Logos that Last: with Allan Peters

29:28But I started taking on all sorts of freelance projects and passion projects like that, the Vikings poster thing I did with all the badges. I did that on the bus, you know, I did that to and from work. I was like the weird guy in those long benches in the front of the bus with my Pantone book all spread out, my laptop on my lap sketchbook on the right, taking up like half the bus to myself. And people thought I was so weird, but I had 45 minutes, man, both ways. It's an hour and a half a day. And after two years of doing that, doing these freelance projects on the bus for ESPN and Nike and stuff like that, my wife, she had done her taxes.

30:07And she said, Alan, do you realize you made more money on the bus this year than you made at Target. And so a lot of people, we dreamed of having an agency way back when I was an intern at my first job out of school. And Maria was still in college. And she'd come and hang out with me. And we talked about all the things we dreamed of, you know, having a family, having kids, all these things like that. I'd read Paul Rand's book. And I was like, I was like, what about if I had a book with my name on it? Like, how cool would that be? and running our own agency. And like you guys said, you were nervous and scared to jump into it.

30:45For me, I took the long, long route. And like, I worked towards it for like 15 years. I was doing freelance projects all through my career, building up clients, building up a reputation, building up the internet, you know, the social following and stuff like that until I basically was running a full-time agency while working at another place. And then I just transitioned, you know, and I was able to like pour myself more into the agency. And, and honestly, I work, a lot of times I take Fridays off and almost every Friday and it's four day work weeks. And I'm just, I'm Hank, I get a lot of time with my kids and I take on as many projects as feel, you know, comfortable and i made way more money than i've ever made at any of the other places because there's there's nobody to to take a cut of it right you know beautiful thing so yeah it was awesome it all it all came to fruition and and finally got to have agency which which we have now my wife and i and um just recently got to write this book which yeah does have alan peters on it and you know it's really cool uh it is the best-selling logo book in the world and has been for the last two weeks straight selling better than all the other ones it has after one one week after one week out it has uh 55 star reviews on amazon and and this is the best part before it even launched it sold over 5 000 copies and it's going to second printing before the launch day which is wow alan congrats man honestly it's it's massive that's awesome you know it's funny i i never really um uh thought of you as a salesman before but now that i'm seeing it i think you're you know the the the i love logos uh you know sort of uh craftsman you know you you you know that's just a facade for the salesman the guy that's uh you know got a book in store and hey you may have a a second life as an infomercial guy this is a real uh i'm seeing another side of you that i really like i think this is wonderful yeah shoot you know i i have i do have like a big chunk in here where i talk about you know selling work to clients because to make a good mark you guys know it or to sell like something like those united sodas behind you you can show it to them but you still got to sell that through you know there's so much good work that gets killed when it's just on the wall and you know they don't pick they don't pick the best direction or whatever and if you can't guide your client and sell sell the good work you know you're never gonna make the good work so yeah it's a big part of it yeah um i just want to ask do you ever take the bus again to get the creative juices flowing you know because of so much of your uh sort of early days were spent working on a bus you ever just like get in a rut and you're like okay i gotta get on that bus and start uh break you know breaking out the pantone chips does that ever uh ever cross your mind i thought i've thought of just nostalgically doing it because i like it just like to go downtown and and go see like like visit a bunch of friends down there and i have gone down there but i did drive um but i think it would be kind of fun just to take the express bus stay down there the whole day go just like visit a bunch of buddies i know at all the different agencies and stuff like that maybe hang out at a coffee shop you know meet up you know schedule a bunch bunch of stuff i think that would be a lovely day something i always end up i've got four kids man and i got a family and i yeah i'm just hanging out with them you know yeah you gotta escape the house sometimes you know so talking about the book sorry uh to to derail us there let's get back to the book logos at last in stores now number one bestseller everywhere uh you find books um what's it like to write a book and you mentioned sort of at the very beginning you were sort of like it's a dream to have that sort of book i'm my computer not a joke is is is uh propped up on the table on Vignelli and Polish air.

34:39So, um, you know, I have a number of books in the studio across on the other side of this, uh, sort of, uh, uh, shelving units and, uh, also propping on my computer, like dream come true, obviously talk about the process, like over, like how long did it take to sort of put this thing together and sort of, uh, do you always have a vision for sort of a book about logo making? Is that sort of a fair to say? I will, I'll, I'll walk you through it. Just first, I gotta say my, my, my monitors propped up on i i have a a double book set of joseph elber's interaction of color i don't know if you know joseph elber's he did like the really cool color studies with the squares i love joseph elber so much but yes i never get to look at joseph elber's because he's underneath my computer that's right exactly another good lesson proper computer up on legends oh yeah well you want to you want to be able to see it right exactly um i originally um have always wanted to write a book, a logo book.

