618: Kings of Anglia: A HUGE game as Town bid to tame dangerous Lions

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0:38Hello friends and welcome to your Thursday edition of the Kings of Anglia Ifritown podcast proudly sponsored by Molecular UK. I'm Mark Heath. We've got a huge, huge, huge game to build up to this weekend as Town entertained the Lions of Millwall. It was a massive clash at the top of the table. Lots also to talk about. We're going to get right into that with my two friends, alex jones and stewie watson stewie you were having a well-earned day off having stepped into my shoes during my period of time off how are you i'm all right thank you yeah a little bit

1:08Stuart Watson:coldy at the moment um but we're cracking on and the suffolk sunshine is glorious today so that always helps it's lovely isn't it generally makes a difference in my mood and i find in the mood of everyone around you when there's a bit of sun out everyone's just a bit nicer aren't they aj Jay, you're nice all the time. How are you? Oh, thank you very much. I'm good, yes. You built that up as a big clash at the top of the table. It is that, but as we discussed earlier in the week, more importantly, you've labelled it as the Alex Jones derby, which is true. That is the main headline. I'm reliably informed that is what they're leading within the match programme as well.

1:44It's not like top-of-the-table championship clash or anything like that. It's just to do with me, which is pretty cool. Are you going to be like the Emperor in Gladiator are just doing this or that. Yeah, that would be perfect. It's exactly what I'll be doing. Enjoying the game. Friends, I thought we'd start today before we get to obviously the game itself and chats around that. Just a little catch up really. See how we're all feeling with nine games left in the season. Obviously this game, then there's an international break and then there's a hectic sprint to the finish made even more hectic by those rearranged games for It's Rich Town.

2:16Eight games in 27 days. So Stewie, town of third. It's been a rollercoaster season. We've often talked about, is this team fully trusted? How resilient are they? Various other kind of talking points around the team and comparisons to the band of brothers in blue. But sitting here right now, Thursday, March the 19th, how are you feeling about things?

2:44Stuart Watson:You could ask me this question day to day and the answer would probably change. Almost hour by hour, there are moments where I can convince myself that I'm cautiously optimistic, that Kieran McKenna and his staff and many of the players have been there and done it before, and that will help, and that the squad depth is going to come to the fore, and that they're actually suited to playing some of the better sides in the division, who they've still got to play, of course. And then there are other moments where all of those doubts that we've discussed along the way, and that you've just outlined just niggle in the back of your mind and that they might just fall short and then the playoffs could be anything and then next year could be a whole different ball game in this division.

3:30Stuart Watson:So mixed feelings is probably my best way of summing that up. Do you know what I was wondering? I was thinking about this the other day. Obviously, we talked about resilience being a big buzzword for this team and have they got enough resilience or do they crumble under pressure? And it struck me that obviously we have seen problems in games where maybe they struggle to turn things around when they go behind and things start going wrong in games. But generally speaking, if you look at how they've reacted to bad results, they've always kind of bounced back, haven't they? And generally gone on good runs after that.

4:02So I wonder if we're maybe being a little bit too critical of their resilience as a team as a whole, as opposed to maybe within games they struggle. What do you reckon, AJ? Yeah, I think that's a fair point. It's one that we've touched on before, where you look at how they've responded. Recently, the back-to-back Wrexham games lost those two in pretty gutting fashion. They then won three on the balance and lost since then. That's a good example. You look at they lost Leicester and went on a really good run. Between then, they didn't lose a game up until Sheffield United more than a month later.

4:38They're capable of doing it. They've not lost lots of games. they're in still what is not a perfect spot but a good enough spot it feels like the start of the season has been almost like a bit of the bane of the campaign doesn't it? Because they had to rebuild and it was a slow start and they had those frustrating results that it felt like the season started with that Sheffield United win whereas other teams like Coventry were able to build up a head of steam from the start But on the flip side, even though the performances have now been good for quite a while, sorry, the results have been good for quite a while, they've been unbeaten since February 24th, I still have that feeling of can they put together a consistent run of performances?

