Harness the Hustle with 2 Chainz

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22:13What happens is when you're immature and young, sometimes people doubt it can seep into you. Yes, yeah. You know, I can't sit here and say that my self-confidence has been at a high level my whole entire life. I have felt like I had something different apart from me, for sure, because I attracted people. Like I could sit at a lunch table by myself and everybody want to come eat around me. This is eighth grade. So I saw that part. But someone can project some doubt on you. And you can feel that sometimes, you know, you may listen to it sometimes. But when I became, because I'm around people, you know, my upbringing, I used to hang around older people too.

22:52Like I didn't even feel, you know, when I was 15, like hanging around a 15 year old would have been, there's no way I could have hung around a 15 year old when I was 15. I'd already went to juvenile I was already like You a grown man No I'm a grown I just couldn't even hang with no But I remember telling a kid that I went to somebody's house We like Grown kids Whatever that means And I said something about Santa Claus These people done kicked me out I'm like I didn't know This man is like He might be 12 Or 13 So this lady I'll never forget it Jonathan if you watching I hadn't even been over I go over there And we talk about this Mama looked at me so mad.

23:31And my daddy been nothing told me. My daddy one time sent me to the trunk to get something. All the gifts in the trunk. And then we stand in an apartment complex. So I said, I don't even have a chimney. I'm like, this ain't even. This doesn't make sense. You know, it just hit me. I'm like.

23:46Craig Robinson:And you're thinking everybody should be able to figure this out. Yes. I'm like, I mean, if you want to play along with it, cool. But like, you serious? You really? You really believe? So I'm like, I say this. no folks no folks sent me home you know so when I'm coming up I'm hanging with people two or three years older than me just because I feel like if I'm in a 10th grade hanging with seniors or someone out of school it's more of my speed or whatever so when you graduate and you just out of school not doing nothing it's easier for you to project something on me as a sophomore or junior because you ain't really doing nothing with your life or whatever or you working at a warehouse or whatever you're doing you know what I'm saying let's go back to when you said, you're talking about how in most communities, people would see somebody like you and say, hey, you don't need to be going over there.

24:36You got too much going for you. That was me. I was, you and I are not that different. Wow. I just had the folks in the neighborhood because we, me shall tell you, we grew up in the same type of a neighborhood. It was, I'm older than you are, obviously, but I want our listeners and viewers to know that because people might think we're like close to the same age.

25:00Craig Robinson:He's old. He's 60, 100 years old. That was supposed to be a joke. Nah, I get what he said. But so they steered me away. They were like, Craig, the same for you. You come up to the courts, gang guys playing, everybody's playing. You'd be on this team. Stuff's about to pop off, Craig. You better go home. Let's get you out of here. Let's get you out of here. You somehow didn't have that and dealt with all the stuff you dealt with, but you circled back around on your own or with the help of some other people? How did you circle back around? Because you circled back around and was a good enough student, straight A student, you know, A and B, like you said, good enough ball player to be recruited, which I want to talk, what AAU team did you play for?

25:46I played with Team Georgia. Yeah, I played with Team Georgia. I'm sure I saw you play. Yeah, Coach Outlaw. and down to burn the recipes to coach outlaw. Yeah. And then, like, team sports help kids. Y 'all, like, team sports, I've been seeing stuff go viral. Like, don't put your kid on the AAU, all that stuff. Like, man, with social development, with, man, you, man, some kids, you know, some parents got more groceries at their house. It's just, it's just like, it's a part of like, for me, it was definitely a part of my upbringing. And then, another thing, I, when I was playing basketball, it was a God-given talent.

26:25Like how my son has God-given talent and I'm taking him to train three, four times a week. It wasn't like that with me. I just came out. I started playing when I was seven years old for MLK in Atlanta. They had an eight and under team. I started playing when I was seven. By the time I was nine, 10, I remember when I, by the time I was 12, I was like, I could hoop. But what happened was when I got in high school, I was doing the one foot out, one foot in thing. So I was still playing ball, but I was still trying to hustle for me and my mom, whatever the excuse is. You know what I mean? And I did that.

27:01I did one foot in, one foot out all the way until I started doing music, literally. And it took me that long to realize that you can't do both. You have to let something go. You have to share it all. You can't have one foot in, one foot out and do this. And it's just not going to pay off. So with basketball, even though I got 11th grade, I had boxes of letters from D1. You know what I mean? It was like me and my other guy, D.C., we would get letters. You know, it'd be so cool. Coach would come out. And I remember Lavender Northwestern letters. I remember Tennessee, that Tennessee orange. I remember Memphis.