35:37And I didn't know exactly what I wanted to write. And so I started doing some research and knowing that I did want to write one at some point. And I've read, by doing research, you know, just going and reading through a lot of these and seeing what, I don't know, like the Saul Bass book or Paul Rand by Stephen Heller or Michael Beirut's how-to book, you know, Draplin's book, all of them, you know, like they all have different styles you know some are more about typography some are more case study based some are the portfolio show where it kind of tells their life through their work and they're all a little bit different and um or like uh george boca i don't know if you know him but like his is very much like a intro to graphic design and brand identity uh logo design and and so and his is very much like a textbook and so there's there's a huge collection of them and i i kind of like i could have written a lot of different books a lot of different styles i've got a lot of different ideas and um uh but i didn't have a publisher and i wasn't gonna sit and do a kickstarter like i legitimately i wanted good distribution and stuff like that and so people kept asking me for years they're like hey do you have a logo book do you have something that talks about your process I want to know what you know.

36:56Do you have a Kickstarter or not a Kickstarter, like a Skillshare or, you know, YouTube videos that talk through it? And I've always wanted, I've got asked to teach a bunch at different colleges. And I always thought that, you know, I would really like to do the book as a way to teach, you know, to give back and share what I know with other folks and what I've learned. Because when I first started in design, you know, I wasn't great. You know, I I sucked it like right out of school and it took me a long time to, to get decent. You know, I didn't start winning awards or anything like that. I was at least like six years out of, out of college and took a bit.

37:33And when I was, when I was young, I would sit at the agency until like, you know, one in the morning, sometimes not because I had to, because I just wanted to work on my craft and get good. And, and I knew my work wasn't at that level yet. And I wanted it to be. and so i i would work kind of towards this goal of you know having like after reading paul rand's book i'm like what what stores now paul rand i just put these two books on my desk because i'm like i know i'm gonna reference this one yeah yeah yeah um uh and so this is by steven heller who he's written so many books i think uh debbie millman's had had him on a billion times legend So after reading this, I remember thinking like, what an accomplishment, what a legacy he left.

38:21And gosh, I'd love to do that. But to do that, you got to be able to fill this big book with work. You have to have something to share. And you can't do that like right away. And you have to kind of work toward that. And so I was kind of at this point now where I, after, you know, over 20 years in the field that, hey, you know, maybe it's time for this. And after keeping these requests over and over again, I was like, Alan, just put it out there. Let people know. Let people know that you want to write a book. And if you put it out in the universe, you know, you have a lot of followers. Maybe somebody will see it.

38:55And I made one video. And it was IGTV back when that was a thing. And it was 20 minutes long. Who's going to sit on Instagram for 20 minutes and watch a video and not flip to the next thing? Like, who has an attention span like that? I don't. I can, you know, I'm like 30 seconds and I'm swiping to the next one. I'm, I got the ADHD a little bit. And, and so my publisher, Jonathan, he did watch this video where I, where I reviewed a couple of design books. And at that way, and I said that I do it was doing it for research to, to write my own book. And he sent me an email like months, probably two, three months after I posted the video.

39:36And he's like, hey, I just watched this IGTV video you posted. And I see you want to write a book. Like, let's do it. Let's make your dream a reality. And so that was the beginning of it. And then at that point, you know, he talks to a lot of people. He's like a senior. What is it? It's not recruitment, but generally like recruiting authors and people to write books. and he has to vet them first, make sure that they can make it to the finish. Because there's a lot of people that I'm sure he works with that only get halfway through a project and they just flake out because they have so much other work.

40:14They're running agencies and stuff like that. But the first thing you have to do is you have to write a full-on pitch deck that's an elevator pitch, why there's room in the market, why this book should exist with all the other logo books out there, There are all the other design books out there. Why the heck is anybody going to want to buy it? Who's the target audience? Why do they care whatsoever? How can I help promote it? Do I have a following? How many people am I able to reach? And I had to have it all listed on bullets, something that you go through in like three minutes and you'd get down to it and be like, no brainer, let's make a book.

40:52And they had to sell it all the way up. And so got approved, got to make the book. and my hook for this book, because I talked about a lot of different stuff. It isn't the portfolio show. It isn't like, hey, the Alan Peter story, start to finish ego trip. It's called Logos That Last and it's about creating timeless brand marks. How do you like, when you think of the Eames Lounger, how beautiful and timeless that is. Ray and Charles Eames got that right and they just nailed it. And they were standing on the shoulder of giants. They were looking at what came before them and they took the best of the best and they applied a little bit of innovation and they made something that is still used all the time in beautiful studios and beautiful spaces.

