Ep. 453: Carson Kressley Mini-Series Pt. 1 - Thom Filicia

11:20Carson Kressley:It's actually better than a lot of televised award shows. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We must be biased. So I know you just got back from Aspen. Yes. And is that your favorite place? And have you ever designed any homes there? You know, I've done a lot in Colorado.

11:38Caroline McGraw:I've actually not done one in Aspen. I actually just, as I told you, I was very lucky to find a little teeny tiny condo right in the village of Aspen for myself. And that actually was my Christmas present to myself and Lago, my dog. and um and it went through so now i'm actually doing that little project there um and i'm excited about having a home base there just because i i'm a big skier i love skiing and also i love that town because there's so much to do and the arts and the food and all of that so i'm excited about it but yeah i mean we i'm just i'm excited to have a home base there because it will make just doing projects there a lot easier you know just because just having a sort of a you know sort of a place to land, which I think is really exciting.

12:31Caroline McGraw:There wasn't a lot of snow. So skiing was not bad, but it wasn't fabulous. So I'm hoping in a few weeks I'll be able to zip out there and not break an ankle.

12:42Carson Kressley:You're going to design your own home.

12:45Taryn D. Williams:Yes. Right. And I'm using a lot of the Carson Kressley, the Thrill of the Hunt pieces.

12:51Carson Kressley:Collection from Ballad? Exactly.

12:53Taryn D. Williams:Yeah, yeah, yeah. I thought so. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. And I'll tell you exactly which pieces I need. And I'm going to have you check availability.

13:02Carson Kressley:This is really good because anybody listening, like I said, I'm just a stay-at-home designer. I don't have a company.

13:13Taryn D. Williams:I tell everyone you're a plus-size stay-at-home model.

13:16Carson Kressley:Wasn't that your tagline from a million years ago?

13:18Taryn D. Williams:It was.

13:22Carson Kressley:But now I can't remember what I was going to say. Oh, I do. I remember now. What was it? This is great that you are doing your own project and you're going to ask me for product because what I do as an amateur stay-at-home designer is I go to High Point Market, which is where everyone goes to buy wholesale, and I order things from my house. And then they say, well, who's your account? It's like, Tom, put it on Tom Felicia. And then six months later.

13:53Taryn D. Williams:I get like four things that end up in my showroom because I have a loading dock. And also my showroom is like two blocks from his house. So all of a sudden these three chairs and like a thing and something else and a vase and two lamps and a chain or whatever it is and some horse whips show up at my house. And the next day, I mean, my office, everyone's like, Tom, what's going on? What are you into? And I'm like, this is Carson's. These are not my horse whips. Because some of the stuff looks kind of like, wait, what's that? And I'm like, OK, this is equestrian stuff, guys. Don't get nervous. This has nothing to do with my personal lifestyle.

14:31Taryn D. Williams:That's a bit. I don't wear that in inappropriate moments. Just like, please, let's not think that way.

14:39Thom Filicia:Just walk it until you've tried it. I did walk market with Carson and he did use your name quite a few times.

14:47Taryn D. Williams:And then people tell him to get out.

14:49Thom Filicia:They were like, get out. Kicked out of so many showrooms. That's hilarious.

14:55Carson Kressley:I did get asked to leave a couple showrooms because they thought I was another designer who I'm not going to name. But they thought I was like in there, like getting ideas and stealing.

15:07Taryn D. Williams:Yeah. But you know what's funny? When they go up to you, Carson, they say, ma 'am, can you please leave?

15:14Carson Kressley:And that happens often and mostly on airplanes. On airplanes. Sir, ma 'am, sir. So we better get into some decorating talk. Let's talk. Let's do some decorating talk. When you're designing your own home, is it like the Shoemaker's kid where they fall kind of to the wayside and they're the last thing that you work on? Or do you consider it more like a laboratory and you can try out things or use your own product?

15:43Caroline McGraw:I mean, I would say, okay, first and foremost, I think the thing that's really interesting about doing your own place is that you're – I feel like most designers are a lot more creative with their own spaces for a couple of reasons. One is you're your own client, so you can kind of push the envelope a little bit. But also, it's really sometimes it's a real exercise in value engineering because you can really look at what you're doing and you're generally trying to do it on a different budget than your client. So it really does give you an exercise in sort of how to do things that you're really excited about, maybe that you haven't done yet or you haven't been able to convince somebody to do.

16:26Caroline McGraw:But how do you do it and also do it in a way where you kind of get that same aesthetic without, you know, some of the things that maybe you just don't fit your budget? So I think that's great. And I think it's exciting. I think sometimes when you are trying to do things that you're excited about, but do them in a cost effective way, I think it really pushes your creativity. And I think it kind of gets you to really sort of thinking about a mix of materials or what's out there or, you know, and just using materials sometimes. like what's really great about what I'm doing in Colorado for myself is that I'm also trying to make it incredibly durable so that if I were to lend it to friends or, you know, people are walking and people like I, I'm so close to the mountain, which is awesome.

17:14Caroline McGraw:So I was in my, how I was in my condo with my ski boots on, like walking my dog and then running across the street for opera ski. So it's like, you know what I mean? Like, so I want it to not be something that's really, um, precious, but I want it to look cool and be interesting and be very comfortable and be very functional and chic, you know, sort of, sort of like I need to kind of tap into all of those things. So I think it's really great when you're doing your own places because it is, it is that sort of laboratory in those, in those ways. Um, I mean, I'm also doing my house out East, you know, the one that you were at in Sag Harbor and that one's a totally different thing because people aren't walking, they're usually barefoot or in flip-flops or, you know, or, you know, just the only thing I worry about there is really like, you know, dogs and, you know, people falling in the pool.

18:05Carson Kressley:Right.

18:05Taryn D. Williams:Actually, you falling in the pool.

18:08Carson Kressley:I may have fallen in once.

18:10Taryn D. Williams:I mean, that's hilarious. But yeah, so each one, I think when you do your own house, which is really what most people really do.

