Why Jan. 6 officers are suing to stop Trump's $1.8 billion allies fund

0:00WBUR Podcasts, Boston. It does an enormous disservice to the officers who risked their lives that day. And I think it, frankly, endangers all of us when he implicitly condones the possibility of political violence. A lawyer for the cops who defended the Capitol during the pro-Trump riot on January 6th says the administration's so-called anti-weaponization fund is corrupt, dangerous, and illegal.

0:39It's Thursday, May 21st, and this is Here and Now Anytime from NPR and WBR. I'm Chris Bentley.

0:49Today on the show, reaction from Havana over the American indictment of Cuba's former president, Raul Castro, and rumors of a possible attack by the United States. If they can defend themselves, I don't know. They certainly say they intend to. Also, political discourse in Washington can be heeded, but that's nothing new. Before the Civil War, an important abolitionist was savagely attacked on the Senate floor. While Sumner's not looking, Brooks approaches from the front, takes his cane, and starts to smash it over Sumner's head. What the caning of Sumner tells us 170 years later, coming up in about 15 minutes.

1:31But first, there is a new lawsuit seeking to dissolve the Trump administration's anti-weaponization fund. We've been covering this story for the last two days on this podcast. More analysis on that new fund on Tuesday and Wednesday's shows. To recap, this is nearly$1.8 billion that the government wants to give to people who claim they were unfairly targeted by the Biden Justice Department. Earlier this year, Trump sued the federal government over the leak of his tax returns. Rather than fight or seek to dismiss the case, the administration that he runs settled with the president, awarding him and his businesses immunity from tax audits and setting up that$1.8 billion fund.

2:18Critics call it a brazenly corrupt scheme that uses tax dollars to reward Trump's allies. Those critics now include two police officers who defended the Capitol from a violent pro-Trump mob that tried to prevent the certification of Joe Biden's 2020 election win. They're suing the administration over that plan, calling it a slush fund to, quote, finance the insurrectionists and paramilitary groups that commit violence, end quote, in the president's name. And we remember the president already granted clemency to those rioters. Brendan Ballou is founder of the Public Integrity Project, a nonpartisan organization that seeks to fight public corruption.

2:57He represents Metropolitan Police Department Officer Daniel Hodges and now-retired Capitol Police Officer Harry Dunn. Both were defending the Capitol on January 6, 2021. Brendan Ballou told Anthony Brooks the Anti-Weaponization Fund is ridiculous on its face. Yeah, the Department of Justice absolutely does not have the authority to be making these payments or setting up this slush fund. To have a settlement, you actually need a valid case or controversy. And the problem that they had with the underlying lawsuit that triggered all this, Donald Trump's lawsuit against the IRS, is that he was on functionally on both sides of that case.

3:34So there was no case, valid case to settle. But how are officers Hodges and Dunn harmed here? These were two men who defended of the Capitol on January 6th could have died that day. Officer Hodges was almost killed in particular. But the threat to them hasn't ended. By continuing to speak out about January 6th, they continue to receive credible threats from rioters or their supporters. And the money from this slush fund, if it actually goes out, is going to endanger them further because it's going to create an endorsement by the president for what these rioters are doing. And it's going to fund their paramilitary and militia activities.

4:11So if this fund continues, it is absolutely going to increase the danger for these officers. Officer Hodges testified on Capitol Hill last year about political violence and what happened to him on January 6th. So let's listen to a little bit of what he said. I am intimately familiar with political violence as when I fought to defend the United States Capitol and many of your very lives. I was beaten, bloodied, crushed with my eye gouged and my skull smashed with my own baton. And Brendan Ballew, you made this case just a moment ago about how this fund will further endanger Officer Hodges' safety.

