Kevin McCarthy

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27:19Someone told me this a while back, and I learned this, not the hard way, but I learned this in the junket world, when I would be lucky to interview somebody multiple times and it took a while to figure somebody out. Like Harrison Ford, I don't think I figured out Harrison Ford, how to interview him until like my fifth time. Yeah, same probably. And he's such a nice guy. He's great in an interview, but he's a craft guy. He loves craft and acting and filmmaking and discovering a character. And I remember when I first met him, I wanted to geek out. I'm like, oh my gosh, it's Han Solo or Han Solo.

27:54And I'm like, it's Indiana Jones. And that's not his vibe. He's an actor who creates a character. Those characters happen to become legendary and iconic. And so how do you meet these people where they're at? And I was like, oh, on the fourth or fifth time I got him, I'm like, oh, I understand what he likes and what he's interested in talking about. He was always nice to me, but I never felt like I got to a connected level of craft conversation until I really understood, oh he's passionate about everything with character development. I think that people often say to me and I take it as a high compliment like oh my god everybody seems so comfortable with you they trust you they go places they want it with other people and a lot of that part of it is I know what I'm talking about and I have hopefully an affable vibe and I'm listening and I'm engaging whatever but a big part of it is just having history like exactly what you're saying.

28:43He's one of my favorite people to talk to now. Harrison Ford every time I book him like I know now what I have to where I have to go with it because at the end of the day and I think you would agree with this as well my questions come from a genuine place of curiosity which is a huge different you would think that's not a differentiating point between most folks in the business yeah but it is so invaluable because again I'm sure you get this a lot you should get this a lot I get the compliment of like oh you actually you care you're genuine and that should be a baseline it's not sadly not to denigrate other folks that do what we do but there are folks that just like are reading off a card and they come and go and I think the folks that last really live and breathe this and and I think hopefully your conversations my conversations people can sense like we love this we absolutely live and breathe this like we both grew up in different ways obsessed with what we are now making our living and I think that the passion uh comes through in every conversation yeah and it's interesting because I my goal at the end of every show is that if one person listens to the episode and learn something that enhances their experience with that film, I've done my job.

29:54And I go back, because I started as a film critic, and I go back and look at older reviews I used to give. I remember reviewing Shutter Island on TV, and my entire review was focused on the cinematography, the music choices, the performance, the movement, the twist. And I'm like, oh, I was already kind of setting myself up in a way where I just translated film criticism into interviewing. Like Park Chan-wook, who was just in here, he used to be a film critic years and years ago. And so I just find it really interesting that it was almost like I didn't realize this was going to be the dream, but I was setting myself up for what that was going to be.

30:33Same thing in a different way for me. It's like, I think my interviews reflect everything that I love, which is like, there's a certain level of geekiness and obsession. there's a certain level of like you know people like give me crap sometimes like oh you're always asking about superheroes or auditions or things they didn't get I'm like I'm asking that because I love that stuff I love hearing the what ifs like what did you almost get this project that like famously never happened what was the audition I love listening to that that's why I'm asking it's not for clickbait I swear to god yeah you're coming from a genuine place and that's why you get the answers because I would argue because if someone is fishing for something for that they can detect that and they're not going to give it to you dude the body language is everything like if you want to sit across from somebody and have a genuine conversation and you're coming from a real place that person knows it and they want to come from a real place as well that's and i think that's the key in my opinion like you have to come at it from an actual genuine place of curiosity and then that Will, people love people who are passionate.

31:37One of the best comments I ever got on anything I ever did was I don't even watch any of the films you talk about, I just like watching you talk to people about their passions. I see that, I get that. That's interesting. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember being in a Q &A event and this woman came up to me afterwards and she's like, I haven't seen any of the films that you guys were just talking about, but I was blown away by the conversation. I'm like, that's interesting to me. I'm like, why would that be interesting to somebody they haven't seen the films. It's because there are people talking about things they love.

32:08I want to hear about, because we've talked, before this, it's funny, we came up with like 25 different topics. We're going to get to like three of them. We're not going to have enough time. But like looking ahead, because we always like to geek out about movies and filmmakers and actors and stuff. Should we talk a little bit about just like the dreams, the ones that we're still chasing, the ones that we try to manifest for each other this year? Let's do a manifesting of a moment here, a moment of gratitude and manifestation. I'm very grateful for everybody I've had. I was, because you were asking me like, oh, let's think about, I like our favorite interviews and like at least the ones for me that I think of like are the filmmakers I grew up loving like yourself.

32:41I'm sure it's like for me, like we both had a lot of Tarantino time. Tarantino, very meaningful for me. No one meaningful for both of us. I think this year. Yes. Spielberg has to be like one of the one of the top seeds because it's interesting. Like in this year we have new Spielberg, new Nolan. Denis. Denis. Inuritu. Fincher. Fincher. Yeah. So is Fincher your number one? I think Fincher might be my number one. Over Spielberg? I think maybe. Neither have been on the show before. Neither have been. I've interviewed both. Spielberg, very little, like small junkets kind of things. And Fincher, I've done a couple.

33:20Actually, I've moderated a couple things. I like Fincher for a number of reasons. Because I like his films I'm obsessed with, of course, needless to say. But I also like who he is as a human being. he is very dry he's very funny he's dark he's twisted these are things I respond to and that's one thing like you're talking about me being like versed in the craft Josh has you have a great ability to stay to stick with a comedic and conversational bit going back and forth like I would be afraid to go comedic with David Fincher but you would be amazing on craft level so our two Finchers would be way different and both amazing because you would go so hardcore on craft like tell me about the score in this shot and the color grading in this scene.