41:39And how do you do that for logos? Like, why is the CBSI still around? You know, it's simple. It's unique. And it's memorable. You know, it's these three key things, the perfect balance. And you can't make that thing any more simple. That is such a beautiful mark. And target bullseye, same thing. That's a dot and a ring, right? Like, how are you going to make that simpler? Like, who's going to refine that? What do you make the, you know, like, hey, it's just a dot now. Remove the ring. Yeah, all of a sudden it loses the memorability because I think every mark should have a good story. You know, in the same way, like when you meet somebody for the first time and you try and come up with a story to remember their name.

42:20or if you meet two people and one person's name is alex and the person's name is hawk you're gonna later on remember hawk's name because there's a story to it and there's a lot of alex's out there right wow i like i remember pretty good yeah because alex center is like freaking famous and like the definition of awesome but if my name was hawk the hawk center Now that's a name, you know, that would be. Hawk Center. Name change incoming. Yeah, yeah. Imagine how many awards would be on that wall. If my name was Hawk. Hawk Center. He's, you know, he's the greatest branding guru that ever existed. You know, Hawk Center.

43:01No. Well, congrats, man. It's beautiful. As I mentioned, Kevin read it cover to cover. I noticed just there were a lot of logos in here. And that's, you know, but it is. I have. I'm kidding. I have sort of looked through it as you sent it to me last week. Thank you so much. And it's awesome. And I appreciate, like you said, the sort of telling of the stories and not just making an Indigo show and not just saying, like, look how great I am. Be inspired by my greatness. But really trying to teach people and help them. And, yeah, kind of giving up the tips, too. Giving up the process so that you're not just hiding it so that only you can do it.

43:39Everyone can do it. They just have to be, you know, they just got to ride the bus for years and hone their craft. And then they can make logos as incredibly as Alan does. And there are some really amazing ones in here. I guess my before I tell you which ones are my favorite, which ones are your favorite? Like what what of of all the logos in this book? And, you know, do you have a do you have a favorite or a couple that you really stand out for you? The pizza. See that one, that firecraft, that is for a small pizza truck. like a like the it's actually a trailer where they do wood-fired pizzas in south dakota of all places wow uh i was lucky them back back during covid um uh draplin was doing like these instagram lives every friday and there'd be a ton of people in there and i remember one night i was i was folding laundry and i had the phone out and i just had his has had his live going and i just like hit the wave button or something like that, you know?

44:40And Lee tells Draplin, she's like, oh, Alan's on, Alan's on. I know you want to talk to him. And he's like, he's like, Alan, Alan, come on right now. And so, you know, you could like invite people on. So I go on, I held up. I had like the Draplin design book and I was like, oh, I went to God, I was like, oh, I was just reading. What's up?

45:04No, he goes, listen, man, I want to tell you a story. And he goes, you know, I go around the whole country speaking and, you know, promoting my book and all these things like that. And I end up going in all sorts of small places and big places here. I'm trying to find that logo while we're talking. I'm not going to find it because I'm so focused on Alex. Look for the page on negative space logos. It will be four logos side by side. It's just negative space. um anyhow so he's like man i went for the i was in i was in south dakota in the black hills and uh there was this delicious smelling pizza truck and i went and got a slice and when i looked at the logo i was like wow and and i asked he goes and i asked them i said i said who did that logo it's amazing and they're like oh this guy from minneapolis alan peters and he's like i know that guy and he's like he goes he goes i just want to tell you allen in front of all these people he goes that day you taught aaron draplin something and i love that logo and that was one of the biggest compliments i've ever got i love aaron draplin and uh big fan uh but yeah that's that's probably the one of the ones that stands out there's a couple other ones there's a north stars one i did that yeah i love that one people really love alan before we move off the pizza logo can i add another compliment to your uh sort of story kevin um so we're talking yesterday obviously uh talking about you in this interview and talking about uh you know questions we're gonna ask you and uh i said uh to kevin kevin uh can back me up here i said uh look i said what my favorite logo that alan has ever made i said it's a pizza logo see if it's in there see if it's in the book and kevin was looking through and he's like oh there's the logo that you look i said that's my favorite thing that i've ever made i was like i love it so much it's on page 53 okay and uh for those uh that want to see it and um i it's it's funny yeah i was saying yesterday that of all your incredible work that is the thing that to me that really stands out or just like again just a personal favorite so genius so incredible um last year maybe two years i'm not going to give out all the details but we were approached by a big giant pizza chain and uh they have fire uh in their brand and uh we did not get the job but the entire time that i was thinking about this project i was in my head going there's no way we're gonna make something better than alan made for that pizza truck and in my head i was like well maybe if we get this job I hope that pizza truck is, you know, maybe they are out of business and I can reach out to Alan and ask him to collaborate with us.