18:19Caroline McGraw:And as a designer, I think it's a great way to sort of sort of relate to sort of when you're talking to people that are actually the end user. You know, it's like so I have products that I sell sometimes to designers, a lot of times to designers and sometimes to the actual sort of the homeowner or like the person that's like living in the space. And so I love that I have the ability to communicate kind of as a as a do it yourself kind of person, essentially, as well as a designer. and being able to communicate sort of how to make those ideas come to life and what to use around you. And I mean, I think that's what's great about your very attractive, fun, cool, curated collection is that it does look very collected.

19:07Caroline McGraw:You know, I think it looks like, you know, they're interesting pieces from your travels that you love and that were inspiring to you. And I think that is ultimately, you know, when you're layering in a space, you're trying to make it look and feel like the people are the person that lives there and sort of tells your story. And I think having access to pieces that actually help you communicate that and that you can be emotionally connected to and have fun with. And whether people are emotionally connected to them because they love you or they love the product or they love both, or it's just something that sort of fits their aesthetic or it's that missing piece they couldn't find, or it's a great gift to give.

19:50Caroline McGraw:Or, you know, I just think that's sort of the fun of design, I think, when you get to that layer of it. So doing your own place, I think, is—I love it. I don't know.

20:03Carson Kressley:A lot of designers say it's difficult. I think it's the hardest. I'm so good at telling people what to wear and what to buy and what shoes are going to look great. Well, I think that's why— The wallpaper. But for myself, I'm just like, oh, my God, there's too many choices. I'm absolutely paralyzed. Well, you know what's interesting?

20:21Caroline McGraw:That's what a lot of people say that are designing their own homes. They say the same thing. They just say like, I'm paralyzed. I'm not sure what to do. But if they walk into a friend's house, they can sort of assess what their friends are doing and tell you what they like, what they don't like. But then when they get to their own house, they have difficulty sort of expressing. And I think it's just, it's like it's a layer of insecurity. I think it's something that people don't do every day. Like you get up, you get dressed every day. You kind of know your aesthetic. You can pick out a sweater here or a belt there.

20:54Caroline McGraw:Like you can find something in a thrift store, whatever. it's like you can literally pull things together bring it home and go oh my god this is amazing i can use it here i can use it there the minute you start talking about home accessories or tabletop or lamps or lampshades rugs people sort of get paralyzed because they feel like it's a decision they're not comfortable with making every day so they just are like they just feel like it's a little bit out of their wheelhouse and it's funny i think sometimes even designers do that when they when they're designing their own house as we just were talking about so um i think it's really I think it's something that a lot of people share, you know?

21:30Caroline McGraw:And so I think giving people solutions, ideas, and the product to sort of help them make those solutions can be a lot of fun. And then having this conversation about how to solve those, you know, challenges.

21:46Carson Kressley:You touched on something, and this was one of my favorite shows when you did Dress My Nest. Yeah. And that was that was really the format of that was that, you know, you went in, you kind of looked at these people's personal style and looked at their closet and saw the things that they like and the colors they like. Is that something you do with clients as well?

22:05Caroline McGraw:Well, you know, at a certain level, yes. But I mean, that was a very kind of made for everyone to understand and really participate and see. So the idea was that these were women who had a very distinct sense of style, whether they were like boho chic or whether they were like, you know, like very conservative and kind of business, you know, sort of gal type, or they were just kind of like cool mom, whatever their aesthetic was, they were really good at the style. their personal aesthetic. But when you would go into their house, they were a complete and utter train wreck. They had no idea what they were doing.

22:42Caroline McGraw:They just were making mistakes around every corner. They couldn't get it together. They were confused. They were overwhelmed. It was too much. And so the idea of taking something that somebody is really good at, like, for example, taking this out of like sort of the space of dress my nest, like if I'm talking to a husband of, you know, husband and wife, and the husband is like, I know nothing about design. If I start talking to him about cars, he knows everything in the world about design. So I know that if I relate, like, if I say like, that sofa is really cool, but it's kind of like a 911. It's like the kind of sofa you might sit in on a weekend, but it's not an everyday sofa.

23:23Caroline McGraw:It's not like, you know what I mean? It's not like an Audi all road. You know what I mean? So like, all of a sudden, he's like, oh my God, I totally get it. We need an Audi all road in our family room. And I'm like, yeah, this is the Audi all road. That's the 911. And so all of a sudden you're speaking the language of, and you're basically giving someone a comfort zone and you're giving them the opportunity to connect with something that they understand and that they're comfortable with. So it's just understanding your audience, knowing how to like connect with them, making them feel comfortable, people making them feel empowered to be a part of the conversation i mean carson you're you know i think you and i are both the kind of people that when we go to a cocktail party or a dinner party we sit next to somebody and one person on one side is amazing and like super gregarious and then the other person's floundering don't you feel like you're able to kind of connect those two people and get the floundering person to kind of come alive because you're able to sort of pull the whatever it is about them that they are confident in out it's the same thing you do when you're meeting with clients.

24:26Caroline McGraw:It's the same concept. And so you want to give them, you don't want one person to feel like they're sort of directing the show and that the other person is kind of floundering. So I think at a certain level, you know, designers, we always say like, we're like, you know, we have to be a psychologist as well, but it's really just about kind of caring about the people that you're working with, wanting them to have a good experience. And also you really, I really want them to participate because I want them to feel like at the end of the day, this journey is about creating a space that typifies them and not really typifies me.

25:02Caroline McGraw:And it allows me as a designer to have like a little bit of a variation and a different journey on sort of the look and feel and the aesthetic and the point of view that I bring to the table. So it's not always the same thing. I don't love, I don't love just sort of delivering my product. I like delivering something that feels fresh and new and personalized, you know, to that, to the client, the location, the lifestyle of that first, second or third home, whatever it is. So, yeah. Anyways, that's kind of, that's my thing.

25:36Carson Kressley:Well, one thing I love about your work, and we have a lot of people who do books and everything and we'll look through the book and be like, I love this room or that room. I don't have that because I was not prepared, but I do have your books. Many of them. You have four books. You don't need my books. You've been in, yeah. Four books. Yeah. I've been to most of these places and rolled around on his sofas and his beds and really checked it out. I mean. But I would say the design style is very, I would say it's masculine, it's contemporary, it's clean, it's layered, but it's also incredibly warm.

