Confederate Memorial at Arlington Cemetery Expected to Return

0:03Tonight, President Trump goes on an AI meme spree right before he's set to host his big midterm convention, but many Republicans are quietly signaling he's focusing on the wrong thing. Plus, Trump's push to rewrite history turns to Arlington National Cemetery. The Confederate Memorial poised to go back up and the context about it that's been taken down. And jurors from the Lindsay Clancy trial speak out for the first time and reveal their thoughts about the lone holdout. That's tonight on Lara Coats Live.

0:43My opening statement tonight, when you're in the home stretch and you're trying to win, it's supposed to be crunch time. You got to be laser focused. I'm talking eye on the prize. So here we are with the midterms less than two months from now and control of the House and the Senate are at stake. And President Trump is about to bring the cavalry to Texas to try to save his majority in Congress. He is headlining a two-day GOP convention that he says is going to be hot. You'd think that would maybe be focusing on one of the hottest issues Americans say they care most about, the cost of living. But then he spent the holiday weekend filling his social media feed with AI slop and internet memes, and not just a little bit.

1:30And this was an avalanche. I'm talking more than 100 posts. He went on about wanting to rename New Mexico to New America. Not once, not twice, people. I'm talking nine times. And then he turned north, taunting Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney and posted this image, showing the stars and stripes stretched across North America. But the fight with Canada, well, that's not just memes. That trade war, it's escalating. Canada's retaliatory tariffs on American goods took effect today. Some Republican candidates are warning Trump's tariffs will only make things more expensive in their states. I still think imposing new tariffs on Canada is a mistake.

2:21And we've actually passed out of the House, with much of my participation in leadership, taking away the tariffs on Canada. I don't think it's the right thing to pick a trade war with Canada. And the posts, they got weirder, like this one. The president reminding voters that his administration took a 10 % stake in intel, which is interesting considering how often Trump uses the socialism attack line against Democrats. And members of his own party have turned to that same word for some of Trump's own policies. Really, it is heading in the direction of what socialism is, which would be owning all of the means of production.

3:02I don't care if it's a dollar or a billion dollar stake in an American country. That starts feeling like a semi-state-owned enterprise a la CCCP. At the end of the day, if we end up with the federal government having equity shares, ownership stakes in the biggest companies of America, that is socialism. Now, I'm not going to expend time trying to explain the rest of Trump's bizarre posts, like this AI meme showing Trump as the Green Lantern, or the dystopian image of the president with a bunch of robin. But here's what doesn't need much explaining. Trump has told voters to pretend that he's on the ballot in November.

3:51Now he's holding a GOP midterm convention where he is at the center, which is a huge risk. Some of the biggest headwinds the GOP is facing were created by the president himself. And several Republicans who are actually on the ballot are deciding their time is better spent somewhere else. I am busy this week. Well, unfortunately, I have a family obligation, so I won't be able to be there. I had stuff already planned in my congressional district or I would be there. Are you going to attend that convention? I go right back to my focus is on the district. I'll be in the district traveling across the district.

4:30Are you planning to go to the Republican convention next week? I'm planning to be in my district. Are you going to the Republican convention next week? Thinking about it. Are you going to the Republican convention next week? I have to be in the district because I have events. I've got a great team of political experts to start us off tonight. former Democratic congressman from New York, Joe Crowley, executive editor of The Washington Examiner, Bob Cusack, Washington bureau chief for the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, Tia Mitchell, and senior congressional reporter for Punchbowl News, Andrew Desiderio.

4:59Thank you all so much for being here. Someone's gonna be in the district, she says, because she has events, right? So are we. Let's talk about this event, Tia. What do Republicans actually want voters to try to take away from that convention? So I think it's a couple of things. A, I think there are Republicans who are on the ballot who know that people paid a lot of money to go to this convention and they want to be in the room with the people with the money. So that's one of the reasons to go. They're also trying to raise money that they can spend on candidates outside of the district. Some of it is just fundraising.

5:30Right. But then on messaging, which is what most people at home will be consuming, it's going to be twofold. A, it's going to be painting Democrats and their policies as wrong for America, as headed in the line towards socialism. And of course, the other part is celebrating Donald Trump. I don't think we can downplay how much we expect Trump and his policies and his agenda to be a focus all day long, Wednesday and Thursday. Well, that's interesting, of course, because a lot of the inflicted wounds that Republicans have complained about have come from some of his statements that have gone off message, to say the least.

