What You Need to Know About Executive Recruiting

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1:16Byron Loflin:I'm Alison Beard.

1:18Mark Thompson:And I'm Ad Ignatius, and this is the HBR IdeaCast.

1:28Byron Loflin:Adi, so many of our listeners, many people who read HBR, who go to business school, are or have aspirations to be senior leaders in their organizations. Maybe C-suite, maybe they even want to be CEO someday. And that, of course, means building a resume that will impress a lot of stakeholders. But one increasingly important group is executive recruiters.

1:51Mark Thompson:Look, I co-ran HBR for a long time. And, you know, we're a different organization from a lot of corporate entities out there. But even we bring in executive search firms for the big roles. And, you know, the senior leaders I talk to, these are people who have great skills, great experience. They're politically savvy. They've made all the right career moves. Even they say they need to figure out how in the world to persuade recruiters that they are C-suite material as both internal and external candidates.

2:17Byron Loflin:Yeah, exactly. It's a tricky process. and today's guests say that companies are bringing in search firms more often than ever, in part because it's so hard to discern who is really ready for senior leadership in a business world that's changing so quickly. They need objective, independent advisors to help them not just see what someone has done in their past, but also gauge their potential for growth into the future. And so anybody who wants a senior role has to be ready for the recruiting process.

2:46Mark Thompson:And the process, I assume, means the behavioral interviews, the assessments, the reference checking, all of that.

2:52Byron Loflin:Yes, it is an onerous process, but thankfully we have some experts here to talk us through how to navigate it. Mark Thompson is chairman of the Chief Executive Alliance, and Byron Laughlin is global head of board advisory at NASDAQ. Together, they wrote the HBR article, How to Stand Out to C-Suite Recruiters, as well as the book CEO Ready, What You Need to Know to Earn the Job and Keep the Job. Here's our conversation. So obviously there's a lot that goes into positioning yourself for senior leadership in any organization, but why is understanding the executive recruiting process so important, especially today?

3:27Byron Loflin:Mark, why don't you start?

3:29Mark Thompson:It's changed dramatically, I think, in the last five years, particularly, where they've played a much, much bigger strategic role in vetting the talent internally. And historically, we've always thought about them vetting external talent. And so now that they're involved in the process inside and out of an organization, they are ones that are now curating what some of the criteria are, what the job description might be, how you might be a cultural fit or not, and how relevant your experience might be. So we took it out in the book as something that was a real developmental change at all levels in the organization where the recruiters and the independent assessment firms are playing a bigger role than ever in history.

4:17Mark Thompson:One of the aspects I've observed in working with Mark is connecting the dots between the board, the recruitment firms, and work that folks like Mark do, and how that brings a more holistic approach to the CEO transition process, that it's not just a start and stop, that it's a long-term development process. and having those parties working together interactively, I think is going to, is and probably will continue to deliver, in a sense, a better product or more effective stewardship, particularly by the board as they select their candidate.

4:56Byron Loflin:And so what are CEOs and boards looking for in advice from recruiters? What are the recruiters giving them and telling them about the candidates that they can't see themselves?

5:10Mark Thompson:let's say a board selects one CEO during the lifetime of nine board members. They only get one chance at this with a recruiter. These are excellent recruiters doing a high value, providing a high value service. They're looking at this possibly with as many as 20 to 50 candidates and seeing this prism, being able to pick it up and looking at it to help the board identify. One image I like to use is a Rubik's Cube. I'll take one and I'll hold it up in the middle of a boardroom and I'll say, how many squares can you see? It's half of the 54. If you're on one side of the room, if you're on the other side of the room, you can see the other half of the 54.

5:54Mark Thompson:And so that's an image of the recruiters helping them look at that Rubik's Cube of risk and assessment of this candidate or candidates in a way that they can see more elements than otherwise they would do.

6:09Byron Loflin:Yeah, they just have so much more experience and have seen so many more C-suite candidates over the course of their careers. Do both internal candidates for C-suite roles and external ones need to think as carefully about the recruiting process?

6:25Mark Thompson:Absolutely. It's interesting because the internal candidate may have grown up in the business, would have been someone who has developed so quickly with their expertise. But we also remember how he or she stumbled along the way. Being a part of a leadership pipeline where you get known over a number of years, that should help de-risk the decision-making process about whether you're the right individual. And so you have both the scourge of, in a sense, being known with your history being at the organization. On the other hand, you have the huge advantage and the reason why boards most still predominantly hire the internal candidate is that you have so much context.

7:05Mark Thompson:You have relationships. You can hit the ground running. The external candidate has to now think about that in exactly the inverse way. So she or he is coming into the organization, needs to demonstrate they can hit the ground running and that they can make a definite difference in the business. because for both parties, both internal and external, as I sit there alongside the candidates over and over dozens of times, the one thing that always goes over very, very well is saying that we're at a crossroads as an organization, that we need to embrace and harvest the best of our culture, the best of our products, the best of our services, the great history that we've been able to contribute to being innovative.

7:48Mark Thompson:And at the same time, we have to open another chapter. I have to be the next person who is going to chart a future that makes sense and be able to demonstrate that they've got that clear to them internally and externally. And that's why the internal and external candidates will all be asked to be presenting a strategic plan, and those will be compared rather vigorously. And it's also where a recruiter can be beneficial internally and externally to help evaluate the candidates on an objective basis. Because if the person's high performing, the board's going to tend to be biased towards that internal because, look, they're high performing.

8:26Mark Thompson:But does that mean they're going to be a great CEO for the corporation?

