A Rough Weekend for Indie Film: Spirit Awards, Berlin Controversy, and Big Questions

0:00Ryan Lattanzio:Let's be real. Whether you're filming for TikTok, YouTube, or that one client who thinks viral means vertical, you don't have time to dig for decent stock. Storyblocks gives you unlimited royalty-free video, audio, and templates that actually look good. Just drag, drop, done. Go to storyblocks.com slash explore, search the library, and see what you've been missing.

0:30Anne Thompson:Welcome to Screen Talk, IndieWire's weekly podcast, bringing you up to speed on the latest goings-on in Hollywood. I'm Anne Thompson in Los Angeles, where it has stopped raining, thank God.

0:43Ryan Lattanzio:I feel so sorry for you, Anne, that you're enduring rain after everything that we have gone through here in New York the past few months. I'm Ryan LaTonzio. This week on Screen Talk, we're going to look at the underwhelming Indie Spirit Awards, which happened last weekend. What went wrong there? and do they have any impact on the Oscars, which are still weeks away on March 15th, thanks to the Olympics? I guess 2027 gets us back to February somewhat, to I think February 28th. So there's that to look forward to. We're also going to check in on some news out of Berlin, including the political debates that were set off by jury president Wim Wenders and some worthy titles I've been able to catch remotely.

1:23Anne Thompson:This week, we will revisit my Santa Barbara panel with six Oscar-nominated screenwriters, including Guillermo del Toro and Jafar Panahi. And we will assess the acquisition of Sundance favorite, Josephine.

1:36Ryan Lattanzio:And Wicker.

1:37Anne Thompson:And that's right. That's right. Mostly, the spirits were dispiriting. The Hollywood Palladium did not measure up to the Santa Monica Oceanside tent. The Olympics are at fault there, too. They've taken over the beach. They're not going to be back at the tent until 29, if anyone cares. I don't even know.

1:58Ryan Lattanzio:I don't know that anyone does.

1:59Anne Thompson:There's going to be an independent film universe left in 2029. Most of us tried to ignore the host, ex-SNL vet Ego Wodum, whose jokes fell flat. And the writing for the show was really awful. I mean, woeful. Horrible. Unprofessional even. I mean, it was just bad. I looked out with a cool neon table with Surratt director Oliver Lash and the secret agents Wagner Mora and Clever Mendoza Filho, who won Best International Feature. This gives the movie some extra momentum going into Oscar voting, but its main competition, Sentimental Value, is not nominated. So, Ryan, what was your reaction to the spirits watching at home?

2:41Ryan Lattanzio:So I was covering the show from the YouTube stream, and I don't have a sense of what the change in venue impacted, but I didn't think that was the issue here. It really felt like a travesty in terms of the writing and the MC perspective, even as some of the winners were definitely deserved. though at this point how many more awards does adolescence have to sweep it's becoming soul draining it even swept the film independent spirit awards and then there's sag coming up we'll we'll do it again but those people weren't even there for the most part right well that's

3:13Anne Thompson:coming up this coming weekend so uh they had they had one they had they had erin doherty on hand basically that that was that was about it i mean what what else do the winners have to really say

3:25Ryan Lattanzio:at this point from that show. Anyway, I digress. Ego Wodim, who was a standout on, you know, SNL is usually terribly unfunny these days, but she was very good for seven years before she left the show in 2025. But she was left totally marooned by all these jokes that she had to do about her dating and her sex life. And then you had comedian Robbie Hoffman seemingly stepping in as another host who then couldn't pronounce anybody's names properly. It seemed like nobody really got a script before that day or even was that script even written before the day? I don't know. And lastly, I am notoriously not easily offended, but there was a joke that really bothered me, which was when Kaya Gerber, not that impressed by her these days, and Heat Rivalry star Francois Arnault teamed up to present best documentary series.

4:16Ryan Lattanzio:And there was some stupid joke about tops and bottoms. And I'm just really tired of the show being used as this entry point to trivialize and laugh at gay sex.

4:26Anne Thompson:Yeah.