6:08And, Bob, some of the party's veteran strategists, they're worried, to say the least, about him being front and center, not just criticizing Democrats. Here is the former Bush White House adviser, Karl Rove, who earlier today said this. Well, I'm a little bit nervous about it because, look, we're in the final stages of the campaign. I'd be more comfortable if this had been held in June or July and set a thematic that could be pursued for four months or five months rather than for 56 days. The White House is pushing a big bet. It's like we're at the tables. They're pushing all the chips on, saying we if we make this about Donald Trump and if we make it about Donald Trump's record and put him at the center of this, then we've got a shot to pull this thing.

6:50You know what I hear when he says that I need time after maybe the cleanup if there was an issue about what he said at the convention. I need more time after he actually speaks. I mean, is it the timeline or who's the focus? Well, Trump's going to be the focus. And a lot of these candidates and these members, they want some of that Trump money. And if you show up, maybe you can lobby him personally to get some of that$400 million that he has. But can they get to him, though, to do that? Yes, I mean, some of them can. You know how he takes everyone's phone calls. But overall, this is a problem.

7:20And Karl Rove's saying he's a little worried. I mean, he's a lot worried. And these are not the headlines that they want. Iran, tariffs. They want to be talking about the big, beautiful bill. The other thing that Republicans really haven't laid out because politics are about the future, what would they do? What would be H.R. 1? What would be the first bill in the House and or the Senate if they keep power? They want to talk about the big, beautiful bill. They're not talking about it because Iran is just sucking all the oxygen out. What would they do next year? We don't know. And honestly, we don't know what Democrats would do for the most part.

7:49Well, that's part of the issue that voters have generally, right? They think to themselves, do you want me to show up at the polls to vote against something or for something in particular? And if it is the for something, what do you got for me? Yeah, exactly. So Democrats right now are using the midterms as an anti-Trump effort, right? They don't want to have the battles that they're about to have in 2028 about the future of their party and what their nominee should embody. They're having that right now, though, too, right? Well, yeah, exactly. They don't want to be is the point, right? You saw the Michigan Senate Democratic primary between Haley Stevens and Abdul El-Sayed.

8:23You've got this issue now about, well, will Haley Stevens' voters even show up in November, or will some of them even vote for Mike Rogers, the Republican candidate? And if it had been on the flip side, you would have had progressives maybe not show up for Haley Stevens. And so that is the risk that Democrats run. And I do want to emphasize that, you know, with Republicans, talk about, you know, day one issue, what is HR1 going to be? The president has made clear he wants it to be the Save America Act. He is not stopping talking about that issue, right? And it is dividing the party. They're supposed to be uniting.

8:56They're supposed to be talking about, as Bob said, the big, beautiful bill. John Thune goes to the Senate floor almost every single day when they're in session, talks about how great this is, and nobody listens. And he understands why nobody listens. And it's because the president is talking about completely different things, like the things he's doing on the White House grounds and beautifying D.C. Well, you know what? In Texas, they want them to listen to you. This has been fascinating to me, perhaps all the wrong reasons. And that is the strategy and the tactics that are being used to get people to listen, to try to focus.

9:28And there's this fully AI generated ad. Have you guys seen this with Tal Rico down at the Paxton did? I mean, he's a Republican Senate candidate down in Texas, And he released this attack ad that recreates, want to be careful, it recreates several past remarks from James Tallarico. Watch. In the beginning, God was non-binary and he wasn't a Christian. And God said, let there be six genders. And there were. Then God so loved the world that he gave us his only son who was a radical feminist and never asked people to worship him. Look, I always think of myself as a Christian who hates Christianity.

10:08James Tallarico, wrong for Texas. America is not a Christian nation. And wrong for America, too. I'm Ken Paxton, and I approve this message. Oh, sorry, I had to wait for him to approve the message. Okay, but if you squint and, like, turn your eye, there was supposed to be a disclaimer. AI was supposed to be there. That's not clear. It's very confusing. It's problematic, I think, in terms of voter transparency. But this tactic being used, I mean, if his real life comments are so horrible, why not just play his comments, give people the context? And look, there's a reason why this has happened. This event is happening in Texas.

