Meet the 'iPod archaeologist' resurrecting forgotten playlists

14:09Kathryn Jezer-Morton:Support for this podcast and the following message come from strawberry.me. Be honest. Are you happy with your job? Are you stuck in a job you've outgrown or never wanted in the first place? Are your reasons for staying really just excuses for not leaving? Let a career coach from strawberry.me help you get unstuck. Discover the benefits of having a dedicated career coach in your corner and get 50 % off your first coaching session at strawberry.me slash NPR.

14:40Claire Hughes:Well, what replaced the iPod was, of course, the iPhone and other smartphones that rolled phones, web browsers, and music players into one sleek package. That felt like a revolution at the time, but it's gone much further than that in the years since. We're now on our phones constantly, using them to store tickets to live events, check out at cash registers, meet people, work, socialize, order food. They make everything that once took some effort frictionless. Literally, tap a picture of a button on a smooth glass screen and something happens in the real world. Maybe we've gone too far. Maybe we've distanced ourselves from the real world.

15:24Claire Hughes:Catherine Jaser Morton pondered that for New York Magazine and joined Indira Waksman on to talk about it.

15:30Kathryn Jezer-Morton:So you say that our comfort with friction is under attack. What is friction in your definition and what do you mean by that?

15:38Claire Hughes:I think that friction is really our ability to sort of tolerate very, very small inconveniences or moments that require our patience throughout the day. And the more we rely on technologies of convenience, the more experiences that previously would have seemed completely normal start to feel like, you know, a burden that we're struggling, that we struggle to bear, that we feel impatient with. So friction, I think, is something relatively new in the sense that these are feelings that we would not have associated with friction maybe 10 or 15 years ago.

16:15Kathryn Jezer-Morton:I mean, what you're describing sounds to me like just the normal job of being a human in life, that, you know, it's hard to get a reservation. It's hard to learn math. I mean, like everything we do in life that's a new experience is inherently hard or challenging. And it sounds like you're saying that now with our phones, especially I would imagine with AI on our phones, everything becomes easy. We don't have to work for it anymore.

16:43Claire Hughes:Yeah, exactly. And when everything becomes easy, things that, you know, we I think lose the capacity to just kind of stay with the trouble of a mild inconvenience, a mild challenge or frustration, because we're just less accustomed to that sensation in our lives.

17:01Kathryn Jezer-Morton:So you share a story about how your own children learn to read. Explain why you think it's important for children to experience inconvenience as they study and learn.

17:12Claire Hughes:So reading, obviously, you know, is an amazing gift. And those of us who love reading know that it gives us so much. But learning to read as a kid is, you know, can be slow going. Not all kids naturally take to it. In my case, we took a family road trip that ended up being very long because we were in a van that was old and falling apart. And we were driving basically across Mexico. And we didn't have iPads. And this was all, you know, we hadn't really thought that the kids would need books to basically stay sane, but that's what we found, and books were all we had. And, you know, over the course of many days, the kids came to realize that books are an amazing escape, and they are a source of great joy.

17:51Claire Hughes:But I don't know if they would have had that opportunity had we been giving them iPads the entire time, because iPads are an immediate source of fun, ease, you know, they're not hard to learn how to play with, obviously. So I think that the kind of necessity of friction and boredom and, you know, long days was what made the books seem as good as they, you know, we all know them to be.

18:16Kathryn Jezer-Morton:All right. So what are some examples of ways we can add friction back into our lives to force us to work harder to actually achieve the results we want in life? And why is it important to do so?

18:28Claire Hughes:Well, you know, I mean, each individual has such a different relationship. And so much of this has to do with our routines. And so, you know, some people might rely very heavily on, you know, traffic and maps apps, for example, in their daily commutes, even though, you know, they've lived in the same city for years and they could probably find their way around without these things, but they're used to them. Like, that might be one example. I think that it's more a question of individually asking ourselves, you know, what are some of the ways that we've sort of lost touch with some of our own instincts in our daily lives?

19:04Claire Hughes:And I think for a lot of people, that's not something that they have stopped to think about. You know, when has convenience started to create its own set of obstacles? And I think that each of us are going to have a different answer for this. But I think it's a reflection that people haven't necessarily had the occasion to have up until kind of now. I think this is why this idea is taking off. People want the opportunity to reflect on convenience.

19:32Kathryn Jezer-Morton:I wonder about that. And I'm just thinking of something that happened to me the other day. I tend to walk with podcasts constantly or news in my ears constantly. And I was walking through, you know, Washington, D.C. with all the beautiful cherry blossoms in bloom. And I was thinking, hey, am I missing out on everything that's around me because I'm so obsessively listening to the news? And, you know, I wonder whether I'm sort of like missing out life that's happening because I'm tethered to my device, even if it's listening and not looking at it.