47:59Or like legitimately, that was my thought process because I was like, he's created the world's greatest pizza fire mark. There's only one thing we could do, which is try to license it, which is, again, nothing I've ever even considered in my entire career of design. And that is the highest compliment I can give you. And I wonder how many people have reached out to you about that logo or ripped the logo off or just like, you know, because it's so brilliant and so simple. And it's, you know, again, it's just stuck here in my brain. I can't even think about pizza or doing pizza branding without thinking about that logo.

48:30The logos that have been ripped off the most, because I get stuff ripped off all the time. This logo has been ripped off a ton of times. and there will be people that that that take it outline it and then put it on like getty images and sell it and i have to like go and like seek it out and take it down and i'm like stop it stop doing that like so that one um both the uh the minnesota cities i designed uh the logos for a city again that i live in and city of shoreview those like there's a there's a hotel chain that ripped off shoreview that's that has is running commercials in the middle east i think or they're somewhere in europe europe area over there um and people keep telling me about they're like oh i keep so i get dms all the time about this this hotel chain that runs commercials with the shoreview logo that they stole and shoreview does i don't think they i don't know if they don't care or what or they just they're like but and then a city of egan there um that that logo has been taken a ton of times and like in brazil i had a lot of people rip off my logos in brazil for like a like big company stole and they went after them um and the other one was um gosh what was it um the loving all people's logo which is one of the ones at the white end of this that's it has three hearts and i literally sketched this logo out over the phone on on the pitch call with the way or the the original call with the clients that wasn't pitched for these guy runs a minister and he's just like a like a couple man show you know it's not like a big deal um but he said he had this this idea and it's going to be loving all peoples and i was like oh you know you could be loving you know heart and i'm like oh you could just rotate that and make it lap you know loving all people like let's go really there is a dating show in brazil a huge one and they rotated one of those i think one other way made him into neon colors and then it came out afterwards and there were a bunch of news uh reports and stuff in brazil all you know that i can't like i'd have to have translated of people saying how they ripped off they ripped off uh united states designer alan peters loving all brazilians that's it i said it i said to him because he's like he's like one of those like a home church churches you know like where they like they don't have a giant place and and so i just i like i did it i don't know i don't know if i got paid for that one maybe i just died for him for the heck of it uh certainly not enough money to hire a lawyer but um yeah i sent those to him and he was like is this real are people like are this is this a real thing that's a giant dating show in brazil and stole our logo i don't know it happens yeah you can't get too stressed about it you know like if it's a big brand they're not going to mess with that like when i do stuff for like blue cross blue shield or for um i don't know disney or whatever nobody ever messes with that work it's always the small brands that that they're like yeah we can get this and just and just lift it i hope the pizza truck is still doing well i actually don't wish bad upon the pizza truck i just uh they have the greatest pizza logo of all time and uh it's it's incredible and uh luckily uh we didn't get that project so i didn't have to uh you know try to uh you know create a different one or reach out to you and say because i would i would have given you his contact info i bet i bet you if if you guys would have given him like a chunk of like what you guys are making like a percentage like maybe even like like 40 of what you guys were bringing in for that logo he would have been like it's all yours i'll just i'll have another one made it's so iconic and you know again like obviously i you know see so much design and there's so many brands and so many logos out there and it's just like you're right like there are like it is a logo that lasts in my head and it's just because i always think about it and it's just so simple and so beautiful and yeah so much of your mark making is just so like what i love about it is is the like you said is the the simplicity and the storytelling that comes with it it's like it's they're very you know simple ideas that you just you know it's it's crafted so so beautifully uh we posted something on our instagram yesterday about the Chili's Mark, how the pepper has an apostrophe for the S.

52:56And it's just like those little things and those little moments of just genius that, again, it takes so many years to have that skill that you have, which is to sort of notice that a heart could be turned a couple different ways and be just an iconic Mark or taking a bike and a heart or finding these sort of intersections of sort of putting ideas together and i think that's what makes uh some really memorable and really iconic stuff so um you got your work cut out for you to to write the second book you got to go design like a hundred more logos i think alan you know that's the that's the challenge i think it would be it would be a little bit different like if i read a second book it would either be god there's a couple of them i'd love to write i i would love to write one that was, you know, I love digging for antiques and finding badges and crests and stuff like that.