10:41It could have been held anywhere else. It's in Texas. They're trying to bring enthusiasm to Paxton's election, to the governor's election as well, because they know they're in trouble in Texas. I mean, it's really hard to believe that they're actually in trouble in Texas of all states. And so when you're using AI, when you're lying about someone's record, especially in something that's so critically important to one's being in terms of their faith, that's a really low blow. And using AI to do that is just another example, I think, of how far this White House and the Republican Party will go to try to destroy someone's integrity.

11:17I mean, what do you guys think about this in terms of its effectiveness on voters? Because there's always a concern that voters are not going to be tuned in 24-7, looking at every detail of everything. And voters are smart, but some might be turning a blind eye or might not realize the extent of the deception. That's problematic. And it should not be done, but here it is on full display. Well, you know, just a year ago, the NRSC tried to do this with some of my own reporting. When I interviewed Chuck Schumer during the long government shutdown last year, he said, every day gets better for us. It was a famous quote that he said that Republicans pounced on immediately because they said, well, what do you mean every day gets better for us?

12:01Every day the shutdown goes on, it gets worse for real Americans, right? And the NRSC created an AI version of Chuck Schumer saying that quote. They actually approached us and asked if we would share the audio. And of course, we said, no, we're not in the business of helping any political campaign in any of this. And they said, we don't need you. We'll get it anyway. They went forward with it anyway because they could, essentially, right? Because the technology allows them to and our laws allow them to. And the risk you were concerned about, though, go ahead. But they need these tactics because their candidate is so flawed.

12:32He is such a flawed, corrupt candidate. He was impeached by his own legislature. You know, so maybe that's become more acceptable today that, you know, someone who was accused of the things that he was doing. Well, I mean, obviously impeached candidates are acceptable to some people. I mean, it worked out for someone in the Oval Office, right? Especially the highest. Yeah, exactly. So but I do think it's reflective of the fact that he is the numbers are so close that Tallarica was a real threat to the majority for Republicans in the U.S. Senate. I will say I think people at home, when they see these types of ads that are they're kind of obviously AI, you know what I mean?

13:12And I think it causes a lot of people to roll their eyes. And I do think it's interesting that this the theme of this ad is Tallarico's Christianity, when Christianity was such a big part of Paxton's rise. And now is one of the big ways he gets attacked because people say he's not living up to the own values. he's stated in some of his controversies. But I think when people are watching at home, the ad at the end of the day doesn't speak to what they want the candidates to be talking about, which is the cost of groceries and the cost of gas at the gas pump. And diesel. And actually, I interviewed two Texas voters who were lifelong Republicans, and they're not voting Republican because of the data centers.

13:54They're mad about data centers in Texas, and they were mad also about the idea of child subsidies and what was going on there in child care and beyond. And this ad doesn't get to that, but they think it's persuasive. Could it be? I don't think this ad is very persuasive. I really don't. And I think you look back to 2024 and Democrats were talking about, well, listen, this election is about democracy. It wasn't about democracy. It was about affordability. And we're still talking about affordability. And the candidates who are talking about that, whether that's the Democrats in Iowa, they're doing very well in a red state, or Ohio, and they could pull some upsets.

14:30Listen, the Texas governor's race is also fairly close. That is not a definite win for Abbott. So this is a real problem to what Joe said. They're hoping to get some type of bounce. But remember, they're going against the NFL tomorrow and Thursday. And a lot of people are watching the NFL. And 9-11 anniversary this week. Yeah. Yes, they are. And also, what was that commercial, the Mike, Mike, Mike? You hear that whole hump day commercial about the NFL on Wednesday? Sorry, it's now in everyone's mind. I had to watch it. You've got to hear about it. And Texas is the ATM for wealthy Republican donors, as John Cornyn always says.

15:03That's another reason why it's important for Republicans to host this in Texas, where they can tap into that ATM. And I guarantee you, John Cornyn is going to be involved, and he's going to be tapping into his own fundraising network, which is very vast over the 20-some years he's been in the Senate. ATM or Texas A &M? No answer. Thank you, everyone. Thank you so much. Still ahead, the administration's mission to recast history, turning its attention to Arlington National Cemetery, where tonight a disclaimer about the Confederacy? No longer. Malcolm Nance has a lot to say about this, and he joins me next.

