KOA Live reaction: Kieran McKenna leaves Ipswich Town

0:08Hello friends, we have a saying in newspaper business, when big things happen, the balloon goes up. Big story happens, big story happens, the balloon has gone up. And friends, it doesn't get much bigger than this. the balloon has very much gone up. Kieran McKenna has tonight left Ipswich Town after three promotions in four seasons, including two to the Premier League. He's just got Town back to the Premier League and he's decided to walk away. This is going to be a live reaction, basically. We're going to talk about a little bit about what's happened, our reaction to it. And the obvious question is, what's next?

0:48And then probably over the next couple of days, we'll do a more considered in-depth pod. This is intended just to be kind of snap reaction, our snap thoughts. First of all, Stu, you've had a much busier evening than expected. Do you want to run us through exactly what's happened? Because it's not what you'd say the traditional way of things occurring. He's not gone to Fulham. He's not gone somewhere else. He's just gone. So talk us through it. Yes, Kieran McKenna has, well, he has. He's quit as Ipswich Town Manager. He's walked away. We're still under contract for two more years. signed that lucrative new deal back in the summer of 2024 when United, Chelsea, Brighton etc were sniffing and we thought that if he was going to go this summer it would be to another club and it was looking increasingly likely externally looking in that it was going to be Fulham because his odds plummeted to five to one on yesterday there was a lot of talk in national media most notably talk sport that he was interested in that role so I think people were bracing themselves for a Kieran McKenna exit but not in this manner he's decided to to walk away there's a statement made by Kieran I haven't watched the video yet I think he's done a lot down the lens piece to camera as to why but I'll read out the statement is with a mixture of gratitude pride sadness and contentment that I've decided to step down from the honour of managing this historic football club.

2:20When you have the connection that we have built at this club, there is never a good time to say goodbye. However, having achieved a second promotion to the Premier League last season with another memorable final day in our stadium and after reflection over the last couple of weeks, I feel this is the right time for me to step aside. I do so with great pride at the incredible progress we have made and with huge hope and optimism for the future of the club so he says and we're told that it's purely down to needing a break from the game for to want to spend a bit more time with his family after giving everything of himself to this job for the last four and a half years we absolutely have to take that at face value I know there will be people that wonder is he going to pop up somewhere else?

3:12Is Fulham suddenly going to happen in the next few weeks? I have been absolutely assured that that is not in his plans. That is not the case. And importantly, Ipswich are well protected. I think they've had the legal team all over this for a little while to make sure that they're well protected. And my understanding is, you know, if he suddenly goes somewhere as much as in the next year, Ipswich Town would be due some hefty compensation As we know, there was an£8 million release clause in that contract. So that's the state of play. A lot to digest. Still getting my head around it all at the moment, as I'm sure everyone is.

3:54What's your thoughts, everyone? Well, Alex just told me before we came live that this is the first managerial departure he's ever had to cover. It's a pretty big one, AJ. McKenna walking away at six o 'clock on a Wednesday night. your first thoughts please yeah bombshell wasn't it and I think that a lot of it kind of came from that tweet from from Sky Sports from Lyle Thomas that was the first that I'd kind of seen of it having clocks off nicely at five o 'clock and then kind of a slightly weirdly worded tweet that kind of said he wasn't going to go to Fulham but there was another twist to the tale essentially alluding to that and that there was going to be more to come and I saw the clock coming near to 6 o 'clock and thought that might have been the time that we might hear more and so it proved.

4:46Yeah, a massive shock if you'd said to any of us, I'd say as recently as, what, eight hours ago, maybe even more recently than that, that, okay, Kieran McKenna leaving to go and take the Fulham job I don't think would have been seen as a huge, colossal shock by any of us, but kind of just leaving is the bit that maybe leaves fans with more questions than answers. And I can understand definitely the aspect of him getting now an opportunity to spend more time with his family, with his young children, having worked incredibly hard. Like football's a tough job when you're working in management with the amount that you have to give and the fact that he's done that with one club going through so much in a relatively short space of time, the transformation that's come with that.