34:04I couldn't keep up with the dry humor. I just wouldn't be able to do it. Yeah, and I would be joking about the what's in the box and all the crazy dark stuff. Oh, yeah, and the gloves and the killer. Yeah, all that stuff. But yeah, Fincher is definitely my vibe. He's one of my spirit animals, and I just obsess with his work. Hypothetical. Yeah. Someone comes to you, you have an hour with Spielberg, hour with Fincher, and you have to choose. Yeah, I don't know. Here's the concern on Fincher. Have we talked about this? He infamously did Marc Maron, and never let Marc Maron run the episode. Are you serious?

34:40Which is so Fincher. Yeah. Because he's so meticulous, he's so control driven. So I would have fear that I would do Fincher, and then he would be like, cut all this out, never run it. So maybe I go with Spielberg then. Because of course, I mean, we're all children of Spielberg. I mean, where do you - Where do you start? Where do you start? Where do you even start? I had Macaulay Culkin on the show a couple months ago, and I only got through half of his life. And I was like, and then to think of - You didn't get to Richie Rich? No, Richie Rich was where we got to, because after Richie Rich, he stopped acting and went back to high school.

35:13Oh, so you didn't get to like 54 maybe and other stuff later on. Like Party Monster, I didn't get to Saved. But thinking of that - Was it Party Monster, not 54? I think that got him confused. I think it's Party Monster. They came out at the same time, yeah, yeah, yeah. But Spielberg, yeah, where would you even begin? Because I guess you would have to like, okay, where's my focus? because so Disclosure Day is his movie that's coming out this year. It's a universal film. It's a UFO film. So clearly. You do that. Right. That's what you would do. You connect it there because that's going to be a big part of the conversation.

35:40Yeah. But yeah, he would be a dream. You've interviewed him, I know, a couple times too. He's the one that you're short to. Dude, my Spielberg story is insane. I'll keep it brief. But back in 2011, he was releasing Tintin and War Horse. Yeah, I did that junkie. Yeah, yeah. Right. in New York. And he was shooting Lincoln in Richmond, I believe. And I think he was coming up to New York on the weekends to promote War Horse and Tintin. So I got him two weeks in a row. I got him four minutes for War Horse, four minutes for Tintin. And then I've been lucky to get him over the years. I got him for The Post.

36:18I got him for Ready Player One. I got him for The Fablemans. I've been extremely lucky. But the first time I sat down with him, I wrote 17 questions for a four minute conversation right i got to three when the interview ended uh we stood up and took a photo and i remember we took four pictures because the lighting wasn't right he was essentially directing the guy in the room right in a way to like we get the best looking photo but yeah him and i weirdly had a interestingly cool connection like he was telling me he wanted me to make a short film i did make a short film i sent it to him it was a really interesting whole full circle but to get him on the podcast would be remarkable.

37:01So Fincher aside, is he your number one this year? I guess so. I haven't thought about it. I mean, I only thought about it because we were texting about this recently. I guess he's probably top of the list because I've done Denis a couple times. I've done Nolan a few times. Dude. We're both going to do Nolan. It's going to happen, obviously. When Josh calls Nolan Chris, I'm like, I couldn't do that. Oh, yeah. So, yeah, for context, a couple times in the interviews, sometimes this is a real thing. This is really funny. Like, what do you call the person? I say Mr. Nolan. And I know you and, like, Jake is always – and I saw our friend Jake Hamilton is always, like, very deferential, Mr.

37:32This, Mr. That. And that's part of, like, his southern, like, you know, thing. But I don't – it would be very rare for me to just call somebody Mr. And maybe I'm a jerk that way. No, it's funny. You actually – dude, you pull it off. I can't pull off calling him Chris. I just can't. Right. I can't do it. It's not my – it's – It's funny. I've had success with that kind of ingratiating, maybe overly so thing a couple times. I think, because it made me just think of when you said that, there's a moment in one of the Gary Oldman things I did, I've done a couple events with him, and he's just, oh my God, talk about the best, amazing.

38:05And he, at one point he was talking about not being proud of his Harry Potter performance, and the entire audience was like, ooh. And I literally interrupted him, like, Gary, are you kidding me? Like something like that. And the fact that I was saying that, like I grew up, I was talking about people I was obsessed with growing up. Like I memorized like the script for Bram Stoker's Dracula as a kid. The shadow work in that film to this day, I would love to geek out with him about how he filmed the shadows. Oh yeah. Coppola was a huge, I did Coppola last year. And that was, For Megalopolis. That was a bucket list.

38:39Or two years ago. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's funny, like you find the right moments to do it. And what I'm referring to is you were interviewing Christopher Nolan for Oppenheimer. Yes. And I think you were talking about Bond or something. And you're like, come on, Chris, or whatever it was. But it was so funny. And I'm like, I could never get away with that. I do take pride in, again, because people, I'm sure they ask you all the time, like interview techniques. And I have my own approach and things I think are valuable. For instance, people always ask me, how do you prep? What's most important?

39:09I always say questions are important. Listening is way more important. Anybody can read a good question listening and responding and being in the moment. And what you're talking about is a good example of that is like being able to interject and even interrupt sometimes and call somebody out and say like, Chris, Gary, and like get them to kind of like respond to me responding to them often will elicit, I think, the best response. 100%. I mean, it's awesome to see because it really kind of grounds the moment. Yeah, it's an interaction. Interviews are high stakes in a way, right? And I think you cut through that with having a bit of a comfortability with saying that.

39:46Because you're not saying it disrespectfully. I hope not. You're saying it. It's not meant that way. No, it's funny. It's like, come on. Come on. We're just hanging out here. It's just funny. Yes. And so it's cool. So prep, though, is interesting because you and I probably prep similarly. But again, like you said, it's guest to guest to guest. Yes. So you're prepping for Jennifer Lawrence right now. And you're prepping for Hiddleston. Hiddleston. And so those are two people you've talked to a lot before. What do you do when you've basically asked somebody everything? That's such a good question because I'm literally in the middle of that with Hiddleston.

