Rome - So is Swiatek back, or what?

34:20Svitolina, incredible stuff. And I feel like we should also give a mention to Serana Castella, who Coco Goff beat in her semi-final. 36 years of age on this retirement tour. She's now 21 in the live rankings, which matches her career high from 2013. And that is extraordinary. She has, she's done the predictable thing, guys. Well, actually, no, she said when she was mid-run, she said, if I win the Rome title, then I might reconsider my retirement. But I think that is putting on the table the mere possibility that the retirement could be revoked. So let's continue to watch that space, Camille. I thought she was joking when she said it.

35:08Yeah. I saw the interview on court, I think. It's her career. She can do what she likes. I'm just saying I've seen this film before. Yeah, no, I get it. I was talking about it yesterday, how it's similar to the interim football manager of the Malbion have had recently, who performs amazingly for the rest of the season, but do you give them the job full-time? And then you don't have the deadline. And it becomes problematic because suddenly you don't have this deadline. It's a different job, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. Totally different job. I hope Castella just... Well, I hope she does whatever she wants, but I kind of feel like it would be quite cool to just stop having to play the best tennis in your life.

35:52Right, see you then. Yeah, absolutely. OK, that is our thoughts on the women's tournament so far and a look ahead to the final between Luna Svitolina and Coco Gough. Let's get the thoughts on all of that and the men's and a whole lot more besides from your friend of mine who has been in Rome. She's no longer in Rome. She's now pampering herself in Italy. Go Pam. But she's been in Rome doing good work for Yonex and scouting players for us. She was on the practice court filming Greg Grzeski and Giovanni Pesci Pericard. Go Pam. Here is your friend of mine, Pamela Howard-Schriver, reporting on the sights and sounds of Rome.

36:40So we'll see you on the other side of Pam to talk about the men's tournament. Hey, everybody. I'm coming to you from a Jam Shriver reset at a spa by a lake in Italy. I went to Foro Italico and worked as a coach this year. It was a place I had been to as a player over 30 years ago. It was amazing to be back, one of the most iconic tennis venues on the planet. A lot of it was the same, but so much had changed. I spent a lot of time watching and supporting players who played on the new arena, the BNP Paribas Arena, which is about the same distance as maybe court 15 all the way towards downtown at Melbourne Park, going all the way to John Kane Arena.

37:36I mean, it is probably maybe even a longer walk. but it was a beautiful new arena in an amazing setting where the Olympics you know it's the old Olympic site from the early 60s I actually was in the coaching box for a player a Yonex player who does not currently have a primary coach and was in the coaching box on the main court Campo Central how do they say it I don't I won't say it correctly and that was kind of interesting to be in the coaching box there. I wasn't really expecting it. And I will say playing conditions, to me, I saw a lot of aggressive tennis being rewarded. I mean, obviously, look what Sinner continues to do with his aggression.

38:24I saw some big power tennis in the matches I watched on the women's game. So while, of course, the conditions are a little slower than Madrid, You can see like today's clay court game is still, they're hitting it hard. Rallies are quite entertaining. I do think 4-0 Italico may need to think about in the coming decade, extending the back of the court. I saw Casper Rood practicing, and the practice courts are just not enough room for especially the men players to return serve where they want to return serve. So the field of play is changing. It's almost like golf courses have gotten longer. Well, the backcourt between the baseline and the back fence, it has to be redesigned.

39:15And that was something I really noticed at 4-0 Talico, not enough room at the back of the court. And even the sides, sometimes just players, their movement is so much better than 30, 40, 50 years ago. And they play differently. They play much more the back of the court and, of course, moving forward quickly. Anyway, enough about that. I do want to make a quick mention on some players complained about white seats in some of the new stadiums at 4-0 Talago. And also there was a big white signage for a sponsor low down, like at the back wall. And white is the total enemy of a tennis player. When you're trying to play and you see white, especially if it's electronically lit.

40:04I watched Ben Shelton lose his match, and he played during dusk, and I was sitting behind the court, and I was like, I can totally understand. He could not see the ball come out. So I feel like overall tournaments need to really respect what players need in order to see the ball in a way that makes them feel comfortable and confident that they're able to – if you can't see the ball, you can't play at your best. So I think it's, I mean, I'm going to transition into from this word, respect the players, what the players need with playing conditions. Also respect what they should have as a percentage of the prize money.

40:48That's a conversation that's been going on now since the beginning of this tournament. I think Sinner really brought up that word respect. And obviously he's such a huge leader in the game today because he's a dominant number one on the men's side. You show respect to players by percentage of the prize money. It's nowhere near what it is for sporting entities, certainly in my home country, USA. Again, showing respect by having good playing conditions. I think having the same tennis ball on segments of the tour so that players aren't risking arm injury because the balls feel different with each tournament leading into a major.

41:28Scheduling shows respect. Having athletes play at 2 a.m. in the morning and then expect them to recover that is not showing respect. Obviously, we're coming up on the one anniversary of my rant at last year's Roland Garros with you all about tournament director Amelie Maresmo and how French Federation schedules the women. They, you know, they get them out of the way. It feels like by two or three in the afternoon and then it's prime time men on all courts, including night matches through the years. but you know overall showing respect to the athlete and the athlete's voice it's trying to get more organized it's trying to get more unified i've seen it many other times in my 47 years and obviously before i started to play in the late 70s it was you know there was a lot of um you know there was the boycott at wimbledon there was the women uh seeking equal prize money at the u.s open there was a lot going on so let's see what happens i think it's going to be interesting on the court um obviously i got to just give a shout out to a guy i nicknamed the piece of work a couple of years ago at a 1 30 a.m u.s open uh interview on ash um medvedev i saw him uh have a practice match with fonseca before the tournament started and he is just unbelievable to watch whether it's practice or a match.

