Brandi Carlile

29:39This is my job. Wow. That's awesome. I mean, that's a good example too of like feeling calm in stressful situations. I tend to get like you, I'm not so nervous when I'm doing something. Sometimes after it's done, I have like this discharge of nerves. Does that happen to you? I was reading an article in The Guardian that is, it was such a smart article and it made me feel so like stupid but kind of proud to be stupid where it basically says that like that what you're talking about is totally necessary in terms of performers these like it's such a unnatural thing to have your psychosympathetic nervous system to do what we do that you have to lack an element of contextual intelligence to do it baby i lack it i lack it and they they liken it to like people that can do penalty kicks and like free throws is like we have this thing where we don't think anything could go wrong totally and i'm just and i kind of dissociate in a way of like whatever what's the worst that can happen exactly yeah and then if something does go wrong so if you do miss the free throw or you do miss the penalty which you do all the time right you don't think well of course i did chances are i would it's a tiny ball tiny net or whatever you just go that was weird.

31:00That'll never happen again. And it's like that, that repetition of stupidity is what gives us our gift. It's so true. It is. I mean, like, um, uh, SNL was a really good training ground for that live performance in general is really good because you have a mistake. Do you, does this happen to you when there's a tiny mistake? Not a terrible, like you don't want something bad, but when there's a tiny mistake, do you get a little energized? Yeah. Because you're like, I got to save it. I can do one. I can't do two. Yeah. And it's a little bit exciting. Yeah. Because two mistakes, no. But one is kind of good.

31:34Do you remember a mistake that happened when you were performing and you just, I don't know, a mic went out or someone didn't come and get the... And you just had a moment of pure excitement and the tingle of that? Yeah. But it happens so often. There isn't a notable one. There's this guy I know that does guitar solo master. He's a dude that I've toured with just because if I can have this happen twice in a show, it takes the show over the top. So this dude, and he will never admit this, but he'll start out his guitar solo with a couple of maybe stock licks or just a couple of notes that are like, oh, those are tasteful.

32:13And then he'll make a mistake. And then it rallies everyone to his, to his support. Like we rage to his side and we go, Oh no, he's, he might not have this. Oh, like, Oh God. And then he looks a little frazzled and he shakes his head a little bit and he kind of does the next lick and it's okay. And by the end of it, he's just shredding. And you realize that there's no way he could ever make a mistake, but that mistake drawing everyone in, not just to listen to him, but to like, you want to support him. And then his victory becomes your victory. So one mistake does that in a performance or a song.

32:48Two mistakes is like she's not prepared. It's so true. And you're absolutely like the way you take in the mistake, like, ha ha. Yeah.

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35:19I've always felt this about the way you perform and seeing you, like the way you talk about yourself and your music and your art and the way you look at the business of it all. It's supposed to be fun. And if you're relaxed, we're relaxed. Yeah. If you're having a good time, we're having a good time. Yeah. It's like if the bride has a good time at the wedding, it's a fun wedding. Period. The end. But it's a hard lesson to learn, which is trying to, I mean, telling people to relax is really hard. Yeah. It's true. How do you relax when you're about to perform? How do you like, how do you just, you just, it just comes natural and always has?

35:53Well, I used to drink a little bit. Sure. And if you drink a little bit and then you stop drinking a little bit before you go on stage then it's like starting over from never having drank a little bit so that sucked yeah i don't drink anymore it's like i can't i can't handle it i mean like it just i just get too drunk too fast i have no tolerance drink a lot of things really fast like i'm like a camel yeah um no i know what you mean i could like just a little bit and suddenly you're like oh i am not on my game yeah i'm not a sharp right and then it's like the spiral afterwards that's the thing i can't deal And then like pretend the spiral just happened in front of like, you know, a few thousand people.

36:31Oh, yeah. And then like whatever you say, like you have to like stand by that the next day. Right. So that's not. Right. We're back to the few minutes before between the song. Back to the few minutes. Yeah. Between the song. Right. Where you decide to get like overtly political in like an unironic way or you just you make the joke and, you know, you were in the pick of destiny. Yeah. Tenacious D. Yeah. I'm not going to tell the story again. I just told the story on Stern. Oh, you already told me. I don't want any stern. I don't want any sloppy stern seconds. I don't want any stern seconds. But you were in the film.