26:13Carson Kressley:And that's the thing that I think is your personality. I think that's your trademark. Every place that I go that you've touched, whether it's someplace at the beach or in the mountains or at Yellowstone Club or wherever, it always has so much warmth and texture. And you can tell it's a Tom Felicia room. Even if I go to High Point and I go to the Vanguard showroom and I'm looking at your products, your beds and sofas and chairs and rugs and artwork, it's very consistent. and I don't know if that's intentional or that's just your vibe.

26:47Caroline McGraw:I would say, you know, that is intentional. I mean, because I look at it as that when I'm looking at the world of product, I use not only our product, but I use almost every other product that you can imagine.

27:02Taryn D. Williams:I mean, like... We all have that dream trip we've been wishing we could go on,

27:05Thom Filicia:but too often life, or usually price, gets in the way. That's why Priceline is here to help you turn your dream trip into reality. With up to 60 % off hotels and up to 50 % off flights, you can book everything you need for your next adventure. Don't just dream about that next trip. Book it with Priceline. Download the Priceline app or visit Priceline.com and book your next trip today.

27:29Carson Kressley:Go to your happy price. Priceline.

27:32Caroline McGraw:You know, we're shopping at, you know, and for example, on my floor at the New York Design Center, or Cedric and Brattle, MySpace, but we are in Varelin, which is like right next door to us, or like we're, we are in our showrooms, the other four showrooms on our floor all the time. And whether it's, you know, whether we're getting paints from Benjamin Moore or whatever it is, I mean, so we use everybody, we work with everybody, and it really depends on what the project is and the personality of the project. I think a lot of times, you know, I always say that what I love to do is sort of cool down a Georgian and warm up a glass box.

28:14Caroline McGraw:And so that sort of urban sort of glass box or that sort of really modern house at the beach, I like to sort of warm that up. And that really sort of like beautiful renovated barn or that incredible sort of Georgian colonial, I like to really cool that down and make it feel fresh and crisp and clean. and I love sort of landing in that middle space. And so that's really what I love to do. And I think of the work that I do as being very traditional and rooted in classic, sort of clean, fresh design. I wouldn't say it's very traditional because I don't think I'm a very traditional person, but it has elements of tradition.

28:53Caroline McGraw:But I would say it lands in a place of classic and timeless or sort of classic and timely. I don't even see myself as being truly modern. So it's really kind of using those kind of words. It is. I mean, transitional, I feel like is, is kind of a, I think that's a very specific space. I think what we do is really more of a balancing act and play with a lot of nuance of those, you know, you're looking at, you know, transitional is just sort of always being in the middle. I think what I'm doing is really balancing sort of the things from the far ends and bringing them together. So it's really looking at the materiality of the architecture and sort of saying, okay, what is this materiality?

29:42Caroline McGraw:Is it rustic? Is it warm? Is it very layered? Is it very, just the materials of the environment. And then when you start looking at the things that you bring into it, you want to bring things in that are clean, they're clear, they're maybe man-made as opposed to handmade to really get that contrast and create that balance. So in a weird way, I much prefer the word balance to transitional because to me, balance is about sort of working together, whereas transitional to me is just sort of like standing apart and being in the middle. And so I don't know, to me, I think I like the idea of it being more inclusive about the overall experience.

30:27Caroline McGraw:If that makes sense.

30:29Carson Kressley:I never really, in all the years that I've been like design adjacent, I was like, what is transitional? I don't understand.

30:36Taryn D. Williams:I'm like, just because I'm wearing a lady's cardigan doesn't mean I'm transitional. Well.

30:48Carson Kressley:I wanted to also ask you about, some of your favorite projects. And, you know, there's celebrity projects, and I did maybe, you know, name drop Iman and David Bowie. Yes. I think we kind of have to ask about that, because I'm sure we're all, like, major fans. Yeah. How did that happen? What was it like? Where did you work? Well, so, I mean, with that— Did you talk to David Bowie one-on-one?

31:15Taryn D. Williams:Yes.

31:16Caroline McGraw:He was amazing, and he was such a cool person and such an incredible artist. And Iman is amazing as well. And she's, you know, they're two very, you know, accomplished, creative people on their own. And as a team, they were very much a team, which is really beautiful to see because you don't always see that in anybody, in any client, whether they're just, they live down, you know, they live in Tribeca or they're on television and they're a superstar or a rock star. Um, no, they, he, he was a really incredible, you know, creative genius and a lot of fun to work with and had a really great personality and a very cool aesthetic.

31:57Caroline McGraw:Um, and she's also same way. Um, they were lovely and, um, it was so, yeah, it was really, you know, it was very, very sad when he passed. Um, but they were quirky, quirky, quirky and cool. And their place that I designed for them outside of the city was really spectacular and, um, just filled with really interesting art. And they just, you know, they just two people that are very open to, um, to really a lot of different, you know, beautiful things and coming up with a way to bring all of those things together and make them live sort of in harmony and sort of tell a sort of a collected story that was unified, basically for both of them, was really fun because they just, you know, they're just, there's a lot of ideas and personality and creativity going into sort of their aesthetic.

32:59Caroline McGraw:So that was really fun. They're also very straightforward, down-to-earth and confident people, which is really lovely. I mean, I think anyone designing anything or anyone picking out an outfit or looking at jewelry, when you're comfortable in your own skin and you're confident in your person and who you are and you're not trying to put on airs or trying to like fit in or like trying to like keep up with anybody. It's just such a different experience, you know, because you're there's an authenticity to what you're doing. You're having fun with it. It's real. It's cool. I mean, I just always tell people, you know, I said, if there's one bit of advice I give people when they're designing is like, you know, just be authentic and be like, let it be exactly.

