Advice Line with Eric Ryan of Method

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28:18Welcome back to the advice line on how I built this lab. I'm Guy Raz and my guest today is Method Olly Welly co-founder Eric Ryan. Eric, let's take another call. All right, let's do it. Hello, welcome to The Advice Line. You're on with Eric Ryan. Tell us your name, where you're calling from, and just a little bit about your business. Hi, my name is Maggie Gerth, and I'm from Chicago, Illinois. And I founded Props Luggage, which is a carry-on suitcase that has its own built-in leg system. So you no longer need a luggage rack when you travel. You basically pull out the legs and your bag is its own luggage rack.

28:58You don't have to bend down to get your stuff. It's just right there. It's right there. Maggie, it's great to have you on the show. You have been to How I Built the Summits in the past. In 2018 and 2019, you were at the summits. I was there at both summits. And you met Eric, yeah, at our How I Built the Summits, yeah. I did. I met you, Guy, and I met Eric. So this is extremely thrilling. And I will tell you, I had this idea over years of traveling with four daughters and messy hotel rooms. I thought about it for years. And a friend of mine invited me to join her at the summit. And so I went with this idea in my head and went again the next year.

29:48And I will say after the second year, I said, okay, it's time for me to - I'm in. Yes, I did. I'm going to do this. And what were you doing before you started this business? I was in investment banking out of school. And after our first daughter was born, I decided to stay home. And so basically I was raising my girls. And when they got a little bit older, I decided to just go for it. I love it. So you basically started to work on this idea, which now is a real thing. You've sent me one. So thank you for that. I have it. It's awesome. And I think you worked with a designer, right, to get everything right.

30:31Because you wanted the legs to come out. And it's not just a, I think you can like, you can use it at the airport to put like a cup of coffee on it or even your legs to rest on it if you want. Like, I don't think you can sit on it. No, but a lot of people. So originally my vision was to use it in hotel rooms because, you know, there's always one luggage rack. But when it was launched, what became even more popular was its use in the airports for people who travel a lot for work or pleasure. You know, how often are we all stranded in the airport for hours? And, you know, you kind of you set it up and you put your laptop on it and you've got your own workstation or you put your meal.

31:18You know, you don't want to be juggling your meal on your lap. So it really, it developed a lot more popularity for use in the airports, which was great. Tell me, and I think you're mainly selling them direct to consumer, but you are in some stores, I think, some boutiques, right? Yes, actually, we started out, this has all been self-funded. Wow. Yes, wow. My husband has been huge support. so we work together but we started out direct and then we were lucky enough to be put into the in-motion stores in airports. We've also we just recently got into the container store which is nice. Maggie just very briefly how are sales doing?

32:11I mean this is a tough category right there are some very very big players and yes um and it is a relatively crowded category which isn't a problem but how you know you're a small player how so far how how has it been with sales the first year was a little bit slow because it was all direct um on our instagram so it was about 50 000 the first year um then we started to gain a little momentum and now we're on probably this year, about$250 ,000. That's helpful. All right. And your question for us before I bring in Eric? So my question is, do I stop the self-funding and just realize in order to really move this ahead aggressively, do I decide to take on investors or partner or bank loans?

33:05All right. Eric Ryan, lots to ponder, lots to think about. Yeah. So I think at the heart of it, that's a personal decision. And I've always heard a great expression of you can either go for control or financial win, meaning if you want to just continue to have full control and really build this yourself, it's going to be a slower, longer build, but you can have control. If you want to really scale up and have a bigger financial win, you're going to have to give up some control. And that's what is required when you bring in partners and advisors. So it really goes back to a very personal question of what do you want to do?

33:41What type of business do you want to build? There's no right or wrong answer here. I think you've done a great job of disrupting the category with what I call an attribute. But the way you think about attributes, benefits, and experiences, I think the opportunity, if you brought in outside capital, is how do you turn this into a brand and a product experience that's bigger than just the props on it. And whether it's like you're really building a smart suitcase, a smart way to travel. I might even drop the S and just call it prop. But I think you've found a way into the category and a point of differentiation.

