Living, Laughing, and Loving: with Shy Trutwein and Jasmine Gallagher

0:00I will say Shai looks incredibly comfortable and Jasmine absolutely the opposite. I thought it'd be vice versa we like to confuse people that I would be the more anxious one so who was having the meltdown who wanted to cancel I think I could tell it was me I'm glad that you didn't cancel social media manager wanted to cancel I'm better online than in person better online you're doing great you're doing so good I don't see why you're stressed thank you Yeah.

0:36I'm looking at all your, now I'm looking at your Instagram pages. Kevin has put this all in for me and I get to look at it. Standard. Yeah. Got a good document going. I've done a lot of research, clearly. What? Yeah, made a good doc. Yeah. What did you unearth? Aspiring comedian. I don't know where you pulled that from. I think you literally, you're like life motto is I'm an aspiring comedian. But as I said, it's purely online. So I don't think I would thrive. I think you said it in an interview one time. what are you aspiring to be followed by you guys because neither one of you follow me on Instagram so you know we'll see yeah neither one nope shy orange asmin neither one which account of mine though oh you have two accounts I have five five accounts yeah what Kevin didn't dig enough what I'm not followed by any of the accounts listed here in three your personal how many I feel like I've got at least two or three listed I'm gonna I thought center was just your personal no i'm a human being outside of work i followed you both so that'll make it easy for you and uh you know we're friends now well it doesn't say follow back so well i just i just pressed it two seconds ago all right um we're uh yeah so is this after hours after hours because that's what i was thinking my name in the podcast you could do that after hours oh my god i've never heard that before i bet yeah that is so original are you in copywriting i'm actually a social media manager yeah and podcaster yeah and podcaster yeah yeah yeah it's getting wild here the sun is fully shining should i intro the pod kevin or i'm hoping it's like a two second intro the credentials are not as long as there's some we got some bios and stuff oh no they're short but they're sweet you're ready i haven't looked at them this week i like all that content though so weave that in.

2:28Yeah, yeah. Go on, Kevin. Put that into the show. Because we... It's easy. I don't know. We'll leave this in Kevin's hands. He's got this. Does he?

2:44Three, two, one. Kevin. What's up? You're wearing one of my favorite shirts today. I know. I just dusted it off this weekend. Yeah, picnic committee. What do you think? Scale of one to ten, Kevin's shirt, real quick. Ten. Ten. Don't be pressured. You don't have to say 10. 10. I feel like 10. I was going to ask about it. Like, is it a band? I actually can't see it. I don't know. I'm saying pick committee. Okay. Pick it in committee. I don't know. I found it at a thrift store. It does believe me that the bottom type is smaller. Type is a little bit smaller. It's like bugs me a lot. I think that's why I like it though.

3:14Okay. It's the color. It's what it says. It's the nuance of the type sizes. And it's how it brings out Kevin's eyes. Yeah. And if there were to be a committee that I would be on, it'd be the picnic committee. Do you go on many picnics? No, not as many as I should. Oh. I should go on more. Do you think this shirt is ironic or do you think this is a real picnic committee? Hard to say. I don't know. Where did you get this shirt? At the thrift store. Which one? Probably in a bin. Okay. Whereabouts in - Ohio. Yeah. This feels like not a new shirt. Honestly, I hope it's earnest. I hope it's earnest too.

3:47Kevin, we have two voices today on the pod. A self-described dynamic duo here today. day after hours shy truth vine is a designer art school dropout failed dj designer a bit of an illustrator and head cleaner yeah what does head cleaner mean um i'm sure there's like a another person who cleans up after me who maybe thinks i did a shit job but they come in you know like when you have a cleaner at home and they like come in you like pay them to clean your house and then you come and you're like they didn't do this i'll just clean the house again okay so i'll be the first clean and then someone else will be the second whoever you're asked whoever's running your socials told me that yeah okay uh the second person would probably be jasmine gallagher the second part of the dynamic duo an art director a producer and where did you pull this from and quote head of everything i back head of everything back head of everything i am no she backs it i back it oh you back i do i want to preface i feel like things would get lost in translation with the accent.

