47: The power of PR: Controlling your brand reputation and the steps to handling a media crisis | Sarah Woodhouse

0:00Welcome to All About Business with me, James Reed, the podcast that covers everything about business, management and leadership.

0:16How can businesses build lasting trust in a world of shifting media patterns and instant scrutiny? What role does strategic communication play in shaping reputation, especially during moments of growth or crisis? Joining me today on All About Business is Sarah Woodhouse, co-owner and director at Ambitious, a communications agency supporting high-growth businesses across sectors like finance, healthcare, and technology. With over 25 years of experience in public relations, Sarah shares practical lessons on how to communicate with purpose, prepare for the unexpected and tailor your message to connect with the audiences that matter most.

0:57Well, today on All About Business, I'm really delighted to welcome Sarah Woodhouse, who is the co-owner and director of a strategic communications agency called Ambitious. And Sarah's come from Bristol today to talk to me, which I'm very grateful to her for. And she's been involved with this agency for, well, since 2012, and has worked also prior to that in communications in Hong Kong. So you've got 25 years of communications experience, I believe, Sarah. So I'd like to begin by just saying thank you for coming and asking you, what is Ambitious? What do you do? What do I do? That's a really good question.

1:38So Ambitious is a strategic communications agency. We lean very much into sort of public relations and content and social media. And our objective is around helping companies achieve their goals, whatever they might be. So clients come to us because they want to repair a reputation, build a reputation, create perception change, or support their sort of sales and marketing process. So there's masses in there, Sarah, I want to sort of delve into further. But let's start with those words, strategic communications. What makes some communications more strategic than others, I suppose? And what's the difference between communications and marketing?

2:16Okay, great. That's a really great question. So if we talk about, I guess, marketing first, marketing is normally what you do to reach your end consumer. So it will be about how you support the sort of sales process, how you reach that consumer to elicit an action, which is normally a sale. But certainly when it comes to communications and public relations, that's a much broader job to be done. So public relations is often involving different audiences. So you embark on communications because you want to reach a regulator, a policymaker, an investor, an employee, a potential employee, lots of different audiences around your business.

2:59And today, you know, trust is so important. And in order to sort of do business, you need to make sure that all those audiences are taken care of and that you are communicating with all of them. So what you're saying, I think, listening to you, is that it goes well beyond your customers or potential customers here. There are all sorts of other stakeholders or people who could have an influence on your future success. That's absolutely right. I mean, it definitely involves customers as well. And you can have PR and communications campaigns that just focus on your customer. But often PR is used to help reach those audiences, to help build relationships with lots of different stakeholders that are involved in a company's success.

3:37So I remember being told years ago, you know, PR is good because if you can get in the paper through PR, you don't have to pay for an ad. It sounds like it's moved on a bit, but that's still the essence of it, is it? Yeah, it's definitely in the toolbox. You've got so many more channels now, though. That's right. So we live in a world where we're bombarded by different channels vying for our attention. And so public relations has definitely moved beyond just about being about securing media coverage. Securing media coverage is definitely still very much important part of the toolbox of what PR people have up their sleeve, but it's also about that multi-channel world we live in.

4:16So it may be about building a presence on YouTube, having influence on TikTok, creating a really big following on LinkedIn. It could be about then the networks that you work through, the partnerships that you build. It's much more around looking at the whole ecosystem and the different touch points that your business can come across and then how you build your influence in those. So for a lot of entrepreneurs starting out building a business, they're not going to have a big budget necessarily. They've got to think about how to build a brand, how to get awareness up and maybe do some communications.

4:52Where would you suggest someone in that situation might start? I'd start small. I wouldn't try to tackle everything at once. I would really think about where your core audience is and what you're trying to achieve. So if you're a startup and your, you know, biggest objective is around securing investment, you know, think about the channels that are going to reach those investors to start with. So that might naturally lead you somewhere like LinkedIn and about building your following on LinkedIn, looking at what you're, you know, communicating what you're doing, how it differs from your competitors, how it's going to change the world and focus on that channel.

5:28But actually, if your objective is around securing, I guess, permission to do something. So if you're in financial services, you may need to reach a regulator or you may need to covet opinion at a sort of policy level with government, then, you know, you find ways to get into those circles. So don't try to do everything. Don't try to communicate with everyone. Really pick on those channels that are going to move your business forward. And then you can always layer on and build in other communication plans as you go. So really prioritise. But you can do that with quite a modest budget then. Yeah, absolutely.