37:04But you've got to tell Stern. I love Howard. But when you're on Stern, you've got to give Stern a good story. Like you've got to bring some meat to Howard Stern. I'm going to tell you the story and you can edit it out if you want to. But I just think that you appreciate this because we are on the subject of drinking and then getting on stage in front of people. So I thought everyone had seen The Pick of Destiny. And I mean, I don't mean to be offensive, but like not everyone has seen The Pick of Destiny. People who should, this is Jack Black and Kyle Gass's Tenacious D. Yes. So Jack Black is in a band called Tenacious D, which made a movie called The Pick of Destiny, which is a real cult classic.

37:37It's a cult classic, but it was my favorite movie. And I have memorized every line. And these guys, because this was like how I, you know, I was in bands like this. They have to win the Battle of Bands because they have to pay their rent. But they're never going to win the Battle of Bands without The Pick of Destiny, which is like a piece of the devil's horn or toenail or something. sure so and it's like but to win the battle of bands they have got to learn a couple of moves and one of the moves is called the rock slide the other move is called the cock push-up yeah they used to do cock push-ups and so my audience didn't see the pick of destiny but I believed everyone had seen the pick of destiny right so I was in Las Vegas I was on stage and I was having a few drinks and I decided to jump off the drum riser and my knees just didn't hold.

38:25They just buckled. And so I kind of like went on my knees and I kind of styled it. And I did like the rock back on the knees thing. And after the song, I stood up and this is the, this is why I'm afraid of the 15 seconds between the songs. And I said to the audience, I said, well, now that you've seen my rock slide. Now it's time for my cock push up. This is a good, this is a good story for Stern. And that, that didn't go over. Nobody knew, nobody knew why Brandy was telling, you know, a couple of thousand middle-aged lesbians that she was going to do a cock push up.

39:02Do you have her? So I don't drink anymore. Are you done drinking? Are you done drinking? I'm not Yeah, yeah, yeah. Also, I just think it gets harder as we get older. Yeah. I just think it's like everything is harder and everything is better. Yeah. Like it's better. What's good about getting older? Well, I mean. What do you think is good about getting older? I travel with this migraine medication in my pocket at all times. You're not sure. Not a sponsor. Not a sponsor. No, it's unsponsored, but that's just there. Yeah. Okay. So I can't really drink. Also, can we talk about these packages? I'm not going to.

39:37How do you get into it? You rip it apart with your teeth because you're desperate. Well, that's because you have your own teeth. Not everybody has their own teeth. So what were you asking? How is it to get older? Okay. So anyway, yes, getting older. Every year I get older. I love being older more than I loved being younger. Yeah, me too. I just love it. I like everything. I like the way that my reverence has grown and sense of humor has changed. I choose myself in more situations. I like the way my face looks. I like, you know, I like it. Yeah, me too. I mean, I don't think enough people talk about it.

40:12They just don't talk about like, I mean, 50s have, I'm 54. The 50s have been my favorite decade. Oh, by far. That's what I think is going to happen. Oh, by far. My 50s birthday was so fun. I mean, I know there's a lot that comes along with it. And especially for people who don't feel like they're in the place they should be. Like that feels really hurt, can be really hurtful and stressful. Or they're not with the person they should be with. Or they've had a lot that they've gone through. but I don't think enough people talk about how it just can get better and better and better. We're just so obsessed with youth, you know.

40:45Yeah. We really, and I love young people too. Yeah, me too. I love young people and I'm always like, oh, enjoy that space, be there, you know, and I have kids too and I'm like, oh my God, be a kid, be a kid. But if I'm really honest, that wasn't my favorite part of my life. Even if, you know, I walked in front of a bus tomorrow and I got to like my life flash before my eyes. I think I probably see the last five years. Yes. Yeah. Very cool. Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of young people that love you and relate to you and feel seen by you and love your music. And you do this thing, I think, for a lot of people where you bridge older artists and bring them back into this like present world.

41:35And there's, you know, a million people that you work with, incredible artists. First of all, what is it like to work with your heroes like Elton John, Joni Mitchell? Like when you meet them, how do you manage that feeling of Indigo Girls where you are like, I was a young Brandy, was a fan waiting outside. and now we're together and I'm going to, you know, I'm kind of helping produce this thing we're doing together. How do you, what's that feeling? Like, how do you do it? That's a really good question. And it's a sacred feeling. It's a really sacred feeling because like, and I guess also the older I get and the more young people do come up to me and say things to me that I remember saying to my heroes, it like, I'm, I'm that kind of fan.

