Tucker Carlson Makes Bombshell Accusation Against Trump, FBI Forced To Stop Probe?

21 Jun 2026 · 34 min · 15 chapters

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In short

The hosts discuss Tucker Carlson’s claim that Trump ordered the FBI to shut down the investigation into the 2024 Butler assassination attempt; they also debate allegations about Kash Patel using a “slush fund,” Israel/Iran ceasefire dynamics, and broader U.S. culture-war issues (voting rights, abortion, affirmative action, “woke,” and racism/representation).

Guests/backgrounds

Toray (author of eight books; veteran at MSNBC/CNN/BET; YouTube host of Toray Show News on TorayTube). Jen (the interviewer/host).

Key claims

Carlson says Dan Bongino told him Trump personally ordered the Butler probe to be stopped. Patel is alleged (via Rep. Jamie Raskin) to have used taxpayer money for partisan/personal payments. Netanyahu is framed as a war criminal; Iran/Putin/Trump dynamics are discussed. The episode argues U.S. rights are being rolled back and that “woke” should mean empathy.

Notable examples

“Afro One” joke about Air Force One; a drunk white man allegedly told black men “they let you guys in here”; Oklahoma racism/transphobia stories; Joy Reid event; debates over criticizing pro-Israel Democratic leaders (Cory Booker/Chuck Schumer).

Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.

Chapters

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Tucker Carlson's Bombshell Claim

0:01 to 0:20

Discussion about Tucker Carlson's podcast revealing claims about Trump and the FBI.

“That's why customers have enjoyed Progressive's Name Your Price tool for years now.”

Tucker Carlson's Bombshell Claim

1:25 to 2:30

Discussion about Tucker Carlson's podcast revealing claims about Trump and the FBI.

“There's some tea dropping over on Tucker Carlson's podcast.”

Analysis of Carlson's Statements

2:30 to 4:00

Analysis of Carlson's claims and the implications surrounding Trump's actions.

“He's the one who should shut down the investigation.”

Discussion on Political Dynamics

4:00 to 5:24

Exploring the political landscape and reactions to Carlson's accusations.

“Like he's like, to me, he's like Marjorie Taylor Greene.”

Kash Patel and Allegations of Corruption

5:24 to 7:36

Discussion on allegations against Kash Patel regarding a personal slush fund.

“how do we like this is amazing you think putin doesn't know that of course they all know it starmer doesn't that yahoo then yahoo oh my god i mean don't you know oh my god uh yeah so then All right, Kash Patel.”

Reflections on White House Culture

7:36 to 9:30

Discussion on the culture in the White House and its implications for governance.

“NOW just said that Kash Patel has a slush fund.”

Personal Experiences and Social Issues

9:30 to 14:01

Hosts share personal anecdotes related to social issues and racism.

“everybody I've ever talked to work in the White House, that you can only do it for a certain amount of time, and then you're just going to probably burn out.”

Personal Anecdotes on Pickleball and Politics

14:01 to 16:45

Hear about experiences navigating social dynamics in Oklahoma while playing pickleball and discussing political beliefs.

“But the other people who laughed, what did they not say?”

Confronting Racism in Conversations

16:46 to 19:09

Delve into the challenges of addressing racism in predominantly white spaces and the importance of speaking up.

“last, since Trump, I'm a lot more confrontational about it.”

Critiquing Black Leaders: A Tough Conversation

19:10 to 21:09

Explore the complexities of critiquing prominent Black political figures and the perceptions surrounding it.

“calling out Cory Booker on his stands for Israel or calling out Hakeem Jeffries.”
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The Forward and Backward Struggle for Justice

21:10 to 24:55

Understand the historical context of Black rights in America and the cyclical nature of progress and setbacks.

“It's just now Americans are, some Americans, many Americans are willing to say that.”

The Importance of Multicultural Experiences

24:56 to 28:05

Discuss the value of multicultural interactions and how they can reshape perspectives on race and identity.

“next two to six years, where we start to see like, okay, now the pendulum is reswinging.”

Navigating Racial Spaces

28:05 to 29:50

Discover the dynamics of racial interactions in different social settings.

“I don't want to, I don't even want to judge them.”