6:02And I guess it's also about the team and the size of team that you've got. So when you first start out, you may have no one in a communications or marketing role. It might be you as a sole founder, or it might be you and a few, I guess, bright sparks that you've employed to help you along the way. So you need to pick something and then put all your attention your focus on that rather than trying to build following or build influence across all channels to start with you can always come back to that later and you can always pick that up as your priorities change which they do as you build a business i was thinking when you were saying that how are you going to go on linkedin and get someone to invest in your business and then i suddenly realized i actually did invest in someone's business because of linkedin and this chap he emailed or messaged me on linkedin made some comment about a post i'd made and my red socks or something.

6:50And he made me laugh. And he said, you might be interested in an idea and it worked in a related sector. And we did invest in his business and it did really well. And so, you know, that does work. But what I was thinking when you were saying that is you need to be proactive as well. He came out towards us and said, you know, this might be of interest to you as well as just posting stuff. Yeah, absolutely. So when we talk about strategic communications and you asked what makes communications strategic, it is about being intentional with what you're doing and how you're building your communications on say LinkedIn as a platform.

7:25So it's not just about posting what you think about in that given moment. It's about laying down a plan, thinking about your audience and all the aspects that they may be interested in. So for instance, if you were a founder going into a building, a new category, you may want to look at you know why you're doing that what that's all about how it's going to grow the trends that are coming out and not trying to get all of that into one post you know really thinking about what you post over time but then also how you engage with your community how you build your following how you ask people within your network to connect you to others how you look at groups that sit with on linkedin and your influence within those and really look at it in the round and invest time in that.

8:11So that is an investment in time and effort. As you say, you have to be intentional. What are the sort of biggest reputation mistakes that you see entrepreneurs making early on? What sort of warnings would you share with us? I think when you're an entrepreneur and you're scaling a business, things can happen quite quickly, can't they? Often you're putting in a lot of effort and it's going slow for a while. Then all of a sudden momentum kicks in and sales pick up and you're in a different stratosphere. But often then the size of the team around you doesn't keep track with that progress. And so whereas you may have had, say, one person looking after everything to do with sort of marketing, communication, suddenly you need a diverse range of skill sets.

8:54But where you've got lots of investment priorities to make in a new business, perhaps you haven't kept track of what you need in that team and you're not putting the right resource in place so as businesses scale you know making sure that you are keeping track of the budget you're spending on marketing to reflect where you are now as opposed to where you were is really important because you've got to just keep investing in order to see that return on investment imagine why you might be encouraging people like me to keep investing which is fair enough but i'm thinking about the mistakes i mean i suppose not investing is one mistake you're saying but there are others surely that I mean it feels like there are lots of bear traps out there yeah in the world of communications to me things that can go wrong I just wanted you to maybe surface one or two for us to think about be aware of no absolutely so I guess a lot of founders have their own personal brands and part of the joy I guess when you're building a business is being able to share your own personal stories being able to use your own personal brand as a real leverage to building your business.

9:59But as you scale and as you draw more attention to yourself, your own views can then either be helpful to your business or counterproductive to that growth and success. And so... What, you mean your own views beyond business? Yeah, exactly. You might have views about... Your political views, your views on all aspects of society, your views on football even or anything else, you know, that can be seen as being controversial. So there's always that really fine line to tread between being a high profile person, using your own personality and your beliefs to build your business and embracing sort of the values that you stand for.

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11:22Go to read.ai and get started. Read.ai, your higher power. Some people, you know, there's this engage and enrage or enrage and engage sort of, I've heard this a number of times where people do that to get sort of attention online. But you're saying that's not a long-term strategy, really. It's not a long term strategy. And I guess the risk there is what you say in the early days where you may have a very core following people that really bind to what you're doing. That can come back to haunt you later. So if you're controversial in your early days because you see that that's a way to get attention, that's a way to score points maybe with people that are really championing what you stand for.

12:04later as you become more mainstream as you open up to more custom bases and attract more people then that can come back to get you because nothing ever goes away does it no but it could be a marmite strategy could be a good strategy couldn't it i mean it might be that you've got a big enough audience that likes what you're doing you don't really care about the others it could be and it depends very much on the sector that you're in as to whether that works or not so which sectors might that be sort of okay in so i think i guess i guess in youth culture where you're really focused on you're a mod or a rocker in the old days but what is it now i controversially switched from one to the other which is shocking it's like changing your football club which is also a mind film and then of course i guess you know food and drink as well we've seen lots of controversy haven't we in those sort of sectors especially within the beer industry right there's lots of quite high profile people that have had lots to say on subject matters that haven't necessarily landed in the beer industry yeah so but then if you're in financial services or you're in the legal industry then you've you probably got to tread a different path haven't you because you i don't know i'm not in those industries but that would be your advice to me if i was yeah i think you obviously if you are a new entrant into a market you want to shake that market up you want to do things differently absolutely but you you've got to make sure that you stick to your values you've got to make sure that what you're saying is helpful to your business and isn't going to come back to get you later so that's interesting you say stick to your values so you would advise your clients to start there really would you yeah definitely I think really articulating what you stand for as a person and where those are reflected in your business and then using your business to show examples of that is really powerful and then that also provides a bit of guidance in terms of what conversations you get involved in what causes you support what you champion outside of your business you know if you if you've got a really clear idea on what those values are that can really help to ensure that you build a bit of a framework for yourself without making that sound too jargony but if you've got an idea of what you stand for as a person then that will help you to shape up conversations that you are prepared to get involved in and others that you probably should just stay away from or stay in your lane about It's a good challenge for anybody.