4:48You explained that. What are you seeking in the lawsuit? Any damages? No, not now. What we are trying to do is get the fund dissolved. You know, the fund doesn't have a legal right to exist. It doesn't have the right to disperse the money that it claims it's going to. The thing to do here is to stop any disbursement of funds and to make sure that the fund ceases to exist. So at a briefing on Tuesday, CNN's Caitlin Collins asked Vice President J.D. Vance why he won't rule out giving taxpayer money to anyone who assaulted a police officer on January 6th. Here's how Vance responded. Because, Caitlin, there are people who I don't know their individual circumstances and I don't rule things out categorically when I know nothing about a person's individual circumstances.

5:31Let's say a person is accused, let's say hypothetically, a person is accused of doing something that they never actually did, that they got a kangaroo court, that they had a judge who mistreated them. I think that we should look at those things case by case. Brendan Ballew, what do you make of the vice president's response there? I'm frankly shocked that somebody like J.D. Vance would say things like that, given that the rioters that we're talking about tried to kill his direct predecessor. You know, these are rioters that we had a 100 percent success rate in convictions and jury trials. The people who attacked the Capitol tried to kill those inside, attacked officers and so forth.

6:11None of those convictions were vacated on appeal for political, you know, as being vindictive or politically motivated. So I think it does an enormous disservice to the officers who risked their lives that day. I think it does a disservice to the prosecutors who prosecuted those cases. And I think it, frankly, endangers all of us when he implicitly condones the possibility of political violence. Let me ask you one more question about this fund. I mean, critics, and you're among them, you know, see this as audaciously corrupt. Trump sues the government that he runs. He settles the lawsuit by, among other things, setting up a scheme to hand over$1.8 billion of taxpayer money to his allies.

6:54The Trump administration's response seems to be, you know, you can't rush to judgment. That's hypothetical. We'll just have to see. No decisions have been made. No payouts have actually been talked about or made. What's your response to that? I think it's already clear how this money is going to be spent. The president last year said that he supported the idea of paying rioters. And the rioters that the president supports says that they're going to apply for money. is entirely consistent with everything that these administration officials have said and with what these rioters have said that this money is going to go to the people who attack the Capitol and attack my clients.

7:33Brendan, one of your clients, Harry Dunn, is also a Democratic candidate for a Maryland congressional seat. Does that complicate his case in any way, perhaps making this lawsuit appear political? No. You know, I've been working with Harry for several years now. We brought a case against the architect of the Capitol for refusing to install the plaque to honor the January 6th officers as required by law. You know, he has been speaking out and advocating on this stuff well before he was running for office. He's running for office because he cares about these things. He's not doing this for a political gain.

8:10He's doing this to protect his safety and to protect the safety of his fellow officers. Brendan Ballou, founder of the Public Integrity Project, which is a nonpartisan organization that seeks to fight public corruption. Brendan, thanks so much for joining us today. We appreciate it. Thank you.

8:29Coming up next, we get reaction from Cuba on the American plan to overthrow that country's government. Indira Lakshmanan has that story after the break.

8:48The Trump administration is ramping up the pressure on Cuba this week in its campaign to topple the country's communist regime. The Department of Justice announced criminal charges against former Cuban President Raul Castro and five others yesterday, and the USS Nimitz strike carrier group entered the Southern Caribbean Sea in a show of force a few hundred miles south of the island. Florida Republican Congresswoman Maria Salazar is the daughter of Cuban exiles, and she grew up in Miami's Little Havana neighborhood. At a press conference yesterday, she sent a warning to Cuba's regime. So I'm talking to Raul, to the cousin, to the nephew, to the son and to the grandson.

9:29Pay attention and look what happened to Maduro. It's time for you guys to go because there is a new sheriff in town and that sheriff is Donald Trump. Well, she's referring to Nicolás Maduro, the deposed leader of Venezuela. Let's bring in Cristiana Mesquita now. She's in Cuba's capital, Havana, where she reports for the Associated Press. Cristiana, welcome back. It's good to be back, Candela. Good afternoon. So earlier this week, you told us about the constant electricity blackouts and devastating food and fuel shortages. If the power is out and the Internet is down most of the time, has news of Raul Castro's indictment even reached the Cuban people yet?