42:19Like I'm a wait outside your tour bus kind of fan. So like, I'm hearing these words and I'm like, I remember those words. And I'm just remembering, like, I'm just understanding how full circle life can be and how human we all are. I actually don't see, I don't even understand like what a fan is without the context of me, you know, because everybody that like, I, I really idolize, like I've got to be friends with. And so there is a part of that that never goes away. And it sort of like sneaks up on you like deja vu or something. You'll be in an interaction that is feeling totally normal. And then suddenly one thing will flash through the room and you'll be like, oh my God, this is Elton John.

43:03And it's like those moments are, I really cherish them. I just grab them and hold on to them and I go, yeah, yeah, you did it. You did it. Yeah. And it's, and it's also an indication that you're still in touch with that part of yourself. Like you're, you don't feel like above it or beyond it or over it. It's really cool. Yeah. And staying in touch with that part of myself keeps me honest in my responsibility within my job to other people that like my music and, you know, buy that concert ticket and get the babysitter and, you know, get dressed up and go out for the night. Like, I'm really going to show up for that gig because I just understand.

43:41What's Elton like? I've never met him and he seems incredible. Like, also, he's always discovering new artists. Yeah, always. like he's really into new music all the time you've never met him no see that's the other thing is most people have met elton because he's so social and he's just so like you will meet him and like a real extrovert absolutely love him total extrovert but like one of those people that's reached maybe the most um iconic status that you can possibly um reach with absolutely no trace of narcissism. Whoa. I know. Like he's competitive and he's intense and he knows he's Elton John.

44:20I love a competitive person. Oh God, I know. So do I. I mean, I have a lot of it. You know, you gotta want to try to win a little bit. But he will ask you questions and listen to your answers and be just genuinely intrigued like by you, you know? And that's why he's discovering all these younger artists. Yeah. He's just an exceptional man. Yeah. Once in a millennium man. And you've worked with Dolly who just... That's another one. What is it like to sing next to Dolly? What does that feel like? Dolly Parton. She's impeccable. She does not miss. So the standard is like so high. Dolly is the boss.

44:54And so when I show up for Dolly, like I show up on time, buttoned all the way up to the top button, and I don't miss. I know everything I'm supposed to do. And she doesn't like ask you to meet that standard, but it's there. like Dolly's high expectations and yeah she's just amazing amazing and the work you've done recently with Joni by Joni's side is just so cool it felt like you were you were the professional and the fan at the same time that's such a nice thing to say oh that's such a nice thing to say and a nice way to look at it. I felt like a student a lot of the time because that music was so wildly complex and inaccessible to me at first.

45:45Even though I was a fan of it, I had never had to get inside of it and learn phrasing and learn, you know, the key changes, the melody. It's a roller coaster. The melodies are roller coasters. You don't, having those twists and turns ready. and then take that and combine it with the fact that Joni doesn't ever like to do the same thing twice and if she thinks you know what she's going to do she's not going to do it so it's a really wild thing getting to sit shotgun next to Joni and as her recovery has progressed and she's gotten more and more and more that way and I see the spirit of who Joni Mitchell has always been more and more every day that she delves into her own music and it must be so cool to talk to like young teenagers who are discovering her for the first time.

46:31Well, they come up to me in mass. That's probably the thing I end up talking about the most. And I love it. Like I never grow tired of talking about Joni and the Joni journey, but like younger people and much older people alike, that is the thing everyone comes to me and says, okay, look, I've got Joni Mitchell's lyrics tattooed on my arm, you know, like really like Gracie Abrams. Like that's how I met Gracie, you know yeah I'm also thinking about that sweet um uh performer um Benicio oh yeah Benicio who sang the joke with you yeah many times which is watching what an incredible song and just the way you know it's not easy to sing with like legends and young people like who are kind of just starting out on their journey like the way you performed with I'm like Chris Farley I'm like remember that

47:26that's my question do you remember when you did it I do I remember Benicio but like that was such a beautiful moment too and it really changed how does a song change depending on who you perform it with that the well first of all the innocence of that with Benicio I was so impulsive back then I like I would just the school I went to the public school I went to in the town I live in a couple times a year I'll do something for them I'll just go speak in an assembly or whatever you know actually feels good to like be cool in that school now that I'm an adult because you were not yeah no no one was so I you know I went there and like Benicio came up and he sang that song and it was just it was stunning and I was like I'm gonna be on TV next week come with me to New York and I could be so impulsive like the stakes were like I don't want to say they were low but it felt like the stakes were really low like back then like I didn't know what I was going to wear.