5:36So I think like everyone, absolutely wishing the best. But I think, again, like everyone, like us four and like everyone in the comments, it's definitely a feeling of shock more than anything. Yeah, Ross, you've been a town fan for longer than all of us. How are you feeling? McKenna has been the best manager you've seen at town. I think that's fair to say. Obviously, Burley was pretty good as well. But he's no more. He's walked away. Just as he's got the Blues back in the Premier League, he's gone. How are you feeling?

6:11Ross Halls:Yeah, first word is shock, really. Obviously, it wasn't the news. We've been dreading the potential departure. But yeah, incredible. It's not been that many town managers that have quit the job. I think, you know, Ramsey went to England, Bobby went to England, and I think Joe Royal is another manager who technically quit, like mutual consent-wise. We've just been seeing managers get sacked. Funny enough, when I first started this job, it was when Paul Hurst got sacked. And I remember you coming over to me and saying, oh, by the way, you've got the job because we need you because Paul Ambert's about to get appointed as Paul Hurst's replacement because he's just been sacked.

6:58Ross Halls:So that was my first experience of a manager sacking. And we've had, of course, Paul Ambert sacked, Paul Cook sacked, Kieran McKenna coming in. And what a journey this football club has been on since he got appointed back in 2021, Kieran McKenna. And we can all say we've had the opportunity to report it was time in the Premier League, which we probably know for. Stu, when he first started covering the club, probably wasn't expecting that. Of course, we've got Premier League football again this season coming up. But yeah, the first thing is just shock and wish him all the best because he's created generations of memories for many town fans.

7:41Yeah. Stu, clearly you spent a lot of time with Kieran McKenna. This is unusual in that it's very rare that a manager just walks away, especially when he's just got a club promoter to the Premier League. We have to take it on face value that he's not walking away to go somewhere else. Is that quite a Kieran McKenna thing to do, do you think? He seems to be a guy who's very logical, very analytical. He wants to do things the right way. Clearly, he's a family man as well. What's your assessment of the way this has happened, knowing what you know about Kieran? I'd love to sit down. with him and talk about it in hopefully the not too distant future to really delve into that but just while you were talking i was getting a picture here which our photographer steve waller took on the pitch after promotion was achieved in may last month there's kieran there with his wife his children his brother his parents um and i think when when we when you read that statement And again, as I say, we have to take that at face value when he talks about wanting to spend a bit of time with his family now.

8:52And we discussed it on a recent podcast, didn't we, about how Kieran had moved up to, what was he, top five longest serving managers across the English divisions after, you know, Pep lasting 10 years at Manchester City is not normal. managers lasting nearly five years at clubs is not normal in this modern day and age. And he's an absolute football obsessive, Kieran McKenna. And I know that having, you know, maybe spent more time with him than most. And it must just take everything from him. and I could see that on the pitch, certainly on the Monday with the Open Top Bus celebrations. I was lucky enough to be on that bus.

9:42And when he sort of soaked up all the adulation and that bus pulled in back at the stadium and everyone kind of filtered off, he looked drained and he said, I'm ready for a holiday. and don't underestimate that you know it's uh so it's a luxury that not many people get within this this volatile business to kind of walk away on their terms and and maybe as much as i'm my instinct my first instinct my first reaction was was to be absolutely gutted and feel really sad because he's the best manager that i've worked with on a on a personal note in terms of what he's delivered but maybe it's it's right that it ends on a happy note on a high and that you know his legacy is fully locked in now can never be tainted going forwards um i think that's where my emotions sit at this moment in time i think as i think about it i think i'd agree with you the fact that he hasn't left to go to another club the fact he said right now is the time i've I've got the team back in the Premier League and now I need to take a step away for myself and my family.

