He Became CEO With Zero Pharmacy Experience. Here's How | Kris Fishman

0:00The hottest thing right now in health, it was GLP-1, and now it's peptides. What's interesting about them is we nominated them a few years ago. The FDA has a period of time to review the nomination. It came to a conclusion that you cannot call Polish products. Nobody wants to do products that potentially are not safe for you. During COVID, when I saw family members and myself take products that Wells made, I became a much bigger believer in these products. after I saw it with my own eyes. Then it became a mission statement to perfecting medicine to some degree.

0:42So Chris, the hottest thing right now in health that I'm hearing about are it was GLP-1 and now it's peptides. And I think a lot of people are like, I want to do peptides. I don't even understand like the differences, this and that. And then you have a lot of compounding pharmacies. And I think for me, I'm totally lost. Can you break it down and simplify what is a compounding pharmacy and why are peptides the hottest thing right now? Yeah. Yeah. Great. So look, compound pharmacies, it's interesting. So if you look back in the history, it started in 754 AD, right? So essentially, where compound pharmacies were putting together preps for all different types of medicines to do wellness and even fix illness.

1:30Not until the 1930s, probably for a decade, so 1930 to 1940, 60 % of what was dispensed to you was through a compound pharmacy. So what is a compound pharmacy, right? So simply put, we buy APIs, which stands for active pharmaceutical ingredients, and we put them in together in some sort of combination to help you with whatever you're going through right so not till the 50s did did did bigger companies scale at large large numbers like like where big pharma came into into the into the picture and and somehow compound pharmacies were forgotten about um interesting is that throughout the last probably 10 to 15 years um more and more people are saying maybe one size doesn't fit all and and they're looking at us as as how do I become more accustomed to my problem, right?

2:23And that's kind of where we started. When I started in the pharmacy world, I as well had no idea what a compound pharmacy was. My wife did. She said, you know, Chris, this is what was used for our kids because we couldn't find a retail version out on the marketplace to serve our kids' needs when they were babies. So she knew about it before I did. About 10 years into the business, COVID came out. And believe me, everyone started to talk about compound pharmacy, you know, and I believe when you can say South Park did an episode, we knew we were going to be, you know, talked about much more. So in essence, we're basically a short term cook, you know, that puts together a lot of products that are served your needs that are not necessarily done by a big pharma company.

3:08Yeah, once you go South Park, it's mainstream already. And thank you for clarifying that. So why is it that within the last two to three years, every single person that I know is talking about peptides? I don't know how this became such a thing so fast, but why are people talking about it so much? Right. So peptides are just amino acids, blockchains, you know, and what's interesting about them is we nominated them a few years ago, maybe five, six years ago. And when we nominated them, the FDA has a period of time to review the nominations and see if the safety, you know, to see if this makes sense to do in our role.

3:52it came to a conclusion that they were not and they removed them from the nominated list and put them on what's called category two category two is just a list that says you cannot compound these products or sort of better you shouldn't um what what happened was is that built a market with a bunch of r &d products so research and development products and and it went all throughout the internet and there was a lot of activity around this it's it's interesting if you if you think about that, sort of that market, that gray market sort of built a lot of traction with a lot of our kids and just people in general on from the working outside to better sleep to you name it.

4:31And that sort of built a demand. Recently, what we're hearing and seeing is the FDA is taking into consideration of having a meeting on July 23rd called the PCAC meeting. And this is where we'll be able to come in with some physicians and some of our pharmacists that have been doing this for years and explain all of our, our reasonings of why we nominated it and to put it under a category one list, which is a list of products that we can buy from and make from. Um, so that, that's kind of, it's what's, what's happening and you're seeing a lot of this in motion right now. Uh, but, but yeah, it's, it's all over social media and TikTok and, you know, all of our children are, you know, talking about every single peptide, you know, for whatever element they need.

5:15I know, I have to laugh. My friend's like, do you ever try like AB345? They're throwing all these numbers. It's very chaotic. It just seems funny, because I'm like, I don't even know what you're like, if you don't explain to me what you're talking about, I have no idea what you're talking about. But I appreciate that. And it seems, it seems like people are very interested in health and longevity. And I think that's amazing as we potentially could live longer as a species now with all of AI and technology. Do you think that there's a world where we potentially not only could live longer, but we could be healthier based on the access to all these things?

5:55Absolutely. Look, I'm not one to say that everything's going to make you live to be 120 and or maybe people don't want to. But at the end of the day, what is there to help make either a broken bone or some sort of issue or concern heal faster, right? And we have a lot of products that do those things. Speaking of building something from the ground up, we often talk on this show about the hurdles from the early days that grind before you have a massive audience or venture backing. But the landscape of creator income is changing so fast, and I want to share a platform that's actually making that path accessible for beginners.