4:51It's already happening here. Head cleaner, back head. Head cleaner, right. What do you think of? The head, like number one cleaner. You were thinking like like primates, you know how they dig? Oh, no, I was not thinking that. In my head, I was actually like someone who cleans someone's head. Oh, you're like, I need some mindful of shit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I need a head cleaner. There's so much stuff in there. Okay, I'll just like sound bath it up. Yeah, exactly. Just clear that stuff. Wait, so are you not a producer or art director? I feel like, you know what? Sure. I am. I am for this instance.

5:27And social media manager, right? Absolutely. She can be who you want her to be. Together, the dynamic duo are the founding partners of your favorite studio's favorite studio, After Hours, a design studio featuring many friends specializing in strategy, identity, design, digital, and content. Welcome to the show, Sean and Jasmine. Hello. Woo! is there a song to me yeah okay perfect wow after hours they both take sips welcome to show thank you for coming by thanks for being here thanks for having us uh sorry yeah a lot of things are going to get lost in translation because it's you know just two language barrier two cultures coming together yeah and uh i i will see if we can get through but you guys are here in new york working here for the next month it seems you guys do something very cool which is you live everywhere talk to me about the nomadic lifestyle where are you off to next how's it going here in new york when do you you guys i assume you love new york maybe new york is like a favorite spot i mean i want no i'm gonna be like nah new york sucks don't butter us don't yeah yeah you don't have to butter us um we're heading home next because we're kind of like constantly chasing the summer okay which uh sorry for everyone who doesn't do that but spend some time we'll be here for like three months and then before that we're in europe for a bit did paris and greece which was good heard you did some travels a little bit a little bit yeah that's it this is about you oh yeah this is talking about myself yes this is gonna go really well you've got a long long session No, it's good.

7:11It's good. I like traveling and working. Yeah. It's like a lot for like - It feels incredibly challenging to me. Yeah. So how did you guys first meet? I guess it's the first question. When did you start after hours? You have no words. Just like you go. Jasmine is pointing to Shai and saying, you got this. You take the first meet. Yeah, you take the first meet. We're like working at an agency. It's like a very hot topic. so we can't like talk much about it. Oh yeah? We're working at an agency. Because of the lawsuit? A hundred percent. A hundred percent. They probably did ask we'll be listening to this as well.

7:49Okay. Probably not. They straight up would be. An unnamed advertising agency from Australia. Say that I'll bleep it out and post where you guys are from. Absolutely not. Yeah. And we're working at a studio or an agency whatever you want to call them. A business that makes things. Yes. We met and we were hanging out after hours. Car. Okay. You never knew each other till you met at this job? Yeah, no, no, we never knew each other. I remember the first day you walked in, I actually, we just fought a lot. We're like, no. Instant hate. Instant hate. Because Gaz was just like, what is this human? I obviously had like, you know when you're like young, you have way too much ego?

8:28I was like, yeah, no, you're wrong. When you're young. So you looked, you sized her up, and you were like, nah, not for me. No, absolutely not. No, fuck this. Yeah. And so how did you guys get through that? I think we just were like forced to work together on like projects and actually turned out pretty good. Okay. And then we're like collaborating after hours on stuff. Can I say the thing that happened? No. Okay. Now you have to say it. No, we're just collaborating after hours and then we weren't at our jobs anymore. Yeah. Okay. So like a couple of things happened months later that like we were just like not at that workplace anymore.

9:09And then we're like, you know what? What I just said, yeah. The agency disappeared. No, no, they still exist. Oh, okay. No, no, we disappeared from the agency. We disappeared. We disappeared. Oh, I got it. We disappeared from the agency. See, a language barrier. Yeah. It's the Australian twang. So you disappeared. Yeah. And then you're like, okay, after hours, we like working on these projects, I assume. Yeah. And then we're like, let's make this a business. Yeah. A duo, a tandem. I think that we were planning on doing something else. So I had in my head, I was like, oh, I'll move to London. Because as an Australian, that's every single person's dream.