Personal Experiences with Racism

29:50 to 31:35

Hear personal anecdotes highlighting unexpected racism in liberal environments.

“And then when they do, I find myself quite often going like I was so surprised by it that I don't even realize what I should say until later.”

Misconceptions and Stereotypes

31:35 to 33:55

Explore how stereotypes influence perceptions in professional and social settings.

“We were a table of black men and we were the only black people in the restaurant.”
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Transcript

Automatic transcript. May contain errors.

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1:08Welcome to iHip News. Joining me in studio in New York City is Toray, my friend. He is an author of eight books, a veteran, MSNBC, CNN, and BET, and host of Toray Show News on YouTube at TorayTube. That's pretty clever, TorayTube. Thanks, Jen. How are you? I'm great. Okay. Country's falling apart. We just lost a war. Everything's fabulous. All right. There's some tea dropping over on Tucker Carlson's podcast. Oh, joy. I want to run by you. Okay. Tucker revealed on his podcast. I avoid Tucker's podcast on purpose, but come here to be debriefed on it. Let's go. All right. Tucker reveals on his podcast that Dan Bongino said that Trump stopped the investigation into the Butler assassination.

2:00So Tucker dropped a bombshell. And he said that Dan Bongino, while he was still serving as FBI deputy director, admitted to him that Donald Trump himself ordered the investigation into the 2024 Butler assassination attempt to be shut down. Sure. Carlson said that after pressing Bongino about Thomas Crook's online presence, Bongino became hysterical on the phone. He was clearly terrified, Carlson said. After a long series of calls and texts, Bongino allegedly told him, take it up with Trump. He's the one who should shut down the investigation. Carlson made the explosive claims during an appearance on Mario Nawh Falls podcast, stating flatly, I know that Trump shut down the investigation into Butler.

2:48That is a fact. Dan Bongino told me when he worked at the FBI. I totally believe it. It's bizarre how little we know about Thomas Crooks, how little we hear about him. Trump is the pettiest, most vengeful person in the world. And yet the person who tried to shoot him, allegedly, we never hear about him and nothing ever happened. I mean, the Trump I know would talk about him all the time, would basically have him in effigy at every rally, would make sure to bankrupt his family. But also, okay, Tucker Carlson has decided to be a right-wing, not apologist, but antagonist. So he is constantly calling out their shit, right, and attacking them.

3:37And if somebody defects from the administration, their first stop is Tucker Carlson. So he's outing the inside of the Trump administration. That's where he wants to be right now. He's not on the left at all. He's not in the center, but he is a muckraker sort of on the right, wanting to be a rabble rouser and mess. And I believe that he is like telling the truth, right? As far as he knows it, right? Like he's like, to me, he's like Marjorie Taylor Greene. Like they were MAGA, they are MAGA, but they're coming into like the reality, right? Like Marjorie Taylor Greene is like snapped out of character.

4:16Now she's like, look, Trump lied to us. Like, I know that I'm sorry that I didn't tell you before. Right. And like Tucker is the same way. Yeah. I think in the case of Marjorie Taylor Greene and Tucker Carlson, it's financial Darwinism. They know that Trump is 80. He's quacking like a duck, like a dementia duck. I mean, he could drop dead at any minute. You've seen the muffin top cankle situation that we have going on, the swollen hands, the sausages it's not good it is not good to ray falling asleep in meetings fallen asleep at an nba finals game to ray he fell asleep in the garden they i i hate to do the tit for tat thing but they were so hard on biden and let's do it let's do it was old i get it but trumpy is just as old he is just as infirmed the iranians had a psychological person working because like we're dealing with somebody who is not mentally all there and that's not like a diss like how do we deal with this leader who is not all there and they are working as if like he's not all there how do we like this is amazing you think putin doesn't know that of course they all know it starmer doesn't that yahoo then yahoo oh my god i mean don't you know oh my god uh yeah so then All right, Kash Patel.