27:37I remember the Tiger. I remember these schools. I'm getting these different letters. South Carolina, South Carolina State, Maryland, Maryland Eastern Shore. But I'm still one for that. I'm still like, I'm literally having days where I have a friend and I say, hey you go to the court today I'm gonna stay here and I'm gonna sell drugs all day and then did you have your one foot in one foot out because you weren't sure if you could make it or was was it a survival thing it was absolutely survival so you have you had to I had to do this I had to do this and then like when you when you it becomes like a brotherhood thing this may be too much information but you start

28:18Craig Robinson:no it's never too much information you start going in on packages with your friends. You're like, man, we're going on a package and now this is ours. You know what, Craig, man? I hope yesterday, man, you go. I'll stay here and handle this spot. And you go. Now, Craig is not better than me and I'm supposed to be the basketball star of the crew, but I got to give him like a day off to go do some. And then the next day, it's crazy how organized it is. The next day, Craig said, you know what? You know what, man? I hope, man. You go on out there with the boys. I'll stay here And I'll sell the stuff that we went in on.

28:52And this happened to me. I'm talking about all the way through college, all the way through college, all the way through. I start rapping. I'm still one foot in, one foot out. And it was this one thing that happened, one thing that happened. And it was, I went on tour with Lil Wayne. And after two months of being on tour with Wayne, when I came back to Atlanta, I went cold turkey. people thought I was man stop playing man anyway they did that for like a week and I was just like I don't do that I don't do that I don't do that you can't be it hit me I had to actually see like oh this this how you become a I had a studio at the time I had a Porsche I had that but I was still like doing kind of having the same concept going on the road leaving this with somebody and just same concept just and like this ain't literally.

29:49Craig Robinson:What did you see? What was Lil Wayne? What did you see with Lil Wayne? Structure, discipline, very habitual. Same thing. Over and over. Show, food, work all night. Work, work, get some good news. Thank you. Work, show, work, make sure the family good. Do this, work again. No extra, no, none, and it's just like a level of professionalism. Man, And I'm great at observing, too. Like, I learned a lot of stuff from just watching, too. I learned how to drive a five-speed of stick from watching my cousin. I used to just be, like, watching. Granted, the first time I took the trash out, I couldn't get over the speed bump.

30:33But I learned a lot from observing. So when I'm with him and I'm just seeing how he moves, I'm talking about from having a chef so you don't have to eat bad, right? You don't have to eat, right? So you got a chef. you got somebody that like can drive you somewhere so you don't have to because a lot of times with creators we write a lot of stuff in our head or thinking stuff so just driving could be a problem you just be like I don't miss my exit I don't miss the time I'm on a one way so just having those things when I got back man I got all that stuff I mean I got me a shell you know what I'm saying this is what I'm in you know what I mean because you got to put the right stuff in you put the right stuff to come at you you know what I'm saying I started just making things more convenient and I started being able to focus just on this and my whole life changed.

31:16At what age did music sort of, you start thinking, and I know it's one foot in, one foot out, but you were thinking music might be a way for me. That's a good question.

31:26Craig Robinson:Oh, another good question. That's a good question. Craig, he's racking up good questions. That's a good, the reason that's a good question is because most artists you see, they started very young and I had a childhood. I actually, like I had A. I had a childhood. A lot of rappers can't say they was on A. So I had a childhood. So, on one of these podcasts, I can't remember, they made me call like a teacher. Like I had to call a teacher on the spot, right? It was very informative. It was one of the most sweetest things that I ever heard about myself because she's never told me that her name is Miss Love.

32:00And when I got kicked out of school my 12th grade year for selling cannabis. So, six teachers wrote letters to get me back in school. I remember Miss Love's letter clear about not letting a child go to waste and how much I mean or whatever. So I called Miss Love and she remembered the letter and she remembered what the other teachers said at the time. And she said that I made her teach differently after I left. And she threw up a scenario that I don't even remember when they used to ask us what we want to be when we grow up. Yeah. Fireman, police, whatever. And she said that I said, I'm going to work for myself.

32:44And she said, I don't think, you know, I don't, I basically said entrepreneur, but I'm not even sure if I had this. The word. This word at the time. But I knew for a fact that the thing that I was hearing, and I didn't want to do that. So, you know, we would say basketball player just to get them off our tail. Like, yeah, basketball, you know what I mean? But deep down inside, I didn't feel like I was going to the NBA. Like you feel That's what I'm trying to tell you Like you know inside Like if you around here Like you up age And you lollygat Like I think I'm around Like you know inside So I'm not going to the NBA But I know I'm not going to like Be in traffic At 7 in the morning On the way to work With like a coffee thing I've never seen that I never I never saw that in my mind I'm not going to be like Running late Grabbing a briefcase Like being in traffic Or coming home Like I never With a coffee Yeah, you know.

33:38I never, I never, I just never saw that image. Yeah. Right. So, it's older, I'm hanging with older guys once again. They rap. I'm just around and interested. Like, this is so cool. Watching again. Yeah, watching again. They rapping. They rap. They taking photos. Mm-hmm. You know, I'm just selling stuff at this car wash, you know what I'm saying? But I'm watching these guys and they say, so then sometimes I would like play around like, kind of try to like freestyle. And they're like, man, you ought to come to the studio and, you know, lay some of that stuff down. I'm like, okay. So I'm learning again.