9:46Okay. And so I was like, let's just do this. That's the dream, just London. This move to London, yeah. And it was something to pass the time. And we were already collaborating together. It was an easy in. But then we started and COVID happened. so so this is recently 2020 okay march 2020 so we launched and we wanted to specialize in hospitality very much loved restaurants and cafes uh alas with covid they all shut down so we actually didn't have much work uh we we didn't have many clients yeah it was like a real like not a joke but like we weren't doing after hours like seriously it was kind of just like a side project and then it kept on like snowballing we're like working together on stuff and then it kind of like went outside of what we thought it would be it was really funny when we started to take on like outside of hospitality or like other projects like typical branding projects whether like cpg stuff or like tech brands whatever we would like set a reminder in our calendar for like two or three months time like is after hours a business or a hobby that's a good question kept on doing that and we actually still do that yeah what is it yeah what where are we at right now alas it is a business it is a business nice yeah yeah yeah so that's how we oh I didn't know we were sitting in the room with business owners whoa business people oh did you think we I just thought you were just kind of a DJ duo you know we could DJ I would have to teach you I love that you guys match you guys I actually am very awesome.

11:27Yeah, it's going to continue. The sun is sort of - That's kind of our bit. That's kind of our thing is we just try to sweat people out. Yeah. So when did you decide to take the show on the road? So when it was COVID, we had no clients. So we actually moved back home to my parents' house. Oh, nice. Because - Shocking. Oh, also a couple just to like - Oh, okay. Yeah. You guys, okay. I didn't see that in the show. I didn't know about it. business owners and lovers. No, because people are like, why do you travel together? That's weird. That's not that weird. I mean, you now have a business. Yes. Yeah, yeah.

12:05Got it. So you were a couple and decided to start a company. Yes, yes, yes. And then it was COVID and it was a hospitality design company. Yes. Then there's no hospitality. Yes. So you start doing projects for packaged goods, cannabis, whatever. whatever just other shit that's not i think we're doing like hospitality because we're like oh you know that's like easy that's what we've done before like music stuff like that okay and we're like well that's not not around so like let's do other stuff how are you guys getting clients at the start because the hospitality industry shutting we did a campaign called save hospital and we were doing free posters for anyone in hospitality to promote their takeaway offering or anything that they could do because we wanted to help them get the word out so they could stay afloat and that really garnered traction and so that kind of was the stepping stone to getting more clients and more legitimate clients yeah I was like freelancing Jazz also was like had a background in PR and marketing so she worked in PR and marketing agencies got it and I had like freelanced a bunch in like music and stuff like that got it and so it was just kind of like I I feel like that's a classic designer kind of like root is like people route.

13:22People like. Both are applicable. Yeah. I understood both. We're trying. Yeah. Okay. Sure. Yeah. But like, you know, you do something else, you're like a multi hyphenate or whatever. And then you end up on this pathway of like, I was doing the design more than like the thing that I tried to do. And then now I'm here. Yeah. It's a very young person thing. Like to be a multi hyphenate. I'm a single hyphenate. Really? Designer. Okay. That's it. You're a podcaster. Oh, fuck. Yeah. You got a couple of hyphens. Now I got to add podcaster. But no, I mean, I'm trying to bring back single hyphens. You know, it's just do your job well.

13:56You know, just do one. Pick a lane. Stay in your lane. Stay in your lane. Okay. Who needs all these side, you know, sort of marks? My shit looks like a river. Like a river spreads. Like all the deltas and shit. Kevin is Mr. Hyphenate. Mr. Water, yeah. Mr. Water. so how does the work break down are you guys both actively designing both managing clients or is one of you more the marketing pr i think it's like a real uh mixed bag okay it's interesting when you talk to like other couples who work together and they also do the same thing like you just like you're always up in someone's business you can't really like separate i would say though shy is definitely lead design got it and more because you're better at the design yeah and then i would do everything else as head of everything head of everything yeah and shy would be head of design if there was a title yes but then everything else i i would um oh yeah and and and head cleaner not to be confused with head cleaner yeah shy does have one other responsibility outside design and that's cleaning yeah for sure but you guys don't have an office no no what are you cleaning the house that we're in yeah at that given time at that given moment so covid happens you're like cool we don't need to be anywhere and so let's be everywhere let's be everywhere yeah well 100 and we so as i was saying before we ended up moving back home for a little bit and then i had three teenage siblings at home so it was a great insight into the younger generation okay but also didn't last very long and so that kind of was the push to just please get me out of here yeah we're like okay this is Too much teenage energy.