15:41And later, the answer to the question so many people wanted to know, what exactly were the Lindsey Clancy jurors thinking before they deadlocked? And the standalone juror was not the only one that was unwilling to see things from the other side.

16:01I'm Dr. Sanjay Gupta, host of the Chasing Life podcast. We get to talk to the men's winner of the New York City Marathon. Andreas Almgren, he's a self-coached 31-year-old who was, get this, making his marathon debut. He never ran a marathon before he won it. If someone wanted to start getting serious about running and they wanted to approach it like a data scientist like you do, how would you suggest they start? Be patient. My peak weeks, I ran like 140, 150 miles per week or something. Wow. Either increase the distance or you should increase the intensity. You should never increase both at the same time.

16:41Listen to Chasing Life, streaming now wherever you get your podcasts.

16:48Well, the Trump administration is rolling back the clock to the Confederacy with a new memorial it's restoring at Arlington National Cemetery, a memorial to Confederate soldiers that was removed back in 2023. Well, that's going back up. The Defense Department also took down a plaque that explained why the monument was taken down. It said the memorial, quote, offered a, quote, nostalgic mythologized vision of the Confederacy, including highly sanitized depictions of slavery. Now, the memorial was taken down after a recommendation by a bipartisan congressional mandated naming commission. But now the memorial is set to return next year to those hallowed burial grounds.

17:36My next guest has a lot to say about that. With me now, retired senior chief petty officer, author, and host of the Black Man Spy podcast on Substack, Malcolm Nance. Malcolm, it's good to see you. Why do you think the administration is so obsessed with bringing back these Confederate monuments and artifacts, especially at military sites?

18:04Well, let's just be honest. This administration has a worldview in which some of those views that were embraced by the Confederacy and the post-Confederacy, particularly this monument, which was established in 1914, is they call it reconciliation. Its real name was the Confederacy Monument, and it was to honor the sacrifice of the Confederacy, which was straight up treason. The United States soldiers left the U.S. Armed Forces, like Robert E. Lee at West Point, his commandant at West Point, went to their respective states, took up arms against the Constitution of the United States, wrote their own constitution in order to enshrine slavery.

18:47Now, this administration seems to think that all of history since the Civil War, which was wrong, let's just be honest, needs to be reestablished in order to assuage the feelings of people who come from the South. That's why this monument was built with all of its horrible images on there. And that's why it was taken down in 2023. But we're restoring the Confederacy again. You know, especially the fact this is happening in a military site, given obviously the implications of the civil war, it's mind blowing to people, particularly there, if not for many of the other reasons you've spoken about.

19:28But history is on full display and maybe being sanitized for the reasons you have described. And the head of the Smithsonian, he is resigning, Malcolm, after really there were relentless attacks from the president. Lonnie Bunch told The New York Times, quote, I have to be honest. Right. It's been stressful. At a certain point, I'd like to wake up in the morning and not look at my cell phone. Now, he has tried to protect the Smithsonian from Trump's attacks and rollbacks. And I am wondering, like many people who frequent the museums, who know about its place in our society and why it's important.

20:05What happens to the museum now?

20:12Well, like many other institutions in the United States government, it's being sort of literally whitewashed. Look, history is not a matter of color. It's a question of respecting the facts as they occurred, as we interpret them using the best knowledge and intellect that we have. That is not what's happening here. We are removing knowledge and intellect away from our institutions in an effort to pursue an agenda. The Trump administration claims that liberalism, wokeism was pursuing an agenda. Well, history is naturally liberal. It's naturally woke. And it's progressive because that's what moving forward really is.

20:54He just hates those words without understanding the meaning of those words. Arlington Cemetery was Robert E. Lee's house. When he committed treason by leaving West Point, taking Southern cadets with him, taking up arms against the Union, against the Constitution of the United States, he forfeited his property. Now it is a cemetery. It started as a Union cemetery in the Civil War. But to go back and honor people who killed the men in that cemetery for their own treason, for what they think of as the southern lost cause, the great lost cause, which was to make money off of enslaved people. They even enshrined those images on the monument.