42:53He's locked in, though, at times. When he was finishing off Landa Lucy, it was so interesting to see him. He could have closed that match out a little sooner, but he stayed so locked in. So I find Sinner Medvedev, while Sinner goes in the big favorite, I think it's such an interesting match. I look forward to that. But women's final. Coco Gauff, I watched her suffer through an early round. I think it was her first match. Solana Sierra on that new court. And she really struggled. She needed a double fault at the end from Solana Sierra to lock up the match. And she was carrying so much anxiety during that match and looked like she was just, oh, hating to be out there.

43:37And then the next thing you know, you know, she's here, she is in the finals and she's gotten better each round. I haven't really watched her play a whole lot. But Svitolina is fascinating. I mean, she's playing by far her best tennis of her career post having her baby. And Andrew Bettles, her coach and I, you know, I've known Andrew for a long time. And we had a few moments we chatted, you know, like after she beat Haley Baptiste in the middle of the tournament easily, like two and one. And, you know, how much she just followed the game plan to perfection. I just feel like Svitolina is an example of such a mature athlete in the prime of her physical and emotional and mental state so it's kind of contrasting styles coco we never know how she's going to be emotionally right now we know she'll keep competing but how much so i think it's i think it's going to be a good final i'm looking forward to it um and i'm mostly also looking forward to seeing you all next week i know this long voice notes so feel free to chop away as you want welcome back to part two of today's tennis podcast sending our attention to the men's tournament now in rome where the semi-finals are being played today as we come to you friday morning um they may already have been played uh one or both of them by the time that you're listening to this luciano darderi having the week of his life at his home tournament against Kaspar Rude and Yannick Sinner against Daniel Medvedev.

45:07Yannick Sinner, the first player in history to reach 32 consecutive Masters 1000 wins. He did that with victory over Andrei Rublev. Rublev deserves a mini trophy, becoming the first man this week to break the Yannick Sinner serve. I feel like that should get you the runner-up prize in men's tennis at the moment. But yeah, I mean, what can you say about Yannick Sinner? He's brilliant. He was clutching at his leg towards the end of that match, which was, I found that very worrying just because of the landscape of men's tennis at the moment. We've lost Lorenzo Mazzetti this week. He is out of Roland Garros.

45:53We have had the good news that And Artifis does seem to at least be fit. And the injury that we were talking about for him on Sunday's show doesn't seem to be what he and we were all worried it might be. So that's a bit of good news. But we've had Rafael Houdar be injured this week. Like, wrap these guys in cotton wool and Yannick Sinner included. I was worried. I am worried. but David you're not falling for a bit of clutching a bit of Yannick Sinner clutching doesn't worry David Law we've seen a lot of it haven't we really I get it we've seen Andy Murray do it we've seen Novak Djokovic do it now we've seen Yannick Sinner do it it's sort of oh my leg hurts and it does hurt so why not let people know that it hurts because it does and some people don't do that Some people just don't make a sign, anything, to give you an idea that something's hurting.

47:01I mean, I think he gets cramp. I think he, you know, who knows? Maybe his body will start to tire out. I mean, it's not surprising if he's feeling a bit tired now. And I think he does need to be a little bit careful, for sure. but his matches are not massively taxing because he's so efficient and so bloody good. He's so much better than everybody he's playing that matches aren't lasting very long. He's ordeal free in his route through these draws. So I just think, I think the bigger problem is whereas you said Svantec could probably do with another tournament next week and I agree with that, Yannick Sinner could probably do with another week off.

47:44You know, you could probably do with one week of just not being in Paris and not being in Rome, but being maybe with Pam on the spa weekend she's having. You know, that's something I'd quite like to have an insight into as a conversation. But no, I think Sinner is right where he needs to be. I'm not concerned. I mean, I don't have any medical or inside information to be sure of that. But my sense is that he's just fine. will be okay but he is knackered and i'm not surprised yeah he's been on and this is the problem with his back-to-back two-week masters you're on for a month and everybody looks and it's not just the tennis is it i mean he told us that he used madrid to to recharge but rome you know the demands on him in rome i mean everywhere he's the world number one but the demands on him in rome in terms of sponsors and you know fans who'll be stopping to sign every single autograph you know he's good he's good like that and waiting for him absolutely he's on the whole time and that's just well a bit like golf in new york you know it's just you can see that it's just weighing a little bit on certainly on her over there and he's he's much quieter about it or he never makes you he never he never references that but in fact he always says he loves it and i think he does but it's it is a lot and i think he compartmentalizes probably as well as anybody i've seen in years yeah yeah i i read those those closing stages as fatigue rather than injury yesterday against rublev and you know it kind of affected his serve i think that was why rublev managed to managed to break his serve um just just on that on that number of 32 wins i I just wanted to say this, that he's overtaken two of Djokovic's streaks there.