40:17I have done Hiddleston. This is going to be, I think, a sixth time. Or Sam from Outlander. Sam Heughan. Same kind of thing. Oh, my God. What's left? What else do you have to ask him? It's crazy. So what do you do? I'm not at a point yet where I've had enough guests repeat because I'm just starting. But when you have someone back on for a longer form chat, obviously their new project becomes. New project will eat up some of the time. it's challenging I'm not gonna lie I mean like Hiddleston luckily is a talker so I don't need to give him that much but you can play with Hiddleston too because you know him I do know him and I can play with him and we can riff about his return to like Avengers he's only gonna say so much I can do that kind of thing and that becomes funny in itself because you know they can't answer it and you try to play with it that way I also like you know to your point about like finding a format finding repeatable like what your way in into the podcast is like I know you've been like you know repeating questions which you absolutely have to do, should do, because it gives it some consistency.

41:13But when does it become old for the audience? Like, for example, if you have a repeatable question, like sometimes they'll get a comment going, hey, maybe ease up on that legacy question you're asking. I'm like, yeah, but that's kind of a staple of the show because all the answers are so different. I think if you like it, if you find you're getting different answers, keep at it. There are always going to be people that are going to give you crap. I get that. So I do like the profoundly random questions, which I'm going to give you before we end this. I'm going to give you a few of mine. 30 minutes, yeah.

41:41And I love doing it because it does open up people in different ways, but Hiddleston's done it. And like, you know. Yeah, so what do you do? You don't do it again, do you? I sometimes will swap something in. I'm actually toying with the idea, maybe if we have time I'll try this out on you. I'm toying with the idea of swapping out profoundly random questions, at least for repeated guests, with a new kind of more movie-centric, don't worry it's not similar to your stuff but it's a similar movie rapid fire thing that kind of like gauges people's like this or that kind of thing? yeah a little bit so I might try that on Tom yeah it's just trying stuff out I have kind of a mini game thing that I might try on him yeah it's just but that's kind of the most challenging I find yes you have the benefit of knowing the guest knows you they'll be comfortable but there is yeah you can't do the same stories although on the other hand it's I find I'm my own worst critic where like I don't know if you find this approaching an interview I research so much and I listen to so many interviews and I don't want to hear the same stories but sometimes your audience doesn't know those stories they don't and they generally don't they really don't and that's okay and honestly and that's what's interesting and I struggle with this too because I don't set out to ask different things I set out to ask things I want to know the answers to.

43:09But if the guest has answered something similar before, I still want to know. And like I had Matthew Lillard in here recently, and I'm sure he's told the Scream story a million times, but I wanted to know. Or Park Chan-wook dissecting the hallway sequence. Exactly. But you have to, because you care about that, and I want to hear him talk about that on your show. Or Macaulay Culkin. Like, you know how many times he's talked about Home Alone? Right. I'm still going to ask him. And that becomes interesting. My wife was really the help in this. She's like, Kevin, not everybody listens to every single interview out there.

43:41100%. I remind myself of that all the time. If you happen to have a similar question and you want to get a story from somebody, then ask it. It's hard because you don't want the repeated answers. And we both know this. For people who've watched Press Junkett interviews before, a lot of actors have canned answers. And things that they're saying on the press tour that speak to the film. and you obviously want to get around that and get the person to open up further than that but sometimes you're just going to get if there's a crazy story that happened on that set and you have that guest in studio and that story's already been out there and you want them to expand on it I've also learned this a lot from and I know you do a lot more of this recently which is moderating which is what I do too and those kind of events you are there to service their story their basic story and again for the audience like I don't want the audience to I don't want to assume the audience knows everything I know because I'm the 1 % that knows everything about it.

44:42And that's the biggest problem that we can have. We are so inundated with material and information that the audience like I was I ran into a buddy of mine the other day I was walking my dog and I was hey I'm having Cynthia Erivo on my show have you heard about this cool thing she does with perfumes? He goes no what do you mean? He goes oh yeah so she was shooting Wicked 1 and 2 and she had different perfumes for each movie so she could figure out where she was in the arc I'm like he goes I know that he goes oh I didn't know that I'm like oh I probably should re-ask her that because my audience might not know that she does that and I was like okay but maybe she's already spoken about it in different places but I'm like you know what the answer she's going to give me is going to be different and it's also coming from a place like I just want to know why and how she does it you know what I mean and it's the beauty of long form it's like you have time So you can have some of that stuff in there.

45:31When I did my Duffer Brothers spoiler conversation, I had already read a bunch of spoiler interviews they did the day before, and they talked a lot about the final scene in the basement and how it was done. And I was like, I haven't seen them do it on camera. I haven't heard it for myself. It's a very important scene to the show. I'm going to spend three minutes on that. And you want to know. I want to know. Exactly. And I think that's the key. Every single question you and I ever ask on our show is because we want to know the answers to it. And that kind of goes back to that. But it is fascinating because you're right.

46:01It's like we have to also think about our audience. Because we're an authority in a way, I guess, if you want to use that word. We're hopefully, they're coming to us to learn and meet people at a different level than a normal press junket interview or a normal television interview. And our job is to present that person in that way. Because I really feel like, and I would agree with you, I'm sure you'd agree with me, the person comes out more in a podcast. 100%. Not that the person's not there in the shorter form interview, but it's much more - You can hide behind the canned answers way more easily in a six-minute interview than - Something, generally speaking, the real person will emerge at least partially through 45 minutes or an hour.

