What's behind the rise of antisemitism in Australia?

0:00Support for WBUR comes from Is Business Broken? a podcast from the Mehrotra Institute at Boston University that explores questions like, why is innovation in healthcare so hard? Is ESG just greenwashing? And of course, is business broken? Listen wherever you get your podcasts. WBUR Podcasts, Boston. Australia has been historically one of the best places to be alive to be a Jew. There is, And there was, for hundreds of years, no entrenched anti-Semitism. An Australian rabbi says the attack on a Hanukkah festival in Sydney has shattered her sense of safety.

0:50It's Tuesday, December 16th, and this is Here and Now, Anytime from NPR and WBR. I'm Chris Bentley. Today on the show, what does it tell us that the Islamic State was implicated in the deaths of three Americans in Syria at the same time that Australian authorities say the suspects in a terrorist attack there had two ISIS flags in their car? It tells us that ISIS is a franchise. It has some structure, so it's not quite Kentucky Fried Chicken, but it's something actually more nefarious and harder to deal with. And unfortunately, these issues are related. Also, immigrants who've spent years getting their paperwork in order to become U.S.

1:34citizens are showing up at naturalization ceremonies only to have the rug pulled out from under them at the last second. You don't receive your certificate of naturalization until that final oath of allegiance is taken. And so these individuals are not citizens until that takes place. That story coming up in about 10 minutes. But first, we're learning more about the two suspects in Sunday's deadly shooting at a Hanukkah celebration in Australia. Prime Minister Anthony Albanese says the suspected gunmen, a father and son pair, were motivated by Islamic State ideology. The Australian Broadcasting Corporation cited security sources saying the alleged gunman traveled to the Philippines last month to receive, quote, military-style training.

2:22But regardless of whether or not there's an ISIS connection to this attack, many Jews in Australia are outraged. Indira Lakshmanan talked to two people about that. Sociologist Matteo Vergani of Deakin University in Melbourne and Orthodox Rabbi Nami Kaltman, who also lives in Melbourne. She told Indira she was in disbelief when she heard the news of the attack. Disbelief, because I couldn't believe as Jews we were being slaughtered for celebrating our faith, but also complete disbelief because there is no mass gun violence in Australia. It's so emotional, Nami, and I appreciate your sharing this with us.

3:03Also, knowing that you had just written an essay in which you talked about how your family first arrived in Australia more than 100 years ago and that you grew up believing that Australia was one of the best places on earth to be Jewish. I mean, beyond the massive reckoning that your country is going to have to have about gun violence, as you say, because apparently, allegedly, one of these shooters had a legal gun license. Let's talk about the particular feeling of having your community be targeted. Australia, if you look at the history of this country, has been historically one of the best places to be alive, to be a Jew.

3:43There is, and there was, for hundreds of years, no entrenched anti-Semitism. Being a Jew was not a barrier to any sort of success in politics, arts, the philanthropy, law. Jews have occupied the highest levels of government. Professor Vergani, you've been doing research on anti-Semitism in Australia. I'd like to hear from you what you've discovered about a dramatic rise in anti-Semitism since the 2023 attacks by Hamas in Israel. Yes, since October 7, 2023, we started collecting data from social media. Defining anti-Semitism is complex and, of course, it's a contested field. So in general, everyone agrees that targeting Jews as Jews is anti-Semitism and in the literature is usually referred to as old anti -Semitism.

4:45And then there is the so-called new anti-Semitism, which is more contested and shifts the focus from individual Jews to the state of Israel. And blaming Jews collectively. I mean, the issue is what you've seen is the blaming of Jews collectively for the actions by the Israeli state. So this is specifically political. It's tied to what's happening in Gaza, as opposed to old historic anti-Semitic tropes, which is what you were calling the old anti-Semitism, correct? Yeah, that's correct. But the thing is that we measured both and we found that both increased after October 7. So from a baseline, we collected data in the one year before October 7, 2023, and then we continued collecting data up to now.

5:38And so from the baseline, we have seen a massive increase. So, for example, in relation to old anti-Semitism, we looked at posts on X where we could get a good geolocation. And we found that anti-Semitism rose from an average of 34 tweets a month in the year before October 7 to over 2000 in the following year. And Nami, I want to ask you, because you're in a city where just in December 2024, arsonists firebombed a historic synagogue in your town just last July. At a separate synagogue, a man set fire to the front door while congregants were inside for a Shabbat dinner. So tell us what it feels like now to be Jewish in Australia, and what's the message you want our listeners to take away?

6:31Jews see ourselves as a canary in the coal mine. And we see anti-Semitism and the sort of unchecked and metastising anti-Semitism in any country and in any community shows a sick society, shows a country that's not doing well. And since October 7th, there's been a very steady drip of anti-Semitism that has been increasing in temperature and temperament. and my community has been begging the Australian Labor government who's in charge saying, protect us, help us, show that you have a zero-tolerance approach. If you were in Australia during the COVID-19 pandemic, you saw what it means when the Australian government will not tolerate any deviation from the rules and there is legislation on Australia's books that would allow for many of the issues that we're facing to be dealt with, but the courts have been slow to react.