15:41Did you learn any cool TikTok dances from them? No. They want the dancing type. No. No renegade? We learned words that like, is it gen alpha? We're using? Gen alpha. Yeah. Yeah. They're young. I think they were at the time like 16, 14, and 13. So it's great insight into a whole nother. Oh, the most annoying thing would be like, you were like talking to them and they'd be like, when? And you're like, what? And they're like, when did I ask? You're like. Oh. That one hurts. That's a tough one. I've been hit with that before. I think you're like, what? And they're like, what? It just keeps going. See, now I'm confused.

16:21Wait, when? Yeah. When did I ask? Oh. Yeah. Yeah, see? It's a classic put down. Now we're wrestling with sort of language barriers and now age barriers. It's fun. You're going to hospice care now. Yeah, I am. I'm elderly. geriatric uh someone get me a coffee no so covid happened and then we were while curve was happening we're jumping between sydney and melbourne in australia and then as soon as the borders as soon as we were allowed to leave australia the borders well we weren't allowed they were pretty hectic uh then we left and so we started that was when two years ago we started three two the europe Adventure.

17:04Europe. Europe. Sorry, we always say Europe. And so - Are you making fun of Americans? No, no, that's how we say it. We catch ourselves saying it. Europe. And so you hit the road and you're like, we're just going to be a business that operates - Remotely. Out of Airbnbs, out of coffee shops, out of anywhere. Yeah. Not coffee shops. We have a very strict rule. Fuck coffee shops. No. Fuck the coffee shops. I can't focus. Also, I don't want to sit there for like hours and just like - I don't understand how anyone works anywhere that's not a desk yeah but so i'm impressed by the fact that you guys can sort of just pick up and move around and be like i'm gonna get work done in this unknown location but you guys make it work yeah do you have any like gear with you like yeah what do you got laptop holders or like oh no we just we just scratched over just the laptop yeah bad posture but we when we do move around it's for two to three months at a time so we'll be taking our life and then placing in a new city so we still have things like a monday to friday routine still have gym still have your day-to-day so it's like we're very high maintenance we're not on holiday it's not a barley um we're not digital nomads i think that's smart though because i think that's the part that feels disorienting for me if i'm in somewhere else kevin will attest to this i have a one block radius that i like to sort of you know it's the block that i live on that connects to the block that our studio I was on.

18:26The whole thing at Bit or whatever thing is that you don't leave Greenpoint, right? That's true. Yeah, yeah. So it's like, but I also, I need that routine. I need to wake up a certain time, go to the gym, do these things. So you just take that and you put it into a different city. I don't know if I could do that. That feels very daunting. How do y 'all work when you're in a new place and you're like, you don't want to work? Yeah, because if I'm somewhere else, I'm like, you know where I could be? Not working. I could be - You know where I could be? I could be in the sun at the beach in the water right now.

18:51I could be eating a baguette right now in the grass. Well, typically it'd be, you'd have Friday, Saturday, and Sunday to explore. And if you're there for six or seven weeks, that's still. You guys don't work on Fridays? Sometimes. Sometimes. It's in the dark, Alex. I put that in the dark. It's in my email signature. Kevin, didn't you see I did that organically, naturally? You see how I asked that and pretended like I didn't know that? Whoops. That's called ProPaz podcasting. I won't reply to an email on a Friday. Okay. But I could be working. How about after hours? Well, there's no after hours technically because we're challenged with different time zones.

19:23Yeah. so actually just always on it might always be after hours oh that makes sense so you have to deal with both living and working in a place that you don't call home but just kind of home and also time zones which god knows how those things work ah yeah just like forever being like sorry I've sent the wrong calendar oh yeah calendar invites has got to be brutal what if you book a place with bad wifi yeah what is that the rule is you can't well you have a co-working space too oh sweet so you always have a co-working space that's like the one number one rule we can't see each other physically in the working day as in we physically need to be separated yes not that we can't see each other physically you need to a divider there's a rule a divider yes that has to be a rule not just a I think that's good for the relationship and the partnership thank you because I I was hoping you'd say that no I think I think there's a lot I think that's fucked up there's a lot of partners that have design studios yeah And I just don't know how you don't think about and talk about work 24-7.