34:14I see how you do it. And like the second time I ever recorded, I got so much great feedback that I told myself, you might be able to do this for a living. So who gave you the feedback? It was just like, so we put a compilation that was called Play A Circle. We put a project out in a neighborhood. and then I also took it down to college. I went to school at Alabama State University. And this is CDs. CDs, this is not...

34:43Craig Robinson:Oh, yeah, we were just talking about CDs. Remember this, the young people? Yeah, CDs. You know, we would try to sell CDs out the trunk, $5 just try to make, you know what I mean? And I swear to you, people would say, you on here rapping? Man, I got this. I got... It was almost like, bro, I'm... They just like, I know I'm finna die laughing. Man, what? You on here? Boy, come on. Come on, boy, I can't wait. I ain't gonna lie. They start coming back. That was, I started being like, yeah. Here we go. You know, so I started hearing it. And so I got other friends that's been rapping before me. And then, you know, they would talk to me like, oh, man, what made you say this?

35:23What made you come that way? And I was just like, you really just kind of like, talk about your life, right? You know what I mean? And by this time, I've been through so much. I got a lot to say. I can do this. I can do this one now, you know. Had you ever kept a journal?

35:36Craig Robinson:Had you ever, did you, you know? I don't even write rhymes. Yeah, yeah. I work every night, so I don't, yeah, I write every night. I mean, I work every night, try to record every night. So I go on, I go through my whole day. This is how I'm thinking about, this is how I think my mind works. I go through all day and it just takes these little secret screenshots. And then I'll hear a beat and then it'll just make me say something about Michelle Obama for some reason. You know what I'm saying? Okay, put me in your next rap. Just remember the screenshot. It'll just be something. And so a lot of my creativity comes from just being literally outside my house, moving around, going places, going out, seeing stuff.

36:19And, but I saw something where somebody had a journal. And although my handwriting sucks, I was like, it would be cool to like. Just be able to jot it down. Jot stuff down. But right now, I use, okay, so we go to the gym. We work out on our muscles. We do this right here. What's a brain exercise besides like a crossword puzzle, right? So for me, my brain exercise or my brain push-up or pull-up is that I remember this stuff that I'm putting in my head. It's like I still try to remember, use my mind. Like, you know what I'm saying? And I talk about my brain a lot, like gigabytes and how I don't have as much room left.

37:04Craig Robinson:Yeah. So I don't remember things that don't mean a lot to me anymore. Like, if I'm out, I mean, hey, how you doing? I'm, um, whatever. Okay, I don't really need to remember this name. I don't have to, like, waste room in my mind to try to remember. You know what I mean? Like, hey, nice of you. But then it was like. That sounds like getting old. Nah, it's getting wise. That's it. It's getting wise. It is getting wise. You don't need to remember nothing that don't mean nothing to her. I'm like, hey, you, Craig, you remember, man. You're like, I'm going to remember that. I remember important stuff.

37:36If it's important, I know my daughter got a prom this weekend. And I need to make sure she got everything she needs. I don't need to remember.

37:44Craig Robinson:You left them with all the resources. Yeah, I left them with everything they needed. The car, the driver, everything. But I'm not wasting my storage on something that just don't mean nothing to me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so you rely on the storage in your head. Yeah, I try to work my, I try to use my brain. And do you still do stuff every night? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. I mean, I do stuff. It may come out, it may not. But I feel like creators, we're so delusional. We go to the, we go, we go to the studio, no, nothing. Just a speaker and an engine, you know, like news. and we go in there and we, we go in there and we tell ourselves we're going to make a song that's going to change our life, people's life and we go in there and we swing hard every night and sometimes it, sometimes it's a foul, sometimes it goes, sometimes, but we're, musicians, like myself, I don't, people don't write for me so I have to go in there and create, but like most people if they write for you just come in and I just say this over, but if you're in there doing your own work, you're one of the most delusional people on the face of this.

38:51earth. You just like, okay, buddy. You like, all right, press record. You know what I'm saying? And then you hope an hour or two from late, like, this guy might be okay. You know what I mean? So that's very delusional. That's a delusional job to have. Kids that keep wanting to be a rapper, think about that. Going to work every night, like, okay. We need one. All right.

39:15Craig Robinson:Well, you've done pretty good with your delusions. Yeah.

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43:24Craig Robinson:When, how did you meet Keisha? I met Keisha in college. She was standing up. Alabama? Alabama State. I was riding with my boy Twan. And she was sitting up there on the hill. Was she in school? She was in school. Little pretty little bow-legged thing, Miss Obama. I said, man. He told me, he said, man, her name is Keisha. She from Atlanta, too. I said, for real? And she just had this complexion, like, It looked like she would have on makeup, but she never wore makeup. And then we started dating, and then she would go to church. How'd you approach her? Like I'm him. Like, hey, you ready for this ride?