10:16Yes, it has, surprisingly. The Gramma, the official newspaper, had this story as soon as it broke as soon as that press conference in Florida was over. And there was quite a fast reaction from the government with the president posting on social media saying that the Justice Department was lying and that it was a political move with no legal basis. We were out in the streets talking to people and they were, you know, baffled by, you know, why those charges were being brought up now and anxious about what it meant. And they kept saying, you know, Castro is not Maduro, so they don't want to compare the operation in Venezuela that resulted in Maduro being taken away from the country with something like this happening in Cuba.

11:33Raul Castro has a much more low profile in terms of his day-to-day and his routine. We know nothing about that. All right. Well, Christiana, we'll get to that. But first, just briefly, briefly remind our listeners what Raul Castro has been indicted for. He's been indicted for a 1996 event when Cuban Air Force shut down two planes that were operated by a Miami organization called Brothers to the Rescue. and the charges are, you know, for murder, destruction of property, all carrying very long sentences. Of course, the Cuban version is that they did invade Cuban airspace and we actually know this for a fact because there were previous flights by the same organization when they threw leaflets over the cities, and they say that the plane was given repeated warnings.

12:52Right. So, Cristiana, Raul is now 94 years old. He stepped down from the presidency nearly a decade ago. Are Castro family members still in power, controlling things behind the scenes, even though there's no longer Castro in charge of the government? Well, Raul Castro definitely is. if not on a day-to-day basis, you know, hands on the government. He's such an iconic figure because he's the last big name of the revolution and of the Castro family. So he still has a voice. There is no doubt about it. And if there is any negotiations going on, I'm sure he's been part of it in some shape or form. Well, let's get to the key question here, which is, is Cuba preparing for a potential attack from the United States and how could it defend itself if so?

13:55They say they are. We are not aware of any practical military preparation. but it is a country where just about everybody did military service. It's mandatory. So they have some kind of training. We have seen, you know, civilian militia doing some updated training in different parts of the country as well. But it's very low key. If they can defend themselves, I don't know. They certainly say they intend to. All right. Well, we'll see whether it comes to pass something big or whether it's a distraction from the Iran war or other things. We'll keep watching it. That's Christiana Mesquita with the Associated Press speaking to us from Havana, Cuba.

14:50Christiana, thanks so much. You're welcome.

14:56We have covered a lot of heavy politics today, from political violence to threats of coups. You hear a lot of news cliches about Congress being bitterly divided or polarized these days. But before you go thinking it's worse than it's ever been, consider what it was like 170 years ago when an infamous incident on the Senate floor set a new low for political discourse. Coming up, Anthony Brooks discusses what we can still learn today from the caning of Charles Sumner. Stick around.

15:40If you think the state of civil political discourse is broken down in America these days, consider how bad it was 170 years ago. May 22nd, 1856 still stands as a low point for Congress. That's when a slave-owning representative from South Carolina used a cane to attack and beat Massachusetts Senator Charles Sumner, who was vehemently opposed to slavery. Sumner was left unconscious in a pool of blood. It was a violent event that demonstrated the deep political divisions in the years before the Civil War. David Freudberg is host of the public radio show and podcast Humankind. His new radio documentary is called Ahead of His Time, The Story of Charles Sumner.

16:26And David is with us now. Welcome back. It's good to have you, David. Good to see you. I want to sort of come back to the present for a moment because the caning of Sumner in 1856, you know, it stands out as this low point in Senate decorum. But we've seen some tough situations on Capitol Hill recently. So here's one recent example from November 2023 when Senator Mark Wayne Mullen, who is now Secretary of Homeland Security, challenged Teamsters President Sean O 'Brien to a fight during a hearing. You want to run your mouth? We can be two consenting adults. We can finish it here. OK, that's fine.

