Pia Mance: Buying The Right Outfit Made Me a Millionaire Before 30 (The Blueprint For Building Your Dream Life)

22:32So maybe I would do that. Or someone really cool like an amazing niche celebrity I would do because they're super cool and upcoming and like aligns us in the right way. Or the product needs to be like innovative and it needs to be like, holy shit, that's fucking amazing. Why didn't I think of that? Or like, how cool is that? I don't want to do collabs that are just like meh. I want them to like make people feel something. What's your favorite collab you've done? we collabed with an LA brand called real fine studio and we did they are known for their really high quality diamonds and their diamond pieces and then we did a lab version with heaven mayhem and that was really fun because we're both Australian founders it was fun to bring the jewelry worlds together it was fun because we could technically be competitors but we're not competitors and we're so helpful to each other so that was really fun and then off the back of that and the success now we have our own lab jewelry collection as well but like no bad blood or anything, but that was a really fun collab.

23:33I'll tell you a collab that I thought was really fun was our Freya collab because we have such a similar audience. And so for us, we were like, this is great because we're bringing our communities together. They're so similar. We would walk around New York doing the content and we would literally see girls with a Freya bag and Heather Mayhem earrings. And we were like, this couldn't be more perfect. People are going to die. And they did. But the problem with that collab was we did an existing product in different prints and colorways to make it more heaven because we have our laptop cases, our belts.

24:01And everyone already had the product. So I think that was a really big learning from that collab is that the product needs to be like really innovative and really different and like make people from both sides excited to buy. That's so interesting. I never even thought about it that way. What is the most viral product and or moment you've ever had at Heaven Mayhem? I think our book boxes. Obviously, when Hailey Bieber wore our earrings, they did really well. And even to this day, I'll see TikToks like Miss Hailey influenced me. Our book boxes went so viral. I didn't have a campaign. My friend was checking out a sunset tower.

24:35I was working out with you that day when you were like, Bryony, can I please come and use your hotel room? Yes. So she was checking out at like maybe 10 a.m. And then she has the room till 12. So she's like, I'll leave the key at the desk for you. You can just come in. And I took my three book boxes and I went with my tripod and I put it around the room and took my iPhone photos and took my film photos. And then I just did one reel on the bed. And it was like opening the book boxes to jewelry. And it was messy, but it was very UGC. And that video got like a couple of million views sold out, sold out, sold out.

25:07And so that I think is our most viral product because it's kind of innovative and cool. That's what I'm trying to do with our products is like, oh, you didn't think of that, right? Like why would a jewelry brand known for earrings, we only really had earrings then, make a book that looks like a book but is a box to hold jewelry? Kind of crazy. So I like to do products like that. Is that what you would say is your road phone case moment? Yes, someone said that to me when I launched. They said, oh my God, I said, this is just as good as the road phone case. And I was like, wow, thank you. Can we take a moment to talk about the least glamorous but most important part of building a business?

25:43Your systems. I see so many founders and CEOs in my ecosystem who are building incredible businesses, but their backend is just chaotic to the point where deals will literally go cold because no one is keeping track of where things are at. So if that's your business, you really ought to think about switching to our sponsor, PipeDrive, a simple and smart CRM for small and medium-sized businesses that's easy to use because it's all centered around a visual pipeline so you can see every deal, what stage it's in, and what needs to happen next. Angels, if your ambition is big, like I know it is, your systems need to match.

26:21Head to pipedrive.com slash HSR to get started with a 30-day free trial. No credit card or payment needed. 100 ,000 companies are already using it, so why not join them? That's pipedrive.com slash HSR. We're the Hartford, with decades of experience insuring millions of unique small businesses. When it comes to your small business insurance, one size absolutely does not fit all. Get a quote or find an agent today at thehartford.com slash small business. When you need to build up your team to handle the growing chaos at work? Use Indeed Sponsored Jobs. It gives your job post the boost it needs to be seen and helps reach people with the right skills, certifications, and more.

27:03Spend less time searching and more time actually interviewing candidates who check all your boxes. Listeners of this show will get a$75 sponsored job credit at indeed.com slash podcast. That's indeed.com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Need a hiring hero? This is a job for Indeed Sponsored Jobs. So now you've done all of these categories And you're right. Like, I think at first you're known for earrings, you're known for jewelry, and then you start expanding into all these other categories. So book boxes, belts, sunglasses, like I'm obsessed with your card holder. What's been the hardest category to crack?

27:37And what's been the one that just like brings in the most amount of revenue? The earrings bring in the most amount of revenue still. The hardest one, I guess, to crack is that everyone who comes into Heaven Mayhem is coming in as like a Heaven Mayhem girl. So they're coming in for the earrings or the sunglasses and they're aware of everything else. Even the book boxes, they're aware. They open it and it's jewelry and they're aware that there's jewelry. Laptop cases for us are also a really viral product and have not brought in any customers from that. So like everyone who buys a laptop case, probably 2 % of customers go on to buy something else ever.

28:08So I guess that's one that quote unquote hard to crack because we're like, how the frigging frick do we get this cohort to come shop other things? And trust me, we've tried everything. Like we do whole shoots, styling your laptop case with earrings and everything else, like office essentials, this, this, this. And they just don't cross over to anything else. So that's a hard one to crack. Who's your thought partner with big decisions like that at the business now? Like when you're really trying to think through, because you've obviously expanded your team, who do you go to for decisions like that?

28:36it's either the brand manager or the VP of ops. But I usually just ask the whole team. We do an all hands every Monday. And I would usually be like, guys, what are we going to do about this? Like, what are we going to do? Come back with ideas next week. Like, think about it. I'll talk to the influencer, go like everyone kind of let's talk about how we can fix this together. I like to bring them all in on the decisions because it's definitely not just me there. How do you hire the best people to work at Heaven Mayhem? It's hard, but I think I've done a good job. It's a long process. Do you hire slow?

29:07Yeah. Hire so slow. It's a first round interview. It's a second round interview. It's a test project. Test project, sometimes we pay for, sometimes we don't, kind of depends on the role, but it would be usually three questions. And then it would mention like, you will be judged or evaluated on the presentation of the deck as well. So someone might send me the most insane operations deck and it's like all these excels and like, they totally showed that they have the brain. But then like the other girl put it on a really nice deck with logos and images from social and TikTok and whatever. And I'm like, okay, they care.