33:46Caroline McGraw:This is about you. This isn't about winning. This isn't about having something that someone else doesn't have. This isn't about keeping up with anybody. This is about creating a space where you feel comfortable. And it sort of is creating, you know, it's personalizing your world. And just having the luxury to be able to do that, you know, is a wonderful place to be in your life. And so I hope that people, you know, it's always fun to work with people that are comfortable in their skin because the design feels so much more energetic and light and fresh and it's full of personality, whether it's clean and simple or it's, you know, or it's, you know, it's layered to the, you know, to the last layer.

34:30Caroline McGraw:um it just it's fun you know you when you go into someone's environment and it's unpretentious and cool and fun and interesting and there's a lot to look at and it just it tells your story and they're excited about it and they're connected to everything it's a very different experience than someone who's like you know i i didn't i don't really i i know nothing about this it just looks pretty and it was expensive it's a different experience you were talking about um before like

34:58Liz McNair:relating the language or, you know, the decorating process to something the other person speaks. I feel like that's such a, I love that insight and sort of what you were just saying about having fun. Like we all hate doing something that we feel we don't know anything about, you know, like taking your car to the mechanic. You're like, I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know any of the language. Like I'm just, I dread it. And that's to your point, like if you are able to, you're helping your client have fun with the experience. Right. So they're going to enjoy it more because you're like teaching them the language.

35:31Liz McNair:That just is so smart. And they're going to be so much happier with the end result because they—

35:37Caroline McGraw:And feel like they're, I mean, you know, and feel like they're actually a part of the journey of what's happening. You know, they're influencing the decisions as well. They're part of the collective. They're part of the conversation. They're, they're, they're moving the narrative forward. And I think when it's done and it's in, you know, sometimes I just think people are more excited about the product, the final like look and feel when they feel like they've had their hand in it. And then I think, look, I think the same thing is with cooking. I think the same thing is with fashion. I think the same thing is with friendships.

36:17Caroline McGraw:I mean, it's the same thing across the board. You know, you want to feel like you're participating.

36:22Carson Kressley:Yeah, it's the old adage, you get back what you put in. And I think if a client is really involved in the creative process and all of the juices are flowing, that's the ideal flow state that you want to be in because ultimately you're helping them tell their story. and you're kind of like the translator and the writer of the book and the person who's like getting it printed, like you're enabling them. I always think that, you know, rooms, homes, offices, whatever you're designing should be autobiographical. And I hate the word like, tell your story because that's so cliche now. But I think you should always be able to walk into a home and be like, oh, this person likes horses or this person is from Pennsylvania.

37:10Carson Kressley:Or it just, it feels good when it's authentic to you.

37:14Caroline McGraw:Yes, I agree. And I think also, I think when someone walks into a space and they, a friend walks into someone's space and they feel like it feels like the people they know. even though it's like a very elevated kind of new fresh different very thoughtful version of maybe what was there before but they know it's been elevated but and they know that they've worked with maybe somebody to do that or they've gotten ideas from somewhere but there they still feel like it feels like this is definitely you know my friend's place and this is i can see all of the things that are kind of like what was here before, but is so much better version of that.

37:55Caroline McGraw:And it feels so much better. It looks so much better, but it still feels like them. I think that's when you know it's a success. Like, I think that's when you know a space has been, I think as a designer, to me, when people say this looks like this totally is them, this is like their thing. I can, like this with the minute I walked in, I was like, oh my God, this is so Sarah and Bill. I think, oh my God, this is so them. I think that's like, that's, that's like, that's when you know, you you're doing what you should be doing. And by the way, even if you say like commercial, think of a commercial job, like a restaurant, like going into a restaurant and like looking at the design of the restaurant and kind of knowing what you're going to be eating and knowing what those flavors are going to be is kind of understanding that environment.

38:38Caroline McGraw:Or when you look at a hotel that you love, a brand that you love, and the interiors kind of really speak to the experience of where you are, what it's going to be like, what the vibe is like. It's totally chill. It's cool. It's relaxing, but it's super chic. It's unpretentious. Like all of those things. I always say the way that you describe an interior should be the way you describe your best friend. You know, it should be like fun and interesting and cool and down to earth and love to get drunk.

39:11Taryn D. Williams:But I mean, I think that's the best way to describe an interior is that it should sound like you're talking about a best friend.

39:16Carson Kressley:A person. Yeah, exactly. One of the things, and Tom and I, for those of you who are listening who don't know who we are, we did do a design show, well, many years ago, 25 years ago almost, called Queer Eye for the Straight Guy. Yes. And then we also did The OGs. And then more recently, in 2018, I think it was, we did Carson and Tom Get a Room with Carson and Tom. I know, it sounded so slutty, though, Get a Room. People were like, what is that

39:46Taryn D. Williams:about? I'm like, well, it's about, like, a room, not, like, Get a Room. Yeah, people were so confused. But I love that show. Whenever anyone finds that show on, like, I don't know where they're finding it, on YouTube, I guess, but

39:58Carson Kressley:It's now streaming in Bulgaria.

40:00Caroline McGraw:Oh, my God. But people will come up to me in, like, airports and be like, oh, my God, I found that show that you and Carson did. Oh, my God, that's the funniest show in the world.

40:09Carson Kressley:And I'm like, it really was really funny. Oh, and we had the best time. I tell people all the time, I've made many, many television shows that was the most fun. Yeah. Mind you, like, and we were doing like high-end rooms, like a$200 ,000 living room.

40:26Caroline McGraw:Which for television was unheard of. But we were at the same time doing like the little, sort of like the little space that was kind of the give back space. And so we were doing kind of both to sort of make that message of, I think the concept really that I was like, let's do real design. So people understand the value of things. They understand that this isn't like this. So we're going to give you a$9 ,000 kitchen. Like, what does that even mean? But so like, you know, and so like that I was like, we were trying to be at a time when the idea of giving people real information about design and keeping it.

41:04Caroline McGraw:you know, sort of authentic to the world of like product and what things cost. But not make it crazy. And then also we were doing the thing that was kind of like approachable and very much a give back. And it was like we could work with product that was super readily available.

41:22Carson Kressley:Yeah. And easy to get. So it was kind of both. We did very high-end rooms. And then we did a brownstone in Brooklyn that was all ballet. With a psychic.