53:47One of the cool things I found was that as I started traveling around and speaking, is that when you go to different cities and different places and different regions, because it's before Amazon and everybody was buying stuff that was made where they lived, the design tends to be regional, very regional back then. And instead of everybody having the same Patagonia coat, you know, there was, you know, this product was made here and they bought it here and this product was made here and they bought it here. And, and it was, it was very much separated. So when you go to start digging around for that stuff, you find all sorts of new things.

54:24Like if I looked in Maine and then I looked down in Arizona, I'm going to find a whole bunch of different types of, you know, packaging and stuff like that. And so I thought it'd be really cool to do a book that's regional based on, based on that. And here's the best part, take like, like three to six months off, drive around the country with the family, and then document it all and talk about like the journey of finding all this stuff and all the funny little like goofy places that you'd have to have to go in to find this stuff, the little small town museums and stuff. I think that would be a cool book.

54:54That's one of the ones I'd love to write. I can put it in here at the end, kind of put it out into the universe. I'd like to write that book. You know, if you're a publisher and you want to make that one. hear me out i think we're thinking too small with book i'm thinking like netflix show i'm yeah i'm thinking tv show yeah kevin and i we have a joint content brands uh yeah no alan hits the road junk in looking at uh you know kind of yeah looking for logos in in the you know in in the great america i'd watch a show do you have any favorite regions or towns like that you go badge hunting or thrifting or antiquing in you know my my theory for that is just to try and usually go off the beaten path go to the smaller towns uh like if i'm trying to like when i went down to houston to speak uh this is like guys probably eight nine years ago ten years ago uh i had gone down there and i had asked them i was like hey when i'm down here you know we're gonna have an extra day or two uh do you can you guys like take me some antique stores can we go like digging around like is there anything nearby and instead of they're like there's not a whole lot here in houston even though it's the fourth biggest city and i think it's the fourth biggest city in the in the country uh but we drove down to galveston which which is right on on the coast there so you know it took a half an hour 45 minutes to get down there but um really cool you know like just tons of really unpicked through antiques there you can find the older stuff the thing is you go to a lot of antique stores now and it's getting to the point where it's like hey it's ninja turtles and it's all the stuff we grew up with you know transformers oh god and you're not finding it's not the stuff from the 50s and 60s anymore it's like lunch boxes with uh smurfs on them and stuff like that which i i love 80s memorabilia and stuff like that i think that's cool but that's not what i'm looking for i'm not i'm not trying to like get inspired by a big smurf man i want to i want to make you feel real old when you go uh antiquing and you find your own childhood memories there you know yeah dude it's a dark dark day you know but it's uh it's sad that but it's true that's where we're at uh before we get out of here alan i um i i would remiss if i didn't tell another story about you which is um is maybe a personal story if you're okay with going there for a second yeah sure i i um you and i were at aiga design camp which is another minneapolis uh sort of event that um is incredible honestly one of the best design conferences that i've ever spoken at it's like a retreat and it's a in the wilderness kevin you'd love it it's uh you know people wearing flannel touching grass and uh you know talking about design it's it's a it's a it's a beautiful thing and um you know i've seen And maybe one of the first times I've seen you do a live talk or just doing a conference talk.

57:47And, of course, I was familiar. We've been friends. And we met about 10 years ago and have this shared in-house sort of love and sort of experience and knowledge. And so much of our paths, they've crossed many times. And so I'm watching your talk. And you're showing all your incredible work and showing your process and showing all the things that you do. And I'm loving it, right? And I'm like, oh, he's so fucking good. He's so talented. And then the whole talk takes a turn in the middle. And you tell a story about when you got shot. And talk about things that have stuck with me. I think it really was, yeah, it's just one of those stories that just honestly changed my perception of life.

58:40And again, it just it changed my perception of you. And, you know, in I just again, it's just one of those things that just really. Yeah, I didn't know. And I was really kind of. Yeah, it's a shocking story, but a beautiful story. And so I'd be curious if you don't mind just kind of telling us if you're if you're not comfortable with it, that's also fine, too. You can play the fifth year and run away. and we can you know i i love telling this story as a christian guy you know it's it's my testimony too so i i i had wanted to like like have it near the front of my book and like talk about that and uh my publisher was like he's like it's a logo book you're talking about logos that's you know that is like maybe maybe maybe not you know maybe like pull it back a little bit i think i originally wrote it it was like four spreads or something i was just like went all in you know yeah yeah like and i thought about a little bit more i'm like yeah you know i really want to tie everything in my book back to um back to designing logos to make sure it was valuable and things like that i do talk about it in the book um but i talk you know i really try and pull it back into like the the how it relates back to the work and so i'll talk i'll talk to that for a minute so back in 2009 when i was working in advertising and working like you know 60 65 hour weeks and a lot of weekends and it it was my wife's birthday and we were we were celebrating her 26th birthday I was that would make me 29 or yeah 2009 29 years old and she was turning 26 she's a young man and we had a big party and we had just moved into a new house And so it was kind of like a housewarming party too.

