Nick Offerman

29:32And we try to enjoy every minute of it. But like Ron Swanson is, would be in the hall, is in the hall of fame of characters. I mean, he is, he is this person that people feel, what is it like almost 20 years later interacting with that kind of work? Like how do people interact with you? It's interesting. I mean, mostly, first of all, I'm so stupidly grateful, like from soup to nuts. And also people are so nice to me and respectful. I think of Ron, like people approach me with a deference and also a little fear. Yeah. But they are really polite to me where I usually have to say, please call me Nick or, you know, because they're shaking and they're scared.

30:24Mr. Swanson, if I may. Yeah. May I approach the bench? They do. And so for all of that, I'm super grateful. It's certainly weird, too. There are thorns on the rose or pits in the peach of like Ron's politics or what Ron represented sort of as a paradigm. some people with poor reading comprehension were like, oh, he's a shotgun guy. Like finally, so they mistook Ron for sort of things they wanted to represent in themselves. Yeah. And usually it was something old fashioned or right wingish, like misogynistic or violent or anything like that. And so that's been weird, too, where people love the character.

31:20And I've even had people argue with me online where they'll say something about, like, they'll say, Ron definitely would have voted for this jerk. And I'll be like, hang on, hang on one second. And I'll call Mike, sure, the main creator and writer and say, somebody said this. And he would give me a pair. He would whip out a perfect paragraph that's hilarious, but also why Ron. For example, anybody that went from the world of business to the world of politics, Ron would think was a fool. Because Ron's like, what are you doing? You're a capitalist. And so then I would – this is back when I used to participate, when social media wasn't just a cesspool.

32:07Yeah. But I would go back and say, here's what Mike Schur says. And they'd say, nope. They would say, no, you guys don't know. You guys don't know shit about Ron Swanson. And I was like, well, I'm just going to leave it there. Yeah. I thought I did, but I guess you got me on that one. Do people come up to you and say, people call me Ron Swanson? Yeah. I get that a lot with Leslie Knope. People say I'm like Leslie Knope. And usually that means like, to your point, it can mean a bunch of different things. It can mean I work hard and I'm fighting the good fight. It can mean I kind of drive everybody crazy and I talk too much and I'm, you know, like it can mean a million things.

32:50Sure. I mean, I feel like when I think of Leslie Knope, I think of her ebullience the most. Like that sometimes and sometimes when people are like that, it's a very heroic characteristic, but it can be too much. Yeah. Because you're like, OK, like I'm doing what you asked me to do. And when people say that to me about Ron Swanson, it's like it usually means they're taciturn. Yeah. And they're like, you know, like I imagine a husband in the grocery store carrying like 112 pounds of stuff and his wife's like, let's just get a cart. He's like, no, I got this. I got it. Just keep going. And so being too stubborn or like relying too much on.

33:39I could just remember us doing scenes together and I would have a hundred words to your one. and I would just circle around you in that office, just like, and you would just sit and watch me. And it was like old archetypes of like the, you know, two different animals in the same room, basically. And that was what's so fun is playing those energies. And then as we got more comfortable, like flipping those energies and having fun with those energies, but like those early days of just, being able to just kind of come in and buzz around while you stood your ground was so fun. That was a really fun game.

34:24And just picturing that, you describing it and me picturing it, made me think of Shauna Mulway-Tweep on B-cam on a Scooty scooter. And we would always make her laugh and she would slam into the wall. Yeah. The camera operators were in the room with us a lot And they were part of the family for sure. And we would make them laugh. And you talk pretty – you don't talk as slow. You talk differently than Ron. But you talk pretty slow. I'm the slowest talking. How do you do that? I don't know. Anything that I see myself in, even now, I'm like, pick it up, man. Like, what is your deal? Oh, my God. I'm the exact opposite.

35:05I'm like, babe, take a breath, dude. I mean, now that I have a podcast, I hear myself and I'm like – And I'm like, whoa. It's weird, especially when people praise some acting work. And I have to watch everything, like watching your baseball swing to see what's working. And every time I speak my dialogue at this pace. Well, I feel like I can do an impression of you. Can you do an impression of me? I would never want to. Really? I'm going to do you right now to your face. I don't have it in me. Well, I have it in me.

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38:14When you were playing Ron on the show, what did you do? What were some ways to get into that character? Like was, was it wardrobe? Was it the mustache? Was it? I mean, it's, it's funny. Megan, we've been together for 25 years and only about five years ago, God bless her. I mean, you've seen the crazy ways. I, I, I, I never get cast as like good looking people. So I get, I get cast as I'm like, okay, great. I'm going to shave the top of my head off and have like Larry from the three Stooges hair. And Megan's like, there was one time I was doing a play and she wouldn't let me get in bed because I looked so upsetting.