29:42They like the brand. I don't want to hire any like full on so-so fans and like obsessed with everything we do, but I do want them to care about the brand and like want to work there. Then we do an in-person interview where they talk about their project. And I want to like make sure I actually encourage the use of AI. I love it, but I want to make sure that they can talk to it. I don't want to see like loads of em dashes and them not really know. I need to know exactly what they meant. And I'll be like, did you use AI? And I like to see people's responses. And then depending on the role for social roles, we do a trial day and then we have them in office.

30:18And then from there, it's like, let's make sure that they have a good vibe with the team. Let's make sure they take good content. Let's make sure they're not scared. Like if they have to come up to me 10 times a day to take little TikTok clips, I don't want someone who's too nervous. I need someone who's like, no, you said you had 10 minutes. I need 10 minutes. You want me to do this video or not? You know, I want someone confident. And then we usually throw like a tiny task like, oh, make sure that you clean up the content that you were working on or like, make sure you keep the products orderly.

30:46And just like tiny things that we're like, we mentioned it at the start of the day and they forgot. So like, do they not have attention to detail? Because it's hard when you're in a small office, an open plan office like ours, it's really noticeable who's not a team player. So we've got to get them from the beginning. How do you recommend someone listening to this stands out when they are interviewing or are doing a trial day at a role at a company that they really want? They're nervous and they need to channel that to more excitement. I think knowing about the brand, bringing some ideas with you or some props.

31:15Like if you're coming for content and they're like, oh, I brought some props, by the way, bring a bunch of magazines or this and their cameras. Like they come prepared versus someone who forgets their laptop is like, it's nine day difference. I think they really need to try little moments like that to stand out and show how committed they are to the role, at least in our team. We had this girl gift us a couch. This is kind of unrelated, but she wanted to gift us a couch for our office and we do some content and stuff. And she wanted to drop the swatches off to the office so we could choose. And she came in and she brought us all cookies from Levain.

31:46Is it Levain or Levion? Yeah, I know what you're talking about, but I couldn't pronounce it to save my life. Dyslexia. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. You know, they've got a gluten-free one and it's really good. Do they? She didn't know it was gluten-free. But she brings this thing and these cookies aren't cheap. And I said to her, like, how old are you? And she was like, I'm 21. And I was like, you keep doing that because I was like, you don't have to pay for cookies every time, but I will never forget you. Like, we will post the fuck out of your couch now. And that really made a difference. Not that we need these gifts, but I was like, you cared enough to stop by.

32:15You're already giving us this free couch, but you cared enough to stop by and pick up some cookies so that we have a great time in the office, so that we remember you. So I feel like people that do things like that really stand out to me. No, it's what we call at Flight Story, the 1%. It's like the 1 % of thing that you can do to make someone's experience better. Like people don't think about how important they actually are, but it's a make or break to getting a job or to being thought of so differently, especially in the world of content and how much there is. There's so many options for people to choose from.

32:42So what can you do that's like 1 % going to make you stand out? Obviously, you've done an incredible job building a multimillion dollar brand in three years. What do you think you've had to sacrifice to get there? Probably a few friends and relationships. Not my husband, though. I haven't sacrificed him. But I think nothing that I have sacrificed hasn't been worth it. Like, I love going to the office every day. It's fun. To me, it's fun. Sometimes I turn around to the girls. I'm like, see, imagine if we worked from home. We couldn't have this kind of fun. Like, I love it. And to me, I'm like, it's not really a sacrifice.

33:18It's like, it's an honor. Did you always want to be a founder? Hard question because I would look when I was modeling and when I was like growing up with my husband's family and listening to them, I would always listen and be like, I want to do it different. Or like, I would do this. So maybe, yeah, but I never actually put that into words and figured out that was my path. But now that I'm in it, I'm like, God, I'm meant for this. I really am. You are really meant for it. What do you think was the turning point, though, that told you I'm going to do this? I just wanted to do something for myself.

33:48I have a really strong work ethic I mentioned it before but I didn't know how to apply it so I was like you know getting stuff organized when we moved to the U.S. a lot of admin getting a house a lot of admin ordering a couch admin I'm up till 10 p.m. okay so if this arrives this day I'm gonna mock it up on the can for how it's gonna look all this irrelevant stuff that like the energy needed to go somewhere so I think then I'm like I need to do something it's gonna be this brand and yeah just took up. Do you think that's because you saw a white space or it's just because of who you are? I did not see a white space.

34:23And I think it's so interesting because there's a billion brands out there in every category. And like, I want to start 10 million more. And I don't think you need to see a white space or a gap in the market. But I think at the time, that one product that I did have was actually kind of a gap in the market because I wanted this one pendant necklace that I couldn't really find. But that's not part of my story. I think people who create amazing supplement brands or create a brand to solve a problem is a gap in the market. But for me, I'm like, no, it was just a small, quick thing. I think the problem we're solving is that we are providing chic accessories for the modern girl and we're bringing them along the ride.

34:57So I think it's not really a problem, but there was no gap in the market. We just decided to do it. Well, I decided to do it. I think that so many people will love to hear that because you often hear the complete opposite advice where it's like, find a white space. Find your purpose. Yeah. Yeah, find your why. Like my why is that I don't want to be staying up till 10 organizing the couch. I want to do something for me and like make these decisions and curate this thing. That was my why. How did your husband take that when you went from being at basically organizing your family life and channeling all of your creativity, all of your work ethic into obviously providing for you and him?

35:32How did he respond to you now wanting to go and do something outside of the house? I mean my husband is like my biggest supporter we've been together since we were so young he's my biggest supporter but like he keeps it real he's obsessed with me and he tells me every day I love you so much I'm obsessed with you but like he doesn't treat me like a princess I'm not on a pedestal like he'll tell me to get the fuck over it he'll tell me like he'll bring me down to earth so we think it's the perfect balance of like I'll say to him oh my gosh look what I did and he'll be like you should have done that yesterday or like you should yeah so now go do it 10 more times or whatever.