20:08Claire Hughes:Absolutely. I mean, I think for a lot of us, we don't like time that's not in some way, you know, where we're being stimulated on some level. Quiet time, right. Silent time, no headphones. These are exactly the types of, you know, moments to reflect on. What if I took a walk and was just looking instead of listening? It's a great question.

20:28Kathryn Jezer-Morton:You write in your piece that escapism has become redundant. What do you mean by that? And how did we get here?

20:35Claire Hughes:I think that we're always already escaping when we're using technologies of convenience. People love an opportunity to just kind of spend some time on their phone every time we're waiting in line, we're bored, we're slightly like these interstitial moments. We have this escape hatch that we all avail ourselves of. So this idea that we would be escaping from a world that we're already compulsively escaping from, that's sort of what I mean by redundant. It's become escaping from reality has become this kind of embedded habit of daily life for everyone. And we don't call it escaping. We just call it, yeah, I'm just checking my phone.

21:16Claire Hughes:I'm checking the scores, whatever.

21:18Kathryn Jezer-Morton:So screens are not just a distraction from everything else we could be doing, but an escapist tool, basically. That's how I feel, yeah. Yeah. I love how you describe social media as digital padded rooms that make it easy for us with predictive algorithms and single tap commands. I think this probably also applies, let's face it, to shopping websites and online gambling sites and everything else that we can carry around in our pocket and get addicted to. What are these digital padded rooms protecting us from?

21:54Claire Hughes:I think that, you know, the predictive modeling that underpins all of these tools, all of these social apps and gambling apps, you know, they're designed to basically get us closer to a sale, right? They're designed to make us purchase or, you know, convert, whatever, you know, the term is being used. And so the experience is being smoothed out to give us sort of the most pleasure, the most ease, the feeling that it's tailor-made for us, this kind of bespoke experience. And in doing that, I think there's a real sort of affective dullening that occurs. We don't have to be exposed to ideas or information that doesn't appeal to us already.

22:32Claire Hughes:We don't have to discern difficult or, you know, topics that might not confirm our existing biases. I mean, we talk about this in terms of people's political ideologies and social media, right? We're in these kind of ideological silos. And that's because it feels good to be in a place among, you know, like-minded folks. But then we lose the capacity to just make sense of difficult information or, you know, difficult circumstances, people who disagree with us, but that are also kind of, you know, needing our help or needing to connect. You know, social media keeps us safe from these tough experiences that are really what being a human is about.

23:10Claire Hughes:And I think we lose practice. We fall out of practice with dealing with these really frictiony moments of encounter that occur, you know, all the time.

23:22Kathryn Jezer-Morton:Journalist Catherine Jaser-Morton is a columnist for New York Magazine and the author of The Story of Your Life, How Social Media Shapes the Way We Experience Everything, which we'll be publishing this summer. Catherine, thank you so much. Thanks so much.

23:39Claire Hughes:Let's take one more short break and we'll be right back.

24:07Claire Hughes:Ready to start learning a new language this spring? Visit rosettastone.com slash NPR today to explore Rosetta Stone and choose the language that's right for you.

24:17Kathryn Jezer-Morton:This message comes from Warby Parker. Prescription eyewear that's expertly crafted and unexpectedly affordable. Glasses designed in-house from premium materials starting at just$95, including prescription lenses. Stop by a Warby Parker store near you. Support for this podcast and the following message come from Fisher Investments. who wants you to know they take a personalized approach to retirement planning. Fisher starts by getting to know your finances, family, health, lifestyle, and more, so they can tailor your portfolio to your unique goals. Then they check in regularly to help make sure you stay on track.

24:52Kathryn Jezer-Morton:And with a transparent fee structure, they do better when you do better. Now that's clearly different money management. Learn more at fisherinvestments.com. Investing in securities involves the risk of loss.

25:03Claire Hughes:This message comes from NPR sponsor Charles Schwab. When is the right time to sell a stock? How do you protect against inflation? Financial decisions can be tricky, and often your own cognitive and emotional biases can lead you astray. Financial Decoder, an original podcast from Charles Schwab, can help. Join host Mark Reepy as he offers practical solutions to help overcome the cognitive and emotional biases that may affect your investing decisions. Download the latest episode and subscribe at schwab.com slash financial decoder. Guys, I found the charger for that old iPod. It still works. Unfortunately, I only had one playlist on there.

25:47Claire Hughes:Check out this postcard from the late aughts. Arcade Fire, Brazilian Girls, Gold Frap, Dirty Projectors, Gorillas, The Hold Steady, MGMT, Magnetic Fields, Rattatat, Yova Tango? Yes, I was what we called back then a hipster. That was the heyday of Pitchfork Media after all. I definitely had iPods before that that are long lost to time. Those probably had a lot of Limp Bizkit on them. But that's the joy of physical media. You keep getting older and it stays the same age. Looking through fixed iPod playlists is kind of like thumbing through a collection of albums or CDs. Not exactly the same as true analog media, but it still has an appeal.

