Why Brands FAIL at Going Viral in 2026 | Rachel Allison

15:46Jimmy:I think that's going to be the new era. I'm quite surprised that the US president hasn't jumped on this yet, but he's probably quite busy. Yeah. Because it feels like quite a, he almost started to pave that way a little bit by having his career start off in TV. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? And I think even with the Obama kind of presidency, he became this way, way, way more personality led figure. And now Michelle is a personality, as well as a political figure. So I think, yeah, I think that's probably going to be the next phase, isn't it?

16:22Rachel Allison:We're going to go to politicians' TV channels, basically. Could you imagine?

16:26Jimmy:I don't think I'll be watching that. I'm not going to lie. It doesn't sound that riveting, but you know what? Each to their own.

16:33Rachel Allison:Metrics. How do you measure this stuff, right? So you mentioned going viral earlier. What does viral mean? What's the benchmark for that? What does it mean? how do you sort of quantify

16:49Jimmy:what viral is yeah let's start with viral viral is the word that makes everyone feel physically ill when a client says it to you like I cannot stress everyone literally tries to hold down the vomit in their throat it is literally not okay to say that word to anyone okay unless you're about to do something that's genuinely going to change the world don't use the word viral so viral is an equivalent i would say spotify raps that is a viral campaign it has transcended beyond the like traditional channels it is something that is becoming colloquial everyone's talking about it that is viral just like the memes of the the beckham announcement that is a viral sensation it was the front post new york new york times or new york post i think while i was out there which was randomly i didn't expect america to be on it as much there but they're like they're our royal family from the UK.

17:42Jimmy:And I was like, really? Like, she's way bigger out there, actually. So there's a lot of, there's a lot of, like, cross-pollination, especially across socials, around who and why people are talking about things. Viral on a smaller scale, not from a brand perspective, but from a, like, general conversation perspective. There was a journalist, actually, recently, called Shantae Jay, who is incredible. she speaks out about lots of different things but she wrote an article in vogue and it was about like having a boyfriend being embarrassing is it embarrassing now yeah and like she does a lot of stuff and her content is fabulous i love her i love following her and she's always got something to say and backs up really well um but that post or like that article is an equivalent of something going viral like people just organically picking it up and being like actually yeah let's have a conversation about it and it being picked up so just explain what the piece was for those okay for people that don't know it was a piece in vogue where she basically identified a trend with married or heterosexual people pretending they don't have a boyfriend on their social feeds in like in during occasions and awards etc etc and was like saying how is this part of a wider societal change that no woman wants to be seen with their boyfriend yeah so that was the article and that got picked up organically so that's something that goes viral brand ability to go viral is not that common yeah like very rarely does it happen and it's normally like very random shifts in the way that the cultural landscape is looking that you even cut through with any brand stuff so let's start with viral viral doesn't really exist and it's very very hard for any agency in the world to prove that they can make you go viral like if they say that they're mostly lying um they can try yeah everyone loves to try um so that's that as a metric in terms of like how the thing i would say about metrics is every brand is so so different about what they deem successes so some might be like success for us is like uh if their football brand it might be like our community's buying more tickets to our games yeah that is like a result of all the storytelling that you guys have done and that's the way that we're going to measure it it genuinely depends and i think it's better actually as an industry if we stop like collectively pretending there's one way that things could be measured because realistically things should be done bespoke to the brand and the thing you're doing um so i try not to force feed anyone on metrics as metrics as much as possible so that's my answer on that you don't kind of um i don't subscribe to a one-size-fits-all no and i think that's silly if you do and that the positioning of the industry has and i think this is where the value of advertising versus pr which i tend to say is like advertising has always been i think has had a better reputation it's where smarter people go and work it's still quite elitist it's still quite hard to get in you get shit tons more money to do everything like you can just make one thing they're like we need 10 people behind the scenes to make it work and everyone's like yeah it makes sense and you can measure it really simply and that's how they've been able to unlock more budget pr is about organic so it's really hard metric to like actually substantiate to anyone internally especially because people like they people unlock budget if it's in their ecosystem or they have data so for some people it could be really clever for me to get them to write like people on linkedin to write so their ceo sees that we've done a successful campaign because actually in that ecosystem they're like it really did work because they've seen it in their space for others that doesn't work and i think I kind of lost my trail of thought there