21:39And let me tell you one thing about that monument. I've seen that monument before. I used to live in D.C. I would go to Arlington often. The depiction of the black woman with the child for the Confederate soldier, Confederate officer, kissing the baby with another child holding its legs. Here's what history is. The probability that those children are mixed race children is exceptionally high for every white child that they had. They had at least three mixed race children. The same thing with the gun bearer following behind the officer. The Confederates did not take black gun bearers for one reason.

22:14They didn't want them to defect and go to the North. My great-great-grandfather and his brother did just that. They ran away from slavery, joined the 111th U.S. Colored Troops, and fought for the Constitution of the United States. He didn't join the traitors. Imagine that, honoring those who fought for the Constitution as opposed to reconstructing ones who did not. Malcolm Nance, thank you so much. Yeah. It is my pleasure. Still ahead, the former New York City mayor, Rudy Giuliani. He is leading a push to try and pressure the current mayor, Zora Mamdani, into not attending the city's 9-11 ceremony.

22:59This is President Trump shares a very specific 9-11 story that had the fact checkers working overtime today. And later, the Lindsay Clancy jurors speaking out about the deliberations we were all wondering about and shedding some new light about the lone holdout at the center of the mistrial. You morally and legally cannot convict somebody for that. And that was therefore a violation of her constitutional rights.

23:32Just days from now, New York City will mark 25 years. 25 years since 9-11 with the annual remembrance ceremony at Ground Zero. And today, a group of politicians and family members of victims gathered to send this message to Mayor Zoran Mamdani. Don't come. I am demanding that he not show his face at that sacred ground. He does not belong there. When you associate yourself with the likes of Hassan Pica. Even though there's going to be other politicians there, these are the politicians that helped us push beneficial laws through and literally held our hand during that time. Mayor Mamdani has not shown any of that, none of it.

24:27We should point out, much of the backlash Mamdani is receiving has been slammed as Islamophobic. He also took heat for signing a 9-11 proclamation and passing a pen to his chief legal counsel, Ramzi Kassam, who once represented a member of al-Qaeda. But the mayor of New York City traditionally does attend the Ground Zero Memorial every single year. It has always been a nonpartisan event honoring the victims, honoring the first responders. And Mamdani says he has every intention of being there. I'm proud to be the mayor of this city. I love this city. I love this country. And what I want this week to be a focus on is on the families whose loved ones were stolen from them 25 years ago in the horrific act of terror of September 11th.

25:19And a focus also on the first responders who gave everything they could to this city and to the people who came together to try and help their fellow New Yorkers. Former Congressman Joe Crowley, he is back with me. He represented New York City in Congress during 9-11. And he introduced the 9-11 Heroes Medal of Valor Act. You know, his first cousin was a first responder who lost his life that day. FDNY Battalion Chief John Moran. Congressman, thank you for being here. I'm sorry to learn that about your experience and your family's loss. 25 years has gone by, and it feels for so many of us so much more recent and raw.

26:02Do you think that the backlash that the mayor is facing, is it fair? I think that the emotions that people feel on this anniversary are very complex in many respects. And I want to be respectful of everyone in terms of their emotions. And this event, it didn't just affect those immediate families. It affected them the most, maybe in terms of their loss, but affected every New Yorker, every American. It was a worldwide event of terror. And so I'm very empathetic towards those people who've lost their loved ones. And I pray that some way they find solace in this 25th anniversary as well. And again, I can maybe understand some where they're coming from.

26:54I don't agree with everything the mayor stands for. I didn't support him. I would not have supported him had I been a voting member of the voting public in New York last year. And now he is the mayor. He's the elected mayor of New York City. And I think that I would say that, you know, he's the duly elected mayor and I think it's rightful that he should be there. I think if he did not go, that would be the controversy. On the other end, that he ignored this commemoration. So I think it's right that he should be there. You know, President Trump, he spoke at an event today and it was honoring 9-11 first responders and he shared this story.