49:45Djokovic had a 30-match win streak at Masters 1000s, and that was in 2015. And he had a 31-win streak, and that was in 2011. And if you had to ask, what was the best version of Novak Djokovic? I think a lot of people would say 2011, and a lot of people would say 2015. Those are historic, great Djokovic years. And Sinner is putting up numbers that it was better than that right now. And he's also overtaken Federer's streak of 29. And that was in 2005, 2006. That was Federer's peak, I think a lot of people would say as well. So I just feel like that's a number where if he can add some majors to it, you know, like which we expect him to do.

50:29if he can add two, maybe even three majors this season, this is going to be going down as like an all-time great ATP season, given this consistency that he's on. And it might go down as his best ever season if he adds those majors. But I feel like we're in the middle of something really historic, which is hard to recognise when you are in it. But just I think the comparison there with Djokovic and Federer helps you realize just how good that is and it was it was kind of remarkable that two matches i watched back to back were the darderi hodda really late one night and it was like fun but it was it was a hot mess katherine it was a total hot mess and then like the next match i watched was yannick sinner against andre rublev and it was just a total opposite it was just like total efficiency and competence from the start.

51:28And it was like, that's it. That's the difference with him and the rest of men's tennis right now. The rest of men's tennis might be really fun and interesting and a good match in isolation. But the difference in performance level from everyone else to Sinner is just staggering right now. You think, oh, maybe that wasn't a brilliant Yannick Sinner set. And then they flash up the stats at the end. And okay, we will take the performance rating with a pinch of salt. But you think, OK, maybe that wasn't brilliant. And he's just dropped an 8.9 on that scale. And you think, oh, actually, like the numbers tell you that that was that was really quite good.

52:05It just wasn't it just wasn't perfection, you know. And that's what everyone else is having to sort of live with right now. You know, he's going to try and drag him into a hot mess, though. Daniel Medvedev. That's that's the play, isn't it? I mean, that's kind of always the play, whether he wants it to be or not for Medvedev, isn't it? Make it a hot mess. but it's definitely the play for him against Yannick Sinner. Nothing if not compelling, Daniel Medvedev on a clay court. Thriller last night against Martin Lander-Luthe, 16-6-4-7-5. It's been a weird tournament, hasn't it, for Medvedev? Got a bye in the first round.

52:46How is this sort of a bit of a quirk that he's reached the semi-final here or is he, I don't know, is he showing some form on clay? I mean, the last time he was showing some form on clay, won Rome and lost round one of Roland Garros, didn't he? So even if he is showing some form, could mean nothing. But is he showing some form, David, or is this a slightly quirky little Medvedev run? I think he's showing some form. I mean, I think everything is relative and I'm comparing him to losing 6-0, 6-0 in Madrid. where he wasn't showing any form. But then I also think back to, he's been fascinating this year.

53:28I mean, he's always kind of fascinating, but he's been fascinating in a positive way overall to me, even though he lost love and love, even though he really, he got destroyed by Leonard Tien in Australia. He then played incredible tennis for two or three weeks in the Middle East and then going into Indian Wells, where he lost out on two tie breaks in the final to Sinner. And honestly, going into that final, I thought Medvedev was going to win that. The level he was playing. It was kind of like Svitolina here in Rome. I don't think Medvedev's playing like that, but I'm not sure he can because of clay.

54:06He wasn't very good in Miami. It's really interesting that you think, oh, he's cracked it. This is Medvedev back, a bit like we're talking about Shvantec. And then he throws in a duffer of a week. But I do think he's playing well. I mean, wow, he had to deal with a lot from Lander Luthe last night. I mean, the first set being 6-1, and Lander Luthe in Medvedev's words saying, if he played like that every set for the rest of the year, he'd be in there with Sinner and Alcaraz. And I mean, I know what he means. You know, Lander Luthe, I think he's a really exciting talent. And he walks about the place.

54:41I was trying to think, who does he remind me of? What's this walk and this look that he's got? And it reminds me of early Boris Becker. He just has this strut and this gait and this sort of love in it and as if no limits on himself. And I love watching Andaluthe. But Medvedev's the guy who ended up winning. And he hit an incredible sort of the vintage Medvedev back and around the net post from being put in the hedge by a kick serve. and he goes over the net post or round that and then into the postage stamp in the corner. I think he's playing well. I think there are limitations to what he can do on clay because the ball doesn't really react in the way that it might elsewhere.

55:33But I often think of him and Sinner as just one of the more fascinating rivalries because of how dominant Medvedev was and how dominant Sinner has become. Medvedev should hopefully take some heart from what he knows he's capable of doing against Sinner. So I wouldn't write that one. I think this is a different category. If Sinner is a little frayed around the edges, which I think he probably is mentally, and who wouldn't be just because of fatigue, Medvedev could be the guy to draw that out and, in your words, hot mess it up. yeah definitely Italian representation in the other semi-final as well let's talk about Luciano Darderi there are so many good Italian men it's quite hard to sort of make yourself stand out from the pack isn't it like it's really easy to sort of look at a Grand Slam draw or look at a result at a Grand Slam and go oh there's another Italian I'm always making the gag aren't they like oh another Italian man's come out of the woodwork who on earth is this one?

56:46So sort of to mark yourself out particularly at a home tournament you know the biggest tour event in Italy if you don't count the ATP finals is incredibly good going I think from anyone and he's done it in memorable style as Luciano Darderi I mean obviously because of the smoke delay in his match against Rafael Hadar. I will come to you on that, Matt Roberts. Weird stuff happening in tennis with comical graphics involved, I feel like, is your mastermind subject. But I feel like we should probably start before that with his victory over Alexander Zverev in the match before, saving four match points, then went on to win the decider, Six Love you know a brilliant performance from Darderi who stood up to Zverev and said okay if your play is to wait for me to miss I'm not gonna mate I'm up to this and played with a good amount of variety as well it was just a really smart performance I thought from Darderi Zverev's take on that match was that it's the worst court I have played on in my life.