5:27That's going to be the next thing where they're really good for like 70 to 90 minutes and they can see out games. And, you know, we had the ones where they beat Watford and Swansea, played really well. Then there was a bit of a setback against Hull, where yes, they won the game, but you could see the performance levels weren't quite the same. The Leicester result, should they've had two penalties? Yes, fair enough. Stoke, first half, was one of the worst halves I've seen from Ipswich. So there's still that kind of fluctuation for me that is a concern. Then adding things like the nature of the games they've got coming up, the nature of the fixture list is going to be a big one with these rearranged games coming in as well.

6:06but there's excitement too because this weekend kicks off this kind of head-to-head between second, third and fourth that I think is going to be really exciting because all the teams have to play each other. Town have to play Borough and Millwall. Millwall have to play Borough and Ipswich. Borough have to play Ipswich and Millwall. So everything's still up for grabs and that's pretty tasty. It is indeed. Stu, do you reckon obviously Mark Ashton was talking on Radio Suffolk about engendering a siege mentality for the run-in, kind of us against the world sort of thing. Do you think that's something that could help them?

6:42Because obviously they've got this kind of burning sense of injustice around these decisions that went against them. Then the Leaf Davis ban, a lot of anger around that. As a team looking to kind of unite around a common feeling, if you like, or a purpose, do you think that could help them in the run-in?

7:01You're on mute, old friend.

7:03Stuart Watson:I think it's probably smart to use it as a distraction from the alternative, which is a crushing sense of pressure of, you know, this squad is worth X amount of money. Was the preseason promotion favorites for a reason. Next year is the last year of parachute payments. It will probably be a stronger division. It will be a stronger division. I think it's been a very average division this year. So there is pressure on Ipswich to get this over the line this year. And maybe trying to foster that siege mentality, even if it's slightly artificial, might not be a bad thing if that kind of unifies everybody and it provides a distraction from all these doubts and concerns and still slightly fragile connection between the fan base and this team.

7:58Stuart Watson:maybe they can use some of this refereeing controversy to a point. I don't want it to become the full focus. There is legitimate frustration around some of these penalty decisions and the Davis ban but it can't become a sort of woe is me tale either. I don't think that's particularly healthy either. I thought it was quite interesting Daro Shea speaking after the game at the weekend who often speaks honestly, doesn't he? I like listening to him saying that we can say there's not pressure. There isn't, there isn't, there isn't. But ultimately there is, and we do feel it. And given that often you hear athletes in every sport kind of saying, oh, no, I love pressure, or I don't feel pressure, or pressure is a privilege.

8:44I hate that, by the way. One of the worst cliches in sport, pressure or privilege. To have the captain of the side admit that, yes, we are human and we do feel pressure, I thought was pretty healthy. AJ, the promotion race itself then, before we get on to Millwall, obviously this is a big game in terms of the whole promotion battle, if you like. How do you see it? Because we started the season all predicting Tam were going to finish in the top two. Then I think midway through, I think Ross said they'd finish fifth. We've been going back and forth between Coventry running away with the league, Coventry finishing third, Borough winning the league, Borough now maybe missing out.

9:24town is all in their own hands given the position they're in and the fact they've still got to play how do you feel with uh with nine games left about how it might all shake out i've made so many predictions yeah it genuinely i feel like i've predicted about five different things um and i think most of them have been wrong obviously pre-season i had town winning the league going up with Southampton mid-season. I had Borough winning the league, going up with Ipswich. And then, most recently, I've gone quite big on Millwall, finishing second along with Coventry, pushing Borough and Ipswich into the playoffs.

10:03So the simple answer is, I clearly have no clue. This is about it. And that's maybe the most exciting thing. It is in Ipswich's hands, you're right. It's also in Middlesbrough's hands, and it's also in Millwall's hands. The fact that any of these teams if they won all of their games would be promoted to the Premier League. I think at this point when you look at things, it's not done at all, but Coventry I think quite clearly are going to be promoted to the Premier League and you can see that with the way that they're playing and the games that they've got coming up. When you look at it as a race, as kind of a three-horse race now for seconds, it's very easy to overanalyse it and I will be overanalyzing it because it makes really good content.