10:54That feels like a nice way to do things. Yeah, well, the cynic would go, well, deep down, is there partly a football decision here? Has he got doubts to how competitive this team or what's required to make it competitive again? And has he got half a mind on thinking, if I get another relegation on my CV, where does that leave my stock, my reputation? I don't want to be having those conversations at this moment in time I want this to be a celebratory moment of what Kieran has done for this football club and you're right if he'd have gone to Fulham that would have felt slightly sour because we'd have been debating well is it a sideways move why has he left Ipswich for Fulham and we'd be having that debate if he'd have stayed on and they'd gone back down again suddenly it's three promotions versus two relegations and it's a slightly different conversation around him.

11:46So I was reminded by someone of the Batman quote, the Dark Knight quote of better to, was it better to leave a hero than stay and end up the villain? Become the villain, exactly. Yeah, it's perfect, isn't it? Yeah. I'm gutted because I felt like there was another chapter in this story to write, but I can understand it and I can be comfortable with it. And as I say, legacy locked in, which is... Absolutely. He's not leaving us to someone else. He's leaving us for a little break. You know, he stepped away and I'm sure we'll see him again in future. And then we'll all want him to do very well wherever he turns up and we'll have the highest expectations for him.

12:30Before I come to Alex for the inevitable question, which is what comes next, Stuart, I just want to ask you a penny for Mark Ashton's thoughts, because obviously his summer has now taken a very sharp diversion. I'm sure he was thinking, we're building towards the Premier League. We've got this, that and the other. We've got the scouting networks. We've got targets. We've got this. Oh, now I need a new manager. Now, clearly, I know he's a prepared man. He'll have lists and this, that and the other. But how do you think he'll be feeling this evening? I'm sure he's probably processed the same emotions that we're all going through now, but just a little bit further in advance.

13:08This is a bombshell news story to us, but these conversations, I'm sure, will have been going on for quite a while behind the scenes. He and others at the club will have convinced Kieran to stay on, but ultimately what's underpinned the cultural success of this club is I often hear the phrase doing the right thing while others aren't looking. and I know people throw Farage Gate into the mix here, but parking that, Ipswich have tried to do well by people at the club. The way the Connor Chaplin exit was handled, the way several player exits have been handled along the way, if you've delivered for this football club, they won't stand in your way when the time is right, if the reason for exiting is for the right reasons.

13:59And that's the sense here with Kieran McKenna. And Mark Ashton, for a long time, has always insisted to me and others that there is a plan in place, that this day would come inevitably at some point and Ipswich would be prepared for it. And his data dashboard includes managers as well as players. He's a man that prides himself on giving young managers their first chance in the game. Aidy Boothroyd, Brendan Rodgers, Kieran McKenna now. Whether he goes down that route again as a Premier League club would be a big risk, and we can have those conversations shortly. But he will have been monitoring the market, monitoring the managerial merry-go-round.

14:44Dare I say, quiet feelers go out from time to time just to see who might be available and who might be interested. So this isn't going to catch up to which town cold. I can say that much. Yeah, I'm going to come back to you, Stu, because I know you're compiling a list of considered runners and riders, but AJ, you're a man with lists. You may not have had this list on your bingo board for this evening. We are getting names, obviously, as we're talking, flashing into the chats. There's one man that's appearing more than any at the moment, which is Mr. Frank, a man who's just said that he's not going anywhere.

15:20He wants a break from management as well. Obviously, he was initially linked to Fulham. um but i've heard liam rosina as well uh what as we sit here at what is it 25 past seven so an hour and a half after it's been announced yeah what are you thinking in terms of uh next man up as it were i like how the comments currently debating gareth southgate that's um a fun start to this one i'm trying to find it someone said uh i'll have gareth southgate someone else has said had a report that that sounds good um before i come on to that i think the one thing i do want to say as well as we talk about this being the right time for kieran mckenna to to leave in a way that he's done it on a high he's not tainted his legacy and the memories are going to be of the promotion and beating norwich and um all of those kind of things but as well he leaves at a time that is quite good let's be honest for ripswich it's at the beginning of the summer where preparations obviously are in place, but you haven't gone and signed all of, say, the players that he would have wanted in the Premier League next season.