5:37I want to say, I want to do with you. You bring up Netanyahu. I'm going to go off your script. Let's do it. I want to. Because Iran is saying that Israel will stop on all fronts, including Lebanon. Originally, they said Lebanon and Gaza. And they have, I think they have said, we can't get them to agree to not attack in Gaza. They'll agree in words to not attack in Lebanon. and then at some point they'll go back to attacking in Lebanon. But at least they'll agree to that in words. They won't even agree in words to stop in Gaza. That's insane. I mean, Benjamin Netanyahu is a war criminal. He is absolutely monstrous person that governs the country of Israel that is not a democracy, that should not be our ally in the least bit.

6:28They commit war crimes like you and I are sitting here chit-chatting. It's horrific. And Benjamin Netanyahu saw in Trump a weak man that Iran sees, that Putin sees, and he flattered him. I mean, he asked every president, please attack Iran. And everyone was like, no. Even George W. Bush and Dick Cheney, the neocons, Rumsfeld. George Bush was like, no, that is not a good idea. And Trump and them were like, what's the right? Right. Marco Rubio was the one who was like, I don't think this is a good idea, you guys. The rest of them were like, let's freaking do it. But Israel is the most bellicose nation in that region.

7:12I saw Joe Scarborough thought he was being a truth teller, saying all the other countries in the region will now fear what Iran is about to do next because Iran has won this battle against the United States. the other countries in the region are not afraid of Iran. They understand that America powering Israel is their great problem. Right. Shifting gears slightly. Allegedly, this just came out. MSNOW is reporting that Kash Patel. Ms. NOW. What'd she say now?

7:48We love her. She's so cute. She's very sassy. Ms. NOW just said that Kash Patel has a slush fund. pop this up. Cash Patel may have a personal slush fund of taxpayer dollars to pay loyalist agents, according to Representative Jamie Raskin. Raskin is demanding documents from Patel, citing claims that$8 ,000 payments are made to agents who carry out unlawful, partisan, and personal orders. I mean, just a bunch of dirty cops. I believe that and ACAB, but also$8 ,000 is all it takes to get you to sell your soul and go against what your oath and all these. I mean, like, I think you're worth more officer.

8:34I think you could demand more from Kash Patel, who's making an illegal payment to you who can't. How much can he argue? and you guys are doing a drug deal. How much can he, right? Because if the cop says, hey, you know, you are breaking the law here. Like, well, you are too, but you are head of the FBI. Like, you can't survive that. This administration, it's a total cagostocracy. What do you make of Kash Patel? Do you think - He's a clown. But don't you think he's on the chopping block? Don't you think Trump's going to fire him soon? I mean, I would imagine so. I mean, you know, I have no idea because they are not running this on some basic, normal meritocratic grounds.

9:15Right. You know, in a normal administration, if you make a big mistake, then they let you go. Right. You also see a lot of churn because it's very hard to work in the White House. Right. Left or right. D or R. You're really not away from your family a lot. It's a very difficult job. everybody I've ever talked to work in the White House, that you can only do it for a certain amount of time, and then you're just going to probably burn out. But, I mean, I don't believe that Trump is working on some normal leader calculus where it's like, oh, well, Jen is not doing the job well, so we'll get rid of her.

9:49I mean, like, our standard of what Kash Patel should be doing is not Trump's standard. Yeah. Whatever it is that we think the FBI director should be doing, that's not what he's doing. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe, you know, so I don't know. Okay. Go chug a beer. All right. So you saw the UFC, the white trash festival. I saw that. They did. I did not watch. Okay. I didn't either, but I watched the highlights. No, I, part of me was like, it is gross to do UFC on the White House lawn. And then I was like, am I just being traditionalist in that in the future, they'll be like, what was the big deal? about the ufc yeah like like if i'm sorry like if if if if a if a president in the 60s or the 50s when boxing was like gigantic in america was like we're gonna do a heavyweight fight on the white house lawn because everybody in america likes boxing the ufc is not there but is it possible that i'm just being like traditionalist and like yeah that's gross it's white trash it's gross it just is these are what should and this is should i mean the exclusion is a larger problem right the exclusion of black culture brown culture gay culture but should white trash have their moment in a white house culture world like no absolutely not white trash has been on display for a really fucking long time to rate.