38:58And I slept on the couch for two nights before I figured out I could put on a stocking cap. And then I got in. But five years ago, she finally said, you know what? I really don't like your facial hair. Oh my God, bless her heart. I know. After 20 years of it, I mean, I think she has liked it at times, but it's a practical thing where she said, it's a mouthful of thistles. Like when we're getting into it, and I was like, well, when you put it that way, it is like a bristle brush. It's like the kind of brush that farmers have to get the mud off your work boots. It's a really stiff bristle. If you have sensitive skin at all and you have a makeout sesh, you can just be totally red-faced.

39:45Right. Yeah. And so now we negotiate. So I've got some work and so I'm maintaining a mustache for the moment. But in a couple of weeks, I'll be shaving it. Yeah. And something I've noticed is my talking changes. Oh. When I have the mustache, I call it my constipative rictus. It's like a sort of invisible clamp comes over me and things become more stentorian and more like Sam the Eagle from the Muppets, like where I can feel my brow more. And when I shave, I look 15 years younger and I just become boyish where I'm just like. Okay, guys. Yeah, what's up? But do you give free mustache rides until you shave your mustache?

40:36I don't. You've always charged for mustache rights. I've always charged, yeah. And I've always thought that was rude. So we do this thing where we talk to someone who knows our guests to get a question from them. So we talk to Aubrey. Oh, Jesus. I know. And there's nothing we can use. It's barely usable. Born on the same day. She speaks of that. And she might read us a little bit of some text that you guys had back and forth. Nothing bad. Nothing bad. You guys share a birthday. And I feel like there was, you know, there's so many people that talk about on the show, obviously, that we worked with and we love.

41:20But Ron and April's relationship to me, especially in the rewatch, is very special. Most of the podcasts so far, I'm willfully not crying, by the way. Yeah. Like, I know that you would like some crying. I don't care either way.

41:42Like, if you just say Ron and April. I know. I'm in trouble. Ron and April. I mean, I have a lot of love for all of this subject matter. I know. wait I have tissues

42:01don't hit me with the slapstick look I have good hanged tissues I'll just keep them here just in case alright you were saying no but Ron and April because if we're going to extend the mommy daddy metaphor definitely Aubrey slash April was our daughter on that show and we both of our characters kind of helped raise her and loved doing it and by doing it like any good parent you learn something about yourself by doing it like you know Leslie learned that like her kind of pushy ambition it needs to be replaced with like a gentle listening as to what people want and need from her and Ron learned what?

42:50Ron didn't learn anything. Ron learned what rap music was. Yeah. Yeah. But, I mean, what was it like doing scenes with Aubrey? I mean, it was so fun because she, you know, she could meet me in my own game. She took my – because one of the things, one of the formative things when we started the show was I said to the guys, I mean, I just couldn't believe it. I couldn't believe that they created a part for me. Like I was so aware that if someone had said to me, write your dream part, I would have written something so much stupider because I'm not sure. Sure. You know, like I would have been like, okay, he's got a fucking, he's got a motorcycle and he always wears t-shirts with no sleeves.

43:46It would have been like some 12 year old's version of like, he's like David Lee Roth. And it would have been very superficial. And in my final audition with you, which I, you know, I had to audition for five months to get the job. Wow. I didn't know it was that long. Yeah. It was, well, it started with, it started with Adam and I were brought in to read for a role named Josh. Right. And it was, it was chemistry reads with Rashida. Right. And, you know, if you're going in to read of chemistry for a TV show, guess who you don't want to walk in the fucking door? Adam Scott. Adam Scott, fucking chemistry machine.

44:29Fucking charisma machine. Believe me, I had to do scenes with him. I was like, this guy. I'm his, I'm like his plumber, if I'm lucky. And, um, both of you have gorgeous hair though. Yeah. They were, and people should know this is your hair. It is, but they also photographed the fleshy parts. But so, so that was crazy and that didn't work. And somehow Mike and Greg also were stuck on me. Thank God. I mean, they called my agent and said, it's not going to happen. If you can imagine, we're not going to cast you as someone who Rashida has to kiss. if you can wrap your head around that. But we really want you on the show.

45:11And there's this part of Amy's boss that should have really been like 20 years old. Yeah. Yeah. I think they were thinking a lot older in the beginning. Yeah. But, and I was, and I was like, I don't, great, whatever. And so then they had me come in and they read every guy in the world. So then finally, the net got as wide as possible. Then it narrowed, narrowed, narrowed. And they brought me in one more time for like, and Mike said, okay, we're looking at like eight guys. And then you came to town and Mike said, all right, we're going to have you come in and read with Amy. And this is it. This is going to be it.