44:06I'm not sure what the words were, but I approached her. And she went, she bit. And, you know, at this time, I'm in school, I'm still, like, obviously, like, hustling. I'm in Alabama, but I'm, like, well-known in Atlanta, you know? And her mom at the time, you know, me and her mom are very cool and close now. But at the time, she like, I don't know if this is the guy for you, you know. So then I bought Keisha a car, you know, did something like that, a little get around, pay a little cell phone bill. So the mom like, I'm not going to pay your stuff. I'm like, cool, I got it. So I had my own place and she had her own.

44:45And then eventually it didn't make sense. I'm like, I could pay him two bills. So we moved in together against older people, shacking up and all of that. How old were you? We were in college. So while you were at school, you moved in together? We were in college. And then she would go to church. This would really seal the deal. She would go to church and take notes and then highlight the notes and then look at them later on like it was a class, like later on during the week. I have a spiritual background as well. So, you know, I very much believe in God, you know, and going to church all the time is something I don't normally do, and especially now I can't.

45:25Last time I went to church was Mother's Day maybe a year or two ago, and Lord, before the church was over, it was a photo line down. I'm like, and then I didn't even tell my mama. She just saw me in there and did that same look when we FaceTimed. Oh, my God! You know, I just snuck in there in the back. But with Keisha, we met then, you know, great friends. We laugh every day. People ask me to see, like, we laugh every single day. It's something that we're just going to laugh about every day. Became close. Built this union. Had this little family. They all look like us, so that's a good thing, you know?

46:00That's a good thing. And, man, you know, really ain't skipped a beat. I want to say that everything has been perfect, obviously, because nothing can be perfect, but I'll never leave.

46:12Craig Robinson:Like you did, right? Like you said, you pick a good partner. Yeah. And I say this all the time to young men, you know, it's like, don't pick easy. You know, pick somebody that's going to help you win, right? Because if you were picking your pickup basketball team, you would get somebody that could do everything. You're not going to pick somebody that just shoots and doesn't dribble. You know, everybody's got to be able to shoot, dribble, score, defend, right? and some, I think some men, you know, you cute. And it's like, well, you know what? Cute ain't gonna help you when you, you know, trying to raise good kids, you know?

46:54Craig Robinson:She gotta have sense, you know? She's gotta have her own hustle. She's gotta have her own confidence. That means she has a voice and it may not be easy. She might not just yes you to death, you know? So, you know, excellence is hard on both ends. and some guys want easy, and easy doesn't help sometimes, you know? And it sounds like Keisha is an all-around player. Let's note, and 2 Chainz, thank you very much. You got my sister to use a basketball analogy. It was really good. I mean, it just, she said, when you're picking a team, you want to win. It was really good. And if you watch this show, anytime I do that, It's like, why you always talking about that?

47:42Yeah, you done rubbed off. That was a good one. That was a really good analogy, too. Like, you got to pick the right team you want to win. And I wear on that, even from a family aspect. So now I'm going to be my sister. So talk about your fashion. Because, you know, I'm trying to... You know, tall, tall. You got to, you know, we already. That's already a W in the column. You tall. Yes. There you go. You know what I'm saying? You tall.

48:07Craig Robinson:You should be able to look good in everything. Yeah, so you tall. Now it's about finding out as we age and body does different little proportions and stuff. It's about you finding out what kind of lay on you the right way and make you feel comfortable. You know what I'm saying? And is it tight, baggy? Is it sweats? Is it t-shirt? Is it, you know, what it is. And for me, I'm tall, dark, handsome, smart, all those things. And I have just always been into fashion Ever since I was a kid I've just always been I've always cared Like a lot of people Like don't, you know Care what they But I've always just cared Today I went, you know A little green A little pop With that little brown too I mean that was a creative That's a creative To put that together right there Color choice right there I gave myself a high five I went in the mirror I was like this is good Because I know I was coming on your show So I didn't want to be I didn't want to be you know what I'm saying yeah I know I know but they sent something out to me I don't be wearing jewelry to make noise I said who's jewelry that is because my jewelry don't make noise that stuff come out the bubblegum machine if it's making our kind of noise my stuff don't I said they must be sending that to some other rapper I'm gonna separate myself early on my stuff don't make that kind of noise but you know it was just a day it's a beautiful day out here in sunny California so I did about 40 push ups this morning Henster So it's like We gonna let the We gonna let the guns out We gonna let the guns out It's light It's light I ain't going too much You can do this You can do this At the foot of your bed And And But I The voice It's crazy because I listen to the voice In my head When I'm putting clothes on I listen to it For everything It probably could be annoying To an average friend But I listen to it For everything Like man Listen I'm just It's telling me to do It's My I can see my closet in my head.

