French Open Day 12 - Will Maja Chwalinska match Raducanu’s title run?

0:10Hello and welcome to the tennis podcast on day 12 of the French Open, a tournament where we have learned to expect the unexpected. And yet the most unexpected thing of all has happened today and absolutely none of us saw it coming. World number 114, Maja Kvelinska, today became the first ever qualifier to reach a Roland Garros final. She's the third lowest ranked major finalist in the open era of women's tennis behind Emma Raducanu and Kim Kleisters, who was unranked when she came back to win the 2009 US Open. And she might, Kvelinska, be everyone's new favourite player. For a story of this magnitude, we have drafted in reinforcements in the form of the Athletics' Charlie Eccleshare.

1:00Charlie, you are quite often the guy that sees things coming. I will never forget you picking Marquetta Vondrosheva for the 2023 Wimbledon title when she was the last name on everyone else's list. Did you see Maja Vlinska coming? I mean, I'd love to pretend I did, but no, I didn't. I mean, I saw her, in fact, in the first round against Junkin Wen. And again, I'd love to say at that point, I said, look out, look out for this qualifier. She is going to take this tournament by storm. But I didn't. I mean, I thought she was like really awkward and, you know, not an opponent that players would relish playing.

1:40But not for a moment did I think, I mean, she would get anything close to this. How could anyone see this coming? I mean, I'm not sure she would have had any sense that this was coming. It's all just fallen into place for her in the most incredible way. And then you watch her and you're like, yeah, I mean, how far can she take this? 7.64 in two hours and ten minutes. Two lengthy, gruelling sets over Deanna Schneider today. Is that the most fun, David and Matt, that you have had watching a tennis match this week? Oh, that's a good question because I've had a lot of fun. I really have. But I think maybe that was the most surprising fun I've had.

2:20Not that I didn't think Walenska was good. It's just I didn't think she was that good. I mean, that was a virtuoso performance showcasing everything she's got. And what she's got is creativity and just incredible nerve to go after some of the things she does and a construction in her mind that's like a sort of snooker player that's four shots ahead. she is reading shots that schneider was gonna hit and setting off towards them before she'd even hit them and and some of her some of her sort of looped deep strokes that she sort of saw bounce and she sort of sort of said i'm going into the net just out of the blue and then the ball would come back and schneider hadn't been expecting that and she then just pats away a drop volley winner it was happening time and time again drop shots sudden sort of injections of pace without particularly on the backhand side on her left-handed backhand which don't look like she's trying to hit the ball hard and she just strokes it and it just goes away and shocks the opponent for the pace of it it had everything she had that crowd in love with her after after about 10-15 minutes, many of whom probably knew nothing about her, let alone how to say her name.

3:40And yet, I mean, I say that there was an extraordinary number of Polish flags in that crowd. I only realised right at the end quite how many, because when everybody ends up celebrating, you look around the stadium, you're like, I actually don't think I've seen that many red and white flags or that many of any nationality's flags. Maybe Novak Djokovic a couple of times at the Australian Open when everybody's come out for him. but it was really striking. But I think the neutral was just, oh, this player is for us, particularly a French crowd. Matt, including me, how many stat requests have you had this evening pertaining to my Kralinska?

4:21Actually, just you. You'll be surprised. People are not coming to me in the press room for stats. I must confess I went to Opta. I mean, it is their actual job. Yeah, but look, there are a lot of fun ones. Opticom for him. There are a lot of fun ones. I just want to pick up on the point David made about, like, surprising fun, because obviously we're going to talk more about the other semifinal later, but I was at a bit of a low ebb after that one. Like, that was the one today coming into the day that I was really excited for. Matt had had some tough Marco Silva news, and then the first semifinal flamed out, and it was a tough Matt Roberts scene, dear listener.