45:51And it was one of those things. This happened to me a lot where I got the job and it blew my mind. Also, you cried. We called you and you cried. Oh, I sobbed my eyes out. I mean, I said to Mike. On the phone. I was like, I'm going to, I said, I'm going to openly sob, but I want to stay on the phone. I was 38 years old. Like I had been through a lot of experiences where I almost got a life-changing job. And this one was so much better than any of them had been. Before we get off of parks, I do want to talk about the other stuff that you have done and are doing. Favorite episode. I know it's hard to pick, but just like, you know, pick one.

46:35Don't overthink it. I have two answers in there, and it's funny. But one is called Ron and Tammy, and one is called Leslie and Ron, I believe. But I mean, you know, Megan is just the most wickedly funny person I've ever met. And getting to, again, the alchemy of what Mike and the writers came up with for her to do. you know the two of us banding together against this evil librarian slapping her face with like a big cock of beef jerky like we're just like mike knew that you know he was like do you think megan would uh i still have people come up and go you really got the library right those people over there i'm like what the people that run the library are like tammy that's insane that's so funny but they they know that yeah but but then the you know the entire series paying off in this episode that was such a gift that was like this crazy one act play yeah um oh god oh here it comes

47:47i love that episode so much and it was so like senior our senior year that was the other thing it was like senior year we got to be in that we got a whole week together in that room That whole thing that they did with, where, you know, Ron, that whole story going into that last season was so gorgeous because they had laid so much pipe. I know. For Ron to like swallow his pride and come to ask you for a job. And then the way it all went down, that was possibly the greatest thing about the show for me was the history of me and Tammy bred so much hilarity. But then what developed between Ron and Leslie was the first time in my life that, you know, that I was counted on by a show to, you know, to carry some emotional weight.

48:43Yeah. And it was, and also I think just like a great example of like the different kinds of love. I mean, we really lionize romantic love and we'd make a lot of art about it, but there's so many different ways to love and love platonic love and friendship. and the idea of like being there for each other and being, going through things with each other and like mentor, mentee, and then equals. And then, and just, and also just the idea, if we're to really widen out that people don't have to agree to treat each other with respect. Remember that? Yeah. Okay. Speaking of beautiful roles, Nick, the last of us.

49:27Oh my God. Let's both get a tissue. That was so good, Mick. Well, thank you. That was so beautiful. I mean, I remember texting you right after, and congrats on winning the Emmy. Yeah, crazy. I mean, it was so – how did you get that part? Well, I wrote a joke about this. They needed a guy who could use a shovel, and there were only three of us in Hollywood. Harrison Ford passed, and Jane Lynch was not available.

50:01I, Craig Mazin, who wrote that, I mean, that everyone knew when you read that script, you were like, this is going to, if we don't fuck this up, this is going to win awards or whatever. For many years, my godson had a little league team and I sponsored it. It was the Offerman Woodshop little league team. And Craig was one of my little league dads. So I was just friends with him from a pretty wholesome place. And we had expressed some mutual affection for each other's work over the years. But he got a hold of me and was like, I'm sending you something and you have to do it. And I read it and it was funny because Megan and I had just had a talk about that I still to this day, my vice is that I overload my calendar with fun.

50:55I have seen that in real time. We worked on making it together, a really fun show together. You would tell me your year and I would think this too shall not, this isn't going to hold. Too many things. The problem is it's, I love it. It's all, but that's, that's my vice. That's my problem. Yeah. And Megan and I just had a talk about where I was like, okay, I'm going to do less. And this thing came in and they needed me in Calgary for a month and I didn't have the month. And so I had Megan read the script and she was like, guess what, buddy? You're going to Calgary. Okay. I mentioned it. We made a really fun show called Making It about makers and like the process of making it.

51:44You have Little Woodchucks, the book that's all about like your guide to tools and tomfoolery. But it is the idea of making things has always been very important to you. You've spoken about it a lot, the spirituality of it, like how important it is for your life, your peace of mind. You work primarily with wood, but all different types of material. why are you writing and you've written many many books this book is for little people why is how do you get little people young people to get interested in making things and why is it important for them to do that i just took my mom and dad on this book tour with me in the uk and we were just talking about how they brought me and my siblings up in a house where it wasn't talked about.