21:44Rachel Allison:no but I think it's

21:47Jimmy:it's interesting because

21:49Rachel Allison:I think it is one of the skills of the future right working out the metrics that matter I literally wish I could figure it out though yeah but you're getting so much more data and there's so much more of it but it's like okay working out siphoning through it and being like okay these are the ones that we actually want to focus on right we've got with a podcast there's so many metrics that we get and it's like but what what are the ones that we're really sort of focused on yeah how do you move the needle on those ones exactly it's a really important skill 100 % and i also

22:21Jimmy:think like um even social media measurement like evolves so much and it's like that consistent like keeping things sometimes it's about like back in the day it was genuinely likes and followers and everyone was just like how do you increase our follower count like that was the thing that everyone was so, so obsessed with. And now it's like, what does deep engagement look like? Because people aren't commenting as much as they were. So it's like, how do you measure sharing? And I think it's kind of scary how deep you'll be able to get in the future. Because I'm sure you'll start to be able to track in real time, like, mentions in a pub.

23:02Rachel Allison:You reckon, well?

23:03Jimmy:Well, I don't know, I'm not a tech queenie. But what I would say is, like, everyone thinks their phone listens to them anyway. There will be a point where that's monetised.

23:14Rachel Allison:Yeah.

23:15Jimmy:So that's probably the future. And that would actually help me out slightly. It's a future for you. Finally. We can all get behind. But no, I actually think it's quite scary.

23:28Rachel Allison:How do you separate between what Axan saw things and what Rachel thinks? how do you go about doing that or is it so intertwined that that's impossible to do

23:42Jimmy:that's a really good question one I've never been asked actually look at you you're good aren't you yeah you're like I've done this before tell this before

23:55Rachel Allison:that was my opening question to Tony Blair was what's the job of a former Prime Minister and he laughed and he said I've never been asked that before completely put him on the back foot it's such a good start that's actually so strong

24:11Jimmy:yeah very good I love it I think it is hard to tell it apart if I'm honest what Axon Saw is and what I am I would say that I'm way more rogue than the Axon Saw brand so like I think sometimes in my office my team are like don't do it stop no if you do it do it through your personal account please don't do it so that is actually I would say my team are quite a good gauge of like what is the brand going to be saying and what can I say and even still they're like oh for god's sake will I do it

24:44Rachel Allison:so I don't know and how do you sort of stay aligned as a team of 15 on that and how's that kind of change right because that the difference from five to 15 is actually quite significant yeah and it's quite overwhelming like it's overwhelming I think each stage you go through

25:03Jimmy:in business, right, you're like, I really want to get to this goal. And then when you get there, you're like, whew, okay. I think everyone, I think you're, I hate saying it like this, because this is kind of what I think could be deemed as slightly, like, not great. But I think people that get into the agency are often quite politically aligned. I don't mean literally we all vote for the same people, but we all want to get the same things out of the stuff that we put into it. Like, we're all massive empaths. We want to do really good work. Like we want to do stuff with impact. We don't believe in doing things for the sake of it.

25:37Jimmy:We'll always say no. Like there's a couple of values, a couple, there's obviously a load of values that we all share. And like, you can tell that because we have quite open dialogues about things that happen in the news. And like, I love to be a bit of a contrarian. Like when everyone's like, oh, this person should be canceled. I'm like, should they? Have you heard this? And I think that's the way I was raised. and I think that is how we operate as an agency. I don't think we sit in any silo.

26:05Rachel Allison:Yeah. What are the values? What are the kind of key values?

26:09Jimmy:What are your values?

26:12Rachel Allison:Stand up for job creators.

26:13Jimmy:Yeah, you did tell me that. You landed that key message straight away. Exactly.