6:37It's called FanView. Whether you're a musician, a fitness coach, or someone with a unique perspective, FanView is a monetization platform that lets you turn your digital content into a real business. What's impressive here is the low barrier to entry. You don't need a million followers or years of experience to start earning. The process is incredibly simple. Upload your content, share exclusive videos or photos that your fans can't get anywhere else. You connect directly through deep, direct relationships rather than just being at the mercy of an algorithm. You get to earn money by generating recurring income through monthly subscriptions or even paywalled vault content.

7:19I've seen creators use their AI analytics to track exactly what's working, helping them scale their income faster than traditional social media ever allowed. It's built for the next generation of founders who want to own their audience from day one. Are you ready to start your creator journey and make it big? Visit fanview.com today and launch your career. You can also find the link right at the top of the description and in the pinned comment to check out FanView Creator Academy. How about better sleep or less stress? All these things are going to be helping us get better at what we do and for really good reasons.

8:01Now, as the FDA reviews this, we're hoping and looking for their support on seeing the data and sharing that as well. Right. So we want to be able to say, look, we got into this industry to to make people better, not not to actually hurt people or or or wait to get sick and then say, OK, now take this. Right. So so we're we're excited because we feel there's a lot of opportunities out there. You know, starting in this industry 10 years ago, I had no idea either. You know, and like I said, I knew about this or my should I say my wife knew about it before. And when things like COVID came out, the people that were ordering products to better themselves were, you know, something that I actually watched from the inside.

8:46It's been interesting to watch. So as the CEO and president, what challenges do you face when you're leading and scaling such a fast growing company at the same time you have these trillion dollar pharma giants that I imagine see you as great competition? And I'm not sure if they even want you around. Yeah, and that's fair. I want to say when the GLP-1 shortages occurred, we were here to actually make that market still demanding. It was available opposed to not having it. So I believe the CEO of Norva Notice at the J.P. Morgan conference earlier this year did thank compounders for stepping in and taking care of the shortage.

9:35Now, as that shortage has ended and we're here really on the personalized side of medicine, I would agree with you that Big Pharma is not a huge fan. And that's okay. Again, if you look at how many people are doing, for example, GLP-1s, it's one out of eight Americans in the United States, which is roughly 35 million people on GLP-1s. So it's a rather large number, and I believe we're here to help, not to hurt anywhere in the demand. It's just to keep up with everybody. What do you think is misunderstood or the greatest misunderstanding right now around compounding? Yeah, you know, I think I would say the safety to what people feel.

10:22There's a lot of communication between pharmacies and big pharma and everybody, right, indicating who's safe and who's not safe, right? I didn't get into this industry ever to hurt anybody clearly. Our job is to take sort of smaller scales. I mean, we're limited to making 250 batch sizes or less and testing every one of them. Very, very through all, you know, the sterile and the non, you know, all the testing that's required. And what we do is we want to make sure that people understand that there may be a lot of pharmacies out there. But some have scale and some are putting a lot of effort into making sure that we're doing it correctly.

11:02And we encourage the FDA. We encourage states to come in and audit us and expect us. I mean, again, we're here only to make sure people are better. We clearly don't want to hurt anybody. So so so we we you know, we want people to understand that, you know, do your homework. You know, when you know, there's want to say seven thousand five or three eight pharmacies in the United States. Speaking of building something from the ground up, we often talk on this show about the hurdles from the early days that grind before you have a massive audience or venture backing. But the landscape of creator income is changing so fast, and I want to share a platform that's actually making that path accessible for beginners.

11:42It's called FanView. Whether you're a musician, a fitness coach, or someone with a unique perspective, FanView is a monetization platform that lets you turn your digital content into a real business. What's impressive here is the low barrier to entry. You don't need a million followers or years of experience to start earning. The process is incredibly simple. Upload your content, share exclusive videos or photos that your fans can't get anywhere else. You connect directly through deep, direct relationships rather than just being at the mercy of an algorithm. You get to earn money by generating recurring income through monthly subscriptions or even paywalled vault content.

12:25I've seen creators use their AI analytics to track exactly what's working, helping them scale their income faster than traditional social media ever allowed. It's built for the next generation of founders who want to own their audience from day one. Are you ready to start your creator journey and make it big? Visit fanview.com today and launch your career. You can also find the link right at the top of the description and in the pinned comment to check out FanView Creator Academy. And I would best say to people is to really maybe do a visit to your pharmacy, go through their quality measures, go through all their legal problems and really go through that pharmacy.