4:27Ryan Lattanzio:And Arnaud didn't even react to or play off the joke, which I kind of appreciated. The whole the whole weekend was a bit sad, as we're going to talk about with some of these acquisitions. Or it's at least some kind of cornerstone where the spirit of words, they don't have to define what indie film is anymore. But there's certainly a destination. uh i will say watching the show there were only about 6 000 people at its peak that were actually

4:51Anne Thompson:streaming it's really sad well that tells you that tells you something that's probably about the number of people who vote for the awards you know now i had a number of friends of mine who were watching and who got in touch with me all of them you know what is this you know they were all really quite horrified um they were actually watching it yeah yeah no the thing that i the thing that worries me, just being there and there's this whole sort of hanging out and networking with the independent film community, which I've always looked forward to and loved. And it's like seeing my buds. It's like seeing my friends.

5:27Anne Thompson:It didn't feel like they were all there. It didn't feel like there was a real presence in the room, except for the various people who were nominated. So I just don't know. Also, Ryan, frankly, even though it's good to promote movies that nobody has heard of to a certain extent, it's really not conducive to a television show. There were so few movies that they haven't heard of. So when you look at the winners, the Oscar contenders usually win. So that happened here. Rose Byrne for lead performance. So she's beating all the men, too. So it didn't even give Joel Edgerton a chance to win something here.

6:12Anne Thompson:She beat him because she was nominated for an Oscar. And then Train Dreams, which is also Oscar nominated, won for Best Feature, Director, Clint Bentley, and Cinematography for Adolfo Veloso. And it was a good day for the Brazilians. They were very happy. There is some overlap between the Indie Spirits voters and the Academy, but this does not mean these films will wind up going for the win, except perhaps for Best Documentary winner, The Perfect Neighbor, which I think will repeat. And then, you know, the BAFTAs are next weekend, and we'll see what's up. You know, that will have another round of impact on what's going on.

6:54Anne Thompson:And some of the Guild Awards are happening, right? So we've already had the DGA, but as you said, SAG. And the other one is PGA. PGA is on the 28th and SAG is on March 1st. Those two will tell us a lot about what's really going on.

7:11Ryan Lattanzio:Yeah, the big wins for Train Dreams at the Spirits, they're not going to repeat, obviously, at the Oscars. But Netflix will enjoy some lovely craft wins for another movie.

7:20Anne Thompson:Frankenstein? Yeah. Yes, they will. Yes, they will. So Ryan, explain what happened in Berlin. So vendors ignites this, you know, shitstorm of protest.

7:34Ryan Lattanzio:Yeah, so I'm not there, obviously, on the ground this year. What I will say actually is I've seen like nine to ten competition films and they've been pretty good. Last year was my first year going and it was pretty underwhelming in terms of the selection. So at least this is now Tricia Tuttle's second year. That aspect has improved. But again, all of the attention is not on the movies. It's now on who at the festival, whether a juror or a filmmaker or talent, what their political stance is, what the festival's political stance is. You know, a couple of years ago, Berlin was really in hot water for bungling its response just a few months after the October 7th attacks and its February 24th edition.

8:12Ryan Lattanzio:And we're kind of seeing a repeat of this now where the festival is being accused of either taking an apolitical stance or one of solidarity, where they are speaking out about other genocides and conflicts globally, but they're not talking about Palestine and Gaza. So Trisha Tuttle set out this letter under the guise of a defense of free speech after Vim Vendors at the jury press conference basically said that it's not filmmakers and jurors jobs to get involved in politics and they should stay out of them, which I think is a crazy thing to say. I mean, all films are political. And to disabuse anyone of that means that you're not really using your critical thinking skills.

8:52Anne Thompson:Well, movies themselves are political. And if you're on a press conference day is, you know, you're going to get asked questions. It's very important to have the freedom to respond appropriately. Right, Ryan?

9:06Ryan Lattanzio:Yeah. There's a German press corps member named Tilo Young, who I actually hadn't heard of until this year's Festival, who has been asking various people on the panel from Ethan Hawke to Neil Patrick Harris, where they stand in terms of political issues. And I do understand what Ethan Hawke said, which was basically, you shouldn't be looking at a bunch of jet lagged drunk actors who are here to talk about their movie for political counsel. But I also kind of feel like, haven't these people all been at a festival press conference before? These questions happen all the time, and you need to be prepared for them.