48:19And I just took a kid from my school with me, you know? And I remember like it had been no big deal to me because I'd already been doing it so much at that point, you know? And when we, they say on those, what was it, what was it, Seth? Or was it? Okay, this is a great question because I tried to look it up. Conan? I have a laptop. Okay. I can't find it. I can't remember which one it was. It said late show, which could mean 45 different shows. Yeah. It said they had the word late in it. And I thought it was Jimmy Fallon. but then it might have been the show was late at night there's a white man and if it's Seth I should be able to find it but I cannot find it and also I'm not great at looking things up well they in those in these shows which I love doing they say you can go you can retake if you need to but you don't you're not supposed to yeah so but Benicio froze and he totally froze and we walked backstage at the thing and he was just crying and I was like Benny I understand you know it's like you're so young and maybe I don't know I should have talked to you about this a little bit more it's okay like listen you're not supposed to retake it but let me go out and see if they'll let us do it again and they did and so the band went back out reset up and we we did it again and I just the real lesson in that was like if there was anything about that that was I think really good for Benicio's growth was that that mistake that failure, that moment of, you know, catastrophe turned into like a total triumph.

49:50It was so triumphant. And that makes so much sense because your joy in the way he was singing with you, like you could feel it in that performance. And it makes a lot of sense that you were like really excited that he was nailing it. Yeah. And it was twice the victory because he got it together. Like that thing we have to do, we have to pull it together and just triumph. That's what winners do. Yeah. I mean, not like it's a competition, but well done, Benicio. Can I ask you your relationship to your hair?

50:22Because it's a deeper question for me about how we all play around with our mask and femme energy, basically. Yeah, yeah, totally. And you, you know, when you were young watching Lilith Fair, and then when you came out as an artist, like when I first saw you, you know, you had like long hair. and I'm curious how you have changed and how your hair has changed and like, are they connected? Yeah, and that's such a like interesting and intuitive question. Like no one has ever asked me a question like that before, but, and now I'm very conscious of my hair. Me too. I mean, I think hair is political, right?

50:57Like, and it's interesting, our relationship with it and it changes all the time and we're telling people who we are through it. Yeah. Well, somebody asked me recently about coming out about like when I really truly felt like I had like stepped into my authentic self. And I just without even thinking about it said when I cut my hair, when I cut my hair. And at that time in my life, yeah, if you saw on the Lilith doc, I had like a little boy, like almost buzz cut, like haircut. And I loved it. It was so freeing. I loved having it off my neck. I loved that my mom hated it. I loved everything about like that haircut.

51:35And then, yeah. And then I, I've, I definitely have played around with and felt comfortable moving in and out of kind of gender, um, representation throughout all of my adolescence. And a lot of times it would depend on my girlfriend, like what girlfriend I had and like what her hair was like. But I've always liked how I looked and changing that and asking myself if I liked, you know, where I was at. And yeah, hair is like the first thing. It is. To address, yeah. You know, we kind of make jokes in the world where like someone has the same hairstyle for 40 years. Yeah. But what's behind that, what's behind that is like a fear of like, if I change, will I recognize myself?

52:22Right. Will I recognize myself? Because so many people want to, you know, they want to feel younger. They want to feel like the version of themselves when they were feeling the best about themselves. That's what happens. I know when so much of it is hair. And like we make fun of like men with comb overs, for example, right? Like we make fun of people who like won't let go. But like, I don't know, it's just there's just a lot of self-esteem that comes from hair. I'm not making any sense here. No, you're making like too much sense. Plus, I do feel like for me, if I wanted to grow my hair, I don't think it would grow long past a certain point.

52:53Yeah. I feel like it would like actually physically just be like, nope, you're getting a bob. Just gonna split at the ear. But no, I know what you mean. Like that is something that comes in all the time. And then add queerness to that, you know, and like the gender issue that you so intuitively pointed out to that. And then it can get like another layer of complication for sure. But I have definitely seen that when a central core group of lesbians will like sort of like set a trend for themselves and not alone, by the way. Usually it takes a team like it does with me. But then you will start to see lesbians everywhere looking.