34:14But for this to be really a long-term success, the props is going to have to be just one of the attributes of a smarter way to travel. Right. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And is this patented? Is your design patented? Yes. It is. Okay. So it's a patented design and it's really right now going to appeal to people who also have this same problem. The question is, can you broaden it out to people who don't have this problem? Like some people just don't care. They're just going to throw their suitcase on the ground at the hotel or on the – there's two beds and they just need one. They're going to throw it on the other bed.

34:48When I think of suitcases that I have at work, I mean some of them have – actually I guess fewer of them now have the plugs because the airlines don't like that. But, you know, just the different pockets or the different compartments or the different ways that they allow you to organize clothing inside. There are other features, the hard case and the hard shell, the look, right? I mean, I think a lot of what differentiates sort of the higher end, the Ramoas from, you know, the others is they focus on the design, the look of it. You know, I think those are all things you want to think about, right?

35:21And have you had any interest from investors so far? Have you been approached by anybody who said, hey, you know, I think this is something I'd like to get involved with? We have had a few, but nobody that we've moved forward with. One thing that I would love to ask both of you is, you know, my intent was never to just have a one product. You can't have a brand. So this was never my intent, just to have the one carry-on suitcase. I always, I have a plan in my head. I've had high demand for the next size from those who have the carry-on. They now want the larger case, but then the tariffs just hit.

36:04So things have been paused. But to that question, how important do you think it is to expand the line? You can't just have a company or a brand that has one product. Yeah. I think it's really hard long-term to build one product. I think could be in one category really well. I think the white space for you too, and some of those brands that Guy just mentioned that are really elevated in design and like to me, but they're at a very high price point and you have a much more sophisticated customer and a younger customer that is traveling, you know, 20 year olds travel in ways that 20 year olds used not to travel.

36:42And so I think you could build, you know, elevate the design, you know, the prop feature is part of this overall more smart approach to baggage, but I think you gotta, you could ladder up, build a bigger brand that feels more elevated, but at an affordable price point. I think that's the real white space opportunity. But yeah, it's got to be bigger than a product feature, and it's got to be bigger than just one suitcase to build a successful company here. Yeah, I agree. And I would also go back to your original question about whether to seek out help. I mean, I think that, look, as you know, being a former investment banker yourself, It's a tough environment now.

37:20It's a tough time to raise money in any CPG category. I think, Eric, you can probably attest to that, although you probably don't have a problem because of your track record. It's always hard. It's a tough environment now, right? Money is tight because of uncertainty, right? Tariffs, economy, what's going to happen? The bond market's scared. But that being said, I mean, you're in Chicago, right? There's a robust sort of network of founders and builders. I was just in Chicago a couple weeks ago and met with some and it's an awesome, just an awesome hub of entrepreneurship. I mean, if you have conversations and you can start to have conversations around potential partners, I would really consider it, especially if you could find somebody who has some experience in travel or in hospitality, something connected to this space, brand building, who can help you sort of develop it.

38:12I think that it might be worth thinking about bringing somebody on if you can find it. Right. Yeah. Right. And to build on that, you don't have to make the decision to raise capital. You can make the decision just to go explore it. So plan A could be to continue to bootstrap it and grow it organically. And then to Guy's point, go out there, really socialize and see if you find a partner that would be a great fit that you're inspired by. And then you can make the decision whether you take the capital or not. Right. I would also be open to the idea, and I would love your thoughts on just licensing the leg system idea to larger brands.

38:47I think it's a great thing to explore, for sure. What do you think, Eric? Yeah, I think it's free cash flow. So that's always a great thing. Less likely to get knocked off and somebody trying to work around your patent if they're just able to access it. And I think it'll put pressure on you to build props into something bigger than just that feature if you're going to be able to license it to others. So, and same thing, like you don't have to make the choice to do it or not. You just make the choice to go explore it, see what opportunities come along, and then you can make the decision to execute a deal like that or not.