26:33Claire Hughes:If you're in the mood for some spring cleaning, though, how about some digital decluttering? Seemingly infinite storage in the cloud is free or pretty cheap, but it comes with an environmental cost. Simone Shaw wrote about that for Time, and she told Scott Tong, it's a good idea to check on your digital carbon footprint.

26:56Kathryn Jezer-Morton:Everything from our old text to our screenshots all relies on the transfer of data from our devices to servers that are stored in data centers. That's what we're talking about when we're talking about the cloud. And that all uses air conditioning and water to keep cool. So estimates over the years show that the amount of energy that's required to store this, for example, one terabyte of data on the cloud, which would be about the amount of storage for four 256 gigabyte laptops, would range from 40 kilowatts per hour to 300 kilowatts per hour annually. And just to put that into perspective, using just 60 kilowatts per hour is equivalent to charging your smartphone every single night for over six years.

27:40Claire Hughes:So the question is, okay, if that's the case, one case for decluttering our lives or digital lives or laptops or our phones, have you found good, efficient ways to do it? Because it's kind of a pain, as you know, as I know.

27:55Kathryn Jezer-Morton:Yeah, I am right there with you. I think that just finding small bite-sized ways in your routines can really help. Some people I know try to do it while they're commuting on the train. Another friend will do it on airplanes when you're just sitting there with no Wi-Fi. So just thinking about little moments, maybe once a week, once a month, it can just get you started.

28:15Claire Hughes:And just for context, like for my phone, is the biggest environmental impact the manufacturing of it, the shipping of it, or me using it? Do you know?

28:25Kathryn Jezer-Morton:When we're looking at the biggest carbon impact, it really comes from manufacturing products. So one of the things that is really important to think about is looking at how many physical products you're buying, being aware of just only buying things when you really need them and making them last.

28:41Claire Hughes:And finally, kind of big, big picture reporting on this in the past. You know, people have said that for Americans and many around the world, right, Their biggest footprint is likely their driving and then maybe their home energy use. I would imagine a digitalizer probably a fraction of that.

28:58Kathryn Jezer-Morton:Yeah, I would say that when we are considering our personal emissions, it really is a drop in the bucket. However, you know, it is because of the environmental impacts of things like this that the UK government, when facing a drought last summer, did urge the public to take steps like deleting digital clutter amongst other efforts to help kind of reduce the strain of water. So it isn't, I would say, the biggest impact, but it can have a difference.

29:25Claire Hughes:There's more to that conversation, and you can listen to it right now at hereandnow.org. Yes, that audio file is stored online, but it's a small file, I swear. While you're there, since we were talking about things gone by the wayside, you could also check out our conversation with a cursive academy in Indiana that is attracting students of all ages. We take it from second grade, which is usually about seven years old, and our oldest graduate thus far is 95 years old.

29:59Claire Hughes:All that and a lot more at hereandnow.org. But that's it for us today. Here and Now Anytime comes from NPR and WBUR Boston. Today's stories were produced by Ashley Locke and Jenna Griffiths. Today's editors were Todd Muntz, Mikaela Rodriguez, Michael Scotto, and Kat Welch. technical direction from Caleb Green and Matt Reed with help from James Trout. Our theme music is by Mike Moschetto, Max Liebman, and me, Chris Bentley. Our digital producers are Alison Hagen and Grace Griffin. And here and now's executive producer is Alan Price. Thanks for listening. Have a great weekend. Go find those old iPods, and we'll be back with you on Monday.

30:45Claire Hughes:This message comes from Rosetta Stone. If you have travel coming up, like a spring break or summer vacation, imagine arriving actually understanding the language. Rosetta Stone has been the trusted leader in language learning for over 30 years, with millions of users and 25 languages to choose from. Ready to start learning a new language this spring? Visit rosettastone.com slash NPR today to explore Rosetta Stone and choose the language that's right for you.

31:12Kathryn Jezer-Morton:Support for this podcast and the following message come from Fisher Investments, who wants you to know they take a personalized approach to retirement planning. Fisher starts by getting to know your finances, family, health, lifestyle, and more, so they can tailor your portfolio to your unique goals. Then they check in regularly to help make sure you stay on track. And with a transparent fee structure, they do better when you do better. Now that's clearly different money management. Learn more at fisherinvestments.com. Investing in securities involves the risk of loss.

31:43Claire Hughes:This message comes from NPR sponsor Charles Schwab. When is the right time to sell a stock? How do you protect against inflation? Financial decisions can be tricky, and often your own cognitive and emotional biases can lead you astray. Financial Decoder, an original podcast from Charles Schwab, can help. Join host Mark Rebe as he offers practical solutions to help overcome the cognitive and emotional biases that may affect your investing decisions. Download the latest episode and subscribe at schwab.com slash financial decoder.