14:22I'm just thinking, what do I stand for? It's a good question to ask oneself. And you would say that's a good starting point. That's a really good starting point. And I think, especially for founder led businesses, when you're building a business, a lot of yourself will be in that business. A lot of you will have probably recognized a problem in an industry and your business will be about solving that issue. so it would be impossible to at the beginning to really sort of delineate yourself from the business because you are the business and then as it builds other people sort of input to that don't they and they help to shape it as well but really those core values especially if you're looking for a legacy if you're looking to then you know pass that business on to your to your family to to others that may have started the business with you you know coming always coming back to those core values can really provide a good solid framework from which to think about you know your your behavior as a business so you you talk about founder-led businesses i suppose all businesses in the early days of founder-led aren't they they all start with somebody doing something is it your view that the founder really needs to take a lead then in these strategic communications that needs to be their voice to begin with i think in recent years that has definitely become a huge expectation of businesses in recent years in recent years why is that what's going on that's about trust and the world that we live in companies can no longer be sort of faceless entities people want to know who's behind the business we have so many channels available to us to find out information and those are constantly fed either by ourselves if we're embarking on sort of proactive communications or by others if we're just reacting to what people say about us in the market.

16:05So if you, if you have the opportunity to sort of shape your communications by using your own profile, if you're a bigger company using the profile of those executives that work for you, you know, that, that can really help you to stand out in the market and that can help tell your story. And people love stories as well. And those are so powerful and people have stories. And if you are just a brand that's sort of communicating without without that type of kind of personal touch that you know that that's that's difficult to sometimes get the cut through you've then got to create the stories the companies are no longer faceless organizations so every company needs a face or two is that what you're saying not every company because i guess there's lots of examples out there of huge companies utilities i'm thinking utilities or they get a bad they get a bad yeah or big brand don't they yeah they do get a bad But big brands where, you know, perhaps the turnover of CEOs is every few years, that's difficult to then build that personal brand aspect.

17:03And there's always the risk that that. Yeah, the tenure of the CEO is not as long as the life of the business. Yeah, absolutely. I think especially when you consider the role of employee engagement and employee communications within brand building, then the expectation is that your leadership is not invisible. People want to know who leads the business. they want to know who they work for they want to know what they stand for so even if you're not projecting that externally into the world that's really important for your for your staff and for your team so when you're describing that are there some business leaders that are popping up in your mind do you think are good examples of that you could share yeah i mean the businesses that we work for a lot of those are sort of scaling businesses i mean there's lots of i guess obvious examples out there people like the richard bransons of the world who are i think were pioneers in personal brand and using kind of the first almost i would say he was probably the first yeah i'm trying to think i suppose people like henry ford and people like that may have come but did they think about personal brand do you think henry ford was thinking about that was he just thinking about making a good car i think he probably stood for a whole generation of i guess manufacturing and industry that didn't exist before he came so he he was a category leader wasn't he in that sort of automotive industry and probably a pioneer yeah and uh as was richard and icon of i guess like 1940s 50s america yeah now sort of racking my brain to really good examples from this day and age well maybe there aren't many that might be the challenge all of us in business we've got to step up and do better no i think there are so many now i think So many, you'd say it's the opposite.

18:48Yeah, I think there are a lot. And I think that people do look to those individuals to work out whether they want to work for that business or do business with that business. And we can pull out lots of sort of, I guess, blue chip businesses. But I think those sorts of strategies of building a personal brand is really key in that scaling business phase and in that startup phase where that's just an opportunity to get ahead and to use that story to supercharge. So when you think about building a personal brand, I mean, is there some sort of list of types of personal brand? I mean, can you be this type?