13:11It's important to do your homework on this. And you've mentioned before that you didn't have much knowledge or experience previously. So you came in as an outsider, you moved up within the organization. What did you see that was the unlock where you said, if we change this, our company will grow and scale much faster? Essentially, was there like a secret sauce or something that you saw that maybe other people didn't? Right. So Wells Pharmacy always had great products. As I started in about 13 years ago, we were very solid in making products that people said, wow, I really feel this. Right. So maybe people took shortcuts or didn't give you the full products, you know, per se.

14:01But what I noticed was that our lack of getting orders out the door timely was a struggle, right? So over the years, we looked at having great products, high level of demand, and just took a little bit of time to get out to the patients, right? People were looking for things next day, not a couple of days later. So we scaled through efficiencies and technology, allowing more of our doctors to put in our orders, get them out quicker and faster up to all, while developing better guidelines and understanding the political outlook of things. For example, we want people to understand our products are safe.

14:40We want them to understand they're useful and they do help. Otherwise, what are we doing? so so over the years we've really became the pharmacy that said look let come visit us come look at the quality control that we have that's never going to give on our business right we're always going to be 100 by the book and then and then work on speed to the market and uh and that's that's happened you know we were luckily able to team up with a lot of our telemedicine companies and we were able to fulfill for them uh at a high speed um with with with real no safety issues meaning we were dispensing appropriately and have the right staff needed.

15:16I would say probably one of our biggest struggles were hiring and qualified people over the last five, six years. So what, yeah, besides hiring, and it seems like a lot of people have been saying that this has been a challenge. As the CEO, it's 2 a.m. You wake up, hot sweats. You're thinking about something. I imagine this happens a lot where you as CEO are always thinking and you're always waking up thinking about something. What is it that you're waking up thinking about? Yeah, I can tell you what I don't wake up thinking about is the quality or someone taking a product of ours and getting hurt.

15:51I have all the enough trust in our sterile team and our quality team making the right decisions. They're empowered to do so. However, what I am worried about is where certain states or even FDA will say, OK, we're not going to do a certain product. You know, so it's really from my job to wake up and realize how do I do a better job of showing data, adverse effects, if there's any, and really just making sure that we're all side by side on why products we want to carry are impactful to you. So that's probably the biggest one is really getting that message through. So we're excited and spending a lot of time and effort on this PCAC meeting coming up with the FDA and kind of working hand in hand with the FDA to see the same picture.

16:41So that's probably the biggest concerns if something's as well. And what has that experience been like when you're working with the FDA? And I mean, this has to be highly complex things, right? And you said earlier, too, so if it doesn't get approved, that could have a significant impact on not just your organization, but many other thousands of compounding organizations. So there's obviously a lot at risk. How has it been working with different government and private organizations? So far, been great. And over the last year or so, there's been a lot of news on this, a lot of movement in regards to the social media play.

17:24I believe our children are speaking pretty loudly on this, obviously mid-age adults. And here's the thing. Nobody wants to go to the black pocket. Nobody wants to do products that potentially are not safe for you. So, you know, we're hoping the impact is positive. Speaking of building something from the ground up, we often talk on this show about the hurdles from the early days that grind before you have a massive audience or venture backing. But the landscape of creator income is changing so fast, and I want to share a platform that's actually making that path accessible for beginners. It's called FanView.

18:04Whether you're a musician, a fitness coach, or someone with a unique perspective, FanView is a monetization platform that lets you turn your digital content into a real business. What's impressive here is the low barrier to entry. You don't need a million followers or years of experience to start earning. The process is incredibly simple. Upload your content, share exclusive videos or photos that your fans can't get anywhere else. You connect directly through deep, direct relationships rather than just being at the mercy of an algorithm. You get to earn money by generating recurring income through monthly subscriptions or even paywalled vault content.

18:45I've seen creators use their AI analytics to track exactly what's working, helping them scale their income faster than traditional social media ever allowed. It's built for the next generation of founders who want to own their audience from day one. Are you ready to start your creator journey and make it big? Visit fanview.com today and launch your career. You can also find the link right at the top of the description and in the pinned comment to check out FanView Creator Academy. To work with us and to do things by the book and ultimately what the FDA is looking for. If it doesn't come through, I fear that that could cause another backlash on the R &D place and people buying whatever they feels appropriate for them online or these dark markets.

19:36So I hope that's not the case, but that's potential. When you think about what's enabled you to get into the position that you are in, is it grit? Is it hard work? What do you feel is one or two things where you're like, every CEO needs to have this trait because I have firsthand experience. And the reason I ask as well is my dream was always to be a CEO of a publicly traded company or a larger organization. I didn't even want to be an entrepreneur. But then I realized as I was moving up in the corporate world, I was not really fit to continue. And the only option I had was to do my own business.

