Hayley Paige: What I Wish I Knew Before My Name Became The Brand (it almost cost me everything)

25:18And for some reason, I was saying if I took a beat or I pushed back or I negotiated it all, I would lose the opportunity and I would lose focus on my craft. And I really believed that. I thought like you can't have this creative brain and also have these business skills. You're just one or the other. And I think that just was me choosing a lane and saying, you know, if I perform enough over here, it is not going to matter. It'll all just come together. Right. So I think I would have to find a way to explain that to younger me that you're not compromising your craft by doing this. And that also there are so many companies out there and there are so many opportunities.

26:01I was hardwired to believe you get one shot. You know, maybe that's gymnastics too. It's like you get one chance to stick the routine. And if you don't, you fall and you're not going to the Olympics. You know, like that's kind of the pattern. And I would have tried at least, but I don't know if I would have listened. Some lessons you just can't, you can't be taught them. You have to experience it and you have to survive it because that's the only way you're going to learn. You know, and I don't feel victimized by what happened. And I just feel like I learned some good lessons. OK, so let's get into what happened.

26:34So you're 25. You signed this contract. You're given your dream opportunity. What happens from here? I just get right to work. And a lot of it was sunshine and rainbows because I was so happy to be a wedding dress designer. And at 25, to me, even at that age, I was like, don't mess this up. You know, like I would tell myself, just stay focused. You're going to do great. You know, just put your pen to paper or pencil to the sketch and kick it up a notch, you know. And so I really just got into it. You know, with what I do, there's such an emotional layer to it that you have to show up and match the energy every single day.

27:16Like there are no off days because you just don't want to ruin someone's experience, you know. And when they're coming in and they're the bride and it's there and they're coming to you like this, you know. And I like I better match that and not feel like I'm exhausted, you know, like to hell with your exhaustion. Like this is her moment. Like this is main character energy every single day. And so I think I was just more focused on the psychology of it and making sure I could get that right and give enough of myself to to what I was doing. So, yeah, I didn't really like, oh, this isn't going well on any other facet.

27:51I just was over here. It's this is great. So let's focus over here. How long was it great for? A long time. I really just worked, worked and worked and enjoyed the process and saw it growing. And social media was so supportive, like the community over there. I'm so lucky I've had very little negative interactions on socials. And I also feel like our brand has always been very inclusive, like not performatively inclusive, just like we're a team. It's a sisterhood. You're in it. You know, like that's the qualification, you know. And so I've really led with that from the beginning. And so we'd never had like this feeling of you can't sit with us.

28:35And that was great because you feel like you're growing together. You're growing with your brides. And that momentum is pretty unstoppable. The very beginning of 2019, things started to kind of unravel. and then we led into this like negotiation period for the contract because my long-term contract was coming to an end so that meant i had to like negotiate and hire a lawyer for the first time and sit at the table you know and exercise some different mental muscles and what take me back to that moment like you're at the table you're negotiating who are you up against really just the capital investor.

29:12At first, it was just, it's kind of just negotiating. You're talking, trying to figure things out, you know? And so in the beginning, I would say it was just something I had kind of been avoiding because I'm not great with confrontation. I do tend to tell people what they want to hear. Like, I was very aware of my own weaknesses in doing that. I'm not that anymore. I can say what's on my mind, you know, but it took a while to get there. But it dilly-dallied. That's a perfect way of saying it. It dilly-dallied and the goalposts kind of moved and the delta started to get wider. And then it started to get a little scary of just like, this is not going well.

29:51So from the beginning of 2019 and then I would say December of 2020, so a year and like three quarters of a year later, almost two years later, that was when I served a federal lawsuit during still negotiations basically we really don't talk enough about how much is actually asked of women's bodies and for me when everything feels like it's ever changing i really value having one part of my routine that stays the same which is where our sponsor ag1 fits into my life because it's truly the one thing that makes me feel like i've got myself together ag1 is a daily health drink it's got multivitamins prebiotics probiotics superfoods and antioxidants all in one scoop.

30:34Their next-gen formula is clinically shown to fill common nutrient gaps even in healthy eaters. It also supports immune defense, energy production, and gut health. Their CEO, Kat Cole, who is amazing, knowing that she is leading AG1, it makes me trust it even more. AG1 has over 50 ,000 verified five-star reviews and comes with a 90-day money-back guarantee. For a limited time, visit ag1.com slash HSR to get a free morning person hat with your first AG1 subscription. Okay, so to back up a little bit, like in the wedding industry, what I've seen is it's very common to name the brand after the designer.

31:12It's not as common to do that in other industries, but you're not alone. Obviously, Bobbi Brown, Jo Malone, Kate Spade, these are all women that have gone through a similar story, although they actually had an exit. So like they were able to kind of like park their brand, but not really be able to use their name commercially again. Yes. Was there ever a moment that you thought, I shouldn't call this brand Haley Page Bridal because there was ever a fear for you to not be able to use your name again commercially? Never. Never crossed my mind. My mom told me to get the domain Haley Page with Network Solutions when I was like 13 years old.

31:49And so I think it was almost innate in me that if I ever had a brand, it would be named Haley Page. and there was never this idea of like what's intellectual property and what are the precautions you'd want to take to protect your personhood if you ever do use it there were like those conversations that like it was just none of my business at that point you know I had no idea but looking at those people and honestly so many of them have been benchmarks so nuanced in every single scenario and what you said about an exit is the number one thing I tell people now is that when you sign a contract, make sure there's a ripcord.