5:00Yeah, so that was the one that I was really excited about. I thought it was going to be the best match remaining in the tournament. And then when that was a bit of a dud, I was a bit gutted. And I started watching this second one and immediately I was like, oh, hang on a minute, the rallies in this one are really to my liking. And there were 41 rallies of nine shots or more in the opening set of this match. That doesn't happen very often. It doesn't happen. And it tells you something about the style of player. Neither of them blessed with, like, huge power. But both have enough power at their disposal to make things awkward for the other player.

5:42And I just loved it so much, the way the rallies were constructed. I mean, Hovlinska's drop shot is a thing of beauty mixed in with those higher balls that Davis described. and when she puts the two together, coming in off the high ball and then playing the drop shot or the drop volley is so fun. And, you know, she had this incredible hold of serve at five all in that opening set. Schneider was coming at her, but she just fended it off. We were in the press conference. That was amusing. Yeah, yeah. Kept looking over. And the screen was on and I was so distracted. I wanted to make noises. I wanted to hit people next to me, David.

6:29But I had to behave myself in the press conference. And it was just like, it was in that game, that five-all game, where I think the match just elevated to something so special. The crowd was clearly going with them. And then in the tie break, I want to shout out the drop shot lob combination because the other skill that Hovinska has is anticipation. She reads the game so well. and she played this drop shot at 5-4. Schneider hits her forehand, but Havlinska's there and she puts the lob over Schneider's head and it lifts her on the way to the set. And it was just such joy. It was like a half volley, the lob.

7:10Yes, it was. It was a reaction half volley. And the look Schneider gave as she realises, like... Not again. It was the look I recognise from someone who's been Siegmunded. I mean look Holinska is not Laura Siegmund in lots of very positive ways but in terms of what she the distraction she's been driving opponents to and the reaction she elicits in them which makes me personally laugh in a very sadistic way it's very similar Yeah I thought Schneider actually did well in some respects to deal with it and especially when she lost the first time on the tie break then got broken straight away at the start of the second it could have ran away from her but actually she came back into it and she played some really good stuff as well i think you know it wasn't obviously felinska was had the crowd but schneider also played with some really nice angles some really nice touch really nice feel more so than i think she sometimes does i thought she almost raised her level in response but felinska the ability she had i mean chattray we know is this enormous core but she made it feel tiny like teeny tiny the with her court coverage her anticipation in the penultimate game in which she breaks to leave herself serving for the match schneider hits this brilliant angled backhand and felinska's like way out of court just kind of hoists up a kind of nothingy it's not a lob it's just kind of getting the ball back in schneider comes in and she's got the whole of the other side to put the ball into but she kind of is spooked by everything that's happened before hits it straight back to felinska who then lobs it again and Schneider hits a smash right back to her again because, again, she's like, I don't know what to do.

8:52Like, the sensible thing is to put it into the open space, but she'll probably chase that down, completely got in her head, and then she hit two more drop shots to break that game. And I thought that game just kind of summed up the match. I mean, stats-wise, Felinska, I mean, quite often this type of play, you know, with lots of loopy balls and, you know, trademarks of a defensive game, very excellent mover, lots of top spin. And sometimes the stats, you know, the numbers are low on both winners and unforced errors. 31 winners, 17 unforced errors for Walenska for two sets for the match. I mean, the ratio there is obviously incredible, but the raw numbers as well.

9:35Yeah, we were in the second set once we'd come out of this press conference where we would. I mean, look, the press conferences were really interesting. I really enjoyed talking to Miran Drava and to Marta Kosciuk. But we just could not help have the eye on over to our right where this big screen was. And one or two people were making involuntary noises next to me anyway. But when I got back out there and we're in the second set, it did feel really important that Flenska managed to win that first set. But I was waiting for her to get reeled in. I just thought she's going to get reeled in. And then Matt mentioned to me that Schneider's third set record has been extraordinary at this tournament.

10:17She's been winning all of them. In her last two matches. Yeah. She's in Sabalenka. And even in the second set, you know, when she's won in straight sets, the second set has been dominant the entire tournament. Once she's taken control of her match, she's really taken control of it. Yeah, but Helinska never really sort of let down. She just... Yeah. She kind of had the odd one or two wobbles, lost a couple of points, but then just quickly. And I think when you're trying to package a game like hers, that must be really energy sapping to have to keep that up for a long, long period of time. It's not like just having a big forehand that you just keep smacking about.