41:31Caroline McGraw:Oh, my God. That talked to my mom. Oh, my God.

41:32Carson Kressley:Remember that? Wow. And I did it. Tom would have to do like the fancy ones where you needed to not mess it up. And then I would be like, I'm going to do a psychic parlor. And I did it in all Howard Johnson's colors of like coral and aqua. And Tom's eyeballs were popping out of his head. I'm like, this is going to be great. And it was. No, it was fun. I loved it. It was great. It just. It was cool. Tom would do like, you know, he would be working for hours and not sleeping and shipping in giant sofas from a showroom. And then I would show up like at the last 10 minutes and I put a white orchid on a coffee table and be like, okay, we're done, everybody.

42:10Carson Kressley:Good job. So I had it easy. But one thing, this is the longest segue ever, but one thing that was really, that I learned, I learned so much doing that show because I was really kind of like Tom's assistant. And I learned about editing. And all of my houses up until that point, and maybe a little bit now, kind of look like stores because I love so much stuff. So I have like, you know, I don't have like one Ralph Lauren hurricane. I have like 17 of them and books and stacks. And I tend to overdo. And editing is something that I learned from Tom. It's so important because it makes the good stuff sing if you're not like competing for all that visual clutter.

42:56Taryn D. Williams:I learned a lot on that show from Carson about airbags because he was driving the car and it was a very big SUV that Carson would sometimes like see a door on a house while we're driving through a neighborhood and say, oh, my God, I need to get a picture of that door and jump out of a moving vehicle without putting it into park while I was buckled into the passenger seat on a hill. and then all of a sudden he would get out to take the picture and I would roll away with the car in it. And I'm like going, what? And I'm trying to get my leg over the middle console to put my foot on the brake because while I was strapped into the seat and I'm trying to unbuckle my seatbelt to get the car to stop barreling it down this hill.

43:44Taryn D. Williams:Anyways, those were many moments like that many i mean i think there were so many i remind you that was hilarious there was also a

43:54Carson Kressley:lot of high low design in that show and i love that i think you've talked about that a lot like that's how we live like we yeah hamburgers and french fries from shake shack and then we go to like maybe a fancy restaurant like it's a lot of yeah but i mean like think of all the things people

44:08Caroline McGraw:i mean like i mean just look it's so funny i mean how many restaurants now serve like caviar and potato chips or look at like just sort of like everyone's wearing like a t-shirt that costs nine dollars from you know like their favorite like store where you can get something like that with like a two thousand dollar belt you know what i mean or you know like really fabulous like cool sneakers that like that are hard to get and are like you had to get a mortgage to buy them and then you're wearing them with like your favorite jeans you've had forever so it's like i just think that like that's kind of the way we live today and i think if you're an interesting cool person.

44:44Caroline McGraw:That mix is how you sort of create the combination that makes sense for the event and the things that you're doing in that day from a fashion standpoint. That's the same thing you do with a house. There are certain rooms where the combination might lean a little bit more high and a little bit less low. Then there are rooms where you do just the opposite. And then you go into a kid's room or a kid's space or the family room. Maybe the entrance hall has a little bit of like, you kind of do all of those things so that it is sort of appealing to everybody and it doesn't feel too pretentious. But then you go into like another room where you can like really go kind of crazy and like really push like all of the envelope and like go crazy with your budget and do things that are maybe a place that you're not worried the kids are going to, you know, sort of run around.

45:29Caroline McGraw:But like, I think that is the way we live. And I think to celebrate that is really cool. And I love the idea that I think high low is, is how, people are cooking. It's everything. It's just like mixing really high-end ingredients with everyday things, I think is a really nice way of being sort of a thoughtful, global kind of person. You know what I mean? It's just like things from all over the world, things from your childhood mixed with things that you were so excited about getting as an adult and letting those things sort of play well together. I think it's a great way to create a very personalized space that doesn't feel like everything else that's out there.

46:14Caroline McGraw:And I think that's, I feel like that's everyone. I think the idea of personalizing your interiors is really what people are doing across the board, whether it's food or fashion, interiors, all of those things. People, I think going into a space that feels personalized, when someone does something with an outfit that feels like I haven't seen that before. I love how you mixed all those things together. That's so cool. That's sort of, that's what everyone's trying to do, I think. And I think that's what's exciting about design right now is that it is really more about rather than trends or maybe just like little sort of like, there are these ideas that can help people sort of navigate, but they're not sort of what you're looking to accomplish.

46:59Caroline McGraw:I think that it's really about looking inward for your inspiration as opposed to outward. So I think that's kind of the moment we're in. And I think, I hope it continues. Yeah.

47:09Carson Kressley:I think that trends are great and they're fun and they keep it fresh. And I always relate that to like the fashion world. Like if, you know, the Tory Burch flat is having a moment like it did back then. That was a fun little trend to be a part of, but it shouldn't be your entire wardrobe. And I think in your home too, I'll add a piece of artwork or maybe like a new plant or something to just make it feel a little bit more up to date I don't have to redo my whole house I'll just maybe change out a coffee table or a rug or switch my rug seasonally or do different pillows and you don't have to spend a lot of money and you can really get that that feeling of refreshment which I love well yeah I mean sometimes it's just about editing too and like getting rid of some things um and refresh your home.

47:56Caroline McGraw:Well, also knowing when you've kind of like, when you're, as we all do, we layer things in over time. And then, you know, you kind of have to look around and say, Hey, like how, okay, I've got to really think about this, like where there's a lot happening in this one area. And I've got to really sort of like, just kind of give it like, just sort of like, kind of, you know, when your phone gets a little crazy and you turn it off, you count to a hundred, I never wait that long, but maybe I count to five and then I hit it back on again.

48:23Taryn D. Williams:and it sort of all stops doing that wiggly jiggly thing. And you're like, okay, we're back. Everything, look, I can get all my stuff. And so I think that's kind of what you need to do with your wardrobe every once in a while. You have to do that with your house every once in a while. You have to do that with that drawer in your kitchen that you're just like, I don't even know what, it doesn't even open anymore. I'm literally, it's January right now.