1:00:31So I got to see everybody that we knew completely. And like friends I hadn't seen forever, family. We had relatives up from like Southern Minnesota and stuff like that. There were so many people that came by. And it was like all the people that would be at your funeral or whatever, you know, it was like they were all there. And so I got to see everybody in my entire life. You know, right on this beautiful day celebrating my wife. And then the other thing about that time is, you know, we were talking earlier about kids. And I always wanted to, you know, at first, you know, basically leaving up to my wife.

1:01:13I was like, if you want to have them, we can do it. If you don't. And she had just made that decision that she wanted to have kids. And so we were trying to have our first kid at the time, too. We were trying to have, you know, a child. And it was about the time of the month where I was like, okay, we could probably take the test now, find out if you're pregnant. I was bugging her all day long. I was like, come on, let's do it, Moran. She's like, Alan, you're probably two weeks off before it will be even kind of accurate. Because if you take the test way too early, it's like 5 % accuracy or something like that.

1:01:48And so I'd been bugging her about it all that whole day. and after everybody had left and there were only a couple people left it was us and another couple um and i won't get to like belabor is i don't i don't want to be like you know the longest podcast of all time but uh it was probably around midnight one in the morning something like that and we're having a fire out back in our in our target purchased fire bowl you know like one of those little copper bowl things that you can buy and um uh just relaxing under the stars and and just Everybody was gone and kind of relaxed finally. And some kids came to our yard and they're all dressed up with ski masks and everything.

1:02:30And probably, I'm guessing, teenagers, like late teenagers, 18, 19, maybe. You know, they're young. And they walked in our yard and I went to like, hey, you know, walk around, you know, because kids would cut through our yard sometimes because we're one of the only houses on the block that didn't have a fence. and and i'd be like hey stay off my lawn you know i was like that dude and so i i went to go confront these kids and they pull the gun out and they're just like sit back down you know like you know they have you ever see that movie date night and uh they have a it's with steve corral and the guy pulls a gun on it and then all of a sudden he turns the gun sideways and steve I was like, oh, no, he's got it in kill mode or something like that because he has the gun sideways.

1:03:19So these guys, they're like, sit back down. And it was like a really weird, uncomfortable situation, not really knowing. Like, it almost seemed weird, like, because they had, like, the ski mask on and gloves and stuff. It looked like some, like, weird thing out of, like, some movie, like, Juice or something like that. You know, that Tupac movie juice. It's just like it didn't it didn't seem it didn't seem like it should even be happening. But anyhow, they they're grabbing at our pockets, looking for money. They wanted money. And they're just, you know, screaming at us. And Maria calls into the house to the of the couple.

1:04:03The other guy was inside. And it's like, Ben, call the police. We're being robbed. Don't come to the window. So Ben comes to the window because, you know, it's all good. I mean, I probably would have done the same thing. Comes to the window. It's like pulls his pockets. Let's not have anything. They're pissed now because Maria already told them to call the police. And they put the gun right to her head. And it's her birthday.

1:04:29And she's probably pregnant. and I number one if I didn't do anything at that point I never would have lived that down but my wife will and I'm like I'm like I gotta I gotta do something about it in my head I'm like I have to handle this situation and I just attacked the guy closest to me just just punched him as hard as I could he flew back and I turned to the guy with the gun and uh like like I was just going to go after him. And the guy with the gun points, bam, shoots me right between the ribs and the bullets still in me. I can feel it. It's right in here. They didn't take it out. I've traveled horizontally through my entire flank and it didn't hit a lung, thank God, but it hit gallbladder, liver, large and small intestines, two major arteries.

1:05:24And yeah, I was shot, man. And I looked at the guy with the gun and I was so like the adrenaline was rushing through me and I didn't, I like looked down and I was wearing a shirt really similar to this one where it's like a little stretch here. And I didn't see a bullet hole or anything. I saw like the burst when the gunshot but it wasn't you know in like movies like ramble or something they shoot a gun it's like it's not like flame shooting everywhere and it's like giant explosions and stuff it wasn't like that you know this is probably this like a smaller gun and just you know it's and you know it just it made a spark and like it it hit me and i turned and i just i just rushed the guy with the gun just screaming at them to get that hell out of my yard and and i chased them for about half a block before i realized it's dying you know bleeding to death and stumbled back to my yard and my wife saved my life that day.