10:55You've got to constantly be putting these combinations together. And she kept it up. And she seems to be a bit ill. Yeah, she didn't sound great, did she? No, she... Sounds like she lost her voice almost. Yeah, she was blowing her nose a lot during the match and then in the press conference afterwards, she was very croaky and coughing a little bit. But against Callan Scar as well, I thought, because she lost a big first set lead. And I kind of thought, I keep waiting for the spell to be broken. And it just hasn't been. Yeah, and I guess then by extension, will it be against Andreeva? And that is kind of my sense.

11:27But I thought that today. I mean, I think it's natural to assume a player outside the top 100 will eventually kind of come crashing back down to earth. On the list of the five lowest ranked WTA players to ever reach a major final in the Open era, all five of them won that final. I mean, it is largely anomalies on that list, like Kleist is being unranked because she was coming back from having a baby. The Serena Williams 2007 Australian Open is in there. Sloane Stephens is in there. I mean, Emberetta Khan, who is the most obvious parallel with Maya Filinska, but all five did win. Is there not Serena 2018 Wimbledon?

12:06Or is there a protected ranking that kind of screws that? She's not on the list I have in front of me. That was one I was given, because I think she was 100 and something. Right. But it might be a protected ranking, messes that up. And obviously she didn't win that final. OK. But I think that is really interesting, even if she, depending on where she's classified, clearly the vast majority do go on and win. And even just off the top of my head in the men's, Goran, Mark Edmondson was very low-ranked when he won the Australian Open. So, yeah, maybe there's something in that. I do think it helps that you haven't come into the tournament with expectations.

12:49And you have not had time to process all of this. Even on the court when she was told you've just reached the final, she couldn't process it. And it's almost better that she doesn't, I feel. And I think she knows that. yeah right she keeps saying oh you know ask me next week and i'll be able to give you some good quotes about what all this is and what it's meant and how i've dealt with it but she's like right now i'm just existing in it and and trying not to think about it too much she's very interesting in the press conference room i think like she's really likable but she's definitely not a people pleaser is she she's like i'm not she's not fawning or sort of trying to ingratiate herself with the media at all?

13:34No, she didn't seem like, wow, I'm so kind of lucky and happy to be here. It was kind of business as usual. Like it was the kind of press conference that you'd expect someone who's kind of a veteran at being at those, you know, what it was just... Like a Shvantec press conference. Yeah, a little bit. You could certainly see it made sense that they're good mates. But like, I just don't understand how you're able to be that blinkered and block out the fact that like this, utterly crazy thing is happening. How do you not just suddenly wake up and realise where you are? I did think or wonder if today might be a bit different because her on-court interview had been markedly different, I thought, in terms of the level of emotion and realisation of what was happening to previous rounds.

14:22It did feel like, OK, this is really quite big now, isn't it? but that's you know when you're totally caught up caught up in the moment and julianne beneteau standing in front of you and she did say didn't she how sort of knackered she felt which again she did seem exhausted yeah which might as i said it might just be a you let your guard down and you let it all out but i do wonder what that looks like in a couple of days time but then she played yesterday didn't she she this was yeah yeah that's true these two were this side of the draw that only had one day's rest. And not only is that sort of difficult from the only having one day's rest point of view, but also I just think that's really tough from a like totally changing the cadence of what you've been used to for 11 days.

15:08Yeah, unless it helps in the, it means there's less time to stop and think about where you are. That's where I'd be a little concerned about the final because of the set piece nature of it, the fact that it's so grand. The interactive dance beforehand. And it's all happening. Ceremony, all this. We've seen a little bit of a rehearsal on the court there. I have, anyway. The reason we're recording where we are is because some rehearsing interpretive dances are preventing us from being on Chattray. Nice though it was. We couldn't clash with that music. But, you know, it is two days. And it's quite a job to try to avoid all the shenanigans that are going on.