11:19No, white elitism has been on display. So has white trash. You saw the Dukes of Hazzard. You saw... No, I know, but not in a White House context. Beverly Hillbillies. No, I... You saw Uncle... I did watch that. Uncle Jed, Jethro. I know, Dr. Dynasty. I know, but not in a White House level. Here's the thing. If Barack Obama had NBA players out there, they would lose their fucking mind if he did that. These are the people that lecture us about the dignity of the office. Zelensky came in and he didn't have on a suit. And now they've got lubricated muscle men prancing around the White House in their goddamn panties.

11:59She said lubricated muscle men in panties. You saw them? They're in panties drinking Monster Energy drinks. This is a four pay-per-view thing situation. Everything about this from top to bottom is unpresidential. It is white trash. Should white trash sports be banned from the White House? Yes. Call this white on white crime. But I have had it, Tarey. I've had it from top to bottom. I don't have, obviously, any white trash people in my world. Like, they're not in my family. Like, I don't talk to them. Like, I don't encounter them. I don't know where any trailer parks are. What does that feel like?

12:36Well, I can't describe the absence. but I'm sure that that is part of your world. It is. And you have made this gigantic thing about like, you stand up for black and brown people and for gay people. Yeah. Do you get, do you have a problem with some of the white people in your life because of the stands that you are taking? Like you, I do not have people in my life that are anti-LGBTQ or engage in anti-black racism. However, I lived in Oklahoma City for 50 years and it's unavoidable. The racism, the transphobia, the homophobia is so ubiquitous. And I'll give you just a prime example. When Barack Obama was president, somebody was at my house and referred to Air Force One as Afro One.

13:27This isn't... A white person. A white person. Wait, what was the context? Just, oh, now we can call Air Force One Afro One. And this is a group of white people. White woman. a white but it's a group of white women are like talking socially racist shit yeah she just says we can call it afro one yeah and everybody laughs yeah that was a real knee slapper and then what did you but what did you say i told the girl to get stand up and get the fuck out of my house you did yeah and what happened she god you're so not everybody's a democrat jennifer that's okay yeah and i'm just like that's fine you just can't be a racist in my house get up and get the fuck out.

14:02But the other people who laughed, what did they not say? Oh, Jen's so uptight. Jen's so sensitive. I know behind my back they've all said, and I'm fine with that. I'm fine being the skunk at the garden party. Really? I'm completely fine with it. Because a lot of these white women in red states, I'll give you another example. I was playing pickleball with these people. And in our - Shut the fuck up, Tare. You're such an elitist snob. No, I'm a tennis player. It's a real sport. I know. I play tennis as well, but I was playing pickleball. I was doing white trash shit in Oklahoma. Okay. I can, I have no white trash friends.

14:39My name is too. I don't. When would I meet them? Is there a Tinder for white trash friends?

14:48Okay. So anyway, I'm playing pickleball and in the pickleball group, lots of lesbians play pickleball. They're really quite good at it. Right. And so these women, I know that they triple Trump. I know. and they let you know that Fox News talking points came out. But this one lady, do you remember that person that worked for Joe Biden that was trans? I think it was like a secretary of transportation. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I think she's Maryland or was she Midwest? Yeah. Something like that. Anyway, she shows me, this lady shows me this image of this trans person that worked for Joe Biden and wanted to like laugh about it.

15:26Like, look, this trans person looks like, and it was something. And I said, that's so mean. And I just snapped her up by her. So that's so mean. I said, we play pickleball with all these lesbians that bring so much joy into our life and into our game. And I know you sit around and watch Fox and I know you voted for Trump, but that's just, I don't want to participate in this laughing, punching down at trans people. I don't like that. And she said, well, I mean, I'm an independent and I just don't like to talk about politics i'm like you're the one you just did you're just a transphobic kind you know like white people don't yeah we know this sociologically don't usually police other white people like in an all-white space if somebody says something racist generally almost always nobody will say anything yep i think there have been times in my life where i haven't for sure um and i regret that it's um when you grow up in the south and oklahoma people will say it's not the south but culturally it is.

16:18It's very culturally, it's a Bible Belt state and it wasn't a part of the historic South. If you look at the Tulsa race riots and Tulsa savagery, which by the way, I didn't learn about in school and Oklahoma public schools, but it's so ubiquitous that experience of being a white person and hearing racist shit that there've been a lot of times where I've kind of, and then the person would leave and I'm like, God, that was kind of fucked up. But I would say probably the last, since Trump, I'm a lot more confrontational about it. And I kind of enjoy it. I kind of enjoy getting in their ass. It happens for me as well in that sometimes white people say things that are ignorant.

