Native Americans say they're being swept up by ICE

0:00Support for Here and Now Anytime comes from MathWorks, creator of MATLAB and Simulink software for technical computing and model based design. MathWorks, accelerating the pace of discovery in engineering and science. Learn more at MathWorks.com. WBUR Podcasts, Boston. As people of color, as many tribal citizens obviously are, do feel like they are being harassed or detained or in some cases even arrested by ICE officers. Native American tribes say indigenous people are getting swept up in immigration raids.

0:48It's Thursday, January 15th, and this is Here and Now Anytime from NPR and WBUR. I'm Chris Bentley. Today on the show, fear is spreading in Minneapolis as President Trump threatens to send in troops. I believe hope is the last thing to die, but I'm shaking. I really cannot even share what emotion is I'm going through right now. Also, Wyoming has a budget surplus, but the Republican legislature is still making cuts to health care, education and public media. These decisions we're making are going to haunt the state. Before we get to that, though, the Trump administration has claimed its immigration agenda is targeted at people in the country illegally, especially those with criminal records.

1:37But immigration agents have picked up and even deported people with no convictions. They've detained, pepper sprayed and shot U.S. citizens. And now Native American tribes are saying they're getting swept up in the dragnet as well. The Oglala Sioux tribe has contacted federal officials, including the Department of Homeland Security, about four of its members that were reportedly detained during raids in Minneapolis. The tribe's president, Frank Starr, comes out, said that would violate treaties and federal law. But DHS, in a statement to NPR, denies that they've arrested or even encountered members of the Oglala Sioux Tribe.

2:20Graham Lee Brewer has been reporting on this for the Associated Press. He's a citizen of the Cherokee Nation, and he spoke to Indira Lakshmanan. So first of all, what do you make of this discrepancy? Oglala Sioux Tribe says their members were detained and that DHS won't give them any additional information unless they enter into a so-called immigration agreement with ICE. DHS has denied this to us. Can you give us any clarity? Well, I think it's really hard to say what exactly has happened right now. The circumstances of the arrests that President Starr comes out has alleged happened are still very murky.

2:55We're still trying to piece together exactly what happened. Even the tribal nation itself is saying that they only have the first names of the four gentlemen and that one of them has been released and three have been transferred to an ICE detention center. As you mentioned, DHS is denying that they have any tribal citizens in their custody, and they're also denying that there was this deal that they offered for more information as long as the tribe agreed to enter into an immigration agreement. So right now, really, all we have to go on is what President Stark comes out, has said in his press release and then the memorandum that he sent to DHS and to Interior, which are some pretty serious allegations.

3:40And so we're still trying to piece together exactly what happened. You know, the tribe is saying that their attorneys are requesting more information and DHS is saying that they can't look up the specific people unless they have the last names and that information. Oglala Sioux Tribe says its members are categorically outside immigration jurisdiction. So is the detention of tribal members by ICE illegal? And what is the jurisdiction of federal authorities when it comes to Native Americans? Well, I do think that it's hard to ignore the obvious irony that we're looking at here, right? That you have Native Americans who are citizens of sovereign tribal nations being detained, allegedly being detained by immigration officers.

4:27I think when President Stark comes out, says that they're outside the jurisdiction, what he's saying is that tribal citizens are also citizens of the United States and that the treaty rights that they enjoy as citizens of tribes are some of the country's oldest legal obligations, right? And so I think obviously there could be a situation where maybe an assault or something like that happened where an ICE officer would have the authority to detain a tribal citizen. But the idea that the Immigration and Customs Enforcement officer would have the legal right to detain and put into detention a tribal citizen on immigration enforcement, it doesn't really necessarily make sense.

5:12Well, it does indeed seem ironic that Native Americans who were here before the pilgrims or other colonists got to this country should be scooped up in crackdowns on illegal immigration. It does seem very ironic. How are tribal nations responding to this? Well, I think you're seeing a lot of anger in Indian country writ large, and I think for obvious reasons, the ones that you mentioned. But you also have tribes, including Oglala Sioux and the Red Lake Band of Chippewa Indians that has several thousand tribal citizens that live in the Twin Cities area. They're advising their citizens to get their tribal IDs so that if and when they are approached by ICE officers, they can very clearly show that they are citizens of tribal nations.

5:59Now, there has been instances reported Elaine Miles, the actress from The Last of Us and also very well known for her time on Northern Exposure, was saying that she was detained by or stopped by ICE officers in Washington who questioned the validity of her tribal ID. And so tribes are setting up areas within Minneapolis so that tribal citizens can go and apply for their tribal IDs. But they're also asking citizens to report to them directly whenever they encounter ICE officers or ICE officers try to arrest or detain them in any way so that they can start keeping track of those instances. Briefly, Graham, have there been other cases of tribal citizens detained by ICE?