10:46and you look at things like Borough, Hayden Hackney is going to be injured, could be out for a few weeks potentially, he's their star man that could be a huge blow Millwall have these games against the top two, sorry, against second and third but other than that, have a really easy run in, like the games they're playing are all down towards the bottom of the division Town have that game in hand which can totally change the complexion because if they want to win that game in hand then they go above Borough and they go into second. So I'd say actually on points per game, they'd end up going, I think they would be above Middlesbrough on goal difference.

11:23So the whole picture, the whole dynamic can swing so quickly. How do I feel? I just don't know. Every time I lean one way or another, the other thing happens. I was going so big on Borough and then their recent form has been pretty poor, losing to Charlton and drawing Bristol City and then Town go get the result and then Coventry drop points and then Millwall go lose over the weekend. It feels like, do you remember that last championship season when everyone was winning relentlessly, just the whole campaign, and it almost felt like no one was slipping? This feels like just different teams slipping at different points and no one seems to be able to take advantage of it.

12:02Yeah, Stu, would you say it is now a race for second? That's basically the spot that's being played for because Coventry obviously have that gap. We talked about Coventry having a wobble and maybe them being the side to drop away, but they seem to have recovered. So do you think Town are now playing for second realistically?

12:21Stuart Watson:Let me just have a little reminder of the table before I agree with that. That's been my gut feeling for a little while, that probably Coventry had banked enough. They got over that little wobble. They've recovered, what is it, nine points with the game in hand.

12:44Stuart Watson:I'd be giving – I wouldn't completely rule it out. Stranger things have happened. It's the championship. It's unpredictable. Few saw Middlesbrough losing to Charlton the other night. There will be – pressure can do funny things to people, and this is where we'll find out whether Coventry, having not done it for so long, and Middlesbrough, same boat, psychologically how that has an impact. Hayden Hackney, there's a lot of angst at Middlesbrough at the moment. He came off injured at the weekend. That could be a huge blow to them if he's out. He's such a talismanic figure for them. Coventry could be one or two injuries away, and then one or two bad results away from it going on a similar run that they had recently.

13:35Stuart Watson:That said, I think it probably is second that Ipswich are shooting for, but I wouldn't completely rule out first still. You never know. Yeah, it was interesting. They did a bit earlier this week with punters putting money on town to win the title after the weekend's results. They got cut from 20-1, I think, to 9-1, 42 % of all bets, according to this particular source was going on town to win the title. So as you say, Stu, still a lot of points to play for. And the first of those points, Watson, is this weekend against Millwall. Millwall, in some ways, is the kind of the forgotten side in this promotion race, the side that won't go away, the side that people keep saying, well, they'll drop off.

14:16They're not really contenders. And yet they're still there. So how are you feeling about this one, Stu?

14:24Stuart Watson:mixture of nerves and excitement in terms of what's you know high stakes I think we can officially say we're in the run-in now nine games for Ipswich eight for most other clubs Millwall the club that have refused to go away a bit Ipswich like from a couple of seasons ago that I remember Mark Ashton saying after promotion was secured that you know we heard the chatter in the boardrooms, Ipswich will drop away. And there was the famous line of commentary, wasn't there, when I think when the Davis goal against Bristol City, if you think Ipswich are going to wither away in this promotion race, think again.

15:00Stuart Watson:And Millwall are that team this year. And if there's one club that revels in being the underdogs, then it's certainly Millwall. They're doing it a different way in terms of style of football. And I say that with the utmost respect. They found a way to be very effective in what they do and play to their strengths.

15:24Stuart Watson:Fascinating game in store. Absolutely. And that teases up for our next talking point, AJ, which is key battles. Now, you, as we've already touched on, have a kind of a foot in both camps. Obviously, you covered Millwall for a while, so I'm sure you still keep in touch with people back there and kind of pay more than a passing attention and kind of interest in what's going on. your first thoughts on this game and then maybe highlight a few key battles where the game could be won and lost. You've done a bit for tomorrow morning, so I don't want you to go through every single one of them. But I know there's one particular battle that you'll be focusing on, which may be the one to highlight as part of this build-up.