36:06Like he is my biggest supporter, but he's not like, you're amazing princess and you can do no wrong. Like he's always kind of pushing me subtly to do better all the time. And I think I do it to him too. And that's why we're like always continuing to level up. Are you guys competitive with each other as two entrepreneurs in the fashion space? He's not competitive with me, but I'm competitive with him. But I would never tell him, but he knows. He's going to watch the podcast. Yeah. And like, oh, he's kind of competitive. Like he'll be, he was on my Shopify for a bit, when I had five users and then I had to kick him off because I hired another employee.

36:40He's like, every day he's like, just add me back. Just add me back. Or like sometimes he'll go up to the girls in the office. Like we had a sample sale and he's like, what do you want for the day? And I'm like, I don't know. I'm like attending to the sample sale. And he went and asked one of the girls or I asked her, I said, can you check? And she said to me, as soon as I pulled up Shopify, he was like at my desk. So we're not competitive, but like he's keen to know. and then sometimes I'm competitive with him. How did your relationship dynamic change once you started achieving real success? It never really changed because it's almost so slowly and it's not like it happened one day and I'm like, I'm a billionaire and I'm famous.

37:16And he's like, who are you? We're just so normal. And we're so the same people that nothing's ever changed. Probably the only thing that's changed is like, I'll be like, I really want to go here. I'll pay for it. And I'm like, time for you to pay for a holiday. And he's like, I've been paying for you your whole life. So you can pay for me for a while. I actually love that. How do you guys talk about money, deal with money? Do you have family meetings? Is it on the fly? Do you talk about money? Like how do you guys deal with that as a couple? We do talk about money. We tell each other, let's do a meeting.

37:46Let's do a meeting. We hardly do it. We go on a lot of walks and that's when we aren't like distracted with work. So we'll talk about it or like in bed or over dinner or something. But we do talk about money. We both invest and it's very shared and very open. And it's not like, for example, me saying like, oh, I paid for that. I couldn't care less. Like my birthday trip, for example, I booked that and paid for it months ago. And some of my friends were like, wait, you paid for that? What do you mean? Like, what do you mean? We're married. He's my love of my life, partner in life. We don't have my money versus his money.

38:19It's just like whoever wants something whose credit card can get out first. It's the same thing. So I think we're very open. And yeah, I think that's such a good way to be. And I think it also shows it's like you have a real foundation because I've had other people on the show even where they were the stay at home mom. They went into the workforce and like their relationship either fell apart because of that or it actually there's actually Amy Liu from Tower 28 who her husband now works at the company and it's like the company that she started. Right. And I think that's why I think it's so important to talk about stuff like that because it's not the same era that we grew up with with our parents like I never want to be in a dynamic where I don't have the option to buy myself something or leave a room if I'm not no longer respected and I think it's really interesting for you having not worked while you were married to Cody and then go and build this like incredible brand how that relationship stays through all the seasons yeah because it's it's very rare for that relationship to almost become closer than to drift apart.

39:23Yeah. What's like one secret rule of having a strong, healthy marriage with Cody now that you have so much going on? We, I feel like I've heard this on a podcast, but I think you said it. I think you said it. Cuddle in bed like every morning. Is that what you said? We do it every day. Yes. Let me go back to the money thing for one second. I will say that I can buy whatever I want. He would never would be like, why'd you spend that? He doesn't even know. He wouldn't ask. It's all good. We can both spend however much we want. Maybe if he wanted to buy a crazy car, I'm like, do you really need that?

39:53But not my business. But let me tell you, when I first started Heaven Mayhem, the whole reason that I say I started it with$900 is because I set up a direct debit from his card to mine because I didn't want, hey, can I have your credit card for this? But I didn't have any money. I was doing some influencing, but I wasn't getting paid very often. We just bought this house. I didn't have any cash coming in. So I set direct debit, his account to my account. Every two weeks, I get$900. With my$900, I can do whatever the fuck I want, get my nails, buy the groceries, see a friend, whatever. I saved one of my two weeks of$900 to start my brand.

40:29And that is why I'm like, it was$900 because that is like all I had at the time. Obviously not to my name. We had all these nice things. But like in cash, that's how much I save. So I have come from a position of being like, can I have this? But also I'm transferring myself. But at the time, Maggie, I'm like to him, can I have your phone because I want to set this direct debit up because I'm not getting paid very often and I want to have this money and I don't want you to know what I spend. And he's like, there you go. There's my face ID for my net banking or my, you know, He's not like, but why?

41:01Like, it's very open and trusting. Do you share with him anything about your finances now, though, like your credit card bills and stuff like that, or no? I don't. Look, we have very different spending habits. I think if he saw how much I spent on clothes, he'd be like, was this necessary? Like, he's probably bought two things in the past year. But like, then again, he drives a way nicer car than me, and that's what he values. So no, he doesn't. He would never look at my credit card statement. But like, he knows how much money we spend in the business. I tell him all the time, hey, I've spent this much.

41:31He's like, oh, your expenses are way too high or like, fuck, you're doing amazing. So it just depends. But I would definitely keep some things to myself. I would never hide it from him. If he asked, like, he'd be like, oh, so you have a new Kelly. I say, yes, he knows. I'm obsessed with you. You know what I mean? I'm so impressed with how creative you are on a consistent basis. How do you find creative inspiration so frequently? I sometimes people say, like, what's your superpower? I think it's ideas. I could think of a billion things and like, of course, some of them are terrible, but I'm just inspired by so many different things.

42:05I'll see a, like a tile and I'm like, oh, that's an earring. I'll see an old grandma with a pair of sunglasses and I'm like, oh, we should do a shape like that. We don't have that. Or she's got like blue nail polish and like maybe we could do a blue frame or something. It just really depends on my mindset. I think you can find inspiration anywhere you're looking for it, but you need to like almost train your brain to see random things. The other day I'm walking my dog around the block at the office and I came in with this gum leaf. It's like a long stick with a little like drop. I'm like, girls, earring.

42:35I've got a new earring. No one touch this. It's not trash. It's staying on my desk. This is a sample. Like you can just find inspiration anywhere. I need to be more aware in my life, but I feel like sometimes when you're consuming so much content, you get your own ideas kind of leave you because you're in that consumption mode. I feel like you actually do consume content of other people. Like you watch my stories. Yes, I look at my story sometimes. You're commenting on my TikToks being supportive and vice versa. So how do you find that balance of how much you're consuming versus how much you're creating?