17:01Perfect. You want to do it now? I'd love to do it right now. Well, stand your butt up then. You stand your butt up. Oh, hold on. Stop it. Is that your solution? No, no. Sit down. Sit down. You're a United States senator. Actively. Sit down, please. We should point out that Mullen and O 'Brien didn't come to blows. And by the way, that was Senator Bernie Sanders of Vermont who helped restore order by admonishing them to behave. But David, take us back. Tell us more about the attack on Sumner. Well, the historian Joanne Freeman has calculated that there have been over 70 physical assaults in the U.S.

17:40Congress in the couple of decades leading up to the Civil War. So this kind of stuff was not unheard of. In fact, at one point, there was a massive brawl and apparently almost everybody in Congress was assaulted or doing the assaulting. Sumner had been speaking fervently against slavery. He understood its evil. He was not going to tolerate people defending it. And there was a U.S. senator, was actually the chair of the Judiciary Committee at that time, Andrew Pickens Butler, who was being accused by Sumner of rape, of abusing female slaves. and this was considered an outrageous event. And his nephew, who was a congressman from South Carolina, also a slaveholder, walked into the U.S.

18:45Senate, had a gutta perch a cane that was gold tipped and started smashing Charles Sumner on the head, inflicted a gash about an inch long, gave him a concussion. He suffered what we now recognize as PTSD, lying in a pool of blood on the floor of the Senate. Wow. I want to ask you more about Sumner. So he wanted racial equality in the country, not just the abolition of slavery. So here's some more sound from your documentary. It's Zakhar Tamiz, author of the book, Charles Sumner, Conscience of a Nation. He grew up as a young boy seeing black kids going to school because the local African-American school was just a few hundred feet from his home.

19:31He grew up seeing blacks go to church and go to work. From a young age, he was just intimately familiar with the lives of ordinary African-Americans in the city of Boston. So, David, this is really interesting. So he grew up in an integrated part of Boston. Talk more about other events and experiences that helped shape Sumner's belief. A lot of Bostonians at that time were against slavery. But Sumner actually recognized that the underlying evil was inequality between the races. He was a young lawyer, and he decided to file a lawsuit on behalf of a family that was living in Boston. Their young daughter, Sarah Roberts, was prohibited from attending her nearby public school because she was black.

20:21And Sumner recognized this as a great injustice. Unfortunately, the Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts did not uphold Sumner's case. But there was a remarkable thing that happened in that he was joined as co-counseled by an African-American attorney. And there were virtually no African-American attorneys in the United States at that time. It was a radical act, but it spoke to Charles Sumner's commitment to equality. When you started this project on Charles Sumner, did you have an understanding of the full extent of his legacy? I did not, which, you know, it just intrigued me. Who was this guy?

21:04What did he do? On what basis did somebody assault him in the U.S. Senate? And I recognize that he was a man of conscience who was willing to take risks because injustices needed to be corrected. And he was the person whom history selected to perform that. All right. Well, it's quite a story. David Freudberg is the host of the public radio show and podcast Humankind. His new radio documentary is called Ahead of His Time, The Story of Charles Sumner. David, thank you so much for coming in today. I learned a lot. I'm really grateful that you came in. Good to be with you.

21:47There's more to that conversation, including how Sumner's work contributed to the Brown v. Board of Education case that desegregated schools in the 20th century. And you can listen to it all right now at hereandnow.org. Here and Now Anytime comes from NPR and WVUR Boston. Today's stories were produced by Jill Ryan, Mark Navin, Will Walkie, and Julia Corcoran. our editors were Todd Munt, Michael Scotto, and Kat Welch technical direction from Caleb Green and Matt Reed our theme music is by Mike Moschetto, Max Liebman and me, Chris Bentley our digital producers are Allison Hagen and Grace Griffin and Here and Now's executive producer is Alan Price click that follow button so you don't miss any new episodes of Here and Now anytime tomorrow our series Reverse Course returns with a look at some climate solutions from AI and wildfires yes, there is a connection to sheep and solar panels.

22:41Ditto. Thanks for listening. Back with you tomorrow.