50:03I can, it go, it's just like, it's the wildest thing. So with this, I guess, circling back to the book, I use, or this voice is just a part of most decisions that I make. So the voice literally, literally told me to put this on today and I guess it worked out.

50:22Craig Robinson:Right again.

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56:11Well, I know you brought a song for us to listen to. But before we get to the song, we have a listener question. Okay. That we tend to...

56:21Craig Robinson:We try to offer some help. We try and give some advice, some help. Some opinions. That's the O in IMO. And this question's from Leo. I've been interviewing for jobs for the past few months and the last opportunity I got pretty far in the interview process before being told I didn't get the job. My self-confidence has definitely taken a hit and now I either overthink everything or avoid trying altogether because I don't want to fail again. I keep wondering if this says something about my abilities or if I'm just not cut out for what I'm aiming for. Even though I know logically that failure is a normal part of growth, I can't seem to shake the feeling that I've fallen behind or let myself down.

57:01How do you reframe failure in a way that actually helps you grow instead of letting it chip away at your confidence? And how can you get back to taking risks when failure starts to feel more discouraging than motivating? From Leo, who's in his 20s in Ohio. First of all, I would tell Leo that that is normal to feel, to have some type of feeling if you don't get something that you wanted. I can also tell Leo that he was qualified enough to be on their radar, but may not be what they needed at the time. I can also tell him that a company should not let him know what his value is that the company could that you know they didn't define his full potential they literally could have been looking for something else and also the confidence comes when you show up for yourself it's not about the wins you gotta like when you make these promises to yourself and you really follow up on your promises, I think that's how you build confidence.

58:20And yeah, you will qualify. So you got to, that's me by the silver lining. You got to take optimism even from the nose. So even with that, you were qualified. You were on the radar. So it's not a complete loss. It's a lesson. And it's something that's also, it's some experience that you can take with you. It's something that you can look back on and say, you know, I don't know if it's like how you came to the, were you on time? Were you, the small things. I think you start looking at the smaller things when you don't get something that you want. Like, you know what I'm saying? And you take that and you just add to it.

59:01Like, really, the failure part is something that just don't be on resumes. Like, everybody that you see up here has failed before. Everybody that you look up to has failed before. We just don't like. life is about highlights that's how social media has so you're looking at even the people that you look up to fail more than you me I fail more than I can even count and so you know that the people that you look up to fail too but they didn't let that you know be permanent and they didn't let that define them at that moment at 20 something years old are you serious you know how much stuff and how much growth and how much opportunity and the way you don't get the opportunity is by being down on yourself feeling sorry for yourself and just staying in the house.

59:45As long as you get out, as long as you mingle, meet and greet, man, God just may have something else that's better for you. But you can't quit and give up right now. Like, this is a part of life. It has to have these little moments that discourage you. It's called life. I know people don't get it, but that's a legit part of life. This little discouraging part, the let me down feeling, that's so much part of life. But you come out of this way stronger than you come in. and you learn, and you don't, the fact that you were considered lets you know that you have a place in trying to do whatever you're trying to do.

1:00:25Well said. Yeah. That's my opinion, y 'all.

1:00:28Craig Robinson:That is a beautiful opinion. That's my opinion, y 'all. It is. It's good when it was... Leo, you 20-something years old. I'm about to quit. Don't do that. Boy, for real, what? Don't. Don't do it. No, man. You know, and you be excited. it. I read your book, man. I pray it didn't work. Don't do that. It's something in there. Even the whole experience of going through that. You got to take that and add it to everything moving forward. The whole experience, the whole process. Honestly, it's character building. That's what it is. The failure is good for character building. That's how I got here, I think.

1:01:08Yep. Losses. Losses helps build character. Yep. It sure does.

1:01:12Craig Robinson:And you, you know, life is, life is like a big muscle and, you know, you, you got to build it up and every failure is like a pushup. Okay. You know, it's a rep. It's a rep. You know, and the more reps you get, the stronger you get at life. And you don't get the strength without the reps. You don't, I'll use another basketball analogy, you got to practice your shot. And for every shot you take, you're going to miss something. If you consider that a fail, then you stop practicing. So a lot of us get through because we build up the muscle for life. And then we have a muscle for failure too. Because you got to learn what's your process for getting through failure.

1:02:01Craig Robinson:We all figure it out the older we get, you know, and some of it is, is like you said, is disappointment. It is. You know, okay. That's the first step in your process is to be disappointment. That's normal. Maybe to play in quitting. You know, maybe you tell yourself that because you're mad. That's normal. All that's completely normal. You know, it's like, that's, that's good. And that's part of your process, but you can't stay in that phase. You better be moving on to the, okay, now let me get myself together. I pouted for a day, you know, and I was ridiculous and thinking that it was just me.