15:48Because, like I said, the number of Polish flags in that stadium, You can only imagine the messages she's getting. And I think it's... I really do think she's captured something here in Paris. Like, it was... I was... I came for a little walk because my back was hurting and I was by the deck chairs watching on the big screen at Match Point. And I know everyone loves an underdog, and that can account for some of it, but they were cheering for her like she was a French player. It's like the spirit of Lois Boisson from last year. has found a new host. And they love the creativity as well here, don't they?

16:27Absolutely. It's a similar type of game, potentially more deadly. And there's, you know, there's a Russian element too. We'll come on to that in part two when we talk about Andreeva and look ahead to the final. But I think she's going to have, like, French player-esque support on Saturday. I really do. Yes, I think it's a tougher final for Andreeva than Schneider would have been. I agree. Because of the more awkward game style, the crowd support, the expectation that, God, I'm in a first-grandstand final and I'm playing a qualifier. Like, this is a massive chance. I'm supposed to win. I'm supposed to win.

17:06Like, I do think there's a chance that Avlinska is so tired and maybe a bit overwhelmed. I do think that is possible. But if she can get into the match, I definitely think she can make it awkward for Andreeva and uncomfortable in a way that I'm not sure Schneider, who is obviously so friendly with Andreva, I'm not sure that that would have happened in that match. And continuing the Boisson analogy, I mean, we will remember what happened with Andreva against Boisson last year. And I thought that that was Kostiuk's chance, which obviously we'll get onto, but in the second set when she did rally and the crowd were getting on Andreva's case just a little bit, or certainly they were rooting big time for Kostiuk.

17:49Like, if that's happening again on Saturday, first-hand final match, you should absolutely be winning. What a huge opportunity. And the crowd start getting on your case. I think that could, you know, bring back those memories of that Boisson match last year. Do we know if Valentina even has an agent? Like, I mean, presumably she's got some, but, you know, she's suddenly, she's got, as you would expect, patches now, sponsored patches on her kit. She doesn't have a kit sponsor. She's wearing different kit every round still, whether that will be the case on Saturday, I don't know. But, like, you'd hope that someone, there's somebody that she can trust that has come along and dealing with all these things because she obviously wants to stay in her bubble, right, as she described it.

18:33But, like, you can want to stay in your bubble, but there are, like, practical things, like media demands and sponsor demands and trying to find a hotel room, you know, to take you out of that bubble. There was someone in the press conference, wasn't there? I don't know who that was but there's always you know man in corner yeah what do they do and someone's phone did keep going off and I was like is that someone to do with that just getting like loads of demands yeah I mean how many patches do we think she'll have on Saturday as many as she's alive I mean make the most of it I'd say Christian Rude style and any team members I mean And it is crazy.

19:19You know, David and I are walking out of the stadium and talking about it. Like, I genuinely thought I would never in my lifetime see a qualifier win a Grand Slam again after Raducanu, right? And look, she might not win. But the fact that we've got this close is blowing my mind. And I remember so strongly the feeling at that US Open in 2021 that Raducanu won being like, I watch tennis all the time. I think about tennis all the time. I read about tennis all the time. And I had no idea that it was going to play out like this. And I've got that feeling again. It, like, really, really humbles you.

20:00And it allows you to, like, open your mind to, like... You never know. Exactly. Just imagine. It's that. It's like... This is how David lives every day. I've always seen this stuff kind of happen. And this is vindication. It's so fun when you just think, what might happen? Like, it's such a fun place to be. But that's what's so weird about it. And I asked Schneider about it. Like, literally yesterday, she beat the world number one with a bagel set in the third set. Yes. A day later, she's losing to the world number 114. And, like... The whiplash there. Yeah. But just by extension, are there, like, tons of other players who, if they caught, like, would, could have this kind of run?