53:34like I've noticed that me and Kate McKinnon are morphing into each other in more ways than once. I didn't say it. Okay. I want to talk to you a little bit about touring. You really nicely came when Tina and I were on tour. You really nicely came one time and did our show, which was so nice of you. I don't think you know how enthused I was to get to do that. I don't think what I did to get home so that I could do that. Oh, Brandy, thank you. It wasn't even a thank you thing it was like it's a thank you from me i was so excited to get to do that i love you guys so much you said famously that like you're you're first of all i love everything you've done all the movies and everything like that thank you sisters like that stop right now pick a destiny definitely um but you you said the the best snl cast is the one when you're 13 yeah not not for me it was the late 90s to mid early 2000s that is my SNL cast so you guys are like everything to me and I was so excited to get to go there and do that with you we had an amazing couple years I gotta say when I look at who I was on SNL with at the time it was crazy heavy hitters Anna Maya, you, Tina, Rachel I mean Will Horatio did you cross over with Chris Chris Citan yeah I don't know I'm just, all I'm saying is you can cut this if you want, but I'm just such a fan.

54:59And to get to do that with you guys. It's funny that you bring up this thing. Just yesterday, my kid was eating mango and he was like, do you want the mango? And I was like, do you want to the mango? And he was like, what? And I was like, oh, there's a character named mango that you want to the mango. I'm going to show it to you. I was like, you have no idea. You haven't met mango yet. Yeah, no. So, and so, but touring is its own thing and its own, you know, and, and I'm sure you have it down. You've toured a million different ways and you figured out like how you like to tour. What do you like about touring and what have you adjusted now to make you like it even more?

55:36How do you adjust it? Brandy style. So, you know what I mean? Like, oh, if I'm going to be in the city, I'm going to make sure that I don't visit anybody and don't do anything, but just do my show. or I'm going to back time three hours from the show and make sure I have a steak or whatever. Yeah. Well, it's changed so much because you've accumulated people. Yeah. And restaurants and places and parks and walks and little, you know, urban rivers to fish in, in my case. Yeah, you're a big fisher. You love to fish. Yeah. So I've acquired memories in each of these places. They're my place now. And so, yeah, I go there and I do all those things.

56:12And now that I'm older and I can't sing as uninhibitedly as I used to when I was younger and I used to just blow my voice out all the time, I'm really careful about days off. So I wind up getting a day off usually in most cities to sort of experience it. One thing I can't do is sleep all day. That's not good for me emotionally. And like I said, I can't do too much drinking. Yeah. And let's talk about sleep for a second. Yeah, sleep, man. Do you like it? Well, we got to do it. Do you get enough? I do. I do. What do you do? What's your bedtime routine? Okay. Well, it involves a heating pad. Do you know about the bio mat?

56:49Yeah. You know, Alanis Morissette just sent me one. And it's life changing. It's changed my... First of all, it's impossible to get up off of it. Once you get on, it sucks you in. Yeah. And you got to be so careful not to bed rot when you're not sleeping. Like, don't go back to that bed once you get out. Do you put your bio mat in your bed? I mean, I've been known to. For those people that don't know, there's many versions of it, but it's basically like a giant heating pad that has crystals in it or whatever they say. And it grounds you. And it's incredible. Yeah, it's incredible. And I love a heating pad.

57:26Like I travel with one, you know. But my bedtime routine is, yeah, I get on the heating pad and I take a melatonin gummy. Nice. And I talk with my wife when we do the debrief of the day. That's, I think, so important for, I just think that's so, I don't know. Do you do that? Yeah. I love the, I love the being able to kind of review, like have a review of the day. Get out of your own head and the way that you saw yourself and your own behavior. Here's somebody else's take on it. Yeah. If you're developing conspiracy theories about other people or starting to crystallize into like weird political, you know, belief systems.

58:04Yeah. You learned, you went down a rabbit hole or whatever, and then you just do have a conversation with a human being that knows you at night. Yeah. And it's a real head cleansing experience. And it's also a time where you can kind of decide, like, I'm going to drag some of these things to trash, and then some I'm going to kind of take with me to the next day. Yeah. You know? Like, some I'm going to just kind of talk through, and then they're going to float away. Yeah. And other things I'm going to remember and keep. Yeah. And you kind of dream calibrate. Yeah. Yeah. And then you get. Do you wear an eye shade?