20:19But what for you has been, you know, some traits where you're like, you have to do this or you have to be like this in order to keep moving up. Right. I would tell you it was the last thing I want to do was the CEO. I never thought this would be the position I would land in. You know, I want to say that the dedication and just being aware of all the moving parts of the business, right, from from shipping to production to customer service, right, every part of it and really understanding those pieces. And then probably what was the most impactful part was spending time with the physicians and going to the trade shows, right?

20:58Because then you start to see patients and why they've changed. And that became the impactfulness. So I almost don't even look at products anymore as a name. Like you earlier said, you know, like kind of these interesting names like BPC, you know, or, you know, CJC. You know, it does sound like we're talking robotics. But what I did see were people that said, thank you for saving me for whatever reasons. Maybe it was for better sleep or better stress or losing weight or whatever it may be. And that became impactful, right? So you as a person start to say, why are people not understanding this?

21:38And it's not to be something afraid of. It's something that you should search for. You know, when we're in school, we learn history. We learn Spanish. We learn a lot of great things. We don't learn about your blood and maybe how to stay healthier longer. We just don't. And, you know, those are not necessarily a standard of school education. Right. So I think that as. yeah yeah so so i want people to start realizing this yeah take your get your blood taken go to your doctor start having conversations start figuring out solutions to maybe live longer not have a heart attack not this i mean all the all the things that we likely can change we just don't and um so so i think that's been the most in fact and what that led to was more of a personal journey for me, especially during COVID, when I saw family members of myself take products that Wells made.

22:31And I became a much bigger believer in these products after I saw it with my own eyes. Then it became a mission statement to say to people, like, let's go through these things. Let's find the best doctors. And people ask all the time, well, who's the best doctor? And it's a hard question. But as you look through a lot of the physicians we work with, I mean, many of them or on a journey to find the answers. And that's the key, right? It's practicing medicine. I hope at some point in our life, we can really get practicing medicine to perfecting medicine to some degree. It would be a nice change in our lifetime.

23:06I used to have a mentor and I noticed once he became CEO, he had a lot of sacrifices in his personal life. Divorce, didn't really even see his kids anymore. from the outside looking in he made like 150 million dollars but from the inside i noticed he was always he was he wasn't miserable but he was very lonely and i always found that very fascinating for you has there been any personal sacrifices along the way that you've had to make to continue in the role that you're in? Yeah. Look, I have four children. And my youngest is 18 who just graduated high school this last week. And I look back at their lifetime from my oldest to my 18-year-old, and I missed the majority of their life.

24:01So it's hard for me to look at that now and say, I don't even remember going to a football game or a baseball game with my son. And that's been hard on my thought process looking in the past. I miss that. But on the other end, I hope to provide them college paid for and at least a kickstart of their life. Because I think it's going to be a little harder to live as prices are skyrocketed by a home or cars these days. So while the sacrifice occurred at the beginning stages, hopefully I'm able to provide a better life for their future. So it's definitely, to your point, it does cause a lot of internal issues to that degree.

24:47I could say that now. Of course, growing through it, honey, it's one more year, one more year, one more year, right? Then you find yourself 30 years later. I was talking to my friend last night about that. We were cracking up. I guess one person at the table retired at 40. My friend's almost 60. And he's like, I'm still working. He's like, I'm VP and I'm making more money than ever. And I can't stop. I'm like, you've been saying for 10 years, you're going to retire. So my wife and I wrote this book called Unlimited Possibilities, where it's basically breaking through barriers you didn't think possible.

25:22What was an unlimited possibility moment for you where you broke through something that you could, you know, going back to as a kid, you never thought was possible? I never, like I said, thought I would be in the pharmacy role. I never thought this was going to be a journey that I took and let alone be the CEO of the journey. So I feel what I've learned in understanding the blood work and understanding products and matching, it's become very clear to me. And I never thought that would be something I ever did. I never really thought that was a solution. Right. So I've become somewhat of a tool to help and advocate, you know, with the family and with friends and so on.

25:59I'm not a physician, but obviously we utilize many of them. And I think that from what I've learned the most and my possibilities is really just trying to be helpful in that world. I've always wanted to be a doctor. I just had a lot of kids really and didn't have the time to go to school to be a doctor. So I feel that from a child to where I am today, I got to a really cool spot. And I like to be in this spot. And ultimately, I get to see results of thousands and thousands of people. so it's awesome to see it's the next best thing there you go my wife said the same thing she's like I always wanted to be a doctor and now I'm doing that so I'm like hey it's the next best thing but Chris Fishman this has been great I learned a lot I'm inspired can't wait to hear what happens in July cannot wait to see what happens in July hopefully you come back let's talk about it and I hope it's all positive news but thanks again for clarifying everything today telling me I've been wanting to ask someone for years about these things because I had no idea and no one ever broke it down.

27:06So I appreciate that. And thank you for joining us today. Yeah. Well, I appreciate the time and look forward to talking to you in the next month or two.