16:30It comes at a point that the club have just been promoted back to the Premier League rather than, let's say, 12 months ago after relegation. So all of a sudden, the names that you're looking at and look at the ones that we're talking about here are very different to the ones that maybe we would have been discussing 12 months ago about who could lead Ipswich Town into the Championship. So this is a really attractive job. It's an attractive job with a new training ground that opens in a couple of months, roughly, isn't it? It's an attractive job where whoever is going to come in is going to have a lot of money to go and strengthen the squad, who's probably going to be paid quite well as well.

17:08Shall we talk some names then? The first thing to say is that I don't think we've really heard too much in terms of reliable stuff ourselves, given the fact this news only broke about an hour and a half ago. TalkSport have mentioned that the two that you brought up there, Gary O 'Neill and Liam Resenia. And I think that a lot of the runners and riders that you've seen from the other odds lists are going to be in the mix. A Sean Dyche, a Thomas Frank, managers of that kind of profile who, let's be honest as well, Ipswich wouldn't have dreamed of being able to appoint a few years ago. So I think it's going to be that kind of level.

17:46there'll be managers within work there'll be managers out of work there's definitely going to be I think some who maybe haven't necessarily cut at the very highest level like a Liam Rossini who still would fancy and would be back to do a job at a solid Premier League side so I think there needs to be a mixture of realism with where Ipswich are at Pep Guardiola's not going to be in the dugout at Portman Road at least in the home dugout next year but at the same time realizing that it's a big job and and i'd say that someone with a fairly strong reputation will get it i'm really interested to see if it's going to be one of these kind of favorites that we talk about or um maybe a piece to come that i've started working on there's could they go down the left field route i've got a list of names possibly that um could be a little bit uh a little bit out there as well but i know stew's kind of been focusing on on the more likely candidates let's say yeah rossi i know you've got your your ear to the floor or rather ear to the phone with the fans um they will surely be

18:52Ross Halls:now talking about who's coming next it is that is the brutality of football isn't it right he's gone who are we getting next and how does it how does it affect who we're going to sign this summer so can you offer thoughts on who you might like to see and who you think or at least the feedback you're getting from fans thus far? Is there a consensus as to who they want realistically next? Yeah, there's loads of names out there. I think a lot of people were likely in Rossini a few years back, I think before the Chelsea gig, but because of some of his interviews and some of his Brent-isms, I think a lot of people are going away from that.

19:25Ross Halls:It's a very rare position, though, for the club to be in because there's only ever been 19 permanent managers in the club's history. There's other football clubs, they get a new manager every bloody month. So it's just a weird position as fans to be in, especially when it's been five years of Kieran McKenna. But yeah, Graham Potter is one that's sort of been put out there. Of course, he's currently managing and managing Swedish national team will be at the World Cup. Sean Dyche is one maybe in terms of experienced manager. That could be an option. It's just the debate is, do you want someone who knows what it is, what it takes to stay in the Premier League?

20:06Ross Halls:Do you want a young, hungry manager, just like Kieran McKenna, in his first job, which is a big risk when you're going in the Premier League? But some clubs have done that. Like Brentford, fair play to Keith Andrews. He's done a fantastic job there. Do you get a foreign, sexy name? That would be fun for us to sort of do that. But I'm sure Mark Cashin's got a list and he's out of the list prior to Kieran McKenna doing this. And yeah, I hope he's got an ace up his sleeve because he has to make a right appointment because if it's not, then it's going to be interesting. Yeah, obviously Ashton nailed, absolutely nailed the appointment of Kieran McKenna.