52:29They just taught us all to sustain the family. Part of the family was we make things together, whether it's a meal or if we are mending our clothing or making firewood, building out buildings, we'd gardened. And woodworking is a great way to think about what's this made of? And that it's true of everything. Who's making this? Who made this car? Who made these shoes? Who made this pie? Are they having a good time? Are they being cool with our resources, the way they're making this car? Yeah. Beautiful. You can feel it in here. It's awesome, Nick. So I love it. Thank you. People are responding really well to it.

53:10Yeah, it's great. All of us, I'm a kid who looks at a screen too much. We all understand that. And making things with each other, whether it's your family or your neighbors or your co-stars, is a great way to not look at a screen and still have a delightful life. Can I show you a prop? Yes, of course. The thing sitting in my shop is, so I want to make a guitar because I tour and I do songs. And I thought if I do that with a guitar I made, I'm done. I can just do that for the rest of my life. Guitars are daunting. So I started with a ukulele. So this is a mahogany ukulele and I've got 12 of them sitting in my shop that are just the bodies and the necks waiting to be put together.

54:04This is beautiful. It's instruments. So I think probably instruments and boats. Can you play the ukulele? Can you play something for us? Let's see if it's in tune.

54:22Would you like to hear my ukulele song? Yes, please.

54:27Whiskey, you were sent from heaven above And Ben Franklin said that beer is proof of God's love But too much of either will earn me a shove From my wife, whom I'd like to stay the husband of I love beer and whiskey, perhaps a bit too much Given the chance I'd fall off a bar stool daily To keep me out of the pub and also out of Dutch I make things like this soprano ukulele I'll give you one more verse Everywhere I go, people staring at a phone Sitting in a crowded room completely alone It gives me more willies in the twilight zone Our brains are hooked on that shit like a dog on a bone Put down your gadget and look me in the eye So our interaction can proceed more gaily Silence your tablet and ejaculate aside To the sweetly strumming sounds of ukulele Oh, Nick!

55:39That was so good! There's more, but that felt like enough. Now you're going to get me going. Now you're going to get my waterworks going. Okay, we're going to end our interview today with a speed round. And you don't... You got the wrong guy for a speed round. I know. I wouldn't need you. I should just do one snap or two snaps. That should be all I'm allowed. But you mentioned hot takes and people having hot takes and how we don't really need hot takes. I want your hot takes on history and philosophy. Okay. Because I know you love history. You love philosophy. I'm going to try lightning round today, but I'm going to only ask you questions about history and philosophy.

56:26Okay. I'll try to go fast, but it's pretty daunting. Okay. I know. Well, don't worry. It won't be hard. Aristotle. Smart or weird? Smart. Kierkegaard used different pseudonyms to debate. What would be a pseudonym you would use to debate? Oh, um, Pilotus. Freud, yes or no? Uh, no. I say no too. Okay. Um, true or false? The unexamined life is not worth living. Uh, true. I think therefore I am. True or false? false you cannot step twice into the same river oh true that's a that's a huge one that's that's on my that's on my up on my board is it oh yeah it's it's something that that occurs to me a lot um you know uh there's nothing you can never recapture especially in our business You know, if like if we ever had cause to do some sort of reboot or something of Parks and Rec.

57:41Yeah. It's not the same river. Different river. Yeah. Can't step twice into the same river. No. I'm a joker. I'm a smoker. I'm a midnight toker. True. Now we're moving on to history. Okay. What was the coolest thing Egyptians invented? Man. in your opinion this is a guess because I don't I'm not sure if that was Egyptians I was going to say irrigation yeah I think so but yeah they did if people disagree with that they're wrong Cleopatra smash or pass pass the Vikings got to America that shit is tired yeah the Vikings got to America before Columbus why doesn't anyone talk about that Because the Vikings did not have good PR.

58:37Columbus had a great press rep. Columbus didn't even set foot on the mainland. He like hit an island. Okay, and now we get to Aubrey's question for you. So Aubrey had, she had a few questions. Her first one was, do you believe in ghosts? Okay, no. But I don't disagree. when people do, I believe them. Ah, well said. Do you believe in hell? No. And if you could go back in a Bill and Ted kind of way where you could basically, you could get zapped back to any point in history. This sounds like a good movie. So you've never seen Bill and Ted? I missed a lot of stuff. Oh my God, fun. It's a great one.

59:24Well, anyway, they zap back in like a time machine. Right? And they go back and they're just Bill and Ted in different, and they're just two dummies. It's like dumb and dumber in a time machine. Totally. And they, so what, if you could zap back in a time machine to any era, where would you go? Who would you fight? And would you take Aubrey with you? Oh man. Yeah. If taking Aubrey is an option, of course, and weapons are involved by all means. I suppose I would go to the Roman Empire and I would have Aubrey fight them with her wiles. And I would discover Cumberland Sausage and take over the British Isles and become king.