58:32Yeah, lately. Interesting. Earplugs? No. I feel claustrophobic when I put in earplugs. Yeah, same. I can't do earplugs. And I shade, I can't really do either. What's your sleep routine? And do you get enough? I try to get so much. I love sleep so much. All I think about is when can I get sleep and like how many hours can I get? What's your mattress? That's where I need some help. Okay, I got some thoughts. Really? Tell me. Okay, so I'm a big mattress person. The very first thing I did when I made any money was by every single person I know a mattress. whoa that's such a baller move it was like it was like when temper pedics first came out and and i didn't have that much money some of my financed you were like i'm gonna get this paid someday yes exactly that is awesome but i could because of the sleep thing like you know but that was like that was when tempur pedic first came out so i was like a big tempur pedic person i do not get paid by tempur pedic yet but i yet but i bought everyone a Tempur-Pedic mattress.

59:34And lately I've really been into this other mattress called the purple mattress. Hold on. So these two, I need a new mattress. Okay. These are the ones. And, and, and, and a new mattress is one of those like adult things that literally feels impossible. Like you're like, I guess I can never get it. Like I'm really good at adulting. I get a lot of stuff done. I'm not a procrastinator, but something about a new mattress. I'm like, I guess I'll just never get a mattress. I don't know. I don't know. I guess they're really hard They're hard to move. They're big. Okay. What do you like about this mattress?

1:00:06Well, I mean. Sell me this mattress. Okay. The purple mattress? Sure. Okay. So it's anything that feels like this like zero gravity mattress situation where you like, in my mind, I tell myself, if I'm not like pressed up against something hard and my like blood can flow freely throughout my body and my circulation is good, then I'm healing when I'm asleep. So you like, you don't like, do you like a softness then? You don't like a firm mattress? You know, it's like less blankets, more blankets. It's like a combination of things. But I just think that like Tempur-Pedic and Purple, these two mattresses, they provide this kind of zero gravity feeling where if you wake up in the middle of the night, no part of you feels pressed up against something else.

1:00:44Yeah. And also if we ever sleep in the same bed, which I feel like is a possibility. Don't touch me. Don't get the rumors started. I don't like to be touched by other people when I'm sleeping. A hundred. No touching. No, absolutely no touching. Well, I mean, also I'm a certain age where like I have to find cool spots a lot. Yeah. Okay. It's still like, it's very hot. Uh-huh. So, and I don't like, I don't like touching. And also I've said this many times for a podcast and I'm sorry, I'm saying it, but I wear a CPAP machine. Oh, so, um, and because I have sleep apnea. We are so hot when we go to bed.

1:01:20So is that going to, I think that's going to really. I'm asked, know your plugs. Special match to CPAP machines. But, see, bio-mat. It's so hot. I mean, that's, that's the, like, I mean, it's true love, actually. It's whoever, whoever can get past that is, it's really true love. Yeah. But what's in your rider? Do you have a rider? Yeah, I do. Anything fun? No, it's so boring. Like, I'm just, I'm really coming off as a normal person. Very boring to you. No, people that are, have weird riders feel, honestly, it feels like it's a stressful way to get people to run around for them. It is. because you know my best friend her job was writers for a while and that's kind of when I was like no my writer is like normal it's like what kind of stuff you got in there I need an avocado perfect I need lemons yep I need uh just some like LaCroix yeah and it's gotta be cold and then um like tuna salad every show every ever I always have to have tuna salad and bananas and I don't like any of those things.

1:02:27But they are a part of my routine. But I have to have them.

1:02:35Okay, well, the rider question brings me to, we do this thing on the show where we have people who know our guest Zoom with me before I talk to our guest to speak well behind their back and also to give me a question. So we talked to Maren Morris today. Oh, God, I love marriage. I know. I do, too. And I mean, the High Women were such a great example of you and all of those women, of course, but like women working together in real time to make really cool stuff and everyone saying yes right away. And Brandy being the one that's like, let's do it. I'm going to make it happen. Here are the dates.