7:19The police don't have the proper training to enforce it. The government from the top has been wishy-washy and that it results in the murder of Jews on a beach in Bondi is not a surprise to us, but it's devastating. And we say to the Australian government, treat the Jewish community right. Your country will not thrive and will not survive and will not endure if Jews are forced to leave because of anti-Semitism and your government's failure to protect us as a community. That's Rabbi Nami Kaltman of Melbourne, Australia. We were also speaking with sociologist Matteo Vergani of Deakin University in Melbourne and director of the Tackling Hate Lab.

7:58Thank you both so much for joining us. Thank you. Thank you. Well, for his part, Prime Minister Albanese called the attacks pure evil, an act of antisemitism, an act of terrorism, and says his government will dedicate, quote, every single resource required, end quote, to eradicate antisemitism in Australia. Coming up next, An ambush on American troops in Syria killed three people over the weekend. Officials say the attack was linked to the Islamic State. So between that and the possible ties to the Australia attack, what's the state of ISIS? That's after the break.

9:08We'll be right back. will compare policies from trusted, top-rated insurance companies to find you the best fit for your health, your lifestyle, and your budget. And they work for you for free. Get the right life insurance for you and save more than 50 % at selectquote.com slash anytime. That's 50 % off at selectquote.com slash anytime. President Trump has vowed to retaliate after a deadly attack on American military personnel in central Syria over the weekend. A lone gunman there ambushed a U.S. Syrian joint patrol near Palmyra, killing two members of the Iowa National Guard and their civilian American interpreter.

9:51Syrian officials say the shooter was a member of the country's security forces, but was slated for dismissal because of its extremist views. These are the first American casualties in Syria since Bashar al-Assad was ousted from power by rebel forces a year ago. It's also a reminder that there are a thousand U.S. troops still stationed there. Andrew Tabler is with the Washington Institute for Near East Policy. He was a member of the National Security Council during the first Trump administration. Here's his conversation with Indira Lakshmanan. So many listeners may have forgotten that the U.S. had troops in Syria.

10:27Remind us why and when U.S. forces were deployed there and what are they still doing there? Yeah, it's a great question. So U.S. forces were first deployed to Syria in 2014 with the effort to fight against the outbreak of the Islamic State, which came out of the breakdown of Syria and the civil war there. Those troops have remained with U.S. forces in the northeast supporting Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic forces and now elsewhere in support of President Ahmad Ashara's government in Damascus. All right. Well, authorities are still gathering details about the ambush and the gunmen. Do you see this as an isolated incident from a lone wolf attacker or is this a sign of the larger kind of regrowth of ISIS forces within Syria?

11:15It's a sign of the ongoing, I would say, ISIS activity in Syria. It ebbs and flows. It never goes completely away, mostly because the reasons for the civil war to start out with haven't dissipated. We still have a lot of economic ruin inside of the country. We still have a lot of ideology and extremism. And so it's not surprising these attacks by the Islamic State happen elsewhere in Syria and even in the day after this tragic loss of life on the American side. There were attacks in Idlib province against Syrian forces. So unfortunately, the fight against the Islamic State hasn't ended. President Trump has vowed, quote, very serious retaliation for this attack.

11:56What might that look like? It really would depend. You know, the quickest way to change any adversary's behavior is military force, but it has a shelf life. So this could be one-off missile strikes. These could be a raid by special forces. It could be all of the above. We just don't really know at the moment. One of the challenges with the Islamic State and this incident in particular is that these folks don't wear Islamic State insignia, per se. In fact, many times, and in the case of this incident, they're disguised as members of other bodies, such as the Syrian Interior Ministry. And so basically, taking the fight to your enemy is hard.

12:39The U.S. has a lot of intelligence there. The matter is deploying it. I want to ask about Syria's president, Ahmad al-Shara. He's condemned the attack. Listeners may not know that in his early 20s, he was a former member of al-Qaeda in Iraq who was imprisoned by the U.S. forces there in the notorious Abu Ghraib prison. About a decade ago, he rebranded his group as more moderate rebels who then gained international support. He was welcomed in the White House just a month ago by President Trump, who praised him. Tell us about him and the challenges he faces in trying to repair a deeply fractured nation that suffered decades of repressive rule under the Assad regime.

13:16The challenges he faces are twofold in general. One is political. He doesn't control all of Syrian territory. And Syria is full of a number of minorities, such as Alawites, Christians, Druze and Kurds. And all of these groups have certain concerns with his government. and that has caused armed groups that are with the minorities to refuse to lay down their arms until now. The other one is just economic. The country was destroyed by years of civil war and, frankly, international neglect of the problem, which led to one of the greatest refugee crises, certainly in the 21st century. And so basically he now is trying to rebuild the country.