43:10I love consuming and I screenshot everything that I'm inspired by. And then I go to my screenshots album as like my saved Pinterest because there's like maybe 6 ,000 photos in there, but 20 ,000 elsewhere. So if I like something, I screenshot it, put it in there and keep it. But I love consuming. And then it gets to a point where you're like, where else can I look? But that is like a really bad trap is at the beginning, I was designing from like, oh, I love this Pinterest reference. I love this. I love this. And then I'm like, holy shit, this other brand saw the same reference as me. Like, this has happened so many times from even just like a quick graphic to a actual product where I'm like, we have the same reference.

43:48And like, I didn't copy you. You didn't copy me. But we actually just saw the same thing. So that's why I try and look at other things to keep it fresh because it's fun to have a new fresh perspective. How do you perfect a mood board? I love a mood board. It's kind of like what started heaven. That's another viral moment we had. I was on this set in London and it just like wasn't vibing the way I thought. So I kind of got bored of like tweaking the model's hair and telling them to do this shot. I'm like, yeah, throw those earrings on. And I was pinning the earrings in the mood board and taking photos of it.

44:16I'm like, this looks way better but the photos were just what we had for references for posing and that ended up being like a viral piece of content that now is on Pinterest every day but for other brands but it really I wish I trademarked that but it's impossible but I think I don't know it's just like my my flavor of the month my mood of the month like I said I'm always trying to think of something new because as soon as I see it's being done a lot I want to change so I watched a very viral clip of you on the Skinny Confidential being like, this is how I use AI. And it was to ask the AI for advice in someone's tone of voice or what they would do.

44:51So I don't know if you watched the Cat GPT episode that I did. We tested that. Really? So I brought an AI expert on and I said, this is my friend Pia's hack. Let's try it. Let's ask for business advice as Maggie Sellers. So it was really interesting because I actually thought that it gave pretty good advice, but it was very generic. It was very high level. So your new flavor of the month with AI, what is the most unhinged but productive or best way that you use AI right now? I quit ChatGPT. You broke up with Chat. God, yeah. I barely even use Chat, to be honest. I use it for some stuff like that to help me with an email to say, we have like a million taglines like, heaven on holiday, heaven bar, whatever, come up with three more, like stuff like that I would use it for.

45:32It's honestly, it's not good. I don't like AI that talks to you like a friend. I like AI that's efficient. My hacks right now is we're using Claude and I'm having probably like two meetings a week with people that are building stuff for us with AI to make our business more efficient. I'm like creating my own skills and agents within Claude to make my life more efficient. I think my number one biggest hack is voice noting with AI. So I will go on a morning walk for an hour and sometimes I'll be like, oh my gosh, I like to be in the office by 8.30. So it's like really not suiting me if I'm on my walk at 7.15, I'm not going to have enough time to do everything plus get ready, which is also an important part of my day.

46:14So I walk around for an hour. I talk to myself and I come up with so many ideas. I'll pull up the Canva. I'll go through our launches. I'll just say, add this, add this. I think we should do this kind of concept for holiday. I want to give this type of girl. I want the content exactly like this. Slack Annika and tell her this. Slack Yvette this. slack my ops channel this ask when this po is coming in i'll get a summary i'll then save it to like add to all my decks and then i'll get all the slacks like send send send send send and sometimes i come through kind of weird but at least it says send from claude so they know if it's not my tone of voice and in that hour i've literally like done so much and they're like how does your brain work you were thinking about this this and this at once but i'm like it's because i was on such a like inspirational moment on my walk that i can kind of go anywhere in the business And then I don't have to write it all down because that would slow me down.

47:03Do you think that you've always had this beginner's mindset where you're just like, okay, being bad at something for a bit and that's what gets you on these things very quickly? Yeah. And one time, I don't know if I should tell this story because it's like so embarrassing. But one time my friend told me, she was like, you know what I love about you? You're just not embarrassed. And I was like, thanks. I appreciate that. And it's true. I'm just like not embarrassed. I'm the first person to say in a meeting, I don't know what that acronym means. and they're like you're the founder that's embarrassing I don't know what that means and I like it I would appreciate to people think I'm embarrassed but I'm not the story that she was like I love that you're not embarrassed is when I was literally like 17 and a half years old I stayed at Cody's house like I'm a almost adult and I had a peppermint tea before bed and I wet the bed I literally wet the bed and I told everyone I still think it's funny his sister brought it up the other day and goes remember that and I'm like yeah that was like one of the funniest moments ever and you know what he did I woke him up and I go oh my god oh my god I've wet the bed and he goes don't worry just roll over on my side I was like you're my husband but you've known Cody since you were 12 met when we were 12 yeah and I was obsessed obsessed are you like Hayley Bieber in that you've manifested your life yeah I'd say so I manifest my husband but I like to plan my life it's like is it a plan or is it a manifestation.

48:25Do you know what I mean? What's the difference? I think people like to manifest like, oh, I'd love that. Don't do anything about it. I'm like, I'd love that. So I'll put in my plan and do it in November, 2025. Like it's in the plan. So it is going to happen. And I think it's like, I'll show someone my plan for the year. Like here's my vision board. And they're like, yeah, but that's going to happen. I'm like, yeah, of course it is. Cause I'm going to make it happen. But I think it's, it's not so woo woo. It's like, yes, I'll add it to the to-do list and it will get done. So the thing that you've manifested the most recently is obviously you're pregnant.

48:54Yes. Talk to me a little bit about manifesting this pregnancy. I'll talk to you about manifesting it and then I'll talk to you about like the work. I said I need to be pregnant on my five-year wedding anniversary which is Halloween and that's what's going to happen. So that it's in my Canva doc. I have a Canva doc every year of like my vision board for the year because it's too overwhelming to have it all on one page so obviously I have multiple pages per month so October November 2025 is pregnancy get pregnant then obviously you have to match it up with your ovulation so I was freaking out because my ovulation was two weeks after that day but that's fine and then yeah I got pregnant fresh dry exactly to the exact time I wanted I will caveat all of this is like yes I put it in my vision board yes it was my plan but I also went to the doctor a year and a half before and was like, I need to get pregnant this month, this year.