1:03:13Let's go. And then making this great record and performing with Dolly. Like, it just feels like that whole experience was so awesome. Was it? It was. It was not uncomplicated, but it was awesome. Yeah. And just like something I am so proud we did. And actually it's something I think we should do again. Yeah. Because it's like that combination of women was really interesting and wild. And I want that back in a way. Why? Especially as my, well, as my girls are getting older, I just, they were so little when I did it. And now, you know, that they are where they are. I just want to, I want them to watch us do it.

1:03:51Yeah. I think they'd really learn from it. And then our kids, you know, like we did that. Maren didn't have a child yet. And, you know, it's like now they're all so big. Mercy's big and Sammy Jo's big and my kids are getting big. And I just, having a girl on the precipice of being a teenager, I think it would be a really neat thing to show them. Well, that's exactly what Maren's question was. What? She was basically saying like, you have two daughters, you're watching your girls get older, they're coming to your shows. Like, like, you know, her question was like, you know, any advice, you know, cause you know, Maren's got a little boy and just, and, and what we were talking about was even extrapolating from that, it's just this idea of like a working mother, like how do we figure out how to invite our kids into the world and show them, you know, it's such a great, it's such a great thing to watch your mom do what she loves to do.

1:04:40It's a big deal. Yeah, it's a big deal. And especially for young girls. So when they come and watch you, do they, um, what do you think about when they're, when they're around you, when you're on tour? I know you've brought them of course, many times on tour. Like, what are you thinking about now with your daughters and, and, and what you want them to see? And what do they, do they like watching you perform? The girls like watching me perform. They're both really into sports, which is mystifying to me because I never, you know but like they were like watching the world series and they were crying when the mariners got defeated and now they won't ever even go to toronto because they're so mad at the blue jays and like i have no feelings about sports whatsoever but i'll take them to a game and then i'll watch them watch that and i'm like you know the concerts don't really register in the same well it's just like how do you how do you um uh rebel when your mom's rock star is you become a jock.

1:05:37Oh, I hope this is not a sign of things to come, but they seem more like, and this is occurring to me as I'm saying it, they seem more excited by and interested in the way I interact with fans as a person, as a public person, than actually how I do music. They're more interested in the fact that I'm a little bit famous than whether I'm a good or bad singer. And they're very interested right now in the way my music interfaces with politics oh wow and maybe that's why i'm so interested in in um maron's question and in and in being a part of like uh another chapter for the high women is i think they would really like it like their favorite very favorite song from my album is church and state they loved the snl performance and they're very proud of of that, even with their limited knowledge, you know, they know that there's a struggle and that our family's a part of it.

1:06:34And they're very proud of that and more interested in that than they even seem to be the musical aspect. And they probably are just figuring that out that, oh, my mom's art, her job is speaking to that. I bet you they're just figuring that out for the first time. They are. They like it. Very cool. Yeah. And that's, they seem to be just energized about, about those kinds of things. And it does sort of translate to their behavior in sports and stuff. I took them to like a Seattle Reign, a soccer game, and they were just took on a life of their own. And you know that song, You Without Me, from my album?

1:07:09Them in sports is a you without me moment. I don't know who they are when they're screaming those things. And they're like, be aggressive, be aggressive. I'm like, no, don't be aggressive. But they're like, that's a chant, mom. Yeah, that's a chant, mom. They're like, we're, we're, it's good. That's so interesting though, because I feel like you have a, you have a, you're, you are, you know, in positively competitive and you have a, a player's attitude toward your work. I'm driven, but I'm not competitive. Like, it's crazy. No, it's actually annoying. It's annoying, I think. Interesting. And I think it puts me a little bit on the outs with some of my friends, even like my relationship with Elton.

1:07:57He's constantly annoyed by my lack of it. But if I'm up for an award and somebody else beats me, I mean, I'm deflated for like three and a half seconds until they get up and do their speech. And then I'm like fighting back tears from like feeling so happy for them. And like I'll go see my own kid play soccer. And I'm just so I'm so proud of all those little girls out there. I don't even know how to root for my own kid. Because I'm so, you know what I mean? But what you're saying, you just have a healthy relationship to competition. Maybe. Because awards are crazy. They're crazy. Of course. And you go there and it's like, if you actually, you know, what is winning?

1:08:38Winning is just being at the show. And same with, you know, watching, like anyone who like yells on the sideline is like total nutbag. Okay, so my last question is, and I ask all my guests this, and I know you're a real comedy. fan. Like real. Learning that. So you have, you probably have a refined taste and comedy is probably something that you seek out, pay attention to and care about. What are you listening to watching? A video, a TV show, a movie, old, new, or like what, what makes you laugh? How are you like in these times, where do you go when you want to feel that lift? How do I go? I go to a few core movies.