32:30That there is like a way for both parties to exit if things don't go well. That's fair. You know, and that like there is a way out. Because technically in my scenario, there really wasn't that opportunity for me. And I had to resign under duress because I was served a lawsuit while still working at the company, you know? And so like, that is never ideal. You don't wish that on anyone, but you know, to have those kinds of checks and balances in the contract is a paramount. Yes. No, I can a hundred percent relate. The craziest contract I've obviously done is my prenup and there is like rip cords on every single possible scenario.

33:09And it's like the most unsexy thing to ever try to do when you're trying to get married, but it's to protect both people. So you don't have that. You're working at this company. You're designing under your name. You're a standout success. You have$220 million of revenue to your name for this company. And all of a sudden, the negotiation starts going south. When did you realize that there could be a moment where you might not be ever able to use your name, Haley Page, again commercially? That moment did not happen until the first hearing. We were served in, I want to say December 14th. The hearing was like two days, three days later.

33:45And the judge ruled from the bench, which means sometimes when you go into a hearing, there's like a discussion and back and forth. Everyone gives their arguments. And then the judge takes a minute to like decide. But it was ruled from the bench. And in that exact moment, I couldn't use my name in any business or commerce or even to publicly identify because of the brand being a personal brand, I had to turn over my social media passwords. So anything that bared my name, Snapchat, TikTok, Pinterest, Instagram, all these ones that I had been chatting up, you know, my besties and boyfriends. And, you know, I had to like hand over all those messages, which was terrifying.

34:27But yeah, it happened like this. And then there was a preservation order in place, which anyone that doesn't know, that's you can't touch anything. You can't go in and like delete messages or like change the history. And if you're caught, you're in big trouble, you know? So, and I'm, I follow the rules. Like I'm like that kind of girl. And so for me, I was like, Oh my God. So how do you think it got to that place? Cause I think a lot of people with the same situation working for someone, like to get to that extreme of a place feels like it's almost like that could never happen to me. Why do you think your former employer under Haley Page wanted all of that IP, social media accounts, like you to never be able to commercially use your name again?

35:09I don't know what I thought, to be honest, or even now, because it's really hard to understand the motivation. I would say in being graceful and answering that, it's just when you're a business, you want to protect what you're building. And I'm very much of the mindset that there are lots of ways to protect your intellectual property or your proprietary interests as a company that don't involve these very one-sided or overbearing contracts. But at the same time, it's just kind of business, you know, and if you don't know the law, the law is going to decide for you. And I didn't really know how that worked.

35:51And a prenup is a perfect example. It gets this really tarnished concept going into a marriage, But it's your opportunity to make your own rules, to make your own laws in your marriage. Because if you don't have that, it results to the state. And then that goes back to humans that are basically going to be interpreting and deciding for you. And do you want someone else to decide that? Or would you rather you too decide it before you go in and when you're happy, you know, and things are going really well? Like that's the same thing with a business is to have that mindset. Like we can have happy negotiation and figure this out so that we can make the rules rather than a court system.

36:30So I'm still stuck on like how you go to the negotiating table. You have a lawyer for the first time. You're up against your former employer. Like how does this get so ugly so fast? Like why were you guys not able to find a contract that could be mutually beneficial with each other? That's a great question. And I'm not sure I know how to answer because with so much of any lawsuit, it's personal. It becomes personal very quickly because of entitlements and feelings like I did this and I did this. And it's just the natural progression of a litigation. And in the very beginning, you have so much of this.

37:05You have an opportunity to make your arguments and it gets real creative. You know, it is not like the law is you tell the truth and then whoever tells the truth wins. Like, no, it's who can make the best argument. That's it. And then how does the judge interpret it? And it's unsexy, but it's humans basically deciding. And a lot of it, it's not so much that it's unjust. It's just that you're at the mercy of subjectivity. And that's important to know. Any young kid should know that even going into adulthood is the law is something that's interpretable. And when you can arm yourself with the right knowledge, you can use it to your benefit.

37:45And it also can help you protect your business and anything you're putting out into the world. So it's all a very positive thing. It's just in my way, it was very volatile. It was an extreme case, too. It wasn't business as usual in a court system because even looking at Kate Spade, looking at Bobby Brown, a lot of those companies, they actually did sell their name. I didn't sell my name. I gave the rights for it to be trademarked in exchange for a job. I had to work at that job to get my salary. So that's like a real fact, whereas a lot of these other companies, they got paid a certain amount of money in a non-compete to sit out of the industry.

38:24Sometimes it can be fair. Maybe it's a million dollars a year to sit out of an industry. For me, I was not getting paid. So even though the contract seemed to have benefits to a royalty, I was not getting paid my royalty on the dresses that were still being sold. So I was under an unpaid non-compete. So there's just differences to it. Mine was just so extreme. it's actually sometimes hard to say like, yeah, this experience is going to, what I went through is going to help you somehow. But it does because it's, there's still baseline things you can do to make sure you're not in this scenario. And if that is the, hopefully the best thing that comes out of my situation is that that girl that goes in for a big dream job doesn't feel like she absolutely has to give it all away to get her opportunity.

