25 at 50: An antique gunboat and America's first mail-order record club

0:00WBUR Podcasts. Boston. It's a pretty massive feat to raise a 53-foot boat from 60 feet down and bring it up intact. Why a restored gunboat from 1776 helps bring America's story to life.

0:29It's Friday, February 6th, and this is Here and Now Anytime from NPR and WBOR Boston. I'm Shiko Thayuli. Today on the show, we continue our series, 25 Objects That Tell the Story of America, as we commemorate the country's 250th birthday. We get the story of a restored gunboat that sank in a 1776 Revolutionary War battle. And

1:03Young People's Records was a popular mail-order subscription club in the 1940s, 50s, and 60s. We examine why the music became such a hit, how the record club works, and why it's important in telling the story of America. And this is a particular window into mid-20th century United States history, but through the lens of a child's eye. But first, the Battle of Valcour Island on Lake Champlain was key in the Revolutionary War. And the outcome was very much in doubt when a gunboat for the colonies named the Philadelphia sank in battle. But more than a century later, it was miraculously raised. Now the Smithsonian is restoring the Philadelphia to show and tell its story.

1:47Jennifer Jones is a curator at the National Museum of American History and joins Scott Tong to talk about it. Let's talk about the Philadelphia. I understand this vessel was built in a big hurry during the Revolutionary War, more than 50 feet long. Tell us briefly about the Battle of Valcour Island, how the British sank the Philadelphia. you. In the summer of 1776, right after the penning of the Declaration of Independence, before the ink was dry, under Benedict Arnold's command up at Fort Ticonderoga, these ships were being built. And it was a race against the British who were building ships in Canada, who wanted to come down through the Lake Champlain Valley, through the Hudson River Valley to cut off the New England states from the rest of the colonies.

2:38So they were built in about three weeks. The Philadelphia is one of eight gunboats. And Arnold knew that he needed to delay the British. And so he knew the area and put the boats up in this small cove behind Valcour Island and waited for the British to advance to try and take Ticonderoga. I find remarkable, right, you mentioned Benedict Arnold, years before, of course, he switched sides. And I read that he led a real rickety crew with rickety ships. Is that the way to think about it? So the crew was not very trained in ships, you know, and sailing. He called them a motley crew. We're not really sure.

3:26They were a bunch of militiamen from New Hampshire, mostly on the Philadelphia itself. There were 44 men who manned the Philadelphia. As far as the boats being shoddy built, they were actually very well built. There were huge numbers of craftsmen and shipbuilders coming into the area called Skainsboro, where they were building this fleet. and it became the fourth largest city in the Americas at the time in North America. So there were about 10 ,000 men coming together to build this fleet and to man those areas. And as you say, in the end, Benedict Arnold and his team, they successfully stalled in a way, right?

4:10The British coming down, Philadelphia sank. How was it found and recovered, brought back to the surface? So there were a lot of accounts. But Lorenzo Haglund, who was the salvage engineer who was responsible for raising the Philadelphia in 1935, had grown up around Lake Champlain. And so there were a lot of stories and people started to look for artifacts and shipwrecks. He found it and raised it in August of 1935 and was able to raise the whole boat intact. Intact. It's a pretty massive feat to raise a 53-foot boat from 60 feet down and bring it up intact. So I live in town. I'm across the river in Arlington, Virginia.

4:57When I go to the Museum of American History, go up to the third floor, what can I see? What should I pay attention to when I look at the Philadelphia? What you should pay attention to is the fact that there is a 30-foot-long window in front of you, which you can view the Texas A &M conservation team working almost daily from 10 to about 4.30 every day, Monday through Friday. They are finding things in the boat. They're cleaning it. And you can actually watch the conservation as it's happening. Do you think about, as your team is working on this project, do you think about this country being established through war and why that's an important story to tell today?

5:40Sure. Sure. Because our nation, because we had to fight so hard for the nascent democracy that was just happening in 1776, the men and people who were involved with particularly this battle could have been seen as traitors if the country had not been able to secure our freedom from Britain. And the fact that our democracy is so fragile, particularly in 1776 as a new democracy, we were really just starting an experiment of beginning a new nation where democracy had not been tested before. And so when I look at this boat and I look at the fragility of the boat itself and the fact that we have to do so much to help preserve it for another 250 years, to me as an American, I recognize that our democracy is just as fragile.

6:40Fascinating. So good to hear you talk about this. Jennifer Jones is a curator at the National Museum of American History. Thank you for joining us. Thank you, Scott.

6:55Coming up next, we take a look at America's first mail-order record club. Stay with us.

7:13Support for Here and Now Anytime comes from SelectQuote. For over 40 years, SelectQuote has been one of the most trusted brokers in insurance. Their mission is simple, to find you the right insurance policy for your unique needs. They shop, you save. In as little as 15 minutes, SelectQuote's licensed agents will compare policies from trusted, top-rated insurance companies to find you the best fit for your health, your lifestyle, and your budget. And they work for you for free. Get the right life insurance for you and save more than 50 % at selectquote.com slash anytime. That's 50 % off at selectquote.com slash anytime.