39:17But free cash flow for a founder, like this all day long. Right. Maggie, you're at the brand. It's called Props Luggage. Maggie, thank you so much for calling in. Thanks so much for coming to the summits and keep us posted. Thank you. So appreciate both of you. And I hope you have another summit. I hope so, too. Great to meet you, Maggie. Nice to meet you, too. Yeah, I do not. I can't remember the last time I checked a bag. Yeah, no, I think checking a bag is a failure as a traveler. I think I fell in love with my wife when I did our first trip together. and I saw how small her carry-on was. Stay with us because after the break, we'll talk to another founder working to take their business to the next level.

40:00That's after the break. I'm Guy Raz and you're listening to The Advice Line right here on How I Built This Lab.

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42:32Welcome back to the Advice Line on how I built this lab. I'm Guy Raz, and today I'm taking your calls with Eric Ryan, brand builder extraordinaire. Eric, let's get back to it and take another call. All right, let's do it. Welcome to the Advice Line. You're on with Eric Ryan. Please tell us your name, where you're calling from, and just a little bit about your business. Yeah, hi, Guy. Hi, Eric. Thrilled to be here. I'm Matt Angorn calling from Scottsdale, Arizona. I am co-founder of Flipmit's 3-in-1 Adventure Gloves. Flipmit's switch or flip between a mitten, a fingerless glove, and sweatpants.

43:07They help you stay warm when you're cold and dry when you're hot. So, wait, like sweatpants for your hand, basically. Is that what you're saying? Yeah, sweatbands. Sweatbands, sweatbands. Sweatbands, yeah. So they wear gloves. I was like, sweatpants? Yeah, they convert to mittens. Oh, wow. They're like running. And then, yeah, they slide them down and you're wearing the sweatbands and they keep you dry or act as a hand towel when you're running. Okay, so this is a flip mitt. It's like a glove that opens up and then it can just – your fingers are free and or it can go on your wrist. Tell me what – just before I ask you about the business, what are the use cases here?

43:43Yeah. So we initially created this for trail runners, was kind of our original case. You'd go running on a cold morning. Your hands would be freezing. But then very quickly, your hands get sweaty. You're looking for a place to put your gloves. And at the end of your run, you've got, you know, soggy gloves and cold hands. And so this actually transitions through the whole run. It keeps you warm in the beginning. It keeps you dry in the middle of your run. And then at the end of your run, you can just slide them back on and they keep your hands warm again. Yeah, I like that. I lived on the East Coast 10 years ago.

44:13I lived in Washington, D.C. I used to love those freezing cold mornings, like 18, 19 degrees to take runs in. I just run better in them. But your hands, it's torture, right? They're so cold. But then when you warm up, obviously it's better. So that's where the idea came from. This was a problem you had? Yeah, yeah. This was a problem I had. I used to run around in the trails in New Jersey, and my hands were over. I always had cold hands. I would wear fingerless gloves inside. I would buy them by packs of 12 and lose them. And so the ability to always have them on your wrist when you want them and then just slide them back onto your hands ended up having a lot of other value too.

44:49So tell me about where you're selling the FlipMits now. Where can you get them? Sure. So primarily via our Shopify store, FlipMits.com. We're also on Amazon. And we're on QVC. We actually did a test run with QVC in January. That went fairly well. So those are the three primary places. We've gone out and visited Walmart. The real challenge there has been we've gotten a lot of great feedback and interest from retailers, but they don't really know where to put our product. Is it for runners? Is it for cyclists? Is it for hiking? And so that's kind of one of the challenges I'm calling about. And tell me a little bit about sales.

45:27I mean, how are you doing so far? How are you doing this year? Yeah, so it's been a roller coaster chasing inventory like so many different companies that call in. But we've done really well. We've done a little over 600 ,000 in sales to date. That's over the course of your whole business. Yeah, yeah. Half of that came in 2024. So we kind of started off with one color, two sizes. We scaled to four sizes and four colors. And then we started launching graphics like skeleton hands and rainbows and trying to make it more fun. And so, yeah. And then we launched Heavyweight last year. And then we're launching Sungloves this summer for sun and sweat.