20:49Plucked him out of nowhere. Clearly the diehards in football will have known who he was, but most of us just went, who the hell is that? Never heard of him. And he's gone on and done what he's done. in terms of names i know you've got a list of names you've already compiled do you think he's more likely to go down the the frank the big ang you know the experience campaign have been there done it or do you think he's going to be more looking at someone like mckenna like a younger manager um extremely progressive thoughtful analytical kind of new ideas what do you reckon uh gut feeling and it is just a gut feeling at the moment is it will have to be a kind of halfway house between those two i think going full-on first managerial gig um alan mckenna is probably too big a risk given given where rips which are at the one name that springs to mind for me that i've kind of thought about for a little while in that category is anthony barry who is the england assistant manager that's followed he's got an incredible cv in terms of he's followed Thomas Tuchel, he's been at Bayern Munich, he worked with Roberto Martinez at Portugal and Belgium as well, he's been with the Republic of Ireland before but and he's 40 years old and I'm sure he will take his first steps into management at some point but he's away at the World Cup at the moment and time is of the essence canips which wait until you know towards the end of July before appointing an Amanda and that similar situation with Graham Potter who's with Sweden with Potichino I don't think would I think he's one that would be out of reach for Ipswich who's with the United States so I think that probably puts that aside so in terms of halfway house ones I don't know quite who who falls into that category I think it's someone that's got to have a little bit of experience but isn't necessarily the sort of dyed in the wool alpha experienced manager, someone that Mark Ashton will feel that he can work with.

22:55You've mentioned it, Gary O 'Neill there. He's managed in the Premier League with both Bournemouth and Wolves recently, currently at Strasbourg. Steve Cooper, who got Forrest up, kept Forrest up, didn't last long at Leicester. Ole Gunnar Solskjaer is an interesting shout-out. I've seen his name pop up. If Kieran McKenna is asked who he thinks should replace him, and I think that his opinion will be taken into account, much like Paul Jewell, I think, recommended Mick McCarthy as his replacement. If you go back several years, I'm sure his good mate, Oli, is going to be sort of at the forefront. They worked very closely together alongside Michael Carrick at Man United.

23:35Solskjaer, okay, didn't do great at Cardiff as the start of a manager, but I think he led Man United to two top four finishes in consecutive seasons. there, Sackbay, Besiktas most recently there's loads of names in there that I could throw around I've got a list that I can pull together Sean Dyche, Ange Postacoglu you've mentioned these sort of certainly in the Dyche side of things probably the most pragmatic option of all come in, just establish Ipswich in the Premier League what names are floating your boat? what route do you want to see Ipswich go down? I'm fascinated to see what your opinions are, what the general consensus is out there among supporters.

24:20There doesn't seem to be a consensus. There's a lot of names being mentioned. I suppose the one that's being mentioned most in terms of positively would be Frank. He's ruled himself out. I think it's important to say that. And again, we have to take him at his word. He's released a statement recently saying, I will not be returning to management this summer. I'm enjoying my work-life balance since getting sacked by Tottenham. When was that? Was that this calendar year, back end of the previous one last season, that he, like McKenna, is enjoying a break from the game, having some time with his family.

24:56He's going to do some punditry stuff around the World Cup is his plan. He wants to go and have some more varied experiences, go and watch other coaching sessions all around the world and come back refreshed. so he has said he's not coming back this summer um so i think we can pretty much rule thomas frank out let me ask you then aj who would you like um so i'm going to take this if you said from really my perspective here because i think it will be box office in so many ways and postocoglu goes very very quickly to the top of that list I would just love that from a journalist perspective and I think it'd be good fun on the pitch as well Do you think that's realistic?

25:41No, I would say it would probably not be realistic I'd say if you said what's the percentage chance of that happening I'd be somewhere between 20 and 30 So in terms of Postacoglu having higher ambitions than Ipswich is that what you think sort of rules that out? yeah I would say so I think that as well I think there's a few factors there I think that he's done a lot of prem work and I think he also seems to be one of those people that is enjoying the punditry side and having a break I do think that um when you look at the jobs that he's had I know Forrest was a disaster but it was always going to be a disaster he'd been at Tottenham before that at Celtic um look it's certainly possible but would he would he want to take over at a team that will He'll be, rightly or wrongly again, among the bookies favourites for relegation at this point in his career.