48:47Carson Kressley:You're like, I found the dog. Okay, everybody, call up search. I'm literally doing that right now decluttering and refreshing and it just it feels so good to do a January detox for your home I think when we were kids it was called spring cleaning

49:04Taryn D. Williams:but I think we have to do it now I think we call it seasonal cleaning now because I feel like it needs to happen more than just in the spring yeah no especially like

49:17Carson Kressley:quarterly cleaning And there's stuff everywhere. I think it's a great time to reset. And somebody told me this. They said, if your closet is disorganized, your life is disorganized. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Your checkbook is disorganized. Your life is disorganized. Yeah, yeah. For me, I'm such a visual person that when the clutter and the disorganization gets to a certain point, I can't even think. Like, I'm just like ADDing my heart out. Like, oh, let's put those Christmas boxes away. Oh, there's a bird. Who wants to play the Wilson? Like, I just have to have structure around me to be able to function.

50:01Caroline McGraw:so I and yeah I everything has to have a place for me so like it needs to I need to kind of know yeah I'm I'm I'm I like a little I will say though I like a little bit like when I go into an environment and it's it's so buttoned up that it feels a little like it kind of feels wound if that that I don't know if I love love love that right and I would say it's not maybe not the middle, but like 75 % like, you know, organized is really nice. That 25 % or that 10 % of free form is, I think that is what allows people to feel comfortable in a space. You know, I think, I think when things are buttoned up enough that it feels really together, but there's a little bit of imperfection, that little bit of imperfection is what allows people to be like, to feel like they can breathe in a space because I will tell you, there are some interiors I've been in where I just, you know, I know that it makes, it intimidates people, makes them feel uncomfortable.

51:06Caroline McGraw:They sit, they sit in an uncomfortable way. They are kind of like, Hey, let's go out to dinner. They can't wait to get out, you know? And I think whenever anyone goes into a space and they're excited about being in that space and they use it in a respect, in a respectful but comfortable way, I think you know as a designer, as a host, that you're giving the right message to people. I think when your host is like barefoot and is very casual with certain elements of what's happening, but also very buttoned up and on point with other things, you're creating that, it's going back to that.

51:44Thom Filicia:When you want your spring break to feel like and your kid's pool day to feel like and your hotel bed to feel like and room service to feel like because at Hilton, hospitality feels like Your cabana's ready. Would you like fresh towels? It matters where you stay. Book now at Hilton.com. Hilton, for this day.

52:13Caroline McGraw:That word balance, but you're creating that balance that allows people to not only feel well taken care of, but also at the same time feel comfortable. So I think it's a little bit of a mix that way.

52:23Carson Kressley:Yeah. And we know that feeling like when you go to your favorite restaurant, it feels warm and welcoming and you're just like, ah, you can exhale. Yeah. Yeah. And I know that's how I want my house to feel. I think that's the goal for most everybody. And even like in fashion, like when I was at Ralph Lauren, we weren't striving for perfection. We wanted things to look a little lived in. We wanted to have the collars judged. We would take a cheese grater and grate the knees of the jeans so they would look a little bit more worn out. That little bit of lived-in insouissance is what makes people feel comfortable.

52:59Carson Kressley:And it's really, really important in interior design. Because personally, I think that's the goal. Make you comfortable and make your guests comfortable. That's why we entertain at home. That's the total reason for doing it. Yeah, yeah. Agreed. I did want to, and I think we probably have about 10 minutes, but I wanted to talk about, you've worked with so many legends in the business, like Albert Hadley. Yeah. Are there lessons and things that you took from each person that you would say, this is like a gem I want to share? Yeah.

53:37Caroline McGraw:Well, so I, you know, I worked to one of my first job out of college, which is so, you know, I mean, and the way I got that job was so crazy. In the 60s, right?

53:46Taryn D. Williams:That was in 1947. 1947.

53:49Caroline McGraw:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it was lovely. Anyways, it was a good time.

53:53Taryn D. Williams:It was a good time. You know, traditional was still kind of like, it's just getting kind of, we're leaning into the 50s, getting a little bit chic, you know, it's nice. No, it was in, it was in, God, what year was that? In the 90s. So it was the 90s, which is still a very long time ago.

54:09Caroline McGraw:But so I was, you know, my first job was working at Parrish Hadley and working with David Kleinberg, who's amazing, and Albert Hadley and Libby Cameron. And oh, my God, Michael Zabriskie and David McMahon in the design office. And I was the lowest man on the totem pole. And I got my job there because I called and basically acted like, I was like, hi, this is Tom Felicia from Syracuse University. So they think they, I, can I speak with Albert Hadley? I think they thought I was giving Albert like an award, like, you know, lifetime achievement award or like an honorary degree or something. They're like, Albert, we have Syracuse University on the phone.

54:49Caroline McGraw:And then they get me on the phone. I'm like, hi, it's me, Tom Felicia. And I was wondering if I could come and interview for an internship. Anyways, he said yes. and I went in and had an amazing interview with him. I was a junior in design school and it was amazing. And I ended up getting the internship and then I worked there. They hired me out of college. So it was great. Um, and what I loved about that experience is that I worked in not only the design office, but I also worked in the architecture office. So I was doing whenever they needed somebody, they had so much going on that like, they were like, we need someone to drop like elevations for like a dining room.

55:27Caroline McGraw:I'm like, I'll do it. So I would run and do that in the design in the architecture office. Then I was like shopping for fabrics and like organizing things and going on installs and doing whatever, doing what really, whatever they needed. Um, but it was so awesome to have that experience. But what Albert Hadley once said to me, it was like, I loved and it's so it's still, he was so amazing with furniture layouts and he would always talk about how every room needs a surprise. Like, it can't be predictable. There has to be that element of, you didn't expect this. Like what? Just like the way a room is laid out.