7:54Remember those Columbia House music record subscriptions, the mail-order music? Well, in the 1940s and 50s, there was something called Young People's Records, which sent vinyl kids' songs through the mail. Like this one, The Little Fireman, 1947. Fire, fire, fire, raging all about Here come the firemen to put the fire out Once upon a time there was a great big tall fireman And once upon a time there was a little fireman Young People's Records sent out songs for preschoolers and grade schoolers every month and the song stayed in print through the 1970s. Now, they have been donated to the Smithsonian Institution, so here to talk about it, maybe sing a few bars, is Maureen Loughran, director and curator of Smithsonian Folkways.

8:46This is part of our ongoing series, 25 Objects That Tell the Story of America. Maureen, welcome to the program. Thank you, Scott. It's good to be here. This is fascinating. So what is the origin story of this mail-order music for kids? Who thought this out? What was the vision? Yeah. So Young People's Records was founded in 1946 in New York City by Horace Grinnell, who was a musician and also educator. And his wife, Judith Sigorsky, was also an educator. And she noticed that children were really they loved music, but they loved music that made them move. And so she influenced her husband, Horace, to start this record company in which they provided music for children in songs that they would appreciate.

9:37And really, it's from a progressive education point of view. Yeah, rather than songs that the grownups wanted the children to hear. Is that the important distinction? Yeah, exactly. I mean, I think that at the time, a lot of adults, parents, thought that kids liked nursery rhymes, Mother Goose songs. And really what Horace and his wife were doing were creating songs and music that told the story of these kids' everyday lives, things that they witnessed. A fireman, you know, the fire truck coming down the street. Well, let's learn about that. And we can learn through singing. There were some big names who contributed to young people's records as I was kind of reading up on this.

10:19Margaret Wise Brown, the children's book author, the folk singer Pete Seeger. So quite the history. Let's listen to another song from the collection. It's Timber with three R's from 1951. Timber!

10:41Listen, you lads and lasses to me. Oh, listen to me now, I say. The tale of the brave and bold lumberjacks. I'll sing and I'll tell you today. It's fun to listen to. You know, America was still largely an agrarian and industrial economy then, 40s and 50s. What do the songs, you think, tell us about the country at the time? Yeah, I think what it tells you is that if you think of just even that last song, Lumberjack. How many times do you think a kid in the middle of New York City would have encountered a lumberjack? Probably not often at all, right? But it allowed them to imagine worlds that they didn't live in, but also introduced them to other parts of the country.

11:29A kid in Michigan might have encountered a lumberjack, right? So then that's telling their experience through this music. I think that one of the great things about when you look at the catalog, it really does tell you a little bit of a window into what life was like, what people imagined life to be like in the 1950s, what their experience might have been. And then timber down comes a tree. Nowadays, logging, like most of our great industries, is carried on with machines. You know, this whole project and why we're talking about it now and why the Smithsonian is highlighting this now, why does this matter to the story of America?

12:17Right. So I think for us, at least at Smithsonian Folkways, since we are the record label here at the Smithsonian, our goal is to have these labels that join our collection that do tell the story of America. And this is a particular window into mid 20th century United States history. But through the lens of a child's eye, really, I think that the songs that are included here, they're very catchy. They're very much like inviting you to sing along and join the story. But what I also love about them is that they remind you, too, of the progression of media at the time. If you know a little bit about radio plays from the 1930s and the 40s, you can hear that in these songs.

13:06You can hear these little skits and stories and they draw you in. Maureen Loughran is director and curator of Smithsonian Folkways. Maureen, thank you again for joining us. Not at all, Scott. Thank you. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go. To the rodeo. Let's go. Oh, let's all go to the rodeo. See them ride. See them ride. See the cowboys ride those bucking broncos. See them ride. And we'll feature stories like these every other Friday on the podcast. If you missed our first installment, just scroll down your Here and Now anytime podcast feed to look for our episode on January 23rd.

13:48Let's go to the rodeo. See them ride. Oh, let's all go to the rodeo. See them ride. See them ride. See the cowboys ride. See them ride. See them ride. See them ride.

14:08And before we go, whether you're a diehard football fan or, like me, you're just showing up for some Good Eats and the halftime show, this Sunday's Super Bowl is not one to miss.

14:36Bad Bunny will take the Super Bowl stage for an historic halftime show, the first to be done primarily in Spanish. It's a huge moment for Puerto Ricans, as Alana Casanova Burgess explains. For the Puerto Rican diaspora, as well as in Puerto Rico, we really see him as a cousin. You know, he's sort of our local boy done good. She hosts a bilingual podcast about Puerto Rican history and culture called La Brega. And she joined Indira Lakshmanan to talk about the significance of Bad Bunny's rise and the cultural depth he's creating in the larger musical landscape. You can hear that conversation at hereandnow.org.

15:18Here and Now Anytime comes from NPR and WBUR Boston. Today's stories were produced by Will Wacke. Today's editors were Michael Scotto and Kat Welch. Technical direction from Caleb Green and Andre Peralta. Our theme music is by Mike Moschetto, Max Liebman, and Chris Bentley. Our digital producers are Alison Hagen and Grace Griffin. And the executive producer of Here and Now is Alan Price. Thanks for listening. We'll see you Monday.