1:06:20A lot of people freeze up in those type of situations, just like stare and not know what to do. She immediately, she's like, lay down, Alan. She put pressure on the wound. She's like, Jennifer, you call the police or the ambulance and stuff like that. And Ben, you get towels right now. And she was just like on it. And she's always like that my wife is a badass and and they got there quick uh got me in the ambulance took me downtown and um uh i'm telling you when i was laying there on the ground there was a lot of things coming out of my mouth that i that can't be said on this podcast because it would you couldn't air it because that was it was the most pain i've ever felt in my entire life but at the same time I was ready ready to go I thought I was dead completely I didn't didn't see making it through that I and I made my peace and when you're a kid man I remember sitting laying in bed actually being scared and having a hard time falling asleep thinking gosh I'm gonna die one day it's all gonna be over I'm gonna be dead and there's gonna be nothing else after that and just laying there with my eyes open freaked out you know when I was like six years old And so here I was, and I wasn't scared.

1:07:36I was like at peace with it. I was like, okay, you know, I made my peace with God at that moment. And I was like, all right. I'm like, I'm ready to leave this place. And it didn't happen that night. I didn't die. I got to the hospital and they stitched and staped me up. And it took two days, two days. They had me cut open from the base, like up base of my sternum, all the way down to like right below my belt line there. And around my belly button, had the whole thing open and just worked on me nonstop. I remember right before I went down, I asked the doctors, I was just like, see, I remember looking up at him.

1:08:14And I just said, please, please save my life. And he's like, I got you. Don't worry about it. We'll take care of you. and they took me to HCMC which is like the the place downtown Minneapolis where like all the like the people who are like the in like they're like trying to steal crack from somebody and they get shot that's where they take them you know they deal with gunshots and stuff like that all the time and so they kept helping nurses and stuff assumed I was like some crazy crack addict or something like while I was there well and then they were like oh no it's just like a regular guy it's just like a regular guy who got shot in his backyard um but graphic designer yeah but it was it was cool when i when i came to uh like obviously i came to and i was like on all sorts of like heroin level drugs and stuff like all the stuff that they have you on when when you're shot but um when when they like all that state like when it kind of dosed me down to something where i could actually um function in in my brain more so uh my wife took a pregnancy test and we found out we were pregnant with Matthew, which is amazing.

1:09:22And the best part about that is something like this, like you hear people who came back from the war and they tell war and they're changed after that sometimes, and they can't get back. They can't get back into life. They can't like basically re-engage and it can break people really badly going through a traumatic experience. For me, I found this as an opportunity to, well, I learned that day, knowing that I thought my life was over, that every day after that feels like a gift. And I feel like you can go at any time. And I know people say all the time, you could die any day, just live life to the fullest.

1:10:07But I literally came this close to dying. I lost over half the blood in my body. And if the bullet would have hit one of those ribs, it would have exploded like a grenade, and I'd be dead. If I hadn't been running like six miles a couple days a week, I would have bled to death because I wouldn't have been healthy enough. And if my wife wouldn't have been on it like she was, I would be a dead man. There's so many reasons. Why didn't they turn around and shoot me again with that gun? They never found a bullet casing, which means that gun jammed. There's a lot of reasons I should be dead right now.

1:10:41And I feel like the Lord kept me here to be here for my family. And also, man, I feel like it taught me a huge lesson about how short life is and that you got to be fearless. You got to be fearless. So much good design and advertising is fear-based. And the person who's the head guys or head lady is so scared of what their customer is going to think of this. and the creative director is worried about what the CEO is going to think. And the ACD is worried about what the CD is going to think. And the designer is worried about what the ACD is going to think. And they're all scared and they're all creating a little bit more lukewarm work because of it.