46:44When do you start hitting a flow? Yeah, that depends on the guest and the history and everything, right? Sometimes they can hit the ground running, but I noticed this again. I was listening to the Tougher Brothers back, and I was like, okay, about 10 minutes in, they relaxed, and we're kind of like, okay. Sometimes it's 30 minutes in. Sure. Like I'll be in an hour conversation and I'll start to feel the flow. The flow, you know what it feels like. It's like you're just in tune. Yeah. You're in tune with each other. And you can feel their shoulders come down and they're just like, okay, this person knows what they're talking about.

47:16I'm safe. I can be a little bit more open. And that can happen even with somebody you already know. It's just like, you know, it's just any kind of conversation. the length will be your best advantage. And I think that's why people respond so well to podcasts. More Happy, Say, Confused coming up.

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48:37One of the big questions I get a lot, and I had to navigate this early on, is what if you don't like the project that you're interviewing the person for? My argument to that was always, I can still find things that I want to talk about. and I've been in plenty of situations where I've walked into a room, I didn't like the person's film. I don't sit there and go, I didn't like your movie. You sit down and you have a professional conversation about the craft of what that movie did. So even if I don't like a film, I can go, hey, that score was great. That shot was incredible. The editing was great.

49:09That performance was good. Maybe the movie didn't work overall for me, but I can still find ways to ask about it and be respectful of the artist because I find that to be a different thing. Film criticism and interviewing are two different things. But ethically, for me, since I started off as a film reviewer, my movie reviews always had to be separate from the interview. You must feel such a relief that you don't have to do that anymore. Not anymore. But there was a lot of times where I would interview a cast and I have to come home and then, you know, the review, I would give a bad review to the film.

49:40And I don't like giving, you know, I don't like saying negative things about anybody's art because I feel like everybody struggles to make their art and a lot of work goes into what that art is. And I try to find a happy medium. But to me, those two were always separate. I never let the interview affect my review. But now I'm in a place where I'm just doing interviews. But it's also tricky, though, and we've talked about this, is we know a lot of people now. We've been doing this a while. And the lines get a little blurry where, like, you know, bro, wouldn't you consider a friend? There are people that I consider friends and people that I interact with or text with a little bit.

50:15And it is, like, you do want to maintain. I actually really hesitate. I hate calling myself a journalist. I don't think I'm a journalist. I have too much respect for the profession of journalism. You're a journalist. Maybe or maybe not. I think we're in a hybrid state of journalism, I guess. Everything is murky. I certainly don't consider myself, not that there's anything wrong with it, an influencer. I don't consider – I hate the term content creator. I'm a host. I'm an interviewer and host. And I do think I pride myself on authenticity as we've discussed. And I do feel like I have found my way in to giving folks the truth about projects and speaking truth to their careers more than 99 % of folks in the business.

50:57Meaning like I will – and it's funny because sometimes you'll get – I read the comments too much like we all do. But like sometimes people will say like, oh, they should have asked this question. They should have like said this or that. I'm like, you don't know how, it's just not appropriate or polite to be rude to somebody about a past, something in their career. That being said, I'm not afraid to, again, depending on the comfort level, give them some crap about every interview I've had with Will Arnett, I will bring up Jonah Hex and Brolin too. But Brolin, those actors that are in Jonah Hex have publicly talked about how bad the film is.

51:33Yes, and again, it's like a feel for it. How much do I know the person? How much do I know a sense of humor they have? I love the opportunities to be able to like ask like Dakota Johnson and City Sweeney about Madam Web. Like, you know, it's, it's tricky and you caught it still have to be respectful, but like even being able to poke a little bit in a respectful way. But if you're interviewing Dakota for Madam Web, no, of course I would never, that's a very different situation because like you're not going to sit there and poke fun at it. You're going to have a conversation. And I did do, I did Dakota for Madam Web.

52:02And certainly I'd never came on there and said, what a masterpiece. You killed it. she also had admitted she had not seen the movie when we did the interview so the writing was on the wall um but i found ways in to as you say talk about things you know production around the film um other aspects as opposed to saying like starting at a baseline of like you did it again yeah well like privately like you and i we know a lot of actors and filmmakers privately i've had discussions with actors off mic and off camera about films that i didn't like of theirs and And that's a completely normal conversation because when we meet in the middle on that way, I'm assuming you've been in the same boat as well.

52:41Yeah. Wait, before the time gets, can I test my new movie? Yes. Q &A on you and I'll do the PR, the profoundly random questions. We call it PRQ in the business. Let's do this. I wanna try my new questions on you because you're my guinea pig, okay? Okay. Let's do this. Okay, so this is, I'm calling this for now, the Happy Say I Confused Movie Matrix. And by the way, this is one of my pet peeves is somebody reading their questions off an iPad or a phone. if you do it in the business it's okay I just hate it I went to the Laugh Factory the other day to see a comedy set and Nikki Glaser got up on stage and did her Golden Globes speech that she's going to do next Sunday and she was reading it off the phone but she was doing it because the jokes were just freshly written, she was testing them to the audience and she killed it, you told me?

53:23she killed it, so good alright wait, now I've lost it, give me one second editing, editing, okay here we go alright, the movie no that's the wrong document I'm so sorry Kevin No don't worry about it Okay The Happy Say Confused Movie Matrix The first victim is Kevin McCarthy This is huge Alien or Aliens Aliens Me too I'm a Cameron guy Yeah But I also All respect to Alien Yeah Aliens I would argue Is the greatest action movie Along with T2 T2 Never made T2 is my favorite movie Of all time But it's interesting Most people would say Alien A lot of people would But You're Aliens too I'm totally Aliens Oh hell yeah who's the best Spider-Man of all time?