49:49How am I doing? Took a load of supplements, tracked my ovulation, fixed my thyroid, ate super healthy, worked out, made Cody stop going in the sauna. I did all the right things and then yes, got lucky on our one try, but it wasn't like I'm like, let's do it this month and it just randomly worked. You know what I mean? So I like to kind of, that's what I'm saying. It's like a manifestation with a plan. Did you call this prep trimester zero? No. What's your thoughts on that? I think it's cool. I think it's really cool. And I have seen a bit of content like that. I totally scroll past it and try and avoid it because I'm like, if I didn't do that, I don't want to watch it and be like, shit, did I fuck something up?

50:30Do you know what I mean? Well, it kind of sounds like you did it. And I've actually been thinking a lot about this for myself of like, how do I trimester zero my business? because that is a whole different beast that is going to happen at some point, right? I'm not sure when, but it's like, how do you prepare yourself as the founder to take off the time to actually enjoy that part of your life? What have you done to start setting up different things so that you can either take off some time or at least not feel like you're underwater when you're a new mom and running a business? I have set up the team and I try and give them so much autonomy and control.

51:09And I also think I apply a lot of pressure and I'm like almost a pusher, like this isn't good enough. Do it again, do it again, do it again. To the point where like everyone's so self-sufficient, like I don't have to be there every day. Nothing breaks if I'm not there. Yes, sure. I'm the visionary, but like other people have great visions and ideas too. I think for me, all I need to do is set up our plan for every launch and the design, approve the designs, like design them and then approve them. But if that's done in advance, like I could take two years off. If I've done every launch, I could literally step away.

51:42Like they're so good. And I have so much trust and faith in my team that I'm like, it's going to be fine. I did say the other day, I was like, I'll probably be offline for like 72 hours and then I'll be reachable via Slack. And Vivian, my VP of ops was like, babes, that's crazy. And I was like, honestly, Slack's like my TikTok. Like, I'm going to want to be checking things, I think. But we'll see. I'm just going to keep it easy. So you don't necessarily want to take a mat leave. I want to have slow mornings with my baby. And I imagine waking up and waking up my baby and then making a coffee for me and my husband and feeding the baby in bed and going for a walk.

52:15And then I imagine getting on my laptop in the mid-morning. And then I imagine going to the office a couple of days a week. last thing I want to do is be chained to going into the office 8 30 to 5 30 and feel like I'm here to prove it to you all that I'm still working because that's just unproductive for everyone so I think I'm gonna take a balance but I definitely like I love working so I don't want to stop that and that's the same thing when I got pregnant I'm like well I'm not giving up my old life the baby hopefully will just come into it hopefully but I know it probably sounds so naive And people who have babies are like, that's never going to happen.

52:52So we'll see. One thing I will never do is let my team burn out, which happens when someone is stretching themselves across a full-time job and trying to become an expert in something new. But I also recognize that with HSR, there are skills that could 100 % change our trajectory as a business that we just haven't mastered internally, like generative engine optimization, no-code engineering, AI -native expertise. FiberPro, our sponsor, has been the best solution for this because their talent is expert-level and vetted. So you're not just getting anyone. You're getting someone who is really, really, really good at what they do.

53:33They can come in, work on a project, and deliver to a very high standard. And Fiverr Pro's hiring experts will source and manage your freelancers for you. All you have to do is pick from a pool of exceptional talent. Your team stays focused on what they do best, and you don't lose momentum trying to figure out something new from scratch. So if you're building or growing a company, Fiverr Pro is worth looking into. Visit pro.fiverr.com to learn more. For the first half of my career, I wasn't allowed to take credit for my own work. I couldn't talk about what I was building, and I couldn't use my own voice.

54:10I absolutely hated it. One day, I decided that things had to change, so I became a creator myself. I built HotSmart Rich as a platform where I could share my insights and own every single word. But if there's one thing I've learned, it's that growing a following requires consistency, which is a lot easier said than done. Stanley, the AI content machine developed by our sponsor Stan, would have been the biggest help to me when I was first starting our channel because Stanley is specifically designed to make it easier for you to post content every single day. You connect it to your Instagram, it learns your tone of voice, and knows exactly what your audience is actually going to resonate and engage with, and it helps you create content based off of that.

54:50We just started using it on HSR and it is unbelievable. Give Stanley a try for free at getstanley.ai slash maggie. You've sent help is now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney plus. We're somewhere in the Gulf of Thailand. Getting us out of here should be your focus. I'm your boss. You work for me. You're not in the office anymore. It's bold, relentless, and endlessly rewatchable. Discover why critics give it 93 % on Rotten Tomatoes. You're so fired. Oh, am I? No help is coming. Send help. Rated R. Now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney+. Trading at Schwab is now powered by Ameritrade, giving you even more specialized support than ever before.

55:35Like access to the trade desk, our team of passionate traders ready to tackle anything from the most complex trading questions to a simple strategy gut check. Need assistance? No problem. Get 24-7 professional answers and live help and access support by phone, email, and in-platform chat. That's how Schwab is here for you, to help you trade brilliantly. Learn more at schwab.com slash trading. Obviously dabbled in investing. What is it about investing that's really intriguing to you? I like building brands and I like being involved in that. Some of the things I've invested in are definitely not in the building stage.

56:11They're like big companies, for example, Shopify. But I still, I get a front seat to like what they're doing. Like they want to test new features or they want to run something by a founder. they ask me. I'm sure they ask a ton of other people, but they'll try it on Heaven Mayhem or ask me. Or like Pa Olive that I invested in, I'm like, let me help with this event on a nitty gritty. Like here's a guest list and I'll reach out to these girls. But then like, let's do this for a campaign or have you thought of this? And I just like love having a seat to the show and being involved. And I think to me, I'm investing as like a hobby.

56:41I'm investing like instead of sourcing some crazy bag and paying for that, I'm investing in your company. And the joy I get out of it is this value and having a seat to the show and being along for the ride rather than financial gain. You've had an interesting investor experience. What do you think you've learned about what not to do when you want to invest in brands and what to do really well to support founders? I think what to do really well is like ask them what they need, but don't overstep like be there to help but it's also their company and I think if someone was coming to me to invest and then took over control I would not feel good about that because I and that's why I haven't taken any investment but I think I think I like love helping and I think the when you get the right fit it's like a marriage you're both in it for the same reason and especially angel investing it's not as if I'm writing these 10 million dollar checks that they're like I can't refuse like it's a really quite a small check so they're like they could say no to the money, but it's more about having me there and the value I can bring.