19:28Is it like picking a color? I mean, how do you approach it? I mean, how do you begin with a personal brand? Because we're all somebody. Yeah. We all have a name. Definitely. We all come from somewhere. Absolutely. So what else is required here? So first of all, it's the sort of strategic aspect of it, which is, again, what we said, coming back to the values. What do you stand for? Really articulating those and getting those down on paper so you can use those to judge everything you do by. Secondly, it's about the messages that you want to get across. So it's not enough just to think about broadcasting and getting out there and saying things on different channels.

20:07You need to really think about what it is that you want to say and have those sort of articulated. Thirdly, it's looking at the channels on which you can be most effective, being quite single minded about those, picking two, three, whatever your time and budget allows for to invest in those. And then fourth, it's looking about how you're going to amplify what you're doing. What is going to give you that sense of credibility so that people see you as a recognisable personal brand? So that might be, are there awards that you should be going for? Are there speaker opportunities where you should be having something to say?

20:45Are there networks where you could be investing in those networks that are going to move the industry on? This sounds like a full-time job, though. you know run a business or sell a product or whatever you know it's a big deal i disagree actually i disagree i disagree why because i think a lot of business leaders do all this stuff naturally anyway what they don't do is package it up and use their channels to replay it i mean most business leaders when they're building a business will be already thinking about oh gosh the talent pool of the future. So you haven't found their media really, but they're sort of doing it anyway.

21:22No, they're doing lots of great stuff, but what they're not doing is articulating that back through their channels. So half of it will be about taking stock. You know, what am I actually doing to build this business that will be of interest to others? And how can I showcase that through my own channels? And so taking people on a journey with you to show them how you're building your business or what it takes, or, you know, that's all really interesting content as well. I mean, what about this word authenticity? It comes up a lot. You know, so you've got a LinkedIn page, lots of people following it.

21:59Should you get your assistant to post on it or should you do it yourself? I think you should do it yourself. Yeah, I agree. So I do mine, but it is time consuming. It doesn't mean that others can't guide you. so we talked about a content strategy and having sort of key pillars of things that you might talk about other other people can guide you with that communications experts here's a sort of menu of things you should be thinking of doing over the next few periods and some ideas and that sort of thing yeah that so you can get input and help yeah and you can use other assets that you're creating in other areas of marketing to then play back on your own personal channels so if you appear in an article in the press, you know, replay that through LinkedIn.

22:43Or if part of your business has commissioned some research, you know, replay that at a speaker platform that you're talking at. So make sure you're using everything. Using everything you've got and start there. Don't look to create stuff from the outset. Look at what you're already doing. That's probably the most cost-effective and time-effective way. And for sure you'll be doing stuff. So you start. You'll be doing it. I mean, I've never met a founder that isn't passionate about what they're doing. And if they're passionate about what they're doing, they're normally passionate about the industry that they're in.

23:15And they probably care deeply about the staff that they're growing and all of that. There'll be aspects of that that they can tell those stories about. So, you know, why they've taken on or invested in apprenticeships. So what's interesting to me listening to this is from when I started in my career, there was no sort of suggestion that you should be sharing all that stuff publicly about how you run your company. And now you're saying it's a good thing to do that and to do it all through these different channels. Yes, yeah. Because why? Why? Because I think people are looking for new ideas. And I think that from a, I guess the buzzword over the last few years has been thought leadership.

23:57I think we're in a new era now of thought for leadership because we have new challenges in our world, don't we? Certainly do. We have cost of living crisis that many employers are trying to support their employees through. We have mental health challenges that many employers feel really responsible for helping their employees to overcome. We have all sorts of sort of, I guess, ideology politically that we're trying to navigate. And so the role of a leader now is sitting across all of these very, very challenging, polarizing conversations and trying to navigate their staff and their team and their workforce through those.

24:35And that's challenging. And they need to, and by sharing perhaps their approaches or the ideas that they've got or how they've tackled certain subjects, that can be really compelling to all aspects of their supply chain or their stakeholders. I really like thoughtful leadership. Thank you. Thanks for sharing that. I'm going to use that and think about it. And all those things you've just described are surreal. And we're all trying to keep our show on the road, so to speak, and keep the team together and keep people focused and keep people, I hope, happy in their work. So that is a new kind of leadership in many ways.

25:17It is, it is. And I guess... Especially with digital and working remotely and all these new things that have happened really in the last decade. Yeah. And I guess you can't just be focused on profit anymore, can you? I mean, ultimately, I'm a true believer in growth. I don't think that we can have conversations about business without talking about growth. But at the same time, there is responsibility towards planet and to people as well. And I don't think there's ever been a time when there's been more responsibility needed to those two other things. so leadership is not in a vacuum it it's the consideration of how profit is made in context of those other two areas and so leaders do have to navigate their way through that and all of that content is is really really interesting so that's profit with purpose yeah i mean purpose is such an overused word isn't it and it's it's challenging purpose now well because um i guess a lot of companies especially if they've got foot both sides of the Atlantic, isn't it?