1:02:37Craig Robinson:You did that. You know, what was you? Now you move into what's your plan. You know, now start thinking about what you're going to do. You know, first of all, I got to start thinking a different way. I got to turn that around. So I think we at this table, we've just been old enough. We failed enough that we know that it's going to take a second, but we will come out of it. And then now you know how to do it. You know how to fail. You've done it. And everybody's got to get good at it. And the more you do it, the better you get at it. And then the fear goes away, You know, because it's the fear that keeps you from the opportunity.

1:03:21Craig Robinson:The fear and doubt. You know? Then when that gets involved, it's hard to shake that. Yeah. Because we can't hear that either. Only you can hear that. Yeah. And Leo's so young, I'll say one thing. And this is for the parents out there. Don't protect your kids from having failures all the way up until they're 20 so that their first failure feels like a catastrophe. That's better than me and her. That's it. We protect them from that. Oh, my God. Man, when they get it, it's just such a traumatic experience. They told me no. Yes. Yeah. Never heard that before. Tell them no, you hear that, Keisha? That's why they don't ask me now.

1:03:59I'm going to make sure they know what no feels like. You know what I'm saying? I'm struck a nerve. This is what no feels like. Ask your daddy. Nope. You know what I'm saying?

1:04:07Craig Robinson:I used to say that the girls tell me that, you know, Mom, you used to tell us no. I would be like, why? Because you need to know what no feels like. Yeah, you need to feel that. Especially for kids like ours who, you know, there's no natural no. Nepo babies, man. We grew up with a lot of no's. It was just no, we can't afford it. No, you can't have that. That was the true answer, no. It was the craziest thing. I have an aunt. I have an aunt, and she used to say, y 'all can't go outside, it's too hot out there. Y 'all can't go outside, it's too cold. I used to be like, yo, when is a good time to go outside over here?

1:04:40because, you know, if it's weather, period, I can't go out in the rain. I can't go out if it's too hot. I can't go out if it's too cold. But it's like, man, they just had to tell us, no, hey, man, well, you can't go out there too hot. Preparing you for life. These kids run up and down the street. Yeah, preparing you. So, yeah, it's the little things. It's the little things. But you brought us a treat. You're going to make me cry. Nah, so this next song, I wrote this next song for my dad. So this song that I'm going to play for y 'all, I'm going to play a piece of this song for y 'all. It's the hardest and easiest song that I've ever recorded in my whole entire life.

1:05:19In my whole entire life. It was the hardest and the easiest. It's a song, it's called Pops. It has the Luther Vandross, Dance With My Father sample. and I talk about you know what I didn't really get to finish telling him before my father passed in front of me in 2012 in the hospital and I put the song out because after opening up this portal and doing this book I realized even in his absence how much he meant to me and you know and how much She's still a part of everyday activities and my way of thinking. And so I put this song out. It's been out maybe a week and I've been getting some very long text messages from men.

1:06:13I didn't know men very, very long, but I've read them. And it's been some good feedback. And it's just like a song for the fathers. I know we have so many songs about our mothers because that's just like black boy joy at its peak. But like I had to do something for my father Like I just had to You know Alright well let's listen to it To dance with my father Again I know a lot of men out there Don't express themselves I miss my pops Cause to me he was a hell of a man He taught me how to box Cook and shoot at a can Don't know if I can drive To Little Grange Again I went to my father Father house popped up I asked my granddad where my dad locked up.

1:06:59He say he went to court, they kept him, wouldn't let him go home. Now I'm out here all alone. It wasn't the first time, ain't crying over spilled milk. Holler at me when you settle, what you need, pimp? I'm getting older now, I'm just trying to build with you. I can't wait till I can chill with you. You gave me your release date, I'm coming to get you. Like Expedition Mead, my mama and Keisha. Told pop she stand with me and he thought about it. Got him a suit, cell phone, and got him a whip. That's when I was a child. So from this point on. Oh, I'm ready for the whole thing. Yeah, man. Yeah, so my dad, he's been going to prison.

1:07:44It really sucks. So I'm going to tell you these two little instances, and I'm just telling you, it just makes me feel a certain way. So my dad, the last time he went to prison, and he was like in his 60s, legit. So I just popped up on my granddad. They were like, your dad went to court and they kept him like, really? I'm like, this man's too old to keep getting in there. Trouble, you know what I'm saying? So my dad go to prayers for like, I don't know, maybe two or three years. So I'm like, by this time, I got a house. I got my own house. And I'm doing a rap. And I've been writing him telling him I'm doing this rap thing, but he's not really getting it.

1:08:19And I'm really not probably explaining it well because I'm not a superstar. But you know what I'm saying? but I'm still hustling too a little bit and I'm doing my rap thing. So when he get out, me and Keisha, my mom, we go pick him up in prison. And he got like stuff he want to do as soon as he get out. He need a cell phone. He need a suit. He just need, you know, he need a bank account because he got some money put, all this stuff. So he gets out. You know, I move him in with me. Like, so the first seven years, we stayed together. And like the last seven years of his life, we stayed together.