57:46So I think they're open to receiving it. Someone wants to pitch you their company. What's going to make them stand out? I do think relentless following up is good and staying front and center, but not in an annoying email way. I need to see what you're actually doing or something different about it when you follow up. I definitely don't want someone to go cold because I'm also like, do you not care. But I think I just have to like them and the product. I think a hundred follow-ups and a hundred deliveries of cookies are never going to do it if I just don't like the product and I just don't resonate with it.

58:20Do you hate to say no? No. I love to say no. How is the best way that you can say no if you're a people pleaser? I'm not a people pleaser. So I say no all day, every day. And it's like my most favorite thing about myself. And I tell everyone I know, I'm like, hey, by the way, I'm not a people pleaser. and like you should be more like me because it's amazing and it's so freeing. And I don't care if you think I'm a little bit selfish because I feel like the people pleaser is like, I wish I was more like that. So no one really thinks I'm selfish or maybe they do. But if I don't want to do something, I won't do it.

58:48If we don't want to do it for the brand, I won't do it. And it's like, I don't think anyone listening is like, what a bitch. What a selfish little bitch. They're probably like, damn, I should do that too. So yeah, I'm not a people pleaser. No, I've had so many girls on the show and so many of them break up with being a people pleaser as they go. Yeah. I'm currently doing that. Good. And actually one of my least favorite parts about investing is having to say no to someone's business. But I posted this on my threads last night, which gets absolutely no views, but plugging my threads, I actually post a lot of VC information there.

59:19Yeah. I need to follow it. Last night I posted a no to a brand and I said to the founder, thank you so much for the opportunity. Never forget that you are offering me an opportunity to make money. You're not a charity. I'm not giving you money for you to go and do whatever with. Like I'm actually missing out on an opportunity. And when you reframe your brain as to like, I'm offering something to someone that could make them more money. I fundamentally think that you are a better founder because you don't come from this place of like, oh, there's so much more above me. And I think we've also glamorized investors so much of like knowing so much and being so much better than you.

59:59Someone that's listening that resonates more with myself of like maybe being a people pleaser or maybe coming at situations where you almost think, well, they're better than me. How have you been able to coach people in your office to think a little bit more like you to be less people pleasing, not afraid of saying no, and just like know your value and your worth? I have trained everyone in the office to be a great negotiator. That's one thing. I'm like, no, go back and do it more. Like know the worth and know what we're willing to pay and we will negotiate. So that's one thing. I think with the people pleaser thing and feeling like people are better than you, that's where I think it comes from.

1:00:33You're trying to people please because you feel a little bit less than and something. But I don't know. I went and spoke at Harvard Business School and people were like, are you nervous? I'm like, not really. Everyone's probably my age or younger and would love to have a cool brand like Kevin Mayhem and want to know how I did it. I'm just speaking to people just like me or like celebrities they're literally just our age our age people who have done way cooler things and have been papped more but like we're literally all the same people and exactly going back to the community event versus influencer like everyone has so much to learn from each other so I don't really think I'm better than anyone and I don't think they're better than me so I feel like bring yourself down to earth that's my advice like bring yourself down to earth for a little and realize like what is so different about me versus them and like why can't I say no or why can't I be on the same playing field.

1:01:19How do you think someone can win in a negotiation? Like three simple things that people can dig away from that. I think with negotiating, you need to, you need to be respectful and you need to realize like, what, what value are you getting here? Can you get it elsewhere? And then I think if you can get it elsewhere or like you can build it yourself on AI, you have such a leg to stand on. So like go use that and go say to them, honestly, like, honestly, our brand is really popping and we have a lot of young founders following us we can post you guys plus I could probably do this with another company half as much or I could build it myself with AI so can you give us this deal because this is what we're willing to pay and they're like okay or like somewhere close to it your employees they almost feel like family to you well yeah not quite.

1:02:08They're like not family. I like to keep it like the most professional sorority sisterhood. We're all such good friends. We will reply to each other's stories. I mean, maybe they all text on the weekend. I don't. But like I'll reply to their story like, you look so pretty. You're like, where's that outfit from? Or like that food looks so good. But I'm not coming into the office every day hugging them. There is definitely a line like this is professional. We're working. And I think sometimes they're like, oh, I wish it could be a bit more fun. I'm like, this is fun. You are working on a fun brand.

1:02:40You have a fun job. You have so much autonomy in your career. You get fun gifts. We do fun work events. But like, it's a job. We're only here because we need to make money. So like, I'm reminding them that it's a job. And I think sometimes I see other businesses where it's like, we're such a family. And like, it does seem really nice. But like, at the end of the day, we're there to do a job. So I think that's like a good balance we have. And I think everyone actually really appreciates it as well. I agree with you. And I actually used to do, I think, a mistake. I would become really close to people at the beginning and almost not have the boundaries.

1:03:12And then it's really hard to add those in later. Whereas like when you set boundaries at the beginning, it's actually a lot easier when you get later on into the process to be like, well, tell me a little bit about your personal life or like, what are you doing on the weekend? I feel like you've learned that obviously from like having entrepreneurs around you. What are the other secret codes of success that you've learned when you're eavesdropping on your husband? He told me something the other day. I wasn't eavesdropping. He just told it to me. But he was like, we were talking about performance reviews and giving raises.

1:03:39And I think that's kind of like the point. Everyone's like, hey, I've been here for a year. Like, where's my raise? And he's like, you know what? I was reading. I forgot what the book was. But he was like, it talks about motivation. And like some people, they're not motivated by money. They're motivated by like coming along for the ride and like building something bigger and more impactful. And like, they're so motivated by being a part of this journey that where they're making a difference. And I'm like, yeah, that's so true. So that's like a little bit of secret sources. Like I tell everyone this work better be so fucking stunning that you would post it on your own personal feed right this second or your own LinkedIn.