56:07Caroline McGraw:Just the way you lay a room out. Like, when you're designing, when you're doing furniture layouts, you know, it's just like, there's the sofa, and then a pair of chairs, and then another pair of chairs in front of the fireplace, and then an ottoman in front of the, and he's like, that's all beautiful. He's like, and it makes sense in the way that the room is laid out. But he's like, but you have to have like just sort of that unusual piece, the furniture, that chair, that extra sort of like sculpture, that little sort of whatever it is, like another little table that like or just a pair of like quirky, weird chairs, like pushed up against the fireplace, you know, the mantle.

56:43Caroline McGraw:Like just something that you're like, wait, I've not seen that before. That's fun. That's unusual. That's a little quirky. Just whatever it is, he's just like, you've got to always think about the pieces that sort of give it that sort of unexpected moment. That like surprise is what he would call it. And so I loved that. And it really serves me so well in all of my projects. It helps me with my showroom. It helps me in just, and it's really a concept. It doesn't even, it doesn't have to be a piece of furniture. It's really just a concept. It's like, it's like even in a conversation or in a story or in a movie or in anything, that unexpected thing where they, you know, entertaining, like, and everyone's having a wonderful time.

57:29Caroline McGraw:and you're like, oh my God, we have to have this after dinner, like sort of like cordial or drink that everyone's like, what is it? I've never had it before. And it's just like a fun thing. And you just like go around and there's like special glasses and you just do this pour and everyone's like, wow, this is so fun. Like any, those unexpected moments are really fabulous in design, in lifestyle as a, as a whole, I would say in lifestyle as a whole. So I love that I learned that from Albert and he loved that. And it was that when you look at his work, you'll always see like a little bunny rabbit, like next to like a door, or you'll see like just something quirky and weird that you're like, where the hell did you get that?

58:07Caroline McGraw:And it's like, he loves all those moments, you know? And I think that it gives personality. It's a surprise, something to talk about, think about just fun. So I love that. When I worked for Robert Metzger, he was such a good businessman. And I love what I learned from him is that, um, a lot of what you need in your designs to finish them, um, a lot of other designers need as well. So always have a showroom that is a way for you to finish your own projects and also to help other designers do their, so he was such a good businessman and he was such a warm hearted, uh, person. I mean, I'll never forget.

58:47Caroline McGraw:I came in, I would go to work someday. So that was like 11 when I worked there. And it was crazy. I would like sometimes come in with like having gone home and showered and gone to work, like never even club, you know, it was like 25 or seven or whatever. So it was so much fun. But one time I was like,

59:05Taryn D. Williams:I literally went home and I passed out. And by the time I got into the office at like noon, which I never do, if you ever known me to ever not be where I had needed to be, I'm always like, I am where I need to be, but I was cuckoo bananas as a kid.

59:20Caroline McGraw:And I came, I was like three hours late for work. And I walk in and he looked at me, he goes, you could have at least called. We were worried sick. And meanwhile, I thought he was going to like fire me and be mad at me. He wasn't, he was mad that they were like worried about me. You know, it's like, anyway, so he was that kind of guy. Um, Albert, Oh, um, uh, Alan Tanksley. I worked for him. He was amazing. He really kind of taught me how to like, like how to be organized in an office. Cause no one ever really taught me that. And he really was like, I helped him sort of set up his whole office and how to be organized in your office, which is probably still not my greatest asset, but, or my greatest attribute, but, or thing that I bring to the table.

1:00:06Caroline McGraw:But, um, but he was really good at that. And I loved the way he talked. He was very, you know, he's just, he's very, Alan's an amazing guy. Um, and then Jeffrey Bill Huber, gosh, I think I learned probably the most from Jeffrey Bill Huber. Um, I just think he, you know, his aesthetic and my aesthetic are oddly very similar and unusually very different. You know, I think, um, I think, uh, it's funny, but I, I really love he and Albert Hadley were very similar also in a lot of ways. But Jeffrey was, I would say, like the, you know, kind of cuckoo bananas version of Albert. So I think that's why I loved his aesthetic.

1:00:54Caroline McGraw:He was so much fun, like visually. And he does so many interesting layers, which I love. We have like, I was almost like if you were to take like, maybe like someone like bill sofield and jeffrey bill huber and put them into a blender that's

1:01:13Taryn D. Williams:sort of who i am i think but like aesthetically so i i but so that's kind of how i landed there

1:01:23Caroline McGraw:but anyways so yeah i love all the people that were amazing opportunities for me to work with and like get to know and become friends with and, um, and learn from, I mean, you know, so many incredible people that have brought so many, I mean, I remember going to like meetings, uh, sister Parrish. I mean, God, she was so like, talk about an intimidating person.

1:01:50Carson Kressley:Yeah. I don't know too much about her, but I think I've seen some foreboding photos.

1:01:56Caroline McGraw:she was she i only met her twice but she was yeah yeah yeah and she was really i don't think she was working a lot when i when i was there she would kind of come in for these little cameos but i would stay in the parish hadley office like on the weekend and do things and like catch up on stuff and like i was helping work on the book and get things organized in like the fabric they would let me go in i would just go in and organize the fabric room you know she was like just to see all the fabrics. I was so excited. But then to organize them all. And then they were like, I can't believe you did this.

1:02:27Caroline McGraw:I was like, I can't believe I did it either. But it was really fun.

1:02:31Taryn D. Williams:So it would, those were really cool. I can't believe it's not Taffeta.

1:02:35Carson Kressley:I can't believe it's not Taffeta. Well, now that you're old, what are you telling kids today about design? Like how do they get their start? What's your mantra? What's your Albert Hadleyism? My Albert Hadleyism is, you know, first I always say like, you know, take what you do seriously, but don't take yourself so seriously.

1:03:02Caroline McGraw:And for the love of God, don't be pretentious because that is, that is those days I hope in our business are over. Um, but I also talk a lot about internships and the power of, you know, going and working in an office, in a showroom, um, with a team with just, if you're interested in it, donate your services, go there and work. I mean, you'll get paid. You know, there's no, I always, I never have ever done that, but, but I, I just think like, just go in and say, I will do anything. Like I want to be here.

1:03:36Carson Kressley:Mm-hmm.