26:17Rachel Allison:Positive about the future of our economy.

26:18Jimmy:Yeah.

26:20Rachel Allison:I think it's never been a better time to be building or switching careers, but... Really? Yeah.

26:26Jimmy:That's quite a big...

26:27Rachel Allison:That's quite a big thing, But I caveat it with that because the opportunities aren't as straightforward as what they were, and the ladder, the career ladder has broken, it is harder if you don't know how to do it. So you've got this paradox, basically, at the heart of the world, which is like it's never been better to be building or switching careers, but actually it's also never been a harder time to do it as well. So that's what we are here.

26:52Jimmy:I don't know if it's that hard to do it, though. Not in a, like, I'm so privileged way. but the reason I say that is like it's it's not harder to do I just think that you get paid for a lot longer yes that's that is like it's it's completely accessible you could probably start to be a video content or content creator or like videographer with your phone yes quite quickly but you won't get paid for quite a long time because everyone can do it yeah so while the entry point is like lower to some extent you can pivot you can do this you can do that like so can everybody else yeah exactly so it's a bit hard it's a bit of a tricky and how long you're willing to go at something yeah and then that comes down to like what's your second income or like how many jobs are you willing to work how many hours you're going to put in and then we basically become little america the three job economy yeah i love that no i don't just to be clear

27:50Rachel Allison:um so but what are the values that stand out for you then values that stand out to me is you know

27:56Jimmy:probably could do with a refresh of my brain but um i would say um yeah we always do things that have like heart and soul like we want to always like leave our own stamp on something yeah i think that's really important for us if any other agency can do it we're probably not like gassed over of putting it out into the world. I think that we all really deeply care about like trying to move the dial, like actually a bit to our own detriment, like to the point of like, I'm like, we're even getting paid for this anymore, just like still going. So I'd say that's one of our values, which I should change.

28:35Jimmy:We are always like, whatever we try and do, we always try and make it inclusive. like i think that the same stories are always told like the success stories the people that have made it to the top of the mountain the um yeah i mean just the same old people are always like celebrated and like even when you're pulling together which you often do for brands like here's like five celebrities you should work with here's five podcasts you should put them on blah blah it takes a lot more time and effort to suggest someone that's emerging and like isn't an obvious suggestion and get a brand to buy into it yeah and that's i think what our like magic thing is that we would care to go deeper on things like that just sort of for the aspiration or the

29:19Rachel Allison:climbers yeah type thing the emerges the emerges yeah that's that's it that's a good phrase yeah thank you i should say i think what i saw about earlier was more like what our mission is rather than the values the the three values that i hold dear are stay hungry stay humble and stay curious they're the three things

29:38Jimmy:I feel like they're quite aligned yeah yeah

29:40Rachel Allison:I also love proactivity

29:43Jimmy:yes I actually think you can't get anywhere in life without proactivity that's how passionately I feel I actually was thinking about it the one thing that irks me is someone being like can you tell me I'm like can you tell me

29:58Rachel Allison:anything

29:59Jimmy:just like no proactivity to like figure something out yourself yeah yeah totally I'm just like a very I'm a self-starter person there is always a way there is always a way there's always like i you don't need me to come in and figure that one out for you you know that's how i feel about life i had a passive aggressive boss once who had a just fucking google it above her head and i that is kind of iconic but also at the

30:25Rachel Allison:time i was like she's psycho but now i get it yeah yeah and also google we've got chat freaking

30:31Jimmy:GBT, you've got Gemino, I've got the old shebang. So, like, really, there's no excuses.

30:36Rachel Allison:As you bring up AI.

30:37Jimmy:Oh, my favourite. How is it going to change PR, and how are you using it? I don't know how it's going to change PR. Nobody knows what they're talking about. The thing is, everyone's pretending and coming in with their hot takes, and I'm like, do you actually know what you're talking about? A lot of people just, for me, I've listened, I went through a phase of like listening to quite a few experts on AI. You've probably spoken about it till the cows come home.

