just need to give him time. I think it will be fine if Iroh has the confidence and enough time to make it work. But you don't really get that in Liverpool, do you? People want stuff now. And they've got so many weak spots in the team and players who you just think, no, it's not going to work, it's not going to happen, particularly in the full-back positions.
51:29Barney Ronay:But I still believe in Wurtz and I still think the combination of a very good manager and him is something to kind of build the team around.
51:38Max Rushden:This is a really good point for Fulham. It was a terrible game. Even the highlights on Match of the Day were slim, you know, extremely slim pickings. I thought Fulham could have had a penalty in this game when Alisson, who Wilson has voiced concerns about his ability to move around his penalty area, he had another rush of blood to the head and came out for a ball and young Josh King sort of jumped over him to avoid clattering into him. And I think if he had clattered into him and gone down, that's a penalty. He can't not be. So there was a little bit of naivety, understandable naivety on King's part there.
52:18Max Rushden:But yeah, it was a performance to forget for Liverpool and a much-needed point for Fulham. Just briefly going back to the Spurs thing, do you think, or do my learned friends think, Given the stunning lack of imagination at both Spurs and the boardrooms of Spurs and United, do you think the availability of Eddie Howe could hasten the departure of either Michael Carrick or De Zerbe?
52:44John Brewin:I suppose it depends on how much of a rest Eddie Howe both wants and requires. When you looked at him towards the end of the time at Newcastle, he looked pretty tired, didn't he? He looked like he'd had enough of it. I would have thought Eddie Howe was probably hanging on to replace Thomas Tuchel. I would have thought that would be his main aim. And so if he can stay out of the game until that reaches its conclusion, that would be his aim. And I would be delighted to see Jason Tindall on the bench of either Tottenham or Old Trafford or England even. Or England. For England it would be amazing.
53:27John Brewin:So arise Sir Jason We've missed Jason And I think we need Jason The most ultimate Jason I think there's ever been Can anyone look more Jason than Jason I think I've said this before Donovan Orange Jason Orange No he's the ultimate in Jason
53:41Barney Ronay:Jason Tindor He's a really interesting figure I remember Eddie Howe was banned for a bit I went to a game at Villa where he was the manager And I thought that's going to be a really good press conference He'd be incredibly feisty He'd be leaping up and slapping people in the chest but he was the most lovely softly spoken actually quite shy gentle it was it was like i just thought oh you're i really need to bring you out for yourself you seem like a just a natural introvert and so i was really thrown by that and intrigued by him maybe that was his well maybe that's a tactic he uses we're about to have a 15 week international break so you know tomo stucco might get so bored by that like the rest of us that eddie howe could just wander in and take over i will finish with this from jeremy a full of a fan in dulwich morning max barry and panel following johnny lou statement on last week's pod that no kid grows up wanting to become a referee i felt the need to get in touch this past world cup in the u.s was the first one that my son ace was fully cognizant of and interested in and we watched a fair few games together despite the brilliance of bellingham the spirit of cape verde or the main character energy of messi he latched onto the referees and the explanation of var decisions to the crowd more than anything he has since stated that he no longer wants to be a goalkeeper for chelsea or a farmer that exclusively makes cheese but a referee this has led him to receiving red and yellow cards, a notebook, and a referee's headset and microphone, an old headset for COVID-era Zoom calls with FIFA logos pritz-sticked on the ears for a recent birthday.
55:04He now spends most of his day dishing out cards for minor infractions, such as being given a broken biscuit or being told to put his socks on. He has an issue with corruption, however, and decisions can be reversed with pledges of TV time or ice cream. Maybe Infantino is actually his greatest influence after all. Keep up the great work. Jeremy, well, look, maybe Ace is the man we need if we can fast track him we'll get ace in in the next two years and have a six year old brandishing cards left right and centre but thank you Jeremy footballweeklyattheguardian.com if you want to get in touch and that'll do for today thank you everybody thank you Barry thank you cheers Barney cheers everyone thank you John thanks for having me Football Weekly is produced by Rory Simon our executive producer is Tyler Papula and we'll be back tomorrow with the EuroPod
55:57Max Rushden:This is The Guardian.
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