39:10I also see this just in general with women entrepreneurs and startups. Like, I don't know if you're familiar with the brand Coastal Caviar. I am friends with her and I just had a conversation with her two nights ago. So I've been watching this drama. Girl, winter is so last season. And now spring's got you looking at pictures of tank tops with hungry eyes. Your algorithm is feeding you cutoffs. You're thirsty for the sun on your shoulders. That perfect hang on the patio sundress. Those sandals you can wear all day and all night. And you've had enough of shopping from your couch. Done hoping it looks anything like the picture when you tear open that envelope?

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40:38to be like, I've been through this. It is a strong sisterhood, let me tell you. I love when people send me the DMs. I get like 100. Jo Malone's video, you should see how many people sent me that video. And then Coastal Caviar, that was a very unique case. We tried to help through our nonprofit because we do offer pro bono and low bono attorney referrals. And when we went through the case, it was really tricky. Again, everything is always very nuanced. But what was really exciting is that she was able to pivot and now it's it's club coastal and she just you know announced her store and she's got this rally in this community behind her and the conversation we had was really like what is in a name it's you you are the name no matter what the name is and it's like this really beautiful appreciation for like nothing will ever take away your input and your value that you're bringing to your brand, even if so much is stripped away.

41:35I loved the way she documented this. And I think this is the amazing era of social media and being these founder-led brands. It's like there's no one telling you what you can and cannot post. And so I feel like she in the public court is winning. People are rooting for her. People are wanting her to succeed. And I feel like the same was so true for you because obviously the legal court initially declines everything. You're like handing over your social media accounts, your IP, your name, your likeness, but the public court swayed your opinion. How can you break down the difference between the public court and the legal court and why both of them are so important?

42:11They're so important and they're so different. I would say the public court is really what made everything happen. And in my opinion, that is the reason I'm sitting here right now. That is the reason I'm Haley Page again. Not because, oh, I fought it out and I'm resilient. I was like, No, it is the individual people that showed up for me on social media, people I don't even know on a personal basis that showed up for me and really just brought this rally of ethics and reputation. I think when you're in a legal court, there's a tendency to lose the narrative. Because in my experience, I was feeling mischaracterized.

42:54What was going on in the court did not match my personal experience, which is very scary. However, on social media, I had all these girls that were like, wait, this doesn't make sense. I met you at this drunk show. And wait, what? You're not getting paid for these restaurants? This makes no sense. And so I didn't even really have to do anything, they did so much of the lifting for me, you know, which was so like to this day, I just can't believe I had that kind of faith and belief in me from these people. But that I would have had that over a court ruling any day. I like even if I was I was thrown in jail, you know what attention in a way that was really honest.

43:41And I was trying to be as honest as possible. You know, in a legal system, it was not working. But out here in the real world, it was. And so thank God, because that is really what shifted the tide for me. And my former employer went bankrupt in 2023, so about three years into the litigation. I got pushed into a bankruptcy court, and that's when the numbers get put out on the table. It's one of those situations in hindsight, I like I look back and I was like, oh, it wasn't that bad, you know, but like in the moment, you know, your soul is on its knees. You've been roundhouse kicked to the face in your decision making mess.

44:16Like, that's what I was feeling because I did feel the responsibility. Like, I got myself into this mess and I didn't want people to feel like, oh, poor me. It was like, oh, my gosh, I've let you down. And I'm going to try to figure this out because clearly this isn't working. But what also made my case unique is because it was so extreme. We went to the appellate court twice. You have the same case, same facts presented to a different court, and they make a different decision. And that's what's interesting is it's like it's still humans deciding. So it does kind of depend what court you're in, you know.

44:50And the Second Circuit is the one that found the social media ruling in my favor and changed the case law. And so I was really grateful for that. But the rally and the love I felt in the public court, nothing will ever replace that feeling because that kept my soul alive. Like that kept me like very steady in a crazy court system, you know, like but I had her still. She knew who I was. I feel like we got our time together and she didn't feel like I was tarnishing her. And she told me that, you know, like metaphorically, it was just such a nice thing to experience that. and that's why I want to give it back.

45:29I want somebody else to feel that. So I'm lucky. Do people relate your story to David versus Goliath a lot? Yes. How does it make you feel? Wonderful. It makes you feel like the little guy can win and that the mighty spirit and good prevails. If someone's listening to this that feels helpless, they're in a situation, whether it's personal, professional, what would you want them to hear? it's temporary it's temporary everything the moment you're feeling right now on this like destruction in your life it's temporary and it's and so are the high moments you're like you're never going to be up here all the time and so to appreciate the contrasts of your life and the depth that you feel emotionally i think actually makes you build your fortitude it compounds and it allows you to build the tolerance to deal with circumstances that are just trying to beat you up.

46:31So ultimately you ended up paying$263 ,000 in May 2024 in a settlement to buy your name back, your social media accounts, your IP, your sketches, and release you from your non-compete. Was that the most amount of money you had ever spent up until that moment? Oh yeah. Well actually no no because i had spent so much more money in legal fees prior to that so i basically had spent all my money fighting and litigation i like spent all the money i made making dresses to fight for my right to design dresses again which is just a funny it's not poetry but it's something ironic that's what it is but at that point where we're in negotiation it really just came down to the fact that there was an opportunity.