31:05Rachel Allison:Yeah, I mean...

31:07Jimmy:You've spoken to experts, beyond experts on AI. What's your conclusion? What do you think is going to change?

31:13Rachel Allison:Well, I think one of the things is going to be brevity. And I think, and I don't like the term authentic because I think it's becoming quite cliched, right? It's becoming very overused and so on. but I think the kind of ability to kind of communicate, it ends up, a lot of the AI stuff ends up being the kind of like mean of everything, right? Like it ends up just sort of being quite average and it's going to raise everyone's game, right? I found as a dyslexic that it's like, it helps me like draft stuff and like it's really good at that, but I do have to spend a lot of time kind of editing it, but that sort of, it gets over the cold start problem in terms of like, I've got an idea for a piece or a post about this, this, and actually it sort of comes back and so on.

32:00Rachel Allison:That's where I find it's best. It's when it's a bit of a sparring partner and a bit of a challenger to you. So I think that's going to be quite... And the biggest thing that I say to young people and whatever is just learn how to use the tools. Oh, a thousand percent.

32:17Jimmy:I actually have teams that are members who are anti-app, like won't use it. Wow. Yeah. What's the reason? I feel like that is quite my agency vibe, right? Like everyone is really like clear on where they stand on things, which I think is amazing. And it produces really sticky work, which is what I like doing. What's my view on AI? Yeah. I feel like it could be a tool that like revolutionizes stuff in a positive way. I think we're in our slop era while everyone figures it out. And it could be something that, I don't know, I read something in The Economist like ages ago, which I live to quilt because it makes me sound so clever.

33:02Jimmy:But it was about agriculture and how like farmers were going out and campaigning and being like, this machinery is going to ruin the world. Like, da, da, da, da. And like, arguably, like as someone who's like quite food conscious about what we're putting into our body, they were kind of right. But there was also an element of like, we actually evolved as a society to do way smarter things and it's not all doom and gloom. I get it that it's scary but you kind of have to embrace it. I'm not here to be a dinosaur about stuff. The thing trend wise in the industry right now is everyone's massively over indexing in like in person events.

33:40Jimmy:Everything's in person. You just have to bring people into your brand world. In person, in person. I would say it was like pre-COVID everyone was obsessed with festivals and being together in those big experiential moments and da-da-da-da. I was so frigging tired before COVID. I was so grateful for the rest of not having to be outside this much because everyone was so obsessed with being in real life and it seems that we're going back that way. And I think that's a great thing for anyone in production.

34:13Rachel Allison:I agree.

34:14Jimmy:Because it's a physical. The physical is going to outshine the like mental well that's unfair but you know what i mean like i think being emotively attentive is going to be a massive skill set to anything and also like being able to physically build things which doesn't help me that much because i'm not that good but i am good at like seeing things and being able to construct it in a way that makes sense to stuff yeah i think that is like probably the two skills that I would say would help through this AI

34:49Rachel Allison:slap now speaking of AI LinkedIn our great partners for this episode I've got this really intriguing stat that over a million jobs have been created with AI in the last two years right so it's like a million jobs created so you can see it in the titles that people are hiring etc and so on I'm sure you've probably got somebody who's an AI lead maybe? No. No. What advice would you give to somebody starting out today? Like, where do you think, if Rachel was starting out today?

35:22Jimmy:Oh my God. What do you think you'd be doing? I'd be an AI whiz. I was a person that cheated on my homework, okay? So I'm absolutely okay with like figuring out what tools help you get further for things that matter, to get closer to things that matter. Not encouraging that to any younger generations. homework is good for you um supposedly um but i do think like exercising your own like understanding of what matters and then doubling down on it and using the tools that are out there

35:53Rachel Allison:is not a bad thing rachel talking about using all the tools that are out there is actually quite a good segue to linkedin who are sponsoring this episode of jimmy's jobs the future one thing that keeps coming up on this podcast is founders doing several jobs at once you're a salesperson the brand manager, the recruiter, sometimes all in the same morning. LinkedIn's just launched a premium all-in-one which is designed to help you exactly with this problem. It brings sales, marketing and hiring tools into one place on the LinkedIn app so you're not switching between a million different platforms just to get through the day.