27:34Let's listen. The United States Steel Building was creaking, really creaking, and we thought it was going to fall down. I'll never forget, two firemen, we thought it was coming down on top of us, and two firemen, big, strong guys, and I'm not the smallest guy in the world, they grabbed me under the arm and said, got to get out of here, and they literally lifted me up. This is not easy to do. I'm big. They lifted me up and they started running with me. I said, fellas, I can run myself. You know, our fact checker, Daniel Dale, he says there is no evidence that Trump was in the U.S. Steel building, that's also known as One Liberty Plaza, when people fear that it might actually collapse.

28:15And the videos show him in the neighborhood of Ground Zero, not the actual site. Have you ever heard this story from the president before? Never. I've never heard that story at all. I know that he owned a building in Norman Hatton at the time. I think he was concerned about that. And I don't want to become over too harshly political. I mean, people, I think, know where I stand when it comes to this president. And I'm very forgiving in terms of people's recollection, but I have never heard that he was actually physically there and removed by anyone. The next thing we might be hearing, he was on the Titanic, for all I know.

28:46You know, it just, to me, is just his need to be present at all events of significance in some way or another. And it can't just be enough that I may have watched it from my television in my office. Again, I don't know if it's true. I just never heard that story whatsoever. Well, you know, Trump actually had a post tonight on Truth Social, and he was attacking people saying he wasn't there. The failing New York magazine wrote a story that I wasn't down at the World Trade Center after the tragedy of September 11th because nobody saw me there. Well, I don't think I would be the first thing on anyone's mind, but I was there, obviously not on the same day as the collapse, but shortly thereafter with a large group of construction workers.

29:25I discussed it today during my remarks on the ellipse in Washington, D.C. for tunnel to towers. everything I said was exactly accurate and to prove the point you can feed the rest on his own true social I mean obviously as you mentioned not wanting to make it political he he is a controversial precedent and say the least people are going to scrutinize everything he says and largely a result of the fact that he centers himself in a number of areas but the center issue to me today in part was the revelation of just how long the government in New York knew about the air quality in Manhattan. I mean, Mayor Mamdani, he released over 170 ,000 pages today, 170 ,000 pages, and it showed that city officials misled the public about air quality around Ground Zero, and they show that the city officials knew the air was unsafe to breathe after 9-11, despite saying that that was not the case, Congressman.

30:24I mean, why did it take 25 years for this transparency, And what did you take away from knowing that they knew? Well, I think also we have to go back and understand that the EPA also said that, and the former governor of New Jersey, Whitman, had said that the air was clean to breathe. So there were multiple levels of letdown here, so to speak. What I also think is interesting, this actually was information that was held over a number of mayoral periods, both Democratic and Republican mayors who held this back. Why? Because, I mean, people died not just on 9-11, but diagnosed with 9-11-related illnesses.

31:04Yeah, I think there was a real push back in that day to get things up and going again and bring some normalcy back, if that could even be put that word and 9-11 together. But I do think that injustice was done here, that people were exposed. My nephew, who just was elected to the New York State Assembly, Patrick Martinez, is he was a freshman at Stuyvesant High School. They went back to school at some point in that area when it was not fully free of contamination. And so I look at that and say that there's some negligence here. Congressman, thank you for being here. Thank you, Laura. That person, the majority of the room was trying to kind of sway that person from the very beginning.

31:47That was a voice from one of the jurors in the Lindsey Clancy trial breaking their silence about the lone holdout who they say led them to a mistrial. So what was it like inside the room? And what does this mean for a decision to try to retry the case? Judge Mathis joins me live to weigh in next.

32:11Tonight, for the very first time, you know, we're hearing directly from jurors in the Lindsey Clancy case, with new insight into what ultimately led to the mistrial that was declared. Here's what the jury foreperson said about the one juror who was said to be the holdout. He had reasonable doubt. He admitted he had reasonable doubt after we watched that video of the interview. I think that's when it was. He admitted he had reasonable doubt. And I started filling out the forms. I was so excited. I actually, there were three forms I had to fill out. And I started filling them out. I wrote my signature on each one.