47:16And if I could put some money on the table in this scenario, and this was advice of my business advisors, you know, this isn't something that I was like, oh, I have an idea. You know, like this is not on me. I had these amazing people, a charrette around me that were protecting me. And they were like, I have a business mentor. I have my fiance. Like these guys are smart, you know, and lawyers that are just ready to go to bat for me. And they were like, you got to put some money on the table because in a

47:44which means vendors aren't being paid, employees. Like in a bankruptcy, you know, you can put the math together, right? And so it was really just about, can I get to a number where it's meaningful and just take it all? Because I didn't want to piecemeal it. At that point, I'd already rebranded. I was ready to be Cheval. Like, we're moving on. You know, I'm still going to try to fight, but like, we're moving on. And then I was like, wait, can I get it back? Because if I can, let's try. And that's basically what the vibe was. Let's put enough money out there so we can get it. And I have angels around me, I'll just say, because that was how that number came to be.

48:24that is someone who truly believes in themselves and bets on themselves to put money up of that level instead of just pivoting and being like i'm done like i've fought this like i need to just put this money into like a new thing and keep going what was inside of yourself that just trusted you to like bet on yourself again i did feel lucky that the support system i had reminded me of my credibility that I had been in the industry for 12 years, 13 years. I built up this dressography that women fell in love with. I grew into my name as a designer. And yes, people identified me that way. But we all kind of got to this collective moment where it was like, we are going to be okay, no matter what happens.

49:17And when you have that feeling that like collective like release of like, I'd like to have my name back. Do I need it? No. It gave me negotiating power and leverage to say, I actually could walk away from this. And so that was a nice mindset to walk into that and to also say, like, I will still be able to design wedding dresses in 2027. It's a long ways away, but I will wait for it and it'll be a different name. And I was perfectly fine with that. It would have been a little bit of a, you know, grin and bear it, but I was having fun with shoes. I was building a new brand and that was more than enough.

49:55How could I even be asking for more at that point? You know, like most people don't get that arrangement of things to happen, you know? And so I just felt the gratitude and going in and saying, let's give it a shot. And if I get it, we're going to get back to dress design ASAP. You definitely have an internal locus of control where like you believe like I'm in control of my destiny. Things are not happening to me. Like I can change what I'm doing. I am so passionate about women being able, what I call having fuck you money to be able to leave any room that they no longer feel respected in and be able to walk away.

50:34And a lot of the time we think about that as it relates to personal dynamic women that, you know, maybe haven't worked, they've been the child bearer and they are no longer being respected by their husband, but like they don't have the money to walk away. You obviously have been able to use money to literally buy freedom. Why should every woman strive for having that, what I call fuck you money, to be able to leave those rooms or those situations that no longer serve them? There are going to be moments in your life where you get a seat at the table. And there are going to be moments when you know you need to get up and leave that table.

51:11And there is something about knowing you will be okay no matter what when you get up from the table. But if you have a little extra leverage, it does make a difference. And in my scenario, it would be dishonest for me to say that had I not had the ability to put some money on the table, I wouldn't have been able to get my name back in that moment. Now, there's a chance it would have still gone through bankruptcy court. Maybe I could have gotten it for even less. Who knows? In a bankruptcy court, how that happens. But I didn't know that at the time. And being able to put some numbers up made a big difference.

51:56I think a lot of times women feel this stigma with finance and with money. And getting more comfortable with it is a process. And knowing that you're deserving of it and that you work your freaking ass off to get it, there is nothing wrong with money, honey. And good for you. So I mean, that's my message. I know that not everyone strives to have that kind of, you know, fuck you money, you know, like, I was like a alien, I swear. But like, not everybody does. But my gosh, if it is something you want for yourself, go get it. Like, go get it. And don't let anything stop you. Use it to benefit. Everyone else led.

52:39So why can't you? Why not you? You keep using my favorite word ever, leverage. When someone's listening to that and they don't really know what that is, can you explain leverage? It's the quiet power to have an upper hand. And it doesn't have to be nasty. It doesn't have to be something that you carry with animosity or weaponized necessarily. It's just a knowingness that you are in control of your own decision. And you can probably make a situation better, not just for yourself, but for everyone using it in the right way. so now that you own your name back and you've been through this entire situation which like most people won't be in this exact situation but even from our example of coastal caviar like this happens when there's a new business owner that's listening to this thinking of naming their their brand their personal brand like how important is the name of your brand and would you ever recommend to someone else even if they're an aspiring designer with the industry the way that it is that they ever call their brand after their personal name.

53:54I think there's nothing wrong with it. I just feel you have to armor yourself. Trading at Schwab is now powered by Ameritrade, giving you even more specialized support than ever before. Like access to the trade desk, our team of passionate traders ready to tackle anything from the most complex trading questions to a simple strategy gut check. Need assistance? No problem. Get 24-7 professional answers and live help and access support by phone, email, and in-platform chat. That's how Schwab is here for you to help you trade brilliantly. Learn more at schwab.com slash trading. Whatever your thing, it could be anything.

54:31Canva helps you make that thing a thing. Canva is a simple online tool thing. It's a way to design with our magic AI tool things. You can social media your thing, Generate images or videos of your thing. Make decks or presentations to show your thing. Whatever needs to be done for your thing, Canva can make it an even better and bigger thing. Canva, the thing that makes anything a thing. You have to go in with the right team of lawyers and show up prepared to make sure you're protecting your IP. And it's as simple as that. It's just making sure that you've got full ownership and understanding how licensing works and structures of royalties and getting into the legalese of things because it actually is pretty simple to map out and find a way.