1:00:11Cumberland Sausage made people king? In my hands. In this narrative? You'd be the sausage king. You're goddamn right, yeah. Guys, guys, we could do this or you could try this sausage. Have you heard of caraway seed? Come with me. Why do you love history so much? I don't know. Do you? I do. I mean, I think because I'm fascinated with what assholes we are. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But also what incredible creatures we are. Like it's when you look at my own, anybody's the foibles of your own life and you look at like, I don't know, a lot of what's going on in our world right now. It's astonishing that the lights are on.

1:01:11Like it's pretty crazy that a civilization has even lasted this long. Do you believe in aliens? I'm agnostic about all that. It seems like there is probably life in the universe. Yeah. But until I get to shake hands with them, or I don't mean to be racist, whatever their limb appendages. Appendages, yeah. You know, all of those things. I think there's a lot we will never know as humans, and I like dwelling in that. So if there are ghosts or spirits, I don't think hell exists because that's a fiction written in a book by people. But that sensibility, whatever the afterlife is, I don't think anyone will ever know what it is.

1:02:03And so if some people are like, I speak to spirits or whatever, I have no cause to disagree with that. They just have never talked to me. That's a very Ron Swanson answer, actually. It's a very libertarian answer, basically, which is like to each his own. Yeah. Yeah. Everyone should be allowed, you know, their own trip and to like what they like. And last question, Nick, what are you watching, listening? Where do you go right now to laugh? Where do you – right? There are two shows because I feel like it comes up a lot that there's not a lot of great – it's not a great time for comedy on television.

1:02:45the big hits like Hacks and Studio, those make us laugh quite a bit. But there are two that we've really loved that are more obscure that I would love your listeners to know about. One's Australian and it's called Colin from Accounts. Yes. Excellent show. It's so funny and also so heartwarming. It really moves me. And then there's one in England called, I think it's called Such Brave Girls. Do you know that show? I do very well. Cat Sadler. And I think the credits, the opening credits are the words spelled out in pubic hair on a tile floor, on a bathroom floor. And that's a great example of the tone of the show.

1:03:32Yes. It's so delightfully filthy and so funny. That is a great show. That's a hilarious show. And those ladies are great. There's a lot of good stuff out there. You just got to find it. You just got to find it. Nick, did we cover everything? I think we did. I think so, yeah. You know. Did we weigh in on Aristotle? Yeah, we did. And you said pass on Cleopatra. You're not going to smash. Yeah, come on.

1:04:03I love you. I'm not going to step in that river twice.

1:04:10I mean you came all the way from England you just landed thanks buddy for doing this I know imagine how fast I would talk if I hadn't just gotten off a plane should we just try to do this like every month totally I love you thank you for doing this I love you thank you and I can't wait to make something else with you soon someday Amen. Yeah, that would be awesome. But thanks for doing this and making this. And thank you for my slapstick. Or is it mine? If you would like it. Oh, no, this is the one you travel with. By all means. It says butt on it. It does say butt joint on it. It scares me a little bit.

1:04:55Thank you so much, Nick Offerman, for being here today. I love you. And it's always good to spend time with you. And for this Polar Plunge, I do want to just highlight something I didn't get a chance to talk to Nick about, which is, you know, we spoke a little bit about the physicality of Ron Swanson and how important it was for him to figure out that character. But do yourself a favor when you're watching Parks and Recreation, take a look at how Ron runs. It's one of my favorite things about Nick is Ron Swanson runs in a very specific way. And sometimes he wipes out. And when he wipes out, it's beautiful.

1:05:27It's like stunt level wipeout. But I can't explain it other than to say, just gives me total delight. Uh, the choice Nick made to run the way Ron runs. And, um, I'm, I'm gesticulating for those listening. So you can't see, but it's just so funny. Um, the tucked in shirt, the way Nick sits when he plays Ron Swanson, the way he stares, all of that stuff is just like a masterclass, I think in comedic acting and, um, probably, you know, what a trained actor learns. And I wouldn't know. But anyway, look, he's that he's it's a genius at work watching Nick work and so happy he could join us. Thank you for listening to Good Hang and we'll see you soon.

1:06:20Bye. You've been listening to Good Hang. The executive producers for this show are Bill Simmons, Jenna Weiss-Berman and me, Amy Poehler. The show is produced by The Ringer and Paper Kite. For The Ringer, production by Jack Wilson, Kat Spillane, Kaya McMullen, and Alea Zanaris. For Paper Kite, production by Sam Green, Joel Lovell, and Jenna Weiss-Berman. Original music by Amy Miles.