1:08:52So he's staying at the house. And my pop started hanging with my friends. At the studio I'm telling you about, when we hustling and all this, I would literally get there and my pop car would already be there. One of my friends coming to the side, you know, your daddy, he back hustling again. I'm like, this is just crazy to me. You know what I'm saying? Like, he taking it, getting his little package, driving out of town with it. And so when my daddy got out, I bought him like this. it was like$3 ,500. It was like a Ford Taurus, like a whatever. I go on the road and I come back and it's this Cadillac in my driveway with a red boat.

1:09:31I'm so naive. I don't know who car this is. It can't be. So I walk into the house, Keisha, who car that is? She said, I still don't get it. Of course, she mad because Pop ain't paying no bills and he in here coming back with new Cadillac, CTSs. I come up and I'm like, man, who car this is? Like, it's mine. I said, man, What a car I bought you. He snaps on him. Boy, I don't send this on me. I ain't been riding around on 4th, 3rd, boy. Who do you think this is? Boy, I've been in jail. I'm trying, you know, he gets on me like, I'm trying to live. I ain't going to be living too much longer. I was like, hey, brother, congratulations on your car.

1:10:07You know what I'm saying? He gets his car. He's doing his hustling. You know, he gets a black one. He trades that and get a white one. Pop doing good. Got his own. He's doing very, very good. And then he go through, I don't know what. He went to like Alabama for like two weeks. did not tell me why. Just said, I'm straight. Don't come looking for me. When he gets back, my dad always kept his shirt off. So he has this long heart on this side. He has this long incision from like on his chest. He laying down. So I'm looking. I'm like, where you get that from? He had a little procedure done. Oh my goodness.

1:10:43I'm like, it was weird. But so he had this red pillow, heart pillow that had signatures on it. I'm looking at the pillow. They're like, you better not come reading. It has nurses saying all this little stuff about him on this pillow. So fast forward that, I have a friend that's a doctor. And for some reason, this little red pillow came up. And she says, basically, that's not a good sign. In order to get that pillow, you have to go through a real procedure. Like, this is like, you don't just get this from going in. and usually people who get that don't live that much longer. I lose this friend.

1:11:24Not friends with him. I don't think we talk. I'm like, what are you talking about? You know, get mad. Get back. Pop started going through whatever he's going through. He ended up being in the hospital. So I talked to him. I say, I'm in there with him for like, I don't know, a week or two. And maybe a week. It was a week. And I had a show in Savannah, Georgia, which is a couple of hours from Atlanta, Georgia. I sent my whole team, and I said, I had been living, staying in the hospital with my dad. I said, if he says, cool, I'll be down there later. I'm in the hospital with him. I say, hey, pops, I got a showdown in Savannah.

1:12:01He said, oh, man, you know. He says, I ain't about to die no time soon. This is what it came out of his mouth. He says to me, man, I ain't about to die no time soon. So I said, oh, okay. And then the next thing he says is, because he's sarcastic, he says the dope man is my role model because I had a song that said the dope man was my role so when he say that I'm like aw man I give him a fist pound when I give him the fist pound he says do it big Epps that's our last name I never I can see the fist in my head I remember fisting him down he said do it big Epps I go do the show in Savannah when I come back the man on a a breathe I never talked to him again he breathed on some so I come in I was having this.

1:12:45Around 2 o 'clock, he started losing oxygen. It was just weird as hell because he just told me at 10, 11, right? I come back. And so this way, it got really hard for me. He's trying to take the tubes out of his mouth. And if you take, the nurse is saying, if you take them out, you could die this way. So they want to do what? Handcuff them to the bed. I know this man don't want to be handcuffed because I just know he don't, right? to this day and I can't really even put myself there I can see him looking at me saying

1:13:20Craig Robinson:don't do that if you don't have him take the he can't say he just but I see him looking at me I'm reading his so I say take him off man take it off and they say take them handcuffs you know literally real I've never seen it for real handcuffs like he doesn't you know take him off and it's a natural reaction I guess because something in his throat to go back and try to get man Miss Obama I do this like four or five times. Put the handcuffs back on. Take the handcuffs off. Just don't even know what to do. I'm like, you know, I tell y 'all, listen to the boss of my head. At this time, I don't have no, I'm looking, I'm trying, I'm looking, he, I'm like, I don't know what to do.

1:13:58And it was just that emotion. Yeah, yeah. I never just want to recreate, but that emotion. And eventually, you know, he started losing oxygen. The nurse came in and did everything they did. And, you know, she comes out and she says, you know, if we keep doing that, he's not going to be with a vegetable. He won't be able to cognitive this. And we already broke a couple of his ribs. I don't care. And she come out the next time, she said, listen, I lost my father too. I don't want to hear it. You know, I knew where she was going. And it's just me. I don't have my mom. So I'm mad at my mom. like why you ain't come up here Keisha is sleek and I had to just like deal with that whole thing alone just a hymn going from yeah

1:14:49Craig Robinson:making that call instead of going from zero to 60 he's like breaking going from 60 down to zero you know what I'm saying just being a part of that and so that's why I felt like it was appropriate to align that song with this book because I I use a lot of his lessons and some experiences that we shared together in there and so I mean I come up with this idea I'm like man I really like that Luther song and it makes it feels like you know, me and my dad never danced together or anything like that, but we smoked together. We hung out together. We laughed together. And so I did that song and my mom was like, my mom, what you trying to do?