55:22And going back to the idea of when you're going into a business partnership, everybody has some kind of benefit to add, some value add. You can still add value. They can still add value. And you can still have full ownership over your IP. and like period end of story like that's how it works if anybody is really putting you in a position where you feel like you have to give that up or lose control of that it's probably not the right partnership maybe there's a scenario where you're getting paid and fuck you money i said it twice now mom i'm sorry maybe there's a scenario there but like seriously make sure it is worth it just make sure and go through your due diligence so eventually 2.2 million people watched you announce your name on social media for the first time when you said i am hayley page i got chills when i watched that video what did it feel like for you remarkable it really did i felt so much pride in it and humility and gratitude attitude.

56:33I felt like I was saying it with people because there were moments during where I would run into people at the airport and they were like, oh my God, it's, and then they were like, wait, can I say your name? Like you, I would literally have those moments and I was like, oh my God, this is insane. You know? And so when I could say it again, I felt like I was saying it with everybody and that we did this. It wasn't just me, you know, it was like, we did this. And that felt really cool to kind of sit with everybody that helped me and let's ride it on, you know, like in wedding dresses. Fabulous shoes.

57:10No, I need to bring this up because so I talk a lot about like feminine and masculine energy, right? Because I think a lot of the women I have on this show, they're like building these empires. They've done the thing. And a lot of the time it's like you expend a lot of masculine energy when you're doing that. And you are a very feminine woman. You can just tell that when I'm sitting across from you. What Haley showed up for work every day when you're in these legal proceedings, you're negotiating, is that the feminine side of you that you use to your advantage? Or did you bring out that masculine energy to go and be able to do this on a day-to-day basis?

57:46I love that question. I've never thought of it in that context before. I loved choosing the name Cheval because it's a very masculine word. And it did make me feel like I'm running against the wind, you know. But in who I am, I feel like I still at the core am this very happy person. And I love my femininity. And I don't think it's like something to weaponize. But I do feel very secure in it. and that's helpful showing up in a room and as and showing up as a designer i think being really honest about that has helped me and it's not so much like oh i love unicorns and sparkle and like of course they do but it's a superpower in that way like using your imagination and feeling like this is something i never actually have to lose touch with even when you're going through something really dark where you've got to put your big girl pants on and you know show up and kind of pump your chest a little bit.

58:47And I would say it's just always there, that side, that feeling, because I feel most comfortable with her. And when I'm putting on a little bit too much of a performance, I do tend to deliver badly. Like, it's just not my normal tongue, you know? And so I would say I'm more feminine, even in those environments as well. I still feel like I can be very strong and powerful from the feminine side. I think that there's so much power when you can embrace your femininity and use it into your business, especially when it's a business for women. Have you ever felt the need to shy away from that side of you to be taken seriously in business now that you've gone through what you've gone through?

59:31Yes. And that's through little moments, not so overbearing. I giggle a lot and I notice it in interviews. I'm going to watch this back. You'd be like, oh, I laugh too much. You know, there's little things that I do that are still me. It's like little me in there. That's like trying to fill a silence or something, or maybe I'm feeling awkward. I don't know. I know those parts. But I would say there are moments where I'm not taken seriously because of the world I'm in and what I'm showing on social media. And I'm okay with that because I don't feel like I have to convince everyone that I've got a brain as well and I've been through hell and I actually full-on know how to combat like I do.

1:00:16I know I can show up for myself. I guess it's I just feel secure in that so I don't have to feel so much like I need to change who I am. But I would say the lessons in it are where the patterns need to be undone. So really making sure I'm looking through contracts now, just thinking twice before jumping into a partnership, how I relay bad news to people, you know, like those things all require a delivery that's really important and to be taken seriously. And so it's really about finding that balance for yourself because you can't go so far of a departure because you start to feel like you're performing.

1:00:56So, so far it's a balance that's working for me. Sometimes I wish I could be a little more assertive and like sexier, you know, like when you see these girls on social media and I'm just like, oh, my God, I would never, you know, and but like there's a side of me that's like, could I, you know, and so it's fun to kind of think about it as you grow as a woman, you know, but I also am like, but I am who I am. And I want other women to feel that, too. Like, I want them to feel like they can be their own person, not feel like you have to be this to get this. So we'll find out if I get hot, smart, and rich.

1:01:36You already are. Everyone keeps asking me how I've grown HSR's Instagram so fast with such an engaged community, and it has nothing to do with me. It's possible for a few reasons. Number one, this community. Number two, my HSR team. I have very little to do with it because I don't want to be the type of founder who's approving captions and bottlenecking the team. Number three, because the HSR team has a secret project management tool that helps them plan, manage, and approve all social content. It's called Rella, and it's now one of our sponsors. Rella was started by an HSR Angel founder, Natalie.

1:02:11Shout out, Natalie. Hello. And it's been such an honor to watch Natalie build this and see how helpful her platform is for social teams trying to grow, plan, give feedback, and approve content quickly. Rella makes it so easy to stay organized and move fast. It is a no-brainer for any HSR Angel trying to grow their own social channel. So head to GetRella.com and use code HSR for 10 % off your first three months or annual plan. For the first half of my career, I wasn't allowed to take credit for my own work. I couldn't talk about what I was building, and I couldn't use my own voice. I absolutely hated it.

1:02:47One day, I decided that things had to change, so I became a creator myself. I built HotSmart Rich as a platform where I could share my insights and own every single word. But But if there's one thing I've learned, it's that growing a following requires consistency, which is a lot easier said than done. Stanley, the AI content machine developed by our sponsor Stan, would have been the biggest help to me when I was first starting our channel because Stanley is specifically designed to make it easier for you to post content every single day. You connect it to your Instagram, it learns your tone of voice, and knows exactly what your audience is actually going to resonate and engage with.