20:26How do you guys do that? You literally think and talk about work 24-7. Yeah, that's fine. Yeah, that's fine. That's fine. But what do you guys do outside of work? What are your hobbies? Did you ask this the other night? I did ask this, yeah. I did ask this. You did ask this and I went home and I was like, I have no hobbies. You write it off a couple. I don't know, you know. You had a couple of fun hobbies. Did I? Yeah, yeah. What are your hobbies? Heckling. Oh, yeah. You like to heckle. At a comedy show or just in general? Just in general. Just actually, I like to get - At the supermarket? At the supermarket?

20:59No, I like to get drunk and just DM people. Oh, and be like, this post sucks? Not even. Just like, hi. That's called bullying. That's heckling. Oh, no. I've been heckled. Have you? I pulled up with a - Yeah, by you. Yeah. Actually, I pulled up with a pork pate sandwich to the first link that we ever had. A pork pate sandwich? I don't know. Who shows up with a pork pate? This is Kevin's alter ego. It was a bad call. I admit that. No, you confused the word of chitarrant with the French word for pickles. Yeah, yeah. I mean, come on. Let's have some ownership here. What an idiot. Oh, my God. I'm getting heckled more.

21:40Yeah. Can you continue the cycling? How do we tackle today, Kevin? I think we can all agree that it was a bad call. Where did you get the sandwich from? Las Sandwichery or something. Oh, yeah. See, that was your first bad call. And I was, what? Did you say Las Sandwichery? La. I thought you said Las. I was like, well, you're Las. I'm trying to speak French. I'm trying to speak French. Oui, oui, oui. It was pate and the chorichons, whatever the fuck they're called. Those are French, right? Yes, but that's pickles. Yeah, no. I think you thought it was chicharro. No, I did think it was. Yeah, I did think it was that.

22:15Potato, potato. I do love pickles. Okay. Some of the letters got mixed up in my head. Yeah, the pate was not it for like a hot Friday. Yeah, but it was, you know, it was my life. I mean, if you were in France, it would have been fine. It was my life. You guys just picked me apart for it. I'll never let that down. This is my life. I'll always be pate boy to you. I think you should get that as a tattoo. Pate. Pate boy. It has a ring to it. Maybe it's your LinkedIn bio. I think my LinkedIn bio is all right as it is. I haven't seen it. Yeah, I think you have. I've got hard proof that you have seen my LinkedIn.

22:44Hard proof. You endorse me for some weird shit Yeah, that's my move Sorry for endorsing you on your professional skills Yeah, Kevin is a LinkedIn He's an artist His canvas is LinkedIn So watch him paint I see what you all are doing on there I like it What do you guys do on there? I don't know, what are we doing on there? You made a post today about coffees And getting another job I'm not participating in LinkedIn I was trying to get into LinkedIn, but I lent in with a bit more of a formal tone of voice, and it just didn't come naturally. Okay. So I've given up. Here's a tip. You got to be formal, but you got to be unhinged.

23:25Overly formal. Do you get into LinkedIn? I dabble. You fuck with LinkedIn. I dabble. I mean, listen, I'm a professional. Yeah. But Kevin is a LinkedIn mess. You got to be formally unhinged. He's… Unhinged, but in like the most formal LinkedIn business speak you can. Yeah. my favorite thing about linkedin is that um i've accepted so many followers uh that all my responses to my posts are ai generated so i just posted actually something uh three hours ago about lithuania as you know i'm going to see our podcast listeners in person and two people commented someone said that's awesome news exclamation uh you know claps i think that's fake and then another one that said great to hear exclamation point that's also fake how do you know they're fake that's what i comment to people do they think i'm saying who says great to hear no that's not a response they have the automated responses down there and they're great no the automated response these kind of seem maybe they're normal but yeah i know that they're not normal because sometimes they're like alex i love the way that you seem together technology and creativity to create a beautiful brand system and it's like that's not a human response like you just didn't do that or it's a completely different project no someone has auto comments okay in stuff set up i'll die for auto comments on linkedin those are great kevin does my favorite thing which is he gives out kudos he's always giving out kudos my new one is uh wow two years already it's like i love a workiversary yeah yeah yeah i love commenting wow two years already what's your response for it that's good a lot of people think it's insightful some people react they think it's funny you can tell now because they have the individualized reactions like the like buttons wow two years already that's good flew by it's a great client so where are your clients now that you guys are sort of hitting the road and eating baguettes and just kind of live in the life.