1:03:37Caroline McGraw:And what you will learn from that and soaking that up is incredible. And it's so important because knowing what you want to do and knowing what you don't want to do, knowing what works for you, knowing what doesn't work for you is very important going out into the world and starting your career. There are so many layers to what we do in the design world, from the PR to the design, to the architecture, to the product, to the showrooms, to the magazines, to the world of the high point and all of that. I just think the more you know, the more you understand who you are in this world, the more of an impact you're going to make.

1:04:19Carson Kressley:Right. You're more able to do what you do and bring you to the equation.

1:04:25Caroline McGraw:Yeah, and jump in and do not think, I just think do as much. If you can do every job from emptying the wastebaskets to drawing the elevations to picking out fabrics and furniture to, if you can do all of those things and know how to write a purchase order or a proposal or how to describe a piece of furniture that will help someone to understand what it is, I think those are all really important skills. and you know whenever anyone says like oh i don't do that that is not something i've ever done or i would ever recommend anyone to say i would say i've never done that but i think i can do it is what i would recommend people say right jump in be a part of the solution um we're probably getting

1:05:17Carson Kressley:close to the end i don't know if caroline liz or taryn have questions for you i've monopolized

1:05:25Liz McNair:I could listen to y 'all chat all day. Y 'all are just...

1:05:28Thom Filicia:I thought I was listening to a podcast, not on it. So this is wonderful.

1:05:35Carson Kressley:You're welcome from the mini vacation.

1:05:37Liz McNair:I know.

1:05:39Carson Kressley:We just show up. You call this a staycation?

1:05:41Thom Filicia:It's so weird that we invited Carson to do this. So weird.

1:05:45Liz McNair:We were like, you know what? We're going to need some time in January and February. Thank you. We'll have Carson notes for the podcast. No, you know, I was actually thinking, hold on. Y 'all did your show, Get a Room with Carson and Tom. I think you said 2018. And that's the first time we had you on the show. So we, and we came to your showroom. I don't know if you remember. Yeah.

1:06:05Taryn D. Williams:I do remember. Yes, I do. I remember going into your studio. We were actually at your studio when we did it.

1:06:11Liz McNair:We did twice. Both. Yes.

1:06:14Caroline McGraw:Oh, that's right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're recording your showroom. I did it in one in Atlanta. We did too. We did it. We were in Atlanta. Y 'all were hosting something here.

1:06:23Liz McNair:So you were both in town. So then we did. That was maybe a year or two later or something. But anyway, y 'all are always so much fun. So we love to have you both because y 'all know each other so well and have such a great repartee.

1:06:40Carson Kressley:Sure do. Well, Tom, tell everybody where they can find you.

1:06:45Taryn D. Williams:At a bar in your neighborhood. I'm just kidding. No, you probably could. No, I am.

1:06:52Caroline McGraw:So Sedgwick and Brattle, which is S-E-D-G-W-I-C-K and Brattle, is in the New York Design Center. We are a just multi-line showroom and it's fun. It's great. I'm in it right now. I love it.

1:07:10Carson Kressley:Can anybody come to that or do you have to be a designer?

1:07:13Caroline McGraw:So designers, it is really, it's a to the trade showroom during the week. And then on Saturdays, it is, it also is available to, you know, to everybody. So that's really kind of cool. And then also we have, but we, people do come in time to time during the week. But so then we also have Tom Felicia Incorporated, which is my interior design office. and we're about 18, 20 people. And we do commercial and residential design, mostly residential right now, but we do commercial and residential. We also have a product division. And so we have the Tom Felicia Home Collection where we have licensed partners in rugs and wall coverings and furniture, textiles, from Cravit to Vanguard to Fazee to York.

1:08:08Caroline McGraw:um uh we cravit fabrics um in both indoor and outdoor i'm looking around we have cyan or accessories um we have lighting with visual comfort which so we have we have a lot of different um license partners that that we um work with and we're designing so we have a little team that does that as well which is the tom felicia home collection and um i don't know i'm just thinking like you can just go to Tom Felicia, T-H-O-M, and Felicia with all I's, F-I-L-I-C-I-A, Tom with an H, and you can go to Portfolio. You can sort of see what we do.

1:08:45Carson Kressley:Or you can go to Amazon and just get one of his books, which really tells the designs.

1:08:50Liz McNair:American Beauty is one of my favorite design books.

1:08:53Taryn D. Williams:Oh, well, thank you. That was my lake house, which is now, yeah, that was my...

1:08:57Liz McNair:If you get that book today, I mean, you published it in 2012, so I have to imagine you designed it in what 2010 or something right yeah yes it is this classic and stylish you know 25 years or 15 years later like it's crazy thank you thank you i'm actually working on a new book right now

1:09:15Caroline McGraw:with risoli and um which is going to be you know more of a monograph of sort of what we do and like um which i'm excited about um and yeah i mean you can go to at tom felicia and sort of see what I'm doing on Insta. And that's it. That's sort of me. Lago and I. Lago, what are you doing? He's like, I'm stretching.

1:09:39Liz McNair:I'm stretching. Well, thank you for joining us. It's always a pleasure. Thank you guys.

1:09:44Carson Kressley:Thanks for having us. This was lots of fun. Well, that's the show, everybody. I want to say a huge thank you to my dear friend, Tom Felicia. Taught him everything he knows for joining us today. No, actually, he taught me everything. I thought sweet green was just salads. Think again. There's a new way to do sweet green. Wrapped and ready. These handheld wraps pack bold flavor and 40 plus grams of protein into something hearty, satisfying, and built for life on the go. From craveable sauces to satisfying textures. They're designed to keep you going without slowing you down. So put that fork down.

1:10:19Carson Kressley:Try the new wraps today in app or at order.sweetgreen.com. Available at participating locations only. I know, and I just want to say thank you so much, dear friend. If you were inspired by anything we talked about today, literally anything at all, you have to check out my exclusive new collection with Ballard Designs. We've put links to all my favorite pieces right in the show notes. So thanks again and click away. I'll be here again next week on the How to Decorate podcast with a guest I know you're going to love. It's the Junk Gypsies, Amy and Joe Lee Sykes from Round Top, Texas.

1:11:00We'll be right back.