20:43And I think that's why this run of Havlinska might be more inspiring to players than Raducanu's because Raducanu was so young and I know she'd had that Wimbledon so, you know, people were tracking her talent and everything. But it was it was the unknown of Raducanu that made it so special. Havlinska's lost 10 times in qualifying at Grand Slams. like we all thought those who knew her would have thought oh i know that player's level yeah you know she's she's been she's been around like she's played a reasonable amount she'd won two tour level matches on clay in her career prior to this and it wasn't just because she hasn't been playing you know she's she's just not been able to get to this level but this kind of breakthrough i it's on the one hand you don't want to say it's an inspiration because I think it's really hard to do.

21:40We can't expect this. That's what makes it so special. But I hope that players do look at this and think, as David would think, you never know, just imagine, why not me kind of thing. I hope that that sort of momentum can catch on for people. I do love that suddenly, what little past footage of Mike Walenska that there is in the world is suddenly coming to the surface as it does. Particularly one bit. Yeah. Well, there's one, somebody on the barge has realised that, so Maya Felinska has one Grand Slam main draw victory to her name prior to this tournament. Wimbledon. Four years ago. 22. Yeah. She beat Katarina Siniarkova and somebody on the barge was there at courtside.

22:25It was on, you know, it was practically in the car park and they were there to watch Katarina Siniarkova and they got a photo of the handshake. And obviously Maya Felinska's in that, but they weren't there to take a photo of Maja Chlinska. And then there is also some absolutely majestic footage that has emerged of Chlinska, have you seen this, Charlie, playing Coco Vanderwey in Wimbledon Quallies? It's just epic. No. It's so wonderful. I've seen the Sviantec speech at the Junior Australian Open. Yes, that's lovely. And some footage of Chlinska icing Chlintec's head during a particularly gruelling United Cup match.

23:02Felinska's been a non-playing member of multiple Polish United Cup and Billie Jean King Cup teams. But yes, the Coco van der Wey Wimbledon qualifying footage is essential viewing. So what's happening in there? Oh, Felinska hits a completely legitimate body shot volley. It's pretty vicious. It's pretty vicious, but at one other point. She apologised. It's the sort of thing you see all the time. It's actually a mid-court sort of forehand. She rifles it straight at her and she holds her racket up but actually hits van der Wey in the shoulder. And van der Wey turns around and goes, that is so messed up.

23:44That is just so messed up. You're a pathetic player. Yeah, she goes, you're a pathetic player. She goes, just eat it. She goes like this. And then Walenska hits her forehand out on the next point and van der Wey goes, yeah, karma, baby. and the next thing you know is whoever's edited it cuts to the handshake which valinska wins and i mean it's just the classic vanderwey no look and walk on it's amazing check this out and valinska's like saying sorry sorry you know she's trying to be really she's very graceful and and vanderwey is just well being found away yeah incredible stuff i think we've reached the end of the road of what we can talk about with Felinska before we address who she's going to play in the final on Saturday.

24:34So join us in part two and we'll talk about Mira and Drover. Welcome back to part two of today's tennis podcast. On to the second semi-final, which was the first semi-final of the day but the second one we're going to talk about because frankly as a match it was nothing compared to the Schneider-Felinska match. Nothing compared to what we were hoping for and expecting from this matchup. Mira Andreva beating Marta Kostiuk 6-1, 6-3 in an hour and 16 minutes. Debate has been raging all day, Charlie, on our Tennis Podcast group chat about how much this was down to Mira Andreva being excellent today and how much this was down to a pretty horrible performance from Marta Kostiuk.

25:21Yeah, I mean, I think Andreva handled the conditions really well and her backhand was really good. She didn't look like she was particularly bothered by the conditions, by the wind, whereas Kostiuk looked so ragged. Her forehand kept misfiring. So I kind of find it tricky to separate those two things. I don't think Andreeva was like absolutely lights out or anything like that. But I think she was really solid and basically did all the things that Kostiuk didn't because Kostiuk was so erratic. And it's easier to be good when you're not feeling under any pressure. right like I think you know playing well and playing badly they don't they don't ever happen in a in a vacuum but there's no getting away from the fact that this was not the match that Marta Kosciuk wanted to play today at all no it and it wasn't the match that she's been playing you know like her level has been so good for so long now I guess I had let my guard down a little bit and didn't see this kind of performance coming from her given the way she's won Madrid in the build-up and the way she's beaten Svantec and Svitolino.