25:27Live, laugh, and love. Yeah, you're just traveling. So are the clients still mostly Australian companies or are they worldwide? They're worldwide. So we have some clients in the States, some in Australia. Had a few in the UK recently, which is really fun for the time zones because it does feel like we're battling UK. The worst. It's like when you're doing it in Australian, like Europe. Europe. And US, sorry. It's impossible. I don't think you can do it. It's just like you can't do it. It's either you're up at 4 or 5 a.m. or it's super, super late at night. You'll wake up that early? For the right client, the right budget, I will be there.

26:07Absolutely. What if they say we need to meet on Friday? Yeah, Friday's fine. That's fine. I want to do a Saturday or Sunday. But then you have the problem where like on Sunday, it's Monday in Australia. That's crazy. Yeah. How does that work? It's not it. I don't know. You have to consult someone. someone else it's a mixed bag so it's a mixed bag yeah so you're but the schedule remains the same wherever you are yeah you have to have a working space i'm very intrigued by this because i do think it's it seems like an ideal life right you guys are getting to travel the world and uh enjoy each other's company while also having a business while also doing the work that you want to do it's just feels like a lot of coordinating who does the coordinating

26:52I don't pick the locations I would say I do I do most of it I wouldn't say there's a locked in plan typically we'd know maybe 3-4 months out we're not big on plans I feel like you need to be a planner I don't know when we go back to Australia where we will be that's why I couldn't do this because I'm not really a planner I'm going to Paris after Lithuania. That sounds like a plan. It is a plan. I don't have a hotel. You know what I mean? I don't like, I book things very of the moment. Is that what you guys do? Yeah. It is a plan though. It's expensive. It's technically a plan, but it doesn't have a lot of details to the plan.

27:33It's a specifics, logistics. You hammer those in later, you know? Yeah, I get it. Just show up. There's hostels. You'll be fine. I'm going to stay somewhere. It's just a matter of where. You should stay at a hostel just for fun. I feel like you, something tells me my wife is not interested. I think you have to like plan, do a lot of planning, but I guess, I guess you guys just, just, just letting it rip. Letting it rip. Yeah. A few months in advance. Got it. And especially for, I mean, we know where we want to go, but we haven't got anything set in. Where are you guys going next? Where, so you're here in New York.

28:07Yeah. For the podcast. Yeah. We're just flown in. We're just flown in for this one. That's right. We're actually on a flight out. Okay. Yeah. So we should wrap this up in the next half hour. Yeah. Where in the world are we going? That's the big question. We have to go back to it. Oh, you don't know. We don't know. So when you're saying planning, we haven't really planned out what comes next. I think it's back to Australia because we are hitting summer in Australia, Christmas, that kind of stuff. But we haven't quite worked out what comes next. I'm looking at options. My options are open. Yeah, that feels daunting to me.

28:42I think that feels sweet. That sounds like a you problem. World's your oyster. Yeah, I guess. I can go anywhere and do anything. that's sweet that's amazing imagine maybe you could do a work trip to Australia because you love Australians we should do a work trip you could just stay there bring a whole damn studio I would love to do that have you been to Australia? no absolutely oh so far don't go no it's so far yes I know I know yeah I mean maybe I'd like to everyone says that speaking of websites your website is fantastic I've been on it actually a lot this week just looking at the work did Kevin tell you to do that?