46:10And we've been doing events, going to running events. And the feedback's been great. We've had customers buy 10, 12 times. Is this design patented at all? We've got trademarks and copyrights, but very difficult to patent apparel. Yes. Has anybody knocked you off yet? Not yet. Waiting for it. Worried. Hopefully it doesn't happen. What question do you have or challenge are you facing? Yeah. I would love your advice on scaling beyond Shopify and Amazon. I did some boutique stores running cycling in the beginning. They were excited, but they didn't really move. And it does really well when I can explain it to people.

46:47People just go, oh, I get it when I give them a demo. But moving it off the shelves on their own has been difficult. We have improved the packaging. We've put the photos of the product on the packaging. But I do wonder if we needed to take it to another level. just kind of curious what kind of advice you would have for me on that. Yeah. First of all, like seeing this is like, why did nobody think of this before? It's pretty genius. Thank you. I think a couple of ways to think about it. So I heard your problem before of like in conversations with Walmart and where does it go in the store and looking at your site.

47:18It's your point too. There's this consumer education. And I always look for things that like hit that intersection of novel and familiar. And you've got a really, really novel, obviously approach to gloves. It takes some education. So I think for retail to work, you've got to be able to really put it into that space of familiarity. And possibly maybe the right way to do that is you create different versions of it, targeting different use occasions. So if you were to go into Walmart, so you've got a sport version that can live in the sports section that's calling out specifically for runners. Maybe you've got one that goes in a hunting section.

47:53Maybe you've got a seasonal one that comes out when the winter gloves and sits in the winter gloves. Oh yeah, I like that. So that was just that familiarity of like, I'm buying gloves. Oh, and then the novelty of like, oh, this is a different type of glove. I love that idea of thinking about different ways. And you are doing some of that already, I think, Matt. Yeah, yeah. And I love that approach. And you totally nailed it, right? I've got hunters, cyclists. I have tattoo artists, people from all walks of life. Anytime your hands are cold and you want control, you have nurses that use them because you can wear them underneath rubber gloves.

48:27And so they are so adaptable. So I love that idea of packaging them for specific activities versus just doing infographic after infographic, which is kind of the approach I've had so far. And you could call it like the runner's glove or the hunter's glove. But also, too, like you've kind of created the world's most versatile glove. I feel like you need to kind of ladder this up to the world's best at something. Yeah. I go back and forth between the age-old wisdom of find your tribe and grow your tribe and really try and grow with their needs versus this product that can go so many different ways.

49:06And I kind of look at Crocs, I feel like, as a similar example sometimes where it's kind of different. It's still a shoe, but it's different and trying to take what I can learn from that. Yeah. And I wonder whether you could do more of a weightlifting glove that has like grips on it, you know, something that is really designed for weights or for the bar, but gripped. Yeah. Yeah. I love that idea. I've done, I've done leather prototype palms and I've tried to do the grip one. We've been trying to produce in North America and I haven't been able to do, find how to do the grip in North America. So if anybody's listening, call me, but that can do that.

49:44But yeah, I love that idea. We've got, I've had rock climbers ask for like extra grading on the side for like rock abrasion and things like that. And so that's absolutely where I'd love to go. and it's been chasing that inventory and having that, you know, we were sold out for almost all of January. Um, and just trying to get it back in stock before, you know, the season warmed up was, uh, was a heart attack for myself and my partner. Yeah. Looking at it, I was debating whether you should ladder up and build a brand because flip flip mitts is, I think you're most more like a flip-flop than a crock and flip mitts feels it's very much a product brand.

50:19And I was debating in my head like, okay, should you go up and build a brand above? And then flip mitts is your product brand, but I don't know what you'd ladder up to. And I think I would do the opposite. I would like ladder down of what you're talking about, be hyper-specialized. So build, build these hyper - specialized use uses, just like you said. Um, and also licensing could be really, I mean, university of Michigan flip mitts available in the stadium, you know, starting in late October. Um, and like, look for those, you know, uh, I think licensing also could be a great way, uh, to open up some of these youth educations, but I would go hyper-specialized.