26:21The US, yeah. If that's the way you're going, yeah, yeah. If you're going to France, it's the channel. It's really challenging, isn't it? Because, you know, perhaps what would have landed in the last administration won't land well now. And if you're running a global business, you've got to take into account perhaps what all of your audiences are thinking and feeling. So companies do need to be purposeful. That becomes very difficult. I mean, I think the company's got to believe in its own purpose, surely. Correct. But I think that's where the values come in, isn't it? A company's got to follow its own values and what it cares about.

26:53Yeah, I mean, our purpose is improving lives through work. Whoever's the president of the United States or anywhere else doesn't change. Yeah. So it worries me that you think, you know, some company might have to sort of, you know, do some sort of dance to change their purpose because of what's going on politically. No, it's not a dance. I think it's more about how companies come back to their sort of true values and how they're living those, not just throwing around words like purpose, but really focusing on that. But of course, the reality - So you feel it's become a bit sort of overused? Yeah, I mean, you won't see any sort of marketing comms these days without the word purpose thrown in.

27:31But I think what purpose means and how companies articulate it has to reflect their own values and their own ideology. So one of the things you do, I believe, is help companies when they have a crisis. Yes. So I've been thinking about a few. I mean, I follow business stories closely. and there have been a few business stories that have given me the heebie-jeebies. And I think, oh, you know, what would I have done in that situation? Well, I'd have called a good communications expert and said, how can you help? So can I just role play a couple of these? Oh, my goodness. Yeah. I'm a bit nervous about this, but absolutely.

28:11Please go ahead. Well, one big story this spring was the Heathrow Airport fire. Oh, yes. And you'll remember that was a fire that occurred at an electricity substation in the night. And it closed Heathrow. Well, the decision was taken to close Heathrow. That's right. Which meant 1 ,200 flights were cancelled. 200 ,000 passengers were inconvenienced, to say the least. And a lot of money was lost. and so one of the one of the notable things that came out of that was that the ceo um thomas woldby had slept through this um momentous night uh the ceo of heathrow and so i am for the purpose of this role play thomas holdby woldby and i've just woken up and i've called you oh my lord And I'm saying, Sarah, what should I say?

29:10What should I do? What should I be thinking about now? This has happened. Help me, please. Absolutely. Well, the best help that any PR person could have given Heathrow at that time is the preparedness that would have gone in pre this crisis situation. Oh, thanks for that. Yeah. But it's happened. No. We'll come on to that in a minute. But ultimately, it's all about the process when it comes to crisis communications. So it's about knowing who's on call, who's responsible, how they're contactable, what that process looks like to make sure that the right people are available in this sort of instance.

29:50And then who is going to step in if that person for some reason, I don't know, wife's in labour or they're in a family crisis or something, is going to take over. So someone did make the decision to close down. It wasn't like there was no one there. But he obviously made the decision to switch his phone off, which is not an unreasonable – you know, we keep hearing – I've talked to many people who say, you know, you shouldn't have your phone on 24-7. You should give – you know, it's not good for one's mental health. You should turn it off. And that's what happened here. So I guess then if you were the PR person briefing him as that scenario that you've given, And then I guess it's about being honest with him about the impact that's going to have, which it did have on the perception because people were outraged that that would have led to him not being available to speak to the to the public.

30:42So in that instance, I think you've just got to you've got you can't shy away from what's happened. You can't pretend that you weren't asleep. You have to say it as it is. You've got to say it how it is. you've got to lean on the fact that you've got a very capable team that you know there was a process in place um and that that that that exec team is is is all sort of responsible but i but i think also probably an apology is is also required in that instance because ultimately when you're the chief exec can you ever really be off that is the question okay okay thank you for that well that's a good question can you really ever be off if you're the chief exec that's one for us to reflect on possibly not and so the next one was a tragedy that happened in america which was the assassination of brian thompson the ceo of united healthcare yes by a young man who's been accused of this crime called luigi mangioni and and luigi mangioni was apprehended you might recall in a mcdonald's and not long after his apprehension because someone who worked at mcdonald's called the police they recognized him and he was arrested not long after his apprehension a tweet appeared on x um from burger king simply said we don't snitch and then it's become apparent sometime later that this wasn't actually from burger king the tweet we don't snitch it was a fictitious account looking like Burger King, but it went viral.