58:08Juniors, pros, futures, practice. I have match point, the ball jumps over my head. I have break point, the ball rolls. Anyway, the wind was also strong. Overall, I still think I should have won the match in two sets. After that, yes, he played wonderfully. Graceful as ever from Zverev there. Also posted a chippy reply to the Tennis Channel on Instagram, on one of the social videos, complaining about how little he was featured in the final edit. It's not giving contender at Roland Garros, is it? I mean, obviously, just totally graceless and making himself look an idiot. But in terms of, you know, the insight he's giving us into his state of mind, David, like, he's clearly a mess, isn't he?

59:04alexander i mean i think he's another one who needs a rest this is the problem i think he's a bit tired um and you don't want to be tired going into grand slam so actually i think in a way losing earlier in rome might end up helping him get over to paris enjoy this glorious weather you're promising us and just relax in a bit i mean he's not i don't i mean he works bloody hard doesn't he? But I think he probably needs some time. The problem is I'm not sure he's 100 % fit either. There are these question marks over his back. His service speed is a bit off. But I feel like Darderi was just tactically superb in this match.

59:52He took, in his own way, he took the Sinner blueprints and kept Zverev off balance. At the start, it was a disaster in terms of what he was doing. He looked exhausted. Darderi didn't feel good. I think he was a bit freaked out by... Suddenly the scores go in the wrong way and he was really heavily down. But then he just... He's set in 5-3 down. I mean, he's about to lose this match. So Zverev, you know, he's right. He should have won the match in two sets. He's right. But he didn't. He didn't serve it out. And I think that's a real concern if you're Zverev. that you're this big guy with this big serve and you don't serve it out.

1:00:35That's kind of his bread and butter. But credit to Darderi for getting back into it and then just keeping him off balance. Kept on throwing, just throwing in a slice. And then when Zverev would lurch forward to get it back and rally it deep, then Darderi would pull the trigger with a really hard, fast, deep one. And you could see that Zverev's just like, whoa, where's that come from? And then he doesn't really give you much in response. And then Darderi just takes over. This was happening time and time again. He volleys well. He's not afraid to go to the net and so forth. So, yeah, I think Darderi's been a real revelation this week.

1:01:12I suspect that this will probably hurt his chances in Roland Garros in a way because I think he's going to be on such a high and he's going to have a bit of a crash. We'll see. But Zverev, I don't think it's terrible. I mean, look, until this one, he'd only been losing to Yannick Sinner. He'd been beating everybody else. And it's best of five at Roland Garros. Six love. Yeah, no, it's bad. He checked out. I think he checked out a bit mentally. I think he's a bit gone. Like, he's just knackered. And he was like, oh, I can't scrap anymore. It was a bit of that, I think. I don't think that that will impact Roland Garros for him.

1:01:57I think he's got enough time because he's lost earlier. He's got a week and a half to freshen himself up, get into five-set mentality. Trying to put that guy away over five sets is bloody difficult. And he still has to remind himself, Al Kraus ain't here. I'm the other guy in the half of the draw. You know, he should still be reaching the final of Ronan Garros. He should still, given everything that's going on. No Mazzetti. Feast question marks injury-wise. Djokovic barely played. He's the guy. The courts are better at Roland-Garom. Yeah, he'll be playing on a proper court. But honestly, don't.

1:02:39Any more excuses. Just shut up with your excuses, mate. I just think those, you know, I know he's doing the rounds on, I think he's deleted it now, that comment on the Tennis Channel video. But I think it's pretty revealing of how, you know, I mean, it's a study in the fragile male ego, isn't it? Like, OK, he's tired. That's revealing about, like, what tennis is going to produce, though? Don't you think he's always just like that? I think it's, yeah, I do. But the fact that he's actually posting, I think he probably thinks that 100 % of the time. But the fact that he's actually posting it is a bit revealing about where he's at.

1:03:20Yeah, I mean, OK, it might just be that he's knackered, making bad choices, and he'll be fine in a week. But I think his ego and confidence is at a low ebb. And I agree, David, it takes a lot to expose that in best-of-five tennis. Not many players are able to expose that and sort of stand up to him enough to do it over best-of-five. but it's clearly there to be exposed and I don't think he can miraculously solve that in a week is how I feel. I'd be surprised if he doesn't make the final of Roman Garros given the likely competition in his half of the draw. Yeah, I mean that's probably still true.

1:04:04And yet, David, post-orangere you will say oh, that guy in the second round could be tricky. You're absolutely right. You've read me like a book.

1:04:20Let's talk about Caspar Rude. Hang on. A moment. Oh, no. Hang on. We've got to talk about the smoke. Sorry.

1:04:31I got distracted by the orangery. Take it away, Matt. Off you go.

1:04:39We've had another smoke delay.