54:04Peter Parker or Spider-Man? No, meeting, oh, I see. Ooh, you've already found a wrinkle. Because I feel like when it comes to Batman, for example, I think Bale is the best Bruce Wayne of all time, but I think Keaton's the best Batman. Oh, I thought you were an Affleck guy. You like that fight. You like that BBS fight, I know. You're right, I do love Affleck. Yeah, anyways, all right, Spider-Man. I'm going to go with Tom Holland. Okay. What's the best comic book movie of all time? Dark Knight. Who's your favorite James Bond?

54:42It's tough because I think the best Bond movie I've ever seen is Skyfall. Is it Connery or Craig? It's got to be Connery, but I prefer Craig and Pierce Brosnan's films. Pierce Brosnan's films? GoldenEye is one of my favorites. GoldenEye is a good one. GoldenEye is like top Bond for me, but I think Connery is the best actor to ever play Bond. He certainly set the mold. Scariest movie ever made? Sinister or The Shining. Good ones. What's the funniest movie ever made? Either Blues Brothers or Dumb and Dumber. What's a movie you can quote backwards and forwards? I know you can do a lot, but what's the one that comes to mind?

55:27that you Terminator 2 and Interstellar and you're the wrong person because there are too many a lot of them yeah and finally what's your go-to movie theater snack milk duds an icy mixed with blue and red popcorn buttered middle way through first and then more on top and then depending on my mood nachos with an extra cheese or a hot dog with just mustard how are you alive do you still do Every day. When's the last day? It's my breakfast. I'm not joking. That's once a week. I hate your metabolism. My cholesterol is not loving me right now. Wait, so what's your movie snack? My movie snack is, see, I should answer this for myself.

56:10Yeah, it's a good idea. I'm pretty basic. I'm a Diet Coke, sorry, a Diet Cherry Coke. Cherry Coke zero, whatever you want. And I'm Red Vines over Twizzlers. Okay, so I've just really started my journey with Red Vines. It's a journey. Because we're in L.A. and I go to the New Bev a lot and the Vista. And Quentin's theaters have a lot of older candies. And like, do you remember Goober's? Sure. Oh, I miss Goober's. Is there peanut involved though? Yeah. Yeah, you're a peanut allergy. No, I don't have a peanut allergy. But I never used to, growing up, I hated chocolate and peanut butter. Now I could live on it.

56:45But yeah, it was a thing. All right, let me ask you some questions. Yeah, go for it. Okay, so a movie you would love to rewatch again for the first time. The memory is gone. So this is an interesting question because the memory, I understand where you may have seen it, who you may have been with. So put that aside and you get to watch the film not knowing anything about it again for the first time. Two come to mind. Maybe this has come up with guests already. Matrix? That's like the biggest standard answer I get. It was so mind-blowing. It was like no one had seen anything like it. I mean, I was 14.

57:19Yeah. And I remember where I was with my dad, my uncle, my brother. Yeah. I remember we went to Pizzeria Uno afterwards, and I was telling my dad, I'm like, I'm buying that movie. He goes, no, you're not, it's rated R, Kevin, or 14. Do you remember where you were? I do remember, it was, I think it was Lowe's 84th Street on the Upper West Side with my brother. Wow. Most of my movie memories growing up were with my brother, my older brother. The other one that comes to mind is a much different kind of movie, but I know I'm sure you love it too, speaking of Fincher. I'd love to see Seven again for the first time.

57:48Yeah. Because it was so shocking. Yeah. That ending is still one of the best, most shocking endings ever. And I think just to experience the visceral, I mean, constant surprises and edge of your seat, John Doe coming out of nowhere. Yeah, I think that would be remarkable to see again with no knowledge. And Seven's also an interesting movie in terms of not showing the violence. Until the ending, you don't see any of the kills. That's all the aftermath. and that's why I always felt like the lust scene was so effective because it's so horrifying to hear the character explain what happened. Like hyperventilating?

58:28Oh, it's worse than what Fincher could have shown us. Favorite shot in cinema history? Oh my gosh, favorite shot, Kevin. Oh no. What comes to mind? I mean, the first thing that comes to mind is Return of the Jedi. When Luke kind of comes out with the lightsaber, like Vader's taunting him, and it comes out, and those lightsabers clash in the darkness. Iconic. Iconic. Right? I just got chills just talking about it. Dude, have you ever seen the Revenge of the Jedi poster? Of course. Where it's like the lightsabers or the colors are switched. I think that's the shot. I ruined, speaking of my brother in childhood, we had the comic novelization of Return of the Jedi before we saw it.

59:24And I read it. I was seven years old and I ruined the ending. I remember screaming out to my brother when I was reading the comic book. I'm like, Darth Vader turns good. And he like wailed on me. He was so angry. Can you imagine if that happened during the social media at times? That would have been everywhere. I know. I know. So, okay, that then brings up an interesting conversation then because I want to do some hot takes here. Okay. Because I weirdly like a lot of the third films in trilogies. Right. So, personally, Return of the Jedi is my favorite Star Wars film. And I don't know, I know, I know, but I don't know if this is an age thing.

1:00:00I found films sometimes at three. So, Die Hard 3 I saw before Die Hard 1 and 2. Right. I saw Back to the Future 3 before I saw 1 and 2. It's been very confusing. Very confusing. But I love Doc's love story. A lot of the threes have become my favorites over the years. So I'm a Return of the King guy. I love Last Crusade. I love Return of the Jedi. I love, you know, so I'm curious, not Godfather 3, but I do love the Coda cut. But I mean, like, where are you a three guy on any of those? As you went down that list, there would be none of those that I would defend as better than the... I thought we were going to be closer because you said aliens.