36:30Rachel Allison:You get things like daily prospect suggestions, in-mail credits to connect with potential clients or candidates and credits to boost your posts to the right audience plus AI tools to help with things like drafting in messages and building out your profile the idea is spending less time hunting for tools and more time actually building the business which is what we're all here to do I'm using it at Jimmy's Jobs of the Future and it's made a big difference

37:04Rachel Allison:No.

37:05Jimmy:Do you know what? I genuinely ride for LinkedIn. I did it before it was cool because I think it's having a bit of a renaissance, okay? But I was ahead of the curve on this LinkedIn loving because, and I will absolutely say it with my whole chest, the reason I love LinkedIn is because none of my friends were there. so I didn't feel judged I didn't care so I was actually quite raw and authentic on there one, two, I didn't have a clue how I was going to get access to the tables I needed to to grow the business and I didn't have a network so I had to literally build it from scratch that meant I had to put myself out there say lots of stuff, give all my thoughts away for free and pray that somebody would see it and then send a couple of DMs that was literally my approach to growing the business at the beginning, like it didn't really pay off, I would say in the first year, but like what it did is it actually created organic conversation about me, which allowed me to get into those rooms.

38:04Jimmy:Anyone I DM'd, I pretty much did not get a lead with, let's be honest, and that was like, okay, love, we don't know who you are. I think it's like the perception, you got your name out there, which actually built that trust. It's the whole, it's actually PR, like. Yeah, personal PR. It built trust organically, yeah. And then people were like, okay, she actually knows what she's talking about. have you seen her post this? Da da da da da. And it was the quiet infiltration that ended up happening. Not a direct, clear result. I think some people are like, oh, my inbox is flying off the chain with all my inbound requests.

38:37Jimmy:That's not me, okay? But it's all of the soft power it allows, I think, is what I would say.

38:43Rachel Allison:One of my favourite terms, Sonny, was soft power. Keeping it fresh. Soft power. It is true, though.

38:49Jimmy:I think that's actually a good way of rebranding PR, actually.

38:52Rachel Allison:Soft power. yeah yeah

38:54Jimmy:because it's not advertising which is obviously hard power yeah they should have thought of this another one give it to you for free industry have that feel the linkedin posts going on you better like it drop a comment

39:10Rachel Allison:drop a comment below let me know if you agree

39:17Rachel Allison:I know you don't want to talk about client work too much but I was fascinated to see you did the goal hanger kind of rebrand, launch, etc.

39:25Jimmy:Yeah.

39:26Rachel Allison:Talk to us about that.

39:27Jimmy:I've done many a thing, me. Yeah, it was with one of my ex-clients from back in the day. He used to work at Boiler Room, who is definitely quite the visionary in the industry. And, yeah, he brought us on board to bring that goal hanger vision to life. I think as a platform, they're just so exciting. Are they a competitor?

39:51Rachel Allison:Well, sort of. but I mean we play in a different space it's adjacent though definitely and to be honest them and Diary of a CEO in a way help blaze the trail right like it helps us

40:04Jimmy:blueprint vibes

40:05Rachel Allison:yeah definitely

40:06Jimmy:agree yeah I mean I think what they've created is incredible they've got so much sick data behind them like just like organic trust I think it's like 75 % of like people would trust anything from a host recommendation which is so wild when you think about like all of the money people spend on advertising to get like I would I mean I don't know the stats I'm not going to start chatting shit but be like 10 % of people actually make the purchase but like for someone to recommend it like if you were to say Axon Saw's the best agency on the planet 70 % of people will be like let me Google them

40:43Rachel Allison:yeah

40:43Jimmy:you know

40:44Rachel Allison:but why but what is this sort of when is a company like that which is listened to loads and has really high distribution recognition rates like what's the what's the brief with a