1:04:44I mean it was crazy it was absolutely crazy like I think the I think the Coppa Italia final you know like the sort of Italian version of the FA Cup always clashes with with Rome doesn't it and it's played in the in the Olympic Stadium which is right next door and after that they let off fireworks and the and the smoke from those fireworks drifted over to the tennis in rome and just sat there and hung in the air for so long i mean it was a it was a 20 minute delay where they had to stop the match because it was so thick that it meant that the electronic line calling wasn't working and they had no had no backup you know so they had to stop i think the players frankly couldn't see the ball anyway tim henman on sky was saying that he was at one end of the stadium and if he if he looked to the other side of the stadium he couldn't make out people's faces or anything like that i mean i was once present at a at a champions tour event that was played entirely in those conditions in chengdi so you know suck it up lads is what i was thinking at one o 'clock in the morning and and yeah and that was the extra element of course it was happening ridiculously lent because you know there's been a brilliant women's match on first um and i mean it was just just comical like i sort of loved it because it was funny but it was also frankly ridiculous and yeah this match ended at gone 2 a.m uh as they as they went into a third set you're thinking right okay it's gone one in the morning let's see how this set goes maybe it'll be quick And like the second game of the deciding set was a 26-point game taking over 10 minutes.

1:06:34It was like, of course, of course. And look, I was actually kind of impressed with both players. You know, Hodder was a set in a breakdown, got it back. He saved match points in that second set, won the second set. I thought he showed real composure and resilience in that second set. he did lose it physically and i think this is a little trend we've seen from holla through this season like a lot of the reasons a lot of the times he's losing matches is physically his tennis is right there it's good enough but he hasn't got it in the legs yet and and darry like to recover from losing that second set his his tactic in the third seemed to be coffee he just kept just kept getting coffee coffee deliveries at like 1 30 in the morning It was like, have you got to record a podcast after this?

1:07:26Yeah, it's like so, so funny. Like a wild match, one that we will remember. It was also extra late because after that women's match, they had a music break. And shout out Laura Robson on Sky. She was absolutely losing her mind at this. She was the only one. I think that was the most farcical thing that happened in the far end of Calico that night. Yeah, it was. it was not the smoke delay Laura was the only one who was appropriately annoyed about it she was like what are we doing we've got another match to get on of course it's probably going to be like two and a half, three hours that means it's going to finish at two in the morning then there was a smoke delay I mean just ridiculous and like the bigger point less related to the smoke but yesterday that Svantec-Svitolina match That is your headline match of the tournament, pretty much, up to this point.

1:08:22Semi-final, two great players. And the way you've scheduled it, the deciding set is happening after midnight, and the stadium's half empty. And there's just absolutely no reason for that in an event like this, where you've got so much time to play all these matches. I feel like they've tried to elevate the 1000s by elongating them. I don't think it has had that effect, but they've tried. And what they've ended up doing is just totally undermining their own tournament by scheduling key matches late at night when half the stadium's gone home. I mean, it's just so like tin pot. And when the conditions are crap.

1:09:04Like, you know, it was so cold. Play in the day. The fact that they were playing as well as they were in those conditions, both of them to be honest was amazing because that was a hospital pass of a set of circumstances. And also the inequity of, you know, Strontic had had so much more recovery time for that semi-final than Svitolina who'd played late the night before against Rebacca. You know, like, you've got 13 days to play with. What are we doing? Yeah. Yeah, repeatable, repeatable rant. Kasper Root

1:09:43he's in the semi-finals beat Karen Hashinov in a weird match Hashinov having been responsible for the Dino Soaring group chat being so so shortly lived under that name Karen Hashinov's sort of a test that you have to pass isn't he and Dino Prismic did not pass that test so Dino Soaring is is on the back burner for now. There's a sort of, we've got a chodar thing going on, which I don't know if that's going to last. Number three is up for grabs, and the group chat name is up for grabs. So put that memo out to men's tennis. Yeah, you've got to come up with a pun, though, David. I hate puns. I might have a word with Hannah.

1:10:29She'll come up and say it for me. David, a few words on Kasparud. Give him some flowers. well having just said Alessandro Zverev should be reaching the Rennig Arrows final if you put Kasparud in his half I would I haven't even been to the Orangry yet I haven't even got to the Orangry I believe in Kasparud in that match up on clay I do and I hope he stays fit because he pulled up lame a few weeks ago I think against Ogilvy Aliasim but he definitely looks like he's got his mojo back a little bit on clay. I know he won Madrid last year but the rest of it wasn't quite what I was anticipating. I feel like it's coming for him.

1:11:21He's moving really well. I think he had that really chastening loss to Sinner, didn't he, at Rome last year where he won a game or something and he was just, oh my word. And of course, look, he could end up playing Sinner and having another experience like that. But I think he's playing better right now. So let's see what I'm saying on Sunday night. But no, I'm encouraged because you're right. I mean, that was a horrible match interrupted by a three-hour rain delay against Hachinov. And all the sets, it was like watching an Ostapenko-Yastrzemska match in terms of the scoreline. Sort of six love, one six, six two.

1:12:06But no, I think Rude's coming on. Just to confirm what we've touched upon a couple of times already, Artifis has confirmed that he is in for Roland Garras, said he was being uber cautious with that retirement earlier on in the tournament. But scans are revealed there's nothing sinister at play. and he's now going to wrap himself in cotton wool and bubble wrap until his first match at Roland Garros. Not so for Lorenzo Mazzetti. Absolutely heartbreaking stuff for him. He's out of Roland Garros with a rectus femoris injury. Matt Futterman in the Athletic reports for us that the rectus femoris is a muscle on the inner part of the thigh, one of the four quadricep muscles.