1:00:38I was like, okay, that's two over one. Yeah, and I'm a defender of Alien 3. Speaking of, again, Fincher. I love Alien 3, man. Come on. I don't understand the hate for that film. You know our guy, Nolan, told me, loves Alien 3. It's true. We like it more than Fincher does apparently. Definitely. Yeah, yeah. Definitely. Again, I would have to bring that up with Fincher, and he would immediately end the interview probably. But then that goes back to what we were saying earlier. It's like, how many times has Fincher talked about what's in the box? Right. How would you not ask that question? Right.

1:01:04Of course you're going to bring that up. No, but going through this, I mean, look, I would say I love Back to the Future 3. Great. One is by far the best. Last Crusade. I've had this argument, I think, with my wife, actually, and others. I love Last Crusade. Don't get me wrong. Raiders is a perfect movie. Temple of Doom, actually, I think, is remarkable. Culturally a little problematic nowadays, but still the opening sequence, arguably the best sequence. Yes, of any indie film. I think that's the best opening of the whole franchise. Fantastic. Okay, all right. Are you at least with me on Return of the Jedi being the best opening?

1:01:38Return of the Jedi being the best opening? Of the three. Yeah, maybe I could do that. Okay. Maybe I could do that. Thank you. Thanks for coming over to my side on that one. I appreciate that. Return of the King, good. I'm not the biggest. I mean, I love War of the Rings, but I can't claim to be an expert. I think I'm a fellowship guy. I think it set it all up. You like the ones. You're a one guy. I'm a one guy. I like setting up the world, I think. T2 or T1? T2. I mean, I love Terminator, but you have to kind of accept it for what it is, right? It was an amazing B movie he did, essentially. But T2, he had all the tools.

1:02:11I mean, T2 was a game changer. That's one I vividly remember seeing for the first time. I know this is your bread and butter. That's the movie for you. But yeah, same for me. That rocked my world. Is that your pivotal opening? I open my show every time by asking somebody the pivotal film that gave them the understanding of the communal experience, mostly in the theater capacity. So do you have a theater experience as a kid that meant a lot to you? And then do you have a film that opened up your world of movies for you? I mean, I have such vivid... I went to the movies all the time as a kid. Like I said, my older brother, Adam, took me to the movies all the time.

1:02:47Who's a writer. Who's a writer. He wrote on Lost and created Once Upon a Time, co-created that. And yeah, I have so many vivid memories. I mean, it's funny. We keep returning to the same films. But seeing Return of the Jedi on opening day, I will always remember. I remember I dropped the big thing of popcorn and my grandmother got really upset with me. I remember that. Isn't that crazy how vivid that memory is? I remember seeing the trailer for Return of the Jedi, 1983, May 25th, I think, was the opening day. Yeah, I mean, I remember, I mean, you have so many memories. I mean, the first movie I remember seeing in a theater is Time Bandits, the Terry Gilliam movie, which is so effed up.

1:03:26The end of that movie is, like, so dark. And I love Terry Gilliam. And that was a huge one for me to talk to him on the podcast. Yes, so, so many. I mean, I remember the first time, this actually wasn't even a theater, but I remember the double VHS tapes of Godfather and Godfather II and discovering those for the first time. And that was definitely an eye-opening moment of like, oh, I need to see everything by this filmmaker. This is clearly cinema, whatever that means. Were you a blockbuster kid? I was a blockbuster kid. Certainly, blockbuster over West Coast Video wasn't around, or like Tower Video was a big one in New York and I used to rent movies to such a degree that I was really bad at returning them on time and I racked up so many late fees that my parents were ready to send me to military academy.

1:04:15It was insane how bad I was. Yeah. What's your favorite movie of all time? I don't really have a go-to. Have you ever answered this? No, I don't have my go-to. I mean, honestly, like T2. You don't have a T2? T2 and Aliens are kind of like my twin greatest action movies of all time. My favorite comedy of all time, I would say, is Young Frankenstein, the Mel Brooks movie. Made a huge impact and I still think it's the funniest movie ever made. Love and Death by Woody Allen, problematic as he is, was a big one for me. Yeah, I mean, I could rack up so many. Like De Palma was huge for me growing up.

1:04:48All of his films, blow that's amazing. Untouchables, I actually really love. I saw that when I was like 11. then, yeah, The Godfather's Needless to Say, Empire Strikes Back, PTA, Magnolia rocked my world. Magnolia's my favorite of his. Yeah. Oh, that's your favorite PTA. Okay. Let's get into some hot take territory here. I'm a Phantom Thread guy. I love Phantom Thread. Don't get me wrong. I also love licorice pizza. And I know that's the one that people generally don't love as much. No, Inherit Vice is the one that's... Yeah. I'm not big on Inherit Vice. No. but I actually personally need to give it another try.

1:05:25I only saw it once. Where are you on one battle? Well, that's like top tier. Top tier. Are you a Phantom Thread guy? Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I'm not like as much, I know there's the master obsessives. It's such a weird tone and so kind of enigmatic and it's just a hard, it's not a fun, not that movies have to be fun. I wouldn't say Magnolia's a fun watch, but I don't know. It's a tough one for me. I respect it. I love it. there'll be blood is a masterpiece of course i would put there'll be blood magnolia at top tier maybe one battle i need to give it like a year or two before i assess because it's like you know tarantino front like once upon a time and i think actually we share this i remember you talked about this it took me a minute to realize how amazing three times i mean i loved it from the start but like it's top tier it's it's it might be his masterpiece it's up there with inglorious for me I think it's his masterpiece.