17:00They don't say overtly racist things around me, right? Obviously. But they may say unwittingly racist things, right? And then it's like, do I educate? Do I challenge the person? Do I point out what they said? That may offend them. I may lose the opportunity to talk to them or work with them. They may think he's such a jerk. I do recall once basically pointing out somebody's racism in a work meeting and everybody just stopped paying attention. It was like, oh, Torre's on his shit again. And I'm like, are you fucking kidding me? And like, yeah. So it's, it's a, it's a struggle for me as well. I, here's the thing.

17:49I want to know, like, I want. You want to know what, that they're racist? No, if I am saying things from a white experience lens that's insensitive, because sometimes something so normal for us, like I went to the high school I went to, Tarey, had 2000 people in the suburbs of Oklahoma City, maybe six black people. And this is not a private school, it's a public school, a public high school. And so I want to know if I say something that is wrong or extraordinarily out of touch with my white experience. You're different than most white people. You're aware and you're opening. Would you say I'm white trash?

18:29No, I would definitely not. You're an interior designer. Have you shown them what this whole room looks like? No, I need to do a tour. This room is really beautiful. This is the most beautiful recording studio I have ever been in, with one exception, was the room that Beyonce was recording in. Oh, Queen Bee. Name drop. Let me ask you this. So I've been thinking about this a lot. So I go after like Hakeem Jeffries and Cory Booker, but I also go after Chuck Schumer and you know, it doesn't matter. And then some black political activists online have pointed out the optics of me, a white woman, calling out Cory Booker on his stands for Israel or calling out Hakeem Jeffries.

19:16And when I see it, when I see those comments, it bothers me. Like, I understand what they're saying. What is your take on that? With Hakeem, for one, not fair, because he is essentially the leader of the Democratic Party in the House. So it's not like you're critiquing, you know, somebody down the line who's black and like, why is this? Like, no, of course, if we're talking about politics, we're going to have to be critical of the leader of the Democratic Party in the House. Um, there's not, you know, Corey is not the leader, but I would think any, I mean, at this point, anybody. But he's a United States senator.

19:57Yeah. You know, I mean, look, this is the critique of you is problematic in that conversation because this is the critical fissure in the Democratic Party right now. Most Democratic voters are pro-Palestinian and have more sympathy for Palestine, want there to be a two-state solution, want there to be far less to no aid to Israel, at least offensive military aid. The leadership of the Democratic Party remains extremely pro-Israel. So they are asking us to vote for and accept things that we don't accept. And this is a voting issue for me. I could not vote for somebody who won't call it genocide, period.

20:39That's what I got into with Cory Booker. I asked him, is Benjamin Netanyahu a war criminal? And he wouldn't answer the question. I mean, if you can't say it's a genocide, then you are completely compromised. AIPAC is holding your back. And you can't even say the truth. I mean, that is just the truth. And in America, right, because I'm married to a Lebanese woman, like a first generation immigrant, right? So I have Lebanese family over there right now. We call it genocide now after what happened after October 7th. It's been a genocide for a long time. It's just now Americans are, some Americans, many Americans are willing to say that.

21:21But like, this has been an attempt to get rid of these people by any means necessary. Can we make them move? Let's do that. But if we make them fear for their lives, and then they're going to move, then great. This has been the idea for a long, long time. Yeah. Yeah. I just, I feel like right now, I understand the optics of what some of the commenters say, but I feel like if Cory Booker is a senator and Chuck Schumer is a senator and I have the same critique for both of them, you're in the big boy seat. You're in the seat where you get criticized and we have to hold our politicians accountable.

22:00I would reject the notion that you can't critique Cory Booker because you're white and he's black. That's ridiculous. You're talking politics. He's a major senator. Yeah. All right. Let me ask you, I'm going to go off script too. I want to ask you a final question. And then I get to ask you a final question. I want you to ask me. I like that. I like the flip the script. The Voting Rights Act has been gutted. And a couple of big things have happened with the Supreme Court. The first one was Roe v. Wade. And that happened. And then the states, like the state that I'm from, the women have no rights there.