1:03:23And it helps you create content based off of that. We just started using it on HSR and it is unbelievable. Give Stanley a try for free at getstanley.ai slash mecky. I think you've had an amazing comeback, specifically collaborating with influencer Rachel Martino and designing the wedding dress at the Bad Bunny Super Bowl. This is like within a few months of your big comeback. Was this a really well thought out PR? We're going to come back and like make a huge blast and do these huge things. Or was this like just organic opportunities that just came about and just happened to fall in your comeback era?

1:04:01Fell right into the comeback era. Very organic. Nothing big strategy, big picture. There is a lot of bootstrapping and relaunching in general and just putting yourself out there. And one of the things I always tell younger designers is just to keep throwing up numbers. Keep putting in the reps. Keep, keep, keep, keep going. And on your worst days, you know, just stay consistent, you know. But when you look at wanting to cast a wide net, you have to think about PR. You have to think about opportunities, how to get your name out there, how to find like moments that are cultural, like the Super Bowl.

1:04:38And Rachel was just somebody I connected with on Instagram. Love her style. Love her. And we stayed in touch on Instagram. She was in need of a wedding dress. And it was literally a DM exchange. Like, I'm still looking. And I'm like, please let me make your dress. And it was just a very casual exchange. And she was like, oh, my God, yes. And so she came to Palm Beach. We got to do a design meeting. And I wanted to customize it for her because she had a very strong vision. and I always love working with brides that are like, I know what I want. You're going to execute it, but I know what I want.

1:05:10And that's fun because it's easier for me to say, okay, technically, I know how this is going to work. Technically, these things, they can't float, but they need to do this, you know? And so it's a fun collaboration that way. She's the most beautiful bride. Oh my gosh. And I loved that she wanted pink and floofy. So that was fabulous. The Super Bowl was just a connection. My sister is an amazing producer. She knows so many people in Los Angeles. And so she was like, oh, my friend who's a stylist is going to ask you for some dresses. Literally, that was it. And I was like, OK, you know. And so she reached out to me and said I need to borrow.

1:05:48Didn't really tell me much. Send some dresses. And then she told me, OK, it is for the Super Bowl. And I was like, what? This is insane. What do you mean this is for like bad bunny? Is he getting married? Like, or is it a dancer? Like, how is this going down? They couldn't, they kept it all under lock and key. She was like, there is a bride. We're going to have her try on a few dresses. I figured she would try on other designers. So there was no guarantee, but she ended up picking the Healy Page dress and it, I got to watch it unfold in real time with my team. And it was, yeah, I could not, but I was like, this is the biggest moment of my whole life.

1:06:23Sorry, honey. I know we're getting married, but like my dress is at the Super Bowl. Like it was it was so cool. Yeah. I can't believe it to this day that that happened. What happens after that moment? Like it was clear that it was a Haley Page dress. Everyone was wondering, is this a real wedding? What's the dress? Like what did you see in terms of like the data or even just the cultural impact of being associated with something like Bad Bunny in the Super Bowl? You see an immediate just influx of joy. You see it on social media. that went viral organically because I think people just wanted this happy moment and they got to watch it and the performance I thought was so great it just it was this really cool cultural shift and it was to the positive and so to be a part of it and have the dress there was like more than you could ever ask for as a designer aside from getting to do a dress from for you know Taylor Swift you Khloe Kardashian any of these people you know like that would be insane too but It's just these little moments that really make me feel so lucky to get to do what I do.

1:07:25And it definitely helps the brand. It's one of those things that just gives you a lot of visibility and culture as well. But it also takes me back to like, this is what I want every single bride to feel. And I hope she does on her wedding day when she's in her dress that she's feeling that. And like, what? Did I get to do that? Or just to be a part of it? Like that's, it's a little mini Super Bowls throughout the year. I wake up Saturday morning. So I'm like, somebody's getting married today. You know, like it's so cool. Is that how you think? Yes. So what is your wedding in terms of how big you're making it?

1:08:02Because if you think about a random person's wedding on a Saturday, like I am concerned for how you're thinking about your wedding, Haley Paige. I'm concerned for you about me. Yeah. Yes. What does your wedding mean to you? Because you put it on hold for a while while this was all going down. Yes, we did. We've been engaged seven years and we're so excited. I feel we've had this really robust and loving relationship. I'm so lucky because we've been through a lot and we've grown as people, but we've grown together, you know. And so to be looking at this moment that we get to celebrate finally and we've really come into who we are as new people, it just you you just can't help but smile and just want to make it the best day and hug everyone and wear like 10 dresses sad that I was gonna ask like how many dresses are we talking about I want to be ridiculous I'm sorry but I do um so we're gonna try to figure that out I appreciate so many designs now I've been at this so long that like and I was married before so going through it 12 years ago, I just was, I knew exactly what I wanted.

1:09:11And now I'm like, no, I'm, I'm all kinds of brides up in here. You know, like I could, I want to do this. I want to do a little of this, you know, and then a little of this. So we're going to have fun. And Conrad's got an amazing sense of style and aesthetic. So I feel like we can pull from his like taste and masculine energy, you know, which will make it really sophisticated and modern. And then I'm like an explosion of whimsy, you know, so we'll find a balance in there, I think, for the wedding, which is great. But the dresses, that's all me. And I'm just going to have the time of my life. Yes.