1:12:59It's the only quadricep muscle that crosses both the hip and the knee, making it nearly impossible to function athletically without it. Sounds a bit of a blow, doesn't it? It sounds pretty crap, yeah. I mean, the fact that he even took to the court for his match against Caspar Ude is mad. I mean, he said in his statement, he all but said, like, I wouldn't have done that if it wasn't Italy and Rome. and I respect that, bless him, but also I hope he hasn't done himself further damage by even giving that match a go. Yeah, it's terrible for men's tennis, it's terrible for Mazzetti, it's gutting. He's making a bit of a play for cursed player, is Lorenzo Mazzetti.

1:13:48I wonder if he regrets the nightmare tour a little bit. I wonder if there's a sort of cumulative toll of the nightmare tour. Has he been hanging around with Berrettini too much? Yeah. Tough. Yeah. The thing is, like, I think you're right, Catherine, you probably could draw a line between the Nightmare Tour and what's happened to him this season in terms of how hard he pushed it. But I think you can also look at the injuries he's had over the last 18 months or so, and it's always the leg. It's always the upper leg. He's obviously got a bit of a weak spot there. Monte Carlo last year in the final, it was the leg.

1:14:27Roland Garros last year in the semis, the leg. Australian Open this year, now Rome this year. There's obviously something there that he needs to find a solution for because it's holding him back in big moments, you know? Mizzetti's withdrawal from Roland Garros does mean that Stan Rorinkus sneaks into the main draw as a direct entry with his ranking and doesn't need a wild card, freeing up a wild card for another lowly ranked French tennis player. OK, that is it for part two. We'll be back in part three with some pretty interesting news to discuss. Welcome back to part three of today's tennis podcast, where we now have to talk about the bombshell news that Andy Murray is to coach Jack Draper for the grass court season.

1:15:27Also in tandem with the news that Jack Draper is no longer working with Jamie Delgado. Obviously, Delgado himself, a former coach of Andy Murray. Tough for Jamie Delgado because he's never really kind of got a run at that job, did he? because Jack Draper's pretty much been injured for the duration of their partnership. I mean, this news indicates that Jack Draper is going to be fit to return on grass, which is good news. And there's going to be the added intrigue of Andy Murray being there in his coaching box, which, I mean, even if it is just the novelty factor, I don't mind. I'm here for it.

1:16:09I'm into it. I'm pumped. and Andy Murray's got maybe something to prove as a tennis coach, you know, after, you know, it didn't go badly with Novak Djokovic, but, you know, I think if he was marking himself out of 10 and he's done a few interviews about it now, including with us, like I think he thinks that could have gone better, doesn't he? Like, I'm really, really into this, David. Interesting. Are you not? Well, I want to see Jack Draper be a tennis player again before I get interested in anything, really. And that's the problem. Everything you say, I agree with. I am excited by the prospects as well.

1:16:55And I'm interested, you know, having had interviews with the two of them a month apart at the end of last year. I mean, it's fantastic for us to get this insight into them both and to see the struggles of Jack Draper and to see the desperation to succeed. and I remember him saying to us, next grass court season I'm going to slide. You know, I'm not going to do what I've been doing and I'm going to figure it out and be a better player on grass. So I'm really into that. I'm really into Andy Murray, the coach, because he did say he probably wouldn't be a coach again until his kids were older. But obviously I get that this is different.

1:17:34You know, if this is just a short spell and it's in Britain, it's easy for him to do it and it's not going to mess his life up. And it's Jack Draper and they've got that whole relationship and they've got the singing proclaimers whilst drunk and Andy Murray's middle finger. Only one of them was drunk. Only one of them was drunk. One of them was driving. You're right. Andy Murray was being perfectly respectable and above board and completely sober and taking the piss out of Jack Draper while he sang and it was great. It was all the fun things. I just think well where's sorry Jack but where's the evidence that you can play tennis anytime soon I know you just said that this is confirmation that he's back for the grass court season, is it?

1:18:18I mean how do we know he's going to be fit I mean I know there's no guarantees of anything. I assume you wouldn't make an announcement like this that you know he's going to cause this kind of stir unless No I understand, I mean like today he might be fit but there's a there's been so many breakdowns of his fitness I really look I really hope that's not the case and you know I love Jack I think he's such a good guy and really want it to happen for him but I just have I kind of not I'm not that into it because I don't think of Jack at the moment as somebody who's playing tennis he's pulled out of the clay court season and he's got it all to prove as to whether he's going to be able to play on the grass it's not that long away i hope he can

1:19:14yeah i mean my first thought was oh well i at least at least jack draper won't make andy murray go on a run i suspect you know right at the start of their coaching relationship i feel like it's going to be a sort of easier way in for Andy Murray into this gig. Yeah, than a minion coming and requesting your presence on a long distance run through Monte Carlo. Yeah, cramping after a few minutes. I think, look, I think I thought Draper would pull the Murray lever at some point in his career. I'd really thought that would happen. It would make sense given we know their relationship and we know how much Murray is into the idea of coaching.

1:19:58I just didn't think it would be now. And I do think it makes sense to have Murray on board in terms of Draper as a player and his career and what he's trying to achieve through that grass court season. Because, you know, we've seen Draper, particularly at Wimbledon, you know, he's done well at Queen's, particularly at Wimbledon, I think deal with a lot of nerves and a lot of pressure of being British number one. And he's never really looked comfortable at Wimbledon. And the sort of expectation of, look at you, you're a big, you're a tall guy, big serving lefty, like obviously this game should be working on grass.