40:57Jimmy:rebound relaunch well they did the the guy steven my so he used to he created um woo at itv did you ever see that it was like a bit of a lockdown baby from him but he's just like he's ahead of the curve and like he's an exciting person for anyone to have on their team like very visionary like always thinking 50 steps ahead so he came up with a lot of their content and stuff and our job was to like get it out there in the world and like make sure everybody knew what they're about and that it's a new dawn for them because they're doing a lot of big and exciting things this year as a company and as an organization and again they're pushing the space that podcasting can be into a whole new realm where i'm definitely not allowed to say what they're going to do but they They are doing, I think the next couple of months, the drops that they have are changing the game for podcasting, which is exciting.

41:57Jimmy:Yeah, super exciting. And the team's pretty chill as well. I feel like podcasting people, I started off in broadcast PR, which is a very, very odd niche of the world. But everyone that worked in broadcast PR was ex-BBC. I quite enjoyed it. it was like quite a it was almost like quite a wc1 energy yeah does that make any sense to you yeah so i like had loads of people to learn from and i feel like podcasting still has that my old school energy doesn't it behind the scenes oh definitely definitely what was the first thing you did for money did for money as in my first ever job yeah i was thinking like about this i I thought you might ask something like this.

42:43Jimmy:I was, I think I washed hair at like the local hairdressers that loads of old people went to. And I used to get tips because I was so chatty. And it didn't last. I famously have worked most places in my local shopping centre and quit.

42:59Rachel Allison:Oh, go on. Talk us through them.

43:00Jimmy:It's nothing to be proud of everybody, okay? No, but it's interesting all the difference. So I worked, yeah, so I worked at the hairdresser. That was my Saturday job. I got a paper round, which I did a couple of times. I don't know, I probably did it like two months. I love the concept of making money. I don't love, especially pre my 30s, I wasn't that wedded to anything, is what I would say. I was quite like flippant. I can get another job. No need to stress, mum. But okay. Yeah, I did that. I worked at a shoe shop, which I would argue, I don't think I was actually meant to, I think my national insurance number had just come through.

43:39Jimmy:do you remember those national shorts that was a really great day for me um and i knew i got the job i had no experience as a queue of people and the guy fancied me and i was like this feels a bit weird but i mean it's the most i've ever got paid um so that was barrett shoes remember them yeah yeah so this is how old i am um despite my baby face barrett shoes i worked at claire's accessories another RIP I worked at what's that shop where I can't even remember the name you know where it's quite a like like a Hollister energy one of those oh right okay one of those ones anyway like that for a bit I worked at a boutique that was really cool because I wanted to get 40 % off and that took ages to get that job I was really proud of myself I worked at my pinnacle basically all of these things because I wanted to work at Topshop I was obsessed with Topshop

44:36Rachel Allison:That was the...

44:37Jimmy:That was the mecca.

44:39Rachel Allison:So how did you get the job at the boutique? It sounds like you really went for that.

44:42Jimmy:I did. I made friends with everybody that worked there. I used to go in and just be like, oh, da-da-da-da. Bring my friends in. Oh, look, buy something. And they were like, okay, she seems to be quite desperate. Give her the job. And then I made it to Topshop and that was like my career highlight. I loved it so much. So you got there and then you made it? I literally was like bunking off school to work at Topshop. It was so stupid how much I loved it. I don't know what was wrong with me.

45:13Rachel Allison:What did it teach you working at Topshop?

45:18Jimmy:Do you know what? For me, it just shows you how pathetic my motivation was around. I loved shops that I would genuinely like, a brand that felt represented me. And I think that they really nailed teenage to adulthood really really well back in the day even though it was operated by some very very characters yeah i just thought it was like i thought it was like that like 90s britannia like positive like tony blair like energy that was like now very nostalgic but you didn't realize you were living in that time you just thought like britain was really cool really fashion forward we had the high street we had cool bands we had like it was just in that era it felt like top shop symbolized it they had like their kate moss collabs and that i just thought it was a really like sexy british time do you know what i mean i felt like top shot like epitomized it so it was like affordable but you like still look like you had a bit of money yeah that's very aspirational yeah so that was um that was my peak and then that kind of weirdly led me into pr actually that makes sense what's