29:13no it was in the document he did we're copying it He didn't put that much information in the doc. There's not much. Oh, my God. There's not. So I had to just kind of go off of what's on this website. Is that self-defecating humor? There's like at least three pages of stuff. Yeah. Okay. So talk to us about After Hours Special. It's a part of your website. I know. I know. It's a dream. It's a dream. It's a dream. It's a fever dream. I think that's great, though, because Front and Center was on our podcast three years before we started it. So it was equally a dream. On our website. It was on our website.

29:47You said it on our podcast. It was on our website about a podcast that didn't exist. Yeah. So it kind of forces you to have to do it. Yeah. It's at the entertainment section or entertainment program of After Hours. So we wanted to have blog posts, a shop, podcasts, and we executed on none of it. Yeah. Well, there's still time. But it's a dream. And it's a reminder every time you look at the website to be like, I haven't fucking done this shit. Oh, we have to do this. Yeah. Well, speaking of as a company that had a very similar dream and goal, it did take us a couple of years because what happens is the work takes priority.

30:22Absolutely. Because you have clients, they're paying you money, I assume. And the social media. Do they pay you money? Yeah, they pay us money. Stop it. We're dealing in crypto. I assume you guys, money is key, especially to travel. I feel like that. We have a good lifestyle. How do you budget that? you don't you don't no I feel like this is the stuff that would give me anxiety no planning no budgeting you guys are just living and just traveling living laughing and loving wow you should get that I know I know it's my favorite saying live laugh and love is that a thing that you have in your houses yeah of course I grew up on that shit yeah did you come up with that live laugh love no just come up for your job as a copywriter that's okay she can have it yeah you just threw it out like no fuck it but this is exciting this feels exciting it feels dangerous in a way you're just like the living and the laughing and the loving yeah all of those things we check back in like next year and it's like bankruptcy yeah yeah no i mean listen if you i mean there's no reason why you need to have an office no there's no reason why you need to live in one country it'd be so boring i think even prior to starting after hours i used to jump cities frequently and i think that just being able to go into new cultures new experiences it's challenges you it's very fun yeah you're on your eat pray love shit i am wow i am too so i'm with you yeah you come up with that too yeah pray and love yeah that's my whole life wow it's my three tenants the pillars i've built my entire life on i mean listen what else more do you need eat pray love live laugh love love yeah it all comes back to love that's really it how do you how do you find working together as partners do you sort of do you ever have some issues where you're like you know like what's what's your favorite quality of each other what's your least favorite quality of each other i think my favorite quality is that you're very passionate vocally about things.

32:29Wow, this is a beautiful moment. Wow, this is so lovely. We don't, we work well, but we don't work well. Yeah, I think that's the whole point is like, it's so funny, like sometimes we'll be like out on the street like having a full-blown domestic just like, fuck you. And then someone will be like, oh my God, I just like, are you here? Like I just driven past you. Like when we're on video calls with clients, there is a lot of under the table just. A punching. I actually really would like to set a camera up one day, a bit weird but under the table just to watch not in like a creepy way but just to capture the action way Sagmeister and Walsh did that did they?

33:12yeah it was like 15 years ago they just had an overhead camera directly above they're talking about a below below the table maybe it'd be like a split video though so you see what's up top but also no someone told me that they i forget who it was that they worked at and watch and someone uh said like their parents used to watch and be like you didn't eat lunch today that's fucking crazy right that's that's that's creepy yeah that's like yeah you been sitting there for six hours go up go take a walk the parents knew that yeah because they had a camera my parents don't even know what city i'm in they're like where are you you guys have parents uh yeah voted question big question sorry actually i didn't i do we do that's a good thing you do because it would have been really rough if you didn't do you think that lesson to this yeah absolutely not no okay good don't send it to them like my mom would try and she'd be like i'm so proud of you and i'll be like but what do you do yeah that's good yeah well your parents listen to this my mom does and she uh shout out to mom shout out to joanie uh she's been on the show too she's a great guest and so um it's about time that she maybe makes her return to the show but it's good i mean it's a good way to talk to your parents so you guys are thinking about doing a podcast it's on the website it's on the website so we had this idea it was to interview other creative couples that work together because i think there's so many interesting nuances but um yeah we just never followed through with that idea which is a common thread apparently i mean You got a lot on your plate.