6:42And is this partly colorism at play? Yeah, you've seen reports last year in the Navajo Nation. There was also a report of a woman in Iowa who was almost deported and later the county sheriff, I believe it was, said that that was due to a clerical error. So, you know, I think people do, as people of color, as many tribal citizens obviously are, do feel like they are being harassed or detained or in some cases even arrested by ICE officers. That's Associated Press reporter Graham Lee Brewer, who covers tribal nations. Graham, thanks so much for joining us. Thanks again for having me.

7:24Coming up next, unrest on the streets of Minneapolis after another shooting by ICE. We'll be right back.

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8:22President Trump is threatening to invoke the Insurrection Act and deploy the military against protesters in Minneapolis, where there's renewed outrage over the actions of federal immigration agents after ICE shot another person there last night. The Department of Homeland Security said agents were trying to arrest a man whom they say is in the country illegally when they say two people came out of a nearby apartment and attacked the ICE officer making the arrest with a snow shovel and a broom handle. That officer fired what the Department of Homeland Security called a defensive shot, hitting the man they were trying to arrest in the leg.

9:02Of course, one week ago, another ICE agent in Minneapolis shot Renee Macklin-Good multiple times while she was driving away from him, killing her and sparking national outrage. The state of Minnesota has sued federal officials over what it says are warrantless arrests and excessive force by immigration agents, while the Trump administration blames Minnesotans for not cooperating. Department of Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem said she spoke to the president earlier today. We did discuss the Insurrection Act. He certainly has the constitutional authority to utilize that. My hope is that this leadership team in Minnesota will start to work with us to get criminals off the streets.

9:44Well, Habon Abdule is one of many Minnesotans who is upset and afraid of what might happen next, with more than 2 ,000 federal agents reportedly active in the Twin Cities as part of the administration's crackdown. Abdule grew up in Somalia and now runs the nonprofit Ayalda Leeds in Minneapolis. Here's her conversation with Peter O'Dowd. I know you've been in emergency meetings today related to this news and the latest violence in Minneapolis. How would you describe the mood in the city and the mood in the conversations that you've been having with people today? It really has been a difficult weeks, if not months here in Minneapolis.

10:27Right now, I just left the meeting and heading to another one. To tell you the truth, we are living through days in Minnesota that we never imagined we would see. Yeah. Well, as you know, the federal government says in last night's shooting, it happened because people were attacking an agent. The president is now threatening to invoke the Insurrection Act, which would allow him to send in the military. Is there a concern that things could erupt even further out of control, something like 2020 after the death of George Floyd? Yeah, again, I am so shaken up right now because of the things I'm seeing.

11:09And hearing that this can get worse, it makes really more painful. Our trauma is, you know, the collective trauma is heightened. So I don't really know what else can be happening in our community. You can hear how my voice is cracking. I'm really trying to keep myself together. The fear is high. Parents are worried about their children. Workers are anxious about commuting, even going to work. Trust has been eroded. I really don't know what else can happen and how worse it can get here in Minneapolis. Is there a coordinated message that groups like yours are trying to send to the community right now that might help calm the situation?

12:00You know, from the community perspective, what we are seeing goes beyond standard immigration enforcement. It feels like an attack on the entire community, rather in targeted legal process. Public safety should not come at the cost of widespread fear and intimidation. That is what our community wants. We want our eyes to be out of our state. As I said, you were born in Somalia. And as you also well know, the president first sent these federal agents into your city to specifically target Somali migrants. He said to crack down on fraud. The actions against your community are now escalating. Somalia is on a list of countries from which the United States will no longer issue immigration visas.

12:46The administration just recently announced the end of TPS protections for Somalis. And that was something that allowed people to live and work in the U.S. since the 1990s. How's all that news landing? Not good. Not good at all. The ending of a temporary protected status for Somalis will have deep and immediate consequences for both families and community in Minnesota. For Somalis, the most painful impact will be separation. parents, spouses, and adult children could be forced to leave while their loved ones may remain back in the United States. Family will be asked to make impossible choices between staying together and staying safe or being separated.

13:36So you can imagine what that means. Across the country, it looks like 2 ,400 people from Somalia are currently on the temporary protected status. which has been in place since 1991 when the Civil War broke out. The Department of Homeland Security says the conditions have improved there. Safe enough to go back. Is that true? What do you know? I haven't been back home for a while. But what I know is Somalia is not safe for everyone. Those who are seeking safety outside of Somalia, there is a reason for that. So I'm not in any place to say, yes, they can go back, Somalia is safe or not. I don't believe that is the case.

14:23If they choose to seek temporary protection status in the United States, there is a reason for that. Habon Abdule, Executive Director of the nonprofit Ayata Leeds, speaking to us from Minneapolis today about the tensions in the city with federal agents. Habon, thank you so much for your time. Thank you again for having us and sharing our experiences with your audience.