1:09:21Like I'll go to a few core comedy movies without sounding too retro or old school. I mean, I love Tommy Boy. Oh my God. I love Tommy Boy. I mean, Bridesmaids, everything Tenacious D. I loved Sisters. I felt like that was a really important one for a lot of reasons. And then SNL, I like never miss SNL. I love SNL and I've got my favorite old episodes and my favorite skits. What's one of your favorite SNL sketches? One of my favorite SNL sketches? We can watch it together. Oh my god, there's so many good ones. One that I come back to a lot is the Liza Minnelli turns on a lamp. Did you ever see that one?

1:10:05Kristen Wiig, a total genius. That's a really good one. I mean, let's watch that for a second. I mean, and by the way, hilarious physical comedy, not great for podcasts, but okay, Okay, the title says Liza Minnelli Tries to Turn Off a Lamp. Oh, that's what it is, yeah. I mean, wig is so friggin' funny. I know. And, okay, let's watch this. I'm also a huge Tracy Morgan fan. Tracy Morgan. Okay, so this is New York. Sugar, babe, it's open by the cats and the curtain goes up in 15 minutes. We got a scooter, Liza. Oh, sure, I'd be delighted. Just let me turn off some of these lamps. I'm a shoulder like a ball on the end of a chain.

1:10:50Remember that? Brandy is dying. In a black city, a chopped old shrimp. I love her. I love her. When she was on TV as a young kid, I was like, who is that? Yeah. Liza, you're very talented. Yes. You should stick with it. Liza, stick with it. Stick with it, Liza. You picked the right job. And Brandy, so did you. You picked her. You're just the best singer. Congrats on your voice, on this record, on all the things that you're the best. You are the funniest, most charming, most interesting person. I really feel I hope this is the beginning of a long friendship. Seriously. I know you have a lot of people live in your house.

1:11:34You have like a lot of people in your house. Yeah. One or two more. You might not even notice. No. And if you need a trim carpenter, if you're afraid to work with wood, I can strengthen your resolve. I am. I feel like this time around, I'm probably not going to do that. Yeah. But that's okay. God is fair. Thank you so much for doing this. This is so fun. I really loved it. Such a joy. It was everything I hoped it would be. Yay! We did it! Thank you so much, Brandy. You are incredible. And it was so, so fun hanging with you. And yeah, you know, we talked about so many good things. One thing that we spoke about, which I just wanted to kind of correct or plunge deeper into in the Polar Plunge, was the performance that her and Benicio Bryant did together for the incredible song, The Joke, which we all know is one of Brandy's best.

1:12:29And that was on Late Night with Seth Meyers. And Seth, I'm sorry that I forgot that. I love your work, Seth. I love what you do. I'm a big, big fan. But I can't remember where things, you know, air anymore. And so it sounded like it would be something that you would have done. Great, great idea. Whoever, you know, I'm sure it wasn't your idea. But whoever on your staff said to do it, so smart. And I'm sorry that I might have attributed that performance to another late night show. You're the only late night show I care about. So, Seth... Congrats on that. And Brandy, beautiful work. And listeners, thank you again for tuning in.

1:13:18See you soon. You've been listening to Good Hang. The executive producers for this show are Bill Simmons, Jenna Weiss-Berman, and me, Amy Poehler. The show is produced by The Ringer and Paper Kite. For The Ringer, production by Jack Wilson, Kat Spillane, Kaya McMullen, and Alaya Zanaris. For Paper Kite, production by Sam Green, Joel Lovell, and Jenna Weiss-Berman. Original music by Amy Miles.

1:14:09Story, starring Elizabeth Banks and Matthew McFadden, the miniature wife, streaming April 9th only on Peacock. This episode is brought to you by Athletic Brewing Company. No matter how you do game day, on the couch, in the crowd, or manning the snack table, Athletic Brewing fits right in. With a full lineup of non-alcoholic beer styles, you can enjoy bold flavors all game long. No hangovers, no buzz, no subbing out for water in the second half. Stock the fridge for tip-off with a variety of non-alcoholic craft styles available at your local grocery store or online at athleticbrewing.com. Your beer, fit for all times.