32:49And then he said, but I'm still not going to say that she's not guilty by reason of insanity. And you'll recall that during deliberations, the defense argued that one juror was refusing to listen to the law and the instructions when it came to reasonable doubt and demanded that jury be removed. The judge interviewed that juror apparently and then denied that request. Joining me now, Emmy winning host of the courtroom show, Judge Mathis. He currently hosts Mathis Court with Judge Mathis and he is here himself. Welcome, Judge Mathis, to the program. I'm eager to your take because this this defense, they wanted the lone juror taken off the jury.

33:26The judge refused, but gave them the option to appeal. Did that the right way to handle this? Well, I don't know, because it ended up in a mistrial. I suspect that had he replaced the juror, that it would be a different outcome. He wouldn't necessarily have to have declared a mistrial. There were alternates. You are right. He decided not to do so. I mean, as a judge, what kinds of questions would you have asked to determine whether that juror was really following your instructions about reasonable doubt? I would ask what you know. What have you known about this case prior to the beginning of the trial?

34:02I would have asked, does do they know of anyone who has suffered postpartum and had they been a victim of the anger? Some folks may have been a victim of mistreatment by someone who had gone through that process. I would hope they'd ask that during the jury selection, but perhaps not. and I would make sure I would ask as the judge went on board during them as a result of the one hung juror. There is another huge trial happening, this time on the West Coast, and it was in the federal court. No cameras, but closing arguments wrapped today in the murder for hire trial of rapper Lil Durk. And prosecutors alleged that he plotted to kill a rival in a revenge killing, but that the shooting killed a different person instead.

34:46Now, throughout the trial, prosecutors tried to use his his own rap lyrics as evidence against him. You take issue with that having been admitted as evidence, they say, to show his state of mind after his friend King Vaughn was killed? No, absolutely. I take issue with it. Indeed, if half of the things that rap artists rapped about were true or something they were intending to do, I don't think we'd have the highest selling genre of music available today, and that is rap music. So, no, you have such things as what they call studio gangsters, where they get in there and rap about things they've never even been a part of.

35:27I'm not saying that about Banks because he isn't quite that. But things you rap about and the art that you display and illustrate is not necessarily something you would carry out on your own. In fact, as we saw what he showed on the video, if you're referring to that, where he walked up on the young man and hit and shot him directly is much different than what the so-called conspiracy was. Yes, the conspiracy that they alleged was a shooting into a car and a crowded intersection. The video that was never actually I think actually that made it to air. They did still show that video. It was called Redman, if I'm not mistaken.

36:02But Judge Mathis, much of the prosecution's case relied on testimony from people who were initially charged as co-defendants. They later pleaded guilty. The defense is saying they're cooperators. They have every reason to lie. They're trying to save themselves. They're not credible. You have obviously seen trials when jurors are seeing cooperating witnesses. How do you as a judge instruct a jury to evaluate and assess their credibility? Well, I would do just that. Almost the exact language. And that is you have to analyze each and every one of the individual discussions that they've had with the prosecutor, for example, and the arresting officers, and then come to your own conclusions as to how you want to accept their testimony and their credibility thereof.

36:57Go ahead, Judge. Excuse me. Yeah, so I would do that. I would do the same for both for the cooperating witnesses. But let me say with regard to them, they also contradicted their testimony from what I've observed between the time one spoke with the investigator and the other time when they were doing the proffer. Another one of the young men showed that his motive, some of the motive was the same as the Tupac murder perpetrator person who killed Tupac. And that is to be famous and rich. It is my time. I'm going to get a movie deal. I'm going to get all of this. So there's a lot of moving parts in there with regard to the credibility of those who are so-called corroborating.

37:40We'll see how the jury sees it. Judge Mathis, thank you so much. Up next, a scary scene on the campaign trail. An armed man is arrested after police say that he tried to confront the Democrat running for governor in Ohio. Tonight, she's my guest, Dr. Amy Acton, here next.

37:59I gotta tell you about another terrifying incident on the campaign trail during a contentious race. This one happened in Ohio where police say an armed man pushed his way through a campaign event for Democratic nominee for governor. Dr. Amy Acton. She was speaking at a local fair when Acton's spokesperson says Patrick Havis lunged at her and knocked down two older adults. Havis appeared in court today and pleaded not guilty to charges of assault, inducing panic and disorderly conduct. A spokesperson for the opponent, Vivek Ramaswamy, called the incident, quote, completely unacceptable. And he added, candidates should be able to meet with voters without having to worry about threats or violence.