26:36I don't know. What do I think is kind of the most realistic middle ground? I'll say it again. I think Resenia is probably the one that stands out to me in that he'll be hungry to prove that the Chelsea job was kind of not the right fit from a profile perspective rather than anything to do with him as a manager. And I think that was the case in that I think that he would be a closer fit as a person to what Ipswich would want compared to Chelsea, where you need to be an ego, a personality, ruthless. And I'm not sure that that's the kind of side that Liam Rossini is. And I think that maybe, and I know he's going to be an unpopular pick for a lot of people, maybe he would be more suited to an Ipswich town job.

27:24And I know there's people who are saying they wouldn't like a Liam Rossini, for example, but plenty of people would have taken him 12 months ago if McKenna had left at that point, even if the club was still in the Premier League, I would argue. And one poor spell at a football club does not decide whether you're a good manager or a bad manager at all. And I think that you do have to look at some of the good stuff that he has done elsewhere. So he's still one that, although I probably wouldn't be towards the top of my list, wouldn't be someone that I'm against in any way. I think that he's going to be more among that profile.

28:02And again, I've spoken about the left field options. I'm not sure necessarily that we're going to suddenly see a La Liga manager leave his job to come to Portman Road. I've got a list of them that might, but I don't know how feasible that will be. As Stuart said, I think the most realistic thing is going to be somewhere in the middle. Ange would be the one that I'd like, as I've mentioned. But I certainly think that Towne could do worse than the Emre Senior at the same time. Ross, you were pulling quite a few faces when AJ was speaking. Thanks, Ross. I think that was linked to... I mean, he does it normally.

28:37But I think that was linked to Rose Senior, was it? That's more Ange, to be fair.

28:42Ross Halls:That's more Ange. That was Ange. Okay. Are you not having him? No. I know he won a trophy for Spurs for the first time in how many years, but... Could you imagine him just fundamentally destroying me in every press conference? It would be great. I mean, Kieran had some of the odd barbs that came my way. I think Ange Postacoglu would literally, like, just tear me in half. You're sensitive, Sol. You're sensitive. I know, I know. But I think it would be good fun for the viewers, nonetheless. I'm not sure Ashton's going to base it on that, if I'm honest. We can only hope that he's listening. Other factors.

29:18Who's going to come in and rip AJ a new one? we're having a lot of conversations about how Ipswich need to be more pragmatic in their approach to kind of digging themselves into the Premier League this time around Ange Postacoglu is not that man it's kamikaze football it's defence playing right up on the halfway line and you know you talk about him being unrealistic I think it'd be well within reach for ripswich he's got some damage reputation uh some reputation reputational damage to undo after you know how it ended at tottenham albeit with the trophy you know we're in a bit of a relegation battle there um and then lasting what 39 days at nottingham forest um so he wouldn't be my choice, but I think he would be within reach.

30:11Yeah.

30:12Ross Halls:Any other names you want to discuss? What's he actually done? Ange? Won a bunch of trophies at Celtic, which is easy to sort of poo-poo now, but they have just, you know, they just about managed to ward off Aberdeen this season, but yeah. Hart. and also I mean you can say what you want about that being a free pass to a trophy Tottenham have been allergic to trophies and now I know what will be said about how they were in the league and that would obviously be a concern but he also took a Tottenham team that was allergic to any form of success and gave them one of the best nights that they've had and a lot of the fans were pretty upset to see him leave I'm interested in the dynamic of who Ashton might be looking at?

31:05Because do you think he would bring in a manager like Ang Prostokoglu? Because Ang is going to come in. He's all blood and guts and thunder. He's the alpha dog. You know, I've been there. I've done it. Or you said earlier, Ashton probably wants someone who's a little bit more kind of mouldable and that kind of younger. Yeah, I think. And I think history shows that. I don't think he's going to want a big ego style manager to potentially clash with along the way. Andropos de Coglu speaks his mind.