14:55Coming up, Wyoming is considering big cuts to public programs, even though the state has a budget surplus. Peter has that story after the break.

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15:50Wyoming state coffers have a surplus of money. So why are lawmakers in Cheyenne trying to make sweeping cuts to the state's budget, including$60 million from Wyoming's only public university? Let's bring in Maggie Mullen. She reports on Wyoming government and politics for the nonprofit publication, WyoFile. Maggie, welcome. Thanks for having me, Peter. This is a lot of money. What are the highest profile programs on the chopping block here? Well, for one, the Wyoming Business Council, which is the state's economic development agency, lawmakers have already voted to completely zero out that agency's budget.

16:27So it would effectively dismantle this department. Wyoming would no longer have a statewide economic development agency. The Department of Health is also on the chopping block, partly because that agency has a bigger slice of the pie in the budget compared to other agencies. But really, because there is this newly empowered group of Republicans in the statehouse now known as the Wyoming Freedom Caucus, really, it seems like almost anything is up for consideration. Well, in fact, this is a group of lawmakers that has gotten a lot more power at the legislature in recent years. Ken Pendergraft is a member.

17:07Here he is at the Capitol discussing his political philosophy. It was Reagan who famously said government's not the solution to the problem. It is the problem. And many of us do not feel that that's just a catchy phrase. We actually believe it. So these cuts are coming from a committee. The whole legislature has to vote on it still. It's not in stone yet. But just to be clear, the state has the money for these programs. Is that right? There's a surplus. Yeah, yeah. In fact, yesterday I reported on another spat that the committee was dealing with, and that was a disagreement over where they should stash$250 million in surplus revenue.

17:48That debate was whether over to put that money into permanent savings where lawmakers down the road wouldn't have access to it, but it would earn investment income, or whether it should be in short-term savings where lawmakers would have the option to spend it down the road if they need to. And that could be a reality because lawmakers are also considering additional property tax cuts. Plus, voters will be deciding in November whether they want to cut residential property taxes. All right. Let's focus specifically on the University of Wyoming. It's the only public university the state has. For many, it's the heart and soul of the state.

18:28It could lose more than$60 million. What kind of effect would that have on the school? I mean, a huge effect. you know, and lawmakers did vote to exempt the College of Education and the College of Agriculture. But otherwise, UW trustees would have to find, you know, places to cut about 11 percent of, you know, the university's budget. And the thing is, as you mentioned, that this is the state's only four-year public university. I mean, this is where Wyoming kids come to earn an education. And morale is already low on campus here in Laramie. UW president Ed Seidel is preparing to depart. And the cost of living in Laramie is becoming an ever-increasing problem for the folks that live here, the folks that work at UW, and the students that attend the university.

19:19Well, the university cuts do include slashing the budget for Wyoming public media. I have to say that's one of our member stations. You worked there for five years. I worked there for nearly two years, and it looks like eight people on a small staff could lose their jobs. What does that mean for local journalism in Wyoming? It means that if Wyoming Public Radio goes away, that the state that already struggles as a news desert would have one fewer statewide news organization. So people would have less information to make informed decisions in their daily lives. And of course, like stations across the country, Wyoming Public Radio is already dealing with the strain that was caused by federal cuts in 2025.

20:06Many lawmakers are against these cuts, including Republicans like Ogden Driscoll. Here he is at the state capitol on Tuesday. This body's sending the message to the people of Wyoming, our own people. Don't stay here. Don't come here. And we're going to cut until it's not a very fun place to live, but you won't have to pay anything in taxes. That's not something I want to have as part of my legacy coming out of here. So that's a dissenting view from a Republican lawmaker. It is a conservative state. What do everyday people in Wyoming think about all this? Well, I think it sort of depends on who you ask.

20:43I mean, I think what it means to be a Republican in Wyoming is up for debate. I mean, for a long time, there was a very strong sort of libertarian streak among voters and among, you know, office holders. And now I think we're seeing that change. We're seeing that in the statehouse. And, you know, I think there are folks that, that even very conservative Republicans are looking at these cuts. Some are cheering them, but some are really concerned about the lasting impact that decisions like this will have on Wyoming. Maggie Mullen is a reporter on Wyoming's government and politics for YO-File. Thank you so much, Maggie.

21:21Thanks, Peter.

21:28That's our show for today. Here and Now Anytime comes from NPR and WBUR Boston. Today's stories were produced by Hafsa Qureshi, Ashley Locke, and Will Walke. Today's editors were Todd Muntz, Michael Scotto, and Kat Welch. Technical direction from Matt Reed and Marcel Damiano. Our theme music is by Mike Moschetto, Max Liebman, and me, Chris Bentley. Our digital producers are Alison Hagen and Grace Griffin. And the executive producer of Here and Now is Alan Price. Thanks for listening. We'll be back with you tomorrow.

22:05Thank you.