14:00Until now, the main avenue of discussion with the United States has been lifting U.S. sanctions on Syria, which President Trump has done over the course of this year and Congress is about to do with the passage of the National Defense Authorization Act. Okay. Authorities in Australia say they found the ISIS flag in the car of two men accused of killing 15 people on Bondi Beach over the weekend. The father and son pair allegedly behind the attack had reportedly traveled recently to the southern Philippines, apparently for military style training from Islamist militants there. What does this tell us about the threat posed by ISIS and similar groups worldwide?

14:42It tells us that ISIS is a franchise. It has some structure. So it's not quite Kentucky Fried Chicken, but it's something actually more nefarious and harder to deal with. And unfortunately, these issues are related. The Islamic State means a lot of things to a lot of people, but one of them is resistance to the United States and the West and also its global presence. And unfortunately, a lot of people in the process end up losing their lives. Andrew Tabler is a senior fellow at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy and a former National Security Council member under the first Trump administration.

15:17Andrew, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you.

15:27Coming up. The final step of becoming a naturalized citizen of the United States is an oath-taking ceremony. You might think it's a formality, and that years of paperwork and waiting in line to legally become an American is enough. But the oath is actually a necessary step, immigration lawyers say, and the Trump administration is taking advantage of that fact to deny citizenship to people from certain countries at the last second. Indira has that story in just a minute.

16:29Thank you. you listen to podcasts and discover stories of impact and possibility.

16:43For many immigrants, becoming a U.S. citizen is the culmination of years, sometimes decades, of work. The process finishes with an emotional ceremony where you raise your right hand and recite an oath of allegiance, swearing to support and defend the Constitution of the United States. But across the country, from Kentucky to upstate New York to San Diego, those ceremonies are being postponed or canceled. It's in response to sweeping changes to limit legal immigration for people from 19 countries after last month's shooting of two National Guard members in Washington, D.C. For more on what happens to those residents who are suddenly thrown into legal limbo, we're going to turn to Gail Breslow.

17:23She's the executive director of Project Citizenship, a nonprofit that provides legal services for immigrants in Massachusetts. Gail, welcome to Here and Now. Thank you for having me. So you serve multiple green card holders who were abruptly pulled out of their ceremonies in downtown Boston last week. What is happening to them now? Were they unable to become citizens? Well, those individuals are in limbo right now. We've had no further communication from USCIS. People indeed were pulled out of line if they hadn't gotten the cancellation notice in time. We have a total of 21 clients right now whose oath ceremonies have been canceled.

18:08And as you said in the lead-in, this is the culmination of a process that has involved significant vetting and background checking on their part. I mean, people have been fingerprinted. They have been photographed. The application for citizenship, which is 14 pages long, and then this is all vetted at an in-person interview with USCIS. that leads up to the ceremony. And of course, it's a years-long process that immigrants go through to be eligible for citizenship in the first place. That is correct. So what I want to understand is, does the fact that you haven't raised your right hand and taken an oath mean that even though you've done all that paperwork, you've gotten your stamps, everybody said, yes, you're okay, you're vetted, you're a citizen, if you don't get to raise your right hand, does that mean you're not a citizen?

18:59You don't receive your certificate of naturalization until that final oath of allegiance is taken. And so these individuals are not citizens until that takes place. And so how are you helping your clients who've gone through this now? Yeah, well, that's a great question. I mean, we have reached out to each and every one of them individually to let them know that we are going to fight for the benefits and rights that they have earned and deserve. We are exploring any legal avenue that might be available to us. And we're also, you know, attempting to communicate with USCIS to see what their requirements are going to be.

19:46I mean, the only information that was provided to these individuals is that the cancellation was due to unforeseen circumstances, is the wording, and that USCIS will advise them of any further action, including a rescheduled interview appointment or, you know, who knows what. But haven't the particular applicants who've been targeted, aren't they from specific countries that are under a travel ban? Haiti, Iran, Somalia, Cuba, some others, right? Yes, that's correct. And so what else is the Trump administration doing to delay legal immigration since these were people who were vetted and approved?

20:27Well, I mean, all along the way now, people are paused from those 19 countries in all respects. So we have over 250 clients from those 19 countries who, whether it's their oath ceremony was canceled or their interview with USCIS was canceled, are just in limbo. The Trump administration has announced that they're opening an enhanced security vetting center in Atlanta. This was announced last week. And it's unclear how long it will take for that to be operationalized or what additional measures they plan to take once it is. Gail Breslow is executive director of the Immigration Services Project Citizenship.

21:16Thanks for joining us.

21:21That's our show for today. Here and Now, Anytime comes from NPR and WBUR Boston. Today's stories were produced by Lynn Managon and Will Walkie. Today's editors were Mark Naven, Michael Scotto, and Kat Welch. Technical direction from Caleb Green, Matt Reed, and Marcel Damiano. Our theme music is by Mike Moschetto, Max Liebman, and me, Chris Bentley. Our digital producers are Alison Hagen and Grace Griffin. And Here and Now's executive producer is Alan Price. lots more to listen to and explore on hereandnow.org thanks for listening we'll be back with you tomorrow