38:45The Democratic nominee for Ohio governor, Dr. Amy Acton, joins me now. Dr. Acton, first, I just have to ask you about this terrifying incident over the weekend. How are you doing? Thank you, Laura. Thank you for having us. And I am doing well, as is my team. It was a bit harrowing for us. We were in the middle of a typical stump speech at the fair where I grew up, actually, Canfield Fair in Youngstown, Ohio. And I was actually speaking to the topic of Ohioans longing for us to bring down the temperature. They're exhausted by the hate and chaos and vitriol in my state. And I can tell you, this doesn't know party and people are ready for change.

39:38And I am grateful that everyone that was a part of this, the injured folks are doing well. And I am very grateful to the state highway patrol, the first responders that were there on the scene. They did a fantastic job. But it is a reminder that the words our leaders use matter. Well, let's move on to what has been a very serious race in the polls right now, suggesting that you are in a dead heat with Republican nominee Vivek Ramaswamy. You're running for governor in a state, as you know, that has voted for Trump in the last three presidential elections. So how do you plan to convince those voters that they should choose you?

40:27Well, first of all, I'm a doctor. I am not a politician, but I am a lifelong public servant. I'm six years old and I've been working to help Ohioans my entire life, including in one way or another with five different governors. I will work with anyone of any party if they actually want to solve problems instead of make them. I've been on the road for two and a half years going everywhere in my state. Quite frankly, I go places Dems haven't been in a while. we've been listening deeply and Ohioans are feeling the effects of uh there being no more breathing room the cost of every day living from rent and housing to child care to energy bills and property taxes it is all too much they're working harder than they ever have and and it just doesn't add up well I want to talk about child care doctor I don't want to talk about Child care, you know, I'm a mother.

41:25I remember full well the bills that it takes to try to care for children, especially if you want to be a working person. You've got to pay child care. And both parties want to make it more affordable. And today, The New York Times reports that the Trump administration is proposing this new policy to allow married couples with a stay-at-home spouse to collect child care subsidies. That's being pushed by the former Ohio senator, now Vice President J.D. Vance. Is that the right move? You know, I absolutely think in Ohio we have got to address the issue of child care. My state subsidizes 49th out of 50th in this country.

42:0255 % of Ohioans do not have access to high quality, affordable child care. I was in Steubenville, Ohio, and people are going to West Virginia to get child care and then crossing back over into Ohio. So what would you do? I will absolutely be working on child care. and all of the other issues to bring down the cost of everyday life in Ohio. My opponent has known for saying Medicaid and Medicare are mistakes. He wants to completely dismantle them, and he's put a nod to Social Security, too, in Part D. So I'm up against a self-funding billionaire who has been putting lies and rhetoric out, $60 million worth of lies and rhetoric.

42:47I want to talk about that. I want that's this is very interesting to me in particular, because you have said that you wouldn't debate your opponent, Ramaswamy, because your campaign says that he has spread, quote, baseless lies about you and your family. Why not use the debate stage to set the record straight then? I want to be very clear, Laura. I will absolutely not normalize the behavior of a man who has said, I'm a victim of child abuse and neglect in my childhood, sexual abuse. And he has said, I'm just complaining about something done to me in my childhood. But I will not normalize or platform a serial liar and a con man who is using rhetoric to incite violence.

43:34Dr. Amy Acton, thank you for joining. Thank you so much, Laura. Thank you all for watching. The Story Is with Alex Michelson is next.

43:49I'm Adi Cornish. I'm Ari Shapiro and it's Engagement Party. It is Engagement Party. And we get to talk about what we're obsessed with, what we're engaged with, what we need to process with a friend. We are going to be talking about the booming market of toys, games, puzzles, crafts for not children, but adults. Okay, not just adults, kidults. Kidulting. This year, for the first time ever, a majority of toy sales were in adult-only households. And there are some other numbers to back this up. Like, in a Harris Poll survey published this year, two-thirds of American adults reported spending$100 or more on playful activities and products like craft kits or action figures.

44:2813 % of adults reported spending$500 or more on these things. So it's a massive market and I think also a massive change in the culture. Follow Engagement Party wherever you get your podcasts.