9:42Ryan Lattanzio:There is one that Neil Patrick Harris, bad gay, I got to say, blew off by basically saying he prefers stories that are apolitical.

9:50Anne Thompson:Well, so what happened with this open letter condemning the Berlin Allies stance? This just happened, I think, yesterday, right?

10:00Ryan Lattanzio:It did. Yeah. There's a letter signed by a bunch of celebrities, Mike Lee, Tilda Swinton, Javier Bardem above them. On top of that, Couther Benhania, she was supposed to receive an award at an event that was attended by hillary clinton and kevin spacey this is the director of the voice of hinders yeah yeah and and she disavowed this award and basically this letter is saying that um what what berlin is doing here is um showing a lack of solidarity by you know couching this letter that trisha tuttle sent out in terms of well you know film all filmmakers are political in their own way and they shouldn't have to answer to these questions.

10:41Ryan Lattanzio:But I got to say, I just think it's ill advised that people would not be prepared for them.

10:47Anne Thompson:So what movies did you think were good? The one I responded to just reading your review actually was Rose. Is that the name of the film? Yeah. The one with Sandra Huller impersonating a man. I really want to see this.

11:02Ryan Lattanzio:Yeah. I think you will love this movie, Anne. And look, in a perfect world, I think a plum distributor would pick this movie up and put it into award season.

11:09Anne Thompson:Is it an Oscar performance?

11:12Ryan Lattanzio:Absolutely. And basically in this movie, she is a soldier who has coming out of the last gasp of the 30 years war. And she's in a rural area in Germany, but she has long disguised herself as a man to move more comfortably in the world. And she ends up at this farm she gets a wife uh it's funny she uh has multiple um strap-ons that she uses uh when that is called for uh and that becomes a whole plot point in itself but basically she becomes like a joan of arc character that ends up being persecuted by this village it's demanding for proof of who she is and what her gender is once it starts to come into question and it's it's shot in black and white it's only 90 minutes so it is just it is chiseled and edited to within an inch of its life.

12:01Ryan Lattanzio:And it is written and directed by Marcus Schleinzer, who was a casting director for Michael Hanukkah, who you probably remember this movie from 2011 called Michael, that he that was his debut feature about a pedophile that kept a boy locked in his basement. I might have missed

12:17Anne Thompson:that one, Ryan.

12:18Ryan Lattanzio:Yeah, I like that one a lot. But of course, no surprise there. But this is a more, you know, it's on its surface, it seems like it's sort of a chilly art house exercise, but it actually is a very devastating movie. And whatever country, whether it's Germany or Austria, Schleinzer is an Austrian filmmaker. I'd have to look at what the production companies were. I think that someone could end up submitting this movie. I could see it being a New York film festival, you know what I mean? Like some of those fall fests. It sounds like it. It sounds like it.

12:45Anne Thompson:So Amy Adams got creamed for her new movie, At the Sea, and I'm worried. She's one of our great actresses. I really, I'm a big fan of hers. I think she can do anything. But she didn't do well in Dear Evan Hansen or Night Bitch, certainly. Not her fault. And I loved her in the TV series Sharp Objects and Vice and Arrival. She can do anything. Did you see this one? I didn't see this one.

13:12Ryan Lattanzio:They didn't show it here. Maybe they're trying to keep a tight lid on it. I don't know. But this is Cornell Mondrusco, who did Pieces of a Woman. And she's playing a dancer who's come out of rehab and is trying to— She's on the redemption tour, basically. And her husband is Murphy. Sorry, Murray Bartlett is her husband. Yeah, this got really bad reviews. And it's unfortunate. She has really been on a bad run. I mean, she got nominated. She got nominated for Hillbilly Elegy, right? That terrible Ron Howard movie.

13:45Anne Thompson:No, I think Glenn Close. You're right.

13:47Ryan Lattanzio:You're right. But then Night Bitch didn't really happen.

13:50Anne Thompson:But Amy Adams was very good in Hillbilly Elegy. So that was not, you know, the movie got excoriated for all the obvious reasons. But she, she, I think the actors came out clean.