16:05Yeah, I mean, huge credit to Millwall for starters, because this is a team of any club I'd possibly go as far as saying in the Football League is operating kind of above their means. It's Millwall because you look through the squad and on paper it's a team that you would probably put towards a playoff battle. So for them to be very much in the thick of a top two battle, look at the form they've had since the turn of the year, look at the fact they've won. I think it's six of their last eight games. They've had a couple of frustrating home defeats in there. They don't concede many goals. They've had the most clean sheets in the division.

16:47You can talk about how maybe going forward that they're not the most potent attacking threat, but then they still go and they beat Birmingham 3-0 and they go and win 3-1 at Hull. So they've got this strong core that they've then added with good attacking players that suit the team and suit the style. There's so much to like about the way they've gone about it. if you're a Millwall fan, it'd be very easy to fall in love with this group of players, I'd say, because you've got a core that have been there for quite a while. Then they've added new signings. And one of the bits that's impressed me the most, I would say, has been the fact that injury list is so long.

17:30They've had so many players out for such a long time. Massimo Long, I remember he went to Millwall, did his ACL. He's been out. Kasper Donore, one of their key players, has been out. Goalkeeper Jensen out. Alfie Doughty out. Joe Bryan's been out. Dan Kelly's been out. They've got other attackers who've been out. There's genuinely a really long injury lesson. The way they've been able to steady and get through this has been really impressive. Shall we touch on a couple of key battles then? We'll have a little look at them. I will give you two. An attack versus defence on one side. I think that whoever starts up front, which I think will be even out on in this game, is going to have a very interesting battle on their hands because Millwall are a team of big boys, big old boys.

18:18I would imagine that the back line very likely will have Jake Cooper, who's 6 '4", and Tristan Kramer, who's also 6 '4". You can probably see Taylor, Caleb Taylor, come in. He's 6 '2". playing alongside Zach Sturge, who's also 6 '2", who got sent off in the game against Blackburn, but that red card's been rescinded because it was embarrassing, it was a joke, and the officials need big improvement, but that's an aside. And so you're looking at whoever is leading the line has to kind of put a dent into them, and that's going to be really difficult, given the height and physicality. Now, my concern possibly about going with Azon for this game is I remember even Azon leading the line at the Den on Boxing Day, and he just didn't get anywhere near the Millwall back line.

19:03But this is a different Azon. I think he's an improved Azon from what we've seen. So I'm hoping that we can now see an improvement from what happened at the Den and that he can have a better run at the likes of Tristan Kramer and Jake Cooper, who will also be big threats in the box from set pieces as well, because this is just a team of giants, essentially. And the other player and the other battles to highlight like going the other way, is Femi Aziz and Ben Johnson. And I've gone a little bit more in depth on this, but this for me is the battle of the game in that you've got Aziz, a former Ipswich target, who they bid for on deadline day.

19:40We're going to break Millwall's outgoing transfer record. He's got eight goals and seven assists in the championship so far this season. And he's going to be coming up against Ben Johnson on that side because with Leif Davis out, there's not really anyone else, and Kipre out as well. There's no one else to play at left back. Johnson's going to be out of position from his natural side. He is a former West Ham man, which I'm sure the Millwall fans will remember, given that he also won the Conference League with West Ham. And it's essentially one of the most potent attacking players in the division, one of the players of the season, coming up against someone who's hardly kicked the ball throughout this campaign, has been dropped out of squads at times because there hasn't been a place for him on the bench, who's starting out of position in the back line, this is a huge test for Ben Johnson.