1:04:14But equally, like if it is that stunning, go post it, like own that. You did that. So I think that's part of like the success or the question to answer is like, I want them to feel like this is equally theirs and they're excited about it and they can scream it from the rooftops and do what they want with it as well. And like, they're really part of it. There's a list of people that I desperately want to meet that I feel like would supercharge the next phase of my growth and not even just in business. Also in like the way that I think my mindset, like my body, who are a few people that come to mind for you that you're like, I want to meet this person.

1:04:46And I know that I'm going to be either a better mom or a better founder or a better friend if they're in my life. I met her a couple of weeks ago in passing, but I would love to sit down and interact with Morgan Stewart. I think she's hilarious and I think she's unapologetically herself and I would love to see how she operates. I would love to interact with Kim Kardashian because I've heard she's so professional and she goes into a million rooms every day and is so professional. So I'd really like to see how she operates. And I agree with you. I meet people sometimes and I'm like, goals. Like I'm learning from you and I kind of replicate some behaviors or like take things away from them as learnings.

1:05:20Who else? I feel like Lauren Ratner would have some really interesting things to say in terms of a marketing perspective. Who's a great mom? Well, I'm already friends with so many great moms. How would you describe yourself as a leader? I don't know, Maggie. We'll see. Like I feel like I should ask them. I know what I want and I'm like, it should be like this, this, and this. Anyone have any thoughts? And then someone will be like, let's say I want everything green, green, green. And someone's like, I just thought pink was better. I'm like, you know what? Pink's really nice. Let's do pink. I'm not one to change my mind all the time.

1:05:54I'm not erratic. I'm not frantic, but I listen to everyone else. If they have another opinion, I'm like, okay, if you guys agree, if you guys think that, let's do that. I'm really open to their feedback. I don't know how to describe myself as a leader. I've never thought of what three words I would use. I think maybe I'm inspirational. Like I like to be like, let's do this, guys. Let's build this. No, I want to be the best. I want this to be about us. I want, let's do this. Let's do that. But, and I like to bring them along for the ride. But yeah, I'm not sure what other characteristics I would use.

1:06:23I think specific. I'm very specific. And creative or visionary. Yeah. I think also like efficient. I like things to be done efficiently. I think that you are very similar in all aspects of your life in a really good way. Like, I always know what to expect with you. And you've actually trained me so well because when you get a text message, you will open it and not necessarily respond. Yeah. And I would spiral when we were first friends. And I was like, oh my gosh, Pia literally hates me. And it actually helped having a friend like you who I had to relearn a different language with where you have so much going on and you aren't a people pleaser and you're very specific.

1:07:07You're very visionary. You're very inspirational. And so I developed a code of language of friendship with you that I haven't really had with other friends. And it's been I was reflecting a lot on that before you were coming on the show. Like we have a very different relationship than I have with most of my other good friends in a really good way. Well, let me tell you, that is part of my personal brand. And that is like such an intentional choice. If you text me, hey, baby, you in LA, I've just been broken into, I'd be at your house in five minutes because of course I've seen the message. If you're like, hey, P, I'm in it.

1:07:40I need this. Of course I'm responding. But if you're like, hey, what dates are you going to be in Europe? I'm like that. She doesn't need me. Not that it's so intentional and calculated, but I don't like the feeling that people text me all the time. My friends, yeah, but like people I work with or like, I'm like, you don't get to just like jump into my space right now. Like sometimes people like you're such a bad responder. I'm not like if I want to respond, like my husband gets a response within one second. My assistant, like whatever, they'll get a response within one millisecond. But I think I'm just very intentional, like don't want to be too available.

1:08:13And I kind of want to give that vibe that like, oh, she's not so reachable. Like I truly try that, do that vibe. Oh my God, I'm obsessed with you. Okay, we're going to do some rapid fire because we've been talking forever. Pia Mance, last thing you put on your credit card? More Claude tokens. Do you know what that is? Oh, yeah. I just bought a$100 a month plan. Oh, yeah. You got to level it up, girl. It's crazy. Once you start running skills, you got to add more tokens. Yeah, it's crazy. Last most expensive thing? I did a wardrobe refresh for my pregnancy style and I bought some new things because I need to feel good and feeling good and looking good is important to me.

1:08:53What is your credit card? I have Platinum Amex, Gold Amex. I just got the American one. It's like Citibank, but I'm planning to use that for points for travel. And I just got an Atlas card and I have Chase Sapphire. And why do you have five credit cards? Because I spend a lot of money and someone has to have the credit card under their name for the business. I spend a lot of money for ads or for expenses. So I want to put different things on different cards for different points. And for example, I'll get like business class flights on my points or I'll go home to Australia. It's like literally$20 ,000 for flights and I'll do it on my points.

1:09:30So that's why I kind of pick and choose my cards for different reasons. What's the best card for travel? I think it's the gold Amex for points to rack up points. But then I think if you're booking travel, it's the platinum Amex. Okay. You can only wear one accessory for the rest of your life. Watch, earrings, sunglasses. I think it's a sunglasses. I know it's crazy, but I have them. I guess you don't have them inside, but I have them. I would never leave the house without my sunglasses. Can we bring some sunglasses over, Bob? The bag's so not cheap. So, like, pick a pair of sunglasses for you and for me right now.

1:10:04Or these are glasses. These are glasses. And I'm like, what matches the vibe? These are our Sloans. They're the best seller. They're a best seller for a reason because they suit every face shape. See, don't you think a glass just elevates? It does. So these I don't even need a prescription for. No, but your assistant has them and she put her prescription in them. I know. And then they also are the transcendence one. Yeah. Wait, what are they called? When you go outside, she made them go darker. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Wow. You would really pick a glass over an earring. Yeah, I think so. Okay. I just, I love a pair of glasses.

1:10:40Okay. You can live in New York or a latest starter brand in your 20s. What would you recommend someone do? Oh, you know what? I might choose New York. I might choose New York. They look really good on you, these glasses. And you actually look like Rachel Bilson right now. Oh, wow. With these glasses on, you have to see yourself. But I think I would choose New York. And you know what? I have a tiny pang of regret that I never lived there. But I think it's a fast-paced city. Everyone's working. You get that hustle mentality. I think for some random reason in life, I was born with it or bestowed on it because of my husband.