46:24Rachel Allison:your assessment of the british culture that we're living in now then oh big question it is a big question but seeing as you because you articulated there and I think that's become quite what you just said there is not quite like fact obviously because culture isn't like that but yeah I think a lot of people would agree with that sentiment like what is it now that we're what represents

46:47Jimmy:us yeah the question I think our challenge right now is we don't know actually I think there isn't anything that we're hanging our hats on, so to speak. In that era, I think we had a really strong music system. I was listening to the rest of the entertainment, lol, look at me plugging, sorry.

47:11Rachel Allison:It's always good to have a smaller podcast out.

47:13Jimmy:That's right. Yeah, that's what we're going to say on that one. They need the viewers. Guys, listen to them. No, but they were saying about how we dominated, as a music empire for so long. And like AI's obviously wiped it all out and there's cuts all over the place. But I was like, you could actually feel that energy that we were creating so much bigger than our like exponential size. And I was actually listening to another podcast, which I won't have an irrelevantly name drop, about the K-pop, actually I will. It's called Pop Syllabus. It's really interesting. It's very new. But it's basically, someone was doing a deep dive on the power of K-pop.

47:55Jimmy:This is very random, slight tangent. But actually how K-pop was created because they were in so much debt after the war and they needed a way to export something bigger than them so that they could bring in a global audience and have soft power, interestingly. And so they kind of, K-pop was a byproduct of that. Like their beauty standards, there's like K-Beauty is like huge as well. They've basically dominated all of that space, the entertainment, the beauty, the drama. So now like a whole new generation of people, like my cousins who are like, I was going to say 16, she's probably like 19. But she's obsessed to the point where I feel like she can speak like three languages off the back of the stuff she listens to.

48:41Jimmy:Do you know what I mean? And I'm like, that's quite intense. We don't have that. We lost sight of that. And I think that's where it's a bit worrying. We've doubled down on this finance thing. And as soon as Brexit happened, we all know they've literally run to the hills, run to Dubai, run to the tax-free havens. So we've got nothing left. And I don't think we're clear what we're trying to double down on. Entrepreneurs could be a nice space, but they don't exactly look after us that well. The government doesn't look after us.

49:12Rachel Allison:Yeah. But I think the K-pop thing is fascinating. Yeah. I wish I remembered more

49:17Jimmy:because I'd have sounded really clever. It was honestly a very interesting deep dive. I still think we've got an edge when it comes to creativity and art and everything else. I don't know why we're not investing in that as a space. It just doesn't make sense to me. And music. Like I grew up on British music being at its pinnacle. Like grime was invented in that era. That's pretty sick. Do you know what I mean? America's now looking over to us being like, oh my God, what are you guys doing? We don't even have that anymore, actually Olivia Dean.

49:51Rachel Allison:And on that note?

49:52Jimmy:On that note, I love Olivia Dean.

49:54Rachel Allison:Thank you very much for coming on Jimmy's Jobs in the future. You're welcome. Thanks, Rachel.

49:57Jimmy:You're welcome.

50:10Rachel Allison:Say mal, hast du bei der Steuer auch diesen Schulfashback? Einfach irgendwas raten und dann hoffen, dass es stimmt?

50:16Jimmy:No, not. Wieso Steuer is my safe space.

50:20Rachel Allison:You mean everything is safe?

50:22Jimmy:Yes, exactly. Wieso Steuer is the app that understands you. Egal if Studium, Job or Umzug.

50:30Rachel Allison:Stimmt, krass. It feels like not like Steuern.

50:33Jimmy:Steuern erledigt?

50:35Rachel Allison:Safe.

50:35Jimmy:With Wieso Steuer. Hey Karriere, why are you so without a soul, without a warm, without a community, without a trust, without a halt? Karriere, how would it be? With Gefühl. Ab März Karriere new discover. Das Handwerk.