8:30Byron Loflin:When a candidate, a senior leader who has C-suite aspirations, eventually wants to position themselves to become a CEO, when they start interacting with recruiters, interviewing for a particular role, for example, what's the first step in being ready for them? You know, whether you're an external or internal candidate, how should you be thinking about the right way to present yourself? What mindset should you have?

8:55Mark Thompson:So first, I would emphasize learning the board and understanding the company that you're interested in or companies, the sector, and what you're going to bring. So preparing oneself to, one, establish what's their credibility in the market. Two, why will an organization want you to be their leader? Why will they cheer when the day comes when you step up on a podium or in front of a group and they say, this is the person we're looking for? What will that feel like to you? And finding that synergy is one of the essential elements that you want to communicate to the recruiters. How do you stand out differently from your competition in terms of your ability to step into that role?

9:46Mark Thompson:That's where productive paranoia, understanding who you are, self-awareness, courageous humility, these are the kinds of areas that start to stand out. It leads to active listening, the ability to interact with people at a level where they feel authenticity when they're with you. The authenticity ends up being a big point that Byron helps the reality check with the board because they can sniff a person being fake about any part of this process. So it's about digging deeper into the successes and failures that you've had. What you've learned from those changes, it builds so much credibility. Everybody doesn't have a perfect trajectory.

10:28Mark Thompson:They want someone battle-tested, someone who can work well in peacetime and wartime. Those recruiters are really testing for that. That's why they're also using a lot of these independent assessment tools. Then they check your references. Recruiters triangulate you. They really are looking at every dimensions. They're doing a 360 and the recruiters are extraordinary at really vetting that sort of part of your development.

10:50Byron Loflin:Because recruiters are not just evaluating you for a particular role, but then also putting you in their database for potential roles in the future. How do you balance sort of the specificity of giving those stories that are fully pertinent to the job at hand versus presenting like the bigger picture of your talent so that they know the breadth of your skills and experience and might consider you for other roles?

11:20Mark Thompson:This goes back to the authentic self piece. And part of that is knowing what you're capable of delivering and being able to communicate that in an interactive way. The recruiter becomes your advocate at a level. So it's important to develop that persona that communicates that who you are, how you're going to lead, what does that look like in a given industry and being selective. One of the things that we emphasize in the book is self-selection and the idea that I do or don't want to be in this role, but it could also be I don't want to be in the role of this company, but I feel the capability to do it in another place.

12:01Mark Thompson:There is demand for CEOs. So developing that relationship so that the recruiter understands and has a vision for how you could fill the role depending on what comes to their plate as an opportunity.

12:17Byron Loflin:Is it worth it or possible to develop relationships with recruiters before you're interviewing for a specific job?

12:25Mark Thompson:That's what I recommend always. Isn't it nice to be out there in the marketplace, getting known, building relationships before you need them? That is perhaps one of the most authentic ways to do that. And so if you're thinking about becoming a chief executive in particular, there's a short list of firms that are specialists in that area. Meet as many of those people as possible and think about it as a developmental opportunity because the point you're making is, Allison, that you've got to think about this, anticipate and develop yourself. And part of that will be to learn from the recruiters what are they seeing right now because they're at the tip of this very changing marketplace out there.

13:07Mark Thompson:and they can also help you understand what might be available to you. Also, how your resume might translate, especially when you're not in a position where you're having to look for that work. You have considerable more gravitas.

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14:00Byron Loflin:Okay, so what should C-suite aspirants know about how the interview process will go with recruiters? What should they expect?

14:09Mark Thompson:The first step will be they will want to think about the context when they're being approached for this of as much as they can possibly learn from their network in the organization about how the role is being defined. This is an extension of what you were asking Allison earlier about. You want to be able to have the breadth of being seen as a credible candidate across companies since you're going to be a part of the recruiters network on the one hand. On the other hand, once we're starting the process that you're talking about, it's highly specific. It's going to be very much about what is the board thinking about and looking for in that next candidate.

14:47Mark Thompson:And so even prior to that first meeting, it's wise for someone who's on that short list or who's in the C-suite with aspirations, to be watching for that when they're in board meetings and at the dinners. It's a context in which you're not always thinking about how they're evolving their evaluation of the current CEO and how you could add value in that process. So if you have a deep resume, there are going to be parts of your resume that you can feature, you can underscore, and maybe need to further illuminate to demonstrate to the recruiter that you have what it takes for this next version of the chief executive.

15:27Byron Loflin:And I know recruiters are known for doing behavioral interviews.

15:33Mark Thompson:Yes.

15:33Byron Loflin:Tell me a little bit about what that means for how we all need to prep.

15:39Mark Thompson:This process of going back almost to childhood, depending on the behavioral interviews, and looking for instances of character, looking for instances of a learning mindset, to think about the way they're framing who you are and how you might be showing up for this organization, how you build relationships, how you are resilient and bounce back. Think about those major themes as you look at your resume because what we often do is think about it in a technical way. It's sequential. It has to do with what happened and what happened next and maybe weaving and stitching the rationale between them. That's not exactly what the recruiter is looking for.

16:17Mark Thompson:They're looking for a whole person who can think expansively and enterprise-wide. And seeing that demonstrated through thick and thin, through highs and lows, the person who has the EQ and the IQ, a person who turns that emotional setback into the resilience that says, okay, what can I do? What steps will I take? How can I show up better for this? a person who is taking responsibility, not necessarily blame, but responsibility is what the role is about, being accountable for recruiting others and having what I always feel is that unusual combination of hubris and humility, where on the one hand, you have to have this, in a sense, outrageous belief that you can run this company in something this complex at this time of disruption, and that it could be a company that continues to lead its industry or redefines what it means to serve those customers, that takes a lot of ambition and stubbornness and belief that you can be the best.