1:11:10I don't think you get that hustle vibe in LA, even though it's done nothing but amazing things for me. I think New York's where it's at. I agree. What is the first thing you do every single morning? Check my phone. Literally wake up, turn my alarm off, check my phone. Just like any quick, urgent text message, Slack, email, like barely check it. Roll over, give my husband a kiss. He'll still be asleep. And then I get up and I go to the gym or I go for a walk. At what time? Get up at 530 every day. Oh, my God. Okay, you have to deliver hard news. Are you doing it in a text message, email, or phone call?

1:11:44depends who it is but probably a phone call best hotel you've ever stayed at oh my gosh it's in italy it's called costello do rescue amazing so romantic and so amazing who is your favorite comfort creator i like watching you i love you i like watching you i like watching this is so random but i really like watching people in their homes and doing things i also really like select mom content but i've liked it for years like i'll know all about like different things because i've like been obsessed with an influencer who had a baby when i was like 17 you need to look chic what is the first thing you're reaching for not glasses that's so unfair no it's the rules okay i'm not people pleasing right now okay love it she is learning what am i reaching for i think I think a big pair of earrings and a slick bun and a lip liner.

1:12:41And what's your current lip liner? Wear of a walnut from Makeup Forever. But I will say I have like 10 on rotation that all look kind of the same. And yeah, I'm obsessed with them all. I mean, you look good in everything. Okay, Birkin or Kelly? Kelly, Kelly, don't even worry. It's Kelly. How do you know if you're a Birkin or a Kelly girl? Well, I'm both, but specific. I'm always specific Birkin. I want the Birkin to be like a beat up. I want the Kelly to be beat up too. But I think anything beat up and vintage is cool. Not a mini Kelly for me. Just a bigger, like I love the one I have, the box leather one.

1:13:17I would also love a box leather massive Birkin that I can like throw my baby's bottle in. That's the vibe I want. How do you, okay, this is not rapid fire, but you're developing your personal brand and you decide mini Kellys are not for me. Why? How? girl it's just like innately I just know that am I a mini Kelly girl if you wanted to be and I think you do you do you do want to be but I just what does that thing about me I don't know Maggie she does that I say it you know I say it well I just I think I don't want a mini Kelly because of course everyone has every bag but to me I like mine because they're like beat up and vintage and They have some personality.

1:14:00I just don't like the way that some people wear the Mini Kelly in the same way as almost like a status symbol. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. And they're also frigging expensive. So like, I'd rather choose something else because by the time you get your hands on a Mini Kelly black paint with gold hardware, like that's a big price tag. Do you want to hear something so funny? I asked my audience because, you know, I get denied from every single Hermes store. Like it is a hilarious thing. I asked my community a few years ago when I was in Paris, maybe this is last summer or the summer before, I said, Hermes keeps denying me, should I just buy the Chanel bag?

1:14:34And honestly, half of my poll was like, you're not an Hermes girl, you are a Chanel girl. But I feel like I love the Birkin for what it is. Like, if you know how it was developed, it was like for moms on an airplane with the CEO and Jane Birkin. And, like, when you actually understand the history of how functional this bag is, it was so a bag I wanted. Yeah. And I would be lying if I said, like, if there wasn't a Mini Kelly, like, available for me, if I would not buy it, I would buy it. Babe, I would buy it, too. But, like, I don't know if that's my nighttime going out bag. Exactly. Yeah. But I'm going to message you and you can help me, like, do a brand refresh.

1:15:10Yes. Okay. Two more questions. So, you know, I do those HSR love notes. Yes. What do you think about those? I love them. I love them. Keep them up. I love them. Sometimes I read them, though, and I'm like, is she sad? Honestly, yeah. You're like, I do love myself no matter what anyone thinks. I'm like, no one's thinking it, babe. We love you too. But I love the HSR love notes. I say it back to myself. Okay. So if you could only say one HSR love note for the rest of your life, what would it be? Something about like, my intuition will get me wherever I want to go or like, whatever you need is within you something like that to like that would be mine that would so be yours if you had to title this season of your life what would it be called efficiency i think it would be called efficiency okay pia mance i love you so much you're gonna have to come back on like honestly probably the most fun i've had in a really long time on the show yeah it's just different recording with people you have a real relationship with and that you know And also, I've seen you come really far.

1:16:17Can I say one thing? You sent me flowers for my birthday. I don't know when it was, two years ago, maybe. And the card said something like, happy birthday. You're smarter than you think. Or you know more than you think. Or something like that. I wish I knew the exact phrase. It was you know more than you think. Yeah, you know more than you think. Love, Maggie. And I'm like, firstly, so chic and straight to the point. Love it. But that, when people say, what's the best advice you've ever been given? And I say that because I'm like, I actually did know more than I think. And I actually still do.

1:16:48And that's what I'm saying. Like, that's why I'm not a people pleaser because I'm like, well, we're all one of the same. But like you taught me that. So that was incredible advice. Like you should Google it. I've said that in multiple articles. Best advice I ever got. Plugging. Clout. Hot smart wrench. Shame dropping. I love you. Where can people find you and how can HSR help you? People can find me and Heaven at PM Ants or Heaven Mayhem. HSR can help me with letting us know what you guys want to see. Like, do we want more community design? Do we want more products? Do we want more this, that?

1:17:19I love developing stuff with the community and with other people and, like, being in my DMs and having a conversation. So if there's something you guys want, tell us. And we're going to manifest an HSR-HM collab. Yeah. What are we going to do? Well, that's what we should ask them. Yeah. So we'll do something special for people at the end of the episode so they can tell us. Love it. Love you so much. Thanks for having me on. Love you more.

1:18:09We'll see you next time. MintMobile.com slash switch. Upfront payment of$45 for three-month plan, equivalent to$15 per month required. Intro rate first three months only. Then full price plan options available. Taxes and fees extra. See full terms at MintMobile.com. Security program on spreadsheets, new regulations piling up, and audit dread? It's time for Vanta. Vanta automates security and compliance, brings evidence into one place, and cuts audit prep by 82%. Less manual work, clearer visibility, faster deals, zero chaos. Call it compliance, or call it compliance. Get it? Join the 15 ,000 companies using Vanta to prove trust.

1:18:46Go to Vanta.com slash com.

1:19:09Thank you.