1:06:16I mean, I saw it twice on 35 and then once on 70, and the 70 mil experience changed everything for me. Number one, Fincher's seven for you. Yeah, I think so. I might have to go with, I think Zodiac is the best movie he's ever made, but I'll never see it ever again. I saw it recently. A friend of mine rented out a theater, and we watched it on the big screen, and it was fantastic. The beach scene is, I can't get it. I know. I can't watch that scene. Again, it's not, I'm kind of with you on Zodiac. I think it's like arguably his masterpiece. It's epic in so many different ways. It's not like, I wouldn't say it's like a satisfying, Seven, it's weird to say Seven is satisfying, but Seven is such like an elegantly made, perfect construction for me.

1:07:02I find it so, I often talk about movies that where I feel like satisfied. They're full meals. Like everything is like tied up. That's why Nolan films are so, they're so satisfying. He returns to the theme at the end. And he knows how to just set you out on the, like walking out of the theater feeling like, oh, drop the mic. He just like, end of Dark Knight, Dark Knight Rises, all his films, like, yeah. I saw Oppenheimer 10 times. And that's not a, that is a heavy film. What movie have you seen the most in a theater? Probably Oppenheimer. Yeah. What about you? I think mine is The Phantom Menace.

1:07:37I think I saw Phantom Menace like 20, 25 times. Dude, there are some really good scenes in that film. I'll defend it. I don't mind defending the pod race is amazing. Listen, there's things in that film I don't love, but you also have to give credit to the ambition. Oh, my God. It's an ambitious film. I always say, people are probably sick of me using this phrase on the podcast, big swings. I need a big swing. I don't care about the doubles. I want the home runs. That's why I like the cloud atlases of the world. Fury Road was wild and insane, and it worked. When they work, so satisfying. I'm glad it happened.

1:08:14Yes. George Miller, by the way, that's a big one for me. He's done The Pod a couple times, and I think that guy's brain is just like another level. I mean, he's incredible. Isn't he in his 80s? Probably by now, yeah. Like, who else is like, I was trying to think of some filmmakers, because there's that famous quote from Tarantino about stopping after 10 films, and then you see certain filmmakers who are obviously excelling way later in their lives as well. I mean, Ridley's still killing it, but Ridley's still hit and miss. Which number one Ridley? Oh, good question. maybe Blade Runner yeah I think it what do you think it has to be Blade Runner has to be or Gladiator but I feel like that's too easy of an answer I love Gladiator but I was never like a huge Gladiator guy to be honest Blade Runner maybe it's Alien Alien's pretty great number one Nolan number one Nolan I think I would do Dark Knight Interstellar a little basic I'm not an Interstellar I like again I like it I know you have the tattoo that's the end of our podcast I know I know Interstellar is like...

1:09:12You've got the Ewok tattoo and the Interstellar tattoo. Jabba the Hutt just sitting on my chest right here. Wait, I promised you the profoundly random questions. Yes, yes. Do we have time? Yeah, let's do this. Okay, we're right here. Okay, let's do it. Josh and I are up against the clock because we have to get to an award show, which sounds insane to even say. We have to go to the Critics' Choice Awards and hang out with Leonardo DiCaprio. I have to change that in my Big Trouble in Little China shirt. Is that what I'm wearing? No, Buckaroo Banzai today. Okay. Buckaroo Banzai. That's a good one, man.

1:09:40I'm not going to talk about a movie that rocked my world. I just think I was eight or nine. Dogs or cats? Dogs. I love cats, though, but my mom is allergic to cats. I never had cats growing up, so dogs is my default. And I love my dog, Murphy, and you love your dog as well. Lucy's the best. What do you collect, Kevin? Movie ticket stubs. What's your favorite video game of all time? Either Donkey Kong for 64 or Mario Kart 64. Classic. Street Fighter 2 Turbo 2. This is the Dakota Johnson Memorial question. She asked me this. I will ask you, would you rather have a mouthful of bees or one bee in your butt?

1:10:20Oh, my gosh. Probably the butt because more bees makes me nervous. And I got stung 15 times when I was a kid when I was mowing the lawn. At once? Yes, at one time. So you have history. So just give me one bee. I get it. Where are you on that? I'm with you. One bee in the butt. Get it over with. What's the wallpaper on your phone? My wife and I and my dog. Yours? Oh, it's Lucy. There you go. Last actor you were mistaken for. Do you ever get mistaken for anybody? Okay, I don't understand this. People say Bradley Cooper. I don't see it at all. Someone said the other day I look like Bradley Cooper and John Grzynski together.

1:10:57Like a Brundlefly? Yeah. Like a combo? Oh, that's a movie. We could talk about The Fly. That's a perfect movie for me. Cronenberg. What's your mistaken actor for you? I was mistaken for you recently. I told you that. You went with it, didn't you? Yeah.

1:11:13Someone complimented me on my scoop with Sean Levy getting Thomas Newman doing the score. But the funny thing is there was a preamble. He was like, oh, I'm such a fan of your work. You're amazing. I'm like, yeah. Oh, yeah, I'm playing it off like great, great, great. He's like, you know, and that recent, the Sean Levy. Because you were past the point of no return. You couldn't tell him then that it wasn't me. That's great. Oh, that's good, good. I guess I can't do worst note a director has ever given you, so we'll skip that. In honor of Happy Second Fuse, who's an actor who always makes you happy.

1:11:44Jim Carrey. Movie that makes you sad. Marley and Me, which I will never watch again. Do you remember how they marketed Marley and Me? It was like a Christmas movie. They buried the lead-based, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm like, what? Yeah, it's cruel. Yeah. And a food that makes you confused. Brussels sprouts. Oh, really? Yeah, what about you? What's a food that makes you confused? I have a bunch. I always say beats. Anything beat related ruins the whole experience for me. Huh. Okay. And then, wait, I have a couple other things. We have to get out of here. Okay, all good. Let me think here. There's a couple other things I want to ask you.