1:09:44Can we talk about the wedding industry? And there was this amazing cut article that came out of like every bride wants to have her wedding now featured in Vogue. And it's like this huge status symbol and coverage and like, especially for someone like you who like likely will be able to tell a story in a very... This episode is brought to you by State Farm. You know those friends who support your preference for podcasts over music on road trips? That's the energy State Farm brings to insurance. With over 19 ,000 local agents, they help you find the coverage that fits your needs. So you can spend less time worrying about insurance and more time enjoying the ride.

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1:11:51With that, it tends to make it feel really pressuring. And I can see from the perspective of an influencer or a girl who really wants a lot of visibility and wants this elevated moment, of course you want that. Of course you want to be featured in Vogue and the New York Times and Dream Big. And when you watch Wedding Wars, should we get married at the plaza? And it's like, I love that. I think that's such a beautiful aspirational quality of a wedding. But I don't think it's necessary. and I don't think it's this like it's this benchmark of like you're not going to have a good wedding if you don't get that and I hope that's a good message to like anyone because most people like they just want to have this amazing moment for themselves and celebrate their love and be with their people and wear a freaking fabulous dress you know and like if you get that right like nothing else really matters and that would just be like sprinkles on Sunday.

1:12:46You know, it would be pretty cool to have that. But if it's not in the cards for us, it's not in the cards, you know, so like it's we're OK not. But we're also like that'd be cool. So does getting into those publications raise your profile as a designer? Like if someone wears a Haley Page dress in Vogue, does it actually raise your profile and like help bring more opportunities to you as a designer? It's so curated and bespoke and elevated that you get this feeling immediately that your brand has this ability to range to this status level, right? At the same time, I feel like I've always wanted a brand that is designer and it's artistic, but it has a price range that's more accessible on some level because I do want to be able to like have range and start here, go all the way up to here.

1:13:39We can do custom dresses and you can't be everything to everyone. We have a very specific aesthetic. And so we are a niche brand house, but I just think it's hard to qualify anymore. It's hard to say if we're featured, we see this huge influx of followers or of brides coming into the stores. It's actually very hard to say this is the one thing that led to more of this to this because the industry now, it's so diversified and it's a bit chopped up as well. so it just it's harder to figure that out mathematically of like this leads to this because you can have an influencer who has no showmanship on any publications anymore and they wear your dress but they've got 50 000 die-hard girlfriends that follow them and you get this huge wave of brides that are like i want to come shop a hailey page dress so you like the micro influencers or the girls that are just really good referrals.

1:14:45Like when you have these families that get married and they have six daughters. One of my lawyers has six daughters and it is my dream to make the dress for every one of his six daughters. First daughter got married. I made her dress, you know, and it's like that's six girls, you know, like how fabulous to be like part of the family, you know, in that way. So it's like it comes from so many different places, which is a blessing. It's just diverse. I a thousand percent agree with you on even just word of mouth. So I just hired a new assistant. Shout out, Emma. You're already getting a shout out on the podcast.

1:15:17And, you know, yesterday an episode came out and she was she sent it to her UT Austin alumni like friend group. And there's, I think, 50 of them in there. And she goes, this is my new boss. Like watch the show. And she said, like, half of them already knew it and loved it. And half of them were like, who is this? I love it. And I literally immediately texted my team after and was like, this is more valuable than any press, any person other posting about this because it is the word of mouth marketing that you actually can't pay for. And to your point, it's like you get these families, you get these women, you get these brides, they have a great experience.

1:15:50It can be so much more worth the Vogue article with the one bride because that's aspirational. But a lot of people reading that are like, well, this could never be me, right? But we've attached such a barrier to entry potentially to get into that, to get to it. Or it's almost like to your point, it's not that inclusive environment that I feel like your brand is so built on. But there is an element to like the right celebrity wearing the dress or the right influencer. That obviously still matters. How do you as a designer get to those people to put your hat in the ring to be like, I want to design your dress or like you're meeting with styles.

1:16:31Like how do those collaborations actually come to be? I feel like I work just as hard to help a girl at any trunk show that I meet that I would for an influencer. Like it kind of goes back to that matching of energy. It really doesn't matter who she is. It's she's the bride. She's the main character, you know, and like so for me, I kind approach everyone the same that like I'm going to be your advocate. I'm going to help you find that dress. Even if it's not a Haley Page, we're going for it, you know. And I think that's really served our brand well because it it creates more of like a community as opposed to it just feeling like we're just selling dresses.

1:17:08It's really, really cool to be in the now right now, especially when I launched back in 2011. It was such a different world. Social media, like how publications worked, you wanted to get into the New York Times, you know. And now, you know, any bride can have a moment where she's, she could go viral or she could just have this stunning wedding that inspires other girls. And so you've got this chain reaction. Every bride becomes your influencer, every single bride. And it's fabulous. And that's why every single bride needs to have a good experience. I will dance monkey dance. I want you to have a good time.

1:17:45Like, that's it for me. You I'm treating her as a celebrity. That's it. So, and it's, of course, it's great to have like anybody wear the dress, but you should treat every single client as if there is an opportunity for word of mouth, for a reputation building, for compounding who you want to be as a brand. I'm obsessed with that. We have to like end there before we go into rapid fire because that was so powerful. Treat every bride like an influencer is so chef's kiss. Okay. Haley Page. Yes. What is the last thing you put on your credit card? A rental car? So unglamorous. What is the last most expensive thing you put on your credit card?