1:11:25And, man, I say just go for it. Like that flag thing, man, I just, I don't care if somebody tells me that. I'm like, oh, you shouldn't do free work because AIGAC. Man, I want to design our state flag. I think that would be amazing, you know? And I'm just going to go for it, man. I'm not going to be scared about it. If we want to start our own agency, we're going to do that. If we want to write a darn book, we're going to go for it. And I learned that the life is short, go and get it done. So that's my takeaway from almost dying. wow wow wow yeah thank you so so so much for for telling that story it is yeah no problem you know uh i'm speechless like uh and i heard the story before you know and i think um and it's it's it's it's a it's a wild story but it's it's it's an important story and thank you for again for telling it on our show and it just it puts so much in perspective and it really does we are uh so lucky all of us to do this for a living and i was saying you know said on a call earlier today it's a it's a privilege really it is and uh we should all um you know approach uh life like that you know and you never know and um and and yeah i've i've i've thought about that story you know ever since that that that conference and just yeah really it kind of puts so much uh yeah it's it's It's a beautiful story in the end.

1:12:51And again, I just admire you. I have for many years and the work that you do is incredible. And yeah, thank you for joining our show. And thank you for doing all the work that you do and putting it all into this book, Logos That Last, available now. and uh yeah continuing to sort of uh help other people because i think that's you know the thing that we we all can do right it's uh you know it's not just to do it for ourselves so that we can you know kind of uh drive sports cars and uh you know sort of uh wear uh expensive jewelry you know that's uh that's not uh you know it's important about helping other people and you can do that in so many different ways and i think your story is you know by telling it i think and not like you said you could run away from it or not uh i think you know telling it and sort of uh is is is so important so thank you for doing it yeah thank you incredibly powerful yeah um and i think then actually a great way to end the show too honestly it's uh you know it's uh i don't know where we uh could possibly go from here but you know you're you're a great guy where can people They'll follow you if they want to see some of your amazing work and follow along on your journey as you post every single day, which I'm actually incredibly impressed by because social media, you make it look easy, but it's a lot of work, I know, to post every single day.

1:14:21It's fatiguing and tough, yeah, but important. It's helped build your business and brand and everything, so it's also another important thing. Don't be afraid to post your stuff out there. Put it online. Absolutely. Hey, thanks for having me. Love your work. You know, the work you guys are doing at Center is amazing. Obviously, the wards, they tell the story right there. But even without a man, like the first time you showed that United Sotos work, holy cow, man. I was like, oh, these guys are going to be huge.

1:15:00Where can you find me? You can find me at Alan Peters. So at then A-L-L-A-N-P-E-T-E-R-S. And that's all social media pretty much everywhere. I'm not on TikTok. Somebody already else already has Alan Peters. So I'm like, screw that. Screw that TikTok.

1:15:21What else? Our website is PetersDesignCompany.com. And that'd be awesome if you came and visited and stopped by or follow on Instagram, man. I've been posting a lot on LinkedIn. That's where the clients are, dude. Post on LinkedIn, man. LinkedIn is the underrated social media platform. Kevin is a big kudoser. It's his thing. He goes around giving out kudos. I love the automated responses. Yes, I do too. It's wonderful. Hit me up. Follow Kevin on LinkedIn. And I will give you a lot of that. We can have a whole automated conversation. I have several automated conversations going on in my messages right now that have been running for years.

1:16:11I also noticed a lot of AI automated comments happening. At least when I post, I'll be like, Alex Center, you and your team do such great work combining the powers of branding and design with the intention of strategy. uh keep doing a good job i'm like that is not a human that wrote that it's not no they have it built into the the posting now i i i posted something uh yesterday and it was like would you want do you want to just put in some prompts and and we will write the post for you no no i don't yeah no linkedin uh back off um alan as you see people are trying to join this uh zoom because there is a meeting that they are trying to attend.

1:17:02Alan, I'd love to hang, our paths will cross again, but thank you for doing the pod. Thank you. I'm going to sing your praises and sort of promote your book. Thanks, dude. It was my own. So thank you, Alan. Appreciate it. Have a good one. And yeah, we'll talk to you. Thank you so much. Thanks, Kevin.

1:17:48We'll be right back. If only they knew how real this life really gets. They would stop acting like a silly bitch. They would respect the cock, whether or not they believed in it. Doesn't take much and that's messed up. Because these people do a lot of simple shit to impress us. While everyone was trying to outdo the last man. I was just a ghost trying to catch some Ms. Pac-Man. Hello ma 'am, would you be interested in some sexual positions and emotional investments? I'm not insane, in fact I'm kinda rational When I be asking, yo, where did all the passion go? East coast, west coast, down south, midwest Nowadays everybody knows how to get trash Somebody give me a big yes God bless America, but she stole the beef from bless Now I'm too fucked up to dance So I'ma sit with my hand on the front of my pants You can't achieve your goals if you don't take that chance So go pry open that trunk and get those amps ין quoteyou

1:19:02see me get all the We both trying to find a balance I'm trying to find a balance I'm trying to find a balance I'm trying to build a balance