1:15:25You know, that was my husband. Now you trying to make me cry over here and stuff like that. So it's been like, you know, a little joke in the house. And then I played it for my kids. Having met my dad, the other two kids did not meet my dad. So like my 10-year-old son was like, oh man, that's the whole story right there. You know what I mean? So it's just something that I feel like, I feel like it'll do well because it's relatable, but I didn't necessarily do the song for it to be a club banger or nothing like that. Yeah, that wasn't.

1:15:55Craig Robinson:This is your fourth therapy. Yeah, it was. I mean, it just flowed. It just flows straight through. The second verse, it flows the same way. It just flows straight through. And, yeah, so this song is, you know, I would say considered mine. Well, it's another thing that, you know, it's like even normalizing how you found out about your, I mean, that's a crazy way to find out that your father was dying, you know. Yeah. That he never, ever fully told you that he was having heart failure. I never told him, I just, yeah. And so you didn't have time to process, you know. So of course you're going to be like, he was just alive.

1:16:38Yeah, he just told me. He was just fine.

1:16:41Craig Robinson:It's like, how could this happen? What y 'all, you know how it is. Y 'all killed. You know how black folks, I'm going to sue this off. Y 'all, they say this hospital ain't, I knew I shouldn't, just everything, man, when it really just be their time going in. Like a lot of times, like I've lost. So it's, you lose, I've lost people. with that situation. My dad was like the boys don't cry type of dude. Yeah. You know, what you crying, just holding back tears just about to pass out holding back tears around him. And then just like when that happened, man, it just was everything that was back. I need a windshield wipe.

1:17:20I needed, I literally could not see. I just, I remember sitting in the car just being like, because he's really like my best friend. I would ask my dad questions that I wouldn't, I asked him something because I know wouldn't judge me that I wouldn't even like say to a friend of mine you know what I'm saying so anyway that's been missing that happened and I buried well he got cremated but we had his funeral on July 4th 2012 so it's been a long time

1:17:44Craig Robinson:July 4th is my oldest daughter's birthday really I was in I was in some church just booing away I don't even remember half of it they say people would and this is the thing I learned this man dead they talking about yeah man he played football he played football what he did you know you just be hearing and stuff coming in and I'm hearing them people talking. I heard, because he never, he was one of them people that, you know how the daddies was so hard back then. They couldn't really say, they couldn't tell you they was proud. He just bragging to all these other folks. Yeah. I'm like, this man ain't never told me this stuff.

1:18:15Like, boy, your daddy used to come to the house. And boy, and I'm just sitting there just like, so that was like, it was an experience that I never, I wouldn't wish that on nobody, but it's inevitable. You know what I'm saying? It was inevitable. It had to happen. And it definitely made me a strong heart. We appreciate you sharing it, man.

1:18:33Craig Robinson:Man, you are... I think I got something for y 'all, though, because it's a thing. I got this book that deals with art, and I got the song that I just played. And where is... Is Ernest around? I might have something for y 'all. Because I wanted to leave y 'all with something like this before I go. Oh, my God. Yeah, so this is art, too. And I think I want to to share this with you guys. Because Father Day is a piss - Oh, dude. Yeah. Oh, man. Yeah, man. You trying to make me cry. Hey, bro. They say it's therapeutic to get one out here and there. So I think this is dope. How'd you get that? She's from L.A.

1:19:20too. That is one of our favorite. Ubami. She's from L.A. That's one of our favorite, favorite photographs. He looks like the guy that did Sinners a little bit with his mustache, Brian Coogler. That's what he wanted. He kind of looks, but at the end of the day, I wanted to give you guys something because honestly, I never thought I would be on a platform like this for my book. I never, it never crossed my mind. that's, you're too kind. Too kind.

1:19:47Craig Robinson:You are, you are one of one. Thank you. You really are. I mean, this is one of our favorite pictures with some. This is one of our favorite pictures. You can see why I go. We got everything in it. That everything in it. Oh, my gosh. Wow. I'm going to be teared up. Thank you for that. Thank you for that. You're welcome. Man, it's been a gift to spend this time with you. Thank you. You know, this was a gift. This was a gift to us. It's going to be a gift to everybody who's going to see this. You are a special man. Congratulations on everything, you know, and just keep being you. you know keep sharing your wisdom you're going to help a lot of people you know in another format you already do that through your music and it's just been a real pleasure thank you

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