1:18:24Oh, actually, no, I can say this. I got Conrad's birthday present. It's a body scan. The MRI thing where they check you for health and everything. And so now we're like our health. We're at that age where we want to stay around. We've got nieces and nephews now and our parents. And so I got him that and it was expensive. Yeah. Is it ProNuvo? It's like that. Okay. It's the one that's in West Palm Beach. Okay. Yes. I actually love that as a gift idea, by the way. There's a company coming here that I'm obsessed with called Neco Health from London. It's opening in New York. It's only$299 and it does like the basics.

1:19:03That's not what I paid. Yeah. It's amazing. It doesn't do like testing for tumors, but it does testing for all of your moles. So they identified like I have 1500 moles on my body. And so it's like checking for skin cancer, checking your metabolic health, your heart health,$299 in the UK. Yeah. And it's coming here, but not until like the end of the year. Refund. Refund. Yeah. Okay. I'm so interested. What is your credit card? I have a Chase Inc. Recommend, don't recommend. It gives you three times the points. and I'm in a unique scenario because a lot of the stuff I do for work is through my business partnership.

1:19:43And so God bless them. They pay for a lot of my expenses. So with that, I don't really use my credit card that often. I do rely on Conrad for a lot of this stuff still. He is so locked in on financial stuff. And so I have a built-in AI guy that can just tell me what to do. I'm obsessed with that. Yeah. You can only design one of these dresses for the rest of your life. This is a really unfair question to ask you, actually, after what you've been through. But a bardo, a strapless, or a high neck? Strapless. That was immediate. Ball gown. Okay, love. You know what. And blush? Yes. Okay. What's better to have on your wedding day for all the brides listening?

1:20:30Confidence or calmness? Confidence. I've never met a calm bride actually no that's not true I was a calm bride were you a calm bride really calm like I had two weddings to be fair August 28th because you'll die both of my husband and my parents were married on the same day August 28th which is a one in 130 ,000 chance um so we got married in our backyard here with our 12 family members and I was so calm and I would not say I'm a calm person so sweet yeah that's really kismet how many guests 12 oh my gosh that's so sweet yeah that is yeah special and then we had a 250 person celebration but and then yeah yeah different dresses uh yeah but i wore i wore three dresses the second wedding and then i actually did wear the dress i got married in to do our first dance because we never got to do that so yeah really fun yeah what is worth splurging on for your wedding photography location or food dress no babe that one i knew i couldn't put that in there because Because that wasn't obvious.

1:21:32Okay, sorry. Photography location or food? Mmm. I would say food slash drink. Okay. Keep the party going. Yeah. Because there's people and everybody wants, it's a feast, you know, and people want to drink and have fun. So I would say that's a big chunk. Because where, like, venues, there's so many great venues out there and they can really deliver. And there's so many great photographers. Oh, my God. But yeah, I would say that that's one area I feel like people forget how expensive it actually is. Okay. Yeah. Have you seen this discourse online about destination weddings and people feeling upset about people having them?

1:22:07A little. Are you pro or con destination wedding? I'm pro. Okay. I think it's fab. It's a way to just say like we're going to go have a weekend. You know, come with us. Let's have a vacay and let's go all out. I would say it's a bigger lift because your guests, you know, they have to get on a plane and it's expensive and they have to book a hotel room. But I also think maybe that comes with the expectation of you don't have to go. It's OK. You can skip out on someone's wedding. Like, but that's my personal opinion. Like, I never get offended if somebody is like, oh, we can't make it, you know, especially if you're asking them to come that far or to spend that kind of money.

1:22:46Totally. So one wedding tradition that needs to be thrown out. um there's so many oh gosh the number one that needs to be thrown out okay this is so silly that you have to wear white because you don't you can wear blue or mint green i love that or rainbow i cannot wait to see what dress you're gonna wear all the dresses that you're gonna wear i do these things called hsr love knows, which is basically an affirmation. If you can only say one thing to yourself for the rest of your life to keep going, what would it be? Be kind. That just comes right off the tongue every time. Like in any scenario, you will not regret being kind to people.

1:23:32It's not a weakness either. It's a form of like respect. I think you can go far with that. I know you don't do errors necessarily or you're not titling it but we do title the season of our life here so if you had to title the season of your life what would it be called well i like unbridled because it it's a like bride bridal but it's like unbridled you know what i mean obsessed let's go i'm a girl let's get in we're going bridal shopping okay hayley page i'm obsessed with you where can people find you and how can hsr help you well i'm so grateful to be here you've already helped uh just had in a conversation but i i'm mostly on instagram uh at miss haley page i got that instagram back i have all the glitters which was the account i used when i didn't have my instagram it's it's like one of those things where i'm i get overwhelmed because i have so many accounts now on instagram i know and then people are like oh no you gotta start a sub stack now you know and oh you gotta be on youtube and you gotta be on tiktok and you gotta and so like i've just told myself like quiet the noise a little bit instagram is your lane do as much as you can over there if something inspires you on another just do it at leisure but you can't do it all like you really can't especially with how much it demands of you to do it right and so it's like i'd rather go deep on instagram than anywhere else so but we'll see we'll see um but that and And then hayleypage.com.

1:25:00And we have our nonprofit. And we have our shoes. She is Chabal. So that's that. Thank you so much for coming on Hot Smart Ranch. We love you. I love you. Thank you.

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