1:12:19Movie you've watched the most in your life. It's probably Phantom Menace. It's probably, again, like growing up like a big old nerd of like Star Wars and Star Trek. Like I went to sci-fi conventions. like just the sheer volume of like Star Trek in my brain. I've seen all those movies, all Star Wars and Star Trek like way too many times. Rathacon is the best Trek movie, right? There's no question on that, right? Yeah, I would say so. So you're a two over one guy on that one. Three's good, but not, yeah, Search for Spock, okay. Did Nimoy direct three? Yeah, and four. Let's not go on Final Frontier with Shatner.

1:12:55Not great. As we reach the end here, let's put this out into the world so we touched this a little bit in the beginning the dream guest for 2026 we're manifesting you have to choose the one I think we should do different ones so you're Spielberg I'm gonna go Nolan you're getting Nolan you don't need to I never assume I never assume I'm getting anybody I have been to the theater to watch the prologue four times Christopher Nolan is my favorite filmmaker ever and like to think that he could possibly sit here on my show. I obviously did a show prior to this called Real Blend. We did have him on for that.

1:13:34I've sat down with Christopher Nolan before in press junket situations, but I can't fathom him sitting here for my show. So I'm not going to say it's going to happen. I'm hoping it happens. That's my number one. He's going to be sitting in this seat with a 64-ounce mug of tea. And I'm going to be crying. You're going to be crying. Yeah. You have to choose. I mean, I don't think it'll happen because, like I said, if he killed the Marin one, it's not going to happen. But I might as well shoot for the stars. Let's make Fincher happen. And it's for, for folks who don't know, he's directed this Tarantino script, this Cliff Booth movie.

1:14:11Yeah, and it's apparently like an episode. I am tight with Netflix takes good care of me. It's a Netflix movie. It might help. Okay, so Netflix called you right now. They say, Josh, you're confirmed for Fincher. what's the first thing you do to prepare? He's one that I might like do a rewatch of virtually everything. I mean, he's worth it. Like, what a joyous assignment to rewatch all his movies. I love the game. Game's so good. I've been searching for years. Well, I've done this. We're over. But like, I've been searching for years. I love the T-shirt that Sean Penn brings out at the end. Do you know what I'm talking about?

1:14:49Yes, yes. I was left for dead in Mexico and all I got was this lousy T-shirt. Now that I got the cruise cake, I want that T-shirt in my life. Wait, okay, we can't get out of here without discussing the cruise cake. So hold on, so Josh has been so passionate about getting this cruise cake. Sad is another word. I was on the carpet with him in New York for the last mission where you made the pitch. That was, by the way, a last minute idea. That was not planned. I'm very proud of myself in a sad way. Yes, for context, like yourself, We've covered a lot of mission premieres. We've gotten a chance to interview Tom a lot.

1:15:24He's so gracious with his time on carpets. Usually carpet interviews are like 10 seconds. He actually gives a decent amount of time. I've hosted, been very privileged, I hosted the world premiere of Top Gun Maverick. I hosted the world premiere of Dead Reckoning, part one at the time, no longer part one. And Tom just landed in a helicopter on an aircraft carrier from Top Gun and then went right over to Josh. Insane. It was unbelievable. So I have history with Tom. He probably would recognize me to a degree. I wouldn't say I'm besties with him. And I've been joking for years, the famous Tom Cruise cake, for those that don't know, he gifts many people in his life, friends, colleagues, et cetera, a holiday chocolate coconut, white chocolate coconut cake every holiday season.

1:16:07And I'm like, I've hosted two world premieres. I've done him like 15 times. Why am I not on the coconut cake list? Come on. I know a couple of journalists that are. I'm like, come on. So I did. I made my pitch in person at the last premiere on the carpet. And I said, I was very proud of myself again, very impromptu. I said, the only Tom, by the way, as I'm ending the interview, the only thing I love more than Tom Cruise movies are coconut cakes. And he laughed and he goes, that's a good hint. Good hint. And then. Do you think he really remembered? I don't know. I truly don't know. How is that possible?

1:16:38I don't know how he got my address. I don't know who did it. Wait, you didn't send your address to anybody? It just showed up? Yeah. Kevin. Kevin it was a miracle it was a Christmas miracle wow dreams can come true that's what I'm saying that's mind blowing that's my gift to you in the audience okay well obviously I have tears in my eyes so we have to wrap this up okay we'll do this again we'll figure out more we've been talking about doing this or other things and hopefully we'll do more I love this I'm happy we did it me too I'm sad it's over and I'm confused why you don't love Return of the Jedi so we're gonna go ahead and just end on that I'm gonna destroy your set now yeah I'm going to burn it all down.

1:17:15Thank you, Josh. Thanks, buddy. And so ends another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't pushed to do this by Josh.

1:17:38The war is over and both sides lost. Kingdoms were reduced to cinders and armies scattered like bones in the dust. Now the survivors claw to what's left of a broken world, praying the darkness chooses someone else tonight. But in the shadow dark, the darkness always wins. This is old school adventuring at its most cruel. Your torch ticks down in real time and when that flame dies, something else rises to finish the job. This is a brutal rules-light nightmare with a story that emerges organically based on the decisions that the characters make. This is what it felt like to play RPGs in the 80s, and man, it is so good to be back.

1:18:21Join the Glass Cannon podcast as we plunge into the shadow dark every Thursday night at 8 p.m. Eastern on youtube.com slash the glass cannon with the podcast version dropping the next day. See what everybody's talking about and join us in the dark.

1:18:39Thank you.