22:36A rapist has more rights than a rape victim in Oklahoma. Guns have more rights than a woman in Oklahoma. all in the name of Jesus. White trash politics, baby. It's a white trash show. But anyway, and now the Voting Rights Act. And these are massive, massive things. And I feel like they happen and we're all like, and then now we just go on. And they're talking about redistricting Georgia again now for 2028. And they're really erasing black representation. How do you see us aligning to fight this fight for Black Americans? You know, Black history is forward and back, forward and back. We do not, we have not moved forward into justice.

23:24We have taken steps forward and then back. We get, like say, freed from slavery, and then you have the nadir, right? We have reconstruction, and then they burn down our cities, right? We get this, you know, we get the right to vote, and then they take the right to vote away in de facto ways, right? And then, so it's been some steps forward and then back, step forward and step back. This is definitely a step back period where we are losing rights. I mean, all the things you said, plus you think about the attack on affirmative action, the continued attack on affirmative action, the attack on critical race theory, the attack on just teaching Black history in college, which I was a Black history major.

24:07it was it was af am uh african american studies in african um and it was so important to my sense of self to understanding the history of how i got here right within america and before america um it is it is deeply important to your self-esteem to understand how you as a as your gender your race, your nationality. Who came before you for you to be here today? It is incredibly important, and Emory University helped me get that. So taking that away from people is a deep problem. This is a stepping back moment, and America does go back and forth, D to R, D to R. So I imagine that we are going to have a correction in the other way at some point, hopefully soon in the next two to six years, where we start to see like, okay, now the pendulum is reswinging.

25:06Somehow the concept of woke has become either horrific, right? And like hated by part of the country, or it's kind of like a joke to the rest of the country, right? Like even as liberals, we'd be like, oh, you're so woke. And I'm like, are we making fun of ourselves when we do that? I want to bring woke back. I mean, I think just being empathetic toward people who are not you, That's all that wokeness means to me that like, I am aware of some of the challenges you have as a woman, even though I'm not a woman, right? Because I have listened, I have read, right? I mean, like, you know, there's challenges that other people have that you heard.

25:44You heard about our periods.

25:51Wow. I'm just kidding. Every month? Every month? Every 28 days? Do you ever take a day, like take a month off? No, you can get like on the pill and stuff like that. So the last time I saw you was at this fabulous Joy Reid event where she does this amazing, it's like a intellectual variety show. Yes. Where she comes up and she talks and tells some jokes, she says something smart. And then Jen Welch comes and sits with her for five minutes. And then there's a comedian. And then Don Lemon and Sunny Hostin is out with her. And then I sat with her. But it was like 95 % black women and a few black men and Jen Welch.

26:31It was. The one piece of rice. The lone cracker.

26:39And I wonder how that feels for you because 99.9 % of your life as a white person, you are in the dominant race in the room. whatever room you go into it's incredibly rare for you to go into a room where you are not you are overwhelmed 99 to 1 how does that feel so i love it and i love it a lot and i my youngest son roman played aau basketball and he played on an all-black team and they traveled everywhere and they were ranked at one point number one in the country oh shit yeah they were fucking serious Is he a star? Yeah. Oh, he's a guard. Yeah, he's a guard. And so shout out to Steven Alexander and AET, all of y 'all in Oklahoma City know Steven Alexander.

27:29But I traveled with all of these fabulous black women, these black moms, and for years, for 10, 11 years. And these women, we still text all the time. We're still great friends. I mean, the kids have all graduated from high school now, but I firmly believe that if a lot of white people had more experiences, multicultural experiences, it's better. That's why New York is so awesome. It's hard to give up that sense of power though, right? I can see for a lot of mediocre white people that it could be very difficult. I don't want to, I don't even want to judge them. You spend your entire life in moments where you never even think about race because it's always whiteness is in charge in the room.

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28:16And then you go into a room like that and you're like, oh, shit. And it takes a lot of humility to accept like, wow, this is a super black space and I need to get in where I fit in. Let me just say something I've observed. And I don't know, maybe there's science out there that can back this up. So white spaces, all white spaces are very reserved. People are more aware of what they do. When you get around a room full of black people, I mean, it's just, it is go, it is celebrate out of fucks to give. Likewise, when I went to college, I hung out with a lot of gay men because I was an atheist, raised an atheist in the Bible belt.