26:33I just trusted her to really show up on this stage and perhaps that was unfair because Grand Sam semifinals are massive occasions and it was windy and the conditions were tricky but you know she lost for serve in the opening game didn't she and that was that was a bit of a red a bit of an alarm bell but then she had Love 40 immediately on Andreeva's serve and I thought, okay, they're both nervous here. This has been a bit of a slow start from them both but when Andreeva held that game, I think it helped her free up and it just kept Kostiuk in the nerve zone of, oh, I haven't got a game on the board, I'm not feeling the ball today and it's hard when Andreeva is in that mode to break through her.

27:16You know, she moves so well, she can change direction, she can be a bit of a wall but she can also attack. She's a really hard player to face when you're not feeling well. She's got a lot of variety as well. She doesn't give you necessarily all the rhythm. And, yeah, I thought Kostiuk, and she said it in the press conference, that she started pulling the trigger a bit too soon in rallies and she just got a bit ragged and it just got away from her. But, you know, it just wasn't what I was expecting. I really thought this was going to be A, close, right to the end, but B, I thought it would be really high quality as well, and they'd both play well.

27:55So I was just caught out by it, you know. I had my expectations really high, and it was a bit of a dud, really. I had over-snacked for this match big time. Yeah, I thought that as well. I came up, I was like, settle in. You're home for the next three hours. And then, oh, like an hour, I was like, oh, this is done, isn't it? it's amazing how i mean i'm sort of always caught out a bit by how good mir andreva's serve yeah is it is such a weapon absolutely and it it wasn't diminished by the wind you know we were talking was it yesterday day before sometime in the recent past about how roof closures tend to benefit big servers because you know perfect conditions for your for your big serve she's got a fairly low toss and in those very windy conditions her serve continued consistently to be just a huge huge weapon yeah and the only period where she was in any sort of peril was when the roof closed i mean it's a surreal thing where the roof suddenly was closing and then she lost a couple of games if anybody would like to see matt roberts expression at that exact moment when the roof began closing during bright sunlight it's available on our instagram and it's worth a look Yeah.

29:10I mean, I did feel that potentially they were vindicated. Yeah, the rain did then come. It did rain. It did come. And before the end of the match. It did. I don't believe that on clay, with the speed with which the roof can close, they need to operate a preventative policy with the roof here. I tend to agree. Personally. I think they were a bit too trigger happy with it. I think you can almost start doing that as soon as the first drops appear, especially on clay, as you say. But, yeah, the roof, the rain did come. It wasn't like the other days where they've shut the roof and there's been no rain at all.

29:47And given the disparity in how they were handling the conditions in that moment, and at this moment, Andreva didn't know that it was going to start heavily raining in three games' time. At this moment, it's sunny outside. You know, you can see the shofts of sunlight around the place. She is so clearly handling the conditions way better than her opponent. I mean, I would have felt, I would have been stomping my feet and thinking I'm being sabotaged and she's 19. And, you know, she clearly was having feelings about it. And there is a version of Mir Andreva that would have dealt with those feelings differently not that long ago, I think.

30:24And she said, I told myself to accept everything that happened on the court because it felt like today was a day when anything could happen. And that's also, I think, the kind of mentality you've needed to get through this tournament because it's been a tournament where they've had to deal with so many different weather conditions and the mayhem and chaos of the draw and not let that affect you. Like, I think this is a real growth mindset-wise for Mandrava. Yeah, there's a real change in her to me. I haven't seen that much of her over the course of the tournament. I haven't actually been in any of her press conferences this week, which I normally loved her press conferences.