50:54I love that. And we've had some small businesses on this show that have done licensing deals with big schools. It's possible to do. It's not as onerous as one might imagine, and that's a great idea. I love that. I do imagine it to be incredibly onerous, but I do think it's an amazing opportunity, and I appreciate the encouragement. The brand is called FlipMits. Matt Enghorn, thanks for calling in. Congrats. Good luck. Thank you so much, Guy and Eric. Appreciate it. Great to meet you. Likewise. Are you a runner? Are you a runner? I can't remember. Only when chased. Yeah.

51:32I should run more. Yeah. No, no, no, no, no. It's okay. I just did a long run the other day and I jacked up my Achilles heel and now I can't run. So I got to wait for five days for it to heal up. Isn't over 50 fun? It's so fun. So fun. But I go to CrossFit. I work out a lot, but I don't know. for running this. That's good. That's very good. You can wear flip meds next time. I know. It's kind of like one of those things, like why did nobody think of that before? A lot of inventions today. A lot of inventions. Cool, right? Eric, before I let you go, a quick question that I ask everyone who comes on the show, which is now with all of this experience, you know, as you become a wise old man, what would you have said to you, you know, when you're 22, 23, starting method, 24, I can't, you're so young, when you started that brand out, with Adam?

52:19If you go back and say, hey, I'm going to give you a piece of advice. Here it is. It would have been my relationship to time. Be much more patient and don't be in such a rush. Building strong foundations takes time in entrepreneurship, but also at the same time, you know, treat your time as what it is, the most precious, scarce commodity that you have. And I think pacing as an entrepreneurship is one of the biggest challenges. And I think it's a theme we heard today. If you really get to the heart of a lot of what everybody was struggling with, whether I take capital, how fast do I grow? It's really about the right pacing of building a business.

53:05That's Eric Ryan, the man behind the brands, Method, Ollie, Welly, and so many others. Eric, it's great having you on the show today. Thanks so much for coming on. Always a pleasure, Guy. Thank you. And by the way, if you haven't heard Eric's original How I Built This Episode, you've got to go back and check it out. We'll put a link to it in the podcast description. And here's one of my favorite moments from that interview. I read at one point, Eric, that to prove that this really was non-toxic, you actually drank it. Yeah. So I was in London. You know, I love the British press. They're so skeptical.

53:37And she said, is it safe enough to drink? I was like, sure. So we both took a shot at the toilet bowl cleaner. And then I immediately text Adam, finally got back to me. I was like, hey, just drank the toilet bowl cleaner. I'm going to be okay. Right? Thanks so much for listening to the show this week. Please make sure to check out my newsletter. you can sign up for it for free at GuyRoz.com. Each week, it's packed with tons of insights from entrepreneurs and my own observations and experiences interviewing some of the greatest entrepreneurs ever. And if you're working on a business and you'd like to be on this show, send us a one-minute message that tells us about your business, the issues or questions you'd like help with, and hopefully we can help you with them.

54:22And make sure to tell us how to reach you. You can send us a voice memo at hibt at id.wondery.com or call us at 1-800-433-1298 and leave a message there. And we'll put all this in the podcast description as well. This episode was produced by Katherine Seifert with music composed by Remtin Erablui. It was edited by Andrea Bruce. Our audio engineer was Neil Rauch. Our production staff also includes Chris Messini, Alex Chung, JC Howard, Carla Estevez, Casey Herman, Sam Paulson, Carrie Thompson, John Isabella, Neva Grant, and Elaine Coates. I'm Guy Raz, and you've been listening to How I Built This.

55:13if you like how i built this you can listen early and ad free right now by joining wondery plus in the wondery app or on apple podcasts prime members can listen ad free on amazon music before you go tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey No one knows your business better than you. So who better to create your website than, well, you? Wix's website builder puts it all in your hands. Create a beautiful website just by talking with AI or choosing from thousands of templates. Customize every detail with simple drag-and-drop tools and get everything you need to start running business your way.

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