20:28If he can stand up to that test and silence Femi and Z, there's a good chance of really nullifying what Millwall can do going forward. But that is probably an area of concern for me, given that maybe on paper looks a little bit of a mismatch. Yeah, good luck, Ben Johnson. Yeah, as I say, AJ's done a bit, which is going out tomorrow morning on the other key battles in the game. Jake Cooper, AJ, I always think is a bit of a contradiction because you look at him, he's, what is he, 6 '4", absolute tank. looks like a brute but he's a bit of a posh boy isn't he i remember you sending me uh some some voice notes of interviewing him after games is that was that him um yes yeah that is he um you just don't expect it at all he was on my transfer targets list and you you said oh i like the sound jake keeper i sent you some of the some of the interviews i did with him and you're expecting him to be like a proper like unit hard man maybe like a northerner or something like that and he talks and he goes yeah well i thought it was a good game and we played quite well um it's been important to get the three point and it's great i love it it's just such a contrast from what you expect um yeah that's uh that's great it sounds a bit more like a rugby boy she was just trying to get something online so i'll stick with you aj just on millwall generally i'm sure you're still in touch with people back there and maybe people who cover it how do you think it's been a how big of a surprise do you think it's been the season they've had yeah so when when we went back to the when i went back to the den on boxing day uh that one obviously finished nil nil and there is such an oh there was such an overwhelming feeling of kind of like negativity among the group of it's the millwall way to fall away it's just kind of a a given that they'll get themselves into a good position and then fall short the season that i covered millwall that happened because they slogged their way through this really tricky run of games in the run-in, being Sheffield United.

22:17They drew Burnley that season, who went up as champions. They were the top two. They kind of got all those tricky away games out of the way, and they were in the top six. And you looked at the run of games they had towards that season, and it was teams fighting relegation right towards the bottom, and you thought, this is a chance for Millwall finally to get into the playoffs. It hasn't happened since they returned to the championship. And then they totally wet the bed, and they won one of them. And then on the final day, all they had to do was beat Blackburn. They went 3-1 up into halftime, and they lost the game 4-3 to miss out on a playoff spot, which is one of the most horrendous games I've ever covered, like players in tears on the pitch.

22:59So when you had those scars before, it's quite natural that that feeling carries on into future campaigns. I think that over time, the way they've kept winning has changed things, and you've seen that it's changed a little bit from, well, I think we're going to fall away from the top two race. Hopefully we can be in a playoff battle to now you're seeing things and it's, why don't we give the top two? Everyone's writing us off. It's almost Ipswich-esque, as Stu mentioned earlier. They do have that and it's changed definitely over, I'd say, the last maybe four games before the Blackburn result that that mentality started to switch now and they think they can get into the top two.

23:37But yeah, we'll have to wait and see. They've got 68 points, the highest that they've had since returning to the championship in any single season has been 72. After that, it's 69, and they're on 68 already. So they're going to absolutely smash the number that they've previously built up. And they might think that might be enough. Stu, how are we doing? Are you okay to jump back in? I can talk, yeah.

24:03Stuart Watson:I've managed to get something online while AJ was talking us through Millwall. Shall we just say what's happened then? Because obviously people will be interested. Yes, Ipswich Town have just announced that two more of their games have been selected by Sky for coverage next month. One is the rearranged game at Portsmouth. Stays on the same date of Tuesday, April. Let me get this right. 14th. Slight change of kickoff time, 8pm. Not a massive deal. The big news is that that huge, and he laughs because this affects us, that huge game against Middlesbrough has been changed dates. It's now on the Sunday instead of the Saturday, and it's a 12 p.m.

24:55Stuart Watson:kick-off. I don't know how I feel about a 12 p.m. kick-off for such a gargantuan clash in terms of atmosphere and mood. I feel for the Middlesbrough fans who are going to have to get down to Suffolk for midday and it has a knock-on effect for us as well, doesn't it? It's happened again, hasn't it? We've got a big call to make, old friends because obviously Kerry Live is on the day before and the reason we had that on that day is because it was going to be after the Middlesbrough Games we could talk about it, a big game, and now that game isn't even happening until the next day so watch this space, friends as I say, we've got a bit of a quandary, a bit of a conundrum, a bit of a call to make we'll let you know as soon as soon we've had a chance to chat about it what we're going to do there the next big talking point Stu is who plays for town which is always obviously fun to talk about are you alright?