1:20:35This is where you should be peaking. And I think David, you asked him about that in our interview, and he really responded to that and was like, yeah, like I'm actually, as you were saying, Matt, like I'm actually not that comfortable on grass. like in very rudimentary ways my game should make sense but in sort of more nuanced ways it doesn't actually make all that much much sense for him so I mean and Murray knows the pressures of Wimbledon and being the guy you know better than anyone who's ever lived probably and I think can help manage that but I do sort of just think at this stage it almost puts the pressure back on you know like I think Draper was kind of going into this Wimbledon probably pretty expectation free you know like because he's not played that much everyone understands that as something people recognize but now like with Andy Murray in his box and without having played that much I feel like there is going to be a lot of spotlight and attention on it and I just I'm with David I just don't know whether whether he's ready physically for for the tennis that's coming and almost like I hope it's not, but is it like a little bit of a panic to pull the Andy Murray lever now and just try and get some good news, just be like, I need something, I need a kick.

1:21:56And I totally understand if that's how he's feeling and what he thinks he needs. But I don't know, I thought that he would do this when he's knocking on the door of trying to win Wimbledon and Andy Murray was trying to help him get over the line. That's not to say he can't go back to Andy Murray later in his career and it can't be a long-term thing. I could imagine this being just sort of an annual thing that Andy Murray helps him out. Maybe it will be. Yeah. Maybe it will be. I hope so. I think that'd be great. And then I would change my perspective on it a little bit. I mean, maybe this isn't a good comparison because, you know, results-wise hasn't gone well, but almost a bit of a Paolini-Irani situation where it was like, well, you're helping me anyway.

1:22:38Like, let's just, let's formalise it, you know. Because I can imagine they would be texting a lot during Wimbledon anyway. I don't know. Yeah. I think it makes a lot of sense. It's just, is this the time, given Draper's not really an active player all that often at the moment? But I hope you're right, Catherine. I hope this is a sign that he is feeling better. and the decision to pull out of the clay is very much one that's targeted for the grass and trying to be fully fit for that rather than, oh, I just cannot play at the moment kind of thing. You know, what we're hearing is that the knee is recovering and Laura Robson on Sky said the other day that he is hitting, you know, full on at the National Tennis Centre right now.

1:23:35So hopefully that's a good sign. okay I feel a bit disconcerted because I'm not used to being the most optimistic on the podcast I don't know where to go it's good being Catherine isn't it no I feel weird it's irksome shall we go to in fact it's the only place to go because it's the last agenda item Carlos Alcaraz and his Vanity Fair piece, his cover shoot, the first kind of sports special for Vanity Fair worldwide. Like just in principle, a huge deal for tennis to have this kind of cut through and exposure in the mainstream and in the sort of places that a piece and a photo shoot like this will be seen, has been seen and a real sort of indicator of Carlos Alcaraz's status in in the sporting world and in the wider world.

1:24:41Matt Roberts is quoted in the piece, as you might have gathered over the course of this show. It was a very distinct style choice with the photo shoot. I think it was done in Miami. We know this because Carlos Alcaraz posted a photo of what we now know is the photo shoot during a March-April photo dump and then deleted the photo from the photo dump, obviously, because it was kind of a spoiler for what was to come. But yeah, it's him dressed all in white and dusted up in clay because obviously they were expecting him to be playing on clay, about to be defending his role on Gareth's title at the time of the drop of this interview.

1:25:29So that's just a really unfortunate turn of events for Vanity Fair and for the style choice of this photo shoot. What, Matt Roberts, did we think when the photos and the interview dropped other than, oh, that's a Matt Roberts quote? Yeah, I was alerted to that by Itamar. He sent me a screenshot that said, Mr. Vanity Fair. but like the photo I was you know I was away in Devon poor signal the photo wouldn't load I was like what what is this um anyway that was that was my experience of it uh I don't know I feel like I had a very different take to you Catherine you didn't like the photos I don't think I I did I I thought it was a great concept I thought it was I thought it was a great concept I liked the concept.

1:26:26I've got... Executed. Interesting. See, I've got no problem with the homoeroticism of it all. I find that fantastic. You know, there's been lots of pearl clutching about it, and that is absolutely not the angle of my issues with it. I just... I... Yeah, I don't think it was executed brilliantly. I think he looks really childish in the cover shot the smile and then the one where he's sort of posing on the ground looking over the shoulder so that's the one where he should be doing the cheeky smile I just think you can see in his eyes that he doesn't look quite comfortable

1:27:09but the internet seems to have enjoyed it so I'm obviously wrong Vicky said that in the cover sheet he looks like a child in PE kit and that's how I felt as well. I thought the one in the suit is the one that should have been the cover shot personally. David, very keen for your views. I have no opinion. I've just not even really taken any of this in. The only bit I was interested in was Matt Roberts' quote. I feel like no one else read the piece. They just looked at the pictures. David's the one. I just sort of let this conversation... I knew it was going on in the group chat and I just thought, I'm just going to let this roll.

1:27:59I'm not really bothered.