28:58So all the Bible thumpers were after me. I was on all the prayer warrior lists, all the gay guys, the Bible thumpers were after them. So I hung out with them all the time in college versus the Bible study girls. and the same thing with the gay men they were just liberated out of fucks to give they they didn't have a filter and there was there's something to be said for a marginalized group of people and the emotional depth that requires them to reconcile and there is a a more authentic group this is just my observation yeah from the lgbtq plus community to my aau circles to joy read show yeah and being the only white hetero cis person in those spaces white people wound up like cheap clocks they are not fun they care so much about what everybody thinks about them it's just those are my observations they're very reserved yes and boring i did learn have to learn because i went to private school so i was quite often the only black person in the room like throughout my childhood and i definitely had to learn to dial it back because you come in with all this energy and you're like i'm just that's just who i am this is where we come from that's just how it is in my house and the white people are like whoa you are so much yeah and they might be like it's fun it's funny but others are like whoa and like you have to learn how to modulate that to get along with them yeah i mean it's definitely 100 especially in the bible belt it's even worse here in new york the white people are cooler they're just a lot cooler because on the streets of new york they've had to cooperate i think the streets of new york and the transportation are an equalizer sure you know you see all different people all walks of life all socioeconomic nobody gives a sure you have to you're just going from point a to point b but in like suburban white america uh it's tough i mean it's some tough stuff it really is When I encounter racism in New York, I am surprised because I didn't expect it because I assumed people are liberal.

31:10People are thoughtful. They're not going to say dumb shit. And then when they do, I find myself quite often going like I was so surprised by it that I don't even realize what I should say until later. Right. Like a spree de scalier. Like I leave the room and I'm like, I should have said this. I can't believe the person said something so dumb. What's an example? Oh, my God. I knew you were going to say that. Let's see. This is a fairly obvious example. I use this in a book that I did about race. We were a table of black men and we were the only black people in the restaurant. And there was a white guy with a big Afro, like Afro wig on like the other side of the room.

31:48And I just knew he was gonna come over. And eventually he came over and he was drunk and he put his hands around two of the guys and said, I can't believe they let you guys in here. Hand to God, there are like six men there. And we all looked at each other like, surely this white man must belong to somebody. Like, is he yours? Because no stranger, he must know somebody at the table. And it was like, we're looking like, is he yours? Is he yours? And when nobody was like waiting to look, and then we like ignored him. Cause we didn't get like, we could have gotten furious. It was just like, go away.

32:35Yeah. But I mean, you know, people, people I'm trying to think about some, Oh, you know, somebody once said, this is professional. When I was starting to come up, I was pushing this magazine to give me a contract. Right? So we're not freelance anymore. Now we're like married. I'm going to write for you all the time. And he said, he said, we know you can write about Run DMC. Could you write about Eric Clapton? Which I thought was a particularly terrible example because Eric Clapton comes from the blues. He is absolutely a white man doing black music. So that example of all, if you had like a purely, purely white example, and there is no, there is no music that has not come from whiteness.

33:18But like he is a white man who is doing black music. And when you get in a moment like that, it's difficult. You can't convince them in the room. They have already decided you can't do this because you're black. You can't do this because you're a woman. My wife and I play backgammon very seriously. We just started getting into this league. So we show up at a bar. The first season, we were subs. So if your team was out, one or two people, you call us and we'll come play. so it's always the men assume she can't play so you walk in the room assuming she's not very good he can't do the thing all right and you can't just defeat that in the mind of some straight white man just easily and quickly yeah well trey this has been so fun thank you i want to have you back in studio again because you're just we're both in new york city now yeah and it's so fun and listener go follow tell them toray to toray to toray show news i'm on there almost every day i'm doing essays right you're doing like conversations and news and segments yeah you're this is like a tv show right i do like an essay on tv entertainment yes you're you're educating hell well i mean you know i need it i love to learn yeah edutainment i love that all right go follow my friend to ray thanks everyone

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