1:28:03I don't think I've even really looked at all the pictures. I saw the one. But I just want him to start playing tennis again. The one where he's covered in clay. He's covered in clay in all of them. Is he? Yeah. he's wearing white shorts the white top the PE kit one yeah I've seen that one yeah I don't care

1:28:30sorry just anyway it's good for tennis isn't it yeah that's true yeah it's good good for tennis it's great it's great profile isn't it yeah yeah good stuff okay we are back on Sunday night with our post-Rome live show 8pm UK time will be on YouTube, the live chat will be going if you want to join us for that, it'll be up as a podcast as usual as well, it is our 1500th show on Sunday I'm going to really try and remember that during the actual show and if you don't we've told everybody now, so it's fine exactly do you see what I did there that was my insurance policy because I just then we can remind them in 1501 yes thank you uh so that's our next show on Sunday and then on Wednesday of next week we are headed to Paris and hello I can't wait I can't wait uh we have a mascot for this show I'm going to try and I'm going to try and get through this because it's such a lovely picture.

1:29:43This is Clara. Clara is owned by Steph and Clara, Steph says is our beloved three year old rescue and three Pete mascot. She says there's no point in guessing her breeds because she's a mix of all dogs. And I'm looking at a picture here of her being hugged so tightly by a little girl whose identity I don't know, but it's making me think of my niece Nina and Billie Jean. And Billie Jean is going to go and stay with Nina and family for the duration of my time at Roland Garros. And there is nothing I love more than Nina, Billie Jean content. Best buds. Yeah. So toddler plus dog hugging content. Yes, please.

1:30:36and Clara's gazing at the camera in that sort of doleful way. It's all just lovely. And there's nothing better than a repeat mascot. We love returning mascots. So thank you so much, Steph and Clara. What a good girl. The bestest of girls. Hello to our mascots. Hello, Bodie. Hello to Maisie. David's aiming to be top of the table come the end of roll on Garros, Maisie, all you need is for Artifeast to win the title, I'm sure it'll happen. Hello to Roger. Haven't had any Roger photos in a while, have we, Matt? Roger can't fit. Paging carry. Definitely request some Roger photos. Paging carry. Hello to our top folks and executive producers, Greg, Chris and Geoff.

1:31:29Matt's back, so a shout out. That's right We have Alec Mills From Bristol Hello Alec Hello Alec Alec says I've been to all four Grand Slames At least twice Very impressive from Alec And he's also visited The Masters events In Madrid and Rome So a very fitting time For Alec's shouting Alec's a clay court guy By the sounds of things Wow Alec Mills you say yes like Alan Mills the former Wimbledon referee very good who was such a wonderful contributor to this show once upon a time when we had end of season awards very good and Wimbledon referee he was bloody great at it yeah Alec thank you keep keep going I mean how many times can you go to all the slams keep going let us know what you get to love that we We also have Marty Betton, short for Martha, Marty says, from Philadelphia.

1:32:38Hello, Marty. Matt's been to Philadelphia. I have been to Philadelphia. Yeah. One of the many places I've seen Fulham beat Brentford.

1:32:54Like Martha Kostiuk? Well Vicky has Looked at this Shout out And says Marty's given us A very long list Of Martys And But has not included Marta Costia Which is the one That Vicky would have Gone for She says Oh thanks Vicky What about Marty Mulligan That's a Very good one That's come up a lot In my Pietrangeli Research Excellent Australian player In the In the 60s Good name that Isn't it Marty Mulligan Yeah, it reached the Wimbledon final in 1962. Wow. And is that on Marty's list? Yes. Is he on Marty's? OK. So that's acceptable. Yeah. Good stuff. Thanks, Marty. And finally, we have a birthday shout out for Emmy from Barry.

1:33:52Hey! Like Barry Island? like going in Stacey Barry yeah or is there a Barry in Ireland as well isn't there no no no hang on no no the shout out is for Emmy from a person called Barry

1:34:21I've not even read this email so like barry cowan right

1:34:33what do we what do we know about emmy and barry so emmy and barry uh live in san diego and met during covid and since then they've gone to indian wells together every year and they were at the US Open for Serena Williams' final match. And Barry says, tennis has been a big part of our relationship and discovering your podcast this past year, listening to it regularly together and both of us becoming friends of the tennis podcast has become the latest evolution of our tennis bond. I couldn't let Emmy's birthday, which was on Thursday the 14th of May, pass without a shout out. Emmy is the ultimate Renaissance woman.

1:35:20She's lived such a rich, varied and full life and it continues to be a joy to connect with her, Barry says. And now we've butchered their shout out. They're from San Diego. They haven't even heard of Barry Island or Gavin and Stacey. They're like, what are they on about? Maybe they're into Gavin and Stacey. You can get it overseas, apparently. Maybe it will introduce them to Gavin and Stacey. Barry I'm sorry Emmy Sorry it's my fault And I don't think we're going to be able to think of any tennis Emmys Are we I think that's David's taking that as a challenge Well closest I've got is Emile Roussavori What about Roy Emerson Who used to be known as Emo Can that be Yeah we'll take it I'm afraid we're going to have to take that Emmy I hope you had a wonderful birthday I've not excelled myself None of us have Emmy I hope you had an absolutely wonderful birthday It sounds like you've got a good in there with Barry Yeah So Yeah Love that Love that for you too And Yeah I've loved this show A bit of a bumper one We'll be back On Sunday With our live post-rame show 8pm UK time On YouTube if you fancy joining us live.

1:36:45If not, then you can watch that anytime or listen to us anytime, wherever you get your podcast. But you know that because you're listening to us right now. Thank you for listening. We are part